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Trump, Gaetz Call GOP Senators Urging Support For AG Confirmation; Some Senate Republicans Want To See Ethics Report On Gaetz; Manhattan DA Agrees To Postpone Trump's Sentencing In Criminal Hush Money Case; Ukraine Fires U.S.-Made Longer-Range Missiles Into Russia For First Time; Rep. Jake Auchincloss (D-MA) Is Interviewed About Ukraine Use Of U.S. Long-Range Missile Into Russia. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired November 19, 2024 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:00:43]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Not Backing Down: President-elect Donald Trump making it clear he wants Matt Gaetz as his attorney general whatever the cost. But will Senate Republicans do his bidding despite questions about Gaetz and what might be revealed by a House Ethics investigation.

Plus, a Major Escalation: Ukraine firing U.S.-made long-range missiles inside Russia just days after the Biden administration gave them the green light. This as Vladimir Putin lowers the threshold for use of nuclear weapons.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And Sean "Diddy" Combs back in court this hour. The new hearing on how prosecutors obtained his handwritten notes allegedly threatening witnesses from his jail cell. Why the defense says the search violated the singer's rights.

We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SANCHEZ: First up this hour, a significant show of force. President- elect Donald Trump, Vice President-elect, JD Vance and former Congressman Matt Gaetz all personally lobbying Republican senators to get Gaetz's confirmation as attorney general across the finish line. We're learning that Vance is trying to set up meetings this week between key Republicans and some of Trump's cabinet picks including the former Florida Congressman. While Trump and Gaetz himself are working the phones to urge lawmakers to give him a chance.

There are growing concerns though among top Republicans over a House Ethics committee report on allegations of sexual misconduct, illegal drug use and other claims against Gaetz. The Committee is set to meet tomorrow as it weighs the fate of that report. Let's take you now live to West Palm Beach, Florida with CNN's Kristen Holmes.

Kristen, we'll get to Matt Gaetz and the questions about his nomination in a moment but first Trump just confirmed some - CNN reporting you put out earlier today - about his pick for commerce secretary.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right Boris, it's going to be the co-chair of the transition, Howard Lutnick. Now the reason why we have been so fascinated and what's going to happen with Howard Lutnick is because we were told that's part of the reason that the secretary of Treasury post has been held up because of the fact that Lutnick at the last minute threw his name into the mix.

Now, in recent days we were told that Donald Trump and those around him were starting to get kind of annoyed by all the pitching that Lutnick was doing. So it seems as though this is how they solved their problem when it came to secretary of Treasury is by putting him in as secretary of Commerce. We saw that very kind statement from Donald Trump.

Just to note Trump and Lutnick have been friends for a very long time, so now the question is does this mean we're going to be seeing a secretary of Treasury as soon as this evening. We know that because of the infighting mostly led by Lutnick - at least that's what we were told by sources - that this post had been kind of put on pause. Donald Trump had extended the list there. But we obviously know this is a key position in this administration particularly since so many of Donald Trump's posts or promises during the campaign were about the economy and what he was going to do. So both commerce will play a big role in that as will secretary of Treasury which we are still waiting to hear about.

SANCHEZ: And Kristen, give us the latest on this effort by Trump and others to push Matt Gaetz over the finish line.

HOLMES: Yes, we are told by people close to Donald Trump that he has been asking everyone do they think that Matt Gaetz can get confirmed that he has acknowledged to some of his allies that they don't have the votes right now in the Senate to get him confirmed and that's why you're seeing him make a personal push. He himself calling people in the last two days Republican senators asking to get their support trying to lobby for Gaetz.

Obviously now we are reporting that Gaetz has been doing the same and there is this push from president - Vice President-elect JD Vance who's going to essentially parade Gaetz through the halls of Capitol Hill to meet with some of these Republican senators. The question, of course, being will it work because one thing to note it's not just Democrats who are calling for the release of this ethics report it is also Republican senators. So how this plays out we'll obviously have to wait and see.

[15:05:03]

SANCHEZ: Kristen Holmes live for us with the latest from West Palm Beach, Florida. Thank you so much Kristen. Brianna?

KEILAR: Now to breaking news in President-elect Trump's criminal hush money case. The Manhattan D.A. is agreeing to postpone sentencing for Trump but the D.A. does not want the case dismissed. And this is coming two weeks after Trump, of course, won back the White House making him the first convicted felon elected to the nation's highest office. CNN's Kara Scannell is live for us from New York with details on this.

Kara, tell us what you're learning.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brianna those issues that you raise are exactly part of the conversation and the thinking that the D.A.'s office has worked through to come to this conclusion. They notified the judge overseeing the case today that they are okay with postponing Donald Trump's sentencing but they said that they do stand by this conviction and they're going to litigate to fight to keep it, because they say they know that Trump's lawyers plan to file a motion to dismiss because of the unique legal issues raised in this case, the Supreme Court's decision on presidential immunity as well as the issues of Trump being the president-elect and facing a state court's potential sentencing from this state court conviction.

And so what the D.A.'s office writes in the letter to the judge they say that the people deeply respect the office of the president are mindful of the demands and obligations of the presidency and acknowledge that defendant's inauguration will raise unprecedented legal questions. We also deeply respect the fundamental role of the jury in our constitutional system.

So they're saying that they are prepared to fight Trump's motion to dismiss this case even suggesting to the judge that he set a pretty quick timeline on this saying that they would be ready to file their response on December 9th and they said that they are okay adjourning the sentencing which is scheduled for next Tuesday because they know that no matter how Judge Merchan who oversees the state case rules, there's likely to be appeals. And appeals courts would inevitably stay or put on pause the sentencing to allow the legal arguments to play out. So essentially saying that seems inevitable, but they are declaring that they are going to fight this.

Now, it is still up to Judge Merchan to decide if he's going to postpone the sentencing but with no opposition that does seem likely. Brianna?

KEILAR: Kara Scannell, thank you so much.

Let's talk about all of this now with our panel. We have CNN Senior Political Analyst, Gloria Borger; CNN Senior Political Analysts, Mark Preston; and Harry Litman, former U.S. attorney and former deputy assistant attorney general.

Harry, what is the practical impact here of kicking the can four years down the road?

HARRY LITMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, four years down the road you never know what Trump will manufacture between now and then. But in theory, Brianna, all it does is put things on ice until January 20th, 2029. In other words the law that says you can't encumber a current president doesn't say anything about then bidding him hello on January 29th and show - 20th and showing him to Rikers Island, so that would be the notion. But every single prosecutor has prefaced the submissions to the court by talking about unprecedented circumstances. Would the case actually hang in there that long? Man, there's a lot of imponderables there.

SANCHEZ: Yes, there's a lot that could change between now and four years from now.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Everything.

KEILAR: Everything, right?

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.

BORGER: Everything can change and, you know, I think his attorneys are still going to try to have this dismissed, right? So they're not done with that, but everything could change. I mean, putting it on ice for four years seems to me to be kind of a way out of this in a funny way. But four years is four years and there'll be a lot of litigation in between.

KEILAR: Yes, there's the appeal.

BORGER: Yes, exactly.

KEILAR: And to several there's this appeal.

BORGER: Exactly.

KEILAR: And so he really may not face any accountability for ...

BORGER: Exactly.

KEILAR: ... there are all - think of all of the man hours that have gone in ...

BORGER: I think it's likely.

PRESTON: Right.

KEILAR: ... into prosecuting Donald Trump in so many different jurisdictions and it's possible - poof.

PRESTON: Oh, I have - I'm not - under no belief that he will ever be - he'll ever serve a moment in jail. He'll ever have to pay, you know, he's paying restitution but like the reality is for what he should have to pay, you know. No, absolutely not.

My question is, is how does this filter down to everyone else? If he can get away with it, who's to say that if you're not Elon Musk and you're the richest man in the world, can you start doing things too and perhaps, you know, you can get away with things.

BORGER: Ask his attorney general.

PRESTON: I mean, it's a dangerous precedent, you know, that's for sure. SANCHEZ: Harry, I know that this result has drawn the ire of a lot of Democrats who had hoped that the sitting attorney general Merrick Garland would have acted sooner or done something to act sooner. What do you make of that argument?

LITMAN: You know, that's been a long-standing debate, Boris. But if you do the math, if Merrick Garland had come in and brought charges the next day instead of first working so many of the biggest - the defendants in the biggest case of all time, the January 6th marauders - you would not - you would not get to the finish line by now.

[15:10:11]

So, this victory improbable as it seemed a few years ago was always going to be if you just take out the calendar that lead to the result that Mark just talked about. Improbable, galling, disturbing but I think unavoidable now. So, the Merrick Garland, I think criticisms are poorly taken given how things have played out.

KEILAR: If you look at how hard Trump is fighting right now and I know that there is some reporting that he understands how embattled Matt Gaetz is, but if you look at how hard he is fighting right now for Matt Gaetz to be his attorney general and you know how much it mattered to him that he didn't quite have the person who would go to bat for him like he wanted last time, what is it about Gaetz's AG that he is so uniquely poised to deliver that Donald Trump wants so badly?

PRESTON: Oh, let me say, I'm of the conspiratorial class on this one, okay? So, I will lay it out. This is a win-win for Donald Trump and for Matt Gaetz. It's a win-win for Matt Gaetz because Matt Gaetz was on an airplane - before he got on the airplane, he wasn't considered for the Department of Justice. Now, he has been nominated. A report was coming out within a couple days. Now, he's able to at least shape the narrative of whatever comes out in that report, he's going to somehow get support out of it.

So, if he's a sacrificial lamb, he's not able to get through. That empowers Donald Trump to get some of his other more controversial nominees through. And quite frankly, he doesn't need Matt Gaetz at the Department of Justice. He needs anybody that will just do whatever he wants them to do.

BORGER: Well, he's got the deputy attorney general there. He's - Todd Blanche who was his lawyer, right?

PRESTON: Right, right.

BORGER: But, you know, this is the traditions of the United States Senate up against a bulldozer who wants to destroy the tradition by saying, take Matt Gaetz, do recess appointments and then he's got all these other controversial appointments. And I think there are United States senators who are sitting and thinking, how much peril would I be in if not only if I opposed Matt Gaetz, but if I opposed Tulsi Gabbard, for example, or Bobby Kennedy, for example, or Pete Hegseth.

I mean, these senators are trying to figure out their own political futures here, particularly if you're a Tillis - a Thom Tillis who's up in a couple of years. They're trying to sort of strategize what this is going to mean for them because these are controversial picks and, you know, which were not vetted by the Senate in advance.

You know, normally you go and you call people and say, hey, would this person have a chance, would that person have a chance.

SANCHEZ: (INAUDIBLE) the idea, yes.

BORGER: You do it in advance. This is being done the other way. You're doing it after.

SANCHEZ: So, I was having this conversation with Shermichael Singleton a moment ago and asking him what he thought about what some Republican senators had said about this House Ethics report, second or third time I've asked it up today, the House Ethics report ...

BORGER: Right.

SANCHEZ: They're seeming to argue that if they put it out now, at least they can contend with what it has and get it out of the way and move toward the confirmation process as opposed to it leaking out drip by drip and then potentially blowing up the confirmation process.

BORGER: Well, it might do that either way, right? If you put it out now, it might blow it up. If it gets leaked, it might blow it up. It depends what's in this report. I mean, we've heard from the attorney, you know, he was on Erin Burnett last night. We heard from him and we heard his story. I don't know how much more is going to be in there. That's probably bad enough for a bunch of people.

But you hear them now saying, wait a minute, I'm not going to vote on rumors. I'm not going to, you know, so maybe it would put some meat on the bones of these charges against Gaetz so he wouldn't say that it was, you know, he was just being charged indiscriminately, it's hard to say.

PRESTON: Yes.

KEILAR: What's happening to the chances when you look at all of this - not just Gaetz, but these other controversial picks to the chances of recess appointments, because you have Sen. Cramer, Republican of North Dakota, saying it's unwise to do unless there's a majority who want this candidate. So, I mean, what were Cornyn and Thune agreeing to in sort of principle about recess appointments? Was it just to go, oh, yes. Well, just like kumbaya recess appointment ...

BORGER: And Rick Scott.

KEILAR: ... if everyone's in agreement with it.

PRESTON: You would have said, if you're running ...

KEILAR: I mean, what are they're looking for?

BORGER: (INAUDIBLE) to win, yes. PRESTON: Look, if you're running for Republican leader at that moment, you would have said ...

KEILAR: So cynical ...

PRESTON: ... you know what? I want to become a member of Mar-a-Lago and would have paid the initiation fee just to get his support. But let's just simplify what should happen very quickly. He should be able to nominate whoever he wants. That's his right. The Senate should be able to do their job. Let's have hearings.

[15:15:00]

If they don't want to give the House report, to your point, it's going to delay. They're just going to have to go back and do that whole investigation. And I will tell you, some of these confirmation hearings in the New Year are going to be off the charts.

BORGER: Well, and if you want to avoid confirmation hearings and you want to avoid vetting people, why is there a United States Senate? I mean, their job is to advice and consent. That is their job. And if they just say, okay, fine, we're not going to do this, we're going to roll over, and I think there are a lot of people who don't want to roll over, then what are they there for? You know, they have to be asking themselves that question.

SANCHEZ: We'll see how they respond. Gloria, Mark, Harry, thank you all so much, appreciate the analysis.

Still to come, for the first time, Ukraine firing U.S.-made long-range missiles into Russia just days after the White House gave Kyiv the green light.

KEILAR: Plus, Sean "Diddy" Combs back in court. This time, his lawyers are arguing that federal prosecutors violated his rights when his personal notes were taken during a sweep of his jail cell. And then later, Elon Musk's increasing role in Trump's world. The president- elect traveling to Texas with the SpaceX CEO to watch the test launch of the company's biggest rocket.

That and much more coming up on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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SANCHEZ: We're seeing a potentially dangerous escalation today in the years-long war between Ukraine and Russia. For the first time, U.S. officials now confirm that Ukraine used American-made weapons like these inside of Russia. The attack happening just two days after President Biden gave the green light for these kinds of strikes. And today, President Putin lowered his country's threshold for using nuclear weapons, something the Kremlin alleges had been in the works for months. CNN's Fred Pleitgen is live in Moscow following all of these developments.

Fred, what can you tell us first about these attacks inside Russia and then the Kremlin's response?

FRED PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And you're absolutely right, Boris, that the Kremlin has lowered the threshold for the use of nuclear weapons. And the scenario is exactly like the one that we're seeing right now with the use of those long-distance U.S.-provided weapons by the Ukrainians. The U.S. obviously says that these ATACMS surface-to-surface missiles were used in the overnight hours to attack a weapons depot in the Bryansk region, that's sort of in the southwest of Russia, close to the Kursk region, where, of course, the Ukrainians are trying to hold off a Russian counter- assault there.

The Russians tell a bit of a different story. They claim that these attacks happened around three in the morning, that six ATAKMS missiles were fired towards what they call a military object, and that five of those were taken down by Russian air defenses. It's unclear, though, what really happened. We really haven't seen any videos that we've been able to confirm about those alleged strikes that took place.

However, you're also absolutely right to say that this morning, Vladimir Putin signed an update to Russia's nuclear doctrine. And one of the scenarios in that nuclear doctrine is very similar to what we saw happen with those Ukrainian strikes deep into Russian territory. One of the scenarios that the Russians now have is that if a non- nuclear country, like, for instance, Ukraine, uses long-distance weapons with the help of a nuclear country, like, for instance, the United States, that the Russians could view that as a joint attack by both of these countries, and that could, therefore, as they put it, trigger the use of Russian nuclear weapons.

There were some other areas as well where the Russians updated that nuclear doctrine, but that was really the main one that everybody here is talking about. And, you know, being here on the ground, Boris, I can tell you that right now, this is obviously the big talking point here in Moscow and state media, but also Russian officials, with the spokesman for Russia's foreign ministry coming out and saying that the Russian response, as she put it, will be felt, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Fred Pleitgen, live for us in Moscow. Thank you so much for the update, Fred.

KEILAR: We're joined now by Democratic Congressman Jake Auchincloss of Massachusetts.

Congressman, welcome to you.

And you have been arguing for long-range weapons use in Russia by Ukraine for a long time, but I wonder if you're concerned that this may be too late.

REP. JAKE AUCHINCLOSS (D-MA): No, it's never too late to lift restrictions that can empower Ukraine to win this war. And yes, winning this war needs to be the objective of the United States and NATO, not simply not losing it. I think that this is long overdue progress, but President Biden needs to go further. He now needs to allow for the use of the ATACMs and F-16 strikes against the four oil refineries that surround Moscow and that provide the petroleum, which is the lifeblood of the Russian war machine.

KEILAR: Do you think Biden did this because Trump won and Trump has made it clear he wants to see the war end quickly? Or do you think it was reaction to Russia bringing in North Korean troops? What was it?

AUCHINCLOSS: Could be a synthesis of both. I don't know. I'm not read into the National Security briefings and conversation that he was having. What I do know is that this should herald a shift in U.S. policy away from flinching every time that Putin flexes and instead achieving peace through strength by making very clear not just to the Kremlin, but to Beijing and Tehran and Pyongyang as well, that might does not make right. And the United States and our East Asian and European allies are going to stand with democracies as they fight on the front lines of the free world.

Ukraine's war is not lost. I know that the narrative is shaping up to be they have to accept some version of defeat here. I disagree. I think that they can achieve freedom of navigation in the Black Sea. They can achieve a secure eastern border and they can achieve European Union membership, which would be a massive win for the United States in the West.

[15:25:06]

KEILAR: What if Trump just reversed his course on this in two months?

AUCHINCLOSS: We have to empower Ukraine to change the facts on the battleground as much as possible, because those facts will predetermine much of their negotiating leverage at any future conference. I can't - I wish I could change what Donald Trump is going to do in two months' time. That election has passed. We know that he is a Putin sympathizer.

What we can do in these next two months is MAGA-proof Ukraine to the extent possible. That means lifting these restrictions so that they can take out Russian oil refineries. That means securing further loans based on the Russian frozen assets so it's not just a $50 billion lifeline, but more and for more time so they can build out their own defense industrial base.

And that also means encouraging our European allies to offer fast- tracked EU membership with the Lisbon Treaty security umbrella associated with it so that Ukraine has real security guarantees.

KEILAR: Putin lowered Russia's threshold for using nuclear weapons today so that it now considers an aggression by any non-nuclear state, but with participation of a nuclear country to be a joint attack on Russia, is that a cause for concern in your mind?

AUCHINCLOSS: Yes. Everything Vladimir Putin does in Ukraine and all of his saber-rattling is a cause for concern. This is a nuclear-powered state and he has signaled these changes for months now with the constitutional change that he made a while back. That is one element of risk that we need to contain. But the other dimension of risk is that Russia wins in Ukraine, that they take Kyiv and they look to Poland or Lithuania or Latvia, and that Xi Jinping takes the wrong lesson from this and decides that 2027 is the right year to try to put an energy blockade around Taiwan and instigate a global conflict or that Iran uses this as a pretext to again strike Israel.

There is an axis of authoritarianism between Russia, China and Iran, and weakness on any one front with them instigates further conflict elsewhere.

KEILAR: You're changing topics here. Your House colleague, Republican Nancy Mace, is pushing to ban transgender women from women's restrooms in the Capitol. She said this is in response to Sarah McBride, who has become the first out transgender person elected to Congress. Mace also says she's working on legislation to apply that to every federal building and federally funded school.

How do Democrats navigate the issue of trans rights, as you also have, you know, one of your colleagues, Seth Moulton, recently saying essentially the Democrats are out of touch with the majority of Americans on the issue of transgender athletes in sports?

AUCHINCLOSS: I haven't looked at this bill. It feels performative and mean-spirited. If these members of Congress have concerns about facilities on the Capitol complex, they can go to the architect of the Capitol. They can go to the House Administration Committee and work through them in good faith. This just seems like they're trying to embarrass a new member of Congress, and I'm not going to participate in that.

KEILAR: And - but can you answer the question about how Democrats should navigate this issue? Because your colleague, your Massachusetts colleague, Seth Moulton, he made headlines. He had some backlash, but certainly I think there are some voters and some of his colleagues who agree with him that this is an issue that Democrats need to find a better place on, at least politically.

AUCHINCLOSS: Sure. So I think it's a series of things. One, we've got to stake out our values. We believe that every individual in this country should be able to achieve their definition of success and freedom, and that the circumstances of your birth should not determine the condition of your life. We want to expand the envelope of freedom that the founders first promised to everybody in this country. We're not going to bully the trans community. That's not who we are as a party.

We're also going to embrace, I think, the complexity of this issue and understand that it needs to be science-driven, it needs to incorporate values of fair play and it needs to be granular. There's not one-size- fits-all for an issue this complicated. It's going to be, you know, age bracket by age bracket, sector by sector, and we have to be willing to talk about it in some level of depth and not simply allow, I think, Republican attacks that seem to characterize this issue in a binary way and that really, I think, sow more fear and confusion than they do empathy and understanding. We can't allow those attacks to stick. We have to rebut them.

KEILAR: Congressman Jake Auchincloss, thank you so much for speaking with us today. We really appreciate it. AUCHINCLOSS: Good to be on.

KEILAR: Music mogul Sean "Diddy" Combs back in court today after federal prosecutors obtained personal notes from his jail cell. Those notes allegedly revealed efforts to tamper with witnesses from jail. We'll have the latest next.

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