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Matt Gaetz Withdraws From Consideration as Attorney General; War-Crimes Court Issues Arrest Warrant For Netanyahu; American Airlines Expands Its Crackdown Online Cutters; Just Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired November 21, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Gaetz is out. The President Elect's controversial pick for attorney general withdrawing from consideration as he faces scrutiny over sexual misconduct allegations. We're following the latest.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And the International Criminal Court issues arrest warrants for two top Israeli officials, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, accusing them of war crimes in Gaza while also pointing the finger at Hamas Military Chief. How Netanyahu's office is responding.

And a crackdown on line cutters just in time for the holiday travel surge. How American Airlines is making sure everyone knows who they are. We are following these stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN News Central.

SANCHEZ: We start this hour with major breaking news. President Elect Donald Trump's pick for attorney general is out. Matt Gaetz says he is withdrawing his name from consideration. The former Congressman posting that his confirmation process was becoming a distraction to the critical work of the Trump-Vance team.

KEILAR: Just yesterday, Gaetz was up on Capitol Hill. He was meeting with key Republican senators, trying to persuade them to support his bid to head up the Justice Department. Our correspondents are standing by with all of the latest developments here and they are developing rapidly.

So let's begin with CNN Chief Legal Affairs Correspondent, Paula Reid. Paula, a lot of new details just coming out. Tell us about your reporting and why this is happening now?

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, let me walk you through what's happened so far this morning. Earlier today around 11:30, we reached out to Gaetz's team to allow them to respond to new reporting that we had. The House Ethics Committee had been told of a second sexual encounter between Gaetz and a woman who was at the time just 17 years old.

And we learned that the Committee was also told by a witness that there was another adult woman involved in this sexual encounter. Now, this is significant because this is the first time that it's been reported that there was more than one instance of the former Congressman allegedly having sex with that underage girl.

Now, of course, the former Congressman has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing. The Justice Department investigated these allegations and did not charge him. The woman who would have been the adult involved in this alleged encounter, she has also denied this encounter. But the reason this reporting was so significant is because it is an example of the kind of information that the Ethics Committee has but the public does not.

I've covered very closely these investigations into Gaetz and these allegations for four years. And this was the first time that we had ever heard this. And this example of the kind of information that could be in that House Ethics report that is currently at the center of a big debate on whether it should be released.

We reached out to the congressman about this reporting. We were waiting for a statement. We were going to go live at 12:30 on Inside Politics. And instead of getting a statement about a minute before we went live, we got this notification that Gaetz was withdrawing his nomination for attorney general.

KEILAR: Yeah. Let us remember this, Paula, as we heard one of those lawmakers saying to reporters yesterday on the Hill, what do you mean? You guys know everything that's in this report. You've been reporting it. And here we are with something new about this Committee and what they knew. Paula Reid, thank you so much for that reporting.

Let's turn now to CNN Chief Congressional Correspondent, Manu Raju, who I think may have been tracking down that lawmaker. What's the mood like on Capitol Hill right now?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, among a lot of Republicans, there is a sense of relief because this would have been a very difficult vote for a number of Republicans who did not want to defy Donald Trump and endure the wrath of Trump, but also did not believe that Gaetz was qualified to run.

The Justice Department had concerns about the allegations in the House Ethics report, had concerns about Gaetz's slash and burn politics, the way he's battled with Republicans over the years. His fact that he led the ouster of Kevin McCarthy as Speaker of the House, all of which pointed to the likelihood that Gaetz had a very uphill climb to become confirmed as attorney general.

One Republican Senator I just spoke with Kevin Cramer told me that it was not worth the political capital to go through all this because he said simply, the math is not there.

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And that was reiterated down the line by a number of Republican senators. One key Republican Senator, the Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell, just told our colleague, Ted Baird, that it is a good thing that Matt Gaetz withdrew from the post and that there were a lot of Republicans, according to Kevin Kramer, who were in the hell no camp in supporting Matt Gaetz.

So the question ultimately would have been for the Trump team if they would have went through this process, a rigorous confirmation process, hearings next year, votes and committee votes on the floor, and ultimately they did not get there. That was simply not worth it for a lot of Republican senators. They didn't want to go through that process. And clearly, at the end of the day, Gaetz made that ultimate calculation.

Well, it wasn't worth it for him. But Democrats, they're happy as well, but they're also wondering who, who comes next, as Chris Murphy, the Democratic Senator from Connecticut, said. He said democracy has been protected for now, but in his view, he asked what comes next? Brianna.

KEILAR: Yeah, everyone wants to know. Manu Raju live for us on the Hill. Thank you.

Sources tell CNN that President Elect Trump does not yet have a new name in mind for attorney general and is now returning to the drawing board. So let's bring in CNN's Kristen Holmes live for us from West Palm Beach, Florida. Because, Kristen, the folks who may have had a bit of a more conventional streak, who were possibilities for AG initially, he wasn't really fond of, right?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He just wasn't impressed by that, Brianna. That's what we had -- we're told. There wasn't no bomb thrower. There wasn't anyone he believed could be an effective communicator, which is why this plan was hatched essentially on the flight from Best Palm beach to Washington, D.C. and by the time he landed back in West Palm beach, he had announced that Matt Gaetz was his pick to be attorney general.

So anyone on that short list, which Matt Gaetz was not originally on, it was not somebody that he felt like was right for the role. Now, when it comes to Matt Gaetz, when it comes to today's announcement, we are told that he informed Donald Trump that transition members were told ahead of him tweeting. So it was not a surprise.

Donald Trump himself has put out a statement that I want to read. He wrote, I greatly appreciate the recent efforts of Matt Gaetz and seeking approval to be Attorney General. He was doing very well, but at the same time, it did not want to be a distraction for the Administration for which he has much respect. Matt has a wonderful future and I look forward to watching all of the great things that he will do.

Now, when I spoke to a number of people either on the transition, close to the transition or close to Donald Trump, they said a few things. One was that while they were cautiously optimistic about how some of the meetings went on the Hill yesterday, they were very much aware that there were too many hard no's when they left to actually get him confirmed. However, while they thought that potentially they could soften some of these hard no's, they also understood the fact that there was more information inside of that ethics report that was going to come out that was not going to help the cause. It's actually going to take away from some of the math there when it came to Matt Gaetz. Now, the other thing I was told is that there was a belief that there were more witnesses that had spoken to the Ethics Committee than previously known, which was obviously going to impact what kind of information came out of here.

Now, we are told that it was not Donald Trump pushing Matt Gaetz at this time to withdraw his name, that it was Matt Gaetz decision. Obviously, we are trying to figure out whether or not there were any side conversations with Gaetz about the numbers in the Senate that ultimately led to his decision. But right now, what we had been told was that not only was it just the math, it was also this idea that as this information came out, it wasn't going to help Gaetz. It was only going to be a distraction and actually probably cause worse math when it came to confirmation.

SANCHEZ^ And now, as the reporting indicates, it's back to the drawing board for the transition team. Kristen Holmes, Life Force in West Palm Beach. Thank you so much.

Let's discuss with our panel. We have CNN Legal Analyst, Carrie Cordero, Former Biden White House Director of Message Planning, Meghan Hays, and Republican Strategies for Axiom Strategies -- Strategist, I should say, Erin Perrine.

Carrie, let's start with you. These are not only some serious allegations against Gaetz, but also the evidence that's been collected against him that we've reported on leads to the question of why the Department of Justice, if they had this information, these Venmo payments, why didn't they press charges against him?

CARRIE CORDERO, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, the Justice Department obviously conducted an investigation, but they have standards that they have to go to. And those standards are supposed to apply equally to people. And they have to do with the fact of whether or not in the judgment of the prosecutors, they think that they would be able to actually succeed at trial and a conviction and that's the standard that they're supposed to apply equitably. And so in this particular case, they made the decision not to go forward.

Now, different people might look at that evidence and have a different view, but that's the judgment of the prosecutors. That was the judgment of the Department of Justice. And so in those cases, then the case is supposed to be over. And so what's unusual here is that information also was separately developed by the Ethics Committee and Congress, which is a political process, not a legal process.

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And so we have additional information that's come to light.

KEILAR: Yeah, because he was a member of Congress. And I wonder, Meghan, if you think it is looking like even more of a mistake. And I also wonder what you think, Erin, about this, for the Trump transition team to skip those traditional FBI background checks that might have allowed him to see this before spending a week on this kind of thing.

MEGHAN HAYS, FMR. BIDEN WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING: I mean, I am pretty sure that President Elect Trump knew what was in this report or under -- has an understanding of what he was being accused of him. And there's probably enough gossip running around, we all know a lot of the stuff in there. So I'm not surprised that they didn't know.

I do think it's a mistake not to have these FBI background checks. I think they lead into your security clearance. There's a lot of information that's really important there that I think is good for our country. And the people that are leading these agencies need to go through just as a standard practice to have the integrity and the character to lead some of these agencies. And I think some of this stuff comes out in those background checks.

ERIN PERRINE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think when it comes to the FBI background checks, they should be done as a member of Congress. All that information is really relevant to the people and to being able to do your job.

And I think that anything we can do as Republicans and, you know, for the Trump administration coming in to assuage fears or to take away some of the dynamite the Democrats are going to set around you, to try to blow up your nominations by putting out as much information as you can about your nominee on the front end and start spinning for them early. Not that that would have worked in this Gaetz case, but it can help down the road be able to blunt what could be one or two votes that really could take a nomination.

SANCHEZ^ Erin, do you share that sense of relief that Manu and others have been describing that now, this controversial nomination and what was undoubtedly going to be an explosive confirmation hearing process that essentially goes away now?

PERRINE: I think there are many Republicans across D.C. breathing a sigh of relief today. It was clear there was not only consternation from Representative Gaetz, his former colleagues in the House, but there certainly were in the Senate. There was initial reporting that that those meetings had gone pretty well on the Hill for him yesterday, but apparently that hell no caucus wasn't moving against him. And because of that, he's not able to go forward.

So this process kind of works the way it should at this point, and now it's up to the President Elect to get somebody into that role.

KEILAR: Do you think, Erin, there's more scrutiny on Pete Hegseth now that Gaetz is out?

PERRINE: Well, there's going to be rolling scrutiny on each of these people, right? They'll all get their moment in the sun and in the spotlight and with the heat. You know, Pete Hegseth, he took a question in the hall today. He's gaggling. He's a little bit unafraid and a bit more coming at this with his chest out through the nomination process. We'll see how that posturing works for him. He was unafraid to take that question today. I think that's a better sign for him being able to get through this process.

SANCHEZ^ Meghan, what do you think about the Hegseth nomination now that these details in this police report from the incident in 2017 have emerged?

HAYS: Yeah, I think that also the timing of Gaetz with pulling back from his nomination is interesting. With this police report coming out with Hegseth, I do think he's going to have an uphill battle. I think that more people are going to zone in on him and more details are probably going to come out. Also, these things start to open a floodgate of things. So if there's more people or more information that comes out, I think it will be problematic for him as well.

CORDERO: There's a couple differences, though, just to point out quickly, which is that with respect to Matt Gaetz, it was -- this has primarily been a conversation about fitness for office. His qualifications are maybe lighter than others who have been nominated for this position or held the position of attorney general in the back, but he was on oversight committees. It was really about the fitness and what this ethics investigation and the DOJ criminal investigation revealed about his fitness to serve in such a position.

With Hegseth, it looks like there's sort of two different pieces. One has to do with the fitness and these allegations that will be explored. The second has to do with basic qualifications to lead the Department of Defense, which is a multibillion dollar enterprise and critical to the U.S. national security.

KEILAR: I was just going to say on this police report coming out, which is 22 pages, is there anything as you look at this legal document that it sort of strikes you as unusual or something that stands out to you as a legal mind?

CORDERO: Well, this is -- this is a local, you know, this was a local police investigation. And so obviously they looked at it, but he was not prosecuted. So again, this falls into the category of an investigation appears to have been conducted, again, very different than any kind of federal investigation. This is a standard local police investigation, and they determined that they could not move forward. And that can be based on so many different factors. Credibility of witnesses, willingness of witnesses to come forward and pursue the case often is an issue in local cases.

SANCHEZ: You spoke a moment ago about the difference between an investigation carried out by the DOJ and a, you know, House Ethics Committee, a congressional style investigation, obviously one criminal, one political. How would you describe the capacity of a Senate committee, let's say in this case the Judiciary Committee or others, to look into these allegations against Hegseth? What resources are at their disposal to try to get some answers to the questions that are on these senators' minds?

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CORDERO: Well, the confirmation process is fairly robust. And I agree with you that this process is demonstrating that the constitution system is actually working. It's a little bit ugly and a little bit, you know, messy, but it's actually working as far as the Senate's ability to advise and consent and ultimately take a vote on these individuals.

So the confirmation process has questionnaires that are filled out. They can interview people and again, the big way that they're able to demonstrate their effort is through the public hearings, if they have them, because then they can call witnesses and they can ask under oath of the individual who's trying to step into this position and then they can compare those types of information.

KEILAR: Erin, what problems does this report about Hegseth present? Do you see any?

PERRINE: Of course. I mean, when he goes into a hearing, I expect hours of questions regarding that police report from Democrats on the Committee and possibly from Republicans on the Committee as well to be able to help balance his ability to answer those questions. You guys know you can ask the question the same way in two different ways and elicit an answer. So I think you might be able to see some of that.

It's something that Pete is going to have to prep a lot for, to go into his hearings and to go into senators offices and have those one on one conversations about why he would work at the DOD, what his vision would be, what he plans to do for President Trump and his ability to address the accusations that were levied in that police report.

SANCHEZ: Conversely, Meghan, I had heard from some Democrats that they were looking forward to having someone like Matt Gaetz. And now, obviously Pete Hegseth up for a nomination because it presents a confirmation hearing, a unique opportunity to ask questions and position themselves as figures in the resistance, if you will, if the resistance is still a thing yet to be determined.

Now, that that is reshaped with Gaetz stepping out and Hegseth stepping into this nomination process, what do you imagine that's going to look like? What will Democrats be looking to achieve?

HAYS: I mean, I definitely think that people are going to be looking to achieve if he has the character and the integrity and the fitness for office to serve in this role as DOD. I think one thing about the military is sexual assault is a huge issue in the military.

And I think that the Democrats, you know, Kirsten Gillibrand is a huge advocate for -- for this issue and I think she would take her opportunities to try to ask a lot of questions and draw a lot of attention to this issue. But I do think Democrats will take an opportunity here to say that the President Elect is nominating people that are not fit to serve in his admin -- in this administration to lead our country forward.

KEILAR: Yeah, military sexual assault is a plague on our -- on our military. And actually I think we've seen for years and years we've seen terrible numbers and there was just one indicator which we need to see if that's actually just a blip or if it is going in the right direction. But that is -- that would be the DOD, Erin, that Pete Hegseth would take over.

PERRINE: And this is the opportunity to be able to address his vision for that about he has served, he's served abroad, he served in combat. I believe he knows what this looks like. He's seen the inside of the military infrastructure serving our nation.

With that said, that also gives them the opportunity to really show a little bit of heart here and humanizing to address the sexual assault that happens in the military and how we're going to be able to root it out as a nation. Because if you are brave enough to put on any service uniform in this country and defend the red, white and blue, we should be able to defend you and make sure you're safe in doing so. And that includes sexual assault. This is an opportunity for him to show some heart when he has that talk.

SANCHEZ: Erin, Meghan, Carrie, thank you all so much for the conversation. Appreciate it.

Still plenty more news to come on CNN News Central. The International Criminal Court issuing arrest warrants for a top Hamas official and two Israelis, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu for alleged war crimes. We'll tell you how Israel is responding in just moments.

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SANCHEZ: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu now has a warrant out for his arrest. The International Criminal Court accusing Netanyahu and his former Defense Minister, Yoav Gallant of war crimes and crimes against humanity. The ICC also issuing a warrant for Hamas Military Chief Mohammed Deif, though Israel claims that he was killed in an IDF airstrike.

Netanyahu's office says that Israel utterly rejects the absurd and false accusations. And the move compels ICC members to now arrest Netanyahu and Gallant, though key powers, including the United States, are not signatories. This all comes as the Palestinian death toll from Israel's war in Gaza has climbed to more than 44,000 people, according to the health ministry there.

Let's get some perspective now from CNN Senior National Security Analyst, Juliette Kayyem. Juliette, thank you so much for being with us. Talk to us about the extent of the authority that the ICC has to execute these warrants.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: So it's not self-executing. So the International Criminal Court is relatively new. It was -- it came out of basically a Rome Treaty in 2002. And it means that it's 100 signatories, of which you note the United States is not one, are required or permitted to arrest the person under ICC, essentially indictment should that person appear or be in their country.

The ICC is obviously in the midst of a very political fight. We'll get into that in a moment. But it is not recent or new that it would go after world leaders, leaders of countries.

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It is putting Netanyahu on the same plane as Putin as well as Assad in Syria.

We can debate whether that's correct. But this is consistent with how the ICC has seen its jurisdiction in terms of human rights violations. And in particular, reading what they released today, they are very focused on food deprivation that that is really a triggering aspect of how the ICC is framing this case against Netanyahu.

SANCHEZ: And, Juliette, what are the practical implications for someone like Prime Minister Netanyahu? Obviously, he travels the world frequently. Now, having this warrant out for his arrest, I imagine it limits him.

KAYYEM: It would likely limit him, or he'll get agreements from countries that he is going to travel to that they would not -- they're not required to arrest him. It's a sort of voluntary aspect of the ICC.

I think Netanyahu travels less than he used to. There are very few countries that would want him. But he does -- has traveled to the United States in the past. He's likely to meet with a new president, President Trump.

But those sort of legal issues are sort, you know, kind of in the backdrop of what is clearly a political issue going on now. And without getting into the merits of what you want to call what the war is going on between Israel and Hamas, it is also a war about images and about visuals and about sort of a war with public perception.

We see this in the United States, and basically Netanyahu and the Israelis, as well as the United States simply say, this is an inaccurate representation of what in fact is going on in Gaza and are rejecting this, basically this description of what the war is, which is essentially, it violates human rights.

SANCHEZ: I wanted to ask you about the incoming Senate Majority Leader, John Thune, threatening sanctions against the ICC unless the prosecutor stops pursuing warrants against Israeli officials. Over the summer, the House actually passed a bill to enact similar sanctions. Do you think any kind of sanction could sway the ICC and make it reverse course on these warrants?

KAYYEM: Not unlikely. I mean, when we decided not to be a signatory, we were taking a long view. Lots of debates in legal circles about this, that --that we would rather sit on the outside and criticize the ICC or funding, or try to control it that way, than be on the inside and have to always vote no or reject -- or reject their findings. And so we sort of made that decision decades ago in terms of the United States policy.

But as you know, this is also quite political because of support for Israel in this country, but also growing condemnation in both political and of course, activist networks in terms of how the war is being conducted. From what I've read from Israel, it's only, you know, sort of strengthened the way Netanyahu talks about the war and what his -- what his goals are. So I think it will have little impact in the United States Israeli alliance.

Where it's going to have impact is in this sort of -- sort of propaganda fight about what's going on in the Middle East. Netanyahu is talking about a seven front war and we see basically a war, we don't call it that in Lebanon, of what Israel is doing and elsewhere. And so to the extent you're seeing the Middle East and the Arab countries refocus and realign in ways that we're barely talking about in the United States, in particular, a growing Saudi Arabia, the Iranian network or sort of, I wouldn't call it a friendship, but a growing acquaintance between those two enemies in the past is going to change the dynamics for Israel.

And look, I recognize as much as anyone the politics of this, the concerns that it reflects antisemitism and the concerns that it is a condemnation of Israel's self-defense. But we cannot deny that over a year later there is also a lot of evidence of what is happening in Gaza and that is what the ICC ran with.

SANCHEZ: Juliette Kayyem, very much appreciate your analysis. Thanks for joining us.

KAYYEM: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Still to come, another, another E. Coli outbreak, this time in ground beef. We'll break down --

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