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Trump Expected To Offer Kelly Loeffler Job As Agriculture Secretary; Judge: Trump's Hush Money Sentencing Is Postponed Indefinitely; Questions Remain Over Hegseth's Confirmation Chances; TX School Board Approves Curriculum That Incorporates Bible Lessons. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired November 22, 2024 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:00:40]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: President-elect Donald Trump has a new pick for Attorney General, but his plan to overhaul the Justice Department remains the same. We have the latest from Mar-a-Lago, including another new potential Cabinet pick.

Plus, Trump's spokesman is calling a new court decision a decisive win for the President-elect, after the judge overseeing Trump's hush money case postponed his sentencing indefinitely. What we know about what factored into that ruling.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And Gone Guy: A kayaker accused of faking his own death, is now talking with police. Ahead why he did it and what legal problems he could be facing now.

We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SANCHEZ: Today, Donald Trump's initial pick for Attorney General, Matt Gaetz, who withdrew from consideration after facing scrutiny over allegations of sexual misconduct and illicit drug use, says he will not be returning to Congress next year. Just hours after Gaetz dropped his bid for AG, Trump picked another fierce loyalist for the position, former Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi. Bondi has a longtime relationship with the President-elect. She represented Trump during his first impeachment trial and is one of the lawyers who promoted Trump's 2020 false election fraud claims.

We're also told Trump is expected to now name former Georgia senator Kelly Loeffler as his new secretary of agriculture. He's also meeting with Loeffler this afternoon at Mar-a-Lago. We find CNN's Kristen Holmes not far from Mar-a-Lago in West Palm Beach, Florida.

Let's start, Kristen, with Trump's new Attorney General pick, Pam Bondi. What are you hearing on that front?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, Republicans that I'm speaking to, Boris, they say they are relieved that he came up with somebody who they think is confirmable. Now, it does also please his MAGA base because of the fact that she has said that she wants to dismantle the Department of Justice. She has also said that she believes you could use the Department of Justice for retribution. So she has echoed the same storylines we have heard from Matt Gaetz, the same narrative we have heard from President-elect Donald Trump.

And Trump clearly believes that Pam Bondi is someone who will help him execute this plan. Just a reminder, Donald Trump wants to gut the Department of Justice and he wants to move it completely under the executive and completely under power of the White House and thus him once he takes office. He wanted somebody who would go along with that.

So it's not all that surprising that he picked Pam Bondi because she has been such a loyalist to him because of what we have heard her say. Now, it was interesting today, we did hear from Matt Gaetz in an interview for the first time since he withdrew his name and since Donald Trump named Pam Bondi as the next nominee for Attorney General. He talked a little bit about why he withdrew his name. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATT GAETZ, WITHDREW AS TRUMP'S PICK FOR ATTORNEY GENERAL: And again, while our discussions were going well, I found myself having to do two jobs at one time, Charlie, and you got a front row seat to this. I had a full time job explaining to senators that maybe a tweet I sent about them was rash and not reflective of how I would serve as Attorney General. And at the same time, I was having to build out the Department of Justice with the right human talent, the right policy infrastructure. And Pam Bondi's confirmation won't have some of the sharp edges.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Now, while we know Matt Gaetz had said a lot of polarizing and negative things about a number of senators that he likely did have to explain in those meetings, we also know that there were a lot of other concerns as well. I spoke to a number of allies of Donald Trump's who believed that there could be more damning information coming out of that ethics report. They also believed that there were more witnesses than they had previously known about who had possibly talked to the Committee that would then be in that ethics report.

And it became more and more clear every moment that he did not have the votes to get confirmed. So while he might have also had to defend some of his mean tweets, we know there were other things looming in the background.

SANCHEZ: Sharp edges, huh? Kristen Holmes from West Palm Beach, Florida, thank you so much. Brianna?

KEILAR: Donald Trump's sentencing in his criminal hush money case is now officially on hold.

[15:04:59]

Today, the judge overseeing the case confirmed that he's postponing the sentencing indefinitely. CNN's Paula Reid is with us now. Maybe we saw this coming, but this is a big move, tell us what happened.

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: It is. We knew unofficially that the sentencing wasn't going to happen next week because earlier this week, the District Attorney's Office said they would be okay with postponing the sentencing until even after Trump is out of the White House. But what they weren't okay with is dismissing this case.

And just a few days ago, Trump's team made it clear that they're going to continue to try to get not just the sentencing delayed, but the entire case thrown out. They're going to argue that under the Constitution as president elect, Trump should not be subject to any state level proceedings. It's unclear if that is going to work, but they have other irons in the fire.

They've also argued that the Supreme Court's recent immunity decision means that this case should be tossed because there was some evidence that came in during that trial, where Trump was convicted on 34 counts of falsifying business records that they argue would be barred by the immunity decision because the Supreme Court said, not only can you charge people for official acts, you also can't use their official acts as evidence. So they're referring to things like Hope Hicks' testimony, but the judge has not ruled on that.

But there were also federal level appeals trying to get this case tossed. So what we got today was a calendar for next steps. He gave the Trump attorneys until December 2nd to file their arguments. Now they had asked for a deadline of December 20th, and it's notable that they were given until December 2nd because that is also when Jack Smith, the special counsel, has said that he would reveal how he's going to wind down the federal cases.

And Trump's lawyer said they wanted to see those arguments, the federal arguments before making their state case because they want to incorporate some of Jack Smith's reasoning in this argument. Clearly, Judge Merchan didn't want to give them a lot of time to contemplate that. So it looks like the judge is appearing to try to maybe make a decision before the New Year. But it's unclear what the fate of this New York conviction will be, if it will hang over Trump while he's in the White House or if Judge Merchan or even a federal judge might find grounds to dismiss it.

KEILAR: All right. We'll see what is waiting for him on the other side of these four years. Paula Reid, thank you so much. We do appreciate it.

Let's talk about some of these headlines with former Fox host Geraldo Rivera. He is currently NewsNation's correspondent at large.

Geraldo, thanks so much for being with us.

GERALDO RIVERA, FORMER FOX NEWS HOST: Hi, Brianna. Nice to join you. Thank you very much. KEILAR: I first want to get your thoughts on Gaetz and his withdrawing from contention. Are you surprised that Trump didn't end up going to the mat politically for him?

RIVERA: I'm relieved, tremendously relieved. I don't know if I am particularly surprised. Matt Gaetz is a toxic stinker of a legislator. I think that he would have been a horrible choice at the Department of Justice. He's barely a lawyer. He's never prosecuted anything. You know, he has a couple of hours in his - in a family firm down in Florida. His, you know, his sex with the underage - alleged sexual encounters with the underage young lady, the 17-year-old in Florida, and the threesomes, and The New York Times releasing, you know, the diagrams of how he paid off scores of these ladies allegedly with PayPal and Venmo is just a lowlife.

I don't know, you know, how the president picked him. I will never know. Seems that it was an impetuous choice. You know, there are a lot in the potential Cabinet, Brianna, that are very controversial, but at least they are arguably competent. Not like this guy, this guy who tried single handedly to destroy the House of Representatives, you know, going off their, you know, the speaker, Kevin McCarthy. It's just, you know, it is a relief.

And Pam Bondi and compared to Matt Gaetz is the best choice you could possibly make. I mean, whatever - the relative quality of these two people is profound and I wish her the best. I've known her for years, interviewed her many times. She was a regular on my at Large show on the weekends and often run into in the green room with Hannity. She's a real prosecutor, a county prosecutor, you know, with vast experience.

Yes, she's controversial with Trump University and a bunch of other things that I've heard you mentioned, but she's the real deal.

KEILAR: Do you question her independence?

RIVERA: You may not like her politics, but ...

KEILAR: That's - and to that point, Geraldo ...

RIVERA: Well, it's a question, I ...

KEILAR: ... do you think she's independent?

RIVERA: That is - I think that's a fair question and I think that we have to watch and see. You know, I'm not sure. Will she be Merrick Garland? No. On the other hand, she's tough on crime. I, you know, I think that she'll do an excellent job from the prosecutorial point of view.

Politically, I don't know if she'll go along with Trump on everything.

[15:10:03]

She certainly is a close friend of the President-elect. But I hold out hope for her and I rely on her. You know, she was - when she was re-elected, Brianna, she got 55 percent of the vote. So the people of Florida have judged her and decided that she was doing a good job, Brianna.

KEILAR: So I do want to ask you, I mean, with Gaetz gone, now there's more focus on these other picks. And there are a lot of critics of Trump's defense secretary pick Pete Hegseth, who say that he's unqualified. People like Congressman Jason Crow, Jake Auchincloss, Sen. Tammy Duckworth, among many other veterans.

Last week, you said of your former colleague that I think it would be a very, very steep learning curve for Maj. Hegseth, but I think that if anyone can do it, he can do it. And you said some very positive things about him. I wonder, has your opinion changed at all since this police report from the 2017 uncharged investigation into a sexual assault allegation against him came out.

RIVERA: Also a fair question. I did not know about that 2017 alleged sex assault. I think that it certainly merits investigation, and people should ponder its significance in terms of his confirmation. But I go back to what I said last week. I don't retract that at all. I know Pete - Maj. Pete pretty well over the years, in Fox & Friends Weekend and, you know, have socialized with he and his wife, Jennifer.

And I think that he has to get enormous deference for the fact that he is a legitimate combat veteran, twice awarded the Bronze Star, one of the foremost advocates for veterans in our country. He's very popular among that community. Can he run a business with three million employees? I don't know. But I do know that everybody, you know, that has any center-right kind of feelings, believe that the Defense Department has gone too ordinary, too woke is the term that they use, too much with DEI and, you know, not enough with ferocity and lethality, and war fighting capabilities.

So maybe Pete will inspires that whilst keeping, obviously, the care, the treatment of GIs foremost in his concern. My wife, Erica and I disagree with Pete on his opposition to women in combat. You mentioned Sen. Tammy Duckworth, a helicopter pilot who lost both of her legs in combat; Tulsi Gabbard, a colonel with combat experience, also combat veteran, she will be his colleague in the Cabinet if both are confirmed.

So I think that Pete is wrong headed in some of these big issues, but I also think - I go back to what I said before - I think Maj. Pete is one of those guys, you know, Brianna, you just trust them. I don't like the tattoos and all that stuff, but, you know, I have tattoos too.

KEILAR: That's interesting. And it is interesting to get your perspective as someone who spent a lot of time with him. But I also want to ask you about Dan Bongino, because I'm sure that you saw this. He's being floated as Secret Service director. The possibility of - I mean, there you go. And I just want to be clear for our viewers who are familiar. You two sparred a lot on Fox and man, am I being understated when I say that? How would you feel about him being Secret Service director? RIVERA: I can't imagine anyone who I feel more fiercely combative with than Dan Bongino. If he were to walk into a bar and I was having a beer, you know, we'd probably square off. We disagree on everything. You know, we - you know, I think he has his own set of facts. I think he's, you know, a provocateur.

But I go back to what I said about Maj. Pete. I have no issue at all with his with his honesty, his credibility, his character, his, his love of the Secret Service. I think all those things are positive for Bongino. And, you know, I think that in some ways all of these people in the Cabinet and you could name others as well, Dr. Oz, are great on TV. They are bigger than life. They're great communicators.

I see where the President-elect is going with this Cabinet. Can they do the job? You know, the day-to-day, the administrative stuff running these businesses, and they are giant businesses, even though they're government agencies, you know, I guess we'll see - some will, some won't.

[15:15:05]

But I - with Bongino, you know, I would - let me put it this way, If I was a target and Bongino was on the job, I feel that Bongino would keep me safe. He would do the job, Brianna.

KEILAR: That is very interesting. Geraldo, it's always great to have you. Geraldo Rivera, thank you so much for being with us.

RIVERA: Thank you. I'm delighted. Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

KEILAR: And still to come, pushing Christianity in public schools. The Texas State Board of Education just approved a new public school curriculum that incorporates Bible stories into elementary school teachings. We're going to be joined by a board member who voted against the measure.

Plus, new images reveal secret oil transfers from Moscow to Pyongyang as thousands of North Korean troops are sent to fight for Russia in Ukraine.

And then later, a massive seven week search operation. A Wisconsin kayaker presumed dead has been discovered to actually be alive and having faked his death. But officials aren't sure where he is exactly. We're going to explain as they're trying to get him home coming up on CNN NEW CENTRAL.

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SANCHEZ: Today, the Texas Board of Education voted to adopt a controversial new curriculum for public schools, allowing Christian Bible lessons to be taught in public elementary schools. The new curriculum follows Republican-led efforts in neighboring states to give religion, specifically Christianity, more of a presence in public schools.

The new learning material passed on a very narrow eight to seven vote this afternoon. We're joined now by Staci Childs. She's a member of the Texas Board of Education who actually voted no on today's referendum.

Staci, thank you so much for sharing part of your afternoon with us.

What's your reaction to today's decision?

STACI CHILDS, (D) TEXAS STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION: I'm not shocked, honestly. I knew that the vote would be tight and I knew that the materials would be passed today. It was in this vein that I tried my best over the past few months to make it as culturally relevant and as sound for not just black students, but students all across all different types of races and religions, but unfortunately we weren't successful.

SANCHEZ: It is optional for schools to introduce this curriculum, but it's on an incentive basis. In other words, they'll receive additional funding if they do so. What percentage of schools there do you think will adopt this Bible-infused curriculum?

CHILDS: A lot of the districts that don't understand how heavily Christianity is infused in these sets of materials will be looking at the financial implications. You get up to $60 per child if you opt into this Bluebonnet Learning just for ELAR.

So if I'm a superintendent of a district, I'm going to get the best bang for my buck and I'm going to opt into Bluebonnet. So there are huge financial implications as a result to districts choosing this material.

SANCHEZ: Staci, the supporters of this curriculum will argue that it's not just stories in the Bible that are infused into the curriculum. It's also stories from Islam, from Hinduism, from polytheism. Do you - it doesn't seem like you agree with that argument they're making.

CHILDS: Absolutely not. I saw one reference to the pillars of Islam. I saw one reference to a Hindu story. But if I may get into the details just briefly, Christianity is referenced three times in the kindergarten curriculum, four times in first grade, 17 times in second grade, 190 times in third grade, 81 times in fourth grade, and 66 times in fifth grade. And no one can convince me that if this goes to court that someone can't challenge the fact that Christianity is spread all across this set of materials.

SANCHEZ: For some folks, they may not find that objectionable. People that I've talked to in your state and others who might say what's wrong with introducing Christianity in classrooms, what would you say to them?

CHILDS: Yes, I think if you say that by being a Christian, I am a moral person, that is what the court would call excessive entanglement. Take a second grade lesson in the Bluebonnet materials on William Wilberforce, for example. Wilberforce was a great abolitionist who spoke against slavery in the United States. And in the materials, they talk about how he was a Christian, and it was because of his Christian faith he took a moral stance against slavery. And then they asked the students: Do you think that William Wilberforce was a moral person? Why was he moral?

And they expect the students to answer he was moral because of his faith. So if I'm a student, I now think I need to be like William Wilberforce. I need to be a Christian, and I need to have faith because that makes me moral. That's wrong.

SANCHEZ: I do want to ask you about a neighbor of Texas, and that is Oklahoma. Their education chief has ordered a copy of the Bible for every classroom in the state, a decision that's being challenged in court. Do you expect that this curriculum in Texas is going to be challenged in court and who might lead the effort to overturn that decision?

CHILDS: Yes, I absolutely think this is going to be challenged in court. I suspect that the ACLU will be the one to lead the effort.

[15:25:01]

But look, I represent District 4 in Houston, Texas. I represent the most diverse place in Texas. I represent Muslims; people of the Sikh faith, right; people that even have no faith that are agnostic, these people should see themselves reflected in the material just as much as a Christian. So, yes, I think that this is going to get challenged tremendously in court.

SANCHEZ: And quickly, Staci, with an incoming administration that has tapped Linda McMahon potentially to lead the Department of Education, a conservative leaning Supreme Court, Republicans holding both chambers of Congress, how do you think that kind of leadership at the federal level may impact what's going on in Texas and how that challenge may go?

CHILDS: Yes, I think some - depending on the legal team that these people have, they'll have a hard time. I see what's going on nationally, but I still think people should fight. I think they're going to have a struggle. I think the way that the courts are stacked all across the United States up to the Supreme Court, they're going to have a struggle. But despite that, I think anybody worth their muster. Anybody like myself who cares about their law license and the oath that they said that they will defend the Constitution of the United States should believe in the separation of church and state, and they should act in that vein.

SANCHEZ: Staci Childs, we appreciate you sharing your perspective with us. Thanks so much for joining us.

CHILDS: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Up next, North Korean troops seen wearing Russian uniforms inside Russian occupied regions of Ukraine. As Vladimir Putin warns, he will keep testing a new ballistic missile system he fired at Ukraine on Thursday. Details on that in just moments. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)