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TikTok Loses Bid To Strike Down Law That Could Ban It From The U.S.; QAnon Followers Celebrate Kash Patel As Trump's FBI Pick; Mysterious Flu-Like Illness Kills 143 In Congo In Just 2 Weeks. Aired 2:30-3p ET
Aired December 06, 2024 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:30:00]
COL. PETER MANSOOR, U.S. ARMY (RET.): But, you know, the government is looking at what's going on and probably making a calculation now, which is better, you know, Assad, who's a murderer and has blood on his hands, or HTS, which is an unknown quantity and potentially could, you know, develop a terrorist regime itself.
I -- my guess is HTS will win out if they -- if they take over. But we'll see.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: You know, it is truly, not to overuse the word, just an extraordinary time in Syria as we we're watching.
Colonel, thank you so much for talking with us.
MANSOOR: Thank you.
KEILAR: Coming up, a major legal setback for TikTok. The app just got one step closer to being potentially banned in the U.S.
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[14:35:19]
KAYLA TAUSCHE, CNN HOST: TikTok is running out of time. Today, a federal appeals court upheld a law that would ban the social media app in the U.S. next month unless it's Chinese parent company agrees to sell it.
Let's discuss the impact of the decision with Lance Ulanoff. He's TechRadar editor-at-large.
Lance, it's great to see you.
This decision was more or less expected, but it means that TikTok is one step closer to a ban, of course, unless it's parent company, ByteDance, agrees to sell it by January of next year.
ByteDance said in April they didn't want to sell. Do you think they've changed their mind?
LANCE ULANOFF. EDITOR-AT-LARGE, TECHRADAR: No. I really don't. I still think they consider it a point of pride that this is such a globally popular app and extremely popular in the U.S.
Even though TikTok instituted Project Texas, which basically took the whole the whole company, the U.S. part of it, made it a U.S. operation. So they theoretically have a lot less control over it. But there's just been no signals.
And it's also unclear who can really afford to buy them.
TAUSCHE: Well, there were a lot of potentially interested suitors four years ago. Microsoft tried to buy them. That deal fell apart. Oracle then tried to buy them.
And you still have several investors circling the company. Not least of which Trump's former treasury secretary.
But I'm wondering if you think there's any one of those buyers who could actually put together an offer that would pique TikTok's interest?
ULANOFF: Well, look to be fair, you know, this is an inflection point, right? Now the clock is ticking. And we're -- we're entering that area of uncertainty.
You know, between now and January 19th, what is going to happen? Something must happen. It is super unlikely that TikTok wins its appeal. You know, if it goes to the Supreme Court, it just doesn't seem likely it's going to happen.
So what TikTok won't -- I don't think ByteDance will let TikTok simply evaporate from the U.S. market. So it may now finally be interested in entertaining that exit idea.
But can anybody put together the right number for them? I don't know. It would take someone big. It would take someone, maybe Apple size.
TAUSCHE: Interesting.
Meanwhile, though, President-Elect Trump, for his part, has appeared at least more willing to allow the company to operate, which, of course, as you know, is a major reversal from 2020, when his opposition to the app set this whole process in motion.
Like what changed between then and now?
ULANOFF: Well, an election changed. I mean, you saw that all the candidates went on TikTok, right? He joined TikTok and became part of it because, you know, reaching 170 million Americans and especially a demographic that they all really want to talk to, which was the younger demographic.
So you know, you sort of -- you know, sometimes you just that's your strange bedfellows.
But it is -- you know, it's honestly quite unclear because we know that Trump has said, you know, that if you ban TikTok, it would make META stronger. META is an American company. But Trump has -- you know, he really doesn't like them very much.
So I don't know entirely what's going to happen. But a lot of it will probably have to do with the people around Trump and what they think.
And one thing I want to emphasize here is that, in this whole time frame, when people have asked legislators and people and government officials, what are they so afraid of, like what have they seen that makes them so worried about ByteDance?
There are certain things they've never told us. They say they've seen things that give them great concern. We just don't know what those things are.
TAUSCHE: And you mentioned the people around Trump. One of them happens to own a different social media platform. So we will see if he can do anything before January 20th. Likely not. And it will all come down to the courts.
Lance, thank you.
[14:38:56]
Still to come on CNN NEWS CENTRAL, why the far-right QAnon community is excited about President-Elect Trump's choice to lead the FBI.
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[14:43:23]
KEILAR: QAnon followers are reacting with glee to President-Elect Donald Trump's pick of Kash Patel as the next FBI director, in part, because of a years-old clue from the so-called Q.
CNN's Donie O'Sullivan takes us inside one of the epicenters of deep- state conspiracies.
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DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We are here in beautiful, sunny Florida, right by Mar-a-Lago. We're on our way to meet a QAnon influencer.
UNIDENTIFIED NARRATOR: What you know, you can't explain.
O'SULLIVAN: For years, Jeffrey Pedersen, a former I.T. guy, has been running the Matrix Groove Show.
JEFFREY PEDERSEN, HOST, THE MG SHOW: Welcome back to the MG Show, where the truth is learned, it's never told.
O'SULLIVAN: It's a show devoted to all things QAnon.
PEDERSEN: If you think QAnon is bad, you're believing the mainstream news.
O'SULLIVAN: Deciphering the cryptic codes from Q and trying to figure out the deep state and the Kabbala and everything else.
PEDERSEN: This is Q post 1828. This is the spy op.
O'SULLIVAN (on camer): And the reason we're here is because he has had as a guest on his show, Kash Patel, who might become the next FBI director.
PEDERSEN: Kash is on the show today. Let's bring him in right now.
KASH PATEL, DONALD TRUMP'S PICK TO LEAD FBI: You guys are the best. I love being on your program.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): Patel has dipped his toe into this QAnon world a bit over the years, has flirted with us.
PATEL: On Truth Social, there's a Q account. Whether or not it's the real Q, I'm not going to get into.
MARY GRACE: Are you a QAnon (ph)?
PATEL: So, like -- so, like everything else, you have to have fun with it. The Q thing is a movement. A lot of people attach themselves to it. I disagree with a lot of what that movement says, but I agree with what a lot of that movement says.
[14:45:03]
O'SULLIVAN: The QAnon movement has long been associated with radicalization and hate. And QAnon iconography was seen throughout the January 6th mob.
PEDERSEN: Is that Donie O'Sullivan?
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): Yes. Glad you're here.
Q has posted how many times?
PEDERSEN: 4,967 times.
O'SULLIVAN: Q posted about Kash Patel?
PEDERSEN: Yes, twice.
O'SULLIVAN: And said, Kashyap Patel, a name to remember.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Q has been so right on so many things. I'll get off that subject.
PATEL: No, he has. And I agree with you. He has. He has. And you've got to take of -- you get to harness that following that Q has garnered and just sort of tweak it a little bit. That's all I'm saying.
He should get credit for all the things he has accomplished because it's hard to establish a movement.
O'SULLIVAN: Who is Q?
PEDERSEN: I don't know. Q says it's 10 people, three non-military, less than 10. We don't know. I see people trying to say that Kash is Q. You can't prove that. I can't prove that.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera: For a lot of people, Kash Patel engaging in the world of Q and QAnon at all, they'll say, well, that's disqualifying.
PEDERSEN: But what you're going to find out is that we have a mandate in America and we want the FBI cleaned. You know, 99 percent of the FBI is good. You know, but there's a 1 percent that is not good.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): The anonymous Q persona hasn't posted in a few years. But the world of QAnon is still very real for people like Jeffrey.
PEDERSEN: News unlocks what the Q posts are. Like, you know, like, for example, Kashyap Patel, a name to remember. Kashyap Patel has just been nominated as the FBI director. Right? That's a Q proof, what we call it.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): Couldn't I just say, well, Q has posted 5,000 times. He just posted a name. Like --
PEDERSEN: Yes, you can absolutely say that. And -- but what about all the other names?
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): In our interview, Jeffrey made it very clear that he condemns violence. He's not a fan of the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers or other groups that conspired to cause violence on January 6th.
PEDERSEN: I always say, you know, we're not going to make fun of liberals because we're going to be here for them when they wake up.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): But there is a lot of portrayal of Democrats, of people on the left, of being evil.
PEDERSEN: Yes.
O'SULLIVAN: Do you think they're evil?
PEDERSEN: Not all of them, no. Do you -- I think there are some? Yes. Like Hillary Clinton, maybe? I don't know.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): As for Kash Patel, Jeffrey and other QAnon influencers welcome him as the country's top law enforcement officer.
PEDERSEN: I think the American people will be happy that Kash Patel is going to straighten out what they've done to President Donald J. Trump and the FBI. And I think America should be happy as well.
O'SULLIVAN (on camera): And a Trump transition spokesperson dismissed any links between QAnon and Kash Patel and described our story as a pathetic attempt at guilt by association.
Back to you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KEILAR: All right. Thanks to Donie O'Sullivan for that.
Health officials are warning about a mysterious and deadly new illness, dubbed Disease X, one that has killed dozens of people. We're going to talk to an infectious disease expert about it next.
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[14:52:07]
TAUSCHE: A mysterious illness in the Democratic Republic of Congo has killed as many as 143 people within just a two-week period.
KEILAR: Local health officials and the World Health Organization are racing to identify the source.
So let's talk about this now with Dr. Michael Osterholm. He is the director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota.
Doctor, symptoms here include fever, headache, cough, anemia. What does the information tell you about what this disease could be?
DR. MICHAEL OSTERHOLM, DIRECTOR, THE CENTER FOR INFECTIOUS DISEASE RESEARCH AND POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA: Well, first of all, I think there's been a rush to judgment that this is somewhat of a mystery disease.
And while, in fact, we don't yet know what's causing it, it's not been because we've tried looking for it and found that there was no answer. It's because the lab tests that really needed to be done just weren't done.
This was in a remote part of the DRC. And while cases started in late October, we're just now getting the first lab tests completed.
So I suspect actually within the next 24 to 72 hours, we probably will know what's causing this situation.
TAUSCHE: But those symptoms that we just listed, normally, Doctor, they're not fatal. So why do you suspect they are with this illness?
OSTERHOLM: Well, first of all, you have to understand that a number of the cases are in children. And we know that in this area of the DRC, malnutrition is a real problem in young children.
So the anemia issue that you raise may have nothing to do with the overall underlying condition of the what's causing the outbreak.
In terms of the respiratory like symptoms that you just mentioned, which sounds like early influenza, it sounds like it could be any number of respiratory illnesses. And I suspect that when the final numbers come in, they're not going
to be quite the same we've heard. I've actually had numbers that range from 29 to 179 deaths, all since October.
So there are now the right health officials on the ground. We're going to know what the real numbers are. We're going to know, is this, in fact, one single disease, or is it a series of respiratory viruses that may be causing the problem?
And again, I come back and just remind us all. I think once we get the lab tests completed this weekend, we're going to know what's causing it.
KEILAR: Yes, I mean, it's a vulnerable population as you say. There are vulnerable populations in many parts of the world. So why is this really sparking so much interest?
OSTERHOLM: Well, I think, coming off the pandemic, there's a heightened sensitivity to any kind of serious illness that might be occurring in the community.
We're seeing it right here in the United States as it relates to avian influenza and H5N1.
In this part of the world, we're concerned that, if we don't find out quickly what's causing it, it could continue to spread, much like mpox did two years ago and continues to spread.
And so there was really, I think, a lot of attention paid to this one, once it was finally recognized.
[14:55:01]
Remember, this is a remote area of the DRC. The public health authorities have limited numbers of people working in that area. And so this kind of went on for some time.
One piece of information I think that is important for people to understand, if you look at the cases back to early November, late October, you'll see that there hasn't been a big increase in number of cases per week. In other words, it's roughly been about the same number week after week.
So there's no evidence that this is explosive or that it's quickly growing in numbers, which is also, again, another reassuring point of information that is reassuring.
KEILAR: That is reassuring. But certainly, a lot of questions. And we hope that they're answered as quickly as you anticipate they may be.
Dr. Michael Osterholm, thanks for being with us.
OSTERHOLM: Thank you very much.
KEILAR: Police have some brand-new clues in their search for the gunman who killed the CEO of UnitedHealthcare. What we know about the latest evidence, next.
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