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Police: Seven People Taken To Hospital After School Shooting; Police: Four Killed, Shooter Dead At Wisconsin K-12 School. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired December 16, 2024 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30;00]

SHON BARNES, CHIEF, MADISON, WISCONSIN, POLICE DEPARTMENT: Every child, every person in that building is a victim and will be a victim forever. And these types of trauma don't just go away. And we need to figure out and try to piece together what exactly happened.

Right now, my heart is heavy for my community. My heart is heavy for Madison. And we have to come together as a community and figure out what happened here and make sure that it doesn't happen in any other place. That should be a refuge for students in our community right there.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What sort of gun related policies, if any, were in place at the school? And did the school have metal detectors?

BARNES: I'm not aware that the school had metal detectors, nor should schools have metal detectors. It's a school. It's a safe space. So I don't know.

Again, it is a private Christian school. It is not under the -- the authority of MSDS. And that is something that we'll have to look into.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Chief, of the of the of the of the seven victims, how many are students? How many are teachers?

BARNES: We're not going to give -- I'm not going to give any information about who the student, who the victims are, whether they're students, staff or parents, because we need to make sure that we can notify people. I think that's the most important thing before we go any further.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: But police -- but police didn't.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: They never fired their weapons. That is correct, right?

(CROSSTALK)

BARNES: I don't -- I don't -- I don't know if it's a male or a female, but the police department did not fire their weapons. Thank you.

BARNES: Scott?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Are there three fatalities you mentioned, including the suspected shooter?

BARNES: That's correct. Yes, sir.

(CROSSTALK)

BARNES: That's correct.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Are the seven that was transported, are the three fatalities within that seven are addition to that?

BARNES: Yes. Within that seven? Yes. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Was the shooter a student at the school?

BARNES: We believe the -- the shooter was a student at the school, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What can you tell us about the status of the other transports?

BARNES: We know that they range from minor -- minor injuries to life threatening. I know that's a huge, you know, spectrum, but that's what we know now.

And so we need everyone, again, to send your thoughts and your prayers out to them.

One thing I do know is that we have some of the best medical care in the country here in Madison, and so we -- we hope that everyone will recover. But at this time we don't know.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So we did just get an update from our command post five deceased at this time, five injured.

BARNES: So a total of 10. A total of 10.

Again this is -- this is an ever evolving situation. You know, just -- just hearing that, What does that make you think? How does that make you feel that we have to do a better job in our community on a Monday? Right. So close to Christmas that we're updating victims.

And so there's a lot of work that has to be done, and we're committed to doing that work. We just ask for your patience.

I think the most important part is the reunification. Again, that we spoke about making sure that those persons who we're in the schools, whether they staff, whether they're staff, students or what have you, are reunified. And we have done that.

Again, I want to say thank you to all our partners. Again, our friends are here from the ATF. They're going to help us. I heard the question about the gun. I don't know yet, which is why we have a great partnership with the -- with the ATF that will help us determine the origin of this gun and where it happened.

So I'm going to -- I'm going to leave it at that and we will have another press conference. Stephanie has the location.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're doing 2:30 at Fire Station 14 in their community room, 2:30, Fire Station 14.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Can you confirm the five who are dead? Does that include the shooter?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That does include the shooter.

BARNES: It was. Yes, it was.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- students, teachers, mix?

BARNES: Yes. Again -- Again, we're not going to talk about -- about that until we notify all the families that may be involved. Again, this is --

(CROSSTALK)

BARNES: Again-again, this is an ever, ever evolving situation and we're trying to figure it out.

What did you say, ma'am?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- school has been cleared? Are all the students out of the school?

BARNES: The school has been through a secondary clearing. We're doing another one now with the help of bomb dogs, just in case. We want to clear vehicles and things of that nature.

So we're going to take our time and we're going to go through we're going to do everything that we can.

So thank you very much and well see you soon. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Fire station 14.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Today, there are many families there in Madison, Wisconsin, who are having the worst day of their lives just before the holidays, after the latest school shooting here in America.

As you heard, the police chief there saying this today is a sad, sad day. He said, for Madison, for the country as another police chief is doing a press conference in a place that's supposed to be sacred, a school there.

He said five people. And that was updated in the middle of his press conference. It went from three to five killed. Seven people had been transported to hospitals, and some of those have unfortunately died.

And he's not able to say if it's students, faculty, if it's a mix, because they're still in the process of notification of families.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Yes, you could hear the frustration in the voice of Police Chief Shon Barnes there as he was describing this as a sad day, talking about how there were actually medics who were training just three miles down the street from here for this exact scenario, who we're called in to respond to it.

[13:35:05]

He says that at about 10:57 a.m. local time in Madison, police responded to an active shooter call with multiple gunshot victims. When they arrived and began doing a search of the premises, they found a juvenile deceased, believed to be responsible for the shooting.

The police chief there also clarifying that the shooter was believed to be a student, though he would not provide any further details about who exactly the student was, what grade or age they may have been.

Again, five people deceased, five injured, and currently receiving treatment at local hospitals.

We have a panel of experts with us along with our reporters.

Let's first go to CNN's Shimon Prokupecz.

Because, Shimon, you were texting in the last hour or so with Chief Barnes, and you heard him there describing this as a tragedy. I wonder what the next stage of the investigation is, as we are set to hear from police in roughly two hours.

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME & JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, sadly, like Chief Barnes said, you know, I've unfortunately had to cover many school shootings in my career and this is just horrific.

And I think the next step is going to be with this community and how to deal with what they are about to face. You know, the media and the many questions that-- the families are going to have.

And I've gotten to know Chief Barnes because I just did a story with him recently. And, you know, he himself was an educator, and he takes this very seriously. He's one of those police chiefs who wears his emotions on his sleeve.

And he's very forward thinking kind of police chief. And that's why we're seeing him do this press conference so quickly. He believes in the right to information and putting stuff out there.

And no doubt for him in this community, obviously this is going to be a very, very, very difficult time. You're dealing with a student who is the alleged suspect here, a juvenile who opened fire on classmates, on teachers.

And now, obviously for the community, there's going to be many, many questions of why and how. And that's something that Chief Barnes and his team there is going to work on figuring out. And we'll hear again in the next couple of hours from the chief again.

But you can hear from the chief. I mean, just today there were medics that we're in training with how to deal with this, and they left the training to go to the scene.

This is something that the chief said his team just trained for just a couple of weeks ago. They are constantly training for this, that potentially this could happen in their communities. And here we go again. This has happened in his community.

So we have five dead, including the gunman. It appears at this point that the injury is self-inflicted. The police did not open fire. They found the suspected gunman as they were going into the school.

Immediately, when they got to the school, they saw victims. They saw students and teachers with gunshot wounds. And then they took action. And as the chief said, they started giving treatment.

You heard the chief there talk about what they trained for. That is you go towards the gunfire, you stop the dying, you stop the killing. And that's what the chief said happened here.

They went towards the victims. They went to clear the rooms. They went to get the victims out of the rooms to get them to the hospital. Some sadly died on their way to the hospital or while at the hospital.

But now is going to be the big question of why and how, and what they can do to try and help this community as they try to heal now in Madison, Wisconsin.

So as I said, the suspect believed to be a student, a juvenile also killed here. Four other victims. And we have yet to learn the breakdown of, how many were students, how many we're teachers?

We know that at least one of them is potentially a teacher, because that's what the chief told me. They believe that a teacher was fatally wounded as well.

So now we wait to hear more, obviously, and we wait to deal with another community yet again having to deal with such a tragedy.

KEILAR: Yes. As you said, everyone is a victim here. This school is k through 12 little kids, big kids, all of them kids. And this is what these almost 400 children, right before their holiday break, have encountered today there in Madison, Wisconsin.

And we should note it was just about 90 minutes ago that police were responding to this. So they are very much in the throes of notifying parents, Shimon.

PROKUPECZ: Yes. And the other thing we have to remember, you know, what this -- you know, so many other parents now who have suffered through this, you know, like where, in Uvalde, every time there's a school shooting, you hear from these parents. It brings back those horrific memories for them. Like in Connecticut.

[13:40:01]

So, yes, everyone who has been through this. And I think what the chief said there was so right, everyone is a victim. And yet again, as he said, this happens again.

And that is also kind of what such a -- always such a tragedy in all of this, that it doesn't only, right, just affect this one community. This is going to affect so many, so many people. And here we go.

You know, yet again, for the -- for families who have suffered through this gun violence, school shootings, and to have just these small kids that were sitting in their classrooms, walking their halls.

For this community, it's going to be a very, very, very, very difficult time.

SANCHEZ: Yes. As the police chief said, everyone there is a victim, also noting that he is a father with kids in school.

We just got very significant information. Five people killed at the Abundant Life Christian School in Madison, Wisconsin, including the shooter in this apparent school shooting dead of an apparent self- inflicted gunshot wound.

We have plenty more news to bring you. Please stay tuned to CNN. We're going to take a quick break. We leave you with sound from a local resident in that area heard.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN DIAZ DE LEON, MADISON RESIDENT: Well, what I heard was ambulance, ambulance, squad car, fire engine. And I thought they were on 51.

But I heard -- I went to the Internet and looked up the scanners and the scanner said they were doing triage at city church parking lot. And I went, oh, what's going on at church? Because this is where I go to church. And my kids went to school here at ALCS.

So I came down and I never saw so many squad cars. I didn't know there were that many squad cars in Madison as they came to support the kids.

We saw a few guys with long guns. They went in the school with a dog. And then later on, a little later on, I saw groups of kids coming out of the school in groups, into the church sanctuary, probably as they we're in lockdown and clearing the building and slowly taking out the kids bit by bit by bit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:46:46]

KEILAR: We've just learned that President Biden has been briefed on the school shooting in Madison, Wisconsin, at a K through 12 school, the Abundant Life Christian School, where we learned just a short time ago from the police chief there that less than two hours ago, officers responded to calls about an active shooter.

And what we now know -- and this was actually a number that was just advanced in the course of the press conference -- that five people we're killed in this shooting.

That includes the juvenile that police believe to be responsible for this shooting, dead of what appears to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound. They believe that the -- the juvenile was a student at the school.

But there were several people transported to hospitals. Some of them have unfortunately died. But again, what police are now saying four killed.

SANCHEZ: Yes, four killed and the shooter as well.

KEILAR: And the shooter as well. Five total.

SANCHEZ: Yes, at this K through 12 school, a private Christian school, one that had roughly 390 students enrolled there. This was the Monday before Christmas break. At the end of the week, they we're set to go on Christmas break.

Something that Police Chief Shon Barnes mentioned in his comments, how some of the families in this community are going to have to endure a holiday season without their loved ones, without children, perhaps also without adults in their lives.

As we noted, it's believed that at least one staff member was shot and killed during this incident.

We have a panel of experts with us, Ed Davis and Juliette Kayyem have been standing by.

And, Juliette, first, I want to go to you.

Just given what we've heard from the police chief there, pointing out that there are five deceased, five injured, but that he cannot get into the details of who those folks may be, in part, because families have to be notified that they've lost their next of kin.

I do wonder what the process is like to identify a suspect in this situation, one that we should note in which officers discovered this juvenile already deceased when they arrived on the scene.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes. And just to just to take just a brief moment, because I think, sometimes, we can forget this, just how absolutely jarring it was to have the police chief be told the number had increased in real time. I think we say numbers like three, four. And you just saw his face

realize like, you know, yes, two more had passed away in the period of our press conference.

And i, having done this a million -- unfortunately, too many times, that was just so jarring to me. And you saw just how important it was for this police chief, who should be commended for this getting out there early, at least on the broader details about -- about that the assailant was essentially downed and that the school was deemed safe for now.

The family unification is -- is also practiced where we -- that's part of the school shooting protocols. They know now who -- who is dead and those families are likely already know now.

This is just going to be a matter of -- of making sure that they've processed the information.

[13:50:03]

And I think in the press conference in about 90 minutes who -- not maybe we won't learn names, but we'll definitely learn the ages.

If this assailant was -- if the killer was a member of the school, which we believe he's likely over 13 at least. Who was he? Was there suspicions about him.

And, of course, as part of this dialog now, we look to the parents. Where was -- were the parents aware? We're they ignored or did they help facilitate this in ways that we've seen in other schools, giving them access to guns?

That's the narrative of how these go, these sort of all-too- familiar incidents in the last, you know, couple decades.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly there will be a lot of questions about that.

And I do want to bring in Ed Davis, former Boston police commissioner.

Ed, we heard from Chief Barnes there, talking about how they had already done their secondary searches. Take us through -- but they're not done. Obviously, they're still collecting information and evidence.

Take us through what that looks like at this point in time and why that's so important.

ED DAVIS, FORMER BOSTON POLICE COMMISSIONER: Well, you're dealing with a person who has committed a horrendous act, and you don't know what other things that they were planning or they had in mind for you.

So you have to meticulously go through that -- that area where the person has been to determine whether or not there are any secondary devices, any ammunition has been stored or other guns have been stored in other places. I mean, this is a really intense search process. And then once the

area is secured and all the victims have been removed, you really have to secure the crime scene. And that can be a multiple-day process.

In the Marathon case, it was almost seven days of -- of securing evidence and recovering things. In an internal scene like this, it will probably be a couple of days.

But they -- they really have to build a case on this, not for prosecution. Unless, as Juliette said, there's some other person somehow involved in the -- in the -- in the providing of the firearms.

But -- but mostly, to just to make sure that we understand this thing right from the beginning to the end. We're trying really hard to figure out where the points of intervention are in situations like this, how you can stop it before it actually goes off.

And to understand that, you really need to methodically put together precisely every bit of knowledge that you can glean from the scene, from the background of the shooter, what the online profile is.

All of those investigative steps that you use in a regular case will apply here, so that we understand what happened.

SANCHEZ: And, Juliette, a part of that also goes to a question that, inevitably, everyone linked to this shooting, the entire community, will repeatedly ask themselves moving forward, and that is why, why something like this ultimately took place.

Help us understand what investigators actually go through, the process of going in to gathering information to determine a motive in a shooting like this.

KAYYEM: This is a Christian school. It's a religious school. It's a place of -- of worship and education. The two -- the two areas where we would once -- where we once hoped were safe spaces are not.

So -- so you know, what kind of motivation might have been related to that? It's just -- it's undeniable that that is going to be -- even though he was a student, that's going to be part of -- of this question.

What was his relationship to the school? Had he been kicked out of the school? Was he suspended often? Was that related to the schools?

The fact that it was not a public school, so had more flexibility. They are going to want to look at that. It's -- and -- and to determine.

Another way that they'll look at it is sort of what kind of clues was -- was he giving, both in the classroom and outside the classroom?

Again, those will come relatively quickly. We have seen almost in all of these cases -- by tomorrow, we will start to hear a narrative that he -- he was having issues or his family was having issues or -- or there we're suspicions about him. That generally is the case. People don't -- especially juveniles,

don't just wake up one day and there's a -- there's a story behind what they did in terms of this kind of shooting.

So I think, because it's relatively limited now, it's not like an outsider coming into a Christian school, it's its most likely an insider. It -- the narrative will be able to be formed through interviews, social media, if he was on it, other students who may have known what his behavior is like.

And whether there was a triggering event, like why today? The school's likely out of session by Friday, like most schools, because of the -- because of the holiday.

[13:55:04]

And you know, it's a -- it's a Christian school and it's Christmas week. And -- and we also have to respect and understand the -- the -- you know, the sort of layering of all of these things.

Shimon was talking about previous victims of school shooting. In this instance, a place of faith, as well as a school is going to have -- it's going to have ripple effects throughout the entire community.

KEILAR: Yes, it sure will.

Juliette, thank you so much.

We are going to get in a quick break. Just to update our viewers what we are following here, four killed at a school shooting in Madison, Wisconsin, at a K through 12 Christian school, Abundant Life Christian School, there in Madison, Wisconsin.

The shooter, who was believed to be the shooter, found deceased, a juvenile believed to be a student at the school.

We are getting new information. We will bring it to you when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)