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House GOP Leaders Eye Separate Vote Strategy to Avert Shutdown; Emerging GOP Plan Would Split Spending Bill Into Multiple Parts; Indiana Man Sentenced to 130 Years For Killing Teen Girls; Just Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired December 20, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:01:09]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: On to plan C. House Speaker Mike Johnson meeting with Republicans trying to sell them on a three part plan to fund the government. Can he win enough votes to avert a shutdown with just 10 hours left?

Plus, a Q (ph) CEO killer Luigi Mangione is in New York federal prison. His lawyers planning their strategy as federal prosecutors weigh whether to push for the death penalty.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: And popular weight loss drugs have become game changers for millions of Americans. But now more than a thousand people are suing manufacturers over side effects they say they've experienced. We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN News Central.

So lawmakers could vote as soon as ton as they race to keep the government from shutting down. But the big question is, will their solution come quick enough to protect federal workers from furloughs and to prevent essential employees from losing their paychecks. It all depends on whether House Speaker Mike Johnson can get enough of his colleagues on board with a brand new plan that breaks up their previous plans into at least three separate parts.

KEILAR: At least three separate parts. What could go wrong? But that strategy could be the key to getting a deal across the finish line before this midnight deadline. And there is less than 10 hours now until the clock strikes 12.

We have a live look at Capitol Hill now where high stakes negotiations have been going on all day. That's also where we find CNN Congressional Correspondent Lauren Fox. She has been a busy, busy woman today. Lauren, help us get up to speed with where things are right now.

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: So right now, Brianna, we are outside of the House Republican conference meeting and inside the room behind us, what we have been hearing is that no decisions have been finalized. The speaker and his leadership team have been walking members through sort of a menu of options. But right now, it doesn't appear to be there's any clear consensus on how to get House Republicans from this moment to making sure the government is funded in just a matter of less than 12 hours now.

So right now, it's unclear what the Republican plan is. They had been potentially eyeing this idea of breaking down legislation into three different parts, having three separate votes on farm aid, on disaster aid, as well as just a short-term spending bill to get them to March 14th. But it appears that they are still not fully announcing that that is their way forward.

And obviously that leaves a lot of room for doubt right now. I was talking to some Republicans who are coming out of here. One appropriator, Steve Womack, said he had no comment. To me, that can show that people are really at a crossroads right now. People are really frustrated, especially appropriators who had worked really hard on that original deal that was unveiled on Tuesday night.

So what comes next? First, Republicans have to make clear what their plan is. Once they make clear what that plan is, they have to set a vote on the floor of the House. Democrats have to decide if they're going to go along with this 11th hour plan. Then even if you can get this out of the House of Representatives, it still has not gone through the United States Senate, which any one senator could slow down that process across the Capitol. So a lot of moving parts right now and it's just not clear what happens next.

KEILAR: Not clear what happens next. Lauren Fox, we know that it will become clearer and when it does that you will be the first person to know. So thank you so much for that live hit from -- as I like to say, she's in the bowels --

SANCHEZ: Yeah.

KEILAR: -- of the Capitol, which kind of seems apropos, to be honest, at this point in time.

CNN's Kristen Holmes here with us now. We also have Jeff Zeleny. Kristen, a quick reminder of how we got here this week. It was Elon Musk who went on a social media rant appearing to channel the sentiment of Trump.

[14:05:04]

But he criticized Speaker Johnson's original plan to avoid a shutdown that set off this wave of blowback led to the deal's eventual demise. And now some are saying that he may actually be calling the shots. Elon Musk.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. And it's obviously not something that Donald Trump wants to be hearing right now. And that's why you heard him when he did a series of quick phone interviews. At least in one of them, he was reiterating over and over again that Elon was essentially asked -- acting at the behest of him, that they had had a number of conversations and he knew exactly what Elon Musk was going to do when he took to X to start criticizing the bill. And just a reminder, he didn't just criticize the proposal, he also was saying that anyone who voted for it should be primaried. I mean, taking it a notch up there, if you will. But this is not something Donald Trump wants to hear from Democrats or Republicans or skeptics that Elon Musk is the one calling the shots.

And that's why you're hearing a lot of senior advisers calling me, telling me over and over again, no, no, no. Elon Musk was acting out what Donald Trump was telling him to do. This wasn't Elon Musk's decision.

But of course, it's still going to raise a lot of questions because we see the enormous power that Elon Musk holds over really the media landscape, over these politicians in general, particularly given the fact that he donated roughly around $300 million to the campaign this cycle. They know that he has the funds to do so, to primary them. So it does raise a lot of questions.

SANCHEZ: It also raises questions, Jeff, about House Speaker Mike Johnson, not only his autonomy as speaker, but also his ability to guide his own conference and his future as well.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: It absolutely does. And look, this is something that talking to a lot of Republicans who generally like him and want him to succeed, they believe he has not handled this well at all. He did not get this done earlier in the week. He sort of let it go. And because a variety of competing interests, which always happens at the end of the year. But his -- this is the most complicated thing he's felt with or he's dealt with, obviously. And people think he and his staff haven't done it very well.

But now I'm told, I was just speaking to a senior, a Republican, whose boss voted for this last night, sort of walked the plank, if you will, and now is that they're complaining because they're being shut out, because the people who voted no are being brought into the discussions of how to get this going forward. So now, there's anger on both sides. And even more than that, the clock is ticking. So that is an issue here.

And Trump has been silent so far today, with the exception of this morning. I mean, he's been silent for several hours, so we'll see if he offers any more bat signals, if you will. But a lot of anger ending the year on Capitol Hill.

KEILAR: It was also fascinating. I was interviewing Republican Congressman Dan Meuser, and he kept referring to the White House. And he wasn't actually talking about the White House, he was talking about the transition, the Trump transition. But there is this feeling certainly that that's how they see it, that Trump is already in charge. That's how Republicans see it.

And sort of aiding that, Jeff, is -- is that you're not really seeing Joe Biden really out there. Now, he is a lame duck. We have to be clear. He's a lame duck president. But how is he doing in all of this compared to what you might normally see a lame duck president do in something like this?

ZELENY: I mean, he has been absent. There's no question about it. He had a conversation this morning with the House and Senate Democratic leaders Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer. And my guess is if there is a shutdown, the President would have to come out and say something. But right now, he can really not control much of anything on the Hill. Maybe the Senate a little bit like what they do.

But this is a rare example of the Senate is probably being jammed. Usually it's the lower chamber that gets jammed at the end of big deal like this. The Senate will probably be jammed on this. But look, he, you know, is -- has made the choice to step back. And part of it, I think, was -- really, I go back to the day that he had Donald Trump back to the White House. Really, since that day, President Biden has not been sort of out there as much. He's been kind of recessing day by day and certainly through all of this.

SANCHEZ: And it seems like that's the way that Trump would prefer it, given that there's this looming shutdown. Trump is basically saying he wants to pin it on Biden and Democrats. He also wants the debt ceiling raised under Biden's watch and not his own, even though when he was president, he suspended the debt ceiling three separate times.

HOLMES: Yeah, I mean, look, whether or not this ploy works, I don't think there's very many people out there who believe that this is going to be the Democrats fault. I mean Donald Trump would like to continue to pin it on them and say this is all under Biden's administration, it's all Biden's fault. But the entire reason the thing fell apart was because of Elon Musk and then Donald Trump putting it out there. So it's very hard to square those two things given that Donald Trump is the actual reason that this tanked, not Joe Biden.

And as Jeff is saying, we've seen him less and less Joe Biden visible every day and Donald Trump more and more visible every day. So how you actually get to a point where people are blaming Joe Biden for this, I mean that seriously seems questionable at this point.

[14:10:02]

But obviously Donald Trump and Republicans are going to continue to do that as much as they possibly can.

KEILAR: All right. Let's head back up to the Hill if you guys can stand by for a second. And we'll go up to Lauren Fox, who is there in the basement of the Capitol, which is where a lot of the action is. Lauren, what's happening?

FOX: Yeah, I just talked to one Republican member, Brett Guthrie. He was coming out of this conference meeting and he basically walked through what some of the options are. So I'm -- I want to walk you through them as well. One of the options, he said, is what we have been reporting, which is that you break this negotiation, this deal that they have into three different parts.

So you have one vote on disaster aid, one vote on farm aid, one vote on the spending bill to March 14th. And if they went that route, he said that they would want to go through the House Rules Committee. That would take some time and kick them into voting late this evening, possibly in the early hours of the morning.

He said the other option the leadership is looking at right now is having one vote, not going through the Rules Committee, putting all those pieces together and then doing it under the suspension of the rules. Now, the trick with that is you need two thirds majority, not just a simple majority. And that gets complicated because they would need a number, a number of Democratic votes.

In that meeting, Johnson, according to Brett Guthrie, said that he's having ongoing conversations with Jefferies, the Democratic leader, about the path ahead. But again, this is all still very fluid. But Guthrie just walking us through what some of the options on the table are right now and what they're talking about in that room. Again, he emphasized no decisions have been made at this point.

KEILAR: All right, Lauren Fox, thank you so much for that update.

SANCHEZ: Yeah, a nebulous situation --

KEILAR: A nebulous and sure is.

SANCHEZ: --to say the least. Yeah, we'll keep track of it. There's still plenty more news to come on CNN News Central.

Including this, for five years, his identity remained a mystery. But today, the killer known for so long as Bridge Guy was finally sentenced for the notorious murders of two young girls in rural Indiana. His punishment is up next.

KEILAR: Plus, the suspect's arrival in New York yesterday looking like a scene out of Gotham. We're going to discuss the -- we will discuss the potential impact on a future jury in the UnitedHealthcare CEO murder case.

And pack your patience

SANCHEZ: Pack your patience.

KEILAR: Winter weather paired with a possible government shutdown could put a damper on holiday travel. Not on our spirits, though, as you can tell we have that and much more coming up on CNN News Central.

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KEILAR: The man convicted of killing two teenage girls in Delphi, Indiana is given the maximum sentence, 130 years in prison. Richard Allen learned his fate earlier today. He was sentenced on two of the four murder counts against him.

SANCHEZ: It's been nearly eight years since the girls were killed. 13- year-old Abigail "Abby" Williams and 14-year-old Liberty "Libby" German disappeared after going on a hike near their small town. Their bodies were found the next day in a wooded area and the case went cold until two years ago when a long ignored tip was rediscovered, placing Allen at the scene of the crime. The sentencing judge told Allen that the killings rank quote "Right up there with the most hideous crimes."

Meantime, another major story to tell you about Luigi Mangione, the man accused of killing the UnitedHealthcare CEO. He's in a federal jail awaiting not one but two potential murder trials. One from state prosecutors in New York, where Thompson was gunned down in early December, the other by the Justice Department, which announced a new federal murder charge yesterday. Mangione arrived to New York yesterday surrounded by a swarm of law enforcement and government officials.

KEILAR: Among them, New York Mayor Eric Adams, who you see right there, who told our affiliate WPIX, quote, "I wanted to look him in the eye and state that you carried out this terroristic act in my city, the city that the people of New York love. I wanted to be there to show the symbolism of that."

SANCHEZ: We're joined now by Elliot Williams, CNN Legal Analyst and a former Federal Prosecutor. Elliot, sorry for that stumble in your introduction.

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: You don't call, you don't write --

SANCHEZ: Well, we're glad -- we're glad to have you back --

WILLIAMS: Good. Good. Good.

SANCHEZ: Just wondering, first off, what you made of that perp walk --

WILLIAMS: Yes.

SANCHEZ: -- clearly made for the world to see.

WILLIAMS: Made for the world to see and not good for the case. Anytime law enforcement is seen as belittling or making a public spectacle out of a defendant, they're possibly tainting the jury pool in New York that's going to have to hold this person in judgment.

Ultimately, a trial is, you know, a jury's -- the makeup of the jury is the community. And ideally, people have not come to conclusions about the case. If people are inundated with images of this individual being trotted out in front of police with the mayor wagging his finger in his face, it's just not good for the process or the system. They could have actually done that completely in private and driven him into the back door of the courthouse.

KEILAR: So, and I want to focus more on the Mangione case in just a moment. But we should also note that Adams himself has some legal problems --

WILLIAMS: He has -- KEILAR: -- right now. And I just wonder how you are seeing that and

what transpired yesterday as it pertains to legal problems of the people around him with that report.

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WILLIAMS: What's -- what's most problematic about Eric Adams statement there is he wagged his finger and said, you committed this crime. Putting aside any presumption of innocence on the part of that individual, when he has him -- he is himself facing charges. It's an odd disconnect to, you know, to be denying your own charges, but then -- but then pointing at somebody else and saying that --

KEILAR: Guilt before their presumption of innocence --

WILLIAMS: Guilt before their presumption of innocence from a person who, you know, if this is a question of federal charges, why is the mayor even weighing in in the first place? Like, I understand that there is still New York City charges, but everything is problematic about the mayor's conduct right there.

SANCHEZ: Between the federal charges and the state charges, we have a lot of questions.

WILLIAMS: Okay.

SANCHEZ: Yeah. The U.S. Attorney essentially said that the state case is going to proceed before the federal one. Why, in that order, is that typical?

WILLIAMS: Anything's typical. More than anything else, federal charges, and particularly federal death penalty charges can take a very, very, very long time to go to trial. When you're talking about empaneling a jury for a federal -- for a federal death penalty trial, there's in effect, two different trials.

They would go to trial first on the underlying crime and then have a separate trial for the purpose of deciding whether to give this person a death sentence. That's all after the whole case would have to go up to the Attorney General anyway for him to make a decision or her in the next administration to make a decision and as to whether the case would go. So it's just -- it's just far more complicated.

In the federal system, there was probably some agreement between states. Remember, there's also Pennsylvania here as well, and they're all working out their jurisdictional issues, too. But, you know, any number of reasons could have caused it.

KEILAR: In the federal complaint, we -- we became aware of this notebook, right?

WILLIAMS: Yeah.

KEILAR: And some of the evidence that prosecutors are going to use in that case. There were entries dating back to August. So that shows quite the workup to this alleged crime six saying, quote, "The details are finally coming together." And, quote, "The target is insurance because it checks every box". There's a separate letter addressed to the Fed saying, I wasn't working with anyone. This was fairly trivial. Some elementary social engineering, basic cat, a lot of patience. So what will his defense be in court?

WILLIAMS: Well, he doesn't have to present one at all. That's his right not to. If anything, it's calling -- holding the government accountable, making the government prove the case against him. But this is quite damning evidence. Also, it shows, number one, premeditation. But the main crime he's charged with in the federal government is stalking. It's seeking someone --

SANCHEZ: Elliot, we have to pause for a moment because Speaker Mike Johnson is speaking to reporters right now on Capitol Hill. Let's listen.

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MIKE JOHNSON, SPEAKER OF THE UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: But I expect that we will be proceeding forward. We will not have a government shutdown, and we will meet our obligations for our farmers who need aid, for the disaster victims all over the country, and for making sure that military and essential services and everyone who relies upon the federal government for a paycheck is paid over the holidays. I'll give you the more details here in just a few moments.

MAN #1: Have you talk to President Elect Trump about this? Have you talk to President Elect, Mr. Speaker?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: A very brief set of remarks from Speaker Mike Johnson. I believe that he sort of outlined his thinking when it comes to this new strategy, this Plan C of breaking up what initially was a large government funding bill that included all sorts of things into smaller pieces. And he spoke about there the importance of keeping the government open, not only to help government workers keep their paychecks and maintain steady pay throughout the holiday season, but also helping folks that were impacted by natural disasters.

KEILAR: We've talked about shutdowns before, but what we would be looking at if we proceeded to one this time is bigger than what we've seen before. We're talking about the military not getting paid, air traffic control working but not paid, TSA working but not getting paid. This is huge what we'd be looking at if they shut down. But there he is trying to assure people they're not going to have a shutdown.

But, man, are they leaving this until the last minute. The clock is ticking. We've got nine and a half hours here until midnight.

SANCHEZ: Yeah. And it speaks to sort of some of the uncertainty created by President Trump and Elon Musk weighing in on -- on this deal that apparently Johnson believed was a done deal as of a few days ago. I know we have Manu Raju who's working to get some answers from lawmakers. Let's go to Manu Raju now live on Capitol Hill. Manu, we couldn't catch all of Johnson's remarks, but it sounded like he was sort of presenting the idea that he wanted to break this larger bill up into smaller pieces.

MANU RAJU: Yeah.

SANCHEZ: And of course, --

KEILAR: All right.

SANCHEZ: -- we have technical difficulties.

KEILAR: We're going to move him 10ft to the left. And I have some faith that we may re-establish a signal. We've been having a little bit of an issue. The fact is, as you see, all of those, that lovely brickwork behind Manu that is the basement of the Capitol.

[14:25:01]

It is very busy down there and the reception isn't great. So we're going to get that under control.

We'll be right back ahead with more news. You hear the speaker there. He's saying we're not going to have a shutdown, but we need some more details. We'll bring those to you.

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SANCHEZ: Technology can be a tricky thing. We were having some difficulty hearing from Manu Raju in the bowels of Capitol Hill. I believe we have the signal now. And Manu, we were asking you about speaker Mike Johnson, who was talking to reporters, seemingly outlined --

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