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Trump Fires Inspectors General; Trump and Republicans Plot Agenda; Numbers on Americans Trust on Immigration; Rep. Morgan McGarvey (D-KY) is Interviewed about Police Reform. Aired 8:30-9a ET
Aired January 27, 2025 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[08:30:00]
ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: General from last week. He worked at the Department of Interior. And essentially he warned that the firing of these different independent watchdogs would quote - or he said, warned that, quote, "nominate and appointing political lackeys would harm Americans."
Take a listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARK GREENBLATT, FIRED INSPECTOR GENERAL FOR DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR: I don't know what the basis of the removal was, but we've been doing good, high impact work trying to help the American taxpayer.
We are the taxpayers' representatives inside the Department of the Interior. And I - what will President Trump do with these positions? Is he going to nominate watchdogs, or is he going to nominate lapdogs? Thats the key question.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TREENE: Now, Kate, as you could hear Greenblatt saying there, the concern is that these different inspectors general are meant to be independent and operate independently, not be political appointees. And this is something that actually we saw play out during Donald Trump's first term when he fired several independent watchdogs and argued it was because they were disloyal.
Now, Trump did confirm that he fired these people over the weekend, telling reporters on Air Force One that he believed some of them weren't doing their job well or unfairly. But I will note, he did not provide any sort of evidence to back up those claims.
But this is really why we're seeing a lot of reaction now from Capitol Hill, from members on both sides of the aisle, Republicans and Democrats alike, who are criticizing this move. One, to what you mentioned, he did not - the White House did not give Congress the 30- day notice that is required by federal law. But he also did not give really a substantial argument for this broad firing of these different inspectors general from several agencies. I mean it's not just the Interior Department, where Greenblatt came from, but also, we're told, the secretaries - or, excuse me, the Departments of State and Energy and so forth.
Now, I do want to read for you what we heard from Chuck Grassley, obviously a very well-respected, high-profile Republican, someone who has long been a defender of these different government watchdogs. This is what he said in a statement to CNN over the weekend. He said, quote, "there may be good reason the IGs were fired. We need to know that. If so," he went on to say, "I'd like further explanation from President Trump. Regardless, the 30-day detailed notice of removal that the law demands was not provided to Congress."
Now, we also heard a similar type of statement from Senator Lindsey Graham, obviously, a fierce Trump ally, over the weekend as well. He kind of shrugged it off, but he did note in an interview that he believes Donald Trump violated the law with some of these moves.
Kate.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Alayna, thank you so much.
Shrugging it off, but he did violate the law. There's a combo for you.
Joining us right now to talk more about this is CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Jennifer Rodgers.
Jen, what do you - just broadly, more than 12 IGs fired overnight, if you will. What do you - what do you think of this?
JENNIFER RODGERS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, 17, I think, although the White House wouldn't really give a number.
BOLDUAN: Right.
RODGERS: Which is startling in and of itself.
Listen, it's a terrible thing. These are the front line of fighting fraud, waste and abuse in the federal agencies. It's really the primary way internally that the executive branch fights corruption. I mean you have the courts, yes, you have Congress, but this is the way in house that you have someone independent looking at what the federal agencies are doing as they spend billions and billions of our taxpayer dollars and making sure that there's as little fraud, waste, abuse, mismanagement and corruption as possible.
So, it's a terrible thing. There are no reasons for firing these 17 individuals. The law that was violated in doing so was passed specifically to address the abuses in the first Trump administration by improperly firing IGs. So, he's completely blown past what Congress tried to do to strengthen the protections around inspectors general.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Chuck Grassley helped write the law. And I just read the law. I'm not going to read it now because it's a little boring.
BOLDUAN: Oh. BERMAN: But it's crystal clear.
RODGERS: Yes.
BERMAN: I'm just hung up on this whole, the White House is breaking the law thing. What happens when the White House -
BOLDUAN: Right, like, and shrugging, and we move on, right?
BERMAN: Yes, Yes. I mean, so, they're breaking the law.
RODGERS: So, you can sue. You can go to court. Congress can investigate.
The problem is, the law isn't that strong because of how much power the president has to fire executive branch employees. So, all the law says is you have to give 30 days' notice and give reason. So, at best, you get 30 days more in the chair and you get some reasons for your firing, but it's not going to keep them in their places.
So, I think Mark Greenblatt and others are more concerned about what happens now. Like, why is he cleaning house and doesn't want any eyes on fraud, waste, abuse, mismanagement and corruption in his administration, and who is he going to put into those positions? People who are probably more loyal to him and are going to look the other way, as opposed to the independent watchdogs we have now.
BOLDUAN: So, then what is the next - like, forget - not even the - you can - you can sue. The next is they announce new inspectors general and then it just moves on.
RODGERS: So -
BOLDUAN: I mean, this - how.
RODGERS: Hopefully what happens is Congress pushes back. They demand reasons for the firing of these people.
[08:35:02]
They'll give us some reasons. I mean they're not going to be satisfactory because they're supposed to be specific, fact-based, case-related reasons, right?
BOLDUAN: That's why - that's why more than a dozen in one fell swoop makes absolutely no sense.
RODGERS: Exactly.
BOLDUAN: It has to be substantive rationale.
RODGERS: Right. So, we're not going to get good reasons. But let's say that they satisfy the Republican Congress, right, let's at least hope that as he nominates new people and these people have to go through Senate confirmation that there is pressure on him to nominate people who are actually independent, who come from the inspector general community, who have a history of not being political one way or the other, but actually investigating wherever the facts and the law lead them and they really push back on who these nominees are going to be in the confirmation process.
BERMAN: And I just want to go back, if I can, one last time to the law itself, because actually the bar is really low in some ways for - for - but what that speaks to is the idea that this White House doesn't even think it needs to address the low legal bars that exist in some cases. Just bigger picture, what does that tell us about what they might do in other cases?
RODGERS: Yes, so, politically, this seems to me to be a real slap in the face to Congress, right? I mean they worked on this law. And I remember at the time there's not much that they could do, right, to strengthen these protections because of the power the president has. This is the most they could do. And even that, they're just brushing away and the White House is ignoring it.
So, I don't know if I'm the Senate, Senator Grassley, maybe I want to draw a line in the sand here and say, we're not going to stand for this. We're going to at least require that you do comply with this very low bar. And as you bring forward your new nominees, we're going to require that they be independent in the historical and very important traditions of inspectors general.
BOLDUAN: Yes, I mean, that - that's a good idea.
Good to see you, Jen. Thank you so much.
RODGERS: Thank you.
BERMAN: All right, this morning, President Trump hosting a Republican retreat at his golf club in Florida as they strategize how to enact his agenda with a slim majority.
And this morning, President Trump fulfilling his vow to, quote, "back the blue." The new move by the administration to halt any reform for police departments that were found to have engaged in a pattern of misconduct.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[08:41:47]
BERMAN: This morning, President Trump is in Florida for the start of the annual Republican Retreat. It just happens to be at one of his golf clubs. Members of Congress, Republicans, want specific plans for how he will pass his agenda.
CNN's Sunlen Serfaty is on Capitol Hill this morning.
They actually have a pretty big task ahead of them over the next several weeks, Sunlen.
SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: They certainly do, John. And this comes at such a critical time for House Republicans. This is a moment that - where they are essentially having to put pen to paper and move forward to plot out a strategy for how they will actually carry through and pass some of Trump's massive legislative priorities. And Speaker of the House Mike Johnson he has a tough road ahead here, including those among his own, really trying to convince them on the right path forward. He goes into this three day session with the stated goal that he wants to finalize a blueprint for how exactly they are going to enact these legislative priorities into one bill. And that's where he differs from many Senate Republicans. He wants one massive bill, including immigration, a tax plan, energy priorities, including many other priorities as well.
And so that is essentially a very tough tightrope that House Republican leaders are trying to walk here. They want to pass this massive bill through something called budget reconciliation, which means that they are attempting to pass this through without Democratic support, which means that this moment where House Republicans are gathering down in Florida is so essential for making sure that every Republican is behind this strategy. So, they are going to be hashing out a lot of policy differences. But the goal is, and they will hear from President Trump later today, and J.D. Vance tomorrow. The goal here is to come out of this unified so that they can push through on Trump's agenda.
But, of course, no small task here, John, especially when unity among House Republicans is sometimes in short order.
John.
BERMAN: And a must in this case because of their slim, slim margin. Sunlen Serfaty, on The Hill, great to see you this morning.
Kate.
BOLDUAN: And one of the things they need to be unified on is the Trump administration's immigration crackdown that they're rolling out right now, launching part of that immigration crackdown over the weekend with operations reported in multiple cities, with nearly a thousand people arrested on Sunday alone. President Trump has been in office for one week now, and there are new numbers now on how opinions on the topic issue of immigration have shifted, have changed since his swearing in.
Harry Enten is here. He's been running the numbers for us on this one.
What are you seeing?
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yes, what am I seeing? I just want to note, how different things are from where we were when Donald Trump first took office, and how much more the American people are on the side of Republicans than they were eight years ago.
So, trust which party more on immigration? You go back to April of 2017. Look at this. The Democrats held an 11-point advantage over Republicans. So, Americans were not liking what Donald Trump and the Republican Party was doing back at the beginning of his first term. Look at where they are now, though. Poll out just in the last week
after Donald Trump took office, which party do you trust more on immigration? Look at the margin Republicans are putting up here. A 22- point lead over Democrats. You rarely see issues in which the American people side so much with one party over the other.
[08:45:04]
But on the main issue that Donald Trump has been pumping up and Republicans have been pumping up since the beginning of his term, just - that began just one week ago, Republicans lead overwhelmingly on this. It's not just unusual for right now, it's just so much different than where we were eight years ago. It just gives the Republicans a lot more leverage.
BOLDUAN: And also, how are you measuring the boost or how much voters, Americans, are liking or how - what they're thinking about Donald Trump and what he's doing now versus Biden?
ENTEN: Yes, I - you know, we always talk about this right direction, wrong direction, right track, wrong track number, right?
BOLDUAN: Oh, yes.
ENTEN: And normally, you know, you might expect the right direction, right track number to be really, really low. And on immigration, what track is the U.S. on? You go back last month, just 14 percent of Americans thought we were on the right track according to Ipsos Reuters. Look at that, the wrong track was 62 percent. Look how much the right percentage is up this month since Donald Trump took office. It's up 23 points to 37 percent. Pretty much right next to that wrong track number at 42 percent. Still slightly more Americans saying we're on the wrong track than the right track, but the right track number has gone through the roof, up to 37 percent, a 23 point jump since Donald Trump took office.
So, the bottom line is this, many more Americans are saying that the country is on the right track right now. They're liking a lot more of what we're doing on immigration than just a month ago in the Joe Biden administration. They're liking a lot more what Republicans and what Donald Trump are doing than what they thought of what Joe Biden and the Democrats were doing.
BOLDUAN: Then I assume that the trend is the same when you look specifically at Donald Trump on immigration?
ENTEN: Yes, it's very similar. So, take a look here. You know, job Trump is doing on immigration. Here you see it, 46 percent approve, 39 percent disapprove. You don't have to be a mathematical genius to know that 46 percent is bigger than 39 percent. Americans approve of what Donald Trump is doing on immigration. They're much more likely to trust Republicans immigration than Democrats. And far more Americans say the country is on the right track when it - with concern on immigration than they did under Joe Biden.
Simply put, immigration is an issue that the Republicans and Donald Trump are going to do well over and over and over again because Americans are much more on their side than they are on the Democrat's side.
BOLDUAN: That's how it looks right now, which gives us a great baseline to compare as this crackdown continues.
ENTEN: We will see where we are two weeks, three weeks, four weeks, months down the road.
BOLDUAN: Yes, absolutely. Great to see you, Harry. Thank you.
ENTEN: Great to see you.
BOLDUAN: John.
BERMAN: We love you, Harry.
ENTEN: Thank you.
BERMAN: All right, this morning, can you smell that smell? Visitors at the Brooklyn Botanic Garden, they sure could. And that was the whole point.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, it smells like rotting garbage.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sweaty.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. It's like being in like a locker room.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gym. It's like a locker room.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's putrid.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's the worst thing that I ever smelled.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And it makes you think about patience. That's what I was thinking about. Like, that whole time it's been in the back here and they've been taking care of it and now - and you never know when it's going to bloom, and it did. So, I'm happy that I came.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: Happy that they came to smell the awful, putrid feet stench of a rare plant, a cousin of the famous corpse flower. Very famous. It has bloomed for the first time since arriving in Brooklyn in 2018. It is known for the stinking, rotting scent.
BOLDUAN: I'm excited about this, John.
BERMAN: I - well, look, I told you, I've been in the business for like 30 years and, like, every time - the corpse flower, every time we do a story on it, it's like it blooms for the first time in 100 years, but I've done it, like, 12 times. So, the math doesn't work out.
BOLDUAN: It depends on the flower.
BERMAN: The math doesn't work.
BOLDUAN: The math does math.
BERMAN: They bloom a lot.
BOLDUAN: It blooms, and only for a very short period of time, and it can be up to nine feet tall. The one in Brooklyn is six feet tall. I did a lot of research this morning. And it is an endangered species of plants.
ENTEN: Why are we smelling a plant that smells bad? Thats my question.
BERMAN: There's that too. There's that too.
ENTEN: Well, what are we doing?
BOLDUAN: Because we like unique things. We like strange things.
ENTEN: I guess that's why you like me, Kate.
BOLDUAN: I do.
BERMAN: Who smells great this morning. We'll end it there.
BOLDUAN: You smell delicious.
ENTEN: We all smell fantastic.
BOLDUAN: Just like -
BERMAN: All right.
BOLDUAN: Just keep going.
BERMAN: Quote, "dress for the cameras." The Trump administration ordering immigration officials to wear raid jackets to maximize media attention for the mass deportation efforts.
And a former member of Sean Combs' girl group breaks her silence for the first time. The new allegations she is revealing this morning.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[08:53:35]
BERMAN: All right, this morning, officials in several cities are vowing to honor agreements with the Justice Department to reform their police departments. This comes after the Trump administration said it was halting what are called consent decrees. These are agreements between cities and the federal government to change practices in specific departments.
With us now is congressman from Kentucky, Morgan McGarvey.
Thank you so much for being with us, Congressman.
Louisville is one of these cities that had entered an agreement with the Justice Department just this December, if I'm not mistaken. Now, if I'm also not mistaken, though, a judge had yet to sign off on the consent decree. Is that correct?
REP. MORGAN MCGARVEY (D-KY): That's exactly correct, which would mark the first time in the history of our country a judge has failed to do so. I mean, you're looking at Louisville, where the mayor, the city, the police chief, they have negotiated, they have - they have entered into an agreement with the Department of Justice. It's there. Both parties have agreed. It's in front of the judge. And now we're waiting for him to sign it.
BERMAN: OK. What would this consent decree have changed?
MCGARVEY: Yes, and I think you - what is a consent decree, right? The consent decree is when the Department of Justice comes in, finds that there have been abuses by the police department and seeks to settle with the city to say, how can we put in reforms, how can we have accountability that reform the police department so the entire community feels that it can be trusted and is protected and served?
[08:55:05]
That's what the city, the mayor, have agreed to. The Justice Department is on board in saying, you know what, yes, we think this is a workable plan but let's put it in front of a judge. But now the Trump administration and the Trump appointed judge are coming in, not at the 11th hour, the 12th hour, seeking to undo years of hard work by our community to get this done.
BERMAN: Well, you use - you use the present tense, what the Justice Department feels. The Justice Department felt that that was the right way to deal with it. It doesn't anymore. It's a different Justice Department. What do you see, or what do you read from the Trump administrations disapproval of consent decrees as a rule?
MCGARVEY: Well, I think we're seeing this across the board with the Trump administration right now. Whether it is the pardoning of January 6th rioters, or whether it is putting in Kash Patel as the director of the FBI, whether it's coming in and undoing consent decrees in places like Louisville. He is looking at doing things that put in loyalists, that - that put in something where - for political points he's able to do what he wants to do, not actually worried about keeping all of us safe.
BERMAN: You brought up the pardons of virtually all the January 6th rioters, including those who had committed acts of violence on police. Vice President Vance was asked about this, and earlier he had indicated he didn't think that people who committed violence should be pardoned, although he did leave this door open for some gray areas, but this is what he says now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MARGARET BRENNAN, MSNBC: If you committed violence on that day, obviously you shouldn't be pardoned. Did you counsel the president against these blanket pardons for 1,500 people?
J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, Margaret, I notice that you -
BRENNAN: Including those who committed violence?
VANCE: Margaret, I noticed that you cut off the thing that I said immediately after that. The full quote is that, of course, there are gray areas. And here's the nature of the gray area. Merrick Garland's Department of Justice denied constitutional protections in the prosecutions. There were double standards in how sentences were applied to the J-6 protesters versus other groups.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: So, all the acts of violence committed against officers fell into gray areas. How do you read that?
MCGARVEY: Yes. This is not a gray area. Someone who stormed our Capitol and assaulted police officers by trying to overthrow a valid election, that's not a gray area. That is black and white. And if you don't believe - if you don't believe me, come to the Capitol. Come talk to the Capitol Police officers. Listen to what they endured. Listen to what their friends endured. There were violent offenders there assaulting Capitol Police officers who were doing nothing more than trying to keep our Capitol and our government safe. This isn't a gray area.
BERMAN: All right, Congressman Morgan McGarvey from Louisville, listen, great to have you on. Please come back again soon.
Kate.
BOLDUAN: So, this morning, a woman who says that she had troubling interactions, how she described it, with Sean "Diddy" Combs is now speaking out about him as he awaits federal trial. D. Woods from the music group Danity Kane spoke with ABC News.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How was it predatory?
WANITA "D. WOODS" WOODGETT, FORMER DANITY KANE MEMBER: Somebody constantly treating you like a piece of meat. Only seeing - only valuing you for your sex appeal. And in - in some of the environments, you know, it was - it was even scary to be by yourself. You know, we'd walk with each other to the bathroom, stand in front of the door for each other. An abuser will knock your self-esteem down and then leave you to try to get their approval and their praise.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLDUAN: All right, Combs has been in federal custody since his arrest in September. His trial on sex trafficking and racketeering conspiracy is set for May. He has pleaded not guilty to the charges.
Breaking news right now. Let's take a live look at the Pentagon, where the new defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, is just now showing up.
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: That is something the Defense Department absolutely will continue to do. And today there are more executive office - executive orders coming that we fully support on removing DEI inside the Pentagon, reinstating troops who were pushed out because of Covid mandates, an Iron Dome for America. This is happening quickly. And as the secretary of defense, it's an honor to salute smartly, as I did as a junior officer and now as the secretary of defense to ensure these orders are complied with rapidly and quickly.
Every moment that I'm here, I'm thinking about the guys and gals in Guam, in Germany, in Fort Benning and Fort Bragg, on missile defense sites and aircraft carriers. Our job is lethality and readiness and warfighting.
[08:59:59]
We're going to hold people accountable. I know the chairman agrees with that. The lawful orders of the president of the United States will be executed inside this Defense Department swiftly and without excuse.