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Midair Collision of American Airlines and a Black Hawk; Trump Expected to Speak about Crash; Patel Confirmation Hearings; Gov. Glenn Youngkin (R-VA) is Interviewed about the Midair Crash. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired January 30, 2025 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: Defense secretary. As you know, this crash between a helicopter and an aircraft involved a military - a Black Hawk helicopter. And so we are expecting to hear some details hopefully from Pete Hegseth when he speaks. We will get to that as soon as that happens.

Joining us now, though, is CNN military analyst and retired U.S. Air Force colonel, Cedric Leighton. Also with us, CNN aviation analyst Miles O'Brien.

Miles, great to see you, as well as you, Cedric.

I know, Cedric, you just left the scene earlier today. I want to start, though, with Miles.

Miles, what are the things that had to go wrong? What are the things that had to break down when you see this mid-air collision, which is extremely rare?

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Yes, it is, Sara. But when you consider all the factors that go into it, you might wonder why we don't have more of a problem. This is incredibly constrained, constricted, restricted, prohibited airspace, and extremely busy. The helicopters fly in a low virtual canyon, basically along the Potomac River, up and down the river. They, on a good day, on their corridor, this route four, which goes right underneath that flight path, would have about 300 feet of separation from an aircraft approaching to land at Reagan National Airport.

Now, that's not a lot of separation on a good, sunny, clear day. But at night, when it's difficult to spot other aircraft, when you're in a sea of lights from the city, a crew could easily mistake, you know, a light on the ground or on other aircraft for the target they're being warned to avoid. So, there's a lot of factors here involving night visual flight rules in close proximity to airliners on instrument flight rules. Everybody has to really stay on their toes to stay out of each other's collision courses.

So, as we look at this, there may be some significant rethinks about the procedures along that Potomac corridor. KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And, Colonel, the combination here of a

military aircraft and a commercial aircraft, the fact that this was a military helicopter that collided with this commercial jet, does that make communications between the aircraft and air traffic control, does that add an extra element of complexity to this as we're trying to figure out exactly what Miles was talking about and what went wrong?

CEDRIC LEIGHTON, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, absolutely, Kate. One of the things to think about is that, you know, military aircraft usually use the UHF frequency band, the ultra high frequency band, whereas commercial use VHF. So, that, you know, means that they are on different frequencies. But the responsibility then is, of course, for the military pilots to contact the civilian air traffic controller. And in this case, we know that they did that. They know that they - we know that there was contact between the civilian air traffic controller at Reagan National and the helicopter. So, there are a lot of things that are unknown about this, but that is one of the complicating factors that could potentially, potentially have something to do with this crash.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Miles, the new secretary of transportation, Sean Duffy, said that the American Airlines flight was in a standard flight pattern and the military helicopter was in a standard flight pattern. Obviously, unspoken there is that they can't be both in the standard flight pattern at the exact same time in the exact same place.

Now, air traffic control, is it their job to keep them separate? And how? And what is the responsibility of the helicopter in this case because Sean Duffy also said, the secretary said that the helicopter was aware of the plane in the area, but he would not go so far as to say that the plane was aware of the helicopter.

O'BRIEN: Really good question here. This is right at the root of the problem here. And this is a nuanced response because if you look at the map horizontally, God's eye view, they were both where they should be. One was on the approach path for runway 33. The other was on this route four - helicopter route four, which flies down the Potomac. It's very important that the helicopters fly at about 200 feet in order to be beneath the traffic going into Washington National Airport.

Now, that aircraft at that point would have been at about 500 feet. So, on a good day that's 300 feet. That's not a lot of leeway. So, is it possible, with the air traffic controller, who was communicating with this crew, said, you know, avoid this CRJ on approach.

[09:35:06]

Could they have mistaken some other aircraft? There were other aircraft flying in the vicinity. Or, for that matter, not seeing it through the city lights? It can be very difficult at night in an environment like that to pick out traffic amid the - all the lights which are in the city.

So, it's quite possible they thought they saw the traffic they were supposed to avoid, were focused on avoiding the wrong traffic, and in so doing flew into the American Airlines flight, tragically.

SIDNER: Colonel Cedric Leighton, Sara here. I want to ask you a couple of things. One is, we've been hearing from the mayor, John just spoke to D.C. Mayor Bowser, who said that the commercial flight followed its normal path. Everything normal. But said nothing about the helicopter.

And then we heard earlier today from the American Airlines CEO, Robert Isom, who says, we do not know why the military aircraft came into the path of the passenger jet.

With these two statements that have been made, does this give us a real clue as to which way the investigation is going to go, as to who may have caused this accident?

LEIGHTON: Well, I think we have to be a little careful, Sara, when it comes to that because we don't know exactly what was happening in the helicopter in, you know, when it comes to these kinds of situations. One possibility is that the crew of the helicopter was wearing night vision goggles, and they might have been blinded, kind of to Miles' point here, that they might have been blinded by some of the city lights or by other aircraft lights. And there are all kinds of possibilities here. We may never know exactly what happened, but it's certainly something that needs to be looked at before one can specifically assign blame or find fault with one aircraft or the other.

SIDNER: This might be a foolhardy question, but why was there a training exercise at night knowing that this is such a tricky airport to navigate? Every single person and pilot we have spoken to have talked about how tricky it is to navigate all the aircraft, and just getting into Reagan National.

LEIGHTON: Yes, I'm sure the Army is going to be looking at - at that as, you know, as something to at least, you know, consider or reconsider when it comes to training.

But one thing that they do need to do, since these aircraft are designed, these Black Hawk helicopters are designed to fly in all kinds of conditions. And they also have specific operational missions that they need to carry out. One of them is the transport of high- ranking individuals.

But that is something that they need to do in all kinds of situations, at all times of - of day or night. So, it would stand to reason that they need to train for that.

The problem that you have, though, is, in your case like this, if the wrong turn is made or the wrong indicators is followed, then that, of course, could result in a tragedy like we have that we're experiencing last night and today.

SIDNER: Yes. And the recovery mission is continuing this morning in frigid temperatures in those waters. No one is expected to have survived.

Colonel Cedric Leighton and Miles O'Brien, you guys don't go anywhere. We'd love to keep you around. Thank you so much for your expertise this morning.

BOLDUAN: And our breaking news coverage does continue. Now only a recovery operation underway in the frigid waters of the Potomac River in Washington, D.C., after this tragic mid-air collision between American - an American Eagle jet and a military helicopter, a Black Hawk helicopter. No survivors on board. Massive investigation now underway.

We'll be right back.

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[09:43:23]

BOLDUAN: And our breaking news coverage continues. Word just in that we will soon be hearing from President Donald Trump about this deadly midair collision.

Let's get over to CNN's Alayna Treene. She's got much more on this reporting.

What are you learning, Alayna?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Yes, that's right, I just spoke with a source familiar with the plans, and they told me that President Donald Trump is expected to speak publicly and address the public from the White House Briefing Room at some point later today. Likely this morning, I was told.

Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy, who was just sworn in a couple days ago, is likely to accompany him, I'm told, as well as potentially other cabinet secretaries.

Now, of course, this comes, as we know, that Donald Trump has been monitoring the situation overnight last night. We know that he was in the Situation Room until very late. I spoke with him National Security Adviser Michael Waltz this morning from the White House who said he was with him. We also heard Sean Duffy say that he expected the president would be back in the Situation Room this morning to be continued to be briefed on what is happening with that midair collision and the latest on the ground here in the D.C. area.

Now, one thing that is also notable is we did see the president post just after midnight and saying that he believes from the information he has that this crash was likely preventable. Of course, we are waiting to hear what more information he can share regarding that today. We did hear Sean Duffy, the transportation secretary, said that he absolutely agreed with Donald Trump, that he believed that the crash was preventable as well. But of course, we are still waiting to gather more information on this and hear what the White House is learning.

[09:45:01]

But we are expected to hear, I'm told, from President Donald Trump himself at some point today. BOLDUAN: Great reporting, Alayna. Thank you so much for that.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, the confirmation hearing for President Trump's pick for FBI director has begun. Kash Patel, he was a controversial pick because of conspiratorial views he has expressed and some violent rhetoric he has posted online, targeted at those who take issue with Donald Trump.

Also grilled this week, Trump's pick for HHS secretary, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and his pick for intel chief, Tulsi Gabbard. Lot going on in Washington.

CNN chief legal affairs correspondent Paula Reid is standing by on Capitol Hill for us.

All right, what can we expect as Patel is in the hot seat this morning,

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Sara, I think we can expect some fireworks here. This is such a high stakes hearing. We're talking about potentially a ten year term to lead the FBI. And Patel is certainly one of President Trump's most controversial cabinet picks.

Now, I've been speaking with multiple sources close to Patel. I'm told he's been preparing for this moment, doing practice hearings with his team where he has rehearsed answers to the tough questions he knows he is going to face about his previous criticism of U.S. law enforcement, his comments about the so-called deep state.

Now, he's already met with many of the lawmakers on this committee. They're also hoping that the fact that he has done hundreds and hundreds of media appearances will prepare him for today. But, of course, Sara, this is a very different forum.

Now, I'm told he is going to try to emphasize his experience as a public defender, a prosecutor, a national security official. He is going to emphasize his fidelity to the Constitution and insists that his political views will not impact how he does this job, but that is highly unlikely to appease his skeptics.

We know he is going to face many questions about his so-called enemies list. And in speaking with my sources, there are differing opinions on his team about how to handle that. Some have encouraged him to express remorse for comments he made targeting specific individuals. This is what some Democratic officials did related to comments they had made that were negative about Republicans during their confirmation hearings. But backing down or expressing remorse does not always work well in MAGA world. So at this point, I'm told, it's unclear exactly how he is going to handle those questions about his so-called enemies list.

He really wants to emphasize his personal story of being the child of immigrants. His parents will be here, along with his sister, even his girlfriend. But I am told that he has revised his remarks and will address the deadly plane crash at the beginning of his remarks.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, Paula Reid, thank you for that. Appreciate it.

John.

BERMAN: And, of course, we have our eye on the breaking news this morning, the deadly mid-air collision of American Flight 5342 and a Black Hawk helicopter. Sixty-seven people dead. It is now a recovery mission. There are questions as this investigation is just now getting underway. Much more ahead.

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[09:52:42]

BOLDUAN: We continue our breaking news coverage. A recovery mission only now underway in Virginia in the waters of the Potomac River after a U.S. Army helicopter collided mid-air with an American Eagle passenger jet as it was on final approach into Reagan National Airport. And officials announced this morning at the beginning of our show that they believe there are no survivors. There were 67 people involved, 64 on the passenger jet and three in the Black Hawk helicopter. All of this playing out in Virginia.

And joining me right now is the governor of Virginia, Glenn Youngkin.

Governor, thank you very much.

This is - this - DCA is in Virginia. Fort Belvoir, where the Black Hawk took off, is in Virginia. What is the very latest that you are learning?

GOV. GLENN YOUNGKIN (R-VA): Yes, well, what a horrifically tragic night. And I first just want to express the deep sorrow and the moment for all of us to lift up the families that have woken up this morning to the shocking reality that they have lost a loved one. And I can't begin to even express the heartfelt sympathy from across the commonwealth. And you're seeing it across the country.

The first responders last night were incredible, and they came from everywhere. The Coast Guard was on the scene immediately with first responders from Virginia and D.C. and Maryland, state resources, federal resources. And into the frigid waters of the Potomac, they went in order to try to rescue people. And when we learned this morning that, of course, the strong belief is there will be no survivors, and we move to the recovery effort, again, the effort that is putting - being put forth in order to make sure that every loved one is accounted for.

And I spoke with Rob Isom from American Airlines early this morning. They are undertaking the - the just terrible task of having to call families, families of passengers and families of the crew members. This process will happen over the course of the day.

I have spoken with the chair of the NTSB, and they are assembling their investigative team.

[09:55:01]

Of course, when this moves to a recovery effort, they are on point. They will investigate what happened. There are lots of questions. Lots of really important questions to be answered. But the work today is to make sure that everyone is recovered and that families are given the tremendous support that they will need, not just today, but going forward.

BOLDUAN: Oh, absolutely. And we are just hours in. They have - they are still - they are still tragically pulling bodies out of the Potomac River. Families are still being notified. This is truly just unfolding. The tragedy is still just unfolding. And the investigation is still underway, which is why I won't ask you what you think happened or what went wrong.

But one thing that has been raised by everyone that we have had on, pilots, to members of Congress is, concerns over the - concerns about the level of congestion and air traffic around DCA.

Do you have concerns about that, Governor?

YOUNGKIN: Well, first of all, this morning the initial briefs were that everything was routine going into the approach for landing for American Airlines Flight 5342. And that, in fact, contact had been made with, of course, the military helicopter as well.

But of course it clearly wasn't routine. And we had two aircraft in the river with 67 fatalities. So, this investigation is going to be critically important to understand exactly what happened so that then we can make sure it never happens again.

Air travel in the United States is the safest form of travel of any of them. And it's the safest air travel in the world. And yet this - this horrific accident happened. And so, there is real work to be done. As I said, I spoke with the chair of the NTSB. They are aggressively moving personnel from all over the country in order to start this investigation. We will support them with every ounce of capability that we have at the state level. Muriel Bowser has said the same thing, as has Governor Moore. And, of course, the president was monitoring all night.

This will be a critically important investigation because this is a very busy area. It's been a busy area that has been safe. And what happened here is something that we must get to the bottom of to understand so it never happens again.

BOLDUAN: Absolutely.

Governor, you have an incredibly big job ahead of you with all of this now unfolding as this investigation gets underway. Fort Belvoir, where that Black Hawk took off, is in Virginia as well. So, you have military families as well impacted.

Thank you very much for your time. Let's see where this investigation takes us.

Thank you.

SIDNER: Oh.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

SIDNER: It's been a really hard day for so many Americans just watching what's happening there in D.C. Sixty-seven people lost their lives. Recovery is happening right now in frigid, terrible temperatures. And we've been looking at the pictures of the fuselage in three different pieces, as well as the helicopter, both found.

BERMAN: We're watching hearings on Capitol Hill all day as well.

Stay with us. CNN's special coverage continues right after this.

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