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Figure Skating Community Mourns Victims Killed In D.C. Tragedy; Sources: Trump Administration Gives At Least Six Senior FBI Leaders Ultimatum; Senators Grill Trump HHS Nominee RFK Jr. Over Vaccine Claims. Aired 7:30-8a ET
Aired January 31, 2025 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[07:30:00]
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: You've talked a lot about the now memo that the White House rescinded that put a freeze on federal spending, and you say that the actual rescission is somehow deepening the crisis. What do you mean?
SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT): Well, what the president announced was that he was rescinding the memo, but the freeze was still going forward. Now how could that be because there was a court order that said he had to stop the freeze. Well, the White House admitted that all they were doing was rescinding the memo because the memo was the only thing that the court order was relevant to.
Now, since that happened there's been another court order telling Trump that he really, really, really has to stop the spending freeze because it's blatantly unconstitutional.
What I'm saying is that Trump is telegraphing -- is admitting that he is going to do everything he can to get around the court orders in order to shut down the federal government in order to be able to stop all federal spending programs so that he can turn back on the programs that reward his political friends and keep off the programs that benefit his political enemies. That's what he's trying to do by taking control of federal spending is to help his billionaire friends and hurt folks like those that live in my state represented by Democrats.
The courts have intervened again. We're still figuring out whether the freeze is still in existence. I was getting calls yesterday from some of my not-for-profits in Connecticut -- those, for instance, that run homelessness programs -- saying that they still couldn't receive money.
It's all corrupt. It's all an effort to pad the pockets of his billionaire buddies. And I'm just very disturbed that he seems interested in getting around the court orders instead of obeying the court orders.
BERMAN: Senator Chris Murphy from Connecticut. Thank you for being with us this morning -- Sara.
SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Ahead, Canada, Mexico, China on notice tomorrow is the deadline for President Trump's promised tariffs. So how might it affect you and your finances?
Also, brand new exclusive video this morning obtained by CNN showing the trajectory of the helicopter and the passenger jet at the moment of impact, giving investigators new insight into what went wrong.
(COMMERCIAL)
[07:37:10]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KIM URBAN, FRIEND OF COLLISION VICTIMS: The Livingstons were just -- they were just a big personality family. They were -- they were loving. They were thoughtful. Donna and Peter were extraordinarily supportive parents. They were loving parents. They were doing anything for their children.
Alydia and Everly were, like, bright children, very talented skaters, and super bubbly. Just loving, talented. And it's just a tragic loss to our community.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: The most beautiful faces. That's a friend remembering a family of four, including 11- and 14-year-old figure skating sisters, all killed in the D.C. plane collision.
Of the 67 people who died in that tragedy 14 were members of the figure skating world and were returning from championships and an elite skating camp in Kansas when this happened. Now this leaving a community that -- just devastated this morning and paying tribute to these athletes, coaches, and parents.
CNN's Ed Lavandera has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NANCY KERRIGAN, 2-TIME OLYMPIC MEDALIST: We just wanted to be here with each other.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): Six members of The Skating Club of Boston died Wednesday. Olympic medalist Nancy Kerrigan came together with the Boston skating community after the unimaginable tragedy.
KERRIGAN: I'm not sure how to process it.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): Among the 67 victims of the deadly collision two teenage figure skaters, Spencer Lane --
SKATING ANNOUNCER: Would you please welcome to the ice Gina Hahn.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): -- and Gina Hahn.
DOUG ZEGHIBE, CEO, THE SKATING CLUB OF BOSTON: We watched Gina just grow up here from just a tiny little tike into this amazingly mature 13-year-old. And we talk a lot about the athletes, but I think we're going to miss their moms as much. Just really good people.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): Their mothers were also on the plane along with two coaches, Evgenia Shishkova and Vadim Naumov, from Boston seen here winning the 1994 World Figure Skating Pairs Championship.
DR. TENLEY ALBRIGHT, FORMER OLYMPIC FIGURE SKATER: I really can't believe that it happened because I picture them right here. The coaches always stood at that entrance. The skaters just flew all over the ice doing remarkable things, inspiring all of us.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): They were just a handful of a larger group of skaters on American Eagle flight 5342.
ZEGHIBE: Fourteen skaters returning home from the National Development Camp at Wichita, Kansas, put on by U.S. Figure Skating, were lost in the plane crash.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): The Russian couple's son Maxim returned home on an earlier flight and just medaled at the U.S. Men's Figure Skating Championship over the weekend.
An eerie silence at the Wichita Ice Center as the magnitude of the loss keeps growing. A mourner left a simple tribute on the bare ice days after an intense three-day training took place here.
[07:40:05]
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're some of my daughter's best friends.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): One of the crash victims was playing a video game with this man's 10-year-old daughter from the plane just before the accident occurred.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And she would always be there to talk to me.
LAVANDERA (voiceover): Tragedy has struck this skating community before in 1961 when the entire Boston Club's team was killed in a plane crash heading to the World Championships.
Other victims in Wednesday's crash over the Potomac River were three U.S. service members aboard the Black Hawk helicopter, and four crew members on the plane that left Wichita, including American Airlines flight attendant Ian Epstein, first officer Samuel Lilley, and Capt. Jonathan Campos.
MAYOR LILY WU, WICHITA, KANSAS: This is a terrible tragedy that will unite those in Washington, D.C. and Wichita, Kansas forever.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SIDNER: All right. With an investigation underway into the deadliest air disaster in the U.S. in decades, we have exclusive new video obtained by CNN showing the midair collision from a different angle. I want to walk you through one of those videos right now.
All right, let's go to this clip that appears to be shot from the airport grounds and shows the plane descending. That's on your right and the helicopter is on the left. And there you see they're continuing at a low altitude and then that explosion after they collide. Now after the explosion both aircraft, you can see, falling into the icy river below.
CNN aviation analyst Miles O'Brien is joining us now. We are looking at this video. Does this video, Miles, give you any better sense of what went wrong and how this rare midair collision happened?
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST (via Webex by Cisco): Yes, Sara. Watching it, it appears from the angle there -- hard to say for sure but it looks as if the Black Hawk helicopter was not taking evasive action at that moment. I could be wrong. It's difficult to see with the darkness.
SIDNER: Hard to see, yeah.
O'BRIEN: But we do know that air traffic controller, right about just before this, had warned the helicopter to be on the lookout for this traffic -- the aircraft which it collided with. And the crew acknowledged that.
The question is what -- when they said they saw the traffic what did they see? Did they mistake the aircraft for something else, or did they become distracted some other way, or is it possible there was some sort of mechanical failure which made it impossible for them to control the craft? All of those things will be in mind.
But I don't see any attempt at getting behind that aircraft, which was the instruction from air traffic control.
SIDNER: Yeah, it doesn't appear that there was any, as you said, evasive action by the helicopter.
The New York Times is reporting that the military chopper may have deviated from its approved path by flying higher than it should have been.
How would something like that happen when there are clear approved routes?
O'BRIEN: Well, we can say with certainty it was above where it should be. The airliner was riding down that -- the rails of instrument approach and had not deviated from that approach path or from its altitude.
The problem Sara is that airliner at that location -- if it's on the proper glide path, which this aircraft was, would be at about 400 feet off the surface. The helicopter corridor directly beneath that approach path requires the helicopter to fly no higher than 200 feet. Well, that is -- that's a very tight, no margin for error airspace arrangement and demands that everybody in that spot be completely on their toes and fly to complete perfection.
So why the helicopter was above the corridor altitude is the absolute core of this investigation. And that leads investigators to the cockpit voice recorder as much as anything to see what the crew was doing. Was it distracted? Was there some other failure of some kind that took their eye off the -- what was ahead of them?
SIDNER: Yeah. I mean, that is the main question now -- why that helicopter was in the position that it was in.
Our Pete Muntean has been reporting that there was one air traffic controller working two different tower positions. Is that normal? Is that something that would normally happen? And if not, what role might that have played?
[07:45:00]
O'BRIEN: Well, air traffic control in the United States is dramatically short-staffed. The FAA has been trying to bounce back from the pandemic. It lost a lot of people during that time. You can't just hire people off the street and put them in the control tower at Reagan National Airport. I think we can all agree on that.
So it's been a very slow rebuild of the ATC workforce. And the ATC personnel are working long hours under a stressful job on a good day. And so they do have a significant problem as they try to fill some 3,000 slots.
Having said all that -- and that is an important point -- don't get me wrong. I don't see evidence yet that this was a failure of air traffic control. It is the responsibility of the helicopter flight crew to see and avoid traffic. Air traffic control provides advisories in this case. There's a subtle distinction there.
SIDNER: Yeah.
Miles O'Brien, thank you so much for walking us through that on this day where families are just trying to deal with this tragedy. I appreciate you going through the investigation with me -- John.
BERMAN: All right, major news on other fronts.
This morning we're learning that at least half a dozen senior FBI leaders have to decide by Monday whether to resign, retire, or they'll get fired.
Let's get right to senior justice correspondent Evan Perez. Something of an ultimatum, Evan. What are you learning about it?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, John. Good morning.
This is a purge, really, that began last week at the Justice Department. Career lawyers that were being forced out or being reassigned as a way to hint at them that they should leave. And yesterday it started happening at the FBI.
Now, we'd heard for weeks from Trump transition officials that there were plans to move out top career FBI agents who they believed were associated with Chris Wray because he's been the FBI director for seven years and he promoted them.
And so yesterday as Kash Patel sat asking questions -- answering questions from senators during his confirmation hearing, some of these officials were brought in and told that they had a choice, which is to retire, resign, or be fired on Monday.
And so this, of course, came up during the hearing. Listen to Sen. Cory Booker ask Patel about this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): And are you aware of any plans or discussions to punish in any way, including termination, FBI agents or personnel associated with Trump investigations? Yes or no?
KASH PATEL, TRUMP NOMINEE FOR FBI DIRECTOR: I am not. No, I am not aware of that, Senator.
BOOKER: Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PEREZ: And John, look, the -- some of this is happening obviously before Patel gets there, but he already has some senior aides who are going to be working with him already inside the FBI.
We also know that the FBI Agents Association was concerned about this, John. Any agents who were assigned to January 6 cases or to the Mar-a- Lago classified documents case very concerned that they would be targeted. And during a meeting with the FBI Agents Association we're told that Kash Patel listened but did not promise to take any action -- John.
BERMAN: A lot of this happening right out in the open.
Evan Perez in Washington, D.C. reporting on it all. Thank you, Evan, very much -- Kate.
BOLDUAN: A lineup for the ages. The music stars that are coming together to help victims of the deadly wildfires. We've got much more on that.
And Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s view on vaccine science past and present now leading a key Republican senator to say he is struggling with RFK's nomination to be the next leader of America's public health agencies. What was revealed after two days of pretty brutal confirmation hearings.
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[07:53:15]
SIDNER: All right, tomorrow is February first. So starting tomorrow, President Donald Trump says he will, indeed, slap a 25 percent tariff on imports from Canada and Mexico. The president has tied the move to concerns over fentanyl trafficking and trade deficits. He says he has yet to decide though whether to impose oil tariffs against both of those nations.
Trump also has indicated he's considering new 10 percent tariffs on China unless Beijing stems the flow of fentanyl into the United States.
All right. On our radar this morning for you, a star-studded night in Inglewood, California all to help fire victims.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILLIE JOE ARMSTRONG, MUSICIAN, ACTOR: Singing "Sending All My Love."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SIDNER: Billie Joe Armstrong there from Green Day kicked off the Fireaid concerts last night in Los Angeles raising money for victims of the devastating California wildfires. Billie Eilish, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Lady Gaga, Pink, and several other artists all joined in.
Dick Button, the Olympic skating champion and beloved broadcaster who transformed the world of figure skating has passed away. He dominated the sport in the 1940s and early '50s becoming America's youngest men's champion at the age of 16. Button won two Olympic golds and five World Championships. He was the first skater to land a double axle and triple loop in competition. Dick Button, 95 years old -- Kate.
[07:55:00]
BOLDUAN: The Republican chair of the Senate's Health Committee says he is struggling with President Donald Trump's pick to head up the country's public health agencies. Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is who we're talking about. He wrapped two days of confirmation hearings that included many serious questions from senators about his views on a critical aspect of public health, vaccines. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BILL CASSIDY (R-LA): If you are approved to this decision -- to this position will you say unequivocally -- will you -- will you reassure mothers unequivocally and without qualification that the measles and hepatitis B vaccines do not cause autism?
ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR., TRUMP'S PICK FOR SECRETARY OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES: Senator, I am not going into the agency with any --
CASSIDY: But that's kind of a yes or no question because -- so if you're -- because the data is there. And that's kind of a yes or no. And I don't mean to cut you off but that really is a yes or no.
KENNEDY: If the data is there, I will absolutely do that.
CASSIDY: Now, there is the data just because I used to -- I used to do hepatitis B, as I said. I know the data is there.
KENNEDY: Well then, I will be the first person -- if you show me data, I will be the first person to assure the American people that they -- that they need to take those vaccines.
CASSIDY: Now what concerns me is that you've cast doubt on some of these vaccines recently -- I mean, like the last few years. But the data -- and I could quote some of it -- the data has been there for a long time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLDUAN: So RFK Jr. insists that he will not change FDA vaccine approval or review standards, insists that he is not anti-vaccine, but lawmakers, like many medical experts, are clearly not convinced.
Joining me right now is Dr. Paul Offit. He's the director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia.
His answer gets to something you have been raising for months and months now. Two days of hearings, hours and hours of questioning. What is your overall takeaway from RFK under oath and before the Senate?
DR. PAUL OFFIT, DIRECTOR, VACCINE EDUCATION CENTER AT CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL OF PHILADELPHIA, MEMBER, FDA VACCINE ADVISORY COMMITTEE (via Webex by Cisco): Well, RFK Jr. is exactly who he's been for the last 20 years when Sen. Cassidy questions him about vaccines is the cause of autism, for which there's been dozens of studies showing that there is no association between getting a vaccine and developing autism.
He says if the data are there. RFK Jr. says if the data are there. What is he talking about? Of course, the data are there. He just ignores those data because it doesn't fit with his -- fit in with his fixed, immutable, science-resistant hypothesis that vaccines cause autism.
His response should scare the American public and it should scare Sen. Cassidy.
BOLDUAN: Yeah. When he says show me the data it almost should be read as I don't trust any data. That's the only two ways you can kind of put it together given -- when he's talking about the hepatitis B vaccine especially.
And he says he's not anti-vaccine. We know that is fundamentally -- can't be true because he does not trust science, which also led to another very striking moment with Sen. Maggie Hassan. Let me play this for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MAGGIE HASSAN (D-NH): I am the proud mother of a 36-year-old young man with severe cerebral palsy. Please do not suggest that anybody in this body of either political party doesn't want to know what the cause of autism is. The problem with this witness' response on the autism cause and the relationship to vaccines is because he's relitigating and churning settled science so we can't go forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLDUAN: And find the cause of autism is what she's talking about.
How is this -- that going to manifest, meaning his refusal to accept accepted science? How is that going to manifest, do you think, or fear if he is in charge of HHS?
OFFIT: Look, his continual beating of the drum that vaccines cause autism continues to have an effect.
So, for example, there was a paper recently published in the Journal of the American Medical Association that found that children with autism are less likely to get vaccinated than children who don't have autism. And in addition, younger siblings of those children who don't have autism unlike their older sibling also are less likely to get vaccinated.
So what he's doing is he's lowering vaccination rates by sounding this false alarm that vaccines cause autism, and he simply refuses to agree.
I think the thing that got me about Sen. Cassidy, who I thought was very thoughtful in this hearing, was when he told a story about a patient he was taking care of who had a hepatitis B virus-induced cancer.
And that RFK Jr. has decried hepatitis B. RFK Jr. said the hepatitis B vaccine doesn't work even though when it was introduced in 1991 as a routine newborn vaccine - hepatitis B vaccine -- we basically eliminated the 18,000 cases of hepatitis B that would occur every year in children less than 10.