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Senate Committee Votes on Tulsi Gabbard's Nomination as Intelligence Director; FBI Turns Over Info About Employees Who Worked Jan. 6 Cases; Netanyahu Arrives at White House For Talks With Trump. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired February 04, 2025 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:00:18]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: From controversy to Secretary. Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s nomination to lead the Health and Human Services Department, passing a key hurdle while the fate of another criticized pick, Tulsi Gabbard, as Intel Chief, will be decided just moments from now.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Also happening this hour. FBI agents fighting back filing a class action lawsuit against the Department of Justice over a survey tied to efforts to purge the workforce. And there's word the bureau is now turning over information about employees who worked on Capitol riot cases. Concerns now about retaliation for their work.

And an offer that's setting off alarm bells for civil rights groups. Secretary of State Marco Rubio suggesting American citizens could serve time in some of Central America's most notorious prisons. We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN News Central.

KEILAR: All eyes on Capitol Hill because we are just minutes away from a critical Senate Committee vote for Tulsi Gabbard, Trump's pick for Director of National Intelligence. She has faced scathing criticism from both sides of the aisle. And now that vote is carrying some added significance. We've just learned that the FBI has complied with a demand from the DOJ, turning over information on employees who worked on January 6th investigations. CNN's Manu Raju is outside the Senate Intelligence Select Committee's chamber. Manu, tell us what you're hearing.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, this vote is going to happen in a matter of minutes. This Committee typically operates along bipartisan lines, but this is a bitterly divided Committee which will be a party line vote.

And just in a key moment earlier today, Senator Todd Young, a Republican who had been wavering about this nomination, announced that he would vote to move ahead on Gabbard's nomination to lead the intelligence community after having extensive conversation, I was told, with J.D. Vance, the Vice President, and getting assurances, including about some of his concerns about how she would deal with people who would leak classified information, including Edward Snowden.

That became a big flashpoint during the hearing last week. And that is something that Democrats have seized upon as well. The top Democrat on the Committee, Senator Mark Warner, earlier today lashed out at Gabbard's nomination and urged Republicans to vote against her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARK WARNER, (D) VICE CHAIR, INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: My concern is this. It's not about our service to the country. It's about our judgment. And some of these secretaries become heads of bureaucracies. But the director of national intelligence gets exposed to some of our most classified information. And will our allies continue to share that intelligence if they're not sure it's going to be safe.

And again, it's flabbergasting to me that she couldn't even bring herself to call Edward Snowden a traitor. Someone that I think all of us involved in the intelligence community feel is a traitor. And I don't know how she's going to run an intelligence with 18 different agencies and say to the workforce, oh, now you got to adhere to the law because she's in charge when before she said he ought to be pardoned and he's a brave whistleblower. It's pretty untenable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now behind the scenes, Gabbard is going to reassure Republicans were concerned about the fact that she did not call Edward Snowden a traitor during the hearing last week. She didn't want to call people names, just simply want to rely on the facts. And the facts that she said is that Edward Snowden broke the law.

She's taken a different tone about Snowden than she did before she was a nominee at that time, she suggested that he should be pardoned or that his charges should be dropped against him altogether. During her hearing, though, she said that she would not advocate for a pardon for Edward Snowden. And that was enough part of what helped win over Senator Susan Collins of Maine, who is also a member of this Committee, who also said that she would vote to advance this nomination.

Another Republican skeptic, Senator James Lankford. After that back and forth about Stone last week he had some concerns, but he had conversations with Gabbard afterwards. He is now a yes, which means that this vote is going to happen along party lines. They'll be approved by a single vote, then they'll be sent to the Senate floor. What we expect Gabbard's nomination to be taken up as soon as next week.

At that point, she can only afford to lose three Republican votes on a party line vote. And at the moment, we don't expect more than three Republicans to vote against her. So she is in a very good spot to get this position after weeks of battling with Democrats and winning over some of those skeptical Republicans, including Senator Todd Young, a critical vote support announced today.

[14:05:06] Brianna?

KEILAR: Manu Raju, thank you for the report. Boris?

SANCHEZ: And more breaking news into CNN. We've just learned that the FBI has complied with orders from the Department of Justice demanding officials turn over information about employees who worked on January 6th cases. Sources say more than 5,000 names were handed over. This comes after the DOJ set a noon deadline to receive the information.

Let's go now to CNN Security Correspondent and Former FBI Special Agent Josh Campbell. Josh, you broke the story. How do those within the FBI think this list of names is going to be used?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is unprecedented for the Department of Justice to go to the FBI and demand a list of names in an apparent effort to exact retribution on behalf of a President, which it appears that that is what is potentially underway here. We knew could be coming.

As we reported here at CNN, the Justice Department had sent a letter to FBI leadership demanding the list of names of people who were involved in that sprawling January 6th Capitol riot case. These were investigations run from coast to coast. And just to talk about how sprawling it is, as you mentioned, we're talking about several thousand names.

One source that I spoke to made the point that as they conveyed to the Justice Department that right now this list should be viewed as preliminary in nature just because of the short time constraint that the bureau was actually given by DOJ to try to gather all this information. We know that a survey recently went out over the weekend to employees asking to specifically identify what their role is.

But, you know, I could tell you, having worked, you know, these FBI investigations, that there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes when, you know, a lead is set to a field office or a case is open. There could be people administratively tied to that case that don't actually end up go on to work it. There could have been people that were just doing investigative activity on behalf of other agents and other field offices. And so there's still a lot to drill down on what exactly the Justice Department is actually looking for here.

And sort of pointing out, you know, I'm hearing reaction from sources inside the FBI that they're angry at what is happening. Again, they believe that this is being amassed in order to potentially seek the firings of employees who were conducting these lawfully predicated investigations. But their anger doesn't appear to be towards FBI leadership because, you know, the way the justice system works.

The Justice Department oversees the FBI. And so it's certainly within DOJ's right to ask for this information. But Employees think that this is only headed one direction and that's to try to come up with a list of people to terminate at the direction of the President.

SANCHEZ: And Josh, at least some of them have come together, current and former FBI officials, to file this class action lawsuit against DOJ. Tell us about that.

CAMPBELL: Yeah, we've heard organizations say, you know, they're going to threaten legal action on behalf of FBI agents, analysts, professional staff across the country. We're now learning about this new class action suit that was just filed by a group of current and former officials. This was done anonymously, but what they're asking is that the names of the people who worked those January 6th cases be not be released to the public. They want a judge to ensure that that does not happen. They're seeking other types of remedies as well.

We expect to see more of these types of cases as this moves on. But of course, this isn't, you know, theoretical. We know in the past that FBI employees have been doxed, they've been targeted, their families have been targeted as well, just because of the cases that they worked on involving Donald Trump.

And so that is one concern certainly out there, is that if the Justice Department then goes and releases this information or, you know, somehow, you know, leaks it out, some these people could be in danger. And so they're asking the courts to actually come in and try to stop it.

SANCHEZ: Josh Campbell, thanks so much for breaking that down for us. Brianna?

KEILAR: Right now, thousands upon thousands of American jobs are on the line after Elon Musk said he got President Trump's permission to shut down the U.S. Agency for International Development. Workers there have been told to stay home. Countless programs are on ice, including work that provides clean water to infants, basic education and medication for children, and that combats the trafficking of girls, according to an alliance of international non-governmental organizations.

USAID also spends billions each year to alleviate poverty, treat diseases and respond to famines and natural disasters. Joining us now is Democratic Congresswoman Ilhan Omar of Minnesota. Congresswoman, thank you so much for being with us. And you have been making an argument --

ILHAN OMAR, (D) MINNESOTA: Thanks for having me.

KEILAR: -- for USAID. Yes, thank you so much. That USAID kept your family fed, kept them safe. But I wonder, because there are Americans who want the money that America spends abroad to be spent at home instead. And they're agreeing with this USAID move and they don't want to help the Ilhan Omar's or their families. They want to help their own families. Can you explain to those people why you think they should be interested in helping families like yours?

[14:10:02]

OMAR: Well, I mean, I think what is really important for the American people to understand is that this money really amounts to less than 1% of what our budget is as a country. It is money that goes to the most vulnerable around the world. It is already appropriated and it can't be re appropriated.

And so what we are seeing right now is economic Elon Musk, a billionaire who is attempting to take away resources from the poorest people around the world. This is someone who is not a government official. He wasn't elected, he's not appointed. He holds foreign debt and foreign interests. And so we should all look at this with cautious eyes and with curiosity to understand why he is making these decisions and why he's being allowed to make these decisions.

I also want to remind people, yes, this agency was created with an executive order from John FK, but it was also congressionally appropriated in 1998. And so there is no authority that rests within the executive that allows them to sidestep the congressional power that we have to create these agencies and to allocate resources.

KEILAR: And those things about congressional authority, they may be true, but there's a lot of people out there who agree with this move philosophically. What do you say to them?

OMAR: Well, I don't understand why they would agree with it philosophically. We are looking at this reckless decision that was made that took away the jobs of so many Americans who are working here in the United States and abroad. These were people who are locked out of their offices, locked out of their emails.

We have crisis response teams that are abroad that are locked out of the resources that they need in case their lives were in danger. So what Elon Musk is doing is actually risking the lives of Americans by making this decision.

KEILAR: Your Democratic House leader, Hakeem Jeffries is out with a 10 point plan. Top three of these things to combat the dismantling of the federal government, as we know it, use the budget process. We should know that's in six weeks. The federal employee buyout decision deadline is in two days. Introduce legislation is the second thing.

You're in the minority. Legislation's likely going nowhere. And the third thing, continue to highlight Republican policies. Negative effects on the economy. Continue, so just do something that you're already doing. Is that all the Democrats can do right now?

OMAR: Well, we are utilizing the judiciary system. And unfortunately, because we are in the minority in the House and in the Senate, the only recourse that the Congress has to make sure their constitutional rights are not being infringed by the Executive is to sue. And it's only the speaker that has the ability to sue on behalf of Congress.

And he is deciding to abdicate that responsibility and go along because these people at this moment are being held hostage. Our Republican colleagues, they are afraid of what Elon and Trump will do. The retribution we're already seeing that's being carried out throughout the United States government, and they don't want any of that for themselves.

And so we ask their constituents to call into their offices to ask them to develop a backbone to remember the oath of office that they took to protect this country from enemies within and abroad. And we are currently witnessing a constitutional crisis and authoritarianism and a dictatorship in the making. And it is up to all of us in Congress who represent the American people to stand up to Trump.

KEILAR: Elon Musk, I want to see if you want to respond to him. He is actually singling you out on X. He retweeted a post that alleged you were telling Somalians who are illegally in the country how to avoid deportation. You do speak Somali in the clip. And the translation, according to the translation, it shows you telling people that if ICE attempts to question them, they are not obliged to answer those questions.

I do not speak Somali. And I'm basing this on the translation that he retweeted here. And this is guidance that we have heard from many immigration advocates. But Musk says that you are, quote, breaking the law, literally, outright. Do you want to respond to that?

OMAR: Well, it just shows you how much he lacks an understanding of what the laws of this country are. In the clip, it was an interview that I gave to a reporter. I'm not in that room, actually, that they pan out to. That is an edited video.

[14:15:01]

And in the interview, I was asked what would I say to Somalis who are undocumented or who their documentations might have lapsed. And it is important for people to exercise their Fifth Amendment right to remain silent unless they feel confident that they have the legal protections that they need. Nobody needs to put themselves at jeopardy by speaking to law enforcement if they do not have the advice of lawyers. And we continue to tell people that.

KEILAR: Just before I let you go sort of back to what Elon Musk is attempting here. Were Democrats kind of caught flat footed? I mean, were you surprised by the swiftness and the scope of what is happening here? I know you said that you don't have the ability so much to use the court system in the minority, but at the same time, were you caught off guard to develop a strategy besides that?

OMAR: No. I mean, we warned the American people of what was to come if they chose to elect a criminal that he was going to carry out criminal activities. And that is what we are witnessing. We also warned them what would happen if they gave him a trifecta with control over the Senate and the House that he was going to appoint.

A lot of the people that we are seeing that are going to be yes people and are going to carry out these kind of illegal activities that are threatening our constitutional republic. And so we are doing what we can within the checks and balances that we have, and that is to utilize the judiciary system to make sure that we are halting a lot of the things that they are attempting.

And you are seeing lawsuits being carried out. There is a coordinated effort with AGs across the country that are Democrats and members of Congress on the Democratic side are working with them and with outside groups to make sure that the people's rights are protected in this country.

KEILAR: Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, thank you so much for being with us and for sharing your family story. We do appreciate it.

OMAR: Thank you for having me.

KEILAR: Still to come, we are standing by for a key meeting between President Trump and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. We're told that while the two leaders will likely appear in lockstep publicly behind closed doors, it will be a very different story.

Plus, China hits back. We'll tell you what and really who will be most impacted by China's retaliatory tariffs.

And it's an unprecedented, possibly illegal offer to accept. We're going to take you inside El Salvador's notorious mega prisons now offering to hold some of America's worst American criminals. We'll have that and much more coming up on CNN News Central.

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[14:22:41]

SANCHEZ: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is due to arrive at the White House just a short time from now and he's the first foreign leader to visit President Trump in his new term. The visit comes at a consequential moment for both men as negotiations begin for the second phase of the cease fire deal in Gaza with some key regional issues still hanging in the balance.

CNN's Alex Marquardt is here with the details. Alex, what are you expecting? What are you watching for in this high stakes meeting?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think on the surface, Boris, it's going to look very friendly, but they have had a contentious relationship in the past, that relationship has improved, but of course it has the potential to turn sour at any moment. This is such a critical moment, particularly for Prime Minister Netanyahu. He essentially has two choices.

He can go forward and end the war, essentially go into the next phase of this cease fire when he's supposed to withdraw IDF troops and end the war altogether. Which, make no mistake, is the wish of the Trump administration. They want this war to end. But then Netanyahu risks his own government collapsing. He's risking his political career, even his personal freedom, because he could go to jail because of all his legal problems.

Or he could restart this war against Hamas after this first phase, maintain his premiership. But then you risk angering the Trump administration and starting off this administration on the wrong foot. So that's the big question today, is whether Netanyahu is going to commit to the second phase of the cease fire.

The negotiations were supposed to start yesterday. They didn't. But Israel has announced that it is sending a team to Doha this weekend to start those negotiations. We did hear from the Middle East envoy, Steve Witkoff, just a short time ago. He responded to a question about what President Trump meant when he said just a few days ago that Gaza should be cleared out. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE WITKOFF, SPECIAL ENVOY FOR THE MIDDLE EAST: There's 30,000 unexploded munitions. It is buildings that could tip over at any moment. There's no utilities there whatsoever. No working water, electric, gas, nothing. God knows what kind of disease might be festering there. So when the President talks about cleaning it out, he talks about making it habitable. And this is a long range plan.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARQUARDT: So he's saying, there, next to the National Security Advisor, Steve Witkoff -- Mike Waltz. Excuse me. And they made clear that they are trying to figure out where these people can go.

[14:25:01]

They're going back mostly to rubble because so much of Gaza has been destroyed. Right now, Boris, the focus is continuing these negotiations to keep this ceasefire on track and getting to that final phase when reconstruction could actually start.

One final note. I think what was interesting in what Steve Witkoff said there at the White House is he actually criticized some of the cease fire negotiations that at the end of the Biden administration, he was actually part of, and he said that it wasn't such a wonderful agreement to begin with. So clearly they're still working through that framework as these discussions continue, a lot of big questions still remain.

SANCHEZ: We'll see if they answer some of them. They have a press conference set for about 5 p.m. so we will be watching that. Alex Marquardt, thank you so much. Brianna?

KEILAR: Israel has now allowed a Palestinian toddler to leave Gaza for lifesaving medical treatment. The two-year-old is now hospitalized in Jordan. And a warning, the next video that you're about to see is disturbing.

This is little Habiba. You can see what gangrene did to her arms and her legs after she waited weeks for Israel to sign off on her evacuation. Jordan launched a major effort to save her life following a CNN report as doctors warned that she only had days to live.

Last Thursday, Habiba developed a lung infection. Her heart stopped twice. She had to be resuscitated, according to her mother and health workers.

And on Sunday, Israel further delayed clearing the evacuation. Doctors believe Habiba has protein C deficiency. It's a rare but highly treatable genetic condition which causes excessive blood clotting. They say the child will likely lose her right leg and possibly both arms.

Thousands of children like Habiba cannot access lifesaving care in Gaza where more than 15 months of a war there has paralyzed the medical system. And we'll be right back.

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