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Americans Opinion on Musk's Role in Administration; Lisa Gilbert is Interviewed about Her Lawsuit Against Treasury; Nebraska's Feeling about Deportations; Questions about New Pain Medication. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired February 05, 2025 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[08:34:26]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump, no surprise here, continues to defend billionaire Elon Musk as he takes a sledgehammer to federal government agencies. Earlier this week, one White House official said Musk is serving as a, quote, "special government employee." So, how do Americans feel about Musk and his unelected role?

CNN's Harry Enten is here to run the numbers for us.

All right, how popular is the idea of having Elon Musk in this position, which has a great deal of power?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yes, I think simply put, the American people did not sign up for this.

[08:35:00]

They voted in Donald Trump. They did not vote in Elon Musk. A key role for Musk in Trump's administration, you see this, 39 percent support, 53 percent, the clear majority, opposed. They don't want this. The American people don't want this. No, no, no. Just 36 percent of independents support the idea of Elon Musk having a key role in the Trump administration.

So, the bottom line, when it comes to all of this, and Elon Musk being everywhere it seems in the federal government, trying to trim down the federal deficit, the American folks, simply put, do not want Elon Musk having a key role in the Trump administration.

SIDNER: Even though he has a very key role at this point.

ENTEN: Yes.

SIDNER: How has his own popularity sort of been impacted by this? Because if you go on Twitter, or X, which he now owns -

ENTEN: I've been there.

SIDNER: You would think he is the king of kings. ENTEN: He may be the king of X or Twitter, but he ain't the king of

the United States of America. And if he were the king, he'd be a very unpopular king.

Elon Musk's net favorable rating. You know, back in 2016, when he was known as the SpaceX guy, right, his net favorable rating was plus 29 points. By last year, pre-fall, he had dropped all the way down to minus three as he began to take on more of a political role. Remember, as he took on X, as he bought X, formerly known as Twitter.

Now look, in 2025, whoa, the bottom has fallen out. Fallen out. Minus 11 points. And it should be noted that Donald Trump's own net favorable rating is closer to about a net zero. So, Elon Musk, at this particular point, is far more unpopular than Donald Trump is, who is at the apex of his popularity. In fact, what we see with Elon Musk is he is at the trough of his popularity.

SIDNER: Look, I think a lot of people saw them as almost a package deal. You saw him more than J.D. Vance. We don't even say J.D. Vance's name. He is the vice president. It is Musk, Musk, Musk all day, every day, because of the moves he's making.

So, does it seem like he's sort of becoming the face of this administration?

ENTEN: Yes, I think in some ways he is. He is becoming the face of this administration.

Look at Google searches for Elon Musk. They're at their all-time high. At their all-time high since Google started tracking this back in 2004. Get this, it's up 700 percent from this time last year. It's like a rocket ship taking up.

And you mentioned J.D. Vance. Get this, searches for Elon Musk are seven times as high as the searches for J.D. Vance. So, the idea that Elon Musk can go do this and kind of quietly go into the corner, uh- uh, he's becoming a face of this administration. An unpopular face at that.

SIDNER: And he certainly has not been quiet about any of it because he owns X and he can put everything out there. And we've seen it on a daily basis.

ENTEN: As someone who's quite loud, I recognize other people who are quite loud. He's quite loud.

SIDNER: Harry, you're loud?

ENTEN: I know. We're all really shocked by that.

SIDNER: This is actually a shocking revelation.

ENTEN: Breaking news. Run the banner.

SIDNER: All right, Harry Enten, thank you so much.

ENTEN: Thank you.

SIDNER: Appreciate it.

Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And also this morning, advocacy groups and unions are now suing the Treasury Department over Elon Musk's move with DOGE staffers to gain access to Treasury's payment systems, which disperse funds to federal agencies. The new lawsuit says this, in part, "the scale of the intrusion into individual's privacy is massive and unprecedented."

And this comes on top of multiple other lawsuits the Trump administration is already facing for attempting to implement that blanket government wide funding freeze.

Joining me right now is Lisa Gilbert, the Co-President of Public Citizen, a watchdog group that's behind the lawsuit against the Treasury Department.

Lisa, thank you for coming in. Why sue -- why take on the Treasury Department? Why sue the Treasury Department specifically, as I know your group has also filed suit against DOGE over its uncertain legal status and authorities previously?

LISA GILBERT, CO-PRESIDENT, PUBLIC CITIZEN: Absolutely. Well, thanks so much for having me. And, you know, our suit simply demands an immediate end to the systemic, continuous and ongoing violation of federal laws that protect all of our privacy, that is, the privacy of personal information contained in federal records.

It's a big deal because the Treasury maintains sensitive personal and financial information of all of us, of millions of Americans, and there are laws in place to protect us. We are simply suing to put us back to regular order.

BOLDUAN: Are there assurances that Elon Musk or the Secretary of the Treasury could offer that would make -- it's not really about feelings, but I'll say, I'll put it that way, would make you feel better about DOGE staffers gaining access to this sensitive Treasury data?

GILBERT: I don't think so. It's a great question. But, you know, Treasury is claiming that, you know, Tom Krause, CEO of Cloud Group has read-only access as if that is supposed to make us feel better. But it's a remarkable justification because read-only access is still illegal. The law bars access to individuals who lack a legitimate need for it. Presumably, they want this access for something. They plan to use the data in some way, either to reject payments or to use it for some other punitive purpose. It's something that regular Americans are fearful of, and certainly it's not something that's allowed or legal.

[08:40:03]

BOLDUAN: Members of Congress have really joined in and protest against these moves specifically by DOGE. I want to play for you something that Democratic Congressman Jamie Raskin said in standing up and protesting against moves like this.

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REP. JAMIE RASKIN (D-MD): Elon Musk, you may have illegally seized power over the financial payment systems of the United States Department of Treasury, but you don't control the money of the American people. The United States Congress does that. We don't have a fourth branch of government called Elon Musk.

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BOLDUAN: And yours is not the only lawsuit that DOGE is facing around its structure and practices here. Why do you think this has struck such a chord?

GILBERT: I mean, this is such a huge amount of information and data. You know, this -- what Treasury does is send out $6 trillion in annual payments, Social Security and Medicare and veterans benefits and tax refunds. This is how your grandfather gets a Social Security check or how your mom's doctor gets paid by Medicare. You know, this is something that an unelected billionaire shouldn't have the power to turn on or off.

You know, it's incredibly important private information, and I think it really is striking a chord. It makes people uncomfortable. You know, Elon Musk and DOGE should not be allowed to continue to infiltrate and take over key government systems with no sense of what they're going to do with this information or even worse, if they'll be using it for personal profit or things that could benefit their own -- his own company.

BOLDUAN: Lisa, what you said you're asking for in the lawsuit is just a stop to this and a return to regular order, if you will, the way -- the way it has been. What is the next step here? I mean, how quickly can this happen? What are you watching for in terms of the next move in trying to decipher the intentions here?

GILBERT: Well, early this morning, we're filing our motion for a temporary restraining order to stop DOGE from accessing Treasury records. So -- so that's the next move. And we'll be waiting to see how the courts respond. I think, in the interim, watching very closely to see how Treasury and Musk and Trump respond to the outrage from members of Congress and senators, as you referenced, from regular Americans.

There was a huge protest in front of Treasury last night responsive to the outrage. You know, I think we're going to continue to see them try to justify what they're doing. But again, you know, there really is no justification. This is our information. These are our payments. It is simply not acceptable for those to be poking around and potentially taking punitive actions here.

BOLDUAN: Let's see what happens next.

Lisa Gilbert, thank you for coming on.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, this morning, the White House press secretary confirms the Trump administration has flown its first planeload of deported migrants to Guantanamo Bay. That follows other immigration tactics, which include sending more U.S. troops to the southern border and high-profile ICE raids in major cities.

As part of his "All Over the Map" series, our John King went to Nebraska, which depends on immigrant workers, to see how this is playing out for voters and the immigrants themselves.

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JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The Nebraska prairie. It's calm and quiet as the rolling farmlands wait out winter.

CROWD: This is what community looks like.

KING (voice over): But even here, the new Trump agenda stirs passion and fear.

CROWD: Love over hate.

KING (voice over): Immigrant workers are critical in a state where cattle outnumber people by more than three to one. Nebraska is second to Texas in U.S. beef production, sixth in pork, and its cornhusker state nickname celebrates its role as an agriculture giant.

JOHN HANSEN, PRESIDENT, NEBRASKA FARMERS UNION: If we have a hitch in the get along in Nebraska, it's a big enough processing state, it's going to be felt in the food chain.

KING (voice over): By hitch in the get along, Nebraska Farmers Union President John Hansen means a Trump immigration crackdown that rounds up undocumented workers.

HANSEN: Do we need better enforcement? I think we do. There's a constructive way to do it, and there's a less than constructive way to do it. And so it remains to be seen how we proceed.

KING (voice over): This is a red state, and its Republican governor is offering support if the Trump White House puts Nebraska on its immigration crackdown list. Fear is the word you hear most from immigrants, even those with legal status.

"GIN", NEBRASKA RESIDENT: This first term was more of like, let's see if this can happen. This year is more, I'm going to do it.

They go to school.

KING (voice over): Gin has a green card now and is working towards citizenship, but he has family and friends who are undocumented, and he asked that we not use his full name.

GIN: It's a scary time for my community, for people I care for aren't basically are not lucky enough like I am. KING (voice over): Rumors of ICE activity spread fast, as did word

that agents can now enter schools and churches.

GIN: It starts up people getting scared.

[08:45:01]

Basically, it starts off like, have you seen immigration? Have you seen this? And you see the fear in people's eyes. Just the fact that they can't go out to the store, they can't go get groceries or even hospitals. It's just a hard time.

KING (voice over): Immigrant advocates like Mary Choate say clients are worried now about sending their children to school or showing up for English classes and other services.

MARY CHOATE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR LEGAL IMMIGRATION ASSISTANCE: We really want to keep immigrants and refugees involved in the community so - because - because they're so integral to our community. But it's been very difficult for them to be able to do that because they fear going outside of their homes.

KING (voice over): "G" is seeking asylum. She was a journalist back home in Honduras, targeted by the government, she says, after reports detailing corruption.

"G", ASYLUM SEEKER (through translator): If I go back to Honduras, they will kill me.

KING (voice over): She entered the states a year ago using a Biden administration phone app that Trump eliminated on day one.

KING: Your lawyers tell you you're in the asylum process and you should be OK. But with Trump as president, are you worried?

"G" (through translator): Of course. For sure.

KING: Why?

"G" (through translator): Because he tries to implement quite strict policies with immigrants in general. And I think even more with people who have just entered the country. At least with the program I entered with, there is some instability, so to speak. So, of course, that increases anxiety and concern.

With Trump's arrival, I have felt very unstable. I have a lot of anxiety. I suffer from insomnia and I cannot stop thinking about the possibility of being deported.

I cannot go back.

KING (voice over): Nebraska State Senator Kathleen Kauth is pushing a new E-Verify law that requires employers to certify their workers are legal. Simple and common sense, she says. But Kauth concedes, the polarized national debate might make it harder to win over Democrats. KATHLEEN KAUTH (R), NEBRASKA STATE SENATOR: I'm really more worried

about Nebraska and focusing on, what do we need in Nebraska to understand the problem, how do we make sure that we are keeping people who are not here legally from taking jobs from people who are here?

KING (voice over): Kauth believes the state can handle any workforce disruption caused by stronger enforcement, and she is a state example of the Trump effect on the Republican Party. Any path to status or citizenship for those already here illegally must start with going home.

KAUTH: I kind of view it as a poison apple from the poison tree. Whatever the legal definition is. If your first act is to break the law, you have become a criminal. And so therefore everything after, even if it's well-intentioned, even if it's wonderful, please go back and go through the process because we do want you here, but we need you to do it the right way. And I don't think that that should ever change.

KING (voice over): Go back is the driving theme of the new Republican immigration push, and a big reason more immigrants think it's best to stay in the shadows.

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BERMAN: And John King is with us now.

John, as we said, Nebraska, as you said, Nebraska is a red state. But in the next major election, the midterms could play an important role.

KING (on camera): That's exactly right. To the eastern part of the state is Omaha. That's Don Bacon's district. He's a Republican. He's always on the list of vulnerable Republicans. Kamala Harris, the vice president, the Democrat, won that district. So, that's one of the reasons we went to Nebraska, to watch how this plays out in a red state that has a very competitive district. As we watch the Trump policy impact from now, not only through the first 100 days, but through the midterms.

There's also a question that, John, even a lot of people who support Trump's enforcement there are worried about economic disruption. They worry about the meat packing industry now. They worry about the construction industry now. They worry about farms when we get to the spring and into the summer and then into the harvest season. They're not opposed to enforcement, a lot of these people, especially in this red state, but they say, what about the other part of the conversation? When are we going to have conversations about an expanded guest worker program or new visas for legal immigrants to come into the country? So, it's a great conversation in a red state where the politics are pretty complicated.

BERMAN: And it was a great piece, a great report. John King, thank you very much for that.

KING: Thank you.

BERMAN: Sara.

SIDNER: So good. Thank you so much, John.

This just in, the U.S. Postal Service updating its guidance now on service from China, saying it will indeed continue accepting all inbound mail and packages from China and Hong Kong. That is a reversal of what was expected today after the agency had warned incoming packages would not be accepted. The new statement this morning goes on to say that the Post Office and Customs and Border Protection will work together closely as new tariffs on China are in place to ensure as little disruption as possible for package delivery. And the chaos continues.

New this morning, the entire staff of the CIA has buyout offers on the table. The new step in the purge of federal government workers.

And your questions about the newly approved pain medication.

[08:50:01]

"Will it make me feel like I'm on another planet?" Dr. Sanjay Gupta is here with the answers to that and many other answers ahead.

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BOLDUAN: This morning there is a new type of pain medication on the market that could be life changing for millions of Americans. Yesterday we told you about it and asked you to submit your questions about this new drug. And now Dr. Sanjay Gupta is back with some answers for you.

Thank you for being back, Sanjay.

So, let's jump right into it.

Stephanie from Minnesota submitted this question and asks, how is this new drug any different from other prescription pain medication?

[08:55:01]

And this gets to the crux of why it could be so life changing.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, this is a pretty big deal in the world of pain medications because it is essentially representing a totally different class of pain medications. You know, you typically think of anti-inflammatories or opioids or sometimes even things like anti-depressants or anti-anxiety medications. This works in a - in a very different way.

You know, for opioids, for example, the way - you know, the brain is processing all pain. So, opioids, in many ways, work by sort of dulling the sensation of pain in the brain. That's why people often feel loopy or feel a little off when they're taking opioids. The way that this medication works is actually more at the site of pain, where the pain is initially being processed, and it changes the way that those pain signals are then transmitted to the brain. So, it's very different than what else is out there. And as a result, I think it's going to be a good option for people.

We haven't had a new pain medication approved, Kate, in more than 25 years in the United States. So, I think that's part of the reason there's excitement. It's 50 mg every 12 hours when you're in pain. It's not cheap. It costs over $15 per pill. We'll see how insurance handles that. But this is, you know, this is sort of emerging even as we speak, Kate.

BOLDUAN: And let's get to something you were just touching on that - that loopy feeling when it comes to medication.

GUPTA: Yes.

BOLDUAN: Because Ali from Marin County in California gets to that, saying that, "will it make me loopy like other meds? I can't take any pain meds because I feel like I'm on another planet." And it turns out a lot, a lot -- and with that, I think, that gets to what a lot of people think when it comes to these medications.

GUPTA: Have you ever tried opioids, Kate? I mean they're completely -

BOLDUAN: I - you know what, I actually never had - never did, Sanjay. I did need to after my back surgery, which was basically one year ago today.

GUPTA: Right.

BOLDUAN: And loopy is like the easy word for it, for what it did to me.

GUPTA: By the way, I'm glad you're doing so well after your back operation.

The - these opioids can really knock you out. I - being on another planet is a good way of describing it. These - again these - these medications, this Journavx, suzetrigine medication, it just works in a - in a completely different way. We're going to see as more and more people take it what sort of side effects that they have. We know that it can cause these types of side effects, itching, muscle spasms, rash.

But in terms of that loopiness, and - and also in terms of the euphoria that people will get that may make those opioids more addictive, it just doesn't seem to be happening with - with this medication. We will see. Again, this is a big deal because it's the first medication approved in a long time. As more and more people take it, we'll see if there's other side effects that sort of emerge. But because it doesn't work on the brain, unlikely to cause those sorts of symptoms.

BOLDUAN: Which leads to another question of what that means in terms of people who have an allergy to other pain meds, like aspirin. We have a - one viewer question, Susan had asked this question, if she - she has an allergy to aspirin and other pain meds like that. What does that mean for Journavx? GUPTA: Right. Well, you know, when you have pain medications, even though they're all called pain medications, they can be in totally different classes, work by different mechanisms. So, I don't know specifically what the allergy is. If it's more of an allergy to anti- inflammatories -

BOLDUAN: Right.

GUPTA: This is not an anti-inflammatory. So, it's not likely you would have an allergy to this. You obviously want to talk to your doctor about that.

But it - you know, if - even if you have cholesterol lowering medications, there can be different classes of those. And some people may be allergic to one or not tolerate one, but be OK with the other. It's probably going to be the same with this pain medication.

The biggest sort of substitute that it's going to probably provide for is for opioids. People who would have otherwise taken opioids, foot pain, abdominal pain, whatever it might be, they may be able to take this medication instead.

BOLDUAN: That - and thank God for that to be able to phase out opioids. And, I mean, first pain medicine in - new pain med in 25 years is pretty mind boggling considering all the -

GUPTA: Yes.

BOLDUAN: All the progress we have in all sorts of - of drug science. But this is understandably so, and why we ask you so many questions about it. This is a big deal.

It's good to see you, Sanjay.

GUPTA: You too. Thanks.

BOLDUAN: Sara.

SIDNER: All right, a strong storm and powerful winds triggering landslides across California. This often happens after major fires. One caused a home in Sonoma County to fall into the river below, where it floated downstream. Thankfully, no one was hurt because no one was inside at the time, but authorities evacuated some homes nearby just in case. A number of roads also shut down due to landslides.

All right, right now, police are searching for a suspect in connection with last night's deadly shooting at an Ohio warehouse. One person killed, five others injured. It happened at a cosmetics facility in New Albany. Police recovered a firearm from that scene. Authorities say the shooting appears to have been targeted.

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No reason to believe there will be any further threat.

Two of Japan's biggest automakers are still holding various discussions, despite reports.