Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Russia Releases American Prisoner; Trump Outlines Goal to Take Control of Gaza. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired February 11, 2025 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Because they don't want to send the least healthy people out. And there was an uproar when they saw the people from yesterday.

So, these people are -- so I don't want to do two, and then we do another two in another week, and then we do four in three weeks. No, no. They either have them out by Saturday at 12:00, or all bets are off.

QUESTION: Mr. President, would you still consider withholding aid to those countries if they don't accept your plans to accept...

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: Well, I don't want to say that, because we have had such a good relationship, and we're doing so well just in the short time that we have been talking.

I mean, the king just made a statement -- I didn't ask him to do that -- about literally saving 2,000 young children from the Gaza Strip. We didn't know about that. You didn't know about that. Nobody did, except for the king and his son.

I assume you told your son, right? And I just thought it was great. No, I think we will do something. I don't have to threaten with money. We do. We contribute a lot of money to Jordan and to Egypt, by the way, a lot, to both.

But I don't have to threaten that. I don't think -- I think we're above that. I do believe we're above that.

QUESTION: Would you consider other countries, not Jordan and Egypt? There was talks about Indonesia, Albania, other places?

TRUMP: Yes, sure. And we have other countries that want to get involved. We have a lot of people that want to get involved. There's a great sense of wanting to help the Palestinians. They really -- there's a lot of good countries out there, people that rule those countries with big hearts. And this gentleman is at the top of the list.

QUESTION: And if they don't want to leave, how are you going to force them, Mr. President?

TRUMP: Oh, they're going to be great. They're going to be very happy.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: Your Majesty, should we expect that the Jordanian response would be part of a coordinated Arab response?

KING ABDULLAH II, JORDAN: The response will be from a multitude of countries, Arab, international. I know the Europeans want to step in.

And, again, we will probably have to look to the help of the United States to make sure that COGAT, which is the clearing agency on the Israeli side, makes this as efficient as possible, because 2,000 kids, the best way to get to them is by helicopters and get them straight to our institutions.

I also believe that quite a few countries would also probably like to take some of those kids and have them treated in their hospitals.

TRUMP: That's right.

ABDULLAH: So we hope to launch this ASAP.

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: Yes. And that's right. They should have been done by the Biden administration, but they didn't do anything. They didn't know what the hell they were doing. So this should have been done by the Biden administration.

This should have never happened because October 7 would have never happened if I were president, zero chance of happening. You wouldn't have had that, that whole mess where the Middle East got blown up, and you wouldn't have had Ukraine and Russia fighting. That would have never happened.

And, by the way, we're making good progress there, I think. I really think we're making some very good progress.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: Mr. President, you said before that the U.S. would buy Gaza, and today you just said we're not going to buy Gaza.

TRUMP: We're not going to have to buy. We're going to have Gaza. We don't have to buy. There's nothing to buy. We will have Gaza.

QUESTION: What does that mean?

TRUMP: No reason to buy. There is nothing to buy. It's Gaza. It's a war-torn area. We're going to take it. We're going to hold it. We're going to cherish it. We're going to get it going eventually, where a lot of jobs are going to be created for the people in the Middle East.

It's going to be for the people in the Middle East, but I think it could be a diamond. It could be an absolute tremendous asset for the Middle East. And you're going to have peace. It's going to bring peace in the Middle East. Gaza, the way it is right now, every 10 years, you're going to have the same thing happening.

I have watched it so long, all the death and destruction of Gaza. The civilization has been wiped out in Gaza. No, it's going to be a tremendous thing. It's fronting on the sea. It's going to be a great economic development job. It's going to put people to work, a lot of people to work. And those people are all going to be from the Middle East.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: And just to follow up with one on that for King Abdullah, can you clarify again, sir, how do you feel about the U.S. taking Gaza, as the president said?

ABDULLAH: Well, again, this is something that we as Arabs will be coming to the United States with something that we're going to talk about later to discuss all these options.

QUESTION: And, Mr. President, take it under what authority? It is sovereign territory.

TRUMP: Under the U.S. authority.

QUESTION: And, Mr. President, would you seek to personally develop property in Gaza after this happens?

TRUMP: No. No. I have had a great career in real estate. I don't...

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: When you have done what I have done in the last number of years, including the four years that we should have been doing something else, frankly, because people see that now, for sure, but when you have done what I have done, you could just do more good for people when you're president.

When you're president, we can do things that -- this is all things that should have been done, but actually things that shouldn't have had to be done. Gaza, absolutely, it would have been so great if the Biden administration would have started this.

[13:05:10]

But, actually, in all fairness to them, it was -- they should have never let it happen. It did happen. And because of the fact that they let this happen, this catastrophe of October 7, something like this becomes practical and very real, meaning the development and all of the things that I have talked about with respect to the Gaza Strip.

If you didn't have the October 7 catastrophe -- and it was a horrible catastrophe -- then probably you wouldn't be talking about that. But the only thing I can say is, this is going to bring stability and peace to the Middle East. And, ultimately, when it's developed, which will be in quite a while from now, is when the things calm down, but when it's developed, it's going to bring tremendous numbers of jobs to the Middle East, including the people of your country.

QUESTION: What if it does not bring peace to the Middle East? There are many Palestinians -- even though you say that everything is going to be beautiful, everything is going to be lovely, they're not going to want to go back. There are going to be people who want to go back and feel like that it is their right to do that.

But you haven't said, will there will be any type of repercussions or anything that happens?

TRUMP: We don't think that's going to happen. We think it's going to -- we think people are going to be very happy, thrilled. A lot of those people that you're talking about are going to end up maybe living there and maybe working there, but it'll be in a different form.

We have had tremendous support for this project, and we think the biggest asset of the project, it's going to bring peace ultimately to the Middle East. All right.

QUESTION: One last question.

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: Go ahead, behind you. You have asked enough.

QUESTION: Mr. President, one of your promises on the campaign trail is to bring peace to the Middle East. It was a promise to your voters, Arab voters here.

The Arab voters in the United States oppose this. What do you say to that?

TRUMP: Well, if you look at Michigan, where we have a large Arab population, as you know, I was just telling the king that we won. As you know, I won the Arab population.

Now, when I started off, I wasn't leading. When I finished a few months later, we started campaigning in Michigan. And when I finished, we won it by a tremendous amount, by 30 points. So my relationship with the Arab population has been fantastic.

And my relationship with the Middle East is very good, very good with all the countries, just about all the countries. Let's see. I would say all the countries. And they all want to do something, and they want to see peace in the Middle East.

So all the stories you hear about the Middle East not really wanting peace, that they want war, they want this, they want to go a certain place, let me tell you, the stories are false. They want to have peace. I know them all very well. They want to have peace. They want to have a good life like other people.

And we will bring -- this will be a big factor in bringing peace to the Middle East.

Thank you very much, everybody.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right, guys. Thank you, guys.

(CROSSTALK)

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: We have been listening to President Donald Trump and King Abdullah of Jordan in the Oval Office as these high- pressure talks at the White House are under way, with the fate of millions of Palestinians hanging in the balance.

King Abdullah II of Jordan is a key U.S. ally in the Middle East, and he's sitting down with Trump at what appears to be a crossroads of this relationship, as President Trump is threatening to pull billions of dollars of U.S. foreign aid from Jordan and Egypt unless they agree to take in all Palestinians currently living in Gaza.

We should point out, Trump seemed to walk that thread of removing aid back, saying -- quote -- "I think we're above that."

Keep in mind, there are more than two million Palestinians living in Gaza, and this is all part of his plan for the United States to take over the enclave and redevelop the area into what he describes as the Riviera of the Middle East, the president there saying -- quote -- "We will have Gaza. There's nothing to buy," even though previously he said that the United States would buy the enclave.

He said: "We would hold it and cherish it."

Asked under what authority the United States would make such a move, he said under the U.S. authority. Unclear exactly what that means, given the context of international law. Further, Trump saying that nobody would question it, saying nobody wants to stay there, even though CNN has heard from Palestinians living in Gaza that say that they would rather die in Gaza than leave.

We did hear from King Abdullah, saying that he would like to hear Egypt's potential plan for taking in Palestinians. Apparently, there will be discussions in Riyadh involving Saudi Arabia as well. He said: "We want to look at the best interest for the Jordanian people."

He did notably make the announcement that Jordan would take 2,000 kids. These are children in Gaza that have cancer and other illnesses. Trump there describing it as a beautiful gesture.

[13:10:06]

It's important to have the context here. The backdrop of these discussions is a fragile cease-fire. Hamas is accusing Israel of breaking their deal, and they threaten to postpone the next hostage release set for next Saturday. Trump described that as Hamas playing cute, saying they want to play tough guy, adding, "We will see how tough they are," essentially encouraging Israel to expand their military operations in Gaza if that hostage release is delayed, saying at that point all bets are off. This coincides with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu moments

ago issuing his own warning, saying the cease-fire will end if Hamas doesn't return hostages on Saturday.

A lot to keep track of during this important meeting at the White House.

We have CNN's Alayna Treene, who is at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, and CNN's Jeremy Diamond, who is live for us in Tel Aviv.

Alayna, what stood out to you about these remarks from President Trump and King Abdullah?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: I mean, it was quite a remarkable spray there.

And I'd note as well that that was just them taking questions in the middle of this bilateral meeting. It is still ongoing, we are told, behind closed doors. The king is obviously still at the White House, so a lot more to learn there.

But this was very striking, one, of course, because we saw President Donald Trump refusing to back off what he has said is his plans to take over and own Gaza, to move in and clean it up, in his words, and turn it in to the Riviera of the Middle East. The king of Jordan, who has said previously that he flatly rejects that idea, saying -- trying to let this continue.

I think it was very telling to me and noticeable to me that he didn't offer a lot of details. He said that he wanted to wait to discuss it, discuss it further with President Donald Trump behind closed doors. He did talk about, as you mentioned, Boris, wanting to wait and see what Egypt and other partners, other Arab partners, in the region had to say about this, that anything like that would have to be some sort of partnership, that they already have a plan for how they want to move forward with what's going on in the Middle East.

So, still a lot of questions, I think, that we have coming out of this. One thing that was very notable, though, was the president seeming to back away from what he told reporters yesterday in the Oval Office, was that he was open to the possibility of withholding billions of dollars in aid to both Jordan and Egypt if they declined to accept thousands of Palestinians who would be displaced when the United States would take over Gaza.

He said he -- quote -- "I do think we're above that." He said he didn't think he'd have to threaten it. But, again, I think there's going to be a lot that needs to really be worked out behind closed doors. We heard a lot from the president himself, less so from the king of Jordan -- Boris.

SANCHEZ: Jeremy, over in the Middle East, there's this tension, obviously, between Hamas, who's vowed to delay the release of these hostages.

Take us specifically through what they're claiming in the cease-fire deal Israel has violated, because it seems as though they're headed to a -- hostilities resuming if this isn't resolved by Saturday.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Boris, this cease- fire certainly seems to be in its most precarious state that we have seen so far.

And we are only halfway through what was intended to be a six-week cease-fire of just phase one of this agreement. And while just a few days ago we were talking about whether or not this cease-fire might or might not be able to be extended into phases two and three, now the question is very much about whether or not we will actually make it to the end of these six weeks, as the Israeli prime minister is now saying that if Hamas doesn't return hostages by Saturday at noon, the cease-fire will end.

Now, it's not entirely clear how many hostages would need to be returned by Saturday. He notably did not say all hostages, like the president did yesterday, as he suggested this ultimatum to Israel.

But, separately, an Israeli official is saying that Israel wants to see all nine remaining living hostages set to be released during this six-week cease-fire in the next few days. And so that very much sets us up for a scenario where, if Hamas doesn't release those nine hostages by Saturday, Israel may very well return to war.

At the same time, it's also clear that the Israeli prime minister is being intentionally vague about what exactly are the criteria for this Saturday release, perhaps in order to give himself some wiggle room here. Hamas said yesterday in a statement that they would not be releasing those three hostages scheduled for release this coming Saturday as planned, citing a series of Israeli violations, some of which we can verify, some of which we cannot.

[13:15:01]

They include the fact that Israeli forces have shot and killed Palestinians in Gaza since this cease-fire has begun, which we know to be true. It also includes claims about Israel not allowing in enough shelter equipment, not only tents, but also these premade mobile homes that were set to enter the Gaza Strip.

We know that many tents have entered. We don't know about those mobile homes entering. But the bottom line is that Hamas said they are making this ultimatum now in order to give the mediators some time to resolve these issues before Saturday. We know the mediators are working on it, but now the Israeli prime minister has certainly upped the ante, a very, very delicate moment in this cease-fire -- Boris.

SANCHEZ: Jeremy and Alayna, thank you both.

We're joined now by Omar Baddar. He is a member of the National Policy Council for the Arab American Institute.

Omar, thank you so much for being with us.

What stood out to you from what you heard there from President Trump and King Abdullah? OMAR BADDAR, NATIONAL POLICY COUNCIL, ARAB AMERICAN INSTITUTE: Yes,

what really stood out is the incredible arrogance with which Donald Trump is speaking about Palestinians.

He's talking about how he and a group of other people get to decide where Palestinians live, rather than actually allowing Palestinians to make that decision for themselves about whether they stay in their own land or not.

And you have all this rhetoric about how he's no longer even talking about buying Gaza, he's just going to take it, and no one is going to question it. I mean, just the level to which he's detached from reality, it's really hard to put into words.

The entire world questions under what authority Trump is allowing himself to basically take ownership of Gaza. It's completely bonkers. And the fact that it's framed as concern for Palestinians, I think, is what's most distasteful about those comments, because the only reason why Gaza has become unlivable is because the United States has allowed Israel to destroy Gaza in atrocities that are documented by every major human rights organization in the world.

Now Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch both describing Israel's onslaught in Gaza as genocidal. If you want Palestinians to be able to live, all you have to do is basically put an end to that onslaught and allow them to live as a free people in their own land. But that seems to be off the table for Donald Trump, who is choosing instead to fulfill Netanyahu's worst fantasies about emptying Palestine of any Palestinians for Israel to take over the entire territory.

SANCHEZ: I do wonder, Omar, how you would then approach the issue of Hamas, because, as you know, they're threatening to delay the release of these hostages over the weekend.

Trump and Netanyahu both seem inclined to restart hostilities if Hamas delays that hostage release. Clearly, they want a future where that group, a terrorist group, is not in Gaza's future. So how do you reconcile those two ideas?

BADDAR: Yes, what Netanyahu and Trump want is the defeat of Hamas, something they have not been able to achieve militarily on the ground, and now they're trying to force through negotiations once more, saying either Hamas accepts its total defeat or else we're going back to the onslaught, that, again, nobody says is actually targeted at Hamas, nobody serious, certainly.

Everybody talks about this as an assault on the entire Palestinian population of Gaza and making Gaza unlivable as punishment until Hamas capitulates and buckles. And what we're seeing right now is clearly an effort by Israel, seeing that they finally have in Donald Trump an endorsement of this idea of displacing Palestinians, Israel has lost any interest in that cease-fire.

And they're looking for an excuse and a reason for it to fall apart, which is why we have seen dozens of Palestinians get killed throughout the so-called cease-fire, why we're seeing Israel drag its feet on moving to the next phase of negotiations that could turn that cease- fire into a permanent cease-fire.

All of that is deliberately designed to force Hamas' hand to basically make it so that Hamas cannot comply without seemingly completely giving in to Israel's wishes, in violation of those terms. And that does mean that we're effectively imminently going back to hostilities that are aiming to displace Hamas from the picture entirely.

And the issue is here is that there is a double standard with which we look at this, is that, if Hamas is disqualified from being in Gaza because of the atrocities they have committed in Israel -- and, certainly, they have committed atrocities, there's no denying that -- why isn't it the opposite true?

Why aren't the far, infinitely greater atrocities that the Israeli government has committed in Gaza disqualifying the Israeli government remaining in power? And that's what we're looking at here is a situation of dominance in which Israel gets to impose its will on the Palestinians, and they seemingly have Trump's complete endorsement in pursuing that, and that is not a recipe for peace.

If we're actually looking for a way in which we resolve this crisis, we have to start recognizing that Palestinians are equal human beings who are deserving of the same dignity and freedom that Israelis enjoy, and that requires a completely, a fundamentally different approach from the United States towards this entire issue, in which we do start demanding that Israel abide by international law and recognize Palestinians as people who deserve to be free in their own land.

[13:20:02]

SANCHEZ: I am curious, Omar, how you then respond to the argument that we would not be here at this stage were it not for Hamas' atrocities on October 7, that the reason this war began, the reason this war has been carried out this way, you will hear from folks who defend Netanyahu and the IDF, is because of Hamas?

BADDAR: I mean, there's no question that the expansion of Israel's onslaught in Gaza was triggered by October 7 and what Hamas did on that day.

But we have to remember that the conflict did not start on that day. There was no freedom or security for Palestinians on October 6. We have had the entire Gaza Strip under Israeli siege, no relationship with the outside world, no connection to the outside world. Palestinians in Gaza were not allowed to leave Gaza or visit any other country in the world unless they had Israeli permission to do so.

The economy was collapsed. Unemployment was through the roof. It was, again, a situation of dominance in which Palestinians were living under the boot of Israeli siege and occupation. And if that's an acceptable status quo, then, by all means, that's something that you could -- you can then decide to blame on Hamas for having rocked, but that is an unsustainable situation. There is no situation in which Palestinians can be denied freedom

indefinitely in which violence is not expected to explode. And if we are serious once again about resolving the core issue, if we're simply looking for a way to just trade blame, that's very easy to do. And we can do that going back for many, many decades.

But if we're interested in solving the issue, you have to deal with the underlying problem. And the underlying problem that existed before October 7 is the fact that Palestinians have spent decades under illegal Israeli rule. The entire world, the International Court of Justice, the United Nations, everybody agrees that that siege and the occupation of the West Bank and Gaza are illegal.

And you can't indefinitely place Palestinians under a foreign military occupation and expect for that situation to be sustainable.

SANCHEZ: Omar, I have one final question for you.

As I heard Donald Trump there talking about some of the inroads that he made with Arab communities, I think he vastly overstated his support among Arabs. But you were someone who was frustrated with the Biden administration's approach to this conflict. And I understand you ultimately sat out the last election.

Seeing now Trump's vision for the Middle East become more solid, become more imminent and real, do you have any regrets?

BADDAR: Yes, I can't quite describe them as regrets.

I mean, I understood that Trump was going to bring a worse outcome moving forward. But the reality is, the reason why Donald Trump can say that Gaza is unlivable and there's nothing for Palestinians left there is because the Biden/Harris administration facilitated the utter destruction of Gaza for 15 months with unrelenting American weapons and diplomatic protection and support and stepping in to block cease- fires and so on.

So, yes, certainly, Trump has made things and seems to be priming us to an absolutely awful situation. But that was built on what the previous administration has done.

And I think that the point here that is really worth emphasizing is that, whereas the Biden administration supplied the weapons for Israel to do what it did in Gaza and its people, killing tens of thousands of Palestinian children, there was all this grumbling about how we don't really approve and we're upset and we think Israel is killing too many people and we encourage calm, whereas Donald Trump does not care about coming across as palatable.

He will just openly say -- essentially endorse what Israel is doing. Instead of pretending what it's not, Donald Trump comes along and basically says, yes, we are for the destruction of Palestinian society in Gaza and the displacement of Palestinians.

But, unfortunately, we have to really look at a longer period of dark American policy towards Israel and Palestine, in which we treat Israel like a country that is above the rules and above the law. And that facilitates the absolute outrages that Trump is proposing at this time.

SANCHEZ: Omar Baddar, we have to leave the conversation there. We appreciate you coming on and sharing your perspective.

BADDAR: Thank you so much.

SANCHEZ: Still ahead this hour: huge questions about a conflict of interest at the Justice Department. Lawyers who defended President Trump may now be investigating those who tried to prosecute him.

And CNN rides along with federal agents patrolling the southern border. What it reveals about the president's immigration crackdown.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is the biggest impact?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Apprehension, detention, ultimately leading to removal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:29:02]

SANCHEZ: We have breaking news now into CNN, the White House saying that special envoy Steve Witkoff has been able to secure the release of Marc Fogel.

CNN's Alex Marquardt is tracking the story and joins us now.

Alex, what do we know?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Boris, this was not something that we were expecting.

Of course, there have been some very notable prisoner exchanges between Russia and the United States in the past few years. This was not something that we expected. Marc Fogel, an American teacher who was arrested back in 2021 and then sentenced and convicted the following year to 14 years in prison on drug smuggling charges, has now been released by the Russians in an exchange, according to the White House.

We don't know who was exchanged for him, but what we do know is that the Middle East envoy, as you mentioned, Steve Witkoff, traveled to Moscow and managed to secure the release of Mr. Fogel. Or, rather, Mr. Witkoff, as far as we know, was involved in the negotiation. Fogel is on his way home. He is out of Russian airspace, according to the White House.

I want to read a little bit of the statement from the national security adviser, Mike Waltz. He says that: "President Trump, Steve Witkoff, and the president's advisers negotiated an exchange."