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Judge Denies Blocking DOGE; Richard Trent is Interviewed about DOGE Targeting the IRS; Dr. Saju Mathew is Interviewed about Pope Francis' Condition; Jury Finds A$AP Rocky Not Guilty. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired February 19, 2025 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Data. Significant in and of itself. Also significant for what this judge's decision could lay the groundwork for going - going ahead, as DOGE is diving into every federal agency.

CNN's Katelyn Polantz is tracking this one for us. She's back here with us.

And, Katelyn, Judge Tanya Chutkan, who's over my shoulder, this is a name that people will be familiar with when it comes to Donald Trump and being in a courtroom. What does her decision mean this time?

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, this is a temporary decision because that's how the courts are being asked to step in right now, in all of these cases where they're being asked to curtail what DOGE is up to. And Judge Chutkan, she did preside over Donald Trump's criminal case that is now dismissed related to the 2020 election, but she's a pretty experienced judge on the federal court in D.C., and she and two of her other colleagues on that same bench, they keep saying that they can't actually step in right now to stop DOGE because there just isn't enough evidence and enough understanding of what DOGE is doing to show that people are being harmed.

So, in this case, the judge, Chutkan, said she was not going to grant a temporary restraining order against DOGE yesterday. What she was looking at was a challenge from a number of democratic state attorneys general, and they wanted her to do a broad curtailing of DOGE's work. They wanted her to tell DOGE, step out of personnel decisions at agencies, and also don't get into any software systems, and a whole slew of federal agencies, including the Department of Education, Health and Human Services, the Department of Energy. And Judge Chutkan, she said, there's just not enough here at this time for her to know that there's imminent, irreparable harm and to meet the legal standard for her to tell DOGE, stop it.

So, that is where a lot of these cases are right now, as the judges are looking on what to do with DOGE on a temporary basis as these cases move forward to the meatier legal arguments about Elon Musk and the ability he has to do things in the federal government. Right now the judges have to be hands off because they just don't find that the law says they can get involved at this point. Kate.

BOLDUAN: At this point. Let's see.

It's good to see you, Katelyn. Thank you so much for tracking it.

Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, thank you, Kate.

The next target for Elon Musk and DOGE, the IRS. They're looking to gain access to the IRS' complex and interconnected data systems, just as the nation is entering the very busy tax season.

Now, advocates and unions are filing emergency lawsuits to stop DOGE from accessing the files to protect you, the taxpayer, they say.

Joining me now is Richard Trent. He is the executive director of Main Street Alliance, one of the groups suing to stop DOGE from accessing those files.

All right, let's just talk in generalities at first. What is at stake?

RICHARD TRENT, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF GROUP SUING TO STOP DOGE FROM ACCESSING IRS FILES: So, imagine that the biggest player in a game is given the referees whistle and allowed to totally rewrite the rules of the game. Imagine the big box store in your small town was given access to the books of the smallest mom and pop stores and allowed to rig the playing field in their advantage. This is a direct incursion into confidential data. It's protected by the Privacy Act. It's protected by, you know, tax - Tax Acts following Watergate. And it's - it's illegal. So, it's - it's why we joined Democracy Forward in this - in this lawsuit.

SIDNER: Who normally has access to this information? I mean we're talking about tax information here. So, it's everything from, where you live, how much you make, how many children you have, who you are married to, and the list goes on.

TRENT: Absolutely. So, what - what DOGE is looking for, and this is kind of the private data mining operation associated with Elon Musk, is access to bank statements, income statements, Social Security information, for small businesses, for individual taxpaying Americans. And it's totally unprecedented.

There are folks who have worked at the IRS for many, many years, the department heads, that don't even have this level of access to data. So, it's - it's something that we need to - to end immediately to make sure that the trust in this key institution doesn't erode anymore.

SIDNER: What do you think the DOGE guys are doing and are going to do with the data that worries you enough to - to join this lawsuit?

TRENT: Well, you know, so - so much of the Trump administration and - and - and Mr. Musk have talked about the need to drain the swamp. But this move is - is - is stocking the swamp with more alligators. [09:35:02]

This is a man with a history of self-dealing. So, you can imagine that with access to the tax information of his competitors, access to the - to the financial information of political rivals, that he would likely use that information against folks.

So, it's not my space to speculate, but we can - we can certainly look at the track record of the folks that are making these decisions. And for what - what - what can come from having this sort of unprecedented access to data.

SIDNER: Do you have any sense of what employees at the IRS are being told at this point when it comes to - to DOGE and what their - what their plans are?

TRENT: No. As the leader of Main Street Alliance, a national network of 30,000 plus small business owners, I focus on the testimony and the feedback of our small business owners and entrepreneurs across the country. And what we're hearing from them is that, you know, Americans don't agree on a lot of things, but we all agree on the need to protect our data, and we don't like these incursions into - into our privacy.

So, this isn't just a left, right, Democrat, Republican thing. This is a matter of one unstable billionaire having access to the private financial information of every single American and small business owner. There's a reason why no other American CEO has this level of access to other business' financial information. It's mad.

SIDNER: And certainly he has a lot of business with the U.S. government as well.

Richard Trent, thank you so much. I really appreciate you spelling that out for us.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, this morning, Pope Francis diagnosed with a new illness. The Vatican reporting he is in good spirits as he receives treatment.

And a new update in the legal battle between Blake Lively and Justin Baldoni. Lively now claims that multiple women on the set of "It Ends With Us" confided in her about Baldoni's, quote, "unwelcome behavior.:

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[09:41:37]

BERMAN: This morning, the Vatican says that Pope Francis had what they call a peaceful night. There have been prayers all around the world as he has been hospitalized for what the Vatican now says is double pneumonia. Primary care physician and public health specialist Doctor Saju Mathew is with us now.

Doc, thanks so much for being with us.

I called it double pneumonia, but bilateral pneumonia. How does that change things?

DR. SAJU MATHEW, PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN: Well, that actually makes conditions worse, John. In an elderly person like the pope, who is close to 90 years of age, we know that part of his lung was removed as a young kid, he already has had multiple bouts of bronchitis. Just having pneumonia in one lobe is tough enough, much less to think about his entire - both lungs infected. That puts him at high risk of, you know, fatality, to be honest. He needs to be watched very closely. One minute the patient is fine, and the next minute the patient is rolled into the ICU. So, we have to be very careful with the pope.

BERMAN: So, the Vatican keeps using the phrase "complex clinical picture." Is that medical terminology or public relations speak?

MATHEW: Yes, I think it's - it's really more public relations talk. In the medical setting we're not going to necessarily say a complex polymicrobial. What that really means is that the pope not only has perhaps a viral infection, he has a bacterial infection as well. And in very few patients, John, if you are extremely immunocompromised, you can also get a fungal infection.

And I think also what a lot of viewers are confused about is, the Vatican says he has a complex medical condition, but he's sitting and, you know, reading the newspaper and he's in good spirits. To me as a physician, that is extremely good news because we're always taught in medical school, John, don't focus on the labs, look at the patient. How's the patient breathing? What's his oxygen level and blood pressure?

BERMAN: You brought up the fact that he's in good spirits, reading the newspaper. They also said he had breakfast. The fact that he's eating, does that indicate he's not intubated? If intubation is even something you do use to treat pneumonia.

MATHEW: Yes, 100 percent in the elderly, just like I said, they can take a turn for the worse so quickly. In fact, 30 to 50 percent of patients in the ICU setting are usually patients that are elderly, immunocompromised, and most of those patients, about 50 percent or higher, will have a double pneumonia. So, this is really not unexpected in the pope. Once again, his condition can be very volatile. It can - it can really go from hour to hour in terms of how he's doing and - and how he's faring.

BERMAN: How do you treat double pneumonia? How do you treat any pneumonia, but particularly double pneumonia?

MATHEW: Yes, so it depends on exactly what the organism is. For most adults, like - like you and I, John, if we get pneumonia, we would have what's called a community acquired pneumonia. And that's usually a bacterial pneumonia.

But in the case of the pope, I'm thinking perhaps initially when he had bronchitis, he probably had the flu or a viral illness that lowered his immune system, and now he has a virus and possibly a, you know, a bacteria as well. So, you would use antibacterials, antibiotics. Perhaps you will need oxygen and also steroids for inflammation of the lungs.

[09:45:06]

BERMAN: So, we are, to a certain extent, speculating on a lot of this because we are getting limited information. Very controlled information, I should say, from the Vatican. What questions - if you could get the answer to any question right now just by asking, what would you ask?

MATHEW: I think the first question I would ask would be, how is the pope doing? What's his oxygen level? How active is he? Because a lot of times in medical school, you know, you want to paint the picture of what the patient looks like when they walk in the room. A good number of times in the hospital or at work I will look at a patient's age and look at their conditions, maybe their white count, and I'm walking in thinking this patient is sick. But if the patient is sitting upright and saying, hey, Dr. Mathew, I'm feeling good, that is almost always a good sign.

But if I had to ask one question, it would be, how alert is the pope? Is he moving around? Is he asking for food?

BERMAN: These are all good questions. I had double pneumonia once. It knocked me on my ass. And I was nowhere near 88. This is a serious thing.

Dr. Saju Mathew, thank you so much for being with us this morning.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, thank you, John.

All right, ahead, why Sean Combs is blaming racism for how prosecutors are charging him and what he wants a judge to do about that. That story and more, ahead.

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[09:50:49]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We, the jury, in the above entitled action, find the defendant, Rakim Mayers, not guilty of the felony.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: That was quite the reaction by A$AP Rocky and those in the court. The rapper jumped out of his seat, you saw there, and eventually into the arms of his girlfriend, and mother of his two children, pop star Rihanna, after being found not guilty on felony assault charges. CNN's Elizabeth Wagmeister is joining us now from Los Angeles.

I understand this whole scenario here and what happened. There's a lot of behind the courtroom reaction, and we could hear some of it. What can you tell us about what happened there?

ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. And that was really a stunning moment from the courtroom, Sara. As you saw there, A$AP Rocky quite literally jumping through the pews into the arms of his superstar partner, Rihanna. Not something that you typically see in a courtroom. You're not supposed to jump through the gallery there. But you can certainly understand why the rapper is so excited and so relieved because, Sara, he was facing up to 24 years behind bars if he was convicted.

Now, A$AP Rocky, he had been facing two charges that stemmed from an altercation in 2021 in Hollywood between him and his former friend named ASAP Relli.

ASAP Relli was alleging that Rocky shot him. You saw photos during the trial that his knuckles were grazed and a little bit bloody. But Rocky's defense said, no, it was actually a prop gun and - that he carries regularly with him for security, and he was acting out in self-defense. So, obviously, the jury siding with Rocky and his defense and fully acquitting him.

SIDNER: It's the first time I've heard someone use a prop gun for security. All those interesting details.

All right, let's move on to another case that has certainly caught the public's attention. We're seeing an update in the case of that Blake Lively versus actor and director Justin Baldoni. What are the new allegations that are being brought in that case?

WAGMEISTER: So, Sara, overnight, and when I say overnight, quite literally, just before the clock struck midnight, which was a deadline that the judge overseeing this case had set for Blake Lively to file her amended complaint.

So, she filed an amended complaint that is 141 pages long. She added 48 pages to her initial complaint that she first filed back in December.

Now, for those who have not been following this case, even though it is the most trending case happening in pop culture for really the past two months, back in December, Blake Lively filed a suit, and she alleged that she was sexually harassed on the set of the film "It Ends With Us" by the director and her co-star, Justin Baldoni. But that's not all. She says she wasn't only subjected to sexual harassment, but then that she was subject to career retaliation and Baldoni's team smeared her behind the scenes in the press.

Now, in this updated, amended filing, the big bombshell here, according to Blake Lively, is that there were other women on the set who were also made to feel uncomfortable by Baldoni's alleged behavior. Blake Lively claims in this new, updated complaint that another female costar, who is unnamed in this complaint, that she actually reported this behavior to Sony, which was the distributor behind this film.

Now, I have reached out to Baldoni's team. We have not heard back. But again, this development coming overnight. And, you know, it was late and it's still early on the West Coast, where his attorneys are based.

But you see there that they say that he did not hold himself accountable after this was reported, and instead that he used a louder voice, it goes on to say, to silence Blake Lively and anyone else who may have spoken up.

SIDNER: And I know you reached out. They have also been warned by the judge that this should not be played out in the media.

[09:55:01]

And almost that they - there might be some sort of - of response by the judge if they speak to members of the media.

Now, let's move on to the Sean Combs case. There is a new move by him and his team to dismiss these allegations. Very serious ones indeed. What do you know there?

WAGMEISTER: Yes. Very serious allegations. As we know, Combs is facing three federal charges. His criminal trial is expected to begin this May. And last night his team filing a motion to dismiss one of those charges, which is transportation to engage in prostitution.

Now, get this, Sara, their reasoning is Combs' defense claims that he has been subjected to a racist prosecution. Now, this is not the first time that they have alluded to this. Actually, last year in an interview with TMZ, they said that this whole case is about trying to take down a black man.

But I want to read you just a quick part from the new filing last night. It says, quote, "Mr. Combs has been singled out because he is a powerful black man. He is being prosecuted for conduct that regularly goes unpunished."

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, Elizabeth Wagmeister, thank you so much for that reporting. Appreciate it.

BERMAN: Ooh, exhausting. Lot of information there right at the end.

SIDNER: A lot of stuff. Yes.

BOLDUAN: True.

Thank you so much for joining.

SIDNER: And we're not touching it. OK.

BOLDUAN: This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL. "CNN NEWSROOM" is up next.

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