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President Trump's Approval Ratings at 47 Percent in Recent Poll; Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-OR) Interviewed on Current Weak Position of Democrats in House of Representatives and Senate; Former Vice President Mike Pence Criticizes President Trump's Claim that Ukraine Started War with Russia; IRS Expected to Fire About 6,000 Workers Today; Eleven-year-old Dies by Suicide After Alleged Bullying Over Migrant Status. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired February 20, 2025 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Ukrainian President Zelenskyy and Donald Trump's Ukraine's envoy made all the more important after Trump parrots Russian propaganda.

And measles cases still on the rise in the U.S. What you need to know now to protect your family from one of the most contagious diseases in the world.

I'm Kate Bolduan with John Berman and Sara Sidner. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, this morning, we are poring through brand new CNN polling on President Trump's second term scorecard so far, if you will. Exactly a month, that's where we are today into his administration. His approval rating is now at 47 percent. There are signs Americans are growing dissatisfied with his handling of the biggest issue on their minds, high prices, but also concern about his push for more presidential power.

Let's get right into it with all of the numbers and all of the analysis. CNN, Washington bureau chief and political director David Chalian, a man with many titles, a man with a big brain. David, 47 percent --

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Thanks, Sara, good morning.

SIDNER: This tells you something about where people are. Give us some sense of what you saw in these numbers.

CHALIAN: Yes. You know, when you're looking at Donald Trump's approval ratings, it's always needing to be compared to Donald Trump, because 47 percent is actually a numeric high in CNN polling for Trump ever. Across the four years of his first administration, we never saw him at 47 percent approval in CNN polling.

Now, just want to point out, though, we also have never seen anybody but Donald Trump this low at the start of a new term, right. So for Trump, he's doing well. Compared to all of his predecessors, this is below where all of them were at this point beginning their presidencies.

You also can look at that 47 percent approval by party. And I think this is instructive. Obviously, you don't expect many Democrats to approve of the way Trump is handling his job. Thats only at 11 percent. But look at that middle column, Sara, independents. He's only at 43 percent approval, 56 percent disapproval among that critical swath of the middle of the electorate. And then, of course, Republicans are largely with him, 88 percent approval there, Sara.

SIDNER: Yes. And as you dig further into these numbers, and I know you've gone over these probably 1,000 times as they have come out, what are people feeling about his policies on some of these key issues?

CHALIAN: You mentioned the big one. I think this is one of the biggest warning signs for the president on prices being lowered, 62 percent, 62 percent say that he has not gone far enough to reduce the price of everyday goods. This is what he promised to do. And we've heard him in the last several weeks try to temper expectations when he speaks publicly that getting prices down may be tough, but this was issue number one for America in the election, and you can see such a large swath of Americans, and that includes a bunch of Republicans who don't think he has gone far enough yet to reduce prices.

Where has he gone too far? I think these numbers are interesting to look at. You see slim majorities, 52 percent say he's gone too far using presidential power. Another slim majority, 51 percent, saying he's gone too far in cutting federal programs. Things like changing how government works or deporting undocumented immigrants, he has a little more popular support there. Those are more evenly divided between folks who think he hasn't gone far enough and thinks he's gone too far. But that use of presidential power, a majority say Donald Trump has gone too far.

SIDNER: Yes, it's interesting because the top two issues for getting him into office were the economy, prices as well, and immigration.

All right, what about how people are feeling about Elon Musk? We just saw the president and Elon Musk sit down for this big interview with Sean Hannity. And who wasn't there? The vice president of the United States. So clearly that relationship looks pretty good. But how do Americans feel about Musk?

CHALIAN: Well, we show that a majority, 54 percent, say that the role that Trump has given Elon Musk is a bad thing, compared to only 28 percent who say it's a good thing, 18 percent of poll respondents say it is neither a bad or a good thing. But clearly they have more work to do, the Trump administration, if they're going to try to bring Elon Musk's sort of popularity with the American people and what he's doing in his mission into better standing. At the moment, they're starting on their back foot with how the American people are perceiving what Donald Trump has handed over to Elon Musk to do in this administration. SIDNER: Fascinating numbers. I know there are many more, and we look

forward to hearing about them from you. David Chalian, thank you so much. Really appreciate it this morning.

CHALIAN: Thank you.

SIDNER: John?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. With us now is Senator Jeff Merkley, a Democrat from Oregon who sits on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Senator, thanks so much for being with us. I think you just heard the new CNN poll numbers, Donald Trump now underwater, dipping a little bit in the first month, and on the economy, that number that David Chalian just told us about on reducing the price of everyday goods, 62% of Americans think that Donald Trump has not gone far enough. There you go. The graphics up there, 62% of Americans think that he has not gone far enough.

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Where do you think Donald Trump's focus has been, and where do you think it should be?

SEN. JEFF MERKLEY (D-OR): Well, certainly, John. I think people are starting to think about Trumpflation, where so many of his actions are going to drive up the costs of basically everything, which is certainly not what he campaigned on doing.

But we have seen such an extraordinary turn of events with the president. First, depending on executive orders, basically viewing the presidency as ruling by fiat. Like a dictator, while in foreign affairs, he's basically shaking the alliance to its roots with Europe, and certainly favoring Russia over Ukraine. And so that is -- there is so much going on here at once, we refer to it as flooding the zone, but there's item after item of deep concern, and authoritarian impulses at home and authoritarian impulses abroad are one common theme.

BERMAN: I will get to Russia in just a moment, but just in terms of what his actions have been and how Americans feel about them, the bad news for Democrats is that voters in the polls don't seem much happier about you. This is from the Quinnipiac poll, how Democrats in Congress are handling their job. Just 21% approve, 68% disapprove. I mean, that's a chasm, Senator. Why do you think that's there?

MERKLEY: Well, there's a lot of expectation that somehow among Democrats that we can stop this Trump train. Certainly here in the Senate, where it takes a supermajority to change a policy, and the Democrats are in the minority. We have limited tools. So we can use our voice, we're using our voice, we're using our every procedural tool we have to slow down the Trump train on some of these horrific nominations for the Cabinet.

But I know from my town halls back home that people are incredibly upset about the direction of our presidency right now, and they expect us to have solutions that, quite frankly, we don't have the power to implement as a minority party in the Senate and the House.

BERMAN: Now, I do want to talk about Ukraine and Russia. I woke up to this quote, this tweet from Dmitry Medvedev, who used to be the Prime Minister but is basically, you know, the number two or three in all of Russia, depending on how you look at it. And he wrote on Twitter this morning, "If you had told me three months ago that these were the words of the U.S. president, I would have laughed out loud. I would have laughed out loud." He's calling about -- he's talking about President Trump calling Volodymyr Zelenskyy a dictator. He's talking about President Trump saying that Ukraine is responsible for the invasion.

But to hear a Russian official saying he would have laughed if he had been told that a president would say something like that, what do you think of that?

MERKLEY: Well, we now have the president of the United States becoming a premier propagandist for Russia. This is the things -- themes that Russia has been promoting. But never in their wildest dreams did they think that they would be repeated by the president of the United States. I mean, we all understand and the Russian officials understand that they started the war. So they are like, oh, wow. How did this happen? Our propaganda is so effective that the president of the United States is spouting it. Blaming Zelenskyy for starting the war, saying Zelenskyy is a -- is a dictator.

I mean, the situation is very clear here in which we have a democracy where the people of Ukraine have fought to defend their freedoms, lost upward of 100,000 individuals, hundreds more, thousands more who have been injured, country decimated. But they have stopped this powerful neighbor, Russia, from taking them over because they want to preserve their freedom of speech and their freedom of religion, their freedom of assembly, the freedom of press. They want their freedoms and they're fighting for them. And meanwhile, we have a president of the United States who seems to be working to get the best deal for Russia instead of the best deal for Ukraine. And meanwhile, shattering our alliance with our European partners.

BERMAN: What's the best deal for America?

MERKLEY: Well, the best deal for America is to continue to be a leader for democracy and freedom in the world. Think of all the dictators around the world who would love to see an America that no longer is engaged. I mean, I visited Taiwan in December. Folks in Taiwan are terrified about how the United States behaves in Ukraine might affect how China considers attacking Taiwan

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We need to be the champion for freedom. Those are our American values. We need to be a partner with nations where people are striving to have, well, government by and for the people instead of through a dictator. That's our role in the world. Those are our values. That's what we need to continue to fight for. And we certainly are well served by our alliance with Europe over the last 80 years. It would be a phenomenal mistake to shatter the alliance with Europe.

But this week, European leaders were meeting and asking themselves, is this a Munich moment? Is Trump basically doing to Ukraine what Chamberlain did to Czechoslovakia in 1938? The fact that European leaders are having this conversation tells you what a dangerous moment we are in.

BERMAN: You gave away the Sudetenland. Chamberlain did, and ultimately all of Czechoslovakia.

Senator Jeff Merkley from Oregon, go Ducks. We appreciate you being with us this morning. Thank you very much.

MERKLEY: Thank you very much, John.

BOLDUAN: President Trump calling Zelenskyy a dictator has, as we know and seen, drawn swift and understandable criticism from both sides of the political aisle. But from Republicans, the pushback, once again, pretty muted, with one exception so far, it seems. His former vice president, Mike Pence, taking on Donald Trump directly on social media, writing this, "Mr. President, Ukraine did not start this war. Russia launched an unprovoked and brutal invasion, claiming hundreds of thousands of lives. The road to peace must be built on truth."

Joining us right now is Marc Short, a longtime adviser to Pence. He was Pence's chief of staff when he was V.P., and Marc is now board chair of Advancing American Freedom. It's good to see you again, Marc. That is what stood out to me when I was kind of watching the reaction play out yesterday, is that Mike Pence is really the only one so far that I've seen to directly address Donald Trump in his criticism of his remarks. You know Pence better than most. Why don't you -- why do you think he decided to come out stronger than really any other Republican so far?

MARC SHORT, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO VICE PRESIDENT PENCE: Well, Kate, I think there's a few reasons. I think we're still in the first 100 days of the Trump administration, and I think that there's a lot of things that President Trump is doing well that I think encourages Republicans on the spending side and on the border. And so I think there's a concern about wanting to be critical at this moment.

But I think for the former vice president, I think that the policy that he seems to be pursuing right now, President Trump is, is not just a departure from the Biden administration, but frankly, it's a huge departure from the first Trump administration policy. The president has spoken about how, actually, during his administration was the only time in this century that that Putin did not take land grabs across eastern Europe. And I think that the policy that we had in place, I think, deterred Russia. The president would speak about the fact that when Putin took Crimea during the Obama administration, Obama sent blankets, but President Trump sent javelin missiles. The president took sanctions against Russian officials. He stopped Nord Stream 2. All that very aggressive posture.

To adopt the talking points of the Kremlin seems a great departure from that. I think that's a big concern. But I think also for the vice president is a concern that, you know, right now, nobody is talking about sending American troops over to Europe. We're actually just supporting Ukraine in their self-defense. But if Russia gets emboldened, takes additional NATO territory, it does require Americans to actually be sent. And I think his concern is you're basically encouraging Putin to continue land grabs across other parts of eastern Europe.

BOLDUAN: And add to that, how is that advancing American interests at all? A former official from Trump's first term told "The Washington Post" this, anonymously, on why Trump is doing this. Here's the quote, "Ukraine is like Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria. Some other idiot's war, not his. And he wants it out of the way so he can get the deal with Putin he has always fantasized about. It's sad, but very simple. And now that Zelenskyy has criticized him, he will try to get rid of him."

You also worked around Donald Trump for years in the first White House. Do you think this has, could have a real impact on the course and contours of the negotiations now?

SHORT: I think it does, Kate. I think that the reality is that the president does want to focus, I think, on issues with Russia and with China, and feels in some ways that these smaller, in his mind, smaller issues, I think are deterrent from solving some of the world's bigger problems.

But having said that, Kate, I think that, as your previous guest said, the concern is that if you're trying to look at how we address China, the reality is look who is aligned with Putin right now in this effort against Ukraine? It's been China, North Korea, Iran have been sending weapons and troops.

And for China, the incentive to say, well, this is a lesson learned on how we should negotiate on Taiwan.

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And so, I think if you're actually saying we want to have, you know, stronger negotiations with China and want this problem out of the way, in many ways, the message you're sending to China, I think, is counterintuitive to what you want to actually accomplish as far as showing a strong force against China's aggressive approach across the Pacific.

BOLDUAN: I want to ask you just real quick about this new polling out from CNN this morning showing that Trump's approval is tilting negative, still higher than at any point from his first term. And in it, you've got a broad majority that says and feels the president is not doing enough to address the high prices, deal with inflation.

Also, 52 percent saying that he's gone too far in using presidential power. You see that, and you think, what, at this point, Marc.

SHORT: Well, I think that the President is always going to have a really, really high floor and a pretty low ceiling. And I think that, that's just the nature of who Donald Trump is. And so, I do think though, that there's been a lot of focus on the border that Americans wanted, but it's hard to say what you could do in 30 days, but you could also say, here's what we're going to be doing our plan is to lower prices.

Instead, I think, what people are hearing is all the tariffs that are anticipated to be coming, and those are only going to drive up costs.

And so, for a lot of Americans, I think, one of the dramatic change from the Biden administration big spending, high inflation. They want to see action taken to actually lower prices, too. And they're not hearing that yet from the administration.

BOLDUAN: And let's be honest, they're hearing a lot from Donald Trump on a daily basis.

SHORT: Sure.

BOLDUAN: And that's the one thing that they're really not hearing about, right. It's not like he's hiding away. He's speaking and he's not talking about inflation nearly like he was during the campaign.

It's good to see you, Marc and thank you so much.

SHORT: I think some of that's good, Kate.

BOLDUAN: I hear you.

SHORT: I think some of that's good because it's a contrast to the previous Biden years.

BOLDUAN: As a member of the press, more access is always appreciated to those in power. It's good to see you. Thank you -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right, ahead, indiscriminate madness and effing chaos. What documents and employees are saying about how the Trump administration's federal firings are actually going.

And the apparent leader of a cult-like group tied to multiple killings across the United States now behind bars. What we're learning about the Zizians who led officials on a cross-country manhunt.

And would you accept $30,000.00 after surviving that? How much Delta Air Lines is offering passengers who survived that insane Toronto plane crash that ended with the plane upside down, but no one lost their lives?

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[08:21:42]

BERMAN: All right, breaking news. We're learning the IRS is expected to fire about 6,000 workers today right in the middle of tax season. This as the Trump administration insist they're only firing recent hires or low performers in the federal workforce.

But interviews and documents obtained by CNN show the opposite in many cases. CNN's Rene Marsh is here with the latest on this. Good morning. What have you learned?

RENE MARSH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, John, CNN spoke with more than a dozen federal workers recently terminated and found not only did many of them have positive performance reviews, but several held mission critical roles involving safety, security, which DOGE has said is off limits.

Across numerous agencies employees, including some with highly specialized roles in cybersecurity, overseeing U.S. nuclear weapons, and maintaining the country's critical infrastructure, received termination letters stating, "based on your performance, their employment was no longer in the public interest," but those employees actually had perfect performance reviews, and CNN got ahold of those documents to essentially verify that.

A Department of Homeland Security cyber official, for example, working to fend off Chinese hackers. They were fired despite receiving a, "achieved excellence" in their performance review just last summer; an employee at Veteran's Affairs who helped veterans seeking mental health care terminated despite a June 2024 performance review, noting there exceptional performance.

A Department of Energy employee fired, then rehired, once the agency realized the critical nature of their work on the power grid in the Pacific Northwest. But upon that employee's return to the office, they discovered their online personnel file listed unsatisfactory performance as the reason for their termination.

That employee actually telling CNN this is blank chaos, indiscriminate madness by a bunch of teenagers being given the keys to the castle from far above Chris Wright's pay grade, Chris Wright being the Energy Secretary at the Department of Energy.

Now, these indiscriminate firings of federal workers really undercut DOGE and the White House has claims that they are targeting these low performers and recent hires.

It also raises questions about who is making the decision and whether the officials doing the firing fully understand what these employees do and the impact of firing them. It is worth noting, John, we reached out to all of the agencies listed in our story and did not receive a response.

BERMAN: Interesting. All right, maybe the people who are supposed to respond have been laid off also.

Rene Marsh, thank you for being with us. Appreciate it -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Investigations are underway in Texas after the mother of an 11-year-old girl says that bullies at school threatening to call ICE to have her parents taken away led to that little girl dying by suicide. The mother saying the school knew of the bullying and never told the family.

Two small planes collide mid-air in Arizona. What we are learning now about this latest deadly aviation crash.

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[08:29:13]

BOLDUAN: A devastating story out of Texas to tell you about. An 11- year-old girl's death now ruled a suicide is under further investigation. That is because her mother says her daughter was bullied at school over the family's immigration status, and says the school knew about the bullying against little Jocelynn Rojo Carranza, but never told the family.

CNN's Ed Lavandera spoke to the family and is here with us now.

Ed, this is just tragic, upon tragic.

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A heartbreaking story, to say the least. We spent significant time speaking with Jocelynn Carranza's mother yesterday just hours after the family had laid the young girl to rest and had funeral services yesterday in the city of Gainesville Texas, north of the Dallas-Fort Worth area.

And the mother told us that her daughter had tried taking her life on February 3rd, but didn't die until five days later, February 8th.

And it wasn't until after that, that she was told by an investigator with the Gainesville School District that her daughter had been a victim of bullying. And this is according to what the investigator told the family and that the young girl had been told that because of her family's immigration status, that she was going to be deported, that her family was going to be deported, and that she would be left alone here in the United States.

Her mother tells us that she believes it was that fear of being left alone that might have played a role in her daughter's suicide.

We also spoke with one of Jocelynn's friend, a young girl who also goes to the same school, and with permission of her mother, she told us that in recent weeks there had been a great deal of chatter in the school about ICE and deportation and immigration.

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