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Zelenskyy Leaves The White House Early After Oval Office Clash; Official: Ukrainians Protested Being Kicked Out Of White House, Made Effort To Continue Talks But Were Rebuffed; World Leaders Support Zelenskyy After Trump Berates Him; Ukraine Source: Zelenskyy, Macron Spoke After Trump Meeting; Rep. Mike Quigley (D-IL) Discusses About His Take on Zelenskyy-Trump Oval Office Meeting. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired February 28, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I want to get the thing set. I'm aligned with Europe. I want to see if we can get this thing done. You want me to be tough? I could be tougher than any human being you've ever seen. I'd be so tough, but you're never going to get a deal that way, so that's the way it goes.

All right. One more question.

(CROSSTALK)

J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I will respond to this. So look, for four years, the United States of America, we had a president who stood up at press conferences and talk tough about Vladimir Putin, and then Putin invaded Ukraine and destroyed a significant chunk of the country. The path to peace and the path to prosperity is maybe engaging in diplomacy. We tried the pathway of Joe Biden of thumping our chest and pretending that the President of the United States' words mattered more than the President of the United States' actions.

What makes America a good country is America engaging in diplomacy. That's what President Trump is doing.

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE: Can I ask you?

VANCE: Sure.

ZELENSKYY: Yes?

VANCE: Yes.

ZELENSKYY: Okay. So, he occupied it, our parts - big parts of Ukraine, parts of East and Crimea. So, he occupied it on 2014. So, during a lot of years, I'm not speaking about just Biden, but those time was Obama, then President Obama, then President Trump, then President Biden, now President Trump, and God bless, now President Trump will stop him.

But during 2014, nobody stopped him. He just occupied and took. He killed people. You know what the contact was ...

TRUMP: 2015. ZELENSKYY: 2014.

VANCE: 2014 to 2015.

TRUMP: or 2014.

ZELENSKYY: Yes, yes, so ...

TRUMP: I was not here.

ZELENSKYY: Yes, but ...

VANCE: (INAUDIBLE) ...

ZELENSKYY: Yes, but during 2014 till 2022, the situation is the same. The people have been dying on the contact line. Nobody stopped him. You know that we had conversations with him, a lot of conversation, my bilateral conversation and we signed with him, me, like a new president in 2019, I signed with him the deal. I signed with him, Macron and Merkel. We signed ceasefire. Ceasefire.

All of them told me that he will never go. We signed him with gas contract. Gas contract, yes. But after that, he broken this ceasefire. He killed our people and he didn't exchange prisoners. We signed the exchange of prisoners, but he didn't do it. What kind of diplomacy, J.D., you are speaking about? What do you mean?

VANCE: I'm talking about the kind of diplomacy that's going to end the destruction of your country.

ZELENSKYY: Yes, but (INAUDIBLE) ...

VANCE: Mr. President - Mr. President, with respect, I think it's disrespectful for you to come into the Oval Office to try to litigate this in front of the American media. Right now, you guys are going around and forcing conscripts to the front lines because you have manpower problems. You should be thanking the President for trying to bring it into this conflict.

ZELENSKYY: Have you ever been to Ukraine that you say what problems we have?

VANCE: I have been to ...

ZELENSKYY: Then come once.

VANCE: I've actually watched and seen the stories, and I know what happens is you bring people, you bring them on a propaganda tour, Mr. President. Are - do you disagree that you've had problems ...

ZELENSKYY: What?

VANCE: ... bringing people and your military?

ZELENSKYY: We have problems ...

VANCE: And do you think that it's respectful ...

ZELENSKYY: I will answer ...

VANCE: ... to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country?

ZELENSKYY: A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning.

VANCE: Sure.

ZELENSKYY: First of all, during the war, everybody has problems, even you, but you have nice ocean and don't feel now, but you will feel it in the future. God bless ...

TRUMP: You don't know that.

ZELENSKYY: God bless ...

TRUMP: You don't know that.

ZELENSKYY: God bless you don't have war.

TRUMP: Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're trying to solve a problem. Don't tell us what we're going to feel.

ZELENSKYY: I'm not telling you, I'm answering on this question.

TRUMP: Because you're in no position to dictate that. Remember (INAUDIBLE) ...

VANCE: That's exactly (INAUDIBLE) ...

ZELENSKYY: I'm not dictating.

TRUMP: You're in no position to dictate what we're going to feel.

ZELENSKYY: You will ...

TRUMP: We're going to feel very good.

ZELENSKYY: You will influence.

TRUMP: We're going to feel very good and very strong.

ZELENSKYY: I'm telling you, you will feel influence.

TRUMP: You're right now not in a very good position. You've allowed yourself to be in a very bad position ...

ZELENSKYY: From the very - from the very beginning of the war.

TRUMP: ... and he happens to be right about it.

ZELENSKYY: From the very beginning of the war, Mr. President ...

TRUMP: You're not in a good position.

ZELENSKYY: ... I was - I was ...

TRUMP: You don't have the cards right now. With us, you start having cards.

ZELENSKYY: I'm not playing cards.

TRUMP: But right now, you don't have playing cards.

ZELENSKYY: I'm very serious, Mr. President.

TRUMP: You're playing cards.

ZELENSKYY: I'm very serious.

TRUMP: You're gambling with the lives of millions of people.

ZELENSKYY: I'm the President in war. You think ...

TRUMP: You're gambling with World War III.

ZELENSKYY: What you are speaking about?

TRUMP You're gambling with World War III.

ZELENSKYY: What are you speaking about?

TRUMP: And what you're doing is very disrespectful to the country, this country.

ZELENSKYY: I'm - with all due respect (INAUDIBLE) ...

TRUMP: That's back to you. Far more than a lot of people said they should have.

ZELENSKYY: I'm (INAUDIBLE) ...

VANCE: Have you said thank you once this entire meeting?

ZELENSKYY: A lot of this.

VANCE: No, in this entire meeting ...

ZELENSKYY: Even today.

VANCE: ... have you said thank you ...

ZELENSKYY: Even today.

VANCE: You went to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October, offer some words of appreciation for the United States of America ...

ZELENSKYY: What you are speaking about?

VANCE: ... and the President who's trying to save your country.

ZELENSKYY: Please, you think that if you will speak very loudly about the war, you can ...

[15:05:01]

TRUMP: He's not speaking loudly. He's not speaking loudly. Your country's in big trouble.

ZELENSKYY: Can I answer?

TRUMP: Wait a minute. No, no.

ZELENSKYY: Can I answer?

TRUMP: You've done a lot of talking. Your country is in big trouble.

ZELENSKYY: I know.

TRUMP: You're not winning.

ZELENSKYY: I know.

TRUMP: You're not winning this.

ZELENSKYY: I ...

TRUMP: You have a damn good chance of coming out okay because of us.

ZELENSKYY: We are saying, Mr. President ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: CNN's Jeff Zeleny is live for us now at the White House. Jeff, tell us how this transpired, what ultimately led to Trump kicking Zelenskyy out of the White House, and how it all went down.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, after that extraordinary exchange in the Oval Office, all sides went to their corners, if you will. Lunch was expected to be served. It was literally sitting out on trays and counters in the West Wing of the White House. A signing table was in the East Room of the White House waiting for Trump and Zelenskyy to sign an agreement this afternoon. That, of course, did not happen.

But we are learning that both the Ukrainian delegation and the American delegation separated, and Trump and Zelenskyy did not speak again, which is not surprising, perhaps, given how that tense exchange ended in the Oval Office. But for about 25 minutes or so, Zelenskyy stayed in the West Wing in a series of offices that are provided for visitors like him, and then he left.

He left the White House in his black SUV. We saw it here live on your show, driving behind us here, and then went out, where he'll be spending a couple more hours in Washington. But we do know that Zelenskyy has canceled an afternoon speech he was scheduled to give. And he's now set to fly to London. And we do not know what will come from this.

But we can say the White House is moving very quickly to capitalize on this as a sign of strength, dispatching allies like Sen. Lindsey Graham out to praise the performance of the Vice President and the President. The White House also releasing a statement saying that Vice President Vance and President Trump are standing up for America's interests.

But the bottom line to all of this here as we near the afternoon hours here in Washington on Friday is what comes of this deal? Is there any track to get it back restarted? We do not know. It does not appear that way in the moment, but we shall see what the coming hours and days bring.

We do know the President is scheduled to leave the White House in a couple hours to fly to Mar-a-Lago, his Florida resort. As of now, we're told that is still on schedule.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Jeff Zeleny at the White House for us. Thank you so much for recapping that for us.

European leaders are reacting. Their support coming so quickly we haven't had time to put together individual responses, but we'll read a few of them to you.

The Prime Minister of Spain writes, quote, "Ukraine, Spain stands with you."

The President of Lithuania writing, quote, "Ukraine, you'll never walk alone."

The President of Moldova, quote, "The truth is simple. Russia invaded Ukraine. Russia is the aggressor. Ukraine defends its freedom and ours. We stand with Ukraine."

From Germany, quote, "Germany, together with our European allies, stands united alongside Ukraine and against the Russian aggression. Their defense of democracy and their quest for peace and security is ours."

Also Sweden, quote, "Sweden stands with Ukraine. You are not only fighting for your freedom, but also for all of Europe's."

KEILAR: Yes, joining us now is CNN Chief International Security Correspondent Nick Paton Walsh, who's in Kyiv.

Some strong words from European leaders there, Nick. I wonder what you think about what you're hearing there and what people in Ukraine are feeling tonight.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Your last question first. I think, consternation, shock, real existential dreads. I mean, I don't want to overstate this, but we've just seen a potential permanent fissure between Ukraine and its main military and financial backer. That rare-earth deal was potentially looking like it might salvage things, but it was always the personal relationship between Trump and Zelenskyy that needed the most attention.

And now we are dealing with a nation which is dealing also, too, with the comments of Lindsey Graham, suggesting that we need to see some sort of change in behavior from President Zelenskyy or he should step aside, again raising the possibility of a change in leadership here, something which the Russian narrative has floated for some time, calling Zelenskyy illegitimate.

And so that starts a separate conversation here, too, although I should also point out on certain military telegram channels and elsewhere there have been very vociferous suggestions of support for Zelenskyy, too. You have to understand the difference in experience here.

Zelenskyy's been at war for three years and consistently been in meetings, frankly, where he's been held up as the hero of so many Ukrainians that he has indeed been guiding them through this particular war. And while I think many had expected he would enter this meeting with the same ingratiating spirit that we saw from France, French and British leaders during this week to sort of clear the road for Zelenskyy to arrive, he was clearly very riled by the statements of J.D. Vance and the meeting then spiraled out of control, frankly.

[15:10:06]

I heard from one U.S. official that perhaps the tone began to feel a bit off when he turned up in a shirt, not a suit. The trademark black shirt he wears to everything. A previous green t-shirt has been his trademark as well, giving the clear symbol that he's a wartime leader.

But the U.S. official I spoke to suggested maybe a suit would have been appropriate. We know his chief of staff was wearing one. But it's that sort of minuscule detail that I think is distracting from the broader problems really here, that this was a time when Zelenskyy should have healed that relationship. And instead, we're now seeing what another official I spoke to said is a completely new landscape that we're dealing with.

What does this mean? Well, a European foreign minister of Estonia suggested perhaps Europe could go it alone and use frozen Russian assets that are under their control to fund Ukraine's defense. We'll have to be honest. I think they probably need to be able to buy American weapons for that to happen. The idea is being held out that possibly there might be something that can be salvaged from this. That's entirely possible. But we are seeing an extraordinary moment here in the war.

And, you know, we like to talk about this as leaders amongst themselves in offices. There is a front line here where the Russians are advancing. There will likely be morale and recruitment issues because of the likelihood of U.S. aid at least being disrupted. When that happened at the end of 2023, it was exceptionally damaging. And so, I think we are going to see Ukraine waking up tomorrow horrified at the unknown landscape ahead of it.

SANCHEZ: Nick Paton Walsh live for us in Kyiv.

We have CNN Chief National Security Correspondent Alex Marquardt with us.

And Alex, this statement from Lindsey Graham essentially saying that Zelenskyy has to fundamentally change or leave, what would happen if Zelenskyy were to step aside or step down?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: I mean, this is remarkable. Graham was in this bipartisan meeting with Zelenskyy and other senators earlier today. Graham is one of the staunchest supporters of Ukraine. And here he is raising the possibility that Zelenskyy may have to step down. Now, this is something that Zelenskyy has himself talked about just a few days ago in a press conference. He said that he was ready to step down if it brought peace to his country, if Ukraine was allowed to join NATO, which, of course, the United States has said should not happen.

This does seem to be an idea that is increasingly percolating. This idea of Zelenskyy stepping down in order to salvage the U.S. backing, the U.S.-Ukraine relationship and essentially get things back on track. I was just speaking with a U.S. official who also raised this possibility, who talked about the relationship between President Trump and Volodymyr Zelenskyy seeming irreparable, this official told me.

It's disastrous, the official said. It's not clear how the bilateral relationship proceeds while Zelenskyy is still in charge unless he can find a way to make this right with President Trump. That does seem like a - that is not - like getting that relationship back on track today is not something that appears to be necessarily in the cards. What could come next? There is no automatic or clear apparent.

So, I think for now, the Europeans are going to try to smooth things over. We have this summit that is being organized by the Brits that is taking place on Sunday. We know that the NATO secretary general is also going. You just read, Boris, all those statements of loyalty and sympathy from those European leaders.

So certainly, the Europeans are going to perhaps not try to go it alone, but at least try to get this back on track. But any discussion about what the U.S. would contribute to a European peacekeeping mission or a backstop, as the Europeans have called it, that appears to have completely evaporated. I mean, we were - the best-case scenario out of today's signing of this deal was essentially to get the U.S. and Ukrainian relationship back to a point where military aid would continue, where there could be these discussions about what an American security guarantee would look like. That has completely disappeared in the wake of this stunning Oval Office meeting.

KEILAR: You know, I wonder, as you're looking at this, Alex, a lot of this seems to be - the undertones of this relationship is driven so much by personal animus. And we can't ignore the fact that Trump's first impeachment happened because of his phone call, the perfect phone call, as he said, with Volodymyr Zelenskyy. And ultimately, that led to, yes, Trump being impeached, a huge - he even referenced it, right, going through the Russia hoax. He referenced it there in the Oval Office with Zelenskyy, not specifically Zelenskyy's role in the call. But it's always something that is on Trump's mind. This is not his favorite person.

MARQUARDT: And he said - Trump said, that Putin went through ...

KEILAR: With him.

MARQUARDT: ... the Russia hoax with him. It's making it sound like they were partners in this. Trump has always felt that Zelenskyy is too demanding, that he's overstepping and too antagonistic.

[15:15:06]

And certainly, J.D. Vance, who sparked all of this today, has never really thought highly of President Zelenskyy and has often advocated for ending or at least cutting back significantly U.S. aid to Ukraine. He said that last year when he was a sitting senator from Ohio. He said also to Steve Bannon, I don't really care what happens to Ukraine.

So, the deal that was supposed to be signed today, this minerals deal, would have gotten the U.S. deeper into a relationship with Ukraine, perhaps something that J.D. Vance did not want to see happen. And what strikes me is also the competing circles, if you will, around Trump. Mike Waltz, the National Security Adviser, and Marco Rubio, the Secretary of State, they are strong supporters of Ukraine. They see Vladimir Putin as the aggressor. But it's not clear that other members of that inner circle see it the same way.

And, of course, there are all these worries about as we go into these negotiations that President Trump has already given these concessions to Vladimir Putin and to the Kremlin. And we're certainly seeing or we can imagine that there are - there's quite a bit of smiling and schadenfreude going on in Moscow today.

KEILAR: Yes. Let's bring in Angela Stent, the senior fellow at the Brookings Institution.

And I mean, we should mention, yes, J.D. Vance does not particularly appreciate Ukraine. His passport proves it. He has not been to Ukraine. As to say, as an example, someone like Lindsey Graham, who we've been talking about, has been to Ukraine, he said, eight or nine times.

But can you just talk about just sort of the big picture of today and how much this matters? Is this the U.S. not just taking, perhaps, a step away from Ukraine, but a step away from Europe and the world order that has benefited the U.S. for many decades?

ANGELA STENT, SENIOR FELLOW, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: Of course. But we saw publicly the U.S. taking a step away from Europe at the Munich Security Conference. When you listen to what Vice President Vance said, the Europeans understand that the U.S. is leaving Europe, that President Trump has a very different vision of what U.S. interests are.

So, in a way, we shouldn't have been surprised by what happened today. But I think what was shocking was that this was done in public and sort of berating President Zelenskyy like this. Normally, these kind of discussions between leaders, you may argue and yell at each other, but it's done behind closed doors. So, I think the symbolism there was very important and I think the Europeans got the message, which is we're on our own now if you want to support Ukraine.

SANCHEZ: I do want to zoom in, Angela, on the way that Trump and Zelenskyy have aligned themselves with Putin's view of this conflict. Part of what sparked this shouting match was Trump saying to Zelenskyy that he has tremendous hatred for Putin and that it's hard to make a deal that way. And that led to the response from J.D. Vance seeming to promote the idea of diplomacy with someone who Zelenskyy referred to as a dictator. Can you speak to that differing view of Russia's leader as being the crux of this disagreement?

STENT: Well, sure. I mean, from President Zelenskyy's point of view, you know, Russia conducted an unprovoked invasion in - full scale invasion into Ukraine. Hundreds of thousands of people have been killed, wounded. What the Russians have done to the Ukrainian population, to their infrastructure, you know, abducting children, raping, torturing, all of that. So, it maybe would be very difficult for a leader of any country not to have a very dim view or to hate the leader of a country that did that to them.

Now, you could argue that maybe what President Zelenskyy should have done was to take a leaf from what Prime Minister Starmer and President Macron did this week, which was to be very polite in the Oval Office, to flatter President Trump and to therefore get a positive response for him. Maybe President Zelenskyy should have tempered his words.

But the idea that somehow he could have a more pragmatic view of dealing with Putin, it's very difficult. If you go to Ukraine and you see what it's like, the people who live there with the nightly air raid bombings and things like that, I think it's on a human level very understandable.

But obviously, President Trump has a different view of this and he wants to be a dealmaker.

KEILAR: Yes. Angela, thank you so much for your insights. We appreciate it. Alex, thank you to you as well.

[15:20:00]

Some lawmakers on Capitol Hill have spent the last few years fighting to keep aid flowing to Ukraine. But now there may be a sea change in America's relationship with Ukraine.

Next, we're talking to a member of the House Ukraine Caucus. We're going to get his reaction to today's extraordinary moments in the Oval Office.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:24:31]

KEILAR: Back to our breaking news. In this tense Oval Office meeting between President Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, a source in Ukraine saying after that meeting, French President Macron spoke to Zelenskyy on the phone and he is now currently speaking to the NATO secretary.

Joining us now is Illinois Democratic Congressman Mike Quigley, who is the co-chair of the Congressional Ukraine Caucus.

First off, just your reaction to what you witnessed.

[15:25:00]

REP. MIKE QUIGLEY (D-IL): Yes. Disappointing, sad, scary, I just - I think people should appreciate the fact that we are fundamentally a different nation than we were just weeks ago. We are alone in the world and we are less safe.

KEILAR: Do you think people understand that?

QUIGLEY: You know, I'm just not sure. In the weeks before the election, I talked to the diaspora of Eastern Europe of what the election might mean with what Trump has been saying openly during the campaign. And honestly, I think it fell on deaf ears that no one imagined that the President of the United States would betray all the things that we fought for, all the reasons we fought the Second World War, that we formed the New World Order, liberal democratic world war after that great conflict. You know, we're on the side of the bad guys now.

I just have to say, questioning the legitimacy of the President of Ukraine who was elected, who has been more like Churchill, and I would say Trump has been more like Putin, is extraordinary. And in his opening address to Congress, Zelenskyy thanked us, the American - and the American people, in my dozens of meetings with Rada, with their military and with Zelenskyy in Ukraine. They always open with their gratitude to the people of the United States.

KEILAR: Yes. He tweeted afterwards many different thank yous to the people, the Congress, President Trump.

I want to ask you about something that Lindsey Graham said. He is someone who is obviously, you know, a friend of President Trump's, but he's also been very pro-Ukraine. He's visited, he said, eight to nine times. He's gone to Ukraine several times. And he said, the question for me, for the Ukrainian people, I don't know if Zelenskyy can ever get you to where you want to go with the United States. Either he dramatically changes, or you need to get somebody new. What do you think of that?

QUIGLEY: Yes, the Ukrainians get to decide who their president is. And the only thing I can imagine that gets somebody who would get along with President Trump, it'd be someone who would be totally submissive to what President Trump wants. You know, we have to ask ourselves, what kind of victory do we want.

And if peace comes at the result of a Russian victory, where they keep the land, where there's no repatriation of the 20,000 or more children who were stolen, the cost of the war crimes that have taken place, we're talking about, in a sense, with the mineral deal, reparations in the reverse. The invaders are being rewarded. And while those who are invader are being told to pay the price, it makes no sense.

I would say to Lindsey Graham, Churchill wasn't getting a call from FDR on the 5th of June saying, we're going to send you a bill for all this. The right thing to do is also the smart thing to do. I just hope all of my Republican colleagues recognize that they need to put democracy in the world and our own safety as a result of it ahead of the party and clearly the President of the United States.

KEILAR: What did you think when Trump said, essentially, and he said this repeatedly, he said this in his Truth Social post, that you hold more cards, he said this essentially, you hold cards because we're involved. And he's raising this specter of, you know, without the U.S., Ukraine might then be forced to go for peace, sort of raising this idea that the U.S. may actually be enabling continued war and deaths by its involvement and support. What do you think he might be prepared to do?

QUIGLEY: Well, look, if he does nothing at all, if the President does nothing at all, Putin wins. They have a four to one manpower advantage. Zelenskyy's address to Congress, he said, help me win quickly because they understand they need a peace, but not a peace which is really a Russian victory. So, I mean, look, they - I get it, the United States needs to be there. I don't know if Ukraine can last six months to a year without U.S. help. I don't think that Europe can make up that difference. But he's got to understand, and the American people have to understand, Putin's aims are well beyond Ukraine.

The words of Gen. Milley and Secretary Austin, if we don't meet Putin's aggression now, we're going to have to double our own military budget and we're inviting more bloodshed. Every European military leader I met with during the trips there during this war said the same thing, we are at risk.

[15:30:06]

And ultimately, the United States is, too.