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Trump Expected to Sign Order Dismantling the Education Department; Furious Constituents Blast Lawmakers at Town Halls; Backlash against DOGE; Shooting at Hospital in Michigan; Rep. Sean Casten (D-IL) is Interviewed about Fiery Town Halls. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired March 20, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: You know, it's possible that the president could really pull back on tariffs and that this sense of slowing in the economy may turn out to be a short-term thing. But honestly, John, I don't think so because, again, I'm going to go back - I've said this before, but I'm going to go back to history. If you discount that short blip for Covid, we're six years overdue for a recession. So, it wouldn't be surprising to me, regardless of what else is going on, if we see a slowdown.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Rana Foroohar, thanks so much for being with us. Always great to see you.

FOROOHAR: Thank you.

BERMAN: A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: The beginning of the end for the Department of Education today. President Trump is set to sign an executive order to dismantle it. What that means for millions of students, teachers and parents.

And protesters and angry constituents are derailing lawmakers town halls across the country. One becoming so heated and combative, police got involved. We'll talk to the congressman who was at that particular town hall.

And new key evidence in the killing of four Idaho college students. The smiling selfie, a knife purchase, prosecutors plan to use against the suspect.

I'm Sara Sidner, with John Berman. Kate is out today. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

BERMAN: All right, expected to happen today, the president signing an executive order to begin dismantling the Department of Education. Secretary Linda McMahon says she's already taken the first step. Last week the department laid off some 1,300 people.

The White House says the order will, quote, "empower parents, states and communities to take control and improve outcomes for all students." But the nation's largest teachers union warns it will do the opposite and take a, quote, "wrecking ball" to the futures of 50 million students.

Let's get right to CNN's Alayna Treene at the White House for the expectations on this today.

You've got some new information.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: That's right. Well, we know that the president is going to be signing that executive order later today, effectively dismantling the Education Department, at least as far as this White House can do. Of course, a key reminder is that it would take an act of Congress. Congress would really need to sign off on any move to completely try to eradicate and remove, really, the Education Department from being under federal control.

But the White House believes that they have enough power to essentially cut funding and slash staffing enough that it would effectively render the Education Department useless on the federal level.

Now, a reminder that this is something the president long vowed to do. This is another move by this administration to try and make good on the president's long held campaign promises. But it's also something that Donald Trump tried to do during his first term as well. I'd remind you that he initially, during his first term, tried to merge the Education Department with the Labor Department. But again, that required Congress to sign off of it. And they did not do that.

Now, in my conversations with White House and Trump administration officials, they recognize they could face potentially some legal issues, but they believe that they will be able to move forward with this pretty smoothly.

And we also know that at that executive order signing this afternoon, the president really wants to make this a made for TV event. There is going to be Republican governors. There's going to be a state education official, as well as some schoolchildren who are expected to flank the president while signing this. Again, really trying to send a message to his supporters that he is making good on this.

Now, one thing to keep in mind as well, that wrestling executive turned education secretary, Linda McMahon, she is someone who has essentially said since starting in this term in her new role that she was put into this job to put herself out of a job. It's something we've heard the president say repeatedly, both publicly, but also behind closed doors.

Take a listen to how he's put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I told Linda, Linda, I hope you do a great job and put yourself out of a job. I want her to put herself out of a job.

I want the states to run schools. And I want Linda to put herself out of a job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: Now, John, I'd remind you as well that, you know, the impact. I think it's really important to keep in mind the impact and the context of what this executive order will do to schools and children across the country who rely on this type of funding. It's something we've heard many unions share and criticize in light of this news.

I want to read to you just one statement from Becky Pringle. She is the president of the National Education Association. She put it this way. She said, quote, "if successful, Trump's continued actions will hurt all students by sending class sizes soaring, cutting job training programs, making higher education more expensive and out of reach for middle class families, taking away special education services for students with disabilities and gutting student civil rights protections."

So, again, a lot of the critics of - of what the president is trying to do with this order, really trying to shine a light on how some of the most unfortunate students in the country are going to be the ones most affected by this.

[09:05:07]

BERMAN: Alayna Treene, at the White House, again, watching for this event to take place later today. Thank you so much for your reporting on this.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, this morning there is growing bipartisan trend in America. Angry constituents taking over town halls, letting their representative have it and listening to their frustrations over President Trump and Elon Musk's gutting of federal jobs and programs.

Wyoming Republican Congresswoman Harriet Hageman was the latest to hear the chorus of boos as she tried to defend the DOGE decisions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HARRIET HAGEMAN (R-WY): Here's the only thing that DOGE has done, which is, it's - it's so bizarre to me how obsessed you are with federal government. But - but here's the thing - calm down. Calm down. Calm down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: All right, Democrats are too facing their own kind of backlash at town halls, but for not doing enough to stop the actions of the administration and for the ongoing conflict between Israel and Hamas.

CNN's Arlette Saenz is with me now.

Let's start with Republicans. We just saw the booing that went on there. We have seen angry constituents coming out in mass to many of these.

How are the Republicans handling this growing backlash? Some of them are deciding not to do town halls. We know that part.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Sara, but right now neither party is immune to hearing from voters directly about their frustration, whether it relates to the Trump administration or for - in Democrats' cases, how they are handling the Trump administration's actions in these early months.

Now, as you noted, the head of the House Republican campaign committee had encouraged some lawmakers to hold virtual instead of in-person town halls. But there are some Republican lawmakers who have bucked that advice, and that includes Wyoming Republican Congresswoman Harriet Hageman. She held back to back town halls two nights in a row and really heard a lot of the voter frustration that is emerging at this moment about the way that the Trump administration has handled its cuts through DOGE and other means.

And here's another one of those moments where voters really expressed their dissatisfaction in this moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HARRIET HAGEMAN (R-WY): What - what DOGE is doing is it's the closest thing to - it is the closest thing to zero-based budgeting that we've seen. Why would you be opposed - why would you be opposed to us looking on a line by line basis when everyday people -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: From an immigrant from South Africa who wasn't elected!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: Now, Democrats have also been getting an earful from constituents this week. Many Democrats had hoped to host town halls and events focused on Medicaid, but they're also facing a lot of questions from constituents in this moment who want the Democratic Party to do more to try to stand up to Trump. So it really paints a picture of the scale of the frustration that's emanating across the country as many Americans are pouring into these town halls, which are really a staple of American politics, especially in the early years of a new administration.

SIDNER: All right, Arlette Saenz, thank you so much.

Ultimately, the Democrats have had to respond as well to really angry crowds for a lot of different reasons, although different reasons in some ways than what Republicans are facing.

What are they saying?

SAENZ: Well, there are a lot of Democrats who have come to some town halls asking their lawmakers why they aren't doing more to stand up to the Trump administration. It really highlights the debate that's playing out within the Democratic Party in this moment, especially after the fight that went on around government funding just last week. And so, we expect a lot more of these town halls to play out for Republicans and Democrats over the course of the day as more voters are expressing their frustration with their lawmakers.

SIDNER: All right, I know you'll be watching it. Arlette Saenz, thank you so much, there live for us from Washington.

John.

BERMAN: All right, with us now, Matt Mowers, former Trump administration official, and Maria Cardona, CNN political commentator and Democratic strategist.

I don't know if you guys could hear it, but in that Harriet Hageman town hall in Wyoming, you heard someone shout about Elon Musk, something about South Africa, right, which is where he was born. And there's more of that apparently coming from some Democrats, including from Minnesota Governor Tim Walz, who brought it up this way at a town hall the other day.

Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN): And there's nothing conservative about an unelected South African nepo baby firing people at the VA.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Why do you think we're hearing that combination there, Maria?

[09:10:03]

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it's because, John, the American people don't support what Elon Musk is doing. And in poll after poll, in focus group after focus group, Elon Musk has been a target of voters ire. Not just Democrats, but independents and Republicans as well because they see that the Trump administration has unleashed him to cause all of this chaos, to fire hundreds of thousands of Americans, to go in and steal our private data, to go in and make sure that his company gets all the government contracts worth billions of dollars while he's firing working class American families. And what we've seen is that the connection to connect Trump and Elon Musk and focus on what Elon Musk is doing as an unelected, unconfirmed and, frankly, unqualified person to do what supposedly he wants to do, which is get rid of waste, fraud and abuse, when, in fact, what he's doing is essentially demolishing civil society, I think is something that Democrats are going to be able to use to their advantage going into the 2026 midterm elections.

BERMAN: You know, Matt, some of the criticism in "The New York Times" in its writeup of Tim Walz noted, some of that criticism of Musk, it would be the South Africa nepo baby part of it, aligns a little bit with what Steve Bannon has said in his - some of his critique of Elon Musk. They don't see eye to eye on everything. MATT MOWERS, FORMER TRUMP ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL: No, but, I mean,

look, I've been on many shows with Maria where she hasn't been afraid to throw around the z word xenophobia, and that's exactly what we saw Tim Walz and others use. They're trying to use tropes right now to try to disenfranchise essentially an individual who's an American citizen, who's volunteering their time and is simply working at the request of the duly elected president of the United States to help enact his - his goal, which he was elected on. The mandate he was elected on, which is to actually turn upside down the system and to break down the federal bureaucracy and return more and more of it into the hands of the people.

In fact, he's actually empowering civil society by the fact that he's not going to have unelected bureaucrats making decisions for everyday Americans anymore. He's going to ensure that those decisions are made at the community, local and state level. And that's what you're seeing the administration do right now. And the fact that they're falling back on these really xenophobic tropes in order to try to diminish the accomplishments that they've had really tells you why the Democratic Party right now is sitting around a 23 percent approval rating. And so, if they want to stick around the - the bottom of the barrel approval rating right now, I encourage them to keep it up.

BERMAN: Maria, what about that -

CARDONA: You know -

BERMAN: Hang on one second.

CARDONA: Yes.

BERMAN: What about that specifically? You can respond to what Matt said. But also, what about the messenger here, Tim Walz, obviously the failed Democratic nominee for vice president, and where he delivered it, which is Des Moines. And I always submit that there is no politician who ever coincidentally ends up in Iowa.

CARDONA: Well, you know, who knows? I think we're going to have a very exciting primary season after what I think is going to be a very exciting midterm election. But I think it's really rich of Matt to bring up two things. Number one, xenophobia, when xenophobia is at the heart of everything that this Trump administration is doing, getting rid of, quote/unquote, DEI -

MOWERS: Or Tim Walz's speech right now, right.

CARDONA: Which means attacking every single community of color and every worker that - whose skin is not white. So, that's rich, number one.

And number two, it's rich that you're complaining about a government who is working for the people, who supposedly has unelected bureaucrats, when the unelected bureaucrat who is taking a demolishing hammer to civil society and to a government who is trying to do good for the people, and frankly we're seeing across the board Americans do not like it. So, what I say to you, Matt, is, by all means, bring it on. Continue

to have Elon -

BERMAN: Let me -

CARDONA: Lead this effort that is destroying the government.

BERMAN: Matt, quick last word.

MOWERS: Yes, you know, those are the same types of comments that led to Donald Trump receiving a historic number of African American votes. He actually won Hispanic male votes outright, an outright majority. So, you know, that type of rhetoric is what's driving voters into the arms of Donald Trump because he's showing accomplishments for the working class, not just rhetoric the way the Democratic Party has. I expect those results will continue and I hope they keep to the playbook and the strategy they've been using because it's been great success for the Republican Party.

BERMAN: Matt Mowers, Maria Cardona, thank you -

CARDONA: And all of those voters are showing buyer's remorse.

BERMAN: We appreciate you both being with us this morning. Thank you.

CARDONA: Thanks, John.

MOWERS: Thanks so much.

BERMAN: Sara.

SIDNER: All right, we are following breaking news out of Michigan. There has been a shooting at a hospital in suburban Detroit. Currently, the suspect is not in custody. We are watching to see how this unfolds. You can see a large number of police there. We will update you on this story ahead.

[09:15:01]

The Trump administration facing multiple legal losses in several court cases this week. We have new reporting on the strategy of the Trump administration, setting their sights now on the Supreme Court.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SIDNER: All right, we want to bring you some breaking news. Police are responding to a shooting right now at a hospital in Troy, Michigan. That's about 25 miles outside of Detroit. Just north of Detroit.

Right now the suspect is not in custody. We were just listening to authorities speaking on this.

[09:20:03]

They do have multiple agencies inside of that hospital. You are looking at a picture of the hospital where this incident took place. And there's plenty of police activity. They do not, at this moment, believe that the suspect is still inside the hospital. However, the suspect has not been found.

CNN's Polo Sandoval is joining us now.

You've been listening to this as well and sort of monitoring what is going on in and around that hospital. What can you tell us, Polo?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the key takeaway, Sara, which is, as you mentioned, that the suspect is not believed to be in the hospital anymore. That's according to police, Sara, in Troy, Michigan, which is just north of Detroit.

Police officials also offering this update, which is that they believe that this has to do with a targeted incident between two employees at that hospital. By no means is this any sort of mass casualty incident. That's because there's only one person that is currently undergoing treatment, a 25-year-old man that was shot twice in the parking area of that health care institution, in that parking garage. The victim in stable condition.

The concerning here - the concerning thing here, though, is that they are still trying to track down this suspect. Again, they do not believe that this person is at the hospital facility any longer here.

And this was a methodical search that was - that was carried out earlier today, shortly after the 7:00 a.m. hour, when there was actually an advisory that was sent out to people there in Oakland County, Michigan, advising them of an active shooter incident and recommending that any sort of patients that had any appointments there to simply stay away from the facility as they try to learn more.

But again, in just the last few minutes we've learned from Troy police there that this was specifically a targeted incident between two employees of the hospital. The shooter reportedly, according to investigators, fired five times at that 25-year-old victim, struck him at least two times in the arm before that suspect fled.

So really just an absolutely unsettling morning for not just patients, but also caregivers as well as they do believe that that threat is - is - at least there is no active threat for anybody at that health care facility. The Corewell Health Beaumont Hospital in Troy, Michigan, Sara.

SIDNER: All right, that is the good news, though the suspect still has not been found or captured. And as you mentioned, Polo, just to remind people, this incident happening about 25 miles north of Detroit in Troy, Michigan. You see that there's a huge police response. Police are inside of that building. They are going around just to make sure the suspect is not still inside, saying they don't believe the suspect is still there. But we are hearing that the person who was shot, potentially was another employee, and that person is expected to survive.

All right, Polo Sandoval, thank you so much for all of your reporting there. We'll keep an eye on it. New details in the Idaho student killings. Court documents revealing

phone calls and social media activity from the surviving roommates. What the timeline shows and why the defense is using it to raise questions about the suspect.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:27:35]

BERMAN: All right, overnight, a tense faceoff at a town hall in Illinois. Democratic Congressman Sean Casten was confronted by pro- Palestinian protesters angry over Israel's attacks on Gaza. Police ultimately asked the congressman to end the event early.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. SEAN CASTEN (D-IL): You have an issue, if you have a question, we can address that in the question period.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I have a question. You're bought and paid for by Israel. You are bought and paid for by APEC (ph), a foreign entity.

CASTEN: Sir, do you - you believe that? You believe that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A foreign entity.

CASTEN: You believe that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What have you done for this country?

CASTEN: It doesn't make it true.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What have you done?

CASTEN: Sir, we will have a question period. If you cannot behave respectfully -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is your nation's (INAUDIBLE).

CASTEN: If you cannot behave respectfully, then leave.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is (INAUDIBLE). It's a shame (ph).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: With us now is Democratic Congressman Sean Casten from Illinois.

Congressman, good morning to you.

What happened?

REP. SEAN CASTEN (D-IL): Good morning.

Well, the whole thing just makes me sad. We've - you know, I've - I've prided myself. We've done - I've been elected now for over six years in this job. I've done about a town hall a month on average. And since the Trump election, we've moved that to a town hall a week. So, this is actually a town hall that I've held since the election, driven by just huge concern that people have about the unlawfulness, the attacks on the Constitution. And that was what the room came to hear.

Unfortunately, there were a, you know, a small group of people who decided to get up and disrupt on an issue that, you know, that they disagreed on. And it's in their rights. I mean nobody - no politician wins 100 percent of the votes. But, ultimately, the police felt that the - there was a risk to public safety in continuing because there was so much disagreement, you know, with some of the protesters in the room. And I defer to the police when they (INAUDIBLE) people to stay safe. So, we - we had to end, which is unfortunate.

BERMAN: You have - you've been critical of some of your Republican colleagues who either have canceled town halls or not scheduled them or kept press out of them. They've - you've called some of them cowards. Do you intend to continue to hold town halls? What are your plans now?

CASTEN: The - we will absolutely continue to hold town halls. And - and I think there's a fundamental difference here that you've got, you know, many of my colleagues who were either not inviting anybody who disagrees with them into the room, which, as you can tell, is not something that we do, or choosing not to have them at all.

I think the challenge, in this particular case is, when you have people in the room who are at odds with other people in the room.

[09:30:03]

And that in - that in turn is creating a public safety issue. We need to be very sensitive about how we do that.