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Blue Origin Lifts Off with All-Female Crew; Michael Liersch is Interviewed about Tariff Whiplash; Meta Faces Antitrust Charges. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired April 14, 2025 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

LELAND MELVIN, FORMER NASA ASTRONAUT: So I think, you know, the worry that Gayle has, you know, anyone should have worry when they go to space or something, but I think it's probably a very safe flight. And it's only 11 minutes, so that should - that should help minimize some of the risk also.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: I should interject that Gayle King told me that she is a nervous flier just in general. And I was like, girl, what are you doing going into space? And she says, I'll be like jelly, but I want to do this.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: But it's only a few minutes, right?

SIDNER: It's only a few minutes.

BERMAN: I mean it's 62 miles. It's basically going to New Jersey and back but maybe safer than that.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: I mean -

BERMAN: Look, I'm just saying.

Leland, can you -

SIDNER: OH, my God.

BERMAN: Can you walk us through what they will feel and when during this, you know, 12 minute flight?

MELVIN: Right, John. So, as they're launching, they're going to feel three Gs. So, three times their weight on their body. And then after the rocket separates, the capsule separates from the rocket, they're going to start getting up to that 62 miles. And they'll feel that weightlessness. So, that's when they take their seat belts off. They'll start floating, flipping. I hope everyone takes their seatbelt off and gets to experience that weightlessness, and then see some of the curvature of the earth, which is so beautiful. And then they're going to have to get back in their seatbelts. And when they're coming down, they're going to feel five Gs. So, five times their weight. The parachutes will come out. They'll land safely. (INAUDIBLE).

SIDNER: There it goes. BOLDUAN: This is clearly the beginning of it. Let's watch this

together.

SIDNER: There it goes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Liftoff. New Shepard has cleared the tower.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Six thousand feet and climbing.

Begin throttle down for q limiting.

Engine response looks good.

Max q. Max on dynamic pressure.

Mock one, vehicle is supersonic.

Engine backup to full throttle.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: On supersonic. We have passed through max q. Maximum dynamic pressure.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Caber (ph) pressures look good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's when the vehicle, the stresses between the atmosphere and the speed are at their maximum.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Passing 47,000 feet and climbing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So, to punch through that is so important. You see the BE3 engines is flying (ph) beautifully through the - the stream of steam behind it.

SIDNER: Her head was so far back, with her hand on her heart, terrified, watching it all happen, but also excited. Wow.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Those ladies right now are having one incredible view on their way to space.

SIDNER: I think they're - they're in three g. I think they just said they're at maximum.

BERMAN: Ed Lavandera, if you're still with us and you can hear us under the roar of that, how much preparation did they have for this flight?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Not much. The crew showed up here in west Texas about three days ago, and they began the process of just kind of going through the safety briefings and understanding exactly what would happen inside the capsule and that sort of thing. So, this is - it kind of adds to the - when you hear Gayle King talk about how nervous she is, I think all that kind of lends itself to that feeling because it doesn't, like, you think that to go up into outer space you'd need a little bit more training than that, but that's the way it is. And it's been rather fascinating to watch this rocket launch here,

John, as we were watching it go straight up into the sky. As it got farther and farther away, you could still see, like, the glow from the rocket, and then instantly it just kind of disappeared into the blue sky. So, it almost gave you that sensation that it was passing in - into space there. So, that was kind of a surreal scene. And it is - it feels like it's directly overhead from us. And we're trying to figure out - looking to see if I can figure out where it might be now. It's almost impossible to see with our eyes here on the ground at this - at this moment.

BOLDUAN: And, Leland, one of the things that - that's discussed here is, it was a debate at the beginning when they just started launching this kind of space tourism is, you know, how far into space do they actually go? This just passes that Karman (ph) line, which I don't pretend to really know much about. And that's why I leaned to you in explaining what that - what that indicates.

MELVIN: So, 62 miles, or 100 kilometers, is where the Air Force designates space. It's where we're out of our atmosphere. And so that - if you get to that point, that's when you're considered an astronaut.

[09:35:06]

SIDNER: Well, you can hear the, oh, my Gods. And you saw Oprah there. It looked like she was crying or pretty emotional watching this. And you saw the Kardashians. I mean it is - it is a big promotional party.

But this is a moment where you're having an all-female crew going up into space. They will be there for, say, 12 minutes or so. And, you know, weightlessness is no joke. I'd like to experience that a little bit, but not the crushing three G. No thank you. I don't want to feel three times my weight. No thanks. I'm not good with that. But look at that. They're - they're almost there, looking back at the earth.

BERMAN: We saw a video of Katy Perry touring the capsule. We have been told the capsule has now separated from the rest of the aircraft. Obviously they're about halfway through.

SIDNER: Yes.

BERMAN: I mean, they're now up there, I imagine now is the period where they will be weightless.

Katy Perry said she intended to sing in space beforehand. One wonders what song she might choose.

SIDNER: I say "Firework."

BOLDUAN: I'm going to go with the, "It's Just Another First," because there actually have been a lot of firsts that Blue Origin - I think, Leland, you were even kind of noting this as - that Blue Origin has, well, people can say what they will and they should about the whole - what everyone watches happening. You - Blue Origin has offered a lot of firsts for people who maybe had gotten passed over in previous attempts to make it to space.

MELVIN: Yes, I mean, Wally Funk was - would have - would have been the co-astronaut -

SIDNER: I think - I think Katy Perry's singing, just to interrupt you. Katy Perry is singing. Hold on one second.

KATY PERRY, MUSICIAN (singing): (INAUDIBLE). I think (INAUDIBLE).

BERMAN: I have to say, I hope the other five passengers like Katy Perry music.

SIDNER: All right, Leland, you can go - you can go ahead. That was interrupted by whatever that beeping.

MELVIN: I don't - I don't recognize that song, though.

SIDNER: Do you know what that noise is?

BOLDUAN: It might be an original (INAUDIBLE).

SIDNER: A lullaby?

MELVON: Yes, I must say, I don't recognize that song.

Maybe it's a - maybe it's a beatbox (ph) there or something.

But, you know, Blue Origin has done a really good job of giving justice to people like Wally Funk, who would have been an Apollo astronaut. She did the training, and she was just as talented as the other astronauts, male astronauts. And then also Ed White, who got justice.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And a great piece of news. They are - all astronauts are back in their seats. You see the two -

SIDNER: OK, so they're coming back down. That was fast.

BOLDUAN: Exactly, By design, they're only up there -

SIDNER: They're coming back down. That was too fast for Sara Sidner. Sara Sidner wants to stay up there for a little bit.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The capsule to its landing spot just two miles north of where it has taken off from.

BOLDUAN: They're coming down with Blue Origin (INAUDIBLE), Sara.

SIDNER: It's - it's pretty cool to watch, though.

BOLDUAN: Uh-huh.

SIDNER: It's pretty cool. And it must be amazing being in it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At the top of the rocket, you see a couple of fins that have popped up. Those are to stabilize the rock as it comes in to land.

SIDNER: Here it goes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shortly thereafter you will see the drag breaks that deploy and will cut the speed of the - the rocket in half.

MELVIN: So, the rocket is coming back first. And then the capsule will come down.

SIDNER: OK. This is the rocket.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And then, in the last moment we've got -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And here it is. We can see it from the stage.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Here comes the rocket down. It's going to relight its engine. We can also see a sonic boom. We're going to hear that shortly here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And remember, this is something that had never been done before until just a few years ago. Truly the stuff of science fiction that you're about to watch in just seconds.

SIDNER: There is that sonic boom.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Drag race.

BERMAN: There we go.

BOLDUAN: Not for nothing. I think that's always the coolest part.

SIDNER: I agree.

BOLDUAN: (INAUDIBLE) land right back down on (INAUDIBLE).

SIDNER: Here on earth. That's the coolest part. Yes.

BERMAN: And that's the rocket, correct? We're going to see the capsule in a second.

BOLDUAN: They come down with the parachute.

BERMAN: Let's hope. And - so they -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) touchdown! Welcome home, New Shepard.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Picture perfect landing right here.

SIDNER: All right, so the cheers you're hearing there, perfect landing. They get to reuse that, I'm assuming, that's one of the big things here that you have - you're able to do this over and over and over again. And they have several times. This being one of those times. But this time you've got Gayle King, you've got Katy Perry, you've got, several very well-known folks, celebrities, et cetera, on this flight, as well as a really important astronaut. BERMAN: Leland, when you are coming down in a capsule, and I know

various types of landing over the last several decades for NASA astronauts, but what's that like? What does it feel like, that slower descent?

MELVIN: Well, John, they're coming back from space. You're getting like five Gs on your body. So, they're feeling five Gs now before these parachutes come out. And it's, you know, you're - you've been in space for a while and you're hard to lift your arms and things under that new Gs.

But I see all the parachutes are starting to come out now, and they're going to be landing safely very soon.

[09:40:03]

BOLDUAN: Ed, you're there in west Texas. What's it like from there?

LAVANDERA: Yes, it's - the parachute - we saw the parachutes deploy here just a few seconds ago. Clearly that's a huge sign of - and relief for all the family and friends watching all of this closely. But that - that rocket booster returning to the launch site was quite something. That thing was, like, just - it almost looked like it - from our vantage point, it looked like it was in freefall coming back for a moment, and then all of a sudden those reverse thrusters turned on and it slowed it down, and it just released a large boom that you - we could feel from the several miles away that we are.

But we're continuing to watch the capsule. And it is far more east than from the rocket, the launch pad. And from our vantage point, it is just now looking like it's touching the ground. And the parachutes starting to descend to the desert floor here. So, by all accounts, it looks like this has gone off safely. And assuming that everyone on board is doing well. But that capsule appears to be on the ground safe and sound with this star-studded crew on board.

SIDNER: Yes, we are watching it just slowly descending now, comfortably descending -

BOLDUAN: And a bit of a delay from Ed there.

SIDNER: A little bit of a delay, yes.

But we - just mentioned that journalist Gayle King is there, singer Katy Perry is there, Amanda Nguyen, who's a research scientist, and Carrie Ann Flynn, a NASA rocket scientist on that flight. And this is, I mean, it's cool. There it is.

BOLDUAN: Wow.

BERMAN: It is something. I have to say.

SIDNER: Yes.

BERMAN: It's an amazing picture.

SIDNER: It is.

BERMAN: Particularly when those parachutes go out. And I think everyone has that moment when they're happy to see them unfurl.

SIDNER: Yes.

BERMAN: And now even happier to see it touch down safely.

BOLDUAN: That's right.

SIDNER: Safe and sound. They will have a story to tell.

BOLDUAN: A star-studded audience for this star-studded crew in west Texas today.

So, we're going to keep - we're going to keep an eye on this. There will be video that - Blue Origin, of course, you know, will be putting out from inside the capsule during their moments of weightlessness.

SIDNER: Yes.

BOLDUAN: And maybe then we can learn what Katy Perry was actually singing. We will all find out together.

Leland, thank you so much.

Ed, enjoy the west Texas party. Thanks, buddy.

SIDNER: I like the orange and blue parachutes there. Just saying.

John, there is one thing we hope is not in freefall. Oh, there are the pictures.

BERMAN: OK, I was told there was - there we go. There it is. And the breaking news. The markets opened just moments ago. You can see, they're up clearly on the news of Katy Perry landing safely in west Texas.

BOLDUAN: John.

SIDNER: John. Good grief.

BERMAN: No, the markets are up ever so slightly this morning. Futures are pointing up all morning long. It seems that investors have been reacting to what the president and the White House did over the weekend, which was seem to pull back on certain tariffs on electronics, that's cell phones, semiconductors and the like, coming from China. They like that. Although yesterday the president and the White House spent all day saying, no, no, no, no, this isn't a pullback on those tariffs. They're going to come back on.

As of now, investors clearly in a little bit of a wait and see mode. But in the green this morning, pointing up, which is something I think that is welcome to a lot of the people who have been watching Wall Street lately, even as uncertainty remains very much over the entire situation, because, obviously, people just don't know what's coming next on tariffs.

All right, much more ahead. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:47:53]

SIDNER: New this morning, investors, businesses and consumers are all dealing with whiplash over President Trump's global trade war. On again, off again tariffs, temporary exemptions and recession fears have raised questions from consumers about what exactly they're supposed to be doing now.

Joining me now is Michael Liersch, head of advice and planning at Wells Fargo.

Welcome back. We always put you in the hot seat. Sorry about that. But we're nervous.

We want to give you a look at CNN's Fear and Greed Index that shows that Wall Street is acting on extreme fear. That is how people see what is happening when asked, how do you think Wall Street is reacting to this? And they are all the way to the left their, extreme fear.

So, the question is, what happens when it appears the markets are acting out of fear?

MICHAEL LIERSCH, HEAD OF ADVICE AND PLANNING, WELLS FARGO: Well, Sara, first of all, that maps with consumer confidence, which is at low levels as well. And so when we think about that type of fear, it's really important for us to put the fear in its right place, which is that - that fear is normal because we're humans after all.

SIDNER: Right.

LIERSCH: And when you think of that fear as being normal, it's important to take a pause and reframe. What's the opportunity on the other side of that fear. And the opportunity is to get your money organized, whether you're a business owner, whether you're an individual, get your money organized. What do you owe? What do you have? And is there anything you could do to stress test your situation? Could you lower your expenses? Are there other income or revenue sources that you could think about accessing? So, really changing that fear into opportunity and making sure you're paying attention to what's in your control.

SIDNER: So, when it comes to all this, you said, sort of, look at where you are. You know, my husband said to me, what if it goes to zero? And I was like, I don't think it went to zero during the Depression. I mean, that would be bad.

But when you look at your own finances, is this a time to buy or should you sell, even though that would lock in your losses?

LIERSCH: So, you have to look at two different things. So, let's go to the buy question. So, when you think about buying, it could be opportunistic from your

perspective. So, if you think the markets are to dip, or at our - an opportunity point for you based on what you think has the chance to grow or produce income for you.

[09:50:09]

It possibly could be that chance.

However, think of it differently. Instead of market timing, think of time in the market as your friend. And so, what is going to give you that time in the market? And usually going with a dollar cost averaging approach can be a much more sage approach because you can buy on the dips, and as markets are going up, you can buy it then as well. So, dollar cost averaging a certain amount of money every month, every quarter, invested in a way that's intentional can be useful.

In terms of selling, that could be opportunistic as well. So, look at your portfolio. What has run up in value, what has gone down in value, and look at something called cost basis. So, what did you buy that security at? And, it's tax time coming up, as everyone knows.

SIDNER: Yes, it is.

LIERSCH: So, is there an opportunity to harvest some of your losses and use that as an opportunity, from a tax standpoint, to benefit you.

SIDNER: You're talking about maybe writing some things off.

LIERSCH: Exactly.

SIDNER: Looking at that.

LIERSCH: Thats exactly right, Sara.

SIDNER: You know, this has always bothered me. So, the markets have all of these people, you yourself, analysts who look at the markets and they say, this is going to do well, this is happening, this is happening, and they're giving you sort of a guide as to what to do with your money. But it seems so emotionally driven. What is that?

LIERSCH: Well, so, it's emotional, but it's also information. So there's an absence of information right now in terms of where tariffs are going to go. And you saw it this weekend in terms of some of the relief in terms of electronics. And we are even still getting more clarity there.

So, it's really about an absence of information connected with that emotion. And then we coin that as uncertainty. So, during these uncertain times, it's really important to take a pause, again, look at your money, organize it, see what you're trying to accomplish. A lot of the best and worst days, as we saw last week, are closely put together.

SIDNER: Right. LIERSCH: So, if you follow that emotion, that gut, it can actually lead you astray. So, really look at your strategy. Is there something to do? Is there something not to do? And really take a measured approach, Sara, because that's going to benefit almost every investor or business owner out there.

SIDNER: It's basically what you can do to make yourself sleep at night is probably the best thing.

LIERSCH: Yes.

SIDNER: Like, just take a - take a minute.

LIERSCH: Take control. Take control of what's in your control. And don't focus on all the things out of your control and follow the herd, because the herd isn't necessarily what you have in mind for your financial life.

SIDNER: All right. Michael Liersch, always a pleasure. You're so calm. It makes me feel a little bit calmer about what the heck is going on, the uncertainty.

LIERSCH: Thank you, Sara.

SIDNER: But John does not.

John.

BERMAN: No, my gut always leads me astray.

All right, this morning, opening arguments set to begin in a trial - the trial of tech giant Meta. How the outcome could drastically change social media.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:57:19]

BOLDUAN: So, this morning, the federal government and Meta are heading to court, kicking off what is sure to be a huge antitrust case. Opening arguments are up first this morning. And what happens next could reshape the social media landscape as we know it. The U.S. government is accusing Mark Zuckerberg's company, Meta, of illegally building up a monopoly over years, through years of, quote, anticompetitive conduct.

CNN's Clare Duffy joins us now with much more on this.

This is setting up to be, well, a big day and a huge case. What do - what are you expecting?

CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS WRITER: It really could be one of the most consequential moments in Meta's history. We're expecting today to hear both sides sort of outline what their arguments are going to be in this case. The FTC, as you said, has accused Meta of illegally building up a social networking monopoly, in large part by buying up platforms that could have been competitors, like Instagram and WhatsApp. And the FTC is almost certainly going to be looking at things like the fact that 3.3 billion people use one of Meta's platforms.

Now, Meta says that it has plenty of competition from platforms like TikTok and X, iMessage, Snapchat. And the platform has also said, and I'm quoting here, "that regulators should be supporting American innovation in the face of competition from China." And if that sounds like an appeal to President Trump, that may not be a coincidence.

As you and I have talked so much about, CEO Mark Zuckerberg has been working to cozy up to Trump, and he has reportedly asked Trump to intervene in this case. So, certainly the company will be hoping that that he may do that because, if he doesn't, if the FTC wins this case, Meta could be forced to spin off Instagram and WhatsApp.

BOLDUAN: If President Trump wanted to intervene, what could he do within the bounds of what's in the bounds?

DUFFY: Yes, it's interesting because normally the FTC operates pretty independently.

BOLDUAN: Right.

DUFFY: It would be unlikely to see a president intervene in a case like this. But we know that the Trump administration is not necessarily typical. Trump recently fired two of the Democratic representatives on the FTC. They are suing to get their jobs back, but it's a bit unclear how that is going to turn out.

And Trump's pick to lead the FTC, Andrew Ferguson, recently said that the agency was raring to go in case - in this case against Meta. But he also said that it was important to obey lawful orders from the president. So, it's possible that Trump could try to signal to him that he would like the FTC to back off on this case.

BOLDUAN: Some of the things I've been seeing about this case, I mean, it's going to be dozens of witnesses that are going to be interviewed, reams of evidence and paperwork. I mean the scope of what all is going to be coming into this. I mean, one thing that Brian Stelter is saying is it could be set - maybe Shan Wu was saying, is setting up to be - really setting up for a settlement. I mean what are you hearing about kind of the machinations of what we're going to see play out in court?

DUFFY: Yes, I mean, this is a huge - this is the result of a six-year investigation.

[10:00:01]

We are expecting to see Mark Zuckerberg, as well as the former CEO - COO, Sheryl Sandberg, testify in this case. So, there is going to be a lot going into this. And, you know,