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Stocks Lower as Economy Shrinks for First Time Since 2022; Trump Blames Biden as GDP Shrinks for First Time Since 2022; Tonight: Senate to Vote on Resolution Blocking Trump's Tariff Powers; Sources: Trump Admin Weighs Sending Migrants to Libya, Rwanda; Trump: "I Could" Bring Back Mistakenly Deported Man, But Won't. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired April 30, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:00:20]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Blame game: President Trump settling on an excuse, blaming former President Biden, as a new report shows the U.S. economy shrinking for the first time in three years, while stock markets are in the red and economists are blaming the trade war. Trump says any problems the next three months may also be Biden's fault.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Plus, some senators have had enough and will vote on a resolution to block the President's power to increase tariffs. There's just one problem. It's kind of all for show, because Speaker Mike Johnson has made sure the move won't be considered for months.

And an alarming warning on A.I. and chatbots. A new report says they pose unacceptable risks to children and teens following a lawsuit over a 14-year-old boy's death by suicide.

We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

KEILAR: We are entering the final hour of trading on Wall Street. On the same day, a new report shows the economy shrank for the first quarter in three years. President Trump is trying to pin it all on President Biden. But most economists say that is not true. They're pinning it on President Trump's tariffs. Stocks are lower on the news. They have been in the red for the trading day. Let's go to Jeff Zeleny now at the White House.

Jeff, the President is about to host some CEOs about an hour from now. How's the administration handling the news?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, those CEOs are going to be here clearly trying to say that their part of the economy is going well. But Brianna, there are so many metrics that suggest otherwise. But the President, for one of the first times, really talked about the potential hardship that may come if this trade war with China continues. He sort of flippantly spoke of Americans having too many things, perhaps. But it was a rare acknowledgment that the actions he's having now may have consequences. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Maybe the children will have two dolls instead of 30 dolls, you know? And maybe the $2 will cost a couple of bucks more than they would normally. They have ships that are loaded up with stuff, much of which, not all of it, but much of which we don't need.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: So talking about those ships loaded up with stuff, obviously easier to talk about a privileged child having 30 dolls than actually talking about items that businesses may need, consumers may need. But again, it was a striking note in the cabinet meeting there where the President often does not like to talk about hardships or challenges or certainly asking for sacrifice, acknowledging there that the store shelves may be empty.

But you'll remember, Brianna, just a couple of weeks ago, he had that meeting with CEOs of big retailers, Wal-Mart and others, and they talked about the empty store shelves. That is one of the things we learned at the time that contributed to him putting a 90-day pause on the tariffs overall, but an interesting moment there.

But even as the President talking about his policies, still much talk in that cabinet room about President Biden trying to blame him. Brianna?

KEILAR: Yes, certainly.

Jeff Zeleny, thank you for the report from the White House. Boris?

SANCHEZ: Let's discuss the economy with Art Hogan. He's the chief marketing strategist at B. Riley Financial, a financial consulting firm.

Art, thanks so much for joining us. How much blame would you put on former President Biden for the way that the stock market has been doing since President Trump took office?

ART HOGAN, CHIEF MARKET STRATEGIST, B. RILEY FINANCIAL: Yes, I think there's three things to think about here. First and foremost, presidents really have very little to do with stock markets. It's really all about policies and how policies affect the economy and inflation. So to that point, I would say there's little or no credit or blame to give Joe Biden for what's happening this year in the stock market.

I would say, though, that there's a lot of fingers to point at the policies and how they're being rolled out for how the market's reacting right now, how consumers feel and how companies feel and certainly how investors feel about the path forward during the middle of this trade war we're in.

SANCHEZ: I wonder what you make of the claim that some of the shrinking that we've seen in the first quarter of this year is also related to the last administration. Aside from markets, President Biden ended his final quarter in office with upwards of 2 percent growth.

[15:05:02]

HOGAN: Yes, we had GDP growth on an annualized basis, just under 3 percent, 2.4 percent in the fourth quarter, north of 3 percent in the third and second quarter and 2.75 in the first quarter. So clearly the economy was at a good pace. We also saw inflation coming down to significantly lower levels than what we had seen in the first two years of the administration. And I would say that the employment situation clearly was quite full and there was a lot of demand for jobs. A lot of that's dissipated as we sort of head into the first hundred days of this new administration, as there's a lot of uncertainty.

So if you're running a company, it's very difficult to lay out long term plans until you know the rules of the game and where the goalposts are on tariffs and where that ends up. So I think that's what's causing the major slowdown here. It's the uncertainty that companies have to grapple with that tends to have them pull back on spending, certainly has them pull back on hiring and I think that's going to play out in Friday's non-farm payroll number as well.

SANCHEZ: Yes. And yet the White House is pointing to domestic investment, gross domestic investment at 22 percent as a positive sign. It seems like the counter argument would be that a lot of these companies were simply front loading, waiting for the impact of tariffs.

HOGAN: Right. So I think that when you look at things like the GDP report and you see the massive amount of imports that came in, that was companies and individuals getting in front of the potential price hikes that we're going to see with tariffs. So, you know, that had certainly played out there. We saw that in retail sales reports over the course of the last couple of months as well, where consumer confidence is at all time low, but consumers seem to be very active. And I think that's just a pull forward of demand that will likely not show up in the next couple of quarters, making purchases that you might have waited a couple of quarters and try to get in front of that potential tariff price hike.

Companies are doing the same thing and building up inventories, hoping that they can get some, enjoy some pre-tariff price inventories and not be stuck without things or have to pay much higher prices to run their businesses.

SANCHEZ: I don't want you to make any predictions, but I do wonder how next week's Fed rate decision might impact what we're seeing unfold with the economy right now.

HOGAN: Well, I would tell you this, the Fed still has time to make a decision on monetary policy and they need that time because much like the rest of us, they don't know what the end game is for tariffs, right? So if we start to cut deals and ameliorate some of those tariffs that have been announced on April 2nd, then the end game is much different. And that one time price increase will likely be much lower. So that inflation piece of their mandate might not be as arduous as it appears right now.

The other side of this is not knowing how long it takes to get to that end game is going to be a drag on economic activity. We saw that in the first quarter. We'll likely see it again in the second quarter. So they are they are at odds with the two mandates they have at the Federal Reserve. They want stable pricing and they want steady economic growth or full employment.

And those are at odds with each other. And they're at a place where they don't have an appropriate monetary policy tool to help that. So I think they take a wait and see approach. Next week's meeting, they may not do anything with monetary policy until some of this dust settles and they know what the end game is on the trade war and they can incorporate some of the concept of the other policy initiatives, like keeping corporate tax rates where they are and maybe having a letter regulatory touch.

SANCHEZ: Art Hogan, appreciate your point of view. Thanks for joining us.

HOGAN: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Brianna?

KEILAR: The Senate is set to vote tonight on a bipartisan resolution that would effectively block President Trump's global tariffs by revoking the emergency order the President is using to enact them. The move is being led by Kentucky Senator Rand Paul. CNN Chief Congressional Correspondent Manu Raju is on the Hill with more on this.

Manu, what are Republicans saying about the economic numbers and would tonight's vote in the Senate really hamstring the President?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, it will not because of what Mike Johnson, the Speaker of the House, did. He included language in a House rule to essentially deny any legislative efforts from going forward that would target Donald Trump's policies through September 30th. And that means what's going to happen tonight will essentially be a symbolic rebuke, but a bipartisan rebuke. Nonetheless, we do expect 51 senators to vote in the affirmative to essentially call for these global tariffs to be halted.

Now, this all comes as there is concern within the ranks about what they are seeing in these economic numbers, including senators who are facing reelection.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): And clearly, if we have this kind of froth this time next year, then it's a real challenge for Republicans. But I believe if we pass the TCJA in a substantially similar form and then we settle down the tariffs and get some of the deals, then we get the economy back on track. But you can't look at this today and recognize it for anything other than being unacceptable.

[15:10:05]

SEN. MIKE ROUNDS (R-SD): I think a lot of people would wish that everything was already set up, ready to go, and everybody knew what the tariff rates would be, and then they could start making business plans. It takes a while to get it done. Most people, I think, are prepared to say, look, there were some really unfair things going on. And if it takes a little bit of time to actually shake things out, I think they're ready to wait for it a little bit. They knew there would be an impact on the economy to begin with. There'd be a few tough months.

SEN. JAMES LANKFORD (R-OK): Every single president is always evaluated on how they handle the economy. This one will be as well. And I think he's taken the risk early on to be able to fix the long-term structural issues.

RAJU: What do you think about what we're seeing out of the economy this morning, contraction of the economy in the first quarter?

SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): Not good.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: What you're hearing from a lot of Republicans is an urging of patience to voters, saying that Donald Trump's policies need some time to kick in, and hopeful, they are hopeful that things will turn around before the midterm elections, but as you heard, there's concern that if it doesn't, it could be a major blowback for the party next November, guys.

KEILAR: Yes, not good. A quote that says so much.

Manu Raju, thank you.

Still to come, new CNN reporting on the Trump administration's plans to send migrants with criminal records to two African nations.

Plus, an update on the case of the Maryland man mistakenly deported to El Salvador. Is the U.S. asking for him back, but being refused by the Salvadoran president? We'll have the latest on possible talks between the two governments.

And then later, desperation in Gaza as hundreds of thousands of parents are struggling to feed their children after a months-long blockade by Israel. We'll have that and much more coming up on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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[15:16:11]

SANCHEZ: This just in. Sources tell CNN that the Trump administration has been discussing the possibility of sending migrants to two African countries, Libya and Rwanda. We're told they're looking at sending migrants with criminal records and in the case of Libya, the administration wants to send asylum seekers apprehended at the U.S.- Mexico border, meaning a migrant from Central or South America who's claiming asylum could be sent to one of the most volatile parts of northern Africa. CNN National Security Correspondent Kylie Atwood has the details for us.

So Kylie, how does this compare with the relationship that the U.S. has with El Salvador?

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: So the details that are being discussed right now are incredibly different than the agreement that the U.S. has struck with El Salvador and here's why, Boris. These migrants who have criminal records here in the United States who are in discussions to potentially go over to both Libya and Rwanda, they wouldn't actually go into prisons there.

In the case of Rwanda, I'm told that this would be more of an ad hoc basis. They actually already had one Iraqi national here in the United States who they sent to Rwanda just last month and they're looking to effectively expand on that agreement. They're looking at the cost structure here. I'm told that it would actually be more costly per person for sending migrants to Rwanda because Rwandans would be integrating them into society, giving them things like stipends, trying to help them get jobs.

In the case of Libya, there's also hopes within the Trump administration of seeking this safe third country agreement. Now, what that means is that the asylum seekers who are coming to the U.S. border wouldn't be coming into the U.S. Instead, they could potentially be sent to Libya. That's a really interesting conversation that's happening at the working level as we understand it right now.

So these are very different proposals than what we're seeing with the migrants going to El Salvador but it builds on the Trump administration's commitment to send migrants out of the U.S. and deter further migrants from coming to the U.S. border.

SANCHEZ: Just to be clear, they would essentially await the adjudication of their asylum claims in Libya.

ATWOOD: That's right.

SANCHEZ: A country that has a history of human rights violations.

ATWOOD: Yes, Libya has a history of many human rights abuses. It has been wrecked by civil war in recent years. And we should also note that Libya is a place where migrants from Africa often move through to try and get to Europe and they have come under incredibly distressing situations over the last few years.

There are reports by the United Nations of rape, of unexpected deaths occurring and so this is a place that is questionable for sending migrants who are trying to seek asylum here in the U.S.

SANCHEZ: Kylie Atwood, thank you so much for that reporting. Brianna? KEILAR: In the case of Kilmar Abrego Garcia, the Maryland man mistakenly deported to El Salvador by the Trump administration, CNN has learned that Secretary of State Marco Rubio has been in direct touch with El Salvador President Bukele. And in an interview with ABC, President Trump was pressed about why he hasn't brought Abrego Garcia back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: This is not an innocent, wonderful gentleman from Maryland ...

TERRY MORAN, ABC HOST: I'm not saying he's a good guy. It's about the rule of law. The order from the Supreme Court stands, sir ...

TRUMP: He came into our country illegally.

MORAN: You could get him back. There's a phone on this desk.

TRUMP: I could.

MORAN: You could pick it up, and with all ...

TRUMP: I could.

MORAN: ... the power of the presidency, you could call up the president of El Salvador and say, "Send him back," right now.

TRUMP: And if he were the gentleman that you say he is, I would do that.

MORAN: But the court has ordered you ...

TRUMP: But he's not.

MORAN: ... to facilitate that - his release ...

TRUMP: I'm not the one making this decision. We have lawyers that don't want ...

MORAN: You're the president.

TRUMP: ... to do this, Terry ...

MORAN: Yes, but the -- but the buck stops in this office ...

TRUMP: I - no, no, no, no. I follow the law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Alexandra Ribe is joining us now. She is an attorney for Kilmar Abrego Garcia and a partner at the Murray Osorio immigration law firm.

[15:20:03]

Alexandra, thank you so much for joining us again. You hear what President Trump says there. Does that change your client's case in court?

ALEXANDRA RIBE, ATTORNEY FOR KILMAR ABREGO GARCIA: Look, the issue is from - in the beginning, when our client, Mr. Abrego Garcia, was deported, the government was very clear in sworn affidavits in the press room that this was an administrative error and that he should not have been deported. And in fact, you cannot look at this set of facts and think any differently.

This man had a final humanitarian order prohibiting his removal specifically to El Salvador. You cannot look at these facts differently. And now that the Supreme Court has specifically told them - told the administration, they must facilitate actively aid in his release from detention - from his release from custody in El Salvador and facilitate him coming back to the United States.

Now this administration is saying that this wasn't an administrative error and, in fact, that he's a terrorist or a human trafficker or a gang member, all these other things that they're saying, which you cannot have that. You cannot look at these set of facts and believe that to be true.

And now, also, you have the President saying that he, in fact, could easily bring him home if he wanted to. If he was a good guy, then he certainly could pick up the phone and call the - Bukele and ask for his return. But because of all these reasons that he's not a good man, he's not willing to do so.

And it's really (INAUDIBLE) it's really a question of accountability and whether the administration is accountable to the Supreme Court order and to the rule of law.

KEILAR: So sources had told CNN that this seven-day pause the district court judge had put in place on these daily reports from the Trump administration about its efforts to facilitate Mr. Abrego Garcia's return that it would - they were put on hold because a diplomatic resolution had become a possibility. Is that true? And now that that is up, did those efforts fail?

RIBE: I mean, look, we were very hopeful that the administration was working in good faith at the time, a week ago, when they asked for seven-day pause and discovery. At this point now, our patience is wearing thin on that. And we're very glad that our understanding is that the district judge who is hearing this case seems to also have her patience wearing thin because, in fact, today, earlier today, she denied the government's motion for another week-long pause of the discovery. So the discovery is continuing.

And from our side, we are going to do everything we can to figure out what exactly - who in the government is trying to facilitate his return, what they're doing, and what is blocking that - him from being able to be returned. Because, I mean, even before Mr. Abrego Garcia was transferred to El Salvador, you had Kristi Noem, you had Marco Rubio, you had Bukele, you had all these people saying that there's this contract facility that the U.S. is working with El Salvador and, essentially, we're renting prison space from them in El Salvador.

And so now, if we're told - I mean, we have whole Supreme Court doctrine on the premise that if somebody is deported, the U.S. government is able to facilitate their return back in certain circumstances (INAUDIBLE) ...

KEILAR: Alexandra, let me ask you, because Secretary has said, you know, our reporting is that he's been in touch with Bukele, but he won't say he was. He said he wouldn't tell even a judge if he was. Do you know if the Trump administration has asked for your client back to get him back?

RIBE: So, I can't speak specifically to discovery right now because it is under seal. What I can say is that the district court judge, in her order today, said that all of our requests for discovery have to be answered by Monday and that there's an expedited discovery process here.

KEILAR: That's - and that's - I understand that, Alexandra, that you're limited by that. I do want to ask you, since I have you, and we do have a limited amount of time, so I apologize for interrupting you. Trump talked about your client's tattoos on his hands. He insists your client has the letters and numbers MS-13 tattooed on his knuckles, not just tattoos that could be interpreted that way. Your reaction to that?

RIBE: I mean, my reaction (INAUDIBLE) - if you look - I mean, to be totally transparent here, they do look a bit photoshopped to me.

[15:25:06]

But regardless, this is a distraction. And at the end of the day, whether he's an MS-13 gang member or not, let's bring him back, let's reopen his removal case and let's figure it out. And for the interview that Donald Trump had, that President Trump had, where he talks about whether immigrants should have due process, I mean, look, if we think that immigrants shouldn't have due process, I mean, one of the issues is that they do have due process under our laws. But then secondarily, I mean, you also have President Trump talking about maybe opening up this contract facility and sending U.S. citizens over there, so it doesn't stop at immigrants and it's a scary notion.

KEILAR: Mr. Abrego Garcia's wife, Jennifer, told The Washington Post she had to move to a safe house after U.S. officials posted a court document on social media that included the family's address. Do you know what happened there? Is she still in a safe house? What's happening here?

RIBE: She is at an undisclosed location, and the government did publicly reveal her home address. And I think that this is part of what happens when you're, you know, trying to look through someone's record to justify what has already been admitted as an administrative error, and then this is - these are the ramifications.

Then, you have a woman and her child - and her children, and her address is publicly available to anybody. Obviously, this case has taken hold of the whole country, and she at - she is with her family at an undisclosed location, and I'm sure very frightened.

KEILAR: All right. Alexandra Ribe, thank you so much for being with us. We do appreciate it.

RIBE: Thank you very much for having me.

KEILAR: Coming up, 20 Democratic attorneys general urging law firms to stand up to President Trump's executive orders that target some of the country's most powerful law firms. Connecticut's attorney general will join us live.

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