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Toy Company Execs Warn Tariffs to Bring Higher Prices, Shortages; Secretary Kennedy Falsely Claims MMR Vaccine Contains Aborted Fetus Debris; Trump Will Nominate Mike Waltz as Ambassador to United Nations. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired May 01, 2025 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: The White House says it is expecting to announce news on trade deals by the end of today. This comes as President Trump repeatedly downplays the effects his tariffs could have on the cost of goods, and he's getting some flack specifically for this comment. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Maybe the children will have two dolls instead of 30 dolls, you know? And maybe the two dolls will cost a couple of bucks more than they would normally, but we're not talking about something that we have to go out of our way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: The White House was asked for some clarity on that remark during today's media briefing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN MILLER, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY CHIEF OF STAFF: He was making a point that I think every American consumer agrees with if they had a choice between -- and I'm not a parent of young children -- if you have a choice between a doll from China that might have say lead paint in it, that is not as well constructed as a doll made in America, that has a higher environmental and regulatory standard, and that is made to a higher degree of quality. And those two products are both on Amazon that, yes, you probably would be willing to pay more for a better made American product.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

Joining us now is Jay Forman. He's the CEO of Basic Fun, a toy maker based in Florida. His company sources the majority of its products from China. We're talking everything from Tonka to Care Bears to Light Bright. Jay, thank you so much for being with us.

What do you make of those remarks from the President, and then the follow-up from Stephen Miller?

JAY FOREMAN, CEO OF BASIC FUN: Well, listen, I understand, you know, the President's concept of people can sacrifice, but we're also all in business together. Imagine if he said to Apple, well, instead of selling 30 iPhones, you only sold 2. It's the same thing as asking somebody, you know, only sell 2 dolls instead of 30. I mean, it's a flow of business. Everybody suffers.

The retailer suffers. The trucking company suffers. The shipping company. So it's not just the reduction of some guy that makes some dolls in China. It's everybody along the way that suffers. I think Mr. Miller's comments are really out of line.

I mean clearly, he's never made anything, you know, a product necessarily, so he doesn't know what we really go through to do it.

The fact is, in an industry like toys, there's almost no manufacturing base in this country, so we really couldn't make those dolls here anyway. And the quality that we get and the standards that we have in China are top quality. Never have a problem and try to tell a little girl that she can't have her doll for Christmas. I think there's bigger issues that he needs to tackle than this.

SANCHEZ: That was going to be my next question because something like 80 percent, you estimate 80 percent of toys sold in the United States are actually manufactured in China. So given these tariffs, how likely is it that some inventory is going to be impacted? It seems like kids are going to have, to the president's point, fewer toys available.

FOREMAN: Well, inventory will be impacted a lot. I mean, there's a de facto embargo right now.

[14:35:00]

Nothing is shipping from points outside the United States for the toy industry. Almost nothing at this point, so there'll be a shortage.

At the end of the day, parents will find things for their kids, even if they have to make them, you know, handcraft them. The issue really is, will there be a Christmas for a lot of families because parents are going to be losing jobs.

Mom and dad might lose their job at a toy company or some other import company. A person who spent the last five years building a business, I call it the shark tank generation of people that have created products and companies in their homes and their garage, their companies may be going out of business.

So while a child may get two instead of 20, the parents might be spending their kids' college education money to try to keep paying the rent and keep their business up and running.

And this is the real problem. And we need some relief. We understand where the President is coming from. We're trying to do our part. We're advocating zero for zero, zero tariffs on exported toys from the U.S. and zero tariffs inward. We're looking to bring manufacturing back to the United States.

We're trying to work with the administration, but the fact is, it takes time and we need some relief now. Otherwise, a lot of small businesses will go under and a lot of people will be laid off in the coming weeks and months.

SANCHEZ: Do you expect that you're going to have to cut jobs?

FOREMAN: I can tell you that if you ask me what it feels like today, April of 2025, it feels like April of 2020 during the early stages of COVID. In April of 2020, companies like ours and many, many others started to furlough employees. If you have no sales, if you have no income, you have to cut expenses. And that's just naturally going to happen.

So there's this big trickle down. It's almost like if somebody told you, hey, we've got to make the town better, we've got to put a freeway through. We've got to widen Main Street. We're going to bulldoze all these businesses on Main Street. That's great if you give us a couple of years to rebuild our businesses on Maple, but if you just come in and you just bulldoze Main Street, we've got nothing.

We've got no business and it's hard to keep our livelihoods going. Many Main Street businesses got crushed during COVID and are having trouble, you know, coming back. This is just going to exasperate that problem as this tariff issue lingers.

SANCHEZ: Jay Foreman, we appreciate you bringing us your story. Thanks for joining us.

FOREMAN: Thanks for having me.

SANCHEZ: Just a few weeks after encouraging people to get vaccinated against measles and amid a deadly outbreak, the nation's top health official is now sharing a debunked conspiracy about the MMR vaccine. We'll discuss next.

[14:40:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: As the measles outbreak in the U.S. continues to grow, Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is sharing a false and debunked claim about the MMR vaccine. While speaking on a panel about President Trump's first 100 days, Secretary Kennedy said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR., HHS SECRETARY: Now there are populations in our country like the Mennonites in Texas who are most afflicted and they have religious objections to the vaccination because the MMR vaccine contains a lot of aborted fetus debris and DNA particles. So they don't want to take it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Now we should note that vaccines do not contain parts of fetuses or fetal cells and there is not a Mennonite doctrine against vaccines. According to a CNN tally, at least 950 cases have been reported in the first four months of this year, triple the number reported in all of last year and public health experts say the actual number of infections is likely significantly higher.

Let's talk about this now with Dr. Paul Offit, the co-creator of the Rotavirus vaccine. He's a member of the FDA Vaccine Advisory Committee whose meeting on next year's flu vaccine was canceled earlier this year and the director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia.

Dr. Offit, it is great to have you because I want you to fact check what Secretary Kennedy said there because there's a reason why he is talking about aborted fetal cells and yet we should be clear that these vaccines, the one in particular he's talking about, is not made with -- it doesn't contain these cells. Explain to us how this factors in these fetal cells.

DR. PAUL OFFIT, MEMBER, FDA VACCINE ADVISORY COMMITTEE: So there were two cell lines which had the names WI38 and MRC5 which were continuous cell lines that were derived from human embryonic fibroblasts. So those cells were initially used to make vaccines like the rubella vaccine, which is the R component of MMR, the hepatitis A vaccine, chicken pox vaccine, one of the rabies vaccines.

So because that's true, this has gone before the Catholic Church because this was an issue for many Catholics and Joseph Ratzinger who at the time was the head of the Pontifical Academy for Life ruled on this and said it's perfectly fine for Catholics who obviously oppose abortion to use these vaccines.

But to say that it contains cells is wrong. To say that it contains large quantities of DNA is wrong. It is possible that it could contain picogram levels meaning trillions of a gram of small fragments of DNA but again this is something that's been true now for decades so I'm not sure why this is coming up now.

[14:45:00]

KEILAR: So explain this because there are going to be, some people look at that and they say that doesn't matter to me, right? We know that. A lot of people don't have an issue with this, they're going to get the vaccine, they're going to think nothing of this.

Some people in this case where you have vaccines that are made from cells like this, they are going to have an issue about this. So talk a little bit more about the reasoning, especially considering the Catholic Church has weighed in for folks like that, who have that concern. When they go to their doctor and they're addressing this concern, what does that kind of conversation go like?

OFFIT: I think again, a choice not to get a vaccine is not a risk-free choice. If you choose not to get, for example, a measles, mumps, rubella MMR vaccine, then you put yourself at risk for measles and mumps, which are still obviously circulating in the U.S., rubella's not, but could come back. So it's not a risk-free choice. It is the only vaccine you have available. And the notion that picogram amounts, which is trillions of a gram of these sort of, you know, small fragments of DNA that were contained in those original continuous cell lines that were derived back in the 1950s and 60s. It's not like the notion that there's contained sort of like abortive parts, or that there's something that's from the original abortion that was there, it's just wrong.

And you know, viruses only grow in cells. So when you make vaccines, you have to pick some cell type. So whether it's these cells, or whether it's a monkey kidney cells, or other cell lines, there's always going to be cell lines that are used.

And they're going to contain infinitesimally small fragments of DNA. And assuming you live on this planet and you eat anything made from vegetables or animals, you're ingesting foreign DNA all the time.

KEILAR: So when he's talking about this, and as we explain the very nuanced background, you see in a way how he's taken something and created a false claim. And I see how people do that kind of thing, doctor, but is it surprising to you that you have the Secretary of Health and Human Services who is doing that and not being exact and clear about his language when he's talking about vaccines? And what's the effect of that?

OFFIT: Well, I think we're in the midst of a massive measles epidemic. Clearly the CDC is underestimating this. If you look on their website this morning, it says there's about 900 cases of measles.

But if you talk to people on the ground, they think it's at least 3,000, probably 5,000 cases. We've already had three deaths from measles, two unhealthy young children. That equals the total number of measles deaths in the last 25 years. It's the first time we've had a child die from measles in more than 20 years.

What should he be doing? He should be standing up every other day using the platform of being Secretary of Health and Human Services and saying, get a measles vaccine. This virus can cause you to be hospitalized and die. But he doesn't, he does the opposite of that. He does everything he can to cast doubt on this vaccine.

He goes on Fox News and says, measles vaccine kills people every year. Measles vaccine causes blindness and deafness. Measles vaccine causes the same symptoms of measles, all of which are wrong.

And now he raises up this question that's been asked decades ago about these nanogram or picogram levels of residual DNA from the original cells that were used that has already been addressed by people who had concerns about this, like the Catholics and Catholic Church. And just to basically muddy the waters and continue to scare people away from a vaccine that could save their lives.

KEILAR: Dr. Paul Offit, thank you so much. We do appreciate your insights here and we'll be right back.

[14:50:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We are following breaking news to CNN. President Trump says he's nominating Mike Waltz to serve as U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, shifting him from his role as national security advisor. Meantime, Secretary of State Marco Rubio will now also serve as his national security advisor.

CNN's Kylie Atwood is at the State Department for us. And you were there, Kylie, for the State Department briefing. It seemed like those that were briefing were surprised by this news.

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It was a remarkable moment in the State Department briefing room today, Boris. What happened was the spokesperson, Tammy Bruce, came out to the podium, had some small talk with reporters, as she often does. And then she was asked about the possibility of the Secretary of State having the dual hat, becoming the national security advisor at the same time.

And she initially said that she didn't want to get ahead of anything that Rubio might decide. What he might say, what he might do. And while she was making those remarks, that's when President Trump posted on True Social that he had made that decision that Rubio would now be serving in an interim situation at both of these roles.

Just listen to how that unfolded as I asked her and read to her the True Social posts from the President.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAMMY BRUCE, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: A lot of activity down here in the first row.

ATWOOD: Can we just read something that's just come out from the President?

BRUCE: Yes, all right, great, terrific, terrific.

ATWOOD: The President has just written on True Social that Mike Waltz is going to become the new U.S. ambassador to the United Nations.

BRUCE: Well, there you go, fabulous.

ATWOOD: And in addition to that, he says that in the interim, Secretary of State Marco Rubio will serve as national security advisor while continuing his strong leadership at the State Department.

Do you know how long he's going to be serving in both roles?

BRUCE: It is clear that I just heard this from you. This is -- the magic --

ATWOOD: You had no heads up that this is coming true?

BRUCE: I have some insights as to the potential of certain things that might happen. But when the President, and this, of course, is all presidential decisions, right? So I'm with State Department.

[14:55:00]

I, it is, as I think would be clear to all of you, you don't want to get ahead of your skis in drawing conclusions or speculating about what may occur.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ATWOOD (on camera): Now, as you can see there, she clearly didn't know that this announcement was coming at this moment in time. What this moment demonstrates, Boris, is just how the Trump administration operates. The President makes decisions often with his close aides at the White House and even folks in other buildings who might be directly impacted by those decisions aren't necessarily in the know about what they might be and when they might come.

That was very clearly the moment here. Tammy went on to say that Rubio has a very good relationship with the President, that he is at the White House many times a week, that he has spent a lot of time with the President. She said that this is exciting news.

And she also noted, of course, that the Secretary has already worn dual hats throughout the course of the administration, serving as the acting administrator of USAID. So this is not necessarily a new thing for him, but this will certainly be a elevated role for the current Secretary of State Rubio.

SANCHEZ: Kylie Atwood at the State Department for us. Thank you so much.

The Department of Transportation says that it has a plan to not only retain but attract new air traffic controllers. We'll discuss ahead.

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