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There Appears to be No Survivors in Air India Crash; More Than 200 People Feared Dead in India Plan Crash; Trump Administration Planned to Use Military for Immigration; Rep. Brad Sherman (D-CA) is Interviewed about the L.A. Protests. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired June 12, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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DR. ELIZABETH COMEN, ONCOLOGIST, NYU LANGONE: So, we want to use what works.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: Right.

COMEN: That's -- that's the divide there. And so, things like diet can be really important, exercise, mind-body techniques. But we also know that they don't unilaterally cure cancer. And what terrifies me, as an oncologist, is the rampant misinformation that is so enticing.

I would love to be out of a job. I would love to be discussing sports medicine or Botox with you on air. But instead, you know, I'm out there every day treating breast cancer patients. And far too often I see patients falling prey to misinformation that's online.

SIDNER: Dr. Elizabeth Comen, thank you to you for -- for putting the most important information out there at this time, and to Stephanie Elam, I love you. To Ananda Lewis' family, bless you.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, the breaking news this morning, the deadly plane crash in western India just after takeoff from the city of Ahmedabad, 242 passengers and crew on board. There is video of the crash itself. It was a flight bound for London. You can see it there. And you will hear from our analysts very shortly about what they see in the flight path. The way the plane was handling. You see it ending there in an explosion.

We have learned it crashed into what they're calling a doctor's hostel, basically a housing center at a medical school where it is feared the students were having lunch at the time. A police commissioner tells the "Associated Press," it appears no one among the 242 people on board the flight survived. Obviously, there is now concern about losses among those on the ground as well.

Let's get right to India. We're getting a tremendous amount of help from Zakka Jacob in New Delhi. He is the managing editor for CNN News 18.

Zakka, let's start with you. What are you hearing this morning?

ZAKKA JACOB, CNN NEWS 18 MANAGING EDITOR: So, what you said a moment ago, that authorities in Gujarat and in Ahmedabad are saying that they don't expect anyone on board this ill-fated Air India Flight 171 from Ahmedabad to London Gatwick, they don't expect any of them to survive. There were 242 people on board, 230 of them passengers, 12 crew members.

One of the passengers, incidentally, happens to be a former chief minister of the state of Gujarat, which is where this plane crashed. It took off a little after half past one this afternoon, at 1:38. And within five minutes of takeoff, the captain lost communication with air traffic control. And within 20 minutes, before 2:00 in the afternoon, the plane crashed just on the outskirts of Ahmedabad City.

It crashed onto a building, which was a hostel facility where undergraduate medical students at that time had gathered for lunch. So, there are a large number of people who were there in that building at that time. It was the lunch hour, just before 2:00 in the afternoon.

We're also given to understand that aside of the people who were on board this flight, none of whom are expected to survive, there's also a grave fear that a large number of people who were in the building on which this plane crashed may have also perished. The word that we're getting from the civil hospital authorities is that over 200 bodies have been sent to postmortem currently. This is one of the major hospitals in the vicinity that is dealing with the dead.

And also we're given to understand that from the people who were there in this building and on the ground, in the vicinity around this building where this plane crashed, there are about 30 who have been rushed to hospital in various conditions of grievous injuries, some of them very grievous injuries, some of them not so much.

So, the concern really is not just about the people who were on board that flight, 240 plus of them, but also the people on the ground, many of whom could have been -- could have perished because of the magnitude of the impact of -- of this crash.

SIDNER: All right, thank you so much. We will hopefully get to keep you around because your reporting has been really extraordinary this morning.

Let's get to CNN's Salma Abdelaziz, who is in London.

Obviously, this flight was headed to Gatwick. And there are some, you know, U.K. nationals on the flight as well.

What are you hearing there in London?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. More than 50 British nationals were on board. U.K.'s foreign minister, David Lammy, saying that he was deeply saddened to hear of this tragedy and that he was going to work open communication channels with the Indian government to provide those answers and that support to those families. We also understand that there's a help center, essentially a help

desk, that's been set up at Gatwick Airport. That's where this flight was supposed to land at about 6:30 local time today.

And I have to emphasize the relationship here between India and the U.K., because there's a massive diaspora community from India that resides across England.

[09:05:01]

There is strong and deep cultural ties between these two countries. So, this tragedy will absolutely be felt here in London and across England.

We've now heard, of course, from the local police commissioner, who says that there are no survivors. And beyond that, of course, the possibility that there are more lives that have been lost on the ground because of the way that this plane crashed low to the ground, low altitude, within moments of taking off, bits of it embedded in a building where medical students were having lunch. So, these images will absolutely resonate.

I also want to emphasize that it wasn't just British nationals and Indian nationals on board. You also have Canadian -- a Canadian national, rather, and several Portuguese nationals as well that were on board. So, an absolutely global tragedy, one that the Indian prime minister, Narendra Modi, has responded to, sending one of his top -- one of his second in command to the scene, promising that help and support to the families. But it is that news, no survivors, that is sure to sink hearts today from London all the way to Ahmedabad.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Absolutely. Salma, thank you for your continued reporting on this as well, while we bring in more details on this breaking news.

Joining us right now, once again, is CNN's safety analyst, David Soucie, and CNN transportation analyst, Mary Schiavo.

David, with the word from the police commissioner on the ground that they believe that there are no survivors. We heard from Zakka Jacob, the managing editor of the news there, saying that they've also heard that 30 people that were on the ground were rushed to hospitals in various states of grave injury. Knowing that this is -- they are actively still looking for people, if not bodies, at the site, and an investigation needs to -- needs to begin in earnest to -- as to what happened, what -- what needs to happen first?

DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: Well, first needs to make sure that there's no people that are still -- still alive within the debris. That's the number one priority is to make sure that there's any kind of rescue efforts that need to be done. Secondly, the bodies will be removed from the site. And then at the third point, that's when they'll start the investigation with the professionals there, which will include anyone from the engine manufacturer, the aircraft manufacturer, both nationalities from -- and people usually from each of the nationalities that were represented in the victims on the flight as well. So, it's quite a large effort. But at this point, they're just trying to make sure that if there are any survivors, that they are removed from the site.

BERMAN: Mary, we do have this video of vantage point of the plane itself. Hopefully we can show it to you, where you can see the plane going down. There it is. I'm just going to let it play for a second. We know it's disturbing, but it is important to see. And then it ends in just a huge fireball.

So, Mary, as we see that video, you know, before the crash, there's no smoke coming from the plane. I can't see any damage on the aircraft itself. What do you see there? What jumps out to you?

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST: What jumps out to me is, first of all, for a takeoff sequence, it's not -- the plane isn't configured properly. We have something called an angle of attack. And for takeoff, your nose is pointed several degrees above the horizon at the sky. And until the final second before the crash, this plane almost seems to be having -- you know, the nose at a level or just only a slightly up position. Then just before the crash, the nose does move up before. But the plane, on takeoff, should be pointed to the sky, and it should be climbing. And -- and in this case, it's not. It is sinking, and the nose is not angled up.

Now, we did have some other reports on an earlier commentator who mentioned a -- a dual engine failure. It's too early to know that unless the pilot said that in the mayday call. We don't know what was in the mayday call. But in a mayday call, the rules, if you will, for a mayday call is that you believe you are in imminent danger of losing the plane. So, the pilot knew that something was very seriously wrong with the plane.

And also in that video we can see that the landing gear is down. And it looks to me, now it's hard for me to make -- get real clarity, but it looks to me like the flaps, the part of the wing that helps with lift, are up. And usually it's the other way around. Usually you stow the landing gear, put the landing gear up at take off, and then stow the flaps. So, there's -- there's much to learn what's going on here. But that video does give some important clues.

BOLDUAN: And, David, the fact that there was this mayday call made, the fact that this signal, as it was reported from the plane, was lost just 625 feet above ground, is -- is there a place where this leads investigators to -- to -- to investigate first?

[09:10:05]

SOUCIE: Well, the first place to start is when the aircraft started rolling. So, the question is, the decision point, which is V1. At V1 they're deciding they're too far down the runway to abort the takeoff, or they're going to abort the takeoff. That's what V1 is. And on this aircraft, that's about 165 knots. So, that's the decision point.

At that point you continue about another ten knots to 175, and then at that point is VR, where you can rotate and bring the aircraft off the ground. So, whatever happened, in my mind, it happened after V1. They achieved the 165 knots. They started to roll. And then they decided at that point it's too late to stop, hit the brakes and make this stop. So, we're going to go ahead and -- and get off the ground.

And as Mary said, you don't see the nose coming up, which indicates to me that they didn't get enough speed at VR. They didn't actually get enough speed to get off the ground and maintain a climb. So, that's where I would look first, is to see where the decision was made and what caused that aircraft to not have enough power to get through the rotation.

SIDNER: Mary, I did want to quickly ask you about the black box, being that this had just happened, just taken off less than a minute. The plane, obviously, exploding. Lots of fuel on board. Hitting buildings as well. I mean, what shape is the black box in at this point when you -- when you look at what happened there?

SCHIAVO: Well, I'll tell you what shaped the black box is supposed to be in, and that is it is supposed to survive. It is in -- it is built, it is intended, the way it is -- is housed and protected, it is supposed to survive, you know, terrible infernos.

Now, I worked on the 9/11, September 11, 2001, plane crashes. And, for example, the black boxes in the World Trade Center did not survive, nor did the Pentagon. The flames were just too hot. But those were much older black boxes. This is the newest of the new. There will be thousands of data points on there. And it is supposed to survive. And I -- you know, if I had to predict, I think they will find it and that it -- it -- it will survive because that's what it's intended to do.

BOLDUAN: Mary, thank you so much. David, thank you as well.

We're going to continue much more on this breaking news and our breaking news coverage.

Ahead, we're going to bring you the latest from London, where the Air India -- where the Air India flight was headed.

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[09:17:00]

BOLDUAN: The breaking news continues. We're talking about this tragedy out of India.

An Air India flight with 242 people on board crashed just moments after taking off from the airport in Ahmadabad, India, this morning.

A police commissioner on the ground there says it appears that no one on board survived the crash. We have also learned that the plane crashed into a residential area, hitting a medical school, including a lunch building of the school where medical students were believed to be having lunch at the time, which, as you can see from the fireball after the crash and the aftermath of the scene, there is a great fear of additional injuries and possibly deaths of people on the ground, but no word or confirmation of that yet. A very active situation right now.

This flight was headed for London's Gatwick Airport. And that is where CNN's Nada Bashir is for us this morning.

Nada, what are you learning?

NADA BASHIR, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right, among the 242 passengers and crew members on board that flight that was, as you mentioned, heading here to London's Gatwick Airport, due to land at around 6:25 p.m. local time today, at least 53 of those on board are confirmed to have been British nationals. So, as you can imagine, this is a moment of huge anguish for family members and relatives waiting for more information from the authorities, both in India and also here in the United Kingdom, and for updates on what is, of course, an ongoing investigation into this appearing to be a fatal crash.

Now, we have been hearing from officials here at Gatwick Airport, they have said that they have not only set up an emergency helpline for relatives, but are also setting up a reception center here at the airport where they will be providing updates for family members, as well as support to many of those who will be, of course, bereaved today upon learning of this fatal crash.

But, of course, we have also been hearing reaction from the British government as well. The prime minister here, Keir Starmer, describing the scene around the crash as devastating. He has said that he has been receiving updates and will continue to receive updates from officials involved in this investigation.

Of course, we've been hearing from the foreign secretary as well, David Lammy, who spoke in the House of Commons just a short while ago, expressing, of course, his condolences, but also saying that he is working urgently with officials to provide that urgent support for relatives and family members, that they have stood up crisis teams, both here in London, and also in Delhi as well to provide support for those relatives.

We've just, in the last hour or so, we have received a statement from the royal family, from King Charles. Of course, India holds a very special place for the royal family. There are very close historical and cultural links between the two nations. And in a statement, the king said, "my wife and I have been desperately shocked by the terrible events in Ahmedabad this morning. Our special prayers and deepest possible sympathy are with the families and friends of all those affected by this appallingly tragic incident across so many nations."

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And, of course, important to remember that there were in those -- among those passengers and crew members on board, not only British nationals, but, of course, more than 160 Indian nationals, one Canadian national and seven Portuguese nationals.

And, of course, we are still waiting for further updates with regards to the details around this fatal crash.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

Nada, thank you very much. We'll be getting back to you as so many updates are going to be coming. Thank you very much.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, President Trump made it seem there was an urgent need to send troops to the ground in Los Angeles for the protests. What our reporters found out from sources about a month's long plan to try to use the military to bolster the administration's immigration agenda.

That story, and more, ahead.

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[09:25:15]

SIDNER: Breaking overnight, protests from coast to coast now. The demonstrations against the Trump administration's immigration raids and the president's deployment of troops on U.S. soil now cropping up in dozens of cities.

In Seattle, at least eight people arrested after police say protesters threw fireworks and rocks and set a dumpster on fire. On the East Coast, in New York, about 200 protesters gathering in lower Manhattan. Police there were seen detaining multiple people. In Los Angeles, the city where these protests really kicked off nearly a week ago, a curfew downtown just expiring a short time ago. Beyond the curfew zone, we're seeing protests erupting outside some hotels, including the one that you're going to see here in L.A. County, believed to have been sparked by unconfirmed social media reports that I.C.E. agents were staying there.

Later today, a high-stakes hearing is scheduled over California's lawsuit challenging the president's authority to send the National Guard into Los Angeles. And we have new CNN reporting this morning indicating that for months the Trump administration had been looking for ways to use the military for immigration enforcement.

CNN's Priscilla Alvarez broke this story with her colleague, joining us now.

Tell us what you have learned from your sources.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Sara, one of the developments this week, when the Trump administration deployed National Guard in Los Angeles, was also images of some of those troops surrounding I.C.E. operations. In other words, sort of standing guard, serving as security perimeter, as immigration enforcement authorities detained individuals. And that was a major development because up until this point no one

that I spoke with could recall ever seeing an instance like that in the interior of the United States. But sources tell me and my colleague Natasha Bertrand that there has been a strong desire within the administration and in discussions among administration officials to use the National Guard for immigration enforcement to bolster their forces across the United States as they try to arrest an historic number of undocumented immigrants.

Now, what is clear here from discussions with officials is that the National Guard is not arresting immigrants so much as serving as sort of this force multiplier and this perimeter.

Now, I spoke to White House Border Czar Tom Homan about this, who called this a needed expansion. He went on to tell me, quote, "we're trying to use all available resources. That's why we're bringing in all these other different agencies, including ATF, FBI, U.S. Marshals." He went on to say, "we got a hell of a job ahead of us."

The other thing that Tom Homan stressed to me is that they are seeing assaults against immigration enforcement agents, which is part of the reason that they feel that they need to have a perimeter around those agents as they are continuing to conduct operations. It's also worth noting that National Guard has been on the U.S.-Mexico border before, not arresting migrants, but sort of serving at a distance in a supporting capacity.

But it is clear, Sara, that there is more in motion here. The Department of Homeland Security recently also sent a request to the Pentagon for 20,000 guard troops to help with detention, support, transportation support and night operations and rural interdiction. So, you can see here how they are trying to, again, expand, as Tom Homan said, their operations across the country as they are trying to get over the logistical hurdles that have previously sort of served as an impediment to administrations when they are trying to arrest undocumented immigrants in the United States.

Now, lastly, Sara, I will also note that one of the other considerations underway is using military bases for immigrant detention. Administrations have done that before. But clearly there is a desire here to really ramp up their immigration operations, not only in arrests, but also with detention.

SIDNER: Wow. That is great reporting by you and Natasha Bertrand.

Priscilla Alvarez, thank you so much.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Joining us right now is the Democratic congressman from California, Congressman Brad Sherman.

Congressman, thank you for coming in.

I want to ask you about the way the president has been consistently describing the situation in L.A., in dire terms, of course, but also in the comparisons that he's making. I want to read you what he posted yesterday about this. "If our troops didn't go into Los Angeles, it would be burning to the ground right now, just like so much of their housing burned to the ground." I think he's talking about the wildfires that -- that are your constituents, and many others, are still recovering from. The way he's describing and the comparisons here, what's your reaction to that?

REP. BRAD SHERMAN (D-CA): The president hates California, and he needs to distract Americans from not only how ugly his big bill is, but this unprecedented level of corruption that we haven't seen since the privatization of the -- of the Soviet Union.

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