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Trump Weighing Use Of U.S. "Bunker Buster" Bomb On Iran; Wyoming Deputy Thanked 14 Years After Rescue; Fed Holds Interest Rates Steady For Fourth Time In A Row. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired June 19, 2025 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[07:30:23]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: An exclusive look inside Iran at some of the damage Israel has caused. CNN has a team on the ground, the first Western journalists inside Iran since the conflict began between Israel and Iran.

This morning our Fred Pleitgen obtained access inside the state-run news agency in Tehran which experienced a strike in the middle of a live broadcast on Monday. At least two people were killed.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're inside the Iranian state broadcasting company IRIB, which was hit by an Israeli airstrike a couple of days ago. And you can see the damage is absolutely massive. I'm standing in the atrium right now but if you look around, this whole area has been completely destroyed. All of the offices, all of the technology that they have inside here -- the broadcast technology -- everything has been rendered pretty much useless.

All right, so we're going to go inside the building now. They have told us that we need to be very careful because obviously there might still be unexploded parts of bombs in here or something like that.

What we see here is the actual studio where an Iranian state TV anchor was sitting and reading the news when the strike hit. You can see here that is an anchor desk right there. And, of course, when it happened the anchor was reading the news and then all of a sudden there was a thud. The studio went black. At the beginning she got up and left but then later apparently came back and finished the newscast and is now being hailed as a champion of Iranian media.

Some of the main bulk of the explosion must have been here because this place is absolutely charred. And if we look back over there that actually seems to be the main part of what was the newsroom with a lot of the desks, computers, printers, phones.

You can see how much heat must have been emitted by the impact and by the explosion. The phones that they had here are molten. Here also the keys molten -- this screen. And there's actually someone's lunch still at their desk standing here, which probably they would have been wanting to eat until they had to evacuate the building. You can see there's a spoon here that's also been melted away by this explosion.

All of this is playing very big here in Iran. There's a lot of public anger that the Israelis attacked this site. And certainly the Iranians are saying that they condemn this and that there is going to be revenge for this.

Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Tehran.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: What an incredible perspective from Fred Pleitgen and his team there.

All right. This morning as President Trump weighs potential strikes on Iran, military experts say the U.S. has the only weapon that could destroy the country's key nuclear facility -- a 30,000-pound bomb known as a "bunker buster" capable of hitting sites deep underground.

CNN's Brian Todd has been digging into this weapon, and he joins us now. Brian, what have you learned about the capabilities here?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, John, the sheer size and weight of this munition is what makes it so very intimidating. The official name of it is the GBU-57 massive ordnance penetrator, also known, as John mentioned, as the "bunker buster." It is the largest non-nuclear bomb in the U.S. military's arsenal. The Israelis do not have any of these -- any of these bombs nor the means to deliver them. Only the U.S. does.

There is interestingly no public record of this bomb ever being used in combat. Why? Well, one expert -- one expert, excuse me, told us that the U.S. has never encountered a target that would require a bomb this size.

There is -- this bomb weighs about 30,000 pounds. It has 6,000 pounds of high explosives. It is about 20 feet long. The only plane that can carry the bunker buster, the B-2 Spirit stealth bomber capable of flying about 6,000 nautical miles without refueling.

Experts say the bunker buster can penetrate about 200 feet underground. You see in that animation there -- maybe more, according to one expert. It is designed to hit deeply-buried and fortified targets.

Now, as for targets that could be in question here. If the U.S. gets involved in this conflict and they use the bunker buster -- well, one likely target is the Fordow nuclear enrichment site which is just south of Tehran. It is buried deep inside a mountain, possibly beneath about 300 feet of rock where the enrichment capabilities are in the halls and tunnels possibly -- under about 300 feet of rock.

Now, experts say given those dimensions and the capabilities of the bunker buster it is not clear if the bunker buster could actually reach that depth of 300 feet underground. One expert told us they might have to drop more bunker busters -- more than one bunker buster onto that site. They would hit it once and then drop another bomb into the crater to maybe get down deeper and hit the actual enrichment capabilities, John.

[07:35:05]

So that's what you're looking at if the U.S. gets involved in this conflict. If they go after the Fordow enrichment site that is deep underground this is the one munition that could possibly penetrate it, but it's not clear if it can reach those depths.

BERMAN: Yeah. It really depends on just how deep the facilities are.

What about possible radiation leaks, Brian?

TODD: It's always a question, John, when you're talking about a bomb this size and, of course, hitting nuclear enrichment sites.

According to three experts a radiation leak would probably be limited to just the immediate area and that a strike would likely not cause the same kind of catastrophic consequences that bombing a nuclear reactor would cause.

So that is what you're looking at as far as possible radiation leaks if this munition were to be used at a place like Fordow.

BERMAN: All right, Brian Todd. Thank you for digging into this and telling us what some of the considerations likely are this morning. Appreciate your work -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right. Thank you, John.

Joining us now is CNN global affairs analyst and former White House coordinator for the Middle East and North Africa, Brett McGurk. Thank you again for being here this morning.

I'm just curious from what you're hearing about the movements that the military is making. Are you seeing everything being put in place for the U.S. strike Iran if the president decides that's what he wants to do?

BRETT MCGURK, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COORDINATOR FOR THE MIDDLE EAST AND NORTH AFRICA: Good morning, Sara.

It certainly looks that way. As of tonight we'll be a week into this crisis. The operation started with the Israeli military campaign. And it does appear now that the president has at least given the order to be prepared and to have all the pieces in place. There is aircraft carrier strike groups moving into the Middle East. Those will take a period of days.

So I would say one thing here. I think the U.S. military, the White House, they kind of own the clock here. There's nothing requiring an immediate strike and so you want to try to use that time wisely. That, of course, means all the military preparations in place. That means giving a last chance for diplomacy. There is a meeting in

Geneva tomorrow with the Iranian foreign minister and our European allies. I don't have high expectations for that meeting. But there is an off-ramp here if the Iranians say we're actually going to remove and get rid of our enrichment capability, particularly in that Fordow site.

So there is some time, but it does appear that all the preparations are getting in place should the president make that decision.

SIDNER: With your extensive knowledge of the region -- I mean, does it make sense for the United States to enter this war?

MCGURK: I have to say, Sara, when this started about a week ago the first thing I think we discussed was Fordow. Fordow, Fordow, Fordow, Fordow. Fordow is the deeply-buried, underground enrichment facility. It was done in secret in the 2000s. It was revealed through intelligence information. It was actually President Obama in 2009 that announced this to the world.

The Obama-era JCPOA focused on Fordow and had a clause that there could be no enrichment in this facility for 15 years through 2030. Since the Americans pulled out of that deal the Iranians now are enriching in Fordow. They have 10 cascades of their most advanced centrifuges.

The IAEA just last week mentioned that this was a serious problem. The only country in the world without a weapons program enriching to the level of 60 percent just below weapons grade in Fordow. Last year, actually, when I was in the White House, the Iranians in Fordow actually enriched up to 83 percent just below weapons grade. They claim that was a mistake.

This is a serious problem. And the issue with Fordow we've always known across administrations it is really the U.S. military with that munition that was just discussed can destroy it. We can do it. The plans are viable. They've been refined and honed over the years.

Now, the Israelis have an option. They can go with a ground force. They actually, Sara, about last year in September they did an operation in Syria. They called it "Operation Many Ways." That was a signal to Iran that we have many ways to destroy underground facilities. It was at a missile facility in Syria about 300 feet underground -- very similar. The Israelis announced that to the world and put it on YouTube. That was a sign to Iran.

But this is very different. The distances are obviously much --

SIDNER: Right.

MCGURK: -- farther. It would be very difficult to do that without U.S. military support. So if want to destroy Fordow -- and at the end of this I think Fordow has to be taken care of either diplomatically or through a military strike -- it really is the U.S. military option.

SIDNER: I just have one last question. Iran says that it will retaliate against the United States if it enters this war. What capabilities do they have? What kind of damage would that mean to the U.S.?

MCGURK: I've dealt with the Iranians for many years. I've negotiated with them. I've been in proxy conflicts with them. I know how they think.

They have proxy militia networks. They can try to target American personnel. They have missiles and they have other capabilities.

[07:40:00]

They are also significantly, significantly weakened because of the disastrous decisions Iran has made since October 7 at Hamas' attack into Israel. Iran chose after that attack to basically join in the campaign against Israel. And it has lost its main proxy group in Hezbollah, just north of Israel. Its missile capabilities are diminished although they can still get some off. It has no air defense.

And look, if we're going to do this -- owning the clock -- you send a message to Iran you have one more chance for diplomacy. Should it come to a military strike we do not intend -- the United States does not intend to escalate this campaign. It's focused just on narrow objectives -- your military capabilities and missiles. But if Iran responds -- if Iran responds, our message to Iran would be our response would then be quite devastating, and Iran would have no way to really defend against that.

Look, this is serious, serious business. The president has a meeting today in the Situation Room, this morning. That's where he should be. And again, we have some time here to get everything in place, and one more shot for diplomacy. But I think the coming days here will be quite decisive.

SIDNER: Yeah. You're saying there is a chance for diplomacy but there is every indication that the U.S. is preparing in case it decides to strike.

Brett McGurk, it is always a pleasure. Thank you so much for your expertise this morning -- John.

MCGURK: Thank you.

BERMAN: All right, with us now former Trump administration official Matt Mowers. Also, former Biden White House director of message planning, Meghan Hays.

As President Trump makes this consideration about whether to use the military to strike Iran we keep hearing some division. Look, there is disagreement on both sides of the aisle about whether this is a good idea or not.

But Matt, it is distinctive here that there is division within the Republican Party and particularly among the president's base. We've heard from members of Congress -- Marjorie Taylor Greene, Tim Burchett, and others -- that they oppose military action.

What's interesting is we are also hearing it from the blogosphere. From the podcasting world that was do decisive in President Trump's electoral victory. It's just interesting to hear where it's popping up, including with Theo Von, this comedian-podcaster the president appeared with last year. J.D. Vance, the vice president, appeared with this year. You know, he took pictures with Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner.

Listen to what Theo Von just said in his podcast. Politico -- the Playbook pointed this out this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THEO VON, COMEDIAN, PODCASTER, "THIS PAST WEEKEND WITH THEO VON": I don't trust the Israel leader at all. I don't believe anything that guy says. And I don't think that our soldiers should have to go and defend stuff that they start.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: It just is interesting to hear this discussion happening among people who have been so key to President Trump's political success, Matt.

MATT MOWERS, FORMER TRUMP ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL, PRESIDENT, VALCOUR GLOBAL PUBLIC STRATEGY: Yeah. I mean, I think the key thing you look at with Theo Von said, he said he doesn't want our soldiers to have to go in. And I think that's ultimately going to be the line that President Trump draws. I mean, he's been very clear since he really announced his campaign and launched his political career almost a decade ago that he opposed putting U.S. troops on the ground to fight other people's battles.

But what he did show in the first Trump administration -- the first term where I served as senior White House adviser in the State Department and saw some of these issues pretty closely -- is that he's willing to take decisive action with American air and naval capabilities as well as working with allies and partners to try to achieve our objectives still -- our security objections -- which obviously preventing Iran from having a nuclear weapon would fall under that category.

I think ultimately what's going to happen here is a couple of things. The president is going to look to see whether there's an opportunity to achieve that objective without have the collateral damage of drawing the U.S. further into a new conflict -- something which he has obviously always been quite allergic to doing and rightfully so, especially given the U.S. experience in the mid-2000s.

And so I think the political base will ultimately trust his instincts. We're a constitution republic for a reason. In a lot of ways we're a constitutional Republican Party. Voters in the MAGA base are willing to trust him with these decisions even though they may not agree inherently with some of those decisions. You see from the Steve Bannons and others that they're willing to trust that Donald Trump has the insights, the intelligence, and the information necessary to make the decisions that they can't, and they're going to follow along if he makes the decision ultimately to take further action.

BERMAN: And Steve Bannon has said that he opposes action but if the president does do it, he does think the base will come around eventually.

You know, Megan, Matt used an interesting there, which is "constitution," which does say that to take military action -- you know, Congress has to vote on it typically. The Constitution does weigh in on this.

Do you think this is something that Democrats will have any success pushing for here?

[07:45:00]

MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION CONSULTANT: I mean, I think that it's unclear what our interests are here and what the president is going to do.

I think when he said he doesn't want to be dragged into another war during the campaign we're still at war -- we still are -- have a conflict in Ukraine. We still have a conflict in Israel and Gaza. We now are going to be into a third conflict here that the president can't seem to get a handle on.

And we don't have a National Security Council or any intelligence that he seems to be listening to, so it's hard to know where Democrats are going to fall because who knows what the intelligence really is here.

So I do think that Congress is going to be very forward, both Democrats and Republicans, in wanting to vote on this and wanting to have final say. And I do think that Democrats and Republicans need to be very careful here. This is going to be an issue that's going to lead into the '28 election and people who are running for president are going to have to answer for their vote and their thoughts here in what happens.

So it's very -- the president is in a very peculiar place here of how we got to this situation.

BERMAN: Look, it's a very serious decision all the way around.

I do want to ask one purely political question, Meghan. There are articles both in Politico and The New York Times today about just flat-out disarray within the Democratic National Committee and unhappiness with DNC chair Ken Martin.

You know, Rahm Emanuel, who has done a lot of different things -- ambassador, mayor of Chicago, White House chief of staff -- he says, "We're in the most serious existential crisis with Donald Trump, both at home and abroad, and with the biggest political opportunity in a decade. And the DNC has spent six months on a firing squad in the circle and can't even fire a shot out. And Trump's world is a target- rich environment."

That quote was from Politico but there are also all kinds of things in The New York Times as well, Meghan.

What do you think the problem here is?

HAYS: I mean, Rahm is not wrong. I think that we lack leadership both on the -- in the Congress and at the DNC to an extent. I think that we are -- we were given a broken party to move forward, and we need to do that. And we need to look inside and make sure that we are cleaning up our own house before we go forward. But the problem is everyone -- there's no aligned vision on how to move forward and I think the DNC is trying to figure that out now.

The bigger problem here is that donors are responding to this --

BERMAN: Yeah.

HAYS: -- and reacting, and we have -- we need the -- we need donors to win in '26. So they don't -- the DNC and the Democratic Party does not have much longer to get it together. They need to do this very, very quickly before the end of the summer to be able to move forward.

BERMAN: All right, Meghan Hays, Matt Mowers. Thanks to both of you on this very busy morning.

Also this morning ripped plywood, broken glass. New reports of a break-in at the home of the slain Minnesota lawmaker.

Plus, SpaceX-plosion. New video shows the moment a SpaceX Starship rocket exploded into a gigantic fireball. We're getting new details about what went wrong here.

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[07:52:00

BERMAN: This morning a deputy in Sweetwater County, Wyoming given a very sweet honor ahead of his retirement for going beyond the call of duty.

CNN's Natasha Chen has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NATASHA CHEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): In July 2010, Deputy Jeff Sheaman answered a call to help a family stranded on Wyoming's Flaming Gorge Reservoir.

DETECTIVE SERGEANT JEFF SHEAMAN, SWEETWATER COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE: It seemed like a pretty easy operation, then the rain started and that's when things got bad.

CHEN (voiceover): Sheaman and two other officers found the Lew family, including father Frank and his 3-year-old son David. They were wet, freezing, and on the boat ride back little David went unconscious. SHEAMAN: All I remember is Frank pulling David off of his body and

handing him to me. He was completely stiff. It was like a block of ice. It was terrifying. I didn't really know if he was dead or alive at that moment.

CHEN (voiceover): Sheaman removed his life vest and tucked David in his coat.

SHEAMAN: All I knew is I just had to generate warmth, and I had to try something.

CHEN (voiceover): At the hospital David was treated for hypothermia, but Sheaman had saved his life.

Fifteen years went by and then this past March Sheaman got a surprise visit at the sheriff's office. A now-17-year-old David Lew presented him with a letter of thanks.

SHEAMAN: "Dear Officer Sheaman, I honestly struggled trying to figure out how to word this letter."

DAVID LEW, RESCUED BY SHEAMAN: I told him that what he did for my family is never forgotten.

SHEAMAN: "It's hard to write about something I don't remember well. However, I do remember my first time driving, my first day of school, my first day at a new job."

LEW: If it wasn't for him, I wouldn't be here.

CHEN (voiceover): David, about to graduate high school, had a special request.

LEW: I asked him if he would do me the honor of giving me my diploma when I walk across the stage on graduation day.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good evening, and welcome to Rock Springs High School commencement ceremony.

CHEN (voiceover): So just a few weeks ago --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: David Jackson Lew.

CHEN (voiceover): -- David Lew was handed his diploma from the man who saved his life.

LEW: I can't repay him for it, but I hope now that he can see what he did is not unseen. It's not forgotten.

SHEAMAN: He's able to become a young man and grow up and be successful. And, I mean, that's all the reward I need.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SIDNER: Sweet. On our radar for you this morning police are investigating a break-in at the home of Minnesota Rep. Melissa Hortman and her husband Mark. The two were killed, as you know, Saturday in what Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz called a "political assassination."

The home had been boarded up. Police say someone removed the plywood and broke a window Wednesday overnight. The Horman's family, though, had removed valuable items prior to the reported burglary and said nothing appeared to be missing after that break-in.

[07:55:00]

Another rocket launch, another explosion. Look at this -- wow. New video showing the moment a SpaceX Starship rocket exploded into a gigantic fireball late last night. This happening at a launch facility in south Texas as SpaceX was preparing for its 10th flight test. SpaceX said the rocket experienced a "major anomaly." You can see that there.

This is the latest of several Starship explosions. He says though no injuries were reported and all employees are accounted for at this time.

All right. Near the Tennessee and North Carolina state line flash flooding and a rockslide on I-40 swamped the highway there. Take a look at the damage. Part of the I-40 had to be shut down in both directions. Crews rescued drivers stranded by the floodwaters. Fortunately, in this case, no one was injured -- John.

BERMAN: All right. This morning interest rates not budging, at least not yet. The Federal Reserve held rates steady for the fourth time in a row as officials continue to wait for the fallout of President Trump's sweeping policy changes and to keep a close eye on the conflict between Israel and Iran.

Fed chair Jerome Powell says the economy is in a "solid position" but highlighted the difficulty of forecasting the impact of tariffs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEROME POWELL, CHAIRMAN, FEDERAL RESERVE: And the thing that every forecaster -- every outside forecaster and the Fed is saying is that we expect a meaningful amount of inflation to arrive in coming months and we have to take that into account.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: With us now CNN global economist -- global economic analyst and global business columnist, and associate editor of the Financial Times, Rana Foroohar. Rana, great to see you this morning.

Jerome Powell was pretty clear that he thinks inflation -- rising inflation is coming. That was pretty striking.

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST, GLOBAL BUSINESS COLUMNIST AND ASSOCIATE EDITOR, THE FINANCIAL TIMES (via Webex by Cisco): Yeah, it's -- it is striking because it's been a while since we've heard a Fed chair be so sure that yeah, we are in a new era. We are in an era of higher inflation.

But, you know, the fact that we're still not seeing the Fed say yeah, we're going to cut rates. Here's how we're going to deal with the situation. They're very split, and half and half of members that want to hold and not cut right now and members who are thinking that the economy is weak and maybe it's time to get a little more juice.

It just speaks to how incredibly complicated the situation is right now. And in particular, how complicated it is to try and make policy in an environment of rolling tariffs that even if they weren't changing on and off as we've seen so many times are difficult to predict, and here is why.

If you think about how tariffs imagine goods that are sitting in a port in China. The boat that's going to take those goods to the U.S. takes between six weeks and three months to even get here. Now, then there's the unloading. Then there's the getting the goods, be they toys or shoes or flatscreen TVs, to wherever they're going. And then you don't know how much inventory each retailer actually has on hand.

So there are all these time delays. And for some time now -- I mean, you and I have talked about this -- we've been thinking when are these tariffs going to hit? When are we going to feel that inflation? We haven't had a strong hit yet, but the Fed says we think it may be coming, and it may be coming this summer, which is why they're holding and not making any quick moves.

BERMAN: It was so interesting yesterday because the president's been very critical of Jerome Powell and would like to see rate cuts. And his arguments of his supporters say look -- look at all the data that is coming until this point. You all said we were going to see this -- these huge inflation spikes. We haven't seen them yet. That's the counterargument there to which Jerome Powell gave a --

FOROOHAR: Yeah.

BERMAN: -- fairly blunt answer, particularly for a Fed chair.

FOROOHAR: Absolutely, absolutely. And I would say I'm more in the Jerome Powell camp -- just anecdotal conversations I've had. I mean, for example, I was speaking to a shipper in New York recently who said look, in the last few weeks our business has contracted about 50 percent. We're now at the point where good inventories are run down. Good are going to start becoming more expensive. I mean, I'm hearing a lot of anecdotal information.

But I'll tell you, John, the summer and September will be the real tell. If we don't see inflation, say, through the summer holidays and into September, then the president would have a leg to stand on with his position. Until then I'm going to be watching very, very carefully.

BERMAN: We can see Dow futures right now -- all stock futures, actually, headed down -- a little bit of a tick here. We have about 30 seconds left, Rana. This conflict in the Middle East -- what are the concerns there? How does that factor --

FOROOHAR: Oh.

BERMAN: -- in to, sort of, longer-term planning?

FOROOHAR: Well, you know, John, you are already seeing -- and I will say I said this a few weeks ago -- oil has been cheap. Boom, it's up. I mean, that's what conflict in the Middle East does. And we'd already seen little shades of that with the Houthi rebels and blocking the Suez Canal.