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Trump Says It's Highly Unlikely He'll Fire Fed Chair After Suggesting Otherwise in Meeting With Lawmakers; Johnson Calls for All Credible Information on Epstein to Be Publicly Released, Says Previous Comments Were Misquoted and Misrepresented; Trump Calls His Supporters Upset About Epstein Probe Weakling; Popular Online Influencers Casting Doubt Over Trump White House; Russia Launches Hundreds of Drone on Key Regions of Ukraine; Hearing for Kilmar Abrego Garcia in Tennessee Criminal Case. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired July 16, 2025 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CO-ANCHOR OF "CNN NEWS CENTRAL": -- some Republican lawmakers seem to disagree with him.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CO-ANCHOR OF "CNN NEWS CENTRAL": Plus, producers and fans of "American Idol" are mourning the loss of one of their own after a brutal double homicide in Los Angeles. We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to "CNN News Central."

KEILAR: Today, President Trump confronting reports that he's planning to fire Fed Chair Jerome Powell. He's dismissing reports that he wrote a draft letter that was dismissing Powell, but he did say this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I haven't drafted a letter.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So you didn't show a letter to Republican lawmakers last night?

TRUMP: No. I talked about the concept of firing him. I said, what do you think? Almost every one of them said I should.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: CNN Anchor and Chief Domestic Correspondent Phil Mattingly is joining us now. And Phil, the president really kicking his Fed fight up a notch today, but also it's rather confusing, what he is (ph) saying.

(LAUGH)

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF DOMESTIC CORRESPONDENT: That's fair. And you shouldn't feel bad if you are confused about this as a normal human being that's trying to follow, because he kicked it up a notch, or at least his staff kicked it up a notch. Behind the scenes in a meeting last night with Republicans, he definitely kicked it up a notch. And then based on what he said earlier today, publicly, he brought it back down to just the kind of simmering hotly level that it's been for the better part of the last couple of months.

Let me explain here. Brianna, as you know quite well, the president has been very clear of his disdain with Jerome Powell, the Fed Chair, but also with where rates have been for a long period of time, pushing him to bring it back down. He has been pressuring for that to happen. His advisors have really jumped in a coordinated effort to escalate that pressure.

Last night, the president told a group of Republican lawmakers, again, about his frustration, but also polled them, I'm told by sources saying, do you think I should fire him? They said, yes, pretty universally. And I'm told from two people familiar with the matter that he pointed to a piece of paper and said, that is a dismissal letter in draft form. White House officials didn't knock that story down. White House officials said he was actually likely going to head in that direction of dismissing Powell, something that he doesn't have the legal authority to do on its face and that he would need cause to actually pursue, and it would still be pretty tenuous.

But the cause, the cause is what has changed over the course of the last couple of days, as officials have tried to lay the groundwork, as the president alluded to.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I don't rule out anything, but I think it's highly unlikely unless he has to leave for fraud. I mean, it's possible there's fraud involved with the $2.5 billion, $2.7 billion renovation. This is a renovation. How do you spend $2.7 billion? And he didn't have proper clearance, et cetera, et cetera. So, you know that's going on. So, there could be something to that, but I think he's not doing a good job. He's got a very easy job to do. You know what he has to do? Lower interest rates.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: The key takeaway there, Brianna, is he's not planning to do it. It's unlikely he's going to do it, but he is referencing this renovation project that his advisors have really keyed on that has been ongoing since 2021, definitely has cost overruns, and they have seized on as a dereliction of duty from Powell, or the potential allegation that he misled Congress on the issue. The Fed has denied that. The Fed has made clear this isn't taxpayer dollars and the stories about it are wrong. They're pursuing it.

I think the big takeaway right now is the pressure is going to increase. The president is pushing for something that he doesn't want to trigger. And the reason why, you look at the market reaction, in that 30-minute period when it seemed like it was about to become reality, stocks dropped precipitously, bond yields -- long-term bond yield yields jumped up pretty high. The potential for market catastrophe really kind of outweighs the idea of actually pursuing something he may not have the legal authority to do. KEILAR: He's not just mad at his Fed Chair; he's also insulting a lot of people who voted for him when it comes to this Jeffrey Epstein issue. And Phil, actually the Speaker just said something so I want to play what he said. This is Speaker Johnson calling for information about Epstein to be released. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON, (R-LA) HOUSE SPEAKER: I have been misquoted and misrepresented on all of that. Go watch the interview I did with Benny Johnson. I'm pretty clear. I mean, we're for transparency. I'm saying the same thing (inaudible). I mean, you need to have all of the credible information released for the American people to make their decision. We trust the American people and I know the president does as well. It's important principle to abide by here.

What they have to do though, what the president has to do is protect the innocent. I mean, there are whistleblowers and minors, names involved in things related to Epstein, obviously, and you can't -- you got to be careful not to release that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: I think this speaks to the difficulty that some members, especially in the House GOP, are having with Trump's stance on this. What do you make of what you just heard from the speaker and how Trump is navigating this issue?

MATTINGLY: I think you key on a really important point. This is a Box Canyon of their own making that is very difficult to get out of when you've been promising something to your voters and very active voting base over the course of a period of years.

[14:05:00]

And that's what makes what the president has done so fascinating over the course of the last couple days, both on Truth Social, but also in his comments today. He is always so careful to take good care of his base. We see it in his policies. We see it in his priorities. We see it in how his emergency services work sometimes. And his willingness to try and go down the path of saying all those things I told you and all those things you saw, they don't actually exist anymore. If they do exist, they're the Democrat's fault. And it's a hoax and we need to move on. Why aren't you paying me more attention for my successes?

It's a tough game to actually pitch when you've been saying the alternative for the better part of years, and people have voted on it and your members have gotten behind it. And your members who support you deeply across the board on everything are saying, wait, we said we were going to do this. You've delivered on everything else you promised during the campaign. There's a very long list. It's actually quite impressive, except for this. That seems strange.

KEILAR: Yeah, they're having a hard time selling that it's a Democratic led hoax, like he is alleging that it is because it so clearly isn't and they're struggling with that. MATTINGLY: That's the hole in it. Yes.

KEILAR: Yeah.

(LAUGH)

KEILAR: Phil, thank you so much for taking us through that. Super helpful. As President Trump attempts to move on from this controversy, some of the most influential voices of the online world now appear to be turning against the president, threatening to destroy his support among one of the most important parts of his base that of young male voters. CNN Steve Contorno is with us now for his new reporting on the so-called manosphere. Steve, some expressing concerns, others actually admitting regret. What are you hearing?

STEVE CONTORNO, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Brianna, it's been a pretty remarkable 180 in recent weeks from these certain corners of the manosphere. Remember, there was an incredible amount of synergy between Trump and these comedians and influencers and podcasters, who had him on his their shows and endorsed him to their massive audiences. Some were even VIPs at Trump's inauguration and had been credited with helping Trump win over a large fraction of young male voters last election cycle. But lately, signs of discontent, increased criticism as they talk to their audiences on their podcasts. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW SCHULZ, PODCASTER AND COMEDIAN: I voted for none of this. He's doing the exact opposite of everything I voted for. I want him to stop the wars. He's funding them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.

SCHULZ: I want him to shrink spending, reduce the budget (ph). He's increasing it.

JOE ROGAN, PODCASTER: There's two things that are insane. One is the targeting of migrant workers, not cartel members, not gang members, not drug dealers, just construction workers, showing up in construction sites, raiding them. Gardeners.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.

ROGAN: Like really?

THEO VON, COMEDIAN AND PODCASTER: It was supposed to be America First, like we're focusing on like, what are we doing to get things back into America, right? Now that we're caught up here and it feels like we are just working for Israel, I don't know. You just really start to feel very disillusioned pretty quickly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CONTORNO: That last voice you heard was Theo Von, the comedian. And I actually went to his show in Detroit on Saturday to get a sense of whether his fans have similar concerns about Trump. And I find that men -- found that many of them did. I talked to one person who said that Donald Trump is breaking his promise of no new war saying it was, "a big lie to my face." Other people expressing displeasure at the cost of Donald Trump's bill, his agenda that is going to add trillions of dollars to the deficits.

And you're starting to see some of this creep into the polls of young men as well. Take a look at where these individuals under 35 were at back in February. 54 percent of them disapproved of the president then. Now, it's up to 60 percent. We're also seeing a lot of dissatisfaction over his handling of the Jeffrey Epstein case among this group where we have seen 65 percent of 35-year-olds and under males saying that they haven't gotten enough information from the president that they wanted to on this compared to 50 percent of the general population.

Now, I will say I talked to more than a dozen people in Detroit over the weekend, and most of them said that they still support President Trump, but the White House's concerns that if they start losing interest in what's happening in Washington and they feel like they're not getting everything that they want, that they won't show up for him in these midterm elections when the house and the Senate is on the line. Brianna?

KEILAR: Steve Contorno, really interesting findings there. Thank you. Boris?

SANCHEZ: Turning now overseas, cities across Ukraine, again, dealing with the aftermath of Russian airstrikes. Overnight, hundreds of long- range drones targeted multiple cities, including the hometown of President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. The Ukrainian Air Force calls it the largest attack of the week, one of the largest of the war thus far.

[14:10:00]

Moscow has only intensified its assault since President Trump again lashing out at Vladimir Putin for not making peace. And while Kyiv says most of the drones were intercepted or disabled, Zelenskyy is again pleading for more air defense systems. Let's go to CNN Chief International Security Correspondent Nick Paton Walsh, and also with U.S. CNN Global Affairs Analyst, Kimberly Dozier. Nick, what are you learning about this latest round of Russian strikes in Ukraine?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, important to put it in context that 400 drones are pretty much nearly half the record number we've seen over Ukraine in the past weeks. But these target -- but the second city Kharkiv, which recorded 16 impacts from drones in just 14 minutes, remarkable. There were two lives lost in Kharkiv and the regions around it during the wave of those attacks. And also, as you mentioned too, Zelenskyy's hometown of Kryvy Rih, which was at the end of what they called by -- local officials called the worst attack of the war so far.

Zelenskyy himself pointing out that the capital had indeed not been hit by a substantial strike for a number of days. And suggesting, perhaps joking that the presence of Trump's envoy, Keith Kellogg, there may have been behind that, suggesting that Russia fears the United States and by extension fears hitting a senior official like that visiting, even suggesting Kellogg should stay and get a Ukrainian passport, seizing perhaps on the significant tone change in the White House. But none of that has made any difference it seems in terms of the nightly barrages Ukraine's on the receiving end of.

SANCHEZ: Kim, I want to get your thoughts on the Kremlin's response so far. They say that they are monitoring, delivery of long-range missiles to Ukraine. They've also alluded to this new deal for the U.S. to sell weapons to NATO and for NATO to funnel weapons to Ukraine as just an issue of funding. Do you sense any level of concern from the Kremlin based on these latest moves?

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: There's concern that Donald Trump in any way is moving away from their position, even if it's just posturing. On one hand, yes, Donald Trump is giving the Russians more leash, giving them 50 more days to keep attacking and pounding Ukraine nightly daily. But on the other hand, this shows that he is willing to find a way to keep funding them somehow. Yes, it'll have to be paid for by the Europeans. But, European officials had told me their main concern when they thought that the White House might cut all aid off, was that most of the weapon systems that Ukraine needs to defend itself, like the Patriots are made by the U.S., bought from the U.S. So you need Trump's permission to give them to Ukraine.

SANCHEZ: To your point about Putin having a longer leash, I assume you're anticipating more of what we saw overnight, right up unto those 50 days, perhaps even beyond.

DOZIER: Yeah. In the past 24 hours, all of Ukraine was under aerial bombing threat. In the first year, 2022 to 2023, the Russians flew about 2,000 armed drones against the Ukrainians. This past year, it's more than 5,000 and the year is just about half done. So every night, Ukrainians go to sleep, they keep their phones nearby and warnings go out as to do you have to be worried in Kyiv. And then you look at your Telegram group, which tells you, OK, the Ukrainian Air Force says it's ballistic missiles. Those can turn, so if it's a ballistic missile, I'm going to go down to the bomb shelter. If it's a drone, I'm going to hope that they'll shoot it out of the sky and maybe I'll just go sleep in the bathroom in the bathtub. This is the kind of thing they're going through nightly, sometimes several times a night. It's as if Moscow has decided this reign of terror is possibly our only way to get them to surrender. And so, they've really stepped this up.

SANCHEZ: Yeah, it is hard to find any other way to describe it other than a terror campaign. I do wonder, Nick, as you see the Kremlin as part of their response say that there are remnants of common sense in Europe. They cite reports that Germany is not going to supply Ukraine with its long-range Taurus cruise missiles. What did you make of that statement and reportedly, that decision by Berlin?

PATON WALSH: I mean, we have seen Moscow always try and make bigger any gaps in European policy. Look, the Taurus decision is something that Germany has gone back and forth on over months. It's possible they may flip back again. It's possible they may not be a hundred percent transparent indeed about what they decide to do. Remember too, though that this issue of longer-range missiles hitting deeper inside Russia, it seems to have been raised when Trump discussed the possibility of hitting inside Russia with Zelenskyy in an earlier July phone call.

But remember, Ukraine's been hitting inside Russia and quite deep inside targets very successfully with its own homemade drones over the past month.

[14:15:00]

So missiles, yes, a larger payload perhaps may be greater accuracy to some degree or speed, but not essential for Ukraine, but certainly a huge psychological impact if indeed NATO members decide to supply things like the Taurus or even the Tomahawks that could be used to take out critical Russian infrastructure. But I think the one thing potentially that Moscow wasn't counting upon in the Trump Administration is the possibly unanticipated byproducts over the last six months where Trump has been relatively sympathetic towards diplomacy, possibly even at times the Kremlin point of view until the whiplash back in the last week or so.

What it has done is made the Europeans much more cognizant of the fact that this is their fight, that it needs to be something that they finance much more heavily. And I'm fairly sure the Kremlin were not expecting that they would see this year possibly $800 billion worth of funding promised by European members for their own defense, i.e., towards keeping back the Russian threat. That's certainly something that I think the Trump Administration could claim credit for and will certainly be something that Putin was not imagining would likely be the impact of the first six months of this new White House.

SANCHEZ: Nick Paton Walsh, Kim Dozier, thank you so much for the conversation. Still to come on "CNN News Central," the Maryland man mistakenly deported to El Salvador is back in a U.S. courtroom today as his attorneys fight to keep him from being re-deported if he's released from custody. Also, how concerns over the Trump Administration's immigration crackdown are pushing one family to self- deport, even though the majority of them are American citizens. And we're following this double homicide in Los Angeles, an "American Idol" supervisor and her husband killed during an apparent burglary. That and much more coming your way in just moments. Don't go anywhere.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:21:35]

KEILAR: Right now, Kilmar Abrego Garcia is expected in court in Tennessee on a criminal case, and the stakes are high for the undocumented father whom the Trump Administration wrongly sent to El Salvador. He could be released in this criminal case involving human smuggling charges. But if that happens, the Justice Department said Abrego Garcia will be deported again. Just before the hearing, his wife and his supporters gathered outside the courthouse, voicing their support and praying for the defendant. CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is here with the very latest for us. Priscilla, what are we expecting to happen at this hearing? Well, PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the arguments that are being weighed is whether he is to be released while he still faces these charges. But the question -- and this is released of course, from detention, but what the administration has said is that even if he is released from pretrial detention, he will be taken into ICE custody. And this is where some of the big questions loom that are now involved in another case in Maryland, which is to say, if he does come into the custody of the Department of Homeland Security, will he be deported immediately or will he remain in custody while he faces these charges?

There have been conflicting statements from the administration on this very issue. When he initially returned from El Salvador, they had said, they being Trump officials, that he would remain in the United States to face these charges. But now, what they're saying in court is that he would actually be immediately deported.

Now, the follow-up question to that is, well, where? Where would he be deported? And this was part of a hearing last week in another courtroom in Maryland, as to if -- will he be deported to say another third country, a country where he has no ties? We've already seen those deportations take place and that really is a question. Now, the Senior Immigration and Customs Enforcement official, who is on the stand for those questions, said that they have not come to determination on that yet in terms of where he would go. That until he's in their custody, they just don't have those answers yet. But you can see how this case is still so complicated, both because it's playing out in multiple courtrooms and also because there's still so many unanswered questions as to what is to happen if he is, again, released to pretrial detention.

KEILAR: There's also a lot of immigrants who are looking at this story and considering their own situations. And you've been talking to one family of mixed status, who has been looking at it and decided, you know what? We're going to actually leave the U.S. even though only one of them is actually undocumented. Tell us about this.

ALVAREZ: Yeah. This case was pivotal for this family. As soon as they saw it, they saw themselves in the family of Kilmar Abrego Garcia and they decided to make the decision in very quick turnaround to move to Mexico. Here's their story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SASHA MENDOZA, U.S. CITIZEN: These are the main pictures from our house that we didn't want to just throw away.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): Sasha Mendoza has the impossible task of packing up her family's life in Pittsburgh into a handful of suitcases.

S. MENDOZA: It's really hard to tell a four-year-old that they can't bring their toys or their stuffed animal. There's just not enough room. We can't put a stuffed animal and then have no pants. I've literally never felt anxiety the way that I have in the last few years here. ALVAREZ: So you are saying bye to the us for good?

JULIO MENDOZA, UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANT FROM MEXICO: For good, yeah. Yeah. For good.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): Fearful of President Donald Trump's immigration crackdown. Sasha, her husband Julio, and their three kids are leaving behind the life they built together.

S. MENDOZA: What are you the most excited for in Mexico?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The pool.

S. MENDOZA: The pool?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the beach.

S. MENDOZA: The beach?

ALVAREZ (voice-over): Julio is an undocumented immigrant from Mexico.

[14:25:00]

Sasha and their three children are all U.S. citizens. They decided to make the move together only moments after Trump took office.

J. MENDOZA: There was an executive order being signed and that was her call for and said like, what do you think about moving to Mexico? And I said, honestly, at this point, yeah, let's do it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're going to move to Mexico,

S. MENDOZA: We're going to move to Mexico, not today.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): And with that, the family began to wind down their lives, sifting through keepsakes and moving out of their home.

S. MENDOZA: Say bye to the house.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bye, house. Miss you.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): When you were dating, did your status as being undocumented come up at all?

S. MENDOZA: On our first date, we kind of like were mentioning it without mentioning it, and at one point, he ordered a drink and he asked for extra ice. And I said, no, we don't -- we don't do ICE here. And he was like, hmm.

(LAUGH)

S. MENDOZA: That I was like the only thing we (inaudible).

J. MENDOZA: So by the way --

(LAUGH) ALVAREZ (voice-over): Julio crossed the U.S. southern border when he was 11 years old and he's lived in Pittsburgh ever since.

S. MENDOZA: One of his first concerns when we talked about moving is like, how am I going to watch the Steelers games?

ALVAREZ: You're a Pittsburgh native for all intents and purposes?

S. MENDOZA: Oh my God. Yeah.

J. MENDOZA: Yeah.

ALVAREZ: What made Trump a second term more nerve wracking for you that to come to a decision that you had to leave the country?

J. MENDOZA: There are no limits. There are no limits on being a target. The only main concern is like, he looks brown, he looks different, he don't speak English, he's the one. It doesn't matter.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CO-HOST OF "ANDERSON COOPER 360": That's where things stand tonight in the case of Kilmar Abrego Garcia.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were confronted with their worst nightmare when Kilmar Abrego Garcia was mistakenly deported to a notorious mega prison in El Salvador.

S. MENDOZA: I can see myself in that, and I don't want us to wait until we're in the same situation.

ALVAREZ: There are people who will say, you came to the U.S. illegally, why didn't you do it the right way? What do you say to people?

J. MENDOZA: If you were to be put in my situation at my age, to tell me do it the right way, the whole process pretty much takes about 15 to 20 years. By that time, I don't think my kids or anyone's kids who are starving or in a dangerous situation can wait 15, 20 years for you to come here and start working.

S. MENDOZA: What did we say that we could get when we get there?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: NPS Thomas (ph).

S. MENDOZA: No, we did not say that.

(LAUGH)

ALVAREZ: How did you approach the conversation with your kids?

S. MENDOZA: They know the realistic part of it, which is that it will be very difficult for them to adapt to, especially -- mostly language wise. That's like our biggest thing. They're not anywhere near fluent. And they are going to be going into a school that is Spanish speaking.

Who's that? That's you

ALVAREZ (voice-over): For Sasha, leaving the U.S. also means saying goodbye to the places she's called home.

ALVAREZ: You grew up in this house. What is it like for you to leave this house and what it represents to you?

S. MENDOZA: It is definitely hard because yeah, there's a lot of good memories. This has always been like the kind of comeback place. As far as we know, we won't be able to do that. We've kind of all decided that today is most likely the last time that we'll all be like in the same place at the same time.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): Hours of research behind them. The Mendoza family spent their final days in Pittsburgh saying goodbye to family and friends.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stay in touch. (Inaudible) stay in touch.

ALVAREZ (voice-over): It's a decision not taken lightly, but for Julio, no other choice.

J. MENDOZA: Rolling the dice will be staying here. That will be rolling the dice, playing with my life, playing with my kids' life, playing with my wife's life. That will be a gamble. I would say it's taken again (ph), where I'm taking a certain win on this one for sure.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ALVAREZ (on camera): Now, Sasha and Julio are settling in, in Mexico, and they are part of a newly emerging community of people who are voluntarily deporting the United States. It's something that the Trump Administration is banking on. They're calling them self-deportations. They're taking to the airways with multimillion dollar ad campaigns and offering financial incentives for people to leave. Now, Sasha and Julio opted not to take that offer. But for them, what was happening in the U.S. was enough, the uncertainty was enough to make this move. And what we learned, of course, in this reporting, Brianna, is it's not just undocumented immigrants doing it, but also their U.S. citizen spouses and children.

KEILAR: Such great reporting, Priscilla, thank you for taking us behind the scenes there. Really appreciate it.

When we do come back, how federal funding freezes are putting after- school programs at risk and parents on edge. Plus, the Senate could vote to zero out the federal funding for PBS and NPR. And ahead, we will speak to the CEO of PBS about what this could mean for communities across the country.

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