Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Interview with Representative Pete Sessions (R-TX); Interview with Oklahoma City Mayor David Holt (R); "Severance" Actress Patricia Arquette Gets 8th Emmy Nod. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 21, 2025 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:43]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, starting tomorrow, the House Oversight Committee chair says the Justice Department will begin turning over Epstein related records. The issue has obviously become a big deal in the House of Representatives, as some Republicans have called for more transparency in the case.

Oversight chair James Comer was asked just moments ago about what redactions might be in those records. Let's listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES COMER (R-KY): I mean, I can't imagine very many scenarios where we would further redact anything. We -- usually we have concerns over over-redaction. So we're just going to see what they -- what they send us and we'll go from there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: All right. With us now, Congressman Pete Sessions, a Republican who was on the Oversight Committee.

Congressman, what do you know about how much and what is being turned over tomorrow?

REP. PETE SESSIONS (R-TX): John, these are all good questions. As you know, Republicans and Democrats, not just on the committee but across Congress, all have voiced opinion that the records need to be released. They need to be released because, in fact, there's a lot to be said about both sides. But the bottom line is someone in power has been protecting a number of people, and it is directly against the values that I think my colleagues, Republicans and Democrats, subscribe to.

And that is we need to know if there's someone in power, if there's someone who held some sway over this data and information. So I think that the American public, and I will tell you, one is my wife and women that work for me have vigorously said to me, you need to make sure we get to the bottom of this. And so redacting it would not be in the best interest of Jim Comer and James Comer is really doing a great job. And so I think he's spoken the way that I would have. And that is

we're going to release the data and information. But there needs to be a review.

BERMAN: OK.

SESSIONS: As you know, any document that you read, you need to know more about the whole document before you go releasing things.

BERMAN: Anything less than turning over all their documents, anything less than that, would that be satisfactory to you?

SESSIONS: Well, I think that we know that there are some reasons why evidently, if it's true that the bureau in New York held some of these documents, I think we need to know whether we're looking at -- and it's going to take some period of time that for us, meaning the committee, meaning the majority, yes, Republicans, to get our hands around this, ask questions. There will be questions. It won't be here's the document, we released them.

And I think that we have to have data and information. But let me assure you that there are members on our side and their side that will be very vigorous about getting to the bottom of this.

BERMAN: Yes.

SESSIONS: And that means that you get to see the data, too.

BERMAN: Just --

SESSIONS: Even the media has, I believe, an intrinsic belief that they need to see this.

BERMAN: Sure. So just one last question on this, because you say someone is keeping this information from being released. We've now had two federal judges almost more than imply that the Justice Department itself is the one deciding not to disclose more.

I want to read you part of this statement from Judge Richard Berman yesterday, no relation, I might add, when he was saying he was not going to release the grand jury testimony. He's saying because the grand jury testimony is nothing. The DOJ is the one that has everything.

He said, "The government is the logical party to make comprehensive disclosure to the public of the Epstein files. By comparison, the instant grand jury motion appears to be a diversion from the breadth and scope of the Epstein files in the government's possession."

Do you feel that the Justice Department has been throwing up diversions?

SESSIONS: Well, let -- let's once again go back to the facts of the case. This goes back a number of years.

[09:35:02]

This is multiple Department of Justices. It is multiple attorney generals. It is multiple people who had their hands -- could have had their hands on this. And I think that there are some significant questions that I need to be able to understand more about.

I don't mind appearing on your show with sight unseen, but once these documents come out, it is going to require a lot of time by members and staff that I'd like to think could be close to being a bipartisan effort. What -- why were these records held? Who had custody of this? Where are the thousands of hours of tapes? Why couldn't someone have put these together? How did things leak out as they have done?

What was all these questions? And I think you're entitled to know. And I guarantee you, women on my staff, my wife, are no different than anyone else. Republican and Democrat. And it sounds like I'm jumping up and down saying, we're going to get it. We're going to get it. We got to see what we get first to know whether we think we got it all. And I think we will find a common denominator to release it without redacting it.

BERMAN: All right. You have to come back next week or the week after and tell us what your wife thinks about what the DOJ hands over.

SESSIONS: Well, look, I want --

BERMAN: Hands over.

SESSIONS: I want to do well enough get invited back. But that's not my point. It is not something that's necessarily going to be, oh, we read the documents in five weeks or two weeks. It is a process that I will tell you James Comer is an honest man, and my colleagues, Mr. Mfume and I work well together on a bipartisan basis. We're going to go after this, and it will be in the advantage of the American people.

BERMAN: Congressman Pete Sessions, I was not putting that as a precondition to invite you back. Rest assured the invitation is in the mail.

SESSIONS: Yes, sir.

BERMAN: Appreciate it.

All right. The bosses at Target could be learning an expensive lesson after abandoning their DEI initiatives. And if you book a window seat, should you get, you know, a window? Why this question is now sparking a lawsuit.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:42:04]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: So Target has named a new CEO after its leader of 11 years, Brian Cornell, announced he's stepping down. The company's current chief operating officer, Michael Fiddelke, is set to take over next year. So what went wrong for Cornell? A perfect storm of sorts? Maybe

seriously slumping sales and a DEI rollback earlier this year that sparked intense backlash, followed by a crippling Target boycott over it led by Reverend Jamal Bryant. At one point, officials reported that boycott was responsible for 9 percent lower foot traffic year over year in Target stores nationwide.

I spoke with Pastor Bryant about it last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: If you could talk to the Target's -- new Target CEO today, what would you say?

PASTOR JAMAL H. BRYANT, LED TARGET BOYCOTT: I would say to him that it pays to give dignity where people are giving dollars, is that what we're looking for is not a favor, but to do business and by them losing almost 20 percent of their stock today with the change, it would be less expensive and a less cost if they would just do right by humanity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: And what Pastor Bryant is speaking to and talking to is the trend of pushing back against diversity, greater diversity, something that the Republican mayor of Oklahoma City is speaking out about now.

In a new opinion piece in "The New York Times," Oklahoma City's Mayor David Holt is taking a stand that greater diversity is a good thing, writing this in part, "As residents of a purple city in a red state, we've been hearing a lot of rhetoric that portrays the drive for equal opportunity as a form of reverse discrimination. Sometimes this rhetoric is cloaked in patriotism, but it is really just repackaged bigotry, misogyny and racism to cast equal opportunity as a threat rather than a goal is a move backward."

And that Republican mayor, David Holt, joins me right now.

Mayor, thank you for being here. When I read this piece, I sent it around to the team and I said, this is a conversation worth having because where is diversity has become a political weapon, for sure, of late or greater diversity, you're celebrating it loudly. Why did you want to speak out about this now?

MAYOR DAVID HOLT (R), OKLAHOMA CITY: Because in my community, diversity is a reality and it's really, really what we have as an obligation is to provide equal opportunity to all of our residents regardless of their ethnic background or their gender, or what part of town they grew up in. So, you know, it's like I'm celebrating what is. And I'm acknowledging that the aspiration of our country has always been to provide equal opportunity.

I don't think that we've ever achieved that but we have the tools to aspire to it and work towards it. And we've been doing that for 249 years. I just think that there's -- understandably it happens from time to time. We've all lived through it in American history. But obviously, as you just alluded to, there's this pushback now.

[09:45:00]

But we can't let that kind of rhetoric stand in the way of what has been a march towards equality over two centuries in this country with many milestones along the way. And I don't want to see us take a step back.

BOLDUAN: Look, I mean, you write that broader perspectives yield more inclusive outcomes and much more. It's worth -- it's really worth reading. These are words that are not surprising to hear from a Democratic mayor in a blue state, but from a lifelong Republican in a deep red state who, as you write, you believe in meritocracy. Someone call it surprising to hear this coming. then from you, I have to say.

Why are you the exception right now in politics today?

HOLT: Well, there's a lot to unpack there. I mean, you know, one of the reasons is -- I mean, I think I'm a pretty conventional Republican. If this were 2002, I understand that there's been an evolution and -- but as you just said, I'm a lifelong Republican, right? I've been one since I -- you know, I graduated high school and registered to vote at age 18.

So I think, though, that what has allowed me to kind of remain a classic conservative in the mold of the party of Lincoln, which we used to call ourselves, is that we elect mayors in Oklahoma City and in a lot of places in a format where the top two candidates advance. All of the candidates have to face all the voters. All the voters get to see all the candidates. It's -- and essentially it's not a closed partisan primary, which really forces me and most mayors in America to run in a format where we build a coalition of what I sometimes half- jokingly call normal Republicans, Democrats and independents. Kind of the 70 percent of people in the middle.

All of that allows me to do what is what political leaders should do, which is bring people together and find these, you know, these objectives that draw a consensus. And I think in politics, 70 percent is about -- is what we call a consensus. And here in Oklahoma City, my efforts to bring everybody together and to work towards building pathways where we all have equal opportunity, which I kind of call One OKC, I wear it on my lapel every day, this has been very broadly embraced and I've been rewarded with large reelection margins.

And our initiatives have been rewarded with large margins of passage. And I think that actually is representative of where America really is. But when you talk about how parties have evolved in recent decades, that's really been driven by closed partisan processes. It's sort of elevate voices at the margins that I don't really think are representative of the general electorate. And so as a result, we're not getting to pursue some of the things you reference that I talked about in the piece. But we're doing it in OKC because we can and we have to.

BOLDUAN: Yes. And you also are the president of the Conference of Mayors right now. So you've got -- you've got your finger on the pulse of what the conversation is with mayors from all across the country right now. It is really interesting and a refreshing, refreshing take in the politics of today.

Oklahoma City Mayor David Holt, thanks for coming in.

Coming up for us, Cracker Barrel has unveiled a new logo, and the internet has some thoughts, friends. The redesign that is dividing the nation. I'm only slightly overstating that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:53:04]

BERMAN: All right. This morning, should a window seat include a window? A group of passengers suing Delta and United claiming the airlines unfairly charged them more for window seats that were not actually next to windows. Due to the placement of air conditioning, electrical components, some jets contain so-called window seats that are actually next to walls you see right there.

Other airlines face similar situations, but are more transparent. Neither Delta nor United responded to requests for comment.

So a little gremlin is making a big profit for its parent company. Labubu plushies boosted Pop Mart's profits by nearly 400 percent in the first half of this year. These things are so huge. I love them. They're so popular Pop Mart stores in the U.K. had to pause sales over chaotic crowds earlier this year.

BOLDUAN: They're so popular you've never heard of them.

BERMAN: Yes. The company -- I have absolutely heard of them before two minutes ago. Not at all. The company is going to unveil an entirely new smaller one soon that you can attach to your phones, which is an even bigger deal.

All right, Cracker Barrel controversy. The restaurant chain is changing its logo for the first time in nearly 50 years. For some reason, this move is causing a serious stir online. The logo keeps the yellow and brown, you know, scheme, but loses the dude and the barrel. OK. And people are very upset about the absence of the barrel and the guy there. We should note the restaurant is also remodeling and changing things.

BOLDUAN: That's part of it. That's part of it.

BERMAN: Yes.

BOLDUAN: When you're updating, you got to do a little refresh.

BERMAN: I can get mad about a lot of things. Cable outraged about a lot of things. I can't really get cable outrage about this Cracker Barrel change.

BOLDUAN: No one has asked him for comment. OK.

BERMAN: Yes. That's true.

BOLDUAN: I mean, he is -- he is very upset.

BERMAN: He's sphinxlike about the whole thing. He's not saying a word. He's sitting there silently.

[09:55:04]

BOLDUAN: So here we go. Award-winning actress Patricia Arquette is nominated for her eighth Emmy for her performance in season two of the Apple TV series "Severance," which is also the show that has the most Emmy nominations this year.

CNN's Elizabeth Wagmeister sat down with Arquette to discuss her character and what is behind the show's success.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: What do you think it is about this show that it's not just critically acclaimed, but has such a fandom?

PATRICIA ARQUETTE, ACTRESS: Well, I think the subject matter is interesting to people. It's a little sci-fi, but then there's relationships. And I think a lot of people kind of are living these bifurcated lives where they have one life at work and one life at home. It's not as severe as "Severance," but they may also not love where they work, and they may not love the corporation they work for.

WAGMEISTER: Are you recognized more for this role than you feel like for others because it's so part of the zeitgeist?

ARQUETTE: No. I don't know if it's because of my wig so not so much. I mean, like a young person will go, you look so much like my favorite actress. I don't know her name. I'm like, oh, from what? He's like "Severance." And then, you know, I might play like Cobel with them.

WAGMEISTER: How do you see her? Do you see her as a villain?

ARQUETTE: It's so weird. This character, I mean, I've never had this happen with any other character, but whenever people ask me about Cobel, the little inner Cobel in me, which doesn't exist in my normal life, comes out and it just wants to, like, throw you off the scent, trick you a little bit, deceive you. And it really enjoys it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: She has fantastic laugh. All week Elizabeth will be sitting down with more of this year's Emmy nominees. You can catch much more of her conversations on CNN.com.

BERMAN: "Severance." Just like all of our workplaces.

Thank you all for joining us. This has been CNN NEWS CENTRAL. "SITUATION ROOM" up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)