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Ibram X. Kendi is Interviewed about the Review of Slavery in Museums; Rep. John Garamendi (D-CA) is Interviewed about the National Guard in D.C.; Higher Tariffs on Furniture to be Announced Aired 9:30- 10a ET

Aired August 25, 2025 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Anti-Racist," Ibram X. Kendi, someone the administration calls a, quote, "hard core woke activist."

Ibram X. Kendi joins me now.

Good to see you. Thank you for taking the time.

You know, last week the White House put out a release saying, the National Museum of African American History and Culture dedicated a series to educate people on a society that privileges white people and whiteness and features content from, quote, "hardcore woke activists Ibram X. Kendi."

What is your response to that characterization?

IBRAM X. KENDI, PROFESSOR OF HISTORY, HOWARD UNIVERSITY: Well, as an historian, it reminds me of the way another group of Americans were described, another group of Americans who were described as hardcore, as extremists, or as radical for being willing to tell the unvarnished truth about slavery. And I'm talking about abolitionists. Abolitionists during their day were constantly defamed and described in -- in -- in similar ways. And so, I just can't help, as an historian, think back to the way in which, you know, those of us who are trying to tell the truth today about American history are being described in the same way that abolitionists who were trying to tell the truth about American slavery.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, part of how these museums are put together and how the stories are chosen, I mean, is a very, very intricate process to try to figure out, OK, what goes where. What do we actually bring into this museum?

But I wonder, you know, as the White House pushes and looks so closely into -- into specific exhibits and specific aspects of -- of exhibits, what do you believe are the broader implications of having a White House look so directly into specific exhibits?

KENDI: Well, again, I hate to -- to compare this again to the enslavement era --

JIMENEZ: Sure. KENDI: But during the enslavement era, those who were defending slavery typically wanted slavery to be presented to the American people as not that bad, as -- as actually somewhat good. And frankly, the primary defense of slavery by pro-slavery politicians was that slavery was -- was a positive good so that the American people won't seek to try to end slavery, or in today's case, the American people won't seek to end child of slavery, which is racism.

JIMENEZ: You know, one -- you can't help but think when you look at, OK, in this case, the election swung for President Trump. The next case, an election could swing for a different type of president. Do you believe the tactics that the current White House is doing just opens the door to other administrations doing the same thing, sort of pushing into more of the cultural aspects -- I mean truly institution wise of the United States?

KENDI: I do. And certainly many American people are divided in many ways politically.

But I do think one area where we could all agree is that politicians should not be dictating what we learn in public museums or even in schools. Museum professionals, teachers, people who are trained in this area should be determining what our kids learn, what the public learns, not politicians. Because if its politicians, it's going to constantly change. And it also, I think we could all agree, should be based on research and evidence, not the whims of -- of a White House.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, before we go, I think it's fair to say there is this cultural war going on, led by this administration, on universities, on museums, on cities, even if you want to include National Guard troops either being deployed or threatened to be deployed.

I just wonder, how do you interpret what is clearly a strategy here by the White House on various aspects of sort of ideas or institutions they may politically disagree with?

KENDI: Well, since we're talking about American history, this also reminds me of the reconstruction era where you had both white and black politicians who came together to build an interracial democracy in the south that created things that helped all southerners, like public schools, and -- and those who no longer controlled the south tried to present those efforts as not helpful to all southerners, but harmful, particularly to -- to white Americans. And so, they're using this same playbook today that somehow equity, that somehow justice is -- is harmful as -- as opposed to what it's always been, helpful to -- to -- to us all.

JIMENEZ: Ibram X. Kendi, got to leave it there.

[09:35:01]

Thank you so much for being here. Thanks for taking the time.

All right, just ahead, thousands of evacuations are underway as a typhoon threat brings dangerous conditions. We'll tell you where, coming up.

And a match point meltdown at the U.S. Open. We're going to talk about what you're looking at right here, and how it was sparked by a photographer's move onto the court. We'll break it down, coming up.

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[09:40:04]

JIMENEZ: President Trump is threatening to expand his deployment of National Guard members to other Democratic run cities after putting troops in the nation's capital.

And we're getting a better idea of which cities could be next. New York, Chicago and Baltimore are on the list, and so is Oakland, California.

Joining me now is Democratic Congressman John Garamendi of California, whose district is just north of Oakland.

Thank you for taking the time, Congressman.

You know, when we look at Washington, D.C., statistics show crime is down. But how people actually feel, you know, whether they feel safe is another thing that sometimes, you know, statistics can't really measure. Americans are concerned about crime, but politically, how should Democrats address that dynamic?

REP. JOHN GARAMENDI (D-CA): Well, I think we need to take a look at this in its whole situation and over the last six months. Trump is creating a policed state. When you consider where the National Guard is deployed, in Washington, it's not in those areas where there's crime. He's deployed those troops around the National Monument. He may very well decide to do the same thing.

But this is about limiting protests by stopping people from peacefully protesting anything that the Trump administration wants to do. It's one more step towards creating a full-on policed state in which the ICE agents, the largest single police force in America, is joined now with the military in our city, Washington, as well as Los Angeles, for the purpose, I believe, of stopping peaceful protests, of cowering the citizens of the United States, preventing the citizens from speaking out.

And when you couple that with the ongoing efforts of the Justice Department to target individuals and to send the FBI to do investigations, we are well into creating a policed state. And we need to be very aware of what's happening all across America and right now in our nation's capital.

JIMENEZ: And that, of course, are -- those are all part of some of the major concerns on if the National Guard is actually deployed to some of the other cities as well, which would be past the 30 days or so we expect them to be deployed in D.C. What comes next is really the question. I want to read something to you because Jim Messina writes, quote --

wrote on his Substack that, "the notion that we can just be anti-Trump or anti-MAGA and ride a wave of discontent to victory in 2028 is a fantasy here."

And I wonder where -- look, I mean, even just listening to some of what you were saying, Trump is creating a policed state. He wants to crack down on peaceful protests. I mean, those are part of the long- standing criticisms we've heard from many Democrats. But where can Democrats actually go on offense and, you know, to use Messina's logic here, actually win people over as opposed to telling people the current situation is bad?

GARAMENDI: Well, it's a -- it's a process that we have to undertake. And we've been working at it for the last six months. You've seen the reaction in California to what Trump has ordered the Texas governor and legislature to do, and that is to set up a new district in which they believe they'll be able to secure five new seats and thereby maintain control of Congress.

What we've done in California is to push back. We're going to go before the voters of California and offer them an opportunity for California to do our own redistricting, to be able to counter what Trump and the Texas governor and legislature did, and that is to -- to play dirty, to cheat, and to set up a redistricting in which they believe they would be able to control Congress. We're going to push back in California, and I think we're going to be able to do that successfully.

However, we need to do this every single day. People need to speak out in their local communities. They need to continue to protest throughout the streets of California on various intersections. You'll find half a dozen, ten, maybe 20, even 50 people with signs protesting Trump. That needs to continue across the nation.

And if I am correct, and that these -- the deployment of ICE agents, as well as military, with full-on armament, as well as rifles, assault weapons and shotguns and ammunition, if I'm correct that this is about stifling protests at our nation's capital rather than really dealing with crime, then we're going to have to attempt to do peaceful protests. Will that result in a confrontation? Doesn't have to.

[09:45:00]

It could. But we need to push back every place along the way, and we need to make sure that in the upcoming election we have free and fair elections. And once again, Trump is trying to do away with fair and free elections by trying to stop the use of mail-in ballots.

JIMENEZ: Well, let's talk about the elections. Just that --

GARAMENDI: Which was actually one of the things that Republicans successfully did in the past.

JIMENEZ: I want to pick up on what you said --

GARAMENDI: But apparently Trump thinks that he will be able to win the next election.

JIMENEZ: Sorry -- sorry to interrupt. I just want to pick up on -- on what you said a little bit earlier about that the California redistricting process. You know, you mentioned -- or it sounds like you're confident that voters will be with you in November. That's a big difference between Texas and California. In California, the voters actually have to approve it.

But the Independent Redistricting Commission is made up of five Republicans, five Democrats and four independents. Again, a commission approved by -- by the voters. And I know you're fighting back here against what Texas is doing. But just from a principle perspective, I mean do you think that California Democrats, Gavin Newsom at the top of the ticket, know better than this independent commission as for what a -- a fair representation of the electorate would look like in California?

GARAMENDI: Well, I'm a believer in the independent commission. I supported it, continue to support it, and also support, as we did in 2019, the establishment of an independent commission all across the nation.

However, we have a very, very different situation now. We have one in which the president, together with the governor and the Texas legislature, have tried to change the nature of the upcoming election by doing a redistricting in Texas. If there was no redistricting in Texas, I guarantee there would be no redistricting in California.

However, we have to be prepared to fight this out in the redistricting situation. We have no choice. This was set up by Trump as he attempts to guarantee that he'll be able to maintain control of Congress and thereby continue his reckless and anti-democratic processes of simply destroying the normal process of government in America. So, we're going to fight back.

Now, keep in mind, we're not doing this through the legislature. We're going to the public. And we're saying, we need to do this. Here's why. Here's going to be the result of it. It'll be a new district for all of us, all 53 of us in California -- 52 of us in California. And if you approve, then it will go forward.

JIMENEZ: And it'll be a big moment. And it will be a big moment if they approve it.

GARAMENDI: And the redistricting commission will continue in the next decade.

JIMENEZ: Yes, I was just going to say, it will be a big moment if they approve it to -- to move forward. It will take this fight, obviously, into its next chapter.

Congressman John Garamendi, I got to leave the conversation there, but thank you for being here. Appreciate the time.

All right, just ahead, why furnishing your home may get more expensive. We'll have the details. Stay with us.

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[09:52:42]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, new this morning, higher prices for furniture could be on the way as President Trump ordered an investigation into furniture imports. The investigation comes as the Trump administration is also thinking about higher tariff levels for copper, semiconductors and pharmaceuticals.

Let's talk though. Let's start on furniture here. CNN's Matt Egan is with us.

And we were just looking at the furniture. Stocks, they're down. Way down this morning.

MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yes, Joh, they are way down. But prices, they could be going way up the next time you're in the market for a bed, a dining room table, a couch, because the president says he's launched this major investigation into furniture imports. And even though that investigation is still ongoing, he says they will lead to higher tariffs.

So, he put out a Truth Social post Friday, after the closing bell, where he said, "within the next 50 days, the investigation will be completed and furniture coming from other countries into the U.S. will be tariffed at a rate to be determined."

Now, Trump is arguing that these import taxes are going to help businesses in Michigan and North Carolina, South Carolina, in terms of creating jobs to make furniture. But this announcement is rattling the furniture companies.

BERMAN: Yes.

EGAN: RH, the company formerly known as Restoration Hardware, down 7 percent this morning on this news. Wayfair, 8 percent. Williams Sonoma, 3 percent. That's because investors are betting this is going to squeeze their profits.

I should note, though, that some companies that make more of their furniture in the U.S., like Ethan Allen and La-Z-Boy, they're trading flat to slightly higher. So, investors are betting that they could actually benefit.

The curious thing, though, here is that we're already seeing higher prices on furniture, even though the president argues that there's no inflation and that tariffs have not boosted prices. That is not so when you zoom in. If you look at just prices for living room, kitchen and dining room furniture, they are up, look at this, almost 8 percent, John, over the past 12 months. That's almost triple the overall inflation rate. And this is, of course, before the furniture tariffs actually kick in. And that is in part because the administration has already leveled tariffs on China and on Vietnam, the two leading sources of furniture imports into the United States. The U.S. imported $12 billion of furniture from those two countries last year alone.

[09:55:01]

And so you got to wonder, though, what's going to happen to furniture prices in the weeks and months ahead because you're going to potentially have a scramble of people who are trying to beat the clock on higher prices. And then you're also going to have the actual tariffs kicking in. You could see how all of this is adding to some of the concerns about the cost of living.

BERMAN: Yes.

All right, Matt Egan, thank you, or no thank you, with someone looking to furnish this house for the first time since, you know, college.

All right, Omar.

EGAN: Thanks, John.

JIMENEZ: John, well, let's take people to the tennis court at the U.S. Open Sunday because a little bit of frustration that started when a photographer walked onto the court, in the middle of a match. You can actually see him in the upper right of your screen there. Former world number one Daniil Medvedev was facing Benjamin Bonzi. Bonzi was about to start his second serve, but because of the distraction, you see the photographer there, the umpire put Bonzi back on his first serve. And that appeared to make Medvedev furious. You see him storming toward the chair, yelling at the umpire, smashing his racket and smashing it a lot. Play was paused for six minutes because of Medvedev's --

BERMAN: You think it's broken? You think it's broken there? Or do you think he needs to do it again?

JIMENEZ: I don't know. I think he should keep going.

BERMAN: Oh, no, it's not broken enough.

JIMENEZ: There it is.

BERMAN: There you go.

JIMENEZ: There it is a little more. Yes, maybe one more. No, I think that did it.

The U.S. Tennis Association says the photographer was escorted out of the stadium and his tournament -- no. More. There you go. His tournament credentials were revoked. Thanks for joining us, though. Good to see you.

BERMAN: What time did you find out you were anchoring this morning?

JIMENEZ: It was right before. But it's OK. We figured it out.

BERMAN: Thank you so much for being here, Omar Jimenez. This has been CNN NEWS CENTRAL. "THE SITUATION ROOM" up next.

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