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Hollywood Icon Robert Redford Dead at 89; Patel to Testify Amid Questions Over FBI Leadership, Kirk Probe; Manhunt Underway in New York State for Suspected Killer; Trump Repeatedly Blames the Left for Rising Political Violence. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired September 16, 2025 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[08:33:16]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, in the breaking news this morning, we did just learn that Legendary Actor and Director Robert Redford has passed away. He was 89 years old. And I think, I was thinking about this, I think Robert Redford is in more of my favorite movies possibly than any other actor.

Let's bring back Jason Carroll, who has been reporting on everything we've learned about his death and his family. Jason, what more can you tell us?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I'm -- I'm absolutely in agreement with you. I think of some of my favorite films, films like Ordinary People, which he didn't even act in. He directed his directorial debut and actually won the Academy Award for.

I want to begin, though, once again by rereading the statement that was given to us, which says the following. It says, "Robert Redford passed away on September 16th, 2025, at his home at Sundance in the mountains of Utah, the place he loved. Surrounded by those he loved. He will be missed greatly. The family requests privacy at this time."

Again, when you think of the name Robert Redford, a name that is synonymous with classic Hollywood actors, you mentioned some of the films there. I mean, the list just goes on and on. The Sting in 1973, The Way We Were with Barbra Streisand, All the President's Men, just some of the films, the noted films that he starred in. This was a man whose career spanned decades. And again, not just an actor, not just a director, not just a producer, but also an activist.

You think of this as a man back in the 1970s who started speaking out about environmental issues, also known for his conservation work. Spoke out early on about the rights of Native Americans and, of course, received the Presidential Medal of Freedom in '26 -- 2016. This is a man who will be greatly missed, not just in Hollywood, but around the world.

[08:35:13] BERMAN: You know, one of the most famous lines in "The Natural" where he played Roy Hobbs -- Roy Hobbs said he wanted people to walk down the street and looked at him and say, there goes the greatest ballplayer that ever was. You know, with Robert Redford, he could walk down the street and people could say there goes one of the greatest movie stars there ever was, to be sure.

Jason, thank you.

I want to bring in Brian Stelter. And Brian, you had a chance to actually interview Robert Redford for CNN. Brian joins us by the phone right now.

Hey, Brian?

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, if there was a Mount Rushmore for film, Redford would be right there on it. And, you know, he had that stature. He had that presence in every room that he walked in. He created and helped and nurtured countless careers by founding the Sundance Film Festival. That is one of his greatest legacy -- actually soon moving, but an annual festival, one of the most important dates on the calendar for independent filmmakers, for documentarians. And that was all thanks to Redford.

I remember interviewing him there about a decade ago. He was pushing 80 years old almost at that point. And he talked to me about how he still learned something new about film. Every year he was there, he said, "I'm looking for innovation. I'm looking for new ways to tell stories with cinematography, with using the camera in different ways."

And I found that so inspiring then and again now that he was always looking for new ways to tell stories, always trying to learn about the art and the craft of filmmaking from younger generations that he helped inspire. You know, he also produced many TV series over the years, including a couple for CNN over the years. The number of titles he had, the number of fans he had. It's really immeasurable, John.

BERMAN: Yeah, you know, his love for the environment. Just watch A River Runs Through It, which he directed. You can see how he felt about the outdoors there, not to mention the fact he helped launch Brad Pitt's career in that remarkable role.

Brian Stelter, I'm watching you talk to him right now. What an interview that must have been. Thanks so much for sharing your experiences.

Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: We're going to continue to bring in reaction from that. And we're also going to turn back to Capitol Hill where there's going to be a lot of action this morning.

We're in just about a half hour from now. The FBI director, Kash Patel, is set to testify. This will be the first time that Patel is coming before the Senate Judiciary Committee since he took the job. And he's expected to face tough questions not only about the FBI's handling of the investigation into Charlie Kirk's murder, but also about Patel's leadership of the bureau overall.

With me now is Senator Dick Durbin, the top Democrat on Senate Judiciary, the committee of course that Patel is going to be testifying before today.

Senator, just yesterday I was listening to you on the Senate floor and you said that the FBI is in crisis. Scores of FBI personnel were shown the door, you say, for political retribution.

You know, Patel was vetted and confirmed. How are you planning to make Kash Patel answer to that now?

SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): We're going to go through exactly what he's done. He is, in my mind, the most incompetent FBI director in history. And to think the importance of this agency to keep America safe, Patel made it clear. He wrote a book called "Government Gangsters" and said, when I get my chance, if I had my chance, I'd go in and address the rot at the core of the FBI.

And he's done just that. Politically, he has dismissed professionals who have decades of experience in keeping America safe. He has had retribution on anyone who said anything negative or even investigated Donald Trump in his first term. He has been interrogated, subject to polygraph tests. I mean, it's -- it's an awful situation.

Thousands of individuals that were keeping America safe have been transferred to the mass deportation effort that is underway in the White House. And we're also seeing an awful lot of destroyed morale at that agency. We can't have it. This agency has to keep America safe.

BOLDUAN: I heard you say also that the brain drain, as you describe it, at the FBI under Patel with the firings, you said represents thousands of years of institutional knowledge wiped away in the blink of an eye. Do you -- if you believe that, do you think that the FBI is not capable of doing its job effectively right now?

DURBIN: Not as effectively as it should. I mean, when you have these individuals who have given their lives to the FBI, who are experts in their field and recognized internationally, dismissed by Patel because they didn't pass his political loyalty test. I mean, it's that awful.

Look at the recent killing of Charlie Kirk, a terrible assassination. And the FBI had to apologize for some of the things Patel said publicly way in advance of when he should.

BOLDUAN: I want to play for you what Patel -- he was responding to criticism of his handling of the investigation into Charlie Kirk. Let me play his response to the criticism.

[08:40:03]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR: Could I have worded it a little better in the heat of the moment? Sure. But do I regret putting it out? Absolutely not. I was telling the world what the FBI was doing as we were doing, and I'm continuing to do that and I challenge anyone out there to find a director that has been more transparent and more willing to work the media on high profile cases or any case the FBI is handling than we have been under my leadership.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Look, and Senator, you made clear you do not think he's up for the job, you do not like his qualifications, but do you hand it to him for what he says? He's out there answering the questions, and he says, being transparent.

DURBIN: Absolutely not. The bottom line is this. How many times in a serious, delicate investigation, like the assassination of Charlie Kirk, did law enforcement basically say, we're not going to say anything, we're in the midst of an investigation? This individual, Mr. Patel, is putting out press releases in the middle of it that turn out to be flat out wrong. How can that help the cause of good law enforcement? He is not up to this job.

BOLDUAN: In the wake of that murder, lawmakers on both sides of the aisle are saying that they're worried about their own security. Just yesterday, one Democratic House member, speaking in a condition of anonymity, says that Speaker Johnson's response to these security concerns has been filled with legislative BS. And Senator Kevin Cramer says that he feels less safe than I ever have in speaking to Manu Raju. Do you?

DURBIN: The numbers tell the story. There have been more assaults on public figures recently than in history, as we look back across the years. And sure, all of us as individuals take it very seriously when an individual like Mr. Kirk is assassinated. That just tells us that there are violent people there. There is no place for violence in politics. And we ought to speak as one.

Some of the statements that have been made, blaming the Democrats, blaming the Republicans, are just flat out wrong. We've all got to do it together, a bipartisan effort to preserve this democracy.

BOLDUAN: The president is saying, though, that he -- he says the political violence is only coming from the left. He says that he's going to go after people on the left, even though, I will say, just as a reminder to everyone, no part of the investigation has shown that this man accused has been part of any broader coordinated effort. Regardless, the president says he's intent on going after left-wing groups. Do you think this is real? If it is, what is that going to look like?

DURBIN: Well, I just can't tell you what the president is thinking. It's hard to keep up with his statements in a time of crisis. I think back with George W. Bush and Barack Obama and others who have tried to calm a nation and move it in the right, positive direction. We don't get that approach at all out of President Trump. It is confrontational. It's every day's political score. I mean, it wears you out after a while. What he is thinking about doing next, I have no idea. BOLDUAN: Having a lot of conversations, just had a really great conversation with S.E. Cupp and Marc Short about the finger-pointing that is going on, but also the way to try to rise above it and try to make this a moment, a tragic moment of positive change, though. A lot of people calling on bringing the temperature down. Some are and some definitely are not when it comes from where you are on Capitol Hill.

Just looking inward rather than outward going forward, do you think Democrats, if you believe that Republicans have done this, do you think Democrats have also gone too far in their rhetoric in demonizing the other side?

DURBIN: Absolutely. I mean, this notion that we're going to characterize MAGA as Nazis, for example, on the other side that the Republicans would characterize the Democrats as a party of murder or evil. I mean, the outrage is coming from both sides and is unacceptable in both instances.

So, yes, both sides can learn the lessons here. Mr. Kirk's, the loss of Mr. Kirk is a good reason to do it.

BOLDUAN: Finally, Senator, in all of your years in the Senate and as you wrap up your career in the Senate, do you -- do you have any optimism or hope that this will change for the better?

DURBIN: Let me tell you what, if you're not an optimist, you shouldn't be in politics. I am an optimist. I believe America will come out of this stronger and more unified. I've seen the course of history. I've studied history. We are a great nation because we have great people in this nation. Eighty percent of the American people are good, solid citizens, not inclined toward political extremism. They can rebuild this America.

BOLDUAN: Senator Dick Durbin, thank you very much. A very big hearing about to get underway. We will be watching it as you head over to the chamber. I appreciate your time.

John.

BERMAN: All right. This week, the Democratic governor of New York, Kathy Hochul, has endorsed the candidate for mayor here in New York who won the Democratic primary, Zohran Mamdani, other Democratic officials have not.

[08:45:08]

Mamdani calls himself a Democratic socialist, which, of course, is something that Bernie Sanders in Vermont is as well. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, the congresswoman here from New York. What about that word, socialism? How does it play in the polls? One man knows the answer. CNN Chief Data Analyst Harry Enten.

Hello, sir.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Hello.

BERMAN: We're talking about socialism and we're talking about Democrats.

ENTEN: Yeah. OK. You know, I'm not really surprised that Kathy Hochul decided to in fact endorse Zohran Mamdani because the fact is socialism is not a four-letter word in Democratic primaries, not among Democratic voters. It's a five-letter word in the minds of a lot of Democrats. That five-letter word being great.

Look at this, net popularity of socialism among Democrats. You go back to 2010, it was plus seven points. Look how high it is now, up like a rocket, up to plus 36 points. That's a jump of nearly 30 points on the net popularity scale among Democrats in just 15 years.

And I was looking at the polling from New York City and what you see is the clear plurality of New York Democrat, New York City Democrats think the idea of having a socialist mayor is a good idea, matching what we see nationally. The bottom line is socialism isn't a dirty word among Democrats at this particular point. It's actually a word that when attached, Democrats seem to like it.

BERMAN: That's a huge jump. And that's not that long ago let me add.

ENTEN: Yeah.

BERMAN: What about capitalism?

ENTEN: Yeah. OK. So, if all of a sudden socialism is now a five-letter word, great. What I would say is capitalism in the mind of Democrats is a three-letter word, bad.

What are we talking about? Net popularity of socialism among Democrats. Look at this trend. It was plus eight points in 2010 on the positive side of the ledger. Look at where we are in 2025 down, falling through the floor at minus 13 points. That's a drop of over 20 points in just 15 years. So, we see the exact opposite trend that we see in socialism, which is up, up and away. What we see with capitalism is down, down, down through the floor.

BERMAN: OK. We're talking about Democrats here. What about if you look at the larger population, Harry, is it the same type of thing?

ENTEN: This is where the danger is for Democrats, because if socialism plays in Democratic primaries, it does not play in the general electorate. What do we see going on here? Net popularity among all adults. Capitalism is on the positive side of the ledger at plus 12 points. Socialism way, way, way underwater at minus 18 points.

So, that's capitalism running away by 30 points over socialism. That is why Republicans are thanking their lucky stars if Mamdani, in fact, wins the general election, because they feel like they can play off of him. Because socialism may play in New York City among Democrats, but among the general electorate, Donald Trump and the Republicans are saying, hey, look at the socialist mayor in New York City. This is what we're dealing with.

So, again, something may play in Democratic primaries. It may play in the very Democratic city of New York. But among the general electorate, Republicans are salivating at the idea that they can run against a Democratic socialist being the mayor of New York City.

BERMAN: Interesting way to break down those numbers, Harry Enten thank you very much.

ENTEN: Always interesting with you.

BERMAN: Kate?

BOLDUAN: All right. Hollywood legend Robert Redford has passed away at the age of 89 years old. A look back coming up of his life and legacy.

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[08:51:30]

BOLDUAN: Happening right now, manhunt is underway in the Adirondack Mountains for a suspected murderer. New York State Police say Anthony Bechand was the live-in boyfriend of Amanda Rodriguez and Sunday Police say Rodriguez's body was found in the couple's home and Bechand has been on the run ever since. CNN's Randi Kaye is following this one.

Randi, what are you learning about this?

RANDI KAYE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Kate, I spoke with the mayor and the chief of police there in Cohoes, New York, and -- where this happened, and they told me, just as I was speaking with them, they had just received the autopsy results. They said this has been ruled a homicide, that Amanda Rodriguez died from extreme blood loss and a punctured aorta. The chief said that she was very likely stabbed with something very sharp.

So, they do believe this was some sort of domestic situation. He was a live-in boyfriend of hers. He was believed to be at the home when this happened. The victim's mother couldn't reach her, so she called a neighbor who checked on the home and found Amanda Rodriguez dead around 9:15 on Sunday morning.

So, there is this manhunt underway for 53-year-old Anthony Bechand. They did find his truck 170 miles away from Cohoes, where this happened, in the town of Brighton in Franklin County. That's just south of the Canadian border in the Adirondacks. This was a 2024 white Chevy Silverado. And here's a bit more of what the mayor and the chief told me.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR BILL KEELER, COHOES, NEW YORK: At the moment, his whereabouts are unknown. I mean, the police were able to track the movement of his vehicle. His truck was abandoned in rural upstate New York. It apparently ran out of gas. So, New York State Police in the area have been combing the area.

CHIEF TODD WALDIN, COHOES POLICE DEPARTMENT: We do consider him armed and dangerous. He is not to be approached. And if you believe you see him or you see him, to notify those authorities in the area. We also have the forest rangers and the U.S. Customs and Border Patrol involved.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: And, Kate, the concern is that Bechand could make his way into Canada. That's why the Customs and Border Patrol is involved here. The chief did tell me, though, they are tracking his cell phone. They're also looking to see if he might have stolen any cars in the area. So, they're looking into that as well.

What's interesting, Kate, is that the chief said that nobody has ever -- police have never been called to the home before for any type of domestic violence situation here and that Anthony Bechand does not have any criminal record as far as they can tell. Also, it's worth noting that they haven't seen a homicide in that area in decades, according to the mayor, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Wow. Just such a mystery around now where he is. Thank you so much, Randi. I really appreciate your reporting.

John.

BERMAN: All right. Today, the suspect in the killing of Charlie Kirk is due to make his first court appearance. His comes as Kirk's death sparks debate about free speech and the safety of lawmakers.

Yesterday, Vice President Vance took to the microphone on Kirk's own show and urged listeners to report people who he thinks cross a line.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE (R), U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: So, when you see someone celebrating Charlie's murder, call them out in hell. Call their employer. We don't believe in political violence, but we do believe in civility. And there is no civility in the celebration of political assassination.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: All right. With us now is Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis, a Republican from New York.

Congresswoman, thanks so much for being with us. There is a discussion about free speech and cancel culture, which Republicans have been very critical of for some time here. So, where's the line here, do you think, based on what the Vice President was saying?

[08:55:00]

REP. NICOLE MALLIOTAKIS (R-NY): I think it's very challenging. I think, first of all, all of us in this nation need to take a step back and look what has occurred here. A young man's life was taken by someone who obviously was very hateful, obviously had mental health issues.

We have to agree with each other that we are going to take this temperature down, that we're going to respect one another. We need to be able to debate on merit and have these discussions of civil -- in civil -- in a civil way. We need to challenge each other at the ballot box. But when we are having these debates on topics, it needs to be civil.

Unfortunately, I think social media has changed a lot of this. And so there is this thin line between freedom of speech but also hateful rhetoric, and it has been crossed numerous times. The problem is you can't legislate civility, right, and you can't legislate morality.

The problem is that we need to take a step back and actually look at what's happening here and also recognize that I wouldn't be surprised if our adversaries right now are taking advantage of this situation, trying to divide us further. We know that they use these bots on social media. They've -- they've certainly tried to infiltrate our -- our -- the mindset of our youth. We need to figure out a way to try to protect the social media platforms that has created this type of divisiveness in our society.

BERMAN: I appreciate everything you just said there, and thank you for those comments, especially the fact this isn't easy. This is complicated, working your way through all of this. When you listen to what Vice President Vance said, he was urging people to call the employers of folks who said certain things about the Charlie Kirk assassination. What do you think the government's role is in -- in policing speech?

MALLIOTAKIS: Yeah, and I think that's really the challenge here. If someone is saying something that is hateful, that is very unfortunate. I don't know that there's something that government can actually do about that other than leading by example, and that's why I say all elected officials must lead by example here. I've seen colleagues go on social media and attack each other to terrible degrees. That has to stop. We need to set an example.

We can only be the change we want to see within ourselves, really set that type of example that we want to see in the world. I truly believe that, and I really feel that what we're putting out there matters.

Now, if it's a direct threat, obviously those things need to be reported to the proper government agency. Perhaps, you know, this could have been prevented had some type of threats made by this individual were reported beforehand. Somebody must have known that he was willing to do this or had considered doing this beforehand, and so we need to take these types of threats seriously and just hope that it will go -- when we're working with law enforcement partners, we could prevent this in the future.

BERMAN: Yeah, again, Spencer Cox of Utah, the Republican governor, said something very similar you did, which is maybe the first place to start for everyone is to look inwards here about how you think and speak and relate to other people.

I want to ask you a couple policy questions here. Congress, you know, there could be a shutdown coming. One of the issues is an extension of tax credits for Obamacare. If Congress doesn't act, there will be people who lose some of these tax credits. What action do you want to take here?

MALLIOTAKIS: Yeah, so these subsidies were put in place at the height of COVID. When the Democrats were in charge, they set the deadline for it to expire at the end of this month. I think that instead of just having a clear cliff here, we need to phase this out. I think that the -- the clear cliff is a problem, and I don't know why they chose that route.

I think that we need to look to see how we can phase this out, but also with the phase-out, it needs to come serious policy changes as it relates to insurance companies. We know the insurance companies are profiting tremendously off these types of subsidies, and they are receiving these subsidies, these tax credits, even when they haven't seen a single patient, doctors.

So, what I would say is there needs to be some type of balance here. We can't just phase out these tax credits without doing something about insurance companies to stop what they're doing, which is increasing tremendously the cost of medical care in this country.

BERMAN: Just to be clear, though, I think what you're saying, a phase- out or working something out here, doesn't mean take no action, because taking no action, it goes away. It's no phase-out. It's just gone.

And my understanding right now is that the proposal leadership's talking about, at least that would be some kind of a continual resolution for a few weeks, wouldn't do anything on these tax credits or subsidies, would they?

MALLIOTAKIS: Yes. So, when this was put in place at the height of COVID, the Democrats who were in charge put a complete expiration date at the end of this month. Republicans, some, want to allow that to -- to just expire.

[09:00:00]

My solution would be somewhat in the middle, which would be some type of phase-out over a longer period of time, while also addressing the core problem of why our medical costs and insurance is so high, and that is because of the way that it's being abused by the insurance companies. And that's a reality. They are making tremendous profits while receiving taxpayer government subsidies. I don't want to see that being transferred to the consumer, to the patient.

BERMAN: OK.

MALLIOTAKIS: This is the middle class in my district that's being affected by this if this were to completely go away at the end of this month. So, there needs to be a balance here. Phase it out, but let's address the core issue of the insurance companies that have been predatory here.

BERMAN: Congresswoman Malliotakis from New York. Great discussion this morning. Thanks so much for coming on. I do appreciate it.