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Trump Needs to Lead on Shutdown Talks; Sen. John Fetterman (D- PA) is Interviewed about the Shutdown; Trump; Americans Fall Behind on Car Payments; Government Shutdown Threatens CDC Tracking. Aired 9- 9:30a ET

Aired October 22, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

MAYOR ANDRE DICKENS (D) ATLANTA: Mental health is showing up in so many places.

If you think a month ago, a mentally deranged man shot up the CDC and ended up killing a Dekalb County officer. And across this United States of America, you're seeing mental health go undiagnosed, unresolved, and that there are not enough institutions to help people. That is the policy issue that we all have to deal with, whether you're a Democrat, Republican, whether you're in a red state, blue state. We got to get that under control because this man was mentally deranged, had access to an assault weapon, and he was a convicted felon. So, somewhere the process went way wrong long before it got to Hartsfield- Jackson.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And all along the way -- at least at one point along the way, the family stepped in and made a very important phone call, and officers training kicked into action, and everyone has to be thankful for that.

Mayor, thank you so much for your time. I appreciate you coming in. Quite a tale. Quite a story.

A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump reportedly seeking $230 million in compensation from his Justice Department for investigations into his conduct. American taxpayers would foot the bill if the DOJ settles.

Now, are you falling behind on your monthly car payments? You're definitely not alone. The deepening crisis and the major warning sign for the economy.

Plus, long lines back at the Louvre. The Paris museum reopening as authorities keep hunting for those brazen thieves, days after they pulled off that daring jewelry heist.

I'm Sara Sidner, with Kate Bolduan and John Berman. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

BOLDUAN: So, this morning, both -- you have some agreement on one element of this shutdown now. Top Democrats, and some rank and file Republicans, now pushing for President Trump to get involved and jump into talks in order to end the government shutdown now entering day 22. One Republican saying on the record, quote, "we absolutely need the president to be involved."

At the same time you've got the Senate minority leader, Democratic Senator Chuck Schumer, demanding the president meet with congressional Democrats before he leaves for his multi-day trip to Asia and as we have a new example of Democrats trying to hold their ground and trying to have a say. On the floor right now you see Oregon Democratic Senator Jeff Merkley. He's now been speaking for about 15 hours, saying that he is protesting the president's, in his words, grave threats to democracy.

House Democrats have written the White House Budget Office demanding the administration stop mass layoffs that they've been threatening and have been taking place during the shutdown.

All caught in the middle Well, all Americans. Federal workers left in the middle.

And here's the latest example. Hundreds of people, much more than were expected, spotted lining up for food at a food bank in Maryland, in the D.C. region, just yesterday. More than a million are working, unpaid or furloughed, right now.

CNN's Annie Grayer tracking all of this from Capitol Hill.

So, you have Jeff Merkley talking in the Senate, and you have -- you have Republicans in the Senate and the House speaking to you on the record now about what they want to see happen.

ANNIE GRAYER, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: That's right, Kate. We're seeing two brewing dynamics kind of unfolding here. You see congressional leadership. Speaker Johnson, Leader Thune and President Trump all adamant that no negotiations about health care can happen until the government is reopened.

But there is a growing number of rank-and-file Republicans, both in the House and Senate, who say it is time to get Trump involved. He is the disrupter that is needed because it is day 22, the second longest government shutdown in history, and the stalemate continues.

And one group who really agrees with those rank-and-file Republicans are Democrats. They also think that Trump needs to be directly involved because they say that congressional Republicans are just going to follow what Trump says anyway, so they may as well negotiate directly with the president.

Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries reached out to President Trump yesterday for a meeting. The group have not met since September 29th, the day before the government ran out of money. But Trump denied that request, again saying that he doesn't want to negotiate until the government opens. Democrats are going to keep pushing for that.

And I just want to emphasize that as the shutdown drags on, this stalemate continues. No real progress has been made. There are no negotiations going on. So, rank-and-file Republicans are looking for ways to try and change that.

I want to play for you from some sound from yesterday from Leader Thune just to show you how much lawmakers are saying pretty much the same thing they said at the beginning of this shutdown.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD): I don't know what there is to negotiate. This is about opening up the government. We have offered them several off ramps now. The Democrats want something that's totally untenable.

People keep saying, you know, negotiate.

[09:05:01]

Negotiate what? I don't know what that is right now. The government needs to open up, and then we're happy to sit down and talk about any other issues that Democrats want to talk about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRAYER: So, round and round we go another day. We'll see if the Senate tries to take up the government funding bill. But again, if they do, we're not expecting a different outcome.

BOLDUAN: As a Democratic senator put it, John Fetterman, "Groundhog Day" upon us.

Annie Grayer, thank you so much.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And with us now is the aforementioned senator from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, Democrat John Fetterman, who has voted many times now to actually reopen the government.

Senator, thank you for being with us.

We just had a report that many people are calling on President Trump to get directly involved. What difference would that make?

SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): Well, of course he would make a difference. I mean he -- he's the decider in this situation. Ultimately, he has to decide what we want to do moving -- moving forward on this situation.

BERMAN: Who's to blame for the shutdown here on day 22?

FETTERMAN: I think there are -- collectively at this point I just want to get the government open at this point. It's not blaming or who's winning or who's losing because the guarantee who is losing, and that's Americans right now.

I am now fighting to opening because of the 2 million Pennsylvanians that are on SNAP, and those funds are running out. Two million people in Pennsylvania depend on this to feed themselves and their family. Compare that to 420,000 Pennsylvanians that receive one of those tax credits for health insurance that I fully support extending those to.

Now, I'm fighting for them both. And those both can occur if we open the government because it's fundamentally wrong to shut our government down. I don't care if it's the Republicans doing that, or my own party doing in those things. I think that's the truth, that our government must be open and we can negotiate all of these very important kinds of priorities.

BERMAN: You have said just yesterday that you would support what is called the nuclear option, which would allow for an up or down vote. You don't need to meet that 60 vote threshold to vote to keep the government open. Why do you support getting rid of the filibuster for this?

FETTERMAN: I am. I absolutely support carving that out to make it virtually impossible in the future, either party, to shut our government down and to put us in this situation right now. I would like people to understand, 2 million Pennsylvanians that depend on SNAP, they're going to stop because of this shutdown, and that's an alarm for me. And that's why we have to cut this, and we have to open it and figure out a way forward.

I do believe Leader Thune is an honorable man. And I do believe we can have a serious, sincere conversation to extend these things. And I am very proud as a Democrat. I believe two things must be true, that we can negotiate and figure out, because I don't want anyone to get slammed by these kinds of increases for health insurance. But I also want to make sure people are fed and keep our government open and -- because I'm also going to be on the side of paying the military. I'm always going to be on the side to paying the Capitol Police that protect us -- all of us here every day. Now it's a loser for America to have our government shut.

BERMAN: Senator, what would you say to Democrats who say that the nuclear option, getting rid of the filibuster here, would give Republicans unfettered power in the Senate?

FETTERMAN: No, that's -- that's actually not true. It would not give them unfettered power, carving out this one specific thing. They did the same thing about the en bloc nominees. They carved it out specifically for that. And now I said this yesterday, no, really, if the Republicans do kill the filibuster, we can't really clutch our pearls because we ran on to eliminate the entire thing. You know, even in my campaign, I said the same.

So, now, it's pretty hypocritical if we love the filibuster, when just a couple of years ago we wanted to wreck it.

BERMAN: I do want to ask you, because as I said, you've been voting -- you've been one of three Democrats or independents to vote along with Republicans to open the government. And when you cast one of the earlier votes, I spoke to Pennsylvania Democratic Congressman Brendan Boyle about your vote. This is what he told me. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. BRENDAN DOYLE (D-PA): Well, you know, unfortunately, at this point, I'm no longer surprised by anything John Fetterman does. Let's not forget, he was the only Democrat right after the election to immediately fly into Mar-a-Lago and -- and kiss the ring. And he has acted accordingly over the last year in much the same way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: What do you say to Democrats like Brendan Boyle?

FETTERMAN: Well, my real problem with -- with Congressman Boyle is that he likes the Eagles more than the Steelers. You know, I'm a full Steelers guy. And he's entitled to his -- other kinds of these opinions, including being on the wrong side of a WAWA (ph) guy, Eagles and the Steelers.

[09:10:08]

BERMAN: Well, look, Brendan Boyle, "Axios" has reported there are some Democrats who may run against you in a Democratic primary. Well, how do you feel about challenges from within your own party?

FETTERMAN: I really could care less about a race that's years away. How much work -- and I'm only primarily concerned about the 2 million Pennsylvanians that depend on SNAP to feed themselves and their families. I'm absolutely worried about paying the military and Capitol Police and opening our government open. And that's what I'm really concerned about.

BERMAN: How -- how committed are you to staying a Democrat?

FETTERMAN: A thousand percent. A thousand percent. And that's really strange to -- we talk about it. You know, I'm not changing my party. I've been very committed to doing those things. You know, I'm a Democrat, but I represent 13 million Pennsylvanians, and I'm going to fight for all of them, regardless of what their parties are.

BERMAN: And even if --

FETTERMAN: And that's what this -- I'm in the middle of it.

I'm -- I'm going to -- I'm going to choose -- I'm always going to vote country over party. I'm always going to vote over paying the military over my party. You know, I'm always going to vote for the 2 million Pennsylvanians that depend on SNAP over party. And I'm not changing my party because I might happen to disagree with parts of my own party's right now.

BERMAN: And you even represent Eagles fans I take it as well.

One final question, Senator Fetterman. The president yesterday seemed to acknowledge that he's trying to get a $230 million payout from the government in response to a couple of the investigations into him that would be taxpayer money. How do you feel about the president pushing for that?

FETTERMAN: I hope that's not true. To -- for that kind of money, that's small ball and I think we have much bigger problems than worrying about those things. I hope it's -- I hope it's not true. And, of course, you know, the two -- $230 million should go to paying people's health insurance or other things. That's not a priority I would ever support for those kinds of payments.

BERMAN: Senator John Fetterman, a Democrat from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, and a Steelers fan, we do appreciate your time this morning. Thank you, Senator.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, thank you, John.

As you just heard, in the Oval Office, President Trump appeared to confirm a "New York Times" report that he's seeking some $230 million in taxpayer dollars from his own Justice Department over its past investigations of him. We're talking about Robert Mueller's investigation into Russian election interference and the probe into the classified documents the FBI seized at Mar-a-Lago.

CNN's Alayna Treene is live at the White House for us.

What more do you know about this situation here? The president was asked about it. He sort of waffled on how much money that he was asking for, but did not deny it.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: No. And he actually appeared to confirm it. Sara.

I think one of the key things to keep in mind here is that the president had pushed and filed these claims with the Department of Justice when he was out of office. Of course, he is in office now. And so that raises some massive conflict of interest issues.

But I do first want you to listen to what exactly the president said in response to this question from CNN. And then I'll break it down for you on the other side.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I don't know what the numbers -are. I don't even talk to them about it. All I know is that they would owe me a lot of money, but I don't -- I'm not looking for money. I'd give it to charity.

Now, with the country, it's interesting because I'm the one that makes the decision, right? And, you know, that decision would have to go across my desk. And it's awfully strange to make a decision where I'm paying myself.

(END VIDEO CLIP) TREENE: OK, a few things to note there. One, he said that if he were to be awarded the money, "The New York Times" reporting it would be some $230 million from the Justice Department, presumably taxpayer dollars, that he would likely give it to charity. He said it is very strange, though. He said it's strange to make a decision where I'm paying myself. And in some ways that's kind of how this looks because note, many of the people, the key decision makers who would be the ones deciding whether or not he actually receives these payments are Trump appointees. And some of them are actually the same people who represented him or his co-defendants in these cases. Just like, for example, Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche, he was representing the president, then his personal lawyer, on one of the cases that the president has filed these claims for.

So, that's where a lot of these ethical issues come to the forefront. And I think as well, in addition to all of that, there's a lot of political questions about this as well. And the timing of this is not really politically great for the president, particularly -- you heard Fetterman say this, but particularly in the middle of a government shutdown when thousands of people have been furloughed or permanently laid off, struggling to make ends meet.

[09:15:08]

It's not a great time for this. And there's a lot of questions of whether this is actually something the president and his Justice Department will try to move forward with, or table until he's out of office.

SIDNER: Yes, to hear that $230 million number, and then you see juxtaposed with the pictures of federal workers in line at food banks, hard one to swallow politically.

Alayna Treene, thank you so much.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Definitely more to follow up on that one.

And also this breaking overnight. A man is now in custody after ramming his car into the gates -- one of the gates right outside of the White House. What was he trying to do? We have new details on what is now this investigation.

Plus, car loan crisis in America right now. And the alarm bells it's setting off about the broader U.S. economy.

And there is new security footage just in of the moment a suspect breaks into a daycare, douses the whole thing with gasoline, and sets it on fire.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:20:22]

BERMAN: There's something of a flashing warning sign this morning for the U.S. economy. A certain group of Americans, borrowers, struggling to make their monthly car payments.

CNN's Matt Egan here with some of the details.

Who are we talking about?

MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yes, well, we're talking about subprime borrowers, which are people who have lower credit scores. And this is a concerning trend because historically people have prioritized car payments over just about everything else, right? You need your car to get to work to take care of your family. But some people are falling behind.

Look at this, 6.4 percent of subprime borrowers are 60 days or more late. That's higher than during Covid. Higher than during the 2008 financial crisis. The second highest reading on records that go back to the early 1990s. The only time it was higher was January of this year.

Now, this isn't a brand-new trend. These delinquencies have been elevated for the past two years or so. But this is getting some more attention because there's a subprime lender in Texas that went bankrupt, and that was rattling investors.

So, why is this happening? Well, part of this is just because life is very expensive right now, right, groceries, daycare, rent, mortgage payment. But it's also because owning a car is really expensive right now.

Look at this. You're looking at average monthly payment on a new car loan. Almost half of those new loans have payments of $700 or more per month. And --

BERMAN: That's a lot of money.

EGAN: It is. And a significant amount are actually above $1,000 a month.

But then there's also the cost of just having a car, right? Car insurance has gotten much more expensive over the past year. Look at this, five percent. And car repair, 15 percent increase over the past year. And we know that car parts are exposed to the president's tariffs. So, this just shows the pressure that some consumers are under.

Now, the fact that some people are falling behind on their car loans, this has been good for the repo business. Car repossessions last year, almost 2 million, the highest since 2009 during the Great Recession. And I talked to the owner of a car repossession business in Texas. And he said, look, business has been good. He described it as a target rich environment at this moment.

So, John, look, bottom line, I don't see this as a brand new warning sign for the economy. It's actually been one that's been staring us in the face for a bit. But it does make you wonder, if this many people are behind on their car loans now, what happens if unemployment spikes or the market plunges or both? BERMAN: I will say, you never want to see the repo business. God bless

the repo business, but you never want to see them doing well because back in 2009, you know how troubled the economy was. And when people aren't paying their loans, it affects the lenders. That affects the banks above them. It really can have a ripple effect in throughout the whole economy.

EGAN: It can.

BERMAN: Matt Egan, thank you.

EGAN: Thank you, John.

BERMAN: I can't see who's behind the camera over there. It's Kate.

BOLDUAN: It's me.

I'll take it. Thank you, sir.

BERMAN: Hi, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Hello, John. The studio is that big, guys.

New this morning, three weeks into the government shutdown, and it is impacting so many federal programs, including the CDC's ability to monitor viruses. Now, this comes at a time also when public health staffing has already been cut and reduced, and respiratory virus season is now upon us.

CNN's Meg Tirrell is tracking this one for us.

So, what is the impact of this?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the main thing that we're seeing down right now is the flu, Covid, RSV, the respiratory viruses. And as we get into this season, typically we're looking at weekly updates from the CDC on these kinds of things.

BOLDUAN: Right.

TIRRELL: We're looking at E.R. visits, hospitalizations, all of those things. Now we are not seeing updated since the end of September. We're also not seeing wastewater tracking. So, that's a passive way of seeing just how much virus is out there. You can see these CDC pages and that they haven't been updated since the end of September. Also their flu view. That really gives a very detailed look at how much flu is circulating, where, what variants are out there. So, this is really, really important stuff.

One thing we should note that is getting updated right now are measles cases. And I just heard back from the HHS just before this who noted that the measles response is an active public health intervention, which is classified under law as an accepted activity. So, we are actually seeing new counts of measles cases. And you can see there, we had, of course, that huge Texas outbreak earlier in the year. But we are seeing several active outbreaks right now. They're still tracking that.

We should note, Kate, though, it's really problematic for respiratory virus season because the CDC is forecasting we're going to have a similar season this year, as we did last year for things like flu, Covid and RSV.

BOLDUAN: And that was rough.

TIRRELL: Those killed tens of thousands of Americans if you look at the estimates from last season. So, it's quite nerve wracking to not have the full picture right now.

BOLDUAN: What's lost -- just when you look at it like, people will be like, OK, so they're not updating a website. What's lost when they aren't?

TIRRELL: Yes, so, for example, states are still keeping track of these things. So, if you look at something like Respiratory Syncytial Virus, or RSV, Florida, for example, on its website has activity.

[09:25:06]

And typically this begins in the southern part of the country and then moves to the rest. And so you might see states preparing their own hospitals, clinics and E.R.s based on what the CDC is putting together on a national basis. And they don't have that right now. So, you do have the state data, but you don't have that national coordination and analysis that public health experts are used to relying on to get ready for the season that's coming.

BOLDUAN: Which is really also one of the -- one of the real jobs of HHS and CDC is to be that national coordinator of these efforts.

TIRRELL: Yes.

BOLDUAN: Thank you so much, Meg.

TIRRELL: Thanks.

BOLDUAN: Sara.

SIDNER: All right, going from the football gridiron to thrills of amusement parks. How Travis Kelce is teaming up with investors to take on the twists and turns at Six Flags.

And we're just minutes away from the opening bell on Wall Street. You can see a mixed bag there. Markets have seen very little change though this morning. Netflix stock dropped during after hours trading yesterday as the streaming giant posted a third quarter miss on their profit and revenue expectations. At the same time, gold prices falling, actually following their huge record-breaking rally. The largest selloff in over a decade of the precious metal comes as uneasiness is growing over what may come for next week's high stakes trade talks between the United States and China. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)