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Poll Numbers for the President; New York Candidates Trade Jabs; William Taylor is Interviewed about Sanctions on Russia; John Garder is Interviewed about National Parks; Tracking Drug Trade in South America. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired October 23, 2025 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: What are we talking about? We're talking about new lows for Donald Trump. He's hit new lows for himself. Trump's economic net approval rating hits lows with these pollsters. CNBC, look at this, down now minus 13 points on the net approval rating on the economy. You come to this side of the screen, it's minus 19 points among Quinnipiac. And keep in mind, we're talking about hitting record lows for Donald Trump in either his first term, which of course ended back in 2021, or his second term, which is ongoing right now. The bottom line is, Donald Trump is at the lowest point ever in either of his terms.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: But compare it to presidents historically.

ENTEN: Yes, let's take a look at this. Donald Trump is beating himself in the way you don't want to beat yourself, record lows. But let's compare it to other presidents.

Well, let's take a look here. OK, worst economic net approval ratings at this point among presidents since 1977. And the presidency, right, this is a new Donald Trump presidency, look at this, he's the worst for any presidency at this point. How about the second term, come to this side of the screen. Of course, Trump's in his second term. He's the worst for any president at their second term at this point.

So, Donald Trump isn't just beating himself with record lows. This is the lowest for any president ever at this point in either a presidency or for a second term. Donald Trump's setting the types of records you, simply put, do not want to set.

BOLDUAN: How could the shutdown impact this? What are you looking at with this?

ENTEN: Yes, OK. So, you see that Donald Trump is right now at the trough in terms of his net approval rating on the economy. Well, if there's any economic blame to go around because of the shutdown, blame for any economic pain caused by the shutdown. Well, look at this. Trump and the GOP gets 53 percent. You see Democrats here at 37 percent. Among independents, that key part in the center of the electorate, they're even more likely to blame Trump and the GOP at 58 percent versus 21 percent for the Dems. So, the bottom line is this, ahead of this key inflation report

tomorrow, right now the grade for Donald Trump among the American people is really an f, at least compared to other presidents. And if the shutdown causes any more pain, that f could somehow become even worse. And I think the key question is, will that report tomorrow show Donald Trump in a worse position? Well, we'll just have to wait and see and find out, because at this particular point, the polling suggests that that inflation report tomorrow, if it follows the polls, will be, let's just say, not so hot to trot. But there's a reason why we'll get that inflation report because that will be real data. This is polling data, which is often reflected in the real data. But we'll just have to wait and see.

BOLDUAN: And the real data will come. Thank you so much, Harry.

ENTEN: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Early voting in New York's mayoral race begins this weekend. Last night, the candidates had their final debate, and the attacks were strong. Former Governor Andrew Cuomo and Republican Nominee Curtis Sliwa went after -- sort of ganged up on frontrunner Democrat Zohran Mamdani at times, blasting his lack of experience. Mamdani fought back against claims he won't be able to stand up to President Trump.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: Donald Trump ran on three promises. He ran on creating the single largest deportation force in American history. He ran on going after his political enemies. And he ran on lowering the cost of living. If he wants to talk to me about the third piece of that agenda, I will always be ready and willing. But if he wants to talk about how to pursue the first and second piece of that agenda at the expense of New Yorkers, I will fight him every single step of the way.

ANDREW CUOMO, (I), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: Donald Trump, I believe, wants Mamdani. That is his dream. because he will use him politically all across the country. And he will take over New York City. Make no mistake, it will be President Trump and mayor Trump, and he will come in and take over the city.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Joining us now, former mayor of New York City, Bill de Blasio, who has endorsed Mamdani, and CNN political commentator S.E. Cupp.

First to you, Mayor.

You hear this sort of attack on Mamdani's experience. And there was a moment where Mamdani said, look, we've experienced your experience, Mr. Cuomo, and we didn't like it. How do you think he did?

BILL DE BLASIO (D), FORMER NEW YORK MAYOR: You know the famous saying, if you come for the king, you best not miss. Cuomo tried to take down the frontrunner and he couldn't do it. That's the bottom line on this debate.

Zohran managed to hold his own. But in that exchange you saw about Trump, Cuomo inadvertently told New Yorkers that Zohran is the better anti-Trump candidate. And that's what New Yorkers want to hear, who's going to defend us against President Trump trying to come into our city and hurt our people?

So, the irony is, Cuomo's, quote/unquote, experience kind of clouds his judgment. And I thought Zohran did a great job of saying, here's what your experience meant. It meant harassing 13 women. He had one of the women who was harassed, Charlotte Bennett, right there in the front row.

SIDNER: Yes, Charlotte Bennett.

DE BLASIO: It meant sending seniors to their death during Covid. So, I don't know why Cuomo keeps coming back to experience, when, in fact, he's setting a trap for himself. In the end, that debate just left Zohran the frontrunner once again.

SIDNER: S.E., is that how you see it? And we'll get, in a minute, to the issue of harassment.

S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No. And, you know, I've been covering this -- this race, and I have not seen this race really change over the past few months.

[08:35:03]

I thought last night's debate might have changed the race.

All of the attacks that Zohran laid against Cuomo were good. They were good attacks, as Bill said. But these were laying into things that voters already know about Andrew Cuomo, his corruption, his, you know, his scandals, the sexual harassment.

What Cuomo and Sliwa were able to do last night, which they had not been able to do before, was really land attacks, with some help by the moderators, on -- on his experience. And I saw Zohran Mamdani flustered for the first time in this entire race and really kind of back on his heels.

Now, if you were just tuning in to this election for the first time at this debate, which we know a lot of voters just tune in when the debates start, I don't know that you saw a confident Zohran Mamdani. I think you saw someone who couldn't answer some questions. And I think when we get some polling, we're going to see this race is a little tighter than it was before.

SIDNER: Interesting. There are a lot of people commenting. They thought that Cuomo was at least more energized than he was in the first debate.

I do want to talk about the tense moment when Andrew Cuomo did face questions from both Mamdani and Sliwa on those harassment allegations that ended his time as governor.

Let's listen to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CURTIS SLIWA (R), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: Do you ever know that no means no. You know what no means?

ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: One of those women, Charlotte Bennett, is here in the audience this evening.

What do you say to the 13 women that you sexually harassed?

ANDREW CUOMO (I), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: If you want to be in government, then you have to be serious and mature. There were allegations of sexual harassment. They were then -- went to five district attorneys, fully litigated for four years. The cases were dropped, right? You know that as a fact. So, everything you just stated -- you just said was a misstatement, which we're accustomed to -- from --

MAMDANI: Everything that I stated was a misstatement?

CUOMO: Yes, because the cases -- the cases were dropped. That's what happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: S.E., I'm curious what you thought of that exchange and what you thought about the Mamdani campaign inviting one of the accusers to the debate?

CUPP: Very strategic. Very smart. This is part of Andrew Cuomo's baggage. And it's why his unfavorables are so high. And to, as he has done, dismiss 13, not one, not two, not three, not four, 13 accusations of sexual harassment is -- is so unfair to voters. And the way he doesn't take this seriously I think really damages him. And it's a hard thing for him to get around because he can't message it very well. He's just denying it. And I don't think anyone in New York or anywhere else believes that 13 people are all lying about who you are and what you've done.

SIDNER: I see you shaking your head, so I'm going to move on to -- to the next big sort of moment. And it was Mamdani facing questions from -- that have been sort of percolating from some of the voters in New York, the Jewish community in particular, about his ability to combat anti-Semitism in this city. That seemed to come up again and again during this campaign.

I want to play what Cuomo and Sliwa said to Mamdani on that issue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ANDREW CUOMO (I), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: It doesn't -- it doesn't justify leaders who stoke the flames of hatred against Jewish people, which is what Zohran does, in my opinion.

CURTIS SLIWA (R), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: You've got a lot of explaining to do. A lot of apologizing to do. My sons are afraid. Their family, their friends, many in the Jewish community are concerned if you become mayor because they don't think, when anti- Semitism rears its ugly head, which it's now doing more than ever before, that you will have the ability to come in and put out those flames of hate.

ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK MAYORAL NOMINEE: I do still want to be the mayor that will keep your sons safe, that will keep every single New Yorker safe. And it is my job to not only deliver on that commitment, but also to ensure that New Yorkers feel it every single day that they live in this city.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Mayor, was that a robust enough answer to the question?

DE BLASIO: It was a good answer, but I think he has more to do. I mean, Zohran's been out in synagogues. He's been meeting with Jewish leaders. He's made very clear he will support and protect the community here in New York City. But I think he has to do more because people just need to feel it in their bones.

Now, that said, he's not the divisive one here. What Cuomo was saying on that debate stage was an attempt to divide New Yorkers, to get people to vote out of fear. And the Cuomo campaign put out last night a video that was just downright racist and fearmongering.

SIDNER: Yes. It was --

[08:40:02]

DE BLASIO: I've never seen anything like that in a New York City mayoral race. Fear doesn't win elections in the end. New Yorkers are actually disgusted by that attempt to divide.

SIDNER: Yes, there was an A.I. video that was put out by the Cuomo campaign. It was taken down, but it did show a lot of stereotypes of black men. And it was -- it was roundly criticized, and it ended up being taken -- taken down. So, that is, though, still out there, and people are going to see it.

Mayor Bill de Blasio, thank you so much.

DE BLASIO: Thank you.

SIDNER: And to you, S.E. Cupp. It is always a pleasure.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Happening right now, we're going to show you -- we will show you a live look at oil prices, I hope. They are soaring right now. They are spiking this morning as traders are worrying about a squeeze on the global supply due to brand new sanctions placed on Russia by the United States, by the Trump administration, over the war in Ukraine.

The sanctions are hitting Russia's two largest oil companies, and you also now have the president calling on Moscow to agree to an immediate ceasefire.

Russia is responding to all of this overnight, calling the move, the sanctions, "entirely counterproductive." So far, no word from the Russian president, though, himself. So, stand by to stand by on that.

Also breaking overnight, the European Union hitting Russia with sanctions of its own. The 19th such sanctions package. This time including a ban on Russian liquefied gas imports. So, they are -- there is a lot going on, on this front. What impact will it have?

Joining us right now is a former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, William Taylor.

It's good to see you again, Ambassador.

These new U.S. sanctions, seen as among the most significant measures the United States has taken against Russian energy since the beginning of this war. Do you think they will be effective -- effective enough to change the course of things and potentially bring Putin to the table?

WILLIAMS TAYLOR, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE: OK, they are part of what's going to be taken -- what's going to be necessary to bring Putin to the table. Yes, these are the first sanctions that the administration -- this administration has put on. And they can be effective. We've already seen that some of the market reaction to indicate that they are effective, that they are going to have an effect on these two big Russian oil companies.

These oil companies provide the revenues for the Russians to continue the war against Ukraine. And so putting pressure on Putin to come to the table with these sanctions is a first step. It's not going to be the only thing that's necessary. What also is necessary is what they all have been talking about in terms of weapons for the Ukrainians. It's a combination of -- of economic and military pressure to put on Putin to bring him to the table.

BOLDUAN: I also keep hearing that the real key is to putting the squeeze on Russia is secondary sanctions, sanctions that would target other countries, other countries that want to continue doing business with Russia, preventing them from doing business with Russia. If that's still kind of the thing -- I mean this has been talked about for months and months and months as the most effective thing to bring the pain to Russia, why do you think that President Trump is still hesitating or dancing around that?

TAYLOR: And he has put those secondary tariffs on one big purchaser of Russian oil, India. What he has not done is put it -- put those secondary tariffs on purchases of oil on China. That would be a big signal. That would be a big blow to the revenues going into the Russian treasury. That does the same thing that putting sanctions on these Russian oil companies would do.

Yes, that needs to happen. That would be the proper move to -- if we're serious about getting the Russians to come to the table and stop this war.

BOLDUAN: Ambassador, the president this -- said last week -- President Trump said last week that he was excited and kind of planning on having another face to face with Vladimir -- with Vladimir Putin. Now, Trump says he's canceling it and he's not.

There's also all of this reporting about Trump's meeting with Zelenskyy and how it kind of went south at -- in -- and it became very tense with the president insisting Ukraine make territorial concessions to Russia in order to end the war. It does keep coming back to this. Where do you think this goes?

TAYLOR: So, Kate, I think what we saw, in that description of last week's meeting, was interesting in that President Trump came out of that recognizing what Zelenskyy had said. He had -- he had said, we need to go for a ceasefire, stop in place. That's what President Trump has come out of that meeting saying.

BOLDUAN: Very interesting.

It's great to see you, Ambassador. Thank you so much for coming in.

Still ahead for us, a family rescued after being stranded on an island after their boat caught fire. How they are doing now. We've got an update for you.

And the head of the NFL standing by Bad Bunny. The league's leader now weighing in on some of the criticism that came after announcing next year's Super Bowl halftime show.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:48:53]

SIDNER: Advocates for America's national parks are urging the interior secretary to close them for now, warning that the government shutdown is leading to some serious and dangerous issues. CNN is learning that law enforcement is investigating after a stone wall at Gettysburg National Military Park, an iconic battlefield, was damaged. You can see the images there. At Yosemite National Park in California there are reports now of people flying drones and base jumping. These actions are illegal and potentially dangerous.

Joining me now is John Garder with the National Parks Conservation Association.

Thank you for being here this morning.

I'm just, from you, what is your biggest concern as this shutdown drags on and these national parks are partially still open.

JOHN GARDER, SENIOR DIRECTOR OF BUDGET AND APPROPRIATIONS, NATIONAL PARKS CONSERVATION ASSOCIATION: Yes. Thanks so much for having us on, Sara.

So, we are very concerned about what this means for the protection of park resources. The examples you gave, you know, of the destruction of a stone wall at hallowed ground, you know, where more than 10,000 people died is just really shameful. And then people doing things like base jumping and, you know, landing in Yosemite Valley, which is a very sensitive ecosystem.

[08:50:01]

And there are other examples where there is, for example, trash and -- strewn along the roadway and what that means for wildlife, like bears, who could become habituated to that sort of thing, which is dangerous for wildlife and dangerous for visitors.

You know, keeping parks open with using fees and just trying to manage with bare bones staff is completely irresponsible. And these are just a couple of examples. And we're worried about what this means. Also for the safety of visitors. You know, when people go and search and rescue times are delayed, that's a -- that's a major concern.

SIDNER: Are some parks able to manage better than others? I mean, Obviously, some parks have very different terrain and are huge in comparison. What are you hearing on that front?

GARDER: Yes, it really varies. You know, each park is different. There are a number of smaller, historic parks, and they're totally shuttered. And that's very unfortunate for visitors who want to go and learn about our history. But those are, you know, better protected.

In some places there is a lot more visitation, you know, and that -- that is actually creating a lot of worry just among the park staff, but also local businesses that rely on millions of visitors who are going out to enjoy leaf peeping. And we've seen at Acadia just traffic jams that creates a danger for visitors. In some cases it might be a little more orderly because they're just getting some help from the states or getting some help from -- from, you know, park partners. But it really varies. And the longer this goes on, the harder it's going to be to really try to manage this very chaotic situation.

SIDNER: Can you give us some sense of just how much staff is there and how, you know, how many people are missing? In other words, the smallness of the number of people who are there who can help you if you're in trouble or who are, you know, are able to -- to keep things slightly moving.

GARDER: Yes. There's about more than 9,000 staff, almost two-thirds of the remaining park service workforce that have been furloughed. And some portion of those are in parks paid for through fees or because they've been deemed what they used to call essential. But that is -- that is very bare bones to just try to ensure that some level of visitor safety operate wastewater treatment plants and things that are, you know, really dangerous to wildlife and human health if there aren't people to operate them.

But your people who are normally out there to just talk to visitors, ensure that they are not making bad decisions, none of those people are there.

SIDNER: What would you say to visitors who are planning to go to these parks, perhaps this weekend? What is your message to them?

GARDER: Yes, we understand people want to visit our parks, right? They're amazing places.

SIDNER: Yes.

GARDER: Which is why they should be open. Which is why the shutdown needs to end. But also why the administration needs to stop cutting staff, which they'd been doing prior to this. They were already whittled down just to 25 percent, more than 4,000 people who were lost during -- just since January. We would tell people, you -- it's worth considering rescheduling your park vacation. We're worried about your safety. We're, you know, worried about the impact this has on a beleaguered park service for the reasons I mentioned. But if you do go, make good decisions. Don't get near wildlife. Don't go on hikes that you shouldn't be going on. Be nice to those park service staff who are just really in a terrible situation.

SIDNER: John Garder, I do appreciate you coming on and talking us through that this morning. Thank you.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: So, the Coast Guard rescues a family -- has rescued a family of three off a small island that is near Cape Cod, actually, after they were trapped for nearly -- and stuck there for nearly two days. The family's boat caught fire. They were able to safely swim ashore -- to the shore, thankfully. A relative called police when they did not return at the time that they said they would. But it was the boat's marine radio that really saved them. It happened to wash ashore after the fire, and the family was able to use it to issue a mayday call to the Coast Guard. Can you imagine?

And also new this morning, the NCAA has approved a rule change that will allow student athletes to bet on professional sports. This does not change the NCAA's rule prohibiting bets on college competitions. Only pro sports. It also prohibits student athletes from spreading information about college competitions to bettors. The new rule is set to take effect November 1st.

The commissioner of the NFL says he's sticking with Bad Bunny as a performer for the next Super Bowl halftime show despite some of the backlash that came, especially in the MAGA world. Roger Goodell says he's not going to be replacing the Puerto Rican superstar.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROGER GOODELL, NFL COMMISSIONER: He's one of the leading and most popular entertainers in the world. [08:55:00]

That's -- that's what we try to achieve. It's an important stage for us. It's an important element to the entertainment value. It's carefully thought through. I would say that I'm not sure we've ever selected an artist where we didn't have some blowback or criticism.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Super Bowl 60 is set for February 8th. That is a true statement.

SIDNER: Yes, that it.

BOLDUAN: There is always -- I mean Goodell's got -- always taking heat for something when it comes to (INAUDIBLE).

SIDNER: They're always booing him. Like, you know what I mean, he's always taking heat. So --

BOLDUAN: Roger Goodell, he's ready to take that heat.

SIDNER: He is. He's taking a stance.

Thank you, Kate.

All right, the U.S. military is expanding its strikes against what they say are drug traffickers. Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth announcing they sunk two boats now in the eastern Pacific this week, killing everyone on board. That followed seven known strikes on alleged drug running boats in the Caribbean Sea in recent months. At least 37 people have been killed, but the latest strike left two survivors.

And CNN's David Culver went to South America and was able to talk to the family of one of those survivors.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID CULVER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): In this small Ecuadorian coastal town, nearly everyone knows someone who has left for work and never come back.

(Speaking in foreign language).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (Speaking in foreign language)

CULVER: This is all her brother, Andres (ph), clothes. The mattress where he slept up until nearly a year ago. She says he was desperate for work. That he was concerned about providing for his six kids. And he said he needed to go to work. And like many in this small coastal town, he is a fisherman. The thing is, and this is what she found odd, he left behind all of his fishing gear.

She says he's a good person and that was just trying to make ends meet. President Trump says your brother is a terrorist.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (Speaking in foreign language).

CULVER (voice over): Her brother, Andres Tuvino Chila (ph), isn't a stranger to U.S. law enforcement. Court records show he was arrested, convicted and jailed in 2020 for smuggling drugs off Mexico's coast before being deported. Now, after surviving the latest U.S. strike on a suspected drug vessel in the Caribbean, he's believed to be back in Ecuador and free. Officials here say they have no evidence he broke local laws and released him.

Yet his case has put a spotlight on a broader question, who and what exactly are these U.S. strikes trying to stop? Since early September, the U.S. has carried out at least seven strikes off Venezuela's coast. The Trump administration says they're about saving American lives from drug overdoses. Yet most U.S. overdose deaths aren't from cocaine, they're from fentanyl, largely produced in Mexico and smuggled over the border, often by U.S. citizens.

It's not clear where exactly the U.S. has been targeting suspected drug running boats, but our analysis of U.S. military flight data shows dozens of surveillance flights just north of Venezuela in the Caribbean, far from Ecuador's shores, where cocaine from Colombia in the north and Peru in the south pours in before moving out to sea using Ecuador essentially as a transit hub to the Pacific. This is how about 70 percent of the world's cocaine supply gets to the U.S. and Europe and beyond.

And the drug runners, the ones risking it all at sea, mostly are not gang members. They're fishermen, often seen as expendable by the gangs that control them. Ecuadorian officials say they're also cracking down, even with limited resources.

Still, many here say the trade feels impossible to escape.

CULVER: When you ask them about the amount of involvement in narco and drug trafficking, some are hesitant to disclose it.

He says, as he looks at it, probably 25 to 30 percent are working in illicit drug trafficking.

CULVER (voice over): Some say they have no choice. In 2023, gangs ambushed a fishing village in the north, targeting those who refused to pay extortion. Nine were killed, dozens wounded.

Others say the money makes it worth the risk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We put a box in the hull of the boat to hide the drugs. As a fisherman, I could make $300 a month. But doing an illegal run up to just off the coast of Mexico, I can make $30,000 to $60,000 a month. It's good money.

CULVER (voice over): If you survive the trip.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (Speaking in foreign language). CULVER (voice over): Since 2024, Solanda Bermello's group has documented more than 2,800 Ecuadorian fishermen missing, dead or detained abroad. These women, some two dozen who wanted to share their stories with us, know their loved ones broke the law, but they also know why.

SOLANDA BERMELLO, MOTHER OF DETAINED FISHERMAN (through translator).

CULVER (voice over): "We don't have work. We don't have any way to support ourselves," she says.

[09:00:00]

As the U.S. strikes continue far from these shores, the ones caught in the crossfire are rarely cartel leaders, but the men who take the risk for them.