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Source: Several Shot Near WH, Including at Least One National Guardsman; DHS: Two National Guardsmen Shot Near WH; Police Say Suspect in Custody. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired November 26, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN HOST: ... tourists generally should approach the security situation in a place like D.C., whereas you mentioned, there are many different security apparatuses here. There are very -- there are lots of moving parts in terms of agencies that might respond to a situation like this. What should tourists be thinking about as they -- as they come here to Washington?

CHIEF CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: You know, for the normal tourists, I mean, you know, you -- you just enjoy the city. I mean, there are obviously going to be some areas that, you know, you're going to see heightened security around the White House, for an example. But for the most part, tourists just -- they just come, they visit, they -- they visit with Smithsonian's, they -- they walk by the White House, grab a couple of photographs and so forth.

But -- I mean, it's a -- it's not a difficult town to get around in. And even though there's a heavy police presence there because of so many different agencies, and it is our nation's capital, it's not as if it interferes with anything, unless you go into one of the secure buildings, like White House, Capitol and places like that. But just an average tourist, there's really -- they just move around.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Yes. We're now joined by CNN Senior Law Enforcement Analyst, Andrew McCabe, a former FBI Deputy Director.

Andy, we are just learning from our -- our producer that the scene has been secured. This is 17th and I, one block from the White House. There is a suspect currently in custody. Obviously, we have very limited details, just that several people were hurt. At least one member of the U.S. National Guard has been shot.

Can you give us a sense of how an investigation like this begins, essentially? We have a suspect in custody, but now is when some of the real work begins.

CHIEF CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes, absolutely. So, especially if we go back maybe half an hour or so before we -- before we learn this, just knowing there's been a shooting in that area, as Chief pointed out, you've got so many different agencies that are overlapping each other in this space.

D.C. Metro PD, clearly in the lead here. This is their turf, but you're in between the White House, where you have Secret Service, you've got Park Police. They have locations that they're responsible for all over the city. You've got the other federal agencies like the FBI. So, there's -- there's a -- the capability of a massive response. And usually, I've seen it in -- in responding to many situations in D.C., you get an over-response. People -- officers on the streets self-deploy to the area around the -- around the spot because they want to be helpful and they want to -- that they want to be able to kind of see what they can -- you know, see what they can accomplish.

And that's not a -- that can be challenging with traffic and getting -- if you have medevac issues, it's tough to get ambulances in and out of there. But for this, where you're looking for a subject, the more law enforcement, you know, eyeballs that you can put on that problem, the better off you are.

So, this is also an area where there is an extraordinarily high degree of video capture. Most of that is private businesses, residences, things like that. We'll have a street facing video capture. And so, one of the first things you'll see law enforcement do is immediately start hitting the businesses in that area, that 17th and I intersection to try and see if they can get video of the suspect. That can lead to a description and can put you in the position that we appear to be in now.

We don't know if it's video that led them to this person or maybe eyewitnesses people on the scene who may have seen things and been able to provide information, but it's great news that they have someone in custody they think is responsible. That will certainly tone down what could have been a very problematic manhunt in the nation's capital on the day before Thanksgiving.

We should also say it's a tough time actually to be in the city because so many folks are trying to leave early to get home to Maryland, to Northern Virginia and other -- other nearby places where government workers and people who work in D.C. typically reside.

So, around this time of day, three, four o'clock in the afternoon, you're going to see a massive traffic jams just normally because it's the day before the holidays. All that could -- could really complicate the investigative efforts here.

JIMENEZ: And Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem now posting that two National Guardsmen were shot as part of this, saying, "Please join me in praying for the two National Guardsmen who were just shot moments ago in Washington, D.C. The Department of Homeland Security is working with local law enforcement to gather more information." Again, we just saw that from a -- from a post from the Homeland Security Secretary.

But Andy McCabe, question for you is, look, National Guard was -- was deployed here to Washington, D.C. as part of the President's -- the President's push here.

[15:05:09]

But also, why -- can you just talk a little bit about the type of personnel that would typically be outside the White House in a spot like this? Again, a block from the White House, but in -- in that area on a day like this, you have National Guardsmen, but obviously you would have police officers. Just -- just what would the scene typically be like?

MCCABE: You know, Omar, typically, it's going to be -- it's a super crowded area of the city. You've got to the south and east just a little bit, you have the whole White House compound, right? Where you have the White House itself, the East Wing, the West Wing, the mansion. You've got the old executive office building next door. You've got the, what is it, the Treasury on the other side. You've got the -- the Ellipse, Lafayette Square, all these kind of square block areas that are part of the White House. All of that is patrolled by the Secret Service Uniform Division.

So, you've got Secret Service marked vehicles, uniform-wearing, gun- carrying agents, really saturating that area, especially any places that might be, might give someone access to the White House compound. Now, in addition to that, if you go north of the 17 and I corridor, you cross K Street, now you're into really like the commercial center of D.C.. All of the law firms, the accounting firms, the lobbying firms, major corporate offices are all right in there on that, like, K Street corridor, L Street, all those areas going up Constitution Avenue into the more northern part of the city.

So, tons of office workers, professionals, people who are leaving their offices on foot, trying to make their way to the Metro train or -- or, you know, going down into the garage and -- and bringing their vehicles up onto the street. So, a lot -- a lot of traffic, a lot of crowds, a lot of chaos in there normally. In addition, you have all those other law enforcement entities that we talked about.

And any one of those entities, Park Police, FBI, Homeland Security could have units out in vehicles doing whatever businesses they have to do, just patrolling, conducting investigations. In the case of Homeland Security folks, conducting maybe immigration activity. So, it's a very dense kind of charged area, both with civilians, with the people like cabinet members and people who would be going in and out of the White House doing business and law enforcement.

So, that's -- that's why I think on our video now, you're seeing a lot of those different uniforms. Now -- so, add to this very confusing picture, the National Guard, who've been around in D.C. for a little while, so they're not quite as novel as they were in the first week or two. But these are folks who've basically been thrown into a pseudo law enforcement function, most of whom don't really have law enforcement backgrounds.

And that adds, I think, a real wildcard element to this thing. We don't really know how those folks would respond if confronted with a violent incident on the street with an armed person. So, there's a lot of variability, I think, in the -- in the -- in the platform here. And so, we'll have to just wait to see what -- what more facts develop from the investigation.

SANCHEZ: Very important perspective there, as we're getting a new vantage point of the scene, just about a block from the White House in Washington, D.C., where we've learned there's been a shooting. At least two National Guardsmen, according to DHS Secretary Kristi Noem, have been shot. Police say that a suspect is currently in custody. Unclear at this point whether those Guardsmen were actually targeted, whether they were responding to an already unfolding incident. Those details are being gathered as we speak, and we see a very large law enforcement presence there.

We've seen ATF, U.S. Marshals, FBI and, obviously, National Guard members.

Back to Chief Ramsey.

Chief, I wonder how investigators now go about determining whether those who were shot were targeted, whether this was a deliberate violent act.

RAMSEY: Well, that's something they may not know right away. I mean, it's going to take time. This is a brand-new investigation. They've got a lot of things they've got to sort out. As Andy mentioned, there's video that has to be recovered. There's interviews of witnesses that has to take place. If in fact they have the suspect in custody, obviously you're going to want to make sure that you at some point in time interrogate that person, but first you want to secure him.

We don't know, he could be one of the people shot. I mean, we just don't know a lot of information right now.

[15:10:03]

So, it's going to take a minute to sort this out, to figure out exactly what took place in this particular incident. And you see all these different agencies and the degree of response. And I heard Andy mentioned how, because you're in, you know, D.C. and you're so close to the White House, you know, you almost get an over response. And that's why it's very important for -- to take charge at these scenes, you know, have specific jobs for people to do and not just standing around.

I mean, there's a lot of work that's going to need to be done in this particular case. I would imagine between interviewing witnesses, recovering video, you know, securing individuals. If the suspect is wounded at the hospital, you got to guard there. You got to process the crime scene and hopefully they're not trampling all -- over the crime scene. I see tape up, but I'm not sure what the boundaries are.

But there are a lot of things going on right now. But -- at -- at this point in time, it looks like D.C. Police would probably be the lead agency. But if more information develops, one of the federal agencies like the FBI might take it over if there's a nexus of terrorism, for example, or something like that. But right now, it's a shooting on D.C. streets and D.C. Police would be the lead until we get more information.

JIMENEZ: Yes, and we're waiting for that more information right now. But again, as we know, at least from the Homeland Security Secretary, two National Guardsmen shot near the White House as police say a suspect is in custody.

You know, Chief Andy McCabe brought up something that at one point in time, seeing National Guard troops on the streets of D.C. would have been a little bit more unusual. It's become a little bit more of the norm over the past few months as troops from multiple states have been in D.C. as part of President Trump's anti-crime crackdown. But one of the dynamics that Andy McCabe was talking about was sort of, you know, usually on the streets, you see police officers, you might see federal agents that typically are more used to interfacing with the public or dealing with situations, unfortunately, like this.

We still don't know the circumstances here, but can you just tell us a little bit about how police are typically trained if there is a confrontation on the streets, if they run into a situation where someone may come up with a weapon and -- and where to go from there?

MCCABE: Well, I mean, obviously, you have the de-escalation training, you have use-of-force standards that are in place. You have all these things that are part of the training. If my memory serves me correct, the basic training for Metropolitan Police Department officers is somewhere around 800 hours of training.

And I'm not saying anything negative about the National Guardsmen. They have been deployed. They're doing what they've been asked to do. I see that they're armed. I don't know how much training they received in general because, you know, policing in urban areas is just different from what they're trained as part of the military. Now, having said that, we don't know the circumstances around this at all, so it's very difficult to say. But that's been a concern of mine early on.

I was in D.C. last week and I saw the National Guard -- some of the National Guardsmen, you know, walking down the street, you know, they were in groups of four and I spoke to them. They spoke to me. I mean, they were just -- it was just very casual. It was nothing out of the ordinary, because, you know, they've been there for so long now, people are starting to get -- kind of get used to it, at least in D.C. anyway.

But people in D.C. are just used to a whole lot of uniforms. I think there's something like 32 different agencies in -- in the District of Columbia. And even though I served there for about nine years, every now and then I'd see a police guard I had never seen before. So, it's just remarkable the number of agencies.

But right now, they all come together. And the one thing that's really unique about the National Capital Region is how closely federal and local agencies work together. This is not unusual. They come together all the time for a variety of things. So, it's pretty seamless when it comes to the scene, trying to figure out who's in charge of what.

You know, I've -- I've been there before. Remember in '98, we had the Capitol -- two officers in the U.S. Capitol that were shot and killed. You know, the D.C. Police actually were the lead agency because there was no nexus to terrorism. Now, we work very closely with the FBI, with the U.S. Capitol Police in that particular investigation, but the D.C. Police were the lead agency, even though it happened on Capitol grounds.

SANCHEZ: We're joined now by a former Secret Service agent, Jonathan Wackrow.

And -- and Jonathan, as you're hearing these details about two National Guardsmen shot near the White House and -- and a suspect now in custody, talk to us about the unique role of the Secret Service in responding to calls like this near the White House, a place that, as we heard from Chief Ramsey and Andrew McCabe, doesn't often see violent crime, but does occasionally see demonstrations.

[15:15:07]

I remember I was working at -- at the White House when someone set themselves on fire just on the South Lawn. So -- so, it is an area where there is activity and obviously a huge law enforcement presence.

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes, good afternoon, Boris.

You know, really the proximity to the White House in this incident does not necessarily indicate there was -- that there was any type of protective breach of the White House complex. But if you think about the way that the United States Secret Service and specifically the uniform division of the U.S. Secret Service, how they operate in concentric rings of protection that radiate out from the White House complex itself, this incident, the location, actually puts it within the zone of protection for the White House.

And because of that, you have multiple overlapping patrols by the uniform division within this area that are part of their daily routine, whether that's bike patrol, you know, patrols via motor, and foot patrols, all within this area, again, supplemented by U.S. Secret Service agents from our Washington field office who are also operating in a protective capacity. They would have been on scene immediately.

And if we see this video, you will see multiple U.S. Secret Service Uniform Division officers taking a position to cordon off the entire crime scene. They probably provided immediate assistance because they may have been one of the first peoples on site because of responding agencies on site, just because of their proximity to their, you know, area of patrol. So, the U.S. Secret Service is very used to working in close coordination, as Chief Ramsey had said, with other federal and local officials.

And to that point, they actually follow the rigor of an incident command system. So, at any time you have a critical event like this, the Joint Operational Command Center of the White House works very closely with Metropolitan Police and other law enforcement partners to coordinate the response to these critical events. The worst thing that could happen is you have an uncoordinated response where you risk a blue-on-blue situation where people are -- you know, responding agencies are intersecting with each other.

So, everyone knows in these -- in these moments what their roles and responsibilities are, especially around the White House complex where you just have so many responding law enforcement entities, you know, convening at once.

JIMENEZ: And Jonathan, you were talking about that coordination, obviously the proximity to the White House here, but just on our screen right now, we're seeing Metropolitan Police, we're seeing U.S. Marshals, we've seen ATF on scene. I mean, a number of different agencies that have responded here. How does that coordination actually happen? And then, once we actually see some of these folks from various agencies on scene, does everybody sort of go under the command of -- of one person to coordinate the actual response here, or does everyone break off into their individual sort of agency roles? How does that typically work in a situation like this?

WACKROW: So, it's a great question, and it's -- it's yes to both of your -- both of your questions in that part, and I'll explain why. In the emergent part of this, right, when you have everybody responding at once, typically the first agency on scene under the incident command structure becomes the incident commander. They're the shot callers. They're the ones that are vectoring in the right resources, you know, predicated on the situation at hand. How many -- how many people are injured? Is there a suspect in custody? Is there a suspect, you know, still on the loose? They're the ones that are putting out the information, and everyone is coming under that immediate incident command structure.

Once the emergent phase is over, and that can be, you know, immediately or it could be prolonged, but once that -- that second phase starts to kick in, you have the investigations that start, that's when people start breaking back into their roles, you know, specific to their agency. But right now, there's -- there's multiple things that are going on at once.

One, law enforcement on the scene, this coordinated effort, they're looking for who -- who's the shooter and the shooters, right? They're determining is -- is this still an active threat? Is there a broader concern here? Is there a regional wide concern here? They're quickly trying to figure out is the public still at risk?

And then from there, they're trying to figure out again, what is the motive? They want to understand, is this a targeted act against these members who are in uniform? Is it a targeted act against law enforcement at large? Is it a targeted towards any persons or asset locations in the region?

They're also quickly trying to find is there any video evidence. Right in that area, it's a high concentration of government-owned, city- owned and privately-owned video capture. So, they're going to try to figure out, you know, to answer that previous question, is this an isolated incident or are there more people involved? They're going to get -- they're going to start getting that from the immediate video response.

[15:20:03]

And then, broadly, if there is a suspect on the loose, this is now where the coordination aspect comes in, where you need to coordinate across a broader set of agencies, not just within the D.C. metropolitan area, but you may be bringing in law enforcement entities from Maryland and Northern Virginia, if you have a suspect on the loose.

So, there's a lot of things that are going on in the immediate moment, but, you know, as time goes on, that is when agencies will fall back into their traditional roles of -- you know, and then respond predicated upon the investigative nature of the event.

SANCHEZ: Yes, fortunately that last word from officials, a suspect is in custody and the scene is secure. Panel, please stand by because we're going to take a quick break. If you're just joining us, two National Guardsmen have been shot near the White House, just about a block away on 17th and I in Washington, D.C. We're going to bring you more details as we get them. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:25:22]

SANCHEZ: We're following breaking news on CNN. Several people have been shot just one block from the White House, and the Department of Homeland Security says the victims include two National Guardsmen, though it's unclear at this point whether they were directly targeted or responding to an incident.

JIMENEZ: Now, according to D.C. Metropolitan Police, one suspect is in custody, and Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt says President Trump, who is currently at Mar-a-Lago, has been briefed.

But I want to bring in CNN Senior White House Correspondent Kristen Holmes, who is live near Mar-a-Lago. Kristen, what are we hearing from the White House?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: We just got a comment from President Trump. This is the first time we've heard from the President himself. I've been talking to White House officials who've said they're monitoring this closely, they're aware of what's going on, and the President was briefed. This is what he posted just now on Truth Social: "The animal that shot the two National Guardsmen, with both being critically wounded, and now in two separate hospitals, is also severely wounded. But regardless, we'll pay a very steep price. God bless our great National Guard and all of our military and law enforcement. These are truly great people. I, as President of the United States, and everyone associated with the Office of the Presidency, am with you."

This clearly gives us more information than we had previously heard. And as I said, President Trump is being briefed on this regularly. He is now saying that, of the people shot, two of them were National Guard, which we knew, but he has here saying that both of them were critically wounded and are in separate hospital around the D.C. area, and saying that the third person who shot at the National Guardsmen is also severely wounded.

Part of the reason that they have been tracking this so closely is because President Trump is -- has been really adamant about bringing the National Guard to Washington, D.C. They've been there for months as part of a severe crime crackdown. And I do want to note here, any moment we expect to see Vice President J.D. Vance, who was already going to be delivering remarks at Fort Campbell in Kentucky. This is part of a Thanksgiving trip that he was doing to see the troops.

And now that President Trump has commented on this, I think it's very likely that the Vice President will also comment on this when he goes up there for those remarks. But clearly here, they are monitoring this very closely, and this is new information that the President is now sharing with the public.

SANCHEZ: Yes, and -- and we'll bring you Vance's remarks as they happen, and anything else that may come from the White House. Kristen, please stand by.

Let's actually go to CNN's Brian Todd, who is live on the scene there for us. Brian, I wonder what you're seeing from your vantage point.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Boris. Here's what I can show you from my vantage point. I'll just let our photojournalist, Joe Merkel, go past me here. We're in Downtown D.C., about a block and a half from the White House. These are Secret Service police officers basically telling people to try to clear this intersection. They're trying to get these cars away from this intersection as soon as possible, but it is real gridlock here on 18th Street. We're about a block and a half from the White House.

You can see beyond me here where the streets have been shut down. A lot of law enforcement presence here. I can tell you that, you know, as is typical in a situation like this, in this city, they have shut down city blocks for many square blocks at a time, and it took us a while just to get in position here, about a block and a half from the White House.

What we can tell you is that, according to Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem, two National Guardsmen were shot. The D.C. Police say that one suspect is in custody and that the scene is secure. That's according to the D.C. Police, according to Kristi Noem, and according to sources who are talking to CNN.

Now, our photojournalist, Joe Merkel, said that a witness to this said that she heard gunshots and that she saw two National Guardsmen getting CPR. That is one detail we can give you, according to a witness who spoke to a member of our team here, Joe Merkel. Again, they're trying to secure the scene. They are trying to move vehicles and people away from this scene so that they can just get some more clearance here, guys. That's what I can tell you from the scene here. We hope to get more information very shortly.

JIMENEZ: Yes, an active scene still behind Brian with some -- with some traffic moving by, but also blocked off.

I want to bring back in our panel as well. Jonathan Wackrow, former Secret Service agent, Chief Charles Ramsey, former Metro Police Chief and former Deputy FBI Director Andrew McCabe. Good to have all of you here.

Chief, I -- I want to start with you because we heard and saw some of Brian's report there that, yes, they had the -- the main portion of the scene, of course, that had investigative value blocked off.

[15:30:02]

But also trying to manage what was clearly a -- a fast-moving, leaving work traffic situation going on, on the other side of this ...