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Interview with Rep. Josh Gottheimer (D-NJ): Vance's Trip Overseas Postponed as U.S.-Iran Talks Delayed; Material Peeling Off Bottom of Reflecting Pool After $14 Million Renovation; Luigi Mangione's Legal Team Withdraws Psychiatric Defense. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired June 19, 2026 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: The universe bends towards justice. And he's like, look, Martin Luther King Jr. used that a lot, but it actually was from a minister in Boston. And it was during the time when it looked like abolitionists were losing and losing the fight.

Do you feel like we're in a similar scenario right now where things are being rolled back, rights are being rolled back, especially for Black folks voting rights?

DAVE CHAPPELLE, COMEDIAN AND ACTOR: I think that there's always going to be people that resist certain inevitabilities. The abolition of slavery was an inevitability. People demand to be free, and you can't keep them enslaved forever.

And I think there's always going to be someone who's just going to buy as much time as they can to satiate their greed or whatever it is inside them that makes them behave like that towards other humans.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SIDNER (on camera): You should know, Dave is a serious thinker, but he also did get funny. So we're going to bring more of that to you in the next hour.

And a new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The president's controversial intelligence pick criticized by Democrats and Republicans showed up to work early. We have new reporting on what he wants to change right away. One question might be, does he do pool maintenance?

The still green reflecting pool that was supposed to be blue now chunks of something are seen floating on the surface. Is that the new paint they just put in? We've got the very latest.

And then inches from disaster, a car just misses people on the sidewalk.

Kate is out today. I'm John Berman with Sara Sidner. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL. Sources tell CNN that President Trump's new acting director of

national intelligence, Bill Pulte, showed up to work a day early and asked for a list of every employee in the office so we could figure out who to fire. Hundreds of jobs potentially.

And one source says Pulte was no intelligence experience. Also raised alarm bells when he asked if he could bring the president's daily briefing book home.

Also this morning, that didn't take long. Signs that the just signed U.S.-Iran agreement could be on shaky ground. Vice President J.D. Vance has delayed his trip to Geneva where talks toward a final deal were supposed to begin today. A diplomat says Iran wants assurances that the fighting in Lebanon will stop before talks resume with the United States.

Now, there were new deadly attacks in Lebanon between Israel and Hezbollah overnight. Now, just in, a source says the U.S. has relayed to Iran that Israel will not further escalate its attacks -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right, thank you so much. Joining me now is Democratic Congressman Josh Gottheimer of New Jersey. He serves on the House Intelligence Committee. Thank you for being here this morning.

Look, it's very clear that these talks went south. Vice President Vance says that Congress will receive a formal briefing on the Iran agreement very soon. What are the questions that you have in your mind as you see things unraveling a bit here?

REP. JOSH GOTTHEIMER (D-NJ), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: Well, clearly, we have a right to a briefing and Congress, for the first time in this conflict, because they've continued to leave Congress out of it, should get an understanding of exactly what's in this deal. You know, the president came into office saying America needs great strength. This deal screams weakness.

You're seeing, obviously, the vice president's trip on hold. Lots of questions around what happened there. But behind the MOU, one of the biggest questions I have is, what exactly does America get here?

Because this is about our national security. Iran clearly has been a threat to our country, attacked and killed Americans, attacked our bases. They live under the banner of death to America.

So by giving them huge sanctions relief, plus some sort of $300 billion slush fund -- which I have a lot of questions where that money is coming from -- to help rebuild, plus being able to sell their oil around the world now, all in exchange for what appears to be reopening the Straits of Hormuz, which, as you know, when we started this conflict, was open. So we're getting back what we had in the beginning but unclear what we've gained when it comes to their nuclear program, their drone program, their ballistic missile program, their terror funding program. So I have lots of questions about, what does America get here for our strength and protecting our country against a regime that's clearly been our enemy?

[08:05:00]

And I don't know, it just screams weakness on every front.

SIDNER: Look, I remember back, I think in 2022, as you know, this looming Iran deal was sort of going forward. And you had some concerns in 2022 with a very different president. When you look back to the JCPOA, do you wish it was still in place?

Or do you think that had big faults as well?

GOTTHEIMER: No, I had very big concerns with the JCPOA, especially because it didn't address the Iran's terror program, which we saw in full effect with Hamas. We see it with Hezbollah now and Palestinian Islamic Jihad. So that never got addressed and they continue to fund terror, which obviously hurt our country and our bases and our service men and women.

So that was one of my big concerns then, it's not been addressed now. And one thing we've learned all throughout this whole process is that Iran lies, the regime there, the government does. Not only did they kill their own people and attack freedom and democracy, but they lie about their nuclear program and continue to.

They claim they were enriching back then for energy, which is a very low percent enrichment. They far went beyond that driving toward a nuclear weapon, which is why we are, of course, part of the reason why we're in this conflict in the first place. They lied then.

I have no reason to believe that they won't lie now about whatever they do. And President Trump saying, don't worry, they've told me they're not going to develop a nuclear weapon. They've given us assurances.

They gave the same assurances under the JCPOA. They've given the same assurances now for decades. They've continued to drive to have a nuclear weapon.

And now they've developed much more sophisticated ballistic missiles and drones and things that put Americans and our allies at risk. So you can't trust this Iranian regime. And it seems right now what we're doing is only losing and not gaining.

SIDNER: Let me shift gears here to what is happening with Bill Pulte. His first day as acting director of national intelligence. And we're learning from reporting that he has plans to reduce hundreds of jobs at ODNI.

What do you make of this? And are you concerned as you were on the Intel committee? Are you concerned about him going in as an acting?

He's not given the full job yet as an acting director and deciding who gets to stay and who has to leave.

GOTTHEIMER: I have deep concerns about that. You know, you don't show up on your first day on the job and just start firing people. And what you would do is you'd show up and say, even though he's obviously never had a serious clearance before or worked in the intelligence community before, which is part of the requirements of the job, you would spend time actually getting to know what we need and what we don't need, what's critical, what's not critical.

Or if there are areas that we don't need, you would study that and then make some recommendations. You'd come before the intelligence committee, which is obviously required, which is responsible for oversight and appropriations of resources. And you'd make your case.

You wouldn't just go in there and just start firing people left and right. And so I'm very concerned about that, especially at a time when we're still in the middle of a conflict in the Middle East, as we just talked about.

But we've got FIFA. We have the World Cup here on American soil and people want to make sure we can protect everybody who's visiting and, of course, Americans. So, yes, I have a lot of concerns. And if he's just been sent in there to just randomly fire people, that's going to put us, it weakens America's national security.

SIDNER: I do want to go to what we heard from President Trump. He did an interview and he was asked a question about presidential power, because I know you all have not gotten the same kind of briefings that you would normally get when the United States is at war. Here is what he said about how he views the power of the presidency.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What have you learned about not just the exercise of power, but the limits on your power as a result of the conflict?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There are no limits.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No limits.

TRUMP: No, not, I haven't learned that lesson yet. I know there are, but, you know, there are no limits.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: There are no limits to his presidential power. That is how he sees his office. How do you see it?

GOTTHEIMER: Well, I think the question is, as we celebrate our 250th, has America realized how we are, who we are? It's because we have separation of powers because we don't have a king, right? There's no despot here and we have appropriate checks.

So the president just can't go make whatever decision he wants to make without going to Congress and getting approval, without the courts holding him accountable.

[08:10:00]

I think he's seen accountability start to seep in and going back to this, this Iran MOU, you see Republicans now in the Senate, we've seen increasingly speaking out and questioning what the president is doing. I think you'll see the same thing here with DNI, because we know that there was the, Mr. Clayton, who's, as you know, right now been nominated. His hearing was canceled this week at the last minute, pulling the rug out underneath him, a qualified, I believe a very qualified and well-respected nominee for the director of national intelligence, right? Those are the kind of things where the Senate has to speak out. Republicans have to speak out, not just Democrats and make it clear, we have a responsibility just like he does to protect our country and he can't just go do whatever he wants.

So obviously that's an absurd statement and everybody in not just Congress, but I think the American people know that's an absurd statement.

SIDNER: Congressman Josh Gottheimer, it's a pleasure. Thank you so much for getting up early for us this morning. I do appreciate it.

GOTTHEIMER: Thanks.

SIDNER: All right, just ahead. First, there was green water. Now there are blue chunks, new details this morning on the reflecting pool problem that just keeps getting worse.

Plus, a new twist in accused CEO killer Luigi Mangione's case as lawyers now changing their defense plan in his state murder trial.

And a grave crime. Police are looking for a woman they say broke into a mausoleum to steal from the dead.

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SIDNER: New this morning, it went from gray to blue to algae green and now the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool is peeling, all after a $14 million no bid renovation ordered by President Trump. Large blue chunks of material were spotted floating in the water yesterday. This is after hundreds of gallons of hydrogen peroxide were dumped in to try to change the color back to what Trump wanted, which was American flag blue.

Let's go now to CNN's Betsy Kline. Betsy, what the heck is going on here?

BETSY KLEIN, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, Sara, we are tracking the nation's most closely watched chemical peel right now. Another issue coming to the surface for President Trump's $14 million project to repair and repaint the Lincoln Memorial reflecting pool that American flag blue. And now some blue material is peeling.

So yesterday, our CNN intern Abigail Rotersheimer went to the reflecting pool where she observed a flap of blue material that was partially attached to the bottom of the pool floating to the surface. Now, it's not clear if this was paint or if it was sealant. It's also not clear why it was peeling.

But we did speak with a pool infrastructure expert. He's the chairman of the Aquatic Council. He said there are plenty of reasons why coating could fail.

But the bigger question here is whether this is a localized issue or if they have a more systemic problem that they're going to have to deal with. The Interior Department has not responded to our request for comment on this. But all of this comes as the Trump administration has been dealing with this massive algae bloom in the reflecting pool.

They have deployed this state of the art technology, the ozone nanobubbler, as well as waste people in waders coming with a vacuum to hydro back that algae up. And we saw people dumping plastic gallons filled with hydrogen peroxide into the reflecting pool earlier this week. Now, there has been some improvement.

The Interior Department says that the water is, quote, crystal clear, but it is clearly still a very murky green. Now, algae has been an issue for this pool spanning multiple administrations, including back during the Obama administration, where they launched a $34 million renovation that did also lead to a massive algae bloom. And the conditions here are just perfect for this to be happening because, one, it is very hot, it is swampy here, this pool is very shallow and it has water from the Potomac River.

So all of that creating the conditions for this to be happening, but certainly not the optics that President Trump wanted heading into the country's 250th anniversary celebration just a few short days from now, Sara.

SIDNER: The way you described it almost made me burst out laughing, which is inappropriate, but the world is watching a chemical appeal happen in real time. Betsy Klein, thank you so much.

All right, breaking overnight. Dangerous weather. High water rescues underway after a supercharged storm system triggered deadly flooding across the South and there are more storms to come. We will get into all that.

Plus, the funny man gets serious. More of my conversation with comedian Dave Chappelle after he attended the grand opening of the Obama Presidential Center.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHAPPELLE: These are tough times, you know, and today reminded me of times that weren't as tough, but we didn't even know they weren't as tough. I'm looking at Bush today like, man, I can't believe I used to not like that guy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[08:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: All right, breaking overnight. Lawyers for Luigi Mangione have decided not to use a mental health defense when he goes on trial in September. Mangione's attorneys changed course after signaling they would argue that he was suffering from a, quote, extreme emotional disturbance at the time of the fatal shooting of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson.

Now, this reversal comes on the deadline for Mangione's attorneys to provide prosecutors with evidence supporting that claim. With us now, CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson. If I can, I want to take this in stages because one of the things, if a defense is going to use the, you know, the extreme mental health or extreme anguish defense, it's basically an admission that he committed the crime that he killed.

So to say that and then say, OK, we're not doing that. What's the consequence?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So good morning, John. The consequence at this point, I think, is very little. Let me explain.

They initially, we know the defense was going with this extreme emotional disturbance.

[08:25:00]

To your point, I think there are two big problems with that defense. Number one, you mentioned essentially, you're admitting that I did it, but you're providing a justification. When you do that, it's problematic.

Number two, it doesn't exonerate you. It simply lessens what you're facing in terms of a punishment and a penalty.

Here's why I don't think it's that big of a deal. Yes, it's out there. However, the records, psychiatric records are still under seal.

Had those records been transmitted to prosecutors that entered the public domain, now you might have a potential problem. Final point.

I think the issue is, upon reconsideration, I think it could be said that defense attorneys have a right to really determine what their defenses are going to be. And if they switch course, let them do it. So we don't know any of the underlying issues relating to the psychiatric records that are under seal.

BERMAN: Yes, no question. The defense should be able to put up whatever arguments they want to. The question is, what jury out there may have seen that they had told the judge they were going to do this, which again, is a basic admission that the killing happened at his hand.

JACKSON: Yes, so that's fair. However, again, I would say yes, when you vet a jury, the determination in front of the jury is not what you heard, what social media told you, what CNN and John Berman told you. The issue is, can you evaluate the evidence based upon what you hear in the courtroom?

And again, there was a suggestion -- because remember on June 3rd, a few weeks ago, they had a hearing under seal itself where there were discussions about it. So what I'm saying to you is because there have not been any records that had been revealed, no admissions that he made. I did it because I was suffering from an emotional disturbance and here's why.

It was just the indication that he may pursue this defense. I think that alone is not going to be as prejudicial, meaning influencing and contaminating a jury, as if all of that was revealed. And then the defense said, you know what, never mind, I'll do something new.

BERMAN: Why do you think they shifted course?

JACKSON: Well, there's, I think, a very solid reason. The solid reason is because, John, that defense is not applicable in federal court, right?

BERMAN: So this was for a state case.

JACKSON: This was for state case, right? Remember here that the case moving in September is the state trial, that is totally distinguishable and separate from the federal trial.

In New York State, you can have this emotional disturbance defense, it's not insanity defense, right? It's something different. It shows that you had a profound loss of control at the time, not just mere anger.

And that by a preponderance of the evidence, is it more likely than not that that affected your actions. Again, it doesn't excuse you, it mitigates. When you go to the other court, federal court, that is not an excuse. And just let's say very briefly, that they did -- that is defense use this in state court and made what you started this segment off as an admission, federal prosecutors would be all over that. And they would have the records, what records psychiatric records?

Why? Because he sits down with psychiatrists. And in those records, if he said I did it, and this is why federal prosecutors would parade that before the jury and say, we got our guy.

And guess what, he'd be facing life without parole.

BERMAN: Really interesting. And I think it just shows what the legal twists and turns will be in this very high profile case. Stands that we'll probably see a lot more things like this.

Joey Jackson, thank you very much.

JACKSON: Thanks John, of course.

BERMAN: All right, a terrifying close call for pedestrians on a sidewalk, as a car just come so close, missing them by just inches.

And then talk about a crisis situation, reports of a beer shortage in Boston. Why? Scotland might be to blame.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've been drinking a lot. It's not a hot drink, but I'm holiday.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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