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Don Lemon Tonight

Trump Today, I Don't Know Acting A.G. Matt Whitaker; Trump Last Month, Matt Whitaker Is A Great Guy; Michelle Obama Calls Out Trump In New Book; Michelle Obama Opens Up in Upcoming Memoir; President Trump Pushes Back on Michelle Obama; Trump Lashes Out After Democrats Win Back the House in Midterms; Repairing Women's Lives After Sex Trafficking. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired November 09, 2018 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00] DON LEMON, CNN TONIGHT NEWS SHOW HOST: How Matthew Whitaker went from United States attorney for the Southern District of Iowa to the acting Attorney General is now coming more clearly into focus. The natural pick for the job would seemingly be the Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein or Solicitor General Noel Francisco, but they were passed over for the man who previously served as Jeff Sessions' chief of staff. CNN is learning tonight just before Sessions resigned at least one justice official in the room mentioned to the A.G. that there would be legal questions about whether Whitaker's appointment is constitutional. So how exactly did the President pick him for the job?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, Matt Whitaker, I don't know Matt Whitaker. Matt Whitaker worked for Jeff Sessions and he was always extremely highly thought of.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So take note, the President claims he didn't know Matt Whitaker, but just last month, he said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Well, I never talk about that, but I can be tell you Matt Whitaker is a great guy. I mean I know Matt Whitaker.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: "The Washington Post" is the reporting that Whitaker had brief Trump on many occasions before the President preferred not to talk to Sessions and that Whitaker met with the President in the Oval Office more than a dozen times. The man who is now in charge of overseeing the Mueller investigation has on multiple occasions discredited it. Just before he rejoined the DOJ in October of 2017, he was asked if he was worried about the special counsel investigation's scope and if it could turn into a fishing expedition.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEW WHITAKER, LEGAL COMMENTATOR, CNN: I think it smells a little fishy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So he went on to say that he would be sure to shut it down if it did. Matthew Whitaker has gone on the record so publicly and left little doubt about the direction he would like to see it go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WHITAKER: I will be one of the ones jumping up and down.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good for you, yes.

WHITAKER: Making sure the limitations on this investigation continue, because that is the way it's supposed to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, Whitaker also publicly disputed the assessments of the nation's intelligence agencies about Russian interference in the 20916 election.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WHITAKER: This theory that essentially Russians interfered with the U.S. Election which has been proven false, they did not have any impact in the election.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: If that is not concerning enough, "the Wall Street Journal" is reporting the FBI has opened a criminal investigation into world patent marketing incorporated. That is a company where Matthew Whitaker served as a paid advisory board member. The company's accused of scamming millions from customers.

Again, how did a former U.S. Attorney with five years' experience end up the top law enforcement official in America? His very public disdain for the Mueller investigation, he is now in charge of, could not be more clear to a President who very much prizes this character trait.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We could use some more loyalty. I love loyalty. Loyalty can be a wonderful thing.

Loyalty is very important. I'm loyal to a fault I'm loyal.

Loyalty. You know, some of these people have like a 10 percent loyalty meaning if they sneeze in the wrong direction they're gone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Whitaker reportedly has no intention of recusing himself from the Russia investigation. If he did, it's hard to imagine how and why he would have gotten the job in the first place. So let's talk about it.

John Q. Barrett is here, he is a law professor at St. John's University and John Dean, is former Nixon White House counsel. Perfect gentlemen to talk about and no hard names, because they're both Johns. I will get them both right. This is for John Barrett. Good evening to both of you, by the way. Let's start with the new CNN reporting that I just talked about. Before Sessions resigned at least one justice official said that it may not be constitutional or they had questions about his appointment. What's your reaction to that?

JOHN Q. BARRETT, LAW PROFESSOR, ST JOHN'S UNIVERSITY: It's a very serious question. He is the principal law enforcement officer acting as a cabinet official. And he is never been for these job or any current job that he holds confirmed by the senate. And under the appointments clause, there's a serious constitutional question involved. The D.C. circuit in a federal grand jury case involving the Mueller investigation has just called for supplemental briefing on that question. A lot of smart constitutional lawyers think that there is a real serious doubt that he is lawfully in office.

LEMON: I want to read this, because President Trump just tweeted on Matthew Whitaker tonight from Paris. Take a look at this. He said Matthew G. Whitaker is a highly respected former U.S. Attorney from Iowa, he was chosen by Jeff Sessions to be his chief of staff. I did not know Mr. Whitaker. Likewise as chief, I did not know Mr. Whitaker except primarily as he traveled with A.G. Sessions. No social contract. He is on the defense here. What does this tell you about his thinking, John?

BARRETT: Well, he knows there's now a big problem. There's a problem of course of the legality of Whitaker and also this incredible appearance problem of a great skeptic at the very least of the Mueller investigation now being brought in to supervise it or to smother it or decapitate it. That is the appearance.

[23:05:06] LEMON: So let's talk about this auditioning for the job, because CNN is learning tonight that Sessions says he didn't -- before Sessions resigned at least one justice official mentioned to him that there were again these legal questions and he said that he didn't know that he was auditioning for the job just one example when things were particularly bad between Trump and Sessions Whitaker would attend White House meetings in Sessions' place. Does that say to you anything about?

BARRETT: Well, it depends on what he was doing when he was at the White House. I can understand Sessions keeping his distance when he was having bad relations with the President and he sends a substitute, but is the substitute there to represent his boss or to undercut his boss?

LEMON: Yes. Before I get to John Dean, let's talk about what happened to you. What you say happened to you in the green room on this show back in 2017 when you met Whitaker. What did he say to you?

BARRETT: You had to sign as guest and 50 feet from here we were chatting before we came on the air and talking about our backgrounds. And I had seen him on TV. I think we had been on split screen in different locations on these show. And he was a big critic of Mueller. I said, you know, why are you interested in this? Why are you doing this? And he kind of indicated that his law practice wasn't booming and that he was interested in being a judge in Iowa where he was from. He said he hoped this would help him get noticed and that President Trump would then appoint him to be a federal Judge.

LEMON: And?

BARRETT: Well, he isn't a Federal Judge, but he is the acting Attorney General of the United States. I think it's beyond the scenario that he was imagining in June of 2017.

LEMON: What do you think of that, John Dean, before I go and ask you other questions? What do you think of that?

JOHN DEAN, FORMER NIXON WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL: I don't think you knew you were recruiting for the White House, but obviously, it worked. We know that Trump watches television. We know he watches your show. We know he has opinions about it. So to hear somebody defending him obviously caught his attention.

LEMON: John Dean, also the two highest officials handling oversight of Mueller's investigation, one of them being Rod Rosenstein, urged Sessions to delay the date of his resignation, but Trump wouldn't allow it. How does this looking to you? What do you read into that?

DEAN: Well, it's hard to know legally how this is all going to shake out. Mueller is very smart. Probably will not take any preemptive moves and watch how this plays out before he decides what to do, but we don't know how it's going to play out. As John Barrett mentioned, you know, a lot of legal scholars question whether this is the legitimate appointment and it can be challenged and it probably will be challenged, Don.

LEMON: Do you think that is so?

BARRETT: I think it's definitely going to be challenged. Anyone who is in litigation against the Department of Justice now has standing, has an injury to claim that the Department of Justice is not in the proper lawful hands.

LEMON: The question is though, and I've heard people say, I wonder if he is going to last through the weekend. Meaning.

BARRETT: Well, it's a political problem. It's an appearance problem. And I assume in the ranks of DOJ, it's an incredible morale problem. You know, this is bringing in somebody at the top who appears to have a very serious conflict of interest. And by all other standards before this time, that is the wrong person for that job. That is what Jeff Sessions realized on day one which led him to recuse himself. Whitaker should recuse himself at the very least, not commit himself to come in and big foot on top of what DOJ is now doing.

LEMON: Didn't you just say that all standards in previous times?

BARRETT: In previous times, yes.

LEMON: This is we're living in different times now. John Dean, the whole thing of Trump originally saying that he knows Matt Whitaker and then today saying he doesn't, and you saw what he just tweeted or read what he just tweeted, he is done this sort of thing with Michael Cohen, with Paul Manafort. Is anyone buying this?

DEAN: It is certainly a prelude to what generally when somebody is on their way out, he suddenly gets a very foggy memory of who that person was, what kind of relationship they had. And as he distanced himself, he telegraphs what he is going to do. He is going to leave this person hanging in the wind.

LEMON: Do you think that this was, John Barrett, that this was all preplanned if you look at it? I think he was recommended some people are saying by the federalist society. They put him in this position. They had to know how he felt about the Mueller investigation.

BARRETT: I don't know if it was preplanned that he would succeed Jeff Sessions. But I think there was an interest in having a friendlier White House connected guy in the Department of Justice. You know, Rod Rosenstein, a consummate professional law enforcement career lawyer was acting as Attorney General on top of the Mueller investigation run by a consummate professional law enforcement figure. This would bring in a political friend, how it would evolve from there is I think has been happenstance.

[23:10:07] LEMON: It's just, I don't know. I mean -- go on, John Dean.

DEAN: There was earlier reporting that he was actually going after Rod Rosenstein's job as the Deputy Attorney General thinking that Sessions might survive, but Rosenstein was being chatted up on his way out. And there was quite a bit of coverage of that. That was the first time I really paid much attention to his name and did a little checking around who he was. And I was surprised he was where he had arrived.

LEMON: I think there's more stage craft.

I think there's more stage craft with a lot of this than we all realize. Let me get John Dean.

DEAN: I do, too.

LEMON: Yes. I want to get your reaction, some controversial views that were really stunning to a lot of people from the new acting A.G. This is back in 2014 where he said judges should have a biblical view. The ADL is calling that deeply troubling. What's your take on that?

DEAN: I think it is deeply troubling. The Justice Department traditionally had a large role in selection of judges. That has really moved over to the White House now. And that seems to be the place that judges are largely selected in working with members of the Senate and the state and jurisdiction in which the judge is going to sit, but I think a religious test is exactly what our constitution forbids. For him to even suggest this is a basis is very wrong.

LEMON: Well, I just want to -- how about John Barrett, his view, the landmark 1803 Supreme Court ruling that establishes the judiciary's ability to strike down laws that violates the constitution, he called it one of the court's worst, worst decisions. That is really outside of the mainstream. And including this whole biblical thing, as well.

BARRETT: Well, the biblical thing is it flatly unconstitutional. Article six of the constitution says we don't have religious tests. So that is sort of flunk high school physics -- high school civics dumb. Marbury versus Madison is a foundation of constitutional law and the role of the Supreme Court. And widely understood, it's a consensus matter in anybody with legal training that the role of the court is to interpret with and authority to position the meaning of the constitution, to go back and reconsider that is really an attempt to nullify the judiciary entirely.

LEMON: All right. I want you to stick around. Both of you, because I want to talk about the "Wall Street Journal" is reporting that Donald Trump was involved in or briefed on nearly every step of the hush money payments made to former playboy playmate Karen McDougal and porn actress Stormy Daniels. Payments that may have violated campaign finance laws.

[23:15:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Back now John Dean, John Q. Barrett. OK, so John Dean, I want to ask you about the "Wall Street Journal" reporting that the feds have evidence that President Trump was directly involved in paying off Stormy Daniels, Karen McDougal. Do you get the sense that campaign finance laws were violated here?

DEAN: It certainly would appear that way as I read that "Wall Street Journal" story, I could envision the indictment that could come out of all that, a conspiracy to violate the federal campaign laws. Whether that will happen or not since Michael Cohen has pled is a good question.

I doubt there will be much further litigation on this in the sense of a prosecution, but David Pecker was also mentioned prominently in that story. And he appears that he might have had an immunity deal as Weissenberg from the Trump organization clearly got an immunity deal. So I don't know that that case is going to go much further, but it is a certainly evidence of a conspiracy.

LEMON: So this is according to the "Journal," John Barrett, Trump met in August 2015 with David Pecker, CEO of the company that owns the "National Enquirer." Pecker offered to pay for the silence of women who might publicize sexual affairs. And the bottom line here this Stormy Daniels saga isn't going away. People -- some Trump supporters turn up their nose and say what are you doing this? But if you look at what happen with the Stormy Daniels saga uncovered Michael Cohen who has now been prosecuted or indicted, I should say by the Southern District of New York. It has also made the President a liar it shows him on Air Force One denying it. And now it is true. So this saga is not going away. BARRETT: No, and it connects obviously not to just Cohen, but to

Pecker to other employees of the Trump organization. And then the Trump organization is Trump tower. That is the site of the Russian meeting. And you've got strands that continue to overlap and are thick and important. So yes. This conspiracy and another conspiracy interlink at some point. They're financial, they're real estate. They're relationships. Their business. So I think it's not an extramarital affair or pornography or anything to turn your nose up at it. It's potentially a very serious criminal matter.

LEMON: I wanted to play the moment that I just mention aboard Air Force One about the saying that he had no knowledge of these Stormy Daniels payments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, did you know about the $130,000 payment to Stormy Daniels?

Then why did Michael Cohen make this, if there was no truth to her allegations?

TRUMP: You have to ask Michael Cohen. Michael is my attorney and you'll have to ask Michael.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you know where he got the money to make that payment?

TRUMP: No, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: We've known John Dean, for a while that what he said aboard Air Force One was not true. The attorney for Stormy Daniels, Michael Avenatti says the President should be indicted. How do you see this unfolding?

[23:20:00] DEAN: Well, this case is now of course, up in the Southern District of New York. It was something that was referred there by the special counsel who apparently ran into some of it along the way, but that is where it's unfolded is in the Southern District. That is a traditionally by long tradition a rather independent U.S. Attorney's office. Yet, they will not, I cannot believe that they would go over the standing policy of the Department of Justice which since 1973 renewed in 2000 has been, you do not indict a sitting President.

LEMON: Yes.

DEAN: There are people who disagree with that law and on strong basis that no man is above the law. It is a dubious policy position, but I think it's going to stand in the Southern District. It's not going to test it at this point.

LEMON: As he said, John Barrett, the current Justice Department guidelines, a sitting President cannot be indicted. So is this President protected? BARRETT: Well, he might be protected from criminal indictment, but a

misrepresentation and a series of not just petty matters, but substantive potentially criminal matters on which a President is lying to the American people becomes a question of political oversight. We've just gotten access to the road map that the Watergate grand jury sent to the House of Representatives in 1974. It was unsealed after all these decades through litigation. And a big part of the road map is President Nixon lying to the American people which the House then regarded as a substantive potential ground for impeachment in 1974.

LEMON: What are you saying here?

BARRETT: I'm saying that a Congress that believes in truth and a President upholding high values in the Oval Office, could regard this as a high crime of a political nature and in an impeachment context following the Watergate precedent and indeed also following the Bill Clinton precedent regard a lying President as a matter of its interest.

LEMON: Well, you said, what Congress? Responsible Congress?

BARRETT: Responsible investigative Congress.

LEMON: Investigative Congress, I mean, John, we've had this conversation several times. How many different ways are we going to have it? Even "the Wall Street Journal" found that Trump was involved at nearly every step of the way with these agreements here. Do you see this is only the tip of the iceberg and if Congress really wanted to act on it that more could come out and that they might actually be able to do something about it?

DEAN: Don, we've been talking about this for a couple years now. And what we see is a continuous pattern of criminal behavior by this President. He is very conspicuous, he is very open about it. And he feels protected apparently that as long as he is got the senate, under Republican control, that never will they find a two-thirds vote, six to seven votes, in the Senate to hold him guilty of an impeachable charge or remove him from office based on such a finding. So I think that is his -- I think that is his firewall is the Senate. So he'll try to politicize anything the House does if they seriously pursue this.

LEMON: John and John, thank you for your time. I appreciate it.

BARRETT: Thank you.

LEMON: The former first lady tell all, I'm talking about Michelle Obama. Tell all new book. We're going to tell you what she is saying about President Trump and why she says she can never forgive him.

[23:25:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Michelle Obama not pulling any punches in her upcoming memoir titled "Becoming." "The Washington Post" reports the first lady, the former first lady takes on life in the spotlight, her time in Washington and her anger at the current President for spreading the birther conspiracy about her husband. Let's discuss now. Krissah Thompson is here. She reported on the book for the "Post." Hello to you. Thank you so much for joining us.

KRISSAH THOMPSON, FEATURES ASSIGNMENT EDITOR, WASHINGTON POST: Hey, Don.

LEMON: She goes there, right?

THOMPSON: Yes, no, she totally does. This is not your average Washington read. You know, she reveals some new things about herself and talks really frankly about her feelings about Donald Trump, I mean, she tells everyone what she really thinks.

LEMON: So let's talk a little bit more specifically about what's in the book. She said that she would never forgive him for spreading the birther conspiracy, because it put her family in danger. It's deeply personal for her.

THOMPSON: Yes, no, this is right. She talks about you know, hearing him as he is beginning to think about running for President talking about birtherism, you know, spreading that conspiracy theory and then talking to the secret service and hearing that the threats against her family had increased and she you know, kind of says that she knows there are nuts and kooks out there and worries about if someone's going to get a gun and find her daughters and just talks about this in some really personal terms. You know, this is not empty rhetoric as far as she is concerned.

LEMON: Yes. And more here. She says, this is quote, her body buzzed with fury and she said when she heard that Access Hollywood tape and she wrote this. It was an expression of hatred that had generally been kept out of polite company, but still lived in the marrow of our supposedly enlightened society alive and accepted enough that someone like Donald Trump could afford to be cavalier about it.

What else did she say about Trump?

THOMPSON: You know, she goes on in that passage to talk about you know, folks who are seen as others in this society. Who are not people in power, minorities and how this kind of language really sets folks apart. She also talks about, you know the 2016 campaign, watching him on stage with Hillary Clinton and how he moved around, and she felt like he was stalking her even on the stage and sort of being menacing.

And then on election night as the returns started to come in and, you know, Florida doesn't look like it's going Hillary Clinton's way, she said she just blocked it all out, went to bed and, you know, was basically shocked at the election outcome.

LEMON: Did she talk -- you remember all the memes and about her on the inauguration day. You know, that she didn't look like she was quite frankly having any of it. Does she talk about inauguration day in the book?

THOMPSON: She does, yeah. That comes up in the book and, you know, she talks about the routine, the transition of one family coming, another leaving. She's going through the process and understands that.

And then she looks up at the stage at the invited guests and in the VIP area for the Trumps and sees what she says, you know, are a bunch of white males and that it doesn't reflect the diversity of America.

And she looks at those optics and kind of thinks to herself, well, they clearly don't care. And she writes that she at that moment decided that she was not going to be smiling through the inauguration and just kind of turned it off.

LEMON: She did go there. Did she talk about the current first lady at all?

THOMPSON: No. There's a mention about writing to the inauguration in the car together but other than that, she doesn't talk about her much. You know, she doesn't talk about many former first ladies. She makes the point in the book that she didn't feel like she really had role models for the role because she was the first African-American woman to be as first lady. And that she identified not so much with other first families.

But, you know, with civil rights leaders that you might think of, you know, she talked about of Sojourner Truth and the lineage of African- American women who kind of paved the way in this country and that those being the kind of historical figures that she more so identified with.

LEMON: When they go low, we go high. Here's what she told NPR when asked about that, if that still applies. She says, "I think even more now because I think we - what's the alternative? Are we all just gonna go low? Are we all just gonna be in the mud kicking and screaming and hating and wreaking havoc and fear? Is that what, is that the recommendation? I think we are living in a time that proves that point even more so."

So, it's not about the politics for her. It's about the principle.

THOMPSON: That's right. You know, she talks about really not liking politics in the book. You know, so I'm sure the question is going to come up, is she going to run for office? She says emphatically in the book that she's not. That 10 years spent in the spotlight in public life in the political sphere showed her that it's just a very nasty space and it's not something that she wants to do.

LEMON: The Obamas are going to have to attend big events with the Trumps for years to come. How is she able to do this when she obviously dislikes him so much?

THOMPSON: She talked in the book -- you know, she doesn't answer that question but she talks about being a person of grace and understanding that she is under what she calls a gaze, the public gaze that the media is watching, that the country is watching, and that that requires a certain kind of behavior that she wants to model.

So I don't think that she will have, you know, much trouble being in those spaces and behaving in a way that she feels like, you know, kind of reflects the dignity of the office. You know, she definitely understands that.

LEMON: Well, we thank you for coming on. Thank you, Krissah Thompson.

THOMPSON: Thank you.

LEMON: President Trump responding to the former first lady today and you won't be surprised to hear he did not follow her mantra of when they go low, we go high.

[23:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: President Trump today responding to the former first lady, Michelle Obama, writing that she will never forgive him for endangering her family with his birtherism.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): What do you say to Michelle Obama who says she will never forgive you for your birther comments in the past?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Michelle Obama said that? I haven't seen it. I guess she wrote a book. She got paid a lot of money to write a book, and they always insist that you come up with controversial. Well, I'll give you a little controversy back. I'll never forgive him for what he did to our United States military by not funding it properly.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: What's wrong with him with everybody making money but him? OK. Here to discuss is Nina Turner, Alice Stewart, Rick Wilson, the author of "Everything Trump Touches Dies."

You know, he said the same thing, almost the exact same thing about April. I guess she got to make a lot of money and she gets a contract. She made a lot of money to write a book. I mean, I don't see anything wrong --

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: -- with making money. He's the one that's always talking -- the theme of the show was money, money, money, money. Oh, my gosh. Anyway, I digress. He just couldn't take the high road there, Rick. Good evening, everybody, by the way. But he did not take on Michelle Obama. He made a jab at the former president.

[23:39:58] RICK WILSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Sure, but you know, Don, the thing about Trump, he's always very sensitive about his book. I like to joke that the only thing that Donald Trump and I have in common, we both had a New York Times number one best seller, only I wrote mine.

(LAUGHTER)

WILSON: His entire snappishness about money, the pettiness right now, this is a guy who is under a lot of stress, a lot of tension. He recognizes how bad the world is going to look in a few weeks. And this has been a week of calamities for him from top to bottom.

We're spending our Friday evening laughing about Donald Trump and this guy Whitaker who is the biggest clown in the clown car so far of the Trump administration. It's going to go so badly off the rails for this thing. And I think we're going to see a lot more of this behavior in the next couple weeks.

LEMON: Alice, let me bring you in because I want to ask you about -- I mean, the former first lady. Doesn't she have every right to talk about her feelings after Donald Trump peddled a total lie about her husband? Is the president angry because his lie is just coming home to roost now and they're actually responding to it?

ALICE STEWART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Sure, she has every right to say whatever she wants to say in her book. From what I've heard of the book and excerpts I've read, it's poignant, it's personal and at times it's political because those paths all crossed when she was the first lady.

Look, she brought up some very valid points about President Trump in her book. She certainly talked about his unfounded nonsense claims about birtherism and she also pointed out the way he treated women and the way he bragged about sexually harassing women. Those were valid points that she observed about the sitting president.

And when he was asked about her comments about the birtherism, he had every opportunity to set the record straight and to defend himself as to why he brought it up. Instead for some reason heaven knows why, he goes off on some tangent about --

LEMON: Military spending.

STEWART: -- President Obama and funding the military. But I think she had the right to say exactly what was on her mind. And I'm looking forward to reading the book because I think she was a role model as a first lady, as a mom, and as someone that I think a lot of little girls like Parker Curry that you've talked to that admired her painting, she has a lot to be proud of. I'm looking forward to reading the book.

LEMON: And Nina, I think a lot of folks are because -- especially if you look at the pre-sales on Amazon, right, Nina? Nina, I've been wanting to talk to you about this, because the former first lady said her body buzzed with fury after hearing the president say that he could grab women's genitals during the campaign. What was your reaction when you heard the former first lady talk about this?

NINA TURNER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, I mean, she was articulating or capturing, if you will, the feelings I'm sure of lots of women and hopefully lots of men as well. You know, one point that Rick was making about the president being petty, he specializes in petty.

When the first lady says when they will go low, we go high, President Trump says that when they go low, I'll go lower. I mean, that really is his M.O. It has been his M.O. as a candidate. It is his M.O. as president.

And, you know, the first lady also said in her book or wrote in her book about about how his comments about birtherism, Don, put her family's life in jeopardy. I mean, that's real. What he could have done is simply apologize. But you know, he can't do that. He has out- trumped himself this week.

LEMON: Stay with me, everyone. I want to hear a lot more from you. The president attacking and demeaning a trio of respected black female White House reporters. We're going to play his words for you.

[23:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: After his party lost the House in Tuesday's midterms, President Trump has spent the rest of the week lashing out at the media, Democrats, other opponents. But a lot of these attacks were specifically aimed at black women journalists. Back now with Nina Turner, Alice Stewart, and Rick Wilson. So, let's just roll the tape before we dive in to this. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

YAMICHE ALCINDOR, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, PBS: On the campaign trail, you called yourself a nationalist. Some people saw that as emboldening white nationalists. Now people are also saying --

TRUMP: I don't know why you'd say that. It's such a racist question.

ALCINDOR: There are some --

TRUMP: Same thing with April Ryan. I watched her get up. I mean, you talk about somebody that's a loser. She doesn't know what the hell she's doing. She gets publicity and then she gets a pay raise or she gets a contract with, I think, CNN. But she's very nasty, and she shouldn't be.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Do you want him to rein in Robert Mueller?

TRUMP: What a stupid question that is. What a stupid question. But I watch you a lot. You ask a lot of stupid questions.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: OK. So, he says for April, I think CNN. But then he tells Abby -- well, he says he doesn't watch CNN. He says, I watch you a lot. Abby of course is on CNN. So, anyway, but I digress. Nina, there is a method to the madness and the vicious tone from this president to three journalists just trying to do their job.

TURNER: Absolutely, Don, and there's a lot to unpack here. Got a big suitcase on this one. I mean, you know, loser, stupid. I mean, this president, he has disparaged African-Americans in particular in way that are deep.

And these stereotypes, these words that he uses towards African- Americans, they rooted in as stereotype in this country that has been hard for African-Americans to come from under because of the deep- seated racism in this country.

He understands exactly what he is saying and what he is doing when he uses those types of terms when referring to African-Americans in general and African-American women in particular. There was just -- just to hear what he was saying to Abby. I mean, all of it was bad, from the first lady to April to Yamiche.

[23:49:59] But that clip that you just played about what he said to Abby just made my skin crawl. It just made me cringe. He is doing these kinds of things deliberately. He should be ashamed of himself, but I know that he is not.

LEMON: I want to put this up. This is another view of President Trump addressing our very own -- look at that. OK, Abby Phillip.

TURNER: He's a bully.

LEMON: Yeah. Alice, look at that. I mean, addressing -- first of all, a president saying that is a stupid question, but beyond that, go on, tell me. What does this tell you, especially that photo?

STEWART: Well, we have virtually the exact same photo from yesterday, him doing the same thing to Jim Acosta, and he also has called Jim and many others stupid and dumb questions. That photo right there is chilling for a lot of reasons.

I come from the news world but I also have worked on communications for presidential candidates. There needs to be a lower temperature with regard to this administration, how the press is handled. It just needs to go down.

And look, when you're the president of the United States and you ask for the resignation of your A.G. and replace him with someone that has been critical of the Mueller investigation, as president, you should be prepped that one of the questions you're going to be asked is, are you expecting this Mueller investigation to be reigned in? Abby's question was not a stupid question, it was the question of the day. He simply just didn't want to answer it.

LEMON: Yeah.

STEWART: So, instead of answering the question or just deflecting or saying no, he attacked her. I just think that's the wrong way to go about it. And it doesn't make it any better to say that he's an equal opportunity offender. But at the end of the day, it just so happens the last few days with African-American women. But he has a long history of treating many members of media --

LEMON: For the sake of time, I --

STEWART: I just don't think it's a smart way to go about it.

TURNER: Don --

LEMON: I'm going to give you the last word, Rick. Nina --

TURNER: I understand what Alice is saying, but what I want Alice to understand and the viewers to understand is there's historic significance to the stereotypes of calling African-Americans dumb and losers and stupid. He even called Omarosa a dog. So even though he has said some disparaging things to white reporters, there is a deep- seated essence historically in this country when it comes to the stereotyping of African-Americans.

LEMON: One of his favorite targets is Maxine Waters as well --

TURNER: Yes.

LEMON: What do you say about this, Rick? What do you think? Because it's hard to ignore the way he spoke with them. All of them were African-American women. I got to tell you, I was out today and people came up to me and said, but what he said to yesterday to April, sit down, they were particular - these weren't just black people. These are people from all different ethnicities saying it made my skin crawl.

WILSON: I think that angry Donald Trump is often closer to the true core of this guy than anything else we see. And in all of these exchanges, you know, particularly when he was telling April to sit down, all I could think of is this guy is like one millisecond away from the N-word. He hates her. It's obvious. It's just -- it's tangible. His inability to control his anger and his temper is remarkable.

I think as we enter this time of increasing stress on him, he's going to continue to lash out at the press because the only card he has left to play is making the white nats happy and using his hatred of the media to keep his former conservative base, now Trump base delighted. That's their bread and butter issue, hating the media.

So he is going to do everything he can to keep that up. I don't think he's got much control over his affect when he's talking to a lot of these reporters particularly the African-American reporters in question this week.

LEMON: And it's only going to get worse, as you said, he has been rattled this week. He is attacking Macron just after he landed on French soil. Fascinating conversation. I wish we had more time. Thank you all. Have a great weekend. Everyone be safe out there. And right, tone it down. Tone it down. We'll be right back.

[23:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: In the United States, young minors are being lured, threatened, beaten and sold every day. They are sex trafficking victims forced to have sex for money. The 2018 top 10 CNN hero Susan Munsey was one of them. Trafficked at 16. Now, she is speaking out and offering safety and a new life to women who have escaped sex trafficking.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SUSAN MUNSEY, CNN HERO: Nobody wakes up and just decides one day I'm going to go sell my body and give the money away. Traffickers and pimps. They know exactly what they're doing. Much of it is on the internet now. They're going on dating websites and they're gaming. They're looking for young vulnerable women, anywhere where young women might hang out. My vision was to have a home where women could come and find safety and find themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Susan's organization, Generate Hope, has been a refuge for more than 100 survivors, some as young as 18. Go to cnnheroes.com right now to vote for her, for CNN hero of the year or any of your favorite top 10 CNN heroes. Again, it is at cnnheroes.com. Thanks for watching. Our coverage continues.

[00:00:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)