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Don Lemon Tonight

FBI Opened Investigation Into Whether President Trump Was Secretly Working On Behalf Of Russia; Don's Take, Why Does The GOP Still Tolerate Congressman Steve King; Senate Leaves Town For Weekend On Eve Of Longest-Ever Government Shutdown; Trump Holds Off Calling Border Emergency, Says Congress Should Act. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired January 11, 2019 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:08] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you for watching. "CNN Tonight" with D. Lemon starts right now with big news.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: I do. But before I let you go, here's what I want to say. The President said this on Friday, right? He said about brown and black people at the border. We have a country that is being invaded by criminals and by drugs, and we're going to stop it. That is what he said.

So, you're right on. He is contributing to this because many believed that is what that wall is about. And not many believed it is, right, because we're not talking about a wall on the Northern Border?

It's just really frustrating because when people deny their racism, maybe we should get them a definition, Steve King and the President, of what racism is because they deny it. And instead, as I've told you about -- as I have told you before, the people who call it out, they call us racist and race baiters.

CUOMO: Listen. You often attack what you don't understand and what you don't like. They know what they're saying. And the proof of it is that they do it opportunistically and they do it repetitively. Look at the president on drugs from the border. Do we have a lot of drugs coming off across the border? Hell, yes, we do. Is it contributing to our problems of addiction here? Hell, yes, it is.

It's just not coming on foot. And a wall is not going to stop it. Not just because of El Chapo's tunnels and all the Cartels, but as we know from DHS, as they use their word, the bulk of it, is their phrase --

LEMON: Right.

CUOMO: -- comes across points of entry in vehicles.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: But he's not loud and proud about the x-ray machines. That is not his big war. I want more money for detection devices than has ever been given before. He wants the wall because the wall was his simple solution to demonizing who comes across. LEMON: The wall, he believes, is going to save him. Without that

wall -- I think it was Lindsey Graham who said it -- if he doesn't get that wall, it's the end of his presidency. I don't know about that, but I think it certainly does some real damage to his credibility with that base.

But I mean -- but again, to Steve King, I don't understand -- and by the way, bravo. Bravo to Tim Scott, right? The only one -- and more people should be joining him. The only one to actually write about it. Other people have spoken out about it, but there's no teeth. They don't do anything. There's essential, there's nothing.

CUOMO: And proof of the value of diversity.

LEMON: Exactly.

CUOMO: Remember when we were talking about somebody else -- let's not bring up any names -- we're talking about another media figure who's sitting at a table and said something that was racially stupid. And you made a good point. You said, you know, you're sitting at a table with people who aren't sensitized to it. You know, if I had been at that table, you said, talking about yourself, I would have said her straight like that.

LEMON: Right.

CUOMO: That's what diversity does on one level --

LEMON: Right.

CUOMO: -- is that when you have people with different experiences and different feelings and insights, you come to better consensus about things like this. Yes, Tim Scott came out. He is the one black guy.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: You know, he is the one black Senator. He comes out, he says it.

LEMON: But he mentioned -- maybe people just don't know that they are racist.

CUOMO: Please. Please.

LEMON: In the situation that you're talking about, I think sometimes people have a wake-up call, and it's a punch, it's a slap -- not a slap in the face -- it's a punch in the face, and they don't realize it. I think Steve King knows exactly what he is doing.

CUOMO: Look, what happened was --

LEMON: And if he doesn't know that he's a racist then he's delusional.

CUOMO: -- look, let's be honest for a second. I feel like you right now. I do. I feel like we just switched positions here. Look, this is what's changed. These guys used to keep their mouth shut or they used to be pushed out to the fringe and they stayed there. Tom Tancrado, Steve King --

LEMON: Wait, hold on, hold on. I want you to make your point --

CUOMO: -- he's been pushing this stuff for years. What's changed is it's now mainstream in that party.

LEMON: No, I want you to make your point. I'm not talking about -- I was talking about the -- what you talked about the analogy of a person, if I was sitting at the table. As far as Steve King is concerned --

CUOMO: Yes. No, no. The journalist, I'm with you on that, but these guys -- come on, man.

LEMON: OK. Go on. Yes.

CUOMO: He knows what he is been selling, just nobody was buying it until Donald J. Trump went and met with him during the primaries? He was like, wow, this stuff really resonates with the base. Let me pick up on this. He is an acolyte of King, the President. It's not the other way around. Maybe that is why he's quiet because he can't speak down to this man.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: He can't call him out. He owned all of his same ideas.

LEMON: Yeah.

CUOMO: He is living the dream that Steve King had.

LEMON: Yes. I'll tell you the worry for many people who are enlightened, right, but mostly for people of color, minorities, marginalized communities are concerned about where we go from here. Number one, if we're going to survive all of this bigotry and racism and hate and stupidity and ignorance, and so on, but then what happens to the country after that?

[22:05:02] Is it irreparable? Is it something that is going to take generations to overcome because, remember, 50 years ago Dr. King, or so, lost his life, right? And how much has changed in 50 years? We still have people who have these views, who are pushing for these views, and who are afraid of the diversity in America.

I wish we had that picture of the new Congress and the new Senate, right? If you look at the Democratic side and you look at the Republican side --

CUOMO: You know what Steve King would called that picture?

LEMON: No place for white men.

CUOMO: Steve King. That is right.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: Now there -- look, there's proof positive. He knows what he is saying. He knows what he is saying and he gets it wrong fundamentally.

LEMON: He's giving away fear, too.

CUOMO: It's not that there's no place for white men. You've got to make room for everybody. That's the point.

LEMON: Right. Exactly. That is the point, but he is giving it away. We're afraid that there will be no room for us. That we will be afraid --

CUOMO: And that used to be a fringe idea. That was remedied not by silencing it.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: But by showing by way of instruction and experience that we're better than that. We're better than that because of our diversity.

LEMON: Well, I don't know if we -- we keep going back and forth about this, you and I at least. I'm not sure if we're better than that. I think that is --

CUOMO: I believe we are.

LEMON: Well, I think we can be better than that, but I believe that's who we are right now. Listen, people like Steve King honestly are afraid of not having -- being the preeminent voice in America, not having things go the way that they've always been going, right?

Really having to share the country in the way that our forefathers thought that we should do, the way that they meant it to happen. That is what he is afraid of and people like him. That's what bigots and racists are afraid of.

And sadly I believe many of the supporters of this President are afraid of that, and they won't tell you that is the reason that they voted for him, because they want to keep America the way that they think it should be.

CUOMO: Even if everything you just said is true --

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: -- there's still a minority population in this country.

LEMON: Look at this. Put that up for us.

CUOMO: The future of the country is diversity.

LEMON: There you go. You see that?

CUOMO: He looks at this, and he sees limitations. I look at it, and I see expansion and strength. Imagine the potential of this country when we harness the power and the value of all the different types of people in it.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: Imagine that. I don't see that as meaning that I'm going to be a dinosaur.

LEMON: Right. Evolving.

CUOMO: You know, that people with my complexion will be ruled out. I think they'll be made better.

LEMON: Exactly. Thank you, Chris Cuomo. I got some breaking news. I understand we have some new people just added to the run down in the show. I will see you next week if not this weekend. Have a good one.

CUOMO: You, too.

LEMON: Thank you. This is "CNN Tonight." I'm Don Lemon. We do have some breaking news. I'm going to tell you about. It is explosive tonight, that breaking news.

"The New York Times" is reporting that after President Trump fired FBI Director James Comey, law enforcement officials were so concerned about the behavior of the President of the United States that they began investigating whether he was secretly working on behalf of Russia.

That is according to former law enforcement officials and others who are familiar with the investigation. Agents were reportedly also trying to find out whether the President was knowingly working for Russia or was being unwittingly influenced by Moscow.

Now, those suspicions were raised during the campaign, but officials held off on opening an investigation in part because they were uncertain how to proceed with such a sensitive matter. There's a whole lot to get to.

Adam Goldman is here of the "New York Times," who helped break the story. Adam, good evening to you. Thank you so much. This is a huge story. Walk us through what you and your colleagues have.

ADAM GOLDMAN, REPORTER, NEW YORK TIMES: Hey, Don. Thanks for having me. What we have, essentially, is after the President fired FBI Director James Comey on May 9th, you know, they became very concerned that there might be a counterintelligence issue here. And the object (ph)of a counterintelligence investigation is there's a threat to national security.

And then Trump goes on TV with Lester Holt of NBC news and says, I did it because of Russia. So, he is telling the FBI, hey, I did it because of Russia. And that sort of tips the scales. And so, while they begin investigating the President, there are two elements to this investigation, the best way to think about it. There's a criminal element, which is the obstruction of the Russia investigation, and there's a counterintelligence investigation in which they're trying to determine whether it was, in fact, witting or unwittingly working for a hostile foreign power.

LEMON: You said there's a criminal element and a counterintelligence element? Is that what you said?

GOLDMAN: Yes.

LEMON: We have to get -- folks should know there's a difference. This is not about the collusion investigation. This is an investigation that was opened by the FBI. There's a distinction between Mueller and this, correct?

[22:10:05] GOLDMAN: Yes. I mean Mueller inherits (ph) this investigation, but when they open the investigation on the President in the days after Comey was fired, the investigation itself had two aspects to it, right? The obstruction and the object of that obstruction was the Russia investigation, right, in 2016, and then the second part of it was, you know, the counterintelligence investigation. That is probably the best way to think about it.

You know, one of the things that concerned me about writing this story is that it's nuanced, and I thought it might get lost on the public because, you know, if you talk to your average person, what do they think Mueller's doing, right? They think Mueller is investigating whether Trump colluded with the Russians, right?

LEMON: Right.

GOLDMAN: Which is essentially, you know, what I'm reporting here. I'm just telling you how it happened --

LEMON: OK.

GOLDMAN: -- and what the circumstances were and what led to it.

LEMON: I'm glad you said that, because I'm trying to get -- there's a distinction there, and there's so much that goes on with the Russia investigation, so many elements.

So on this one, where are we -- you said that Mueller is going to inherit this -- and he inherits this. What is the status of this investigation now, Adam?

GOLDMAN: You know, Don, if I knew that -- if I knew that I'd be on TV hosting my own show. I'm kidding. I don't know what the status is, you know, but my assumption is that, you know, Mueller will have -- since he did inherit this investigation, he is going -- if he does write a report, he is going to have to -- it would seem likely that he's going to have to answer that question.

But more importantly, Don, I think the American public wants an answer to that question, right? Doesn't the American public want to know if the President was, in fact, colluding or conspiring with the Russians, right? Isn't this what the Mueller investigation's about?

LEMON: Right.

GOLDMAN: Isn't that what people -- isn't that the expectation?

LEMON: Yes. Adam, will you stand by for me, please, because I'm going to need your help as we go through this. I would appreciate it, sir. If you can.

GOLDMAN: Sure.

LEMON: OK. Let's bring in now John Dean and Juliette Kayyem. Good evening to both of you. I got to ask you, John, reading this report and hearing what Adam said, just give me your initial thoughts.

JOHN DEAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: My initial thought is that it wasn't just an accident that a Special Counsel was selected, that there was already a lot of suspicion in the FBI that there was deep concern about this president, enough to open a counterintelligence investigation. So it was a very small step to name -- or have a Special Counsel look into this issue of obstruction.

LEMON: Yes.

DEAN: And it's probably expanded well beyond there today.

LEMON: Let's talk about this, Juliette, you being a security expert. So, as Adam said, there's a criminal element to this, and then there's also a counterintelligence investigation into whether the President constituted a possible threat to national security. Connect the dots for us here.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: OK. So what we know from Adam's great reporting and I'm -- and others who are analyzing this like Benjamin Wittes at Law Fair is that the counterintelligence investigation that was started against Donald Trump was focused on the President himself. So this was no longer who in the campaign knew. This is Trump specifically, so just everyone take a step back as the FBI opened a Counterintelligence Investigation on the President himself.

The second thing is that we -- and I do this on your show all the time -- tend to think of the Mueller investigation in three different pools. There's the financial, there's the obstruction of justice, and there's the collusion, right, with Russia.

Now what we need to think about is the collusion, which we tend to think about between Russia and Trump, and the obstruction of justice investigation, which we tend to think of as just a Trump issue is -- are they the same? I mean, in other words, does the collusion extend to things like the firing of James Comey? And that is a significant move.

I'm not going to connect anymore dots because we obviously don't know where the investigation went, but I will end with this point. A President -- how would a President compromised by the Russians behave and give me any moment in the last two years where Trump has behaved differently? And that's what I took away from this story.

LEMON: So, Adam, you're there, right? Can I bring you back in?

GOLDMAN: Sure.

LEMON: OK. I want to give the White House response because just moments ago, the White House responded, and said, this is absurd. James Comey was fired, because he is a disgraced partisan hack, and his Deputy, Andrew McCabe, who was in charge at the time, is a known liar fired by the FBI.

Unlike President Obama, who let Russia and other foreign adversaries push America around, President Trump has actually been tough on Russia. Well, many people think that -- they would say that Trump has been anything but tough on Russia. What do you say to that response?

GOLDMAN: I'm not sure that response has anything to do with my reporting.

[22:15:00] I mean the facts are what they are, and if you think about what Jim Baker, the General Counsel for the FBI, told Congress behind closed doors -- and we quoted from his testimony -- it's really -- it's really extraordinary thinking that the object of the obstruction, right, the possible obstruction, was the Russia investigation from 2016. And the act of firing Comey, he told Congress, was a national security threat. It was a national security threat.

LEMON: John, what -- to this response, why are the responses from the White House always a deflection or a push to Obama or Hillary Clinton or whatever? It's never a direct response to the allegations or the evidence there. It's always some sort of deflection and name-calling. What's going on?

DEAN: It's obvious they don't have a good response. They don't either know and they're winging it, or they're trying to deflect, but they don't seem to be able to hit any of this head-on. I've seen this in another White House from the inside and seen very similar tactics when you don't have a good response.

LEMON: Yes. We've been talking about the reasons that this came up, right, because according to "The New York Times" and Adam and his co- workers, investigators were concerned over a letter that Trump wrote to Comey, thanking him for previously telling him that he was not a subject of the FBI's Russia investigation. And then this interview caught their attention.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Regardless of recommendation, I was going to fire Comey knowing there was no good time to do it. And, in fact, when I decided to just do it, I said to myself, I said, you know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It's an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should have won.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: So, why would counterintelligence investigators be so

interested in these things? Juliette, that is to you.

KAYYEM: Yes. So because this statement is made after a couple other things have happened. First of all, Trump had tried to fire Comey, asking Rosenstein to do it based solely on the Russia investigation. Rosenstein comes back with a sort of more benign explanation.

Trump, who always signals what his intentions are, because he can't keep it quiet, whether it's him signaling about WikiLeaks or in this, then says it did had to do with the Russia investigation to Lester Holt. And also says so -- remember this moment in the Oval Office soon after he fires Comey, he tells the Russian ambassador, essentially, I got rid of our problem.

What they did not factor in, of course, is that Rosenstein has another move behind him, which is, of course, the picking of Mueller. And I think that that is essentially what they did not intend or plan, and it's no surprise at this stage that Trump spends most of his time trying to undermine Mueller and end the investigation.

So, that sort of the context of all of that and would justify the opening of a counterintelligence investigation, because the person who's saying it is the one who is saying, you know, I'm doing it essentially to help the Russians is -- and stop the Russia investigation is the President himself.

So this is -- you know, as I say, there's no smoking guns, but this is part of an understanding of how far this investigation is going for Mueller at this stage.

LEMON: The breaking news tonight as the FBI opened an inquiry into whether Trump was secretly working on behalf of Russia. That is the breaking news. That is the headline from "The New York Times" Adam Goldman, one of the reporters who worked on that -- on this, the lead reporter, I would believe, Michael Schmidt as well, and Nicholas Spandose (ph) on that report. We have Adam with us. We also have Juliette and John Dean. We're going to talk to them on the other side of the break.

[22:20:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: We're back now with much more on our bombshell breaking news. "The New York Times" reporting that after President Trump fired FBI Director James Comey, law enforcement was so concerned that they opened an investigation into whether the President was working on behalf of Russia either knowingly or unwittingly.

John Dean, Juliette Kayyem are back with me. So let's dig into this a little bit more. Juliette, investigators were also troubled by this comment during the campaign. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Russia, if you're listening, I hope you're able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. (END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: The Republican Party also softened its convention platform to benefit Russia. What kind of questions does that raise?

KAYYEM: So that would -- you know, that starts in 2016, and this is -- by the reporting in "The New York Times," this is when the FBI agents and Counterintelligence begin to get concerned about the extent to which Trump is either being manipulated, like does he know or does he not know, or actually actively working with the Russians.

What we have to remember is that the Trump campaign was told by the FBI, be careful. The Russians are trying to infiltrate these campaigns in these election. These were told this well before the general, and not a single one of the couple does, I think, at this stage who had contact with the Russians ever told the FBI that this was going on.

And I just quickly want to juxtapose that clip that you just said with the year later, maybe a little bit more than a year later, which is Helsinki, is there are moments in this investigation where people like me wonder, you know, is this just so obvious and we're -- you know, we're looking at the details, we have to also remember Helsinki that that moment where the President essentially standing with Putin says, "You know, I'm yours. I have no U.S. interests. I only have Russian interests." really would be evidence if the investigation is ongoing about the nature and extent of the relationship between Trump himself and Russia.

LEMON: You know, someone, my producer brings up a good point, you know, by saying that, John, this isn't Manafort or Flynn or, you know, some sort of character that was associated, or Roger Stone, right, with the campaign. This is the President of the United States.

And up until now, we have been thinking there is a collusion case, and obstruction case, but after this "New York Times" report, Benjamin Wittes from Law Fair, he blogs -- the law fair blogs wonders if the act of obstructing could actually be colluding. Does he have a point?

[22:25:-2] DEAN: It's a possibility. Don, there's so much below the surface that we can't be sure of other than we know the high standards that are necessary to start this kind of investigation, particularly on a President of the United States that by this time we know that they knew many of the activities that had taken place during the transition.

Kushner's effort to set up a back channel, Flynn talking with the ambassador about -- the ambassador to Russia about sanctions, there's all kinds of things going on and much more than probably has broken the surface in any way that Mueller is well aware of now.

So this just sort of puts a sharp focus on that high degree of activity that was going on. And as Juliette says, he is done nothing to dissuade anybody from being in the powers of the Russians at all, since becoming President.

LEMON: Well, I appreciate both of you. Thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you very much.

We're going to have much more on our breaking news tonight. Plus, while some Republicans are criticizing Congressman Steve King for his White Supremacy comments, more are silent. How the Republican Party got to this point. That is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Tonight, we have to talk about Congressman Steve King. Let's talk about his long history of frankly racist comments. And we are going to talk about why his party tolerates it? Why do Republicans tolerate it?

The GOP is where it is today because the party chose to go down this road, playing to racists and xenophobes, demonizing immigrants, allowing a manufactured crisis at the border to shut down our government.

[22:30:04] When you do that, what you get is someone like Congressman King, someone who feels emboldened to use language that is not a dog whistle. It's straight-up hateful. It's a bullhorn.

The latest was just this week when the Congressman told "The New York Times," quote, white nationalist, white supremacist, western civilization -- how did that language become offensive? Why did I sit in classes teaching me about the merits of our history and our civilization?

Well, today Congressman King just made excuses for what he clearly said, sounding an awful lot like he is trying to paint himself as a victim.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. STEVE KING (R), IOWA: I regret the heartburn that has poured forth upon this Congress and this country and especially in my state and in my Congressional District, but the people who know me know I wouldn't have to even make this statement because they do know me. They know my life. They know my history.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. So let's go down some of that history, right, because -- let's take some of his history into account here. There's this comment from 2013 about the children of undocumented immigrants.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KING: For everyone who's a valedictorian, there's another 100 out there that they weigh 130 pounds and they've got calves the size of cantaloupes because they're hauling 75 pounds of marijuana across the desert.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: There's this from 2017. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KING: We have growing elements in America that want to destroy Western Civilization. There's argument that diversity is our strength. I just wonder if anybody ever questions that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Also in 2017, this tweet, quote, "We can't restore our civilization with somebody else's babies." Last year he did an interview with a far-right Austrian website associated with neo-Nazis and asked, quote, "What does this diversity bring that we don't already have? Mexican food, Chinese food, and on and on."

He endorsed a white supremacist for mayor of Toronto, and he follows an Australian anti-Semitic activist on Twitter. A senior GOP aide tells CNN that Congressman King's latest comments are a tipping point. It's not at all clear that his party will take action on this.

But in an op-ed in today's "Washington Post," pay close attention to this. Senator Tim Scott of South Carolina, the only black Republican Senator, said this, and I quote, "When people with opinions similar to King's open their mouths, they damage not only the Republican Party and the conservative brand, but our nation as a whole. Some in our party wonder why Republicans are constantly accused of racism. It is because of our silence when things like this are said."

Bravo, Senator Scott. You are absolutely right. You can't have it both ways. You can't argue for a wall to keep migrants out without being accused of racism. And when it comes to the wall, Congressman King has out-Trumped Trump. There's this photo. It's from the early days of the Trump administration, Congressman King showing his own model of a wall to John Kelly just before he became the Secretary of Homeland Security.

And this tweet just a few months later, quote, "Congress will fund the wall. Trump will build a wall. It is a mandate from the American people. Honor the mandate from we the people." Like I said, this is the direction the GOP chose, and what you get when you do that is Donald Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists, and some, I assume, are good people. Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States. I think there's blame on both sides. You had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people on both sides.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: What you get is a manufactured crisis over the wall and a government shutdown that is poised to become the longest in our nation's history. The President upping the ante today, calling the crisis at the border a crisis of his own make making and invasion. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You know, we have a country that is under siege. You could actually -- you know, a lot of people don't like the word invasion. We have a country that is being invaded by criminals and by drugs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And we're going to stop it. That was the last part? This is the direction the GOP chose, but it didn't have to be this way. We've talked before about Ronald Reagan's final address of his presidency.

[22:35:04] And I want you to listen to some -- these are more wise words from the 40th President.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RONALD REAGAN, FORMER PRESIDENT OF UNTED STATES OF AMERICA: I've spoken of the shining city all my political life. In my mind, it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teaming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace, a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors, and the doors were opened to anyone with the will and the heart to get here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: My gosh, contrast that to the Oval Office speech just a few nights ago. Walls with doors, doors open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That sounds to me like making America greater. It's always been great.

Lots to talk about tonight with Nia-Malika Henderson, and Charlie Dent. We'll dig into that next.

[22:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: So Republican Congressman Steve King was unapologetic today about his latest shocking comments, this time about white supremacy, but what does that all say about the state of the Republican Party? Here to discuss, Nia-Malika Henderson, and former Republican Congressman Charlie Dent. Good evening to both of you.

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER, CNN: Good evening.

LEMON: Charlie, what's wrong with Steve King?

CHARLIE DENT, (R) FORMER U.S. REPRESENTATIVE, PENNSYLVANIA: Well, as you went through a long litany of his history, and I think this time he is just finally gotten to the point where I think the leadership has finally woken up and said enough and that it's time that there's a change. There's a primary opponent, primary move.

My feeling, this is almost like a Todd Aiken moment. You know, when he made those comments about legitimate rape, and everybody just stopped and said, this is just, so out of bounds, we've got to do something about it, enough.

And they got -- it's -- he is unapologetic about it, and it's just a really sad point, but I think it speaks to a larger issue. I've been worried about this nativist, protectionist, isolationist element within the Republican Party that is -- those are just bad characteristics, bad traits, and I think it can lead at times to some of these times of really ugly --

LEMON: That is why he feels so emboldened, you think, because of just the climate that has been out there?

DENT: Yes. I think that is part of it, absolutely. I think that is a part of it. And I don't know how you put an end to it other than Tim Scott, I thought, nailed it very nicely --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: I want to talk about that, but hold on. Does he feel protected or like he is bulletproof somehow because no one really -- you know, people may say stuff, but no one really does anything about it?

DENT: Well, I'll tell you what. I think the issue is he's been making some of these types of comments now for several years --

LEMON: For years, yes.

DENT: -- And he was just re-elected. I mean his constituents or whatever, and he was still elected. Now, he barely won this time, and I suspect that this -- I think he is finally gone a bridge too far.

LEMON: All right. Nia, hi. Welcome.

HENDERSON: Hey there.

LEMON: So, this is the reaction from the House GOP leadership, OK, and I'm going to give some quotes. Reckless, wrong, offensive, abhorrent, racist, but what good is outcome if there's no accountability?

HENDERSON: Yes. I think that is right. I mean is he going to be formally censured? Is he going to be stripped of any committee positions he has? Again, he has been saying these types of things for years, and I think the issue here is much broader than Steve King.

You played that clip from Ronald Reagan, for instance. I mean Ronald Reagan himself played to racial fears and racialized stereotypes. I mean he was one of the people who really popularized the term "welfare queens." And when he launched his campaign, he very much was kind of using the southern strategy, talking about states' rights in the south, which was obviously seen as a dog whistle to folks in the south, who used the idea of states' rights to defend segregation.

So this has been a long problem, I think, in the GOP, and you have Donald Trump come along and really pick up a lot of these pieces and strains in the Republican Party that we've seen over the last 50 years and really, I think, put them all together in a really toxic brew that was successful for him in 2016.

Even to somebody like Steve King, he borrowed -- Donald Trump borrowed from Steve King a lot of the language of that he saw Steve King use with his constituents there in Iowa. So it's a problem that is much bigger, I think, than Steve King.

You see in that editorial that Tim Scott obviously talking about Steve King there, but also essentially saying without saying that anybody who uses this kind of language, it's a problem, and shame on the GOP for being silent.

LEMON: Yes.

HENDERSON: You know, and the thing is Tim Scott had been silent in some ways, and certainly, much of the GOP had been silent around the birtherism claims that were so popular in the GOP, and of course Donald Trump picked up on those as well.

LEMON: Yes. So let's talk about -- you wanted to respond to the Tim Scott op-ed, OK, Charlie. So, let's let you do it now. He condemned King in the "Washington Post," and he writes in part, "Some in our party wonder why Republicans are constantly accused of racism. It is because of our own silence when things like this are said." How big of a problem, honestly, is this in your party?

DENT: Well, it's -- I think it's a bigger problem than anybody would like to admit. I think that is -- that is the reality. Don, I'll share an experience that I had with you once when I was in the House when I was running my bill on military construction and the V.A. for the Appropriations Committee, and somebody tried to offer an amendment to make it easier to permit the display of the confederate flag at veterans' cemeteries, and I objected to this.

[22:45:03] I remember getting a lot of grief over this from some members, because I said I really didn't appreciate it, and they couldn't understand why I would block the display of the confederate flag. And I said, I was -- I'm from Pennsylvania, and we won that war. You know, that's how I answer them. I said, you know, I really don't want to have to answer this anymore. I don't think we should have this discussion at all.

And this was even after Nicki Haley had taken down the confederate battle flag in the South Carolina State Capitol grounds. So we were having this debate after the fact. And this wasn't on television. It was behind the scenes, but I'm having this argument with some members over the confederate flag and I don't want anything to do with it.

LEMON: Thank you both. I thank you both. We'll continue the conversation.

HENDERSON: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Have a good weekend.

Stay with us. Washington Governor Jay Inslee is with me next.

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LEMON: The Federal Government, get this, is on the verge of the longest shut down in history and with Democrats not budging on the president's demands for a border wall funding, there is no end in sight to all of this.

Jay Inslee is the Democratic Governor of Washington State and he joins me now. It's good to see you again. Thank you so much for coming on. Happy New Year to you by the way.

GOV. JAY INSLEE (D) WASHINGTON: Thank you. Yes, it's been a happy new year so far, except for this.

LEMON: I'm sure -- yes.

I'm sure you saw the breaking news that we did or you at least read a little bit on it on "The New York Times" report tonight that the FBI opened an inquiry into whether Trump was possibly working on behalf of Russia. What do you think of that?

INSLEE: Well, I think first off there might have been a legitimate question of whether Donald Trump was a Russian asset, but we certainly know he has been a liability since he's been in Office. That has been clear. And what I would say about this is that this is a good sign.

Every time one of our pillars of democracy gives us hope that we will be able to restrain rogue activities out of the White House, it's a really positive thing because I think when you think of the Trump administration, the long term question will be whether democracy and its fundamentals has remained healthy and intact. That means that no one can hold us hostage successfully. That means that no one can subvert justice and that no one can obstruct justice.

So the fact that the FBI had enough courage to start that process, in fact, if that happen, to me is a positive thing. Now, obviously, ultimately, the Mueller investigation, together with vigorous House of Representative investigations, need to get to the bottom of all of this and I believe that we will.

LEMON: Thank you for that response on that. Let's talk about the shutdown now because this government shutdown poses some challenge that are unique to your state. What are some of them?

INSLEE: Well, there's dozens of them. And the more you peel back this onion, you find out more how interrelated the federal and state governments are.

So for instance, I live in an island to get there, you tale a ferryboat from Seattle. We will not be able to have service on four of our ferry boats in the next several weeks. So we may not, again this is a risk, because you need to have Coast Guard inspections to certify them at a regular basis.

Now you wouldn't thought that a President holding hostage the American people could end up denying ferry service to people that have to get to an island or to another Puget Sound city, but that may be in the circumstance.

In a few weeks, we'll be looking at people losing that their nutrition for 800,000 people in food stamps as a possibility. And I have to tell you, I was in a meeting the other day, it was a mixed group, Democrats and Republicans. And I just ended up to what I was saying because I saw the Coast Guard facility over to my right.

And I said, it is not right that people who are bound and determined to save our lives are not getting paid. And that was probably the biggest ovation I've had from Republicans and Democrats alike.

And it's sad that we know have a -- an emergency involving national security because of border guards and others are not getting what they need because of the Presidential insecurity of this President. And this hostage taking and that is what it is needs to be defeated.

LEMON: I want to know how you see this shutdown, which by the way, in just over an hour, close an hour, it will be the longest one on record.

INSLEE: Yes.

LEMON: Is it a failure of governing in your opinion?

INSLEE: It's a hostage taking, pure and simple. Look, you know, I served in Congress many years. I respect people's disagreements, sincere disagreements about matters of policy, but we need to understand this situation. There was consensus of the 100 to zero in the Senate of a bill that both parties agreed to.

LEMON: Right.

INSLEE: The situation is we have a President who has this bumper sticker fixation who doesn't have the courage to stand up to Ann Coulter. And as a result, he is taking hostage my citizens who may not get their nutritional benefits, ferry riders that may not have a ferry to ride on, and federal workers who can't pay their rent tonight, and that is just wrong. And if we yield to this type of hostage taking protocol, God help us. So we cannot allow this to become standard operating procedure.

LEMON: Yes.

INSLEE: And what we got to hope for is that we will have enough Republicans and they're starting to crack in the Senate will stand up and say, we just can't do this to our people anymore. We can't allow Donald Trump's fixations to damage our people, and let's hope that that happens.

LEMON: Let's talk more about the cause of this shutdown because you hit on some points here about the cause of it.

[22:55:05] And I think it's frustrating to many people when they say it's a both sides as well as, you know, obviously the Democrats are dug in as well, but there was an agreement and the President is the one who decided to shut down the government. He has moved the goal posts. He's fixated on building a border wall between U.S. and Mexico. But you represent a state that shares a border with Canada. And compared to the South, there are fractions of customs and border patrol agents. Do we need the wall?

INSLEE: Listen, everybody who has any ounce of information about this, Republicans and Democrats alike to some degree, understand that there are places where barrier makes sense for security purposes, but there's hundreds if not 1,000 miles of areas where it is an absolute waste of money.

You know how many people you could put to college? I don't know how many thousands, but it's in the thousands. Today, I announced a huge increase in financial aid for my students in Washington State. But instead of putting those people in college, you're going have some monuments to Donald Trump's personal insecurity out in a desert that isn't helping anybody do anything.

No. This is actually a threat to National Security, because it takes money away from things that are legitimate, things that we need to do perhaps in the Department of Defense.

LEMON: Yes.

INSLEE: Now, what he is threatening to do now, which is to take money out of the Department of Defense for things that do provide us National Security is itself weakening our protections.

LEMON: And governor, listen, I want to get to this in, sorry, because I'm up against the clock, I had to get to the top of the hour, but it's an important issue -- sorry to give you a short trip, I want to apologize -- but you announced a measure granting pardons to certain people with past marijuana convictions in your state.

INSLEE: Right.

LEMON: What was behind your decision and how has it gone so far?

INSLEE: Well, first, it's just unfair and unjust to have a life sentence of a blot on your record for something that is no longer illegal. And this prevents people sometimes we're getting financing, college loans, even take your kid on a field trip. So it's just a just thing to do. I think people understand that.

Second, listen, we have so much racial disparity in our criminal justice system. We know that people have use marijuana historically, kind of uniformly across ethnicity, but African-American people were convicted two to three times more often. So this is a small way to chip it away at the massive racial disparity that has haunted us for decades.

Third, I think it does help remove some of the stigma. Look, our country is moving towards legalization rapidly. If this helps other senators and governors to get a little dose of courage and federally legalize marijuana that will be a good thing. It's what the people want. We ought to do it. And we're going in the right direction. LEMON: The producer gods have granted us a little more time. So, I'm grateful for that. So, I have to ask you, you're headed to New Hampshire later this month. You just served as chair for the -- you know where this is going. You just served for the Democratic Governors Association. You helped flip seven states to Democrat. You just set up a Federal Political Action Committee. Sounds to me like someone who is running for President. Are you?

INSLEE: Well, I'm seriously considering it. I do have some very compelling convictions that we do need a President who will make climate change a paramount first and foremost issue, who will rally the American people to the tremendous capabilities we have as a nation that defeated fascism and put a man on the moon, and we need that same type of rallying cry from the Presidential office right now.

I don't think it will be bad to have a governor who is part of the effort that is created the best economic -- the best economy in the nation, because of the progressive things we've done of net neutrality and paid family leave and raising the minimum wage and doing gender pay equity and having a great transportation infrastructure program when they can't build a birdhouse in Washington, D.C.

So I am considering it. And I'll be in Nevada tomorrow talking to some great Democrats. They've elected a lot of Democrats in Nevada.

LEMON: Sounds like a stump speech to me. Don't' give it all the way, right here. But when you announced, come on. You got to go. Your satellite is going to go way in three, two, one --

INSLEE: We'll see.

LEMON: -- we got to go. Thank you. Good luck to you. Have a great weekend. Thank you, Governor.

INSLEE: Thank you. You bet.

LEMON: We'll be back with our breaking news on -- that's fine.

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