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Don Lemon Tonight
Sen. Cory Booker (D-NJ) Was Interviewed About Who He Thinks Will Win in the South Carolina Primary Tomorrow; A Pandemic Can't Stop Trump from Lying; School Closed Due to Possible Community Transmission; House Passes Bill to Make Lynching a Federal Crime in Historic Vote; The State of the 2020 Democratic Presidential Race Hours Before the South Carolina Primary. Aired 11p-12a ET
Aired February 28, 2020 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[23:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon.
We've got a busy hour coming up. And here are tonight's big headlines.
The 65th case of coronavirus was just confirmed here in the U.S. This is now the third case of unknown origin in this country. The person being treated worked at an elementary school that is now closed until Wednesday. Are we entering a new phase of the epidemic?
And the coronavirus outbreak is rattling financial markets. Why did the markets fall so far so fast this week and what could be next?
Plus, state of the race. We're just hours away from South Carolina voters heading to the polls. This primary is critical to the future of Joe Biden's campaign. Can he win big? I'm going to ask former Democratic presidential candidate Senator Cory Booker.
And President Trump also in South Carolina tonight, using a campaign rally to troll Democrats and push conspiracy theories like this one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. One of my people came up to me and said, Mr. President, they tried to beat you on Russia, Russia, Russia. That didn't work out too well. They couldn't do it. They tried the impeachment hoax.
(CROWD BOOING)
TRUMP: That was on a perfect conversation. They tried anything. They tried it over and over. They've been doing it since you got in. It's all turning. They lost. It's all turning. Think of it, think of it. And this is their new hoax.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: We're going to get to the truth and we're going to talk to Daniel Dale. He's here to give us a Trump fact check.
But first, I want to get to the coronavirus outbreak, here to discuss this, Max Boot -- Boot. Max is a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. Catherine Rampell is here, Washington Post columnist. And Dr. Waleed Javaid, the director of Infection Prevention and Control at Mount Sinai Downtown, and Akane Otani, a markets reporter for the Wall Street Journal.
I'm so glad to have all of you here. Thank you so much. Dr. Javaid, I'm going to start with you. Today we learned two more coronavirus cases in the U.S. where the origin is unknown. One more person in California, and an elementary school employee in Oregon. The school is now closed until Wednesday. All of those students and teachers are they at risk now?
WALEED JAVAID, DIRECTOR, INFECTION PREVENTION AND CONTROL, MOUNT SINAI DOWNTOWN: So, I would imagine they are at potential risk. But I would leave it to the public health officials to determine the risks. We don't know a lot of details.
Being a teacher in school doesn't mean -- he was working at school during the exposure. There's a lot of things that they need to look at and a lot more information needs to come out before we can determine.
LEMON: At this point is it inevitable that more people will contract this virus, the coronavirus in this country?
JAVAID: So, we expect more people to show or come out with the coronavirus or get diagnosed with coronavirus in the coming days, weeks, and possibly months, at this time.
LEMON: Yes. Max, you know, a public health crisis, that's when we need leadership. That's when we need science, that's when we need truth, we need facts. Does this outbreak show that the dangerous weakness of this administration, of the Trump administration?
MAX BOOT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Yes, absolutely, Don. I mean, it's hard to imagine anything more irresponsible than the president going to this rally, going on TV and saying this is a hoax. I mean, he is echoing the worst elements of his base, people like Rush Limbaugh and others who are saying this is some of conspiracy against Donald Trump.
Now that of course feeds into Trump's conspiracy mongering and, you know, his inveterate suspicion that everything is a plot against him. But what kind of message is that sending to his followers?
Because there really are people out there who actually believe what Donald Trump says, there are people who believe what Rush Limbaugh says, there are people who listen to these voices. And what kind of message does it send to say, don't be worried, this is liberal Democratic plot against Donald Trump that does that mean they're not going to take the proper precautions, they're not going to listen to public health authorities?
I mean, this is a danger to public health what the president of the United States is doing, feeding his fantasies and paranoia.
LEMON: Yes. Listen, doctor, I know this is not a political question, but is this -- is this a hoax?
JAVAID: Coronavirus?
LEMON: Yes.
JAVAID: Or infections from coronavirus?
LEMON: Yes.
JAVAID: We have known about infections from coronavirus for a while. And we have seen these infections here as well as in the novel coronavirus. So, I can't call it a hoax in that sense.
[23:05:05]
LEMON: Yes. Thank you for that. And I don't want -- and I don't you to answer a political question. But I think people need to know that science is real, that facts are real.
So, let's talk about other facts because this administration, Catherine, has made cuts to the CDC, the National Security Council, two groups really that are key to coordinating and responding to growing -- a growing epidemic. How does this impact Americans?
CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think there are a number of actions that this administration has taken that, in retrospect, were -- well, in retrospect and probably in real-time were extremely wrongheaded and left us very unprepared for a crisis such as this, right? Or a potential crisis such as the one that we're facing right now.
One has to do with disbanding the guy on the National Security Council, or the portion of the National Security Council that dealt with pandemics. There have also been a number of changes, policy changes that make it harder for people to have good health insurance. Right?
We've lost or something like a million people who have lost their health insurance since Trump took over as president. That's going to make it more difficult or at least raise the barriers for people to go seek care if, in fact, they're showing symptoms.
Discrediting experts, also extremely, extremely unhelpful. And of course, as we were talking about yesterday evening, all of the little lies that this administration has told again and again and again about dumb things, like crowd size or whether windmills give you cancer, those kinds of things mean that --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Or hurricanes paths with sharpies.
RAMPELL: Right. Right. I mean, I would say that was not a dumb thing. That was actually a significant thing that also put people's lives at risk.
But the fact that they can't be trusted to tell the truth when the stakes are so low suggests that people won't be willing to trust them when the stakes are actually quite high, even if they do tell the truth. Even if from here on out miraculously they adhere to whatever the facts are, why should anyone take their word at face value?
And it's extremely troubling to me that not only have they been willing to fritter away the political appointees, or you know, the senior principal's credibility but we're also seeing reporting that any scientists and public health experts have to clear their public comments through Pence's office first.
So, if those experts want to say something reassuring to the public and it's true, again, how much trust will people place in those comments?
There were reports today that Dr. Anthony Fauci, the noted public health expert had been booked to go on to all the Sunday shows this current weekend and was basically told to stand down.
I mean, what kind of signal does that send to the public? Does it send to the public all -- you know, the message that all is well if, in fact, we're not letting one of our most authoritative health experts go out and tell the truth?
LEMON: Akane, I want to bring you in, because last week U.S. stocks were at record levels, seemingly unphased by the coronavirus, and then this week we saw the worst week of stocks since 2008, which was the height of the financial crisis. How do we explain this sudden fall?
AKANE OTANI, REPORTER, WALL STREET JOURNAL: Well, Don, up until a couple weeks ago, even, I had been hearing from a number of money managers who were actually surprised that stocks here had been so resilient because they were seeing what was happening in China, increasingly, Japan, South Korea and they were questioning, well, how can we be sure that this epidemic doesn't come to the U.S., how can we be sure that we're not actually going to see a big disruption in economic activity here?
And over the weekend we started to see reports that actually the number of cases in Italy had spiked. We had seen transmission of cases in Iran. And I think that really drove home the message to a lot of people that actually maybe stocks were sort of priced for this perfect scenario, where the U.S. was going to escape the brunt of the impact of the epidemic.
And then on Tuesday we saw the CDC say, listen, I think schools and businesses should actually start preparing for the possibility that this disease spreads further in the U.S. And I think those two things combined really brought to home to investors that maybe they were a little bit too optimistic about what things were looking like and that maybe we were due for a pullback.
LEMON: As the Dow fell, this is what we heard from the national economic council director, Larry Kudlow, this will be for you. This is on Fox News. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, U.S. NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: I still think long-term investors should give very serious thought to coming back in or adding to their positions in the stock market. It looks like we will weather this and this is not going to last forever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Government officials giving stock advice, Max?
BOOT: Well, I mean, it's not crazy to have Larry Kudlow out there trying to keep the market up.
LEMON: Right.
BOOT: But the problem is they have zero credibility because these guys lie all the time and what they're saying is divorced from reality and it's at odds with what the public health officials are saying.
[23:09:59]
They're saying everything is great. We got it under control. Everything is wonderful and the public health officials are saying, as we just noted, hey, you've got to prepare because this could be really bad. And the market is getting freaked out and it's not reassured by hearing Larry Kudlow give kind of the party line.
I mean, this reminds me of a line that a friend of mine (Inaudible) said, which is that, you know, when Trump and the people who work for him, when they say that you should be concerned you should actually be calm about the situation, when they're saying you ought to be calm, that's when you ought to be concerned. And right now, they're saying you ought to be calm and it's not reassuring, it's not credible.
LEMON: Yes.
RAMPELL: I think it's very inappropriate. I disagree with you slightly about this.
BOOT: OK.
RAMPELL: But I think it's very inappropriate for the president to have his economic adviser go out and try to pump the stock markets.
LEMON: What do you think, Akane? How does Wall Street respond to this kind of comment from the president economic -- the economic adviser talking up the stock market?
OTANI: Well, it didn't stop us from losing $3.6 trillion from the stock market. So, I think you can interpret that your own way. But you know, there also is something to be said about the fact that investors recognize that nobody in this administration can tell us for sure that we're not going to see a serious spike in cases here. And I think that's the main source of uncertainty that's really
rattling Wall Street right now. Nobody, whether, you know, no matter the political spectrum you're talking about, can really say for certain that this is not going to disrupt economic growth.
LEMON: Dr. Javaid, the CDC said it wants every state and local health department testing for coronavirus at the end of next week. At this point is that even possible there are enough test kits?
JAVAID: So, I'm not sure about how many test kits are going to become available but that's what they're planning and they're planning for -- they have been planning for several weeks now. So, I would imagine they will have enough test kits to be able to cover the entirety of the country.
LEMON: Yes. Catherine, I want you to listen to this, this is what the president's allies are claiming, that Democrats in the media are focusing on the coronavirus, just to hurt the president. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICK MULVANEY, ACTING WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: The reason you're -- so you're seeing so much attention to it today is that they think this is going to be what brings town the president.
DONALD TRUMP, JR., DONALD TRUMP'S SON: Anything that they can use to try to hurt Trump, they will. For them to try to take a pandemic and seemingly hope that it comes here, and kills millions of people so that they could end Donald Trump's streak of winning is a new level of sickness.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: These comments are, as I said earlier, despicable and reprehensible and they're taking their cues from the president.
RAMPELL: I think it is extremely unhelpful to give the understatement of the century.
Look, I remember when it used to be the right-wing mantra that facts don't care about your feelings. I don't know if anybody else at this table remembers that but that used to be the chant not very long ago about left wing snowflakes, facts don't care about your feelings.
Well, I would add that probably pandemics don't care about your political grievances either. You can't just wish away this risk that the economy faces, that public health faces, by trying to scapegoat Trump's political enemies, or at least perceived political enemies. I kind of understand, I guess, the strategy in calling other things a hoax, you know, calling some sort of political scandal a hoax.
LEMON: I don't get this one.
RAMPELL: But for this, I mean, this is like easily disprovable, if your grandmother gets sick and dies, you know, you can't just say, that was a hoax, there was no such thing as the epidemic. LEMON: I don't -- Max, I really don't understand this one. It's just
-- this one is just really mindboggling.
BOOT: I think it's kind of kneejerk, trying to wish away bad news and freaking out about the stock market. Because you're right, Don, it doesn't make any sense, it certainly doesn't make any sense from the standpoint of what a president should be doing but even from the standpoint of a political self-interest. Because what is his incentive right now? To say everything is wonderful, everything is great if there's suddenly a huge outbreak.
People are going to say, you know, why weren't you prepared? Or if he goes the other way and if he shows some proper concern now, and if it's not as bad as feared going forward, then he'll get credit. And he can say we headed this off and prevented this from happening. So, it doesn't make any sense logically, it doesn't makes any sense, politically. But this is, you know Donald Trump. He doesn't -- he's not entirely rational, frankly.
LEMON: I want to end on a medical note here. So, folks are going to their primary care physician, trying to get some information, trying to get some comfort or whatever, but who are -- what are doctors, who are doctors looking to get their information on coronavirus?
JAVAID: So, there are several sources that we are looking at, including CDC, public health has regular calls with hospitals and health care workers, they provide us information and updates and CDC has been very good and proactive in providing information as quickly as it is available to everyone.
LEMON: All right. Thank you all. I really appreciate it. Thanks so much.
President Trump holding a rally tonight as coronavirus spreads and not only was he focused on his campaign while the country is on edge, but he made a lot of dubious comments about the disease. A Trump fact check with Daniel Dale is next.
[23:15:01]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Now time for the Trump fact check. The president went to South Carolina tonight for a rally just hours before the primary and he's repeating some questionable claims involving statement as the pressure rises over coronavirus.
Here to help with -- to help us sort through all of this, CNN fact checker ordinaire, Daniel Dale. Hello, Daniel.
DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: Hey, Don.
LEMON: President Trump was asked about the stock market drop this week as he left the White House earlier. He mentioned the virus but added this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think they're not very happy with the Democrat candidates when they see them. I think that has an impact.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: OK. So, he said some version of that a few times this week but does that hold water?
DALE: It doesn't, Don. It obviously doesn't. In one of the earlier versions the president suggested that investor had -- investors had watched the Tuesday Democratic debate and then suddenly panicked.
[23:19:58]
If you take a look at the chart of the Dow and other markets it had been declining since late last week, well before the debate.
And just to depart for a moment from the somber fact-checker persona, like come on, this is -- this is laughable stuff the idea that investors are suddenly freaking out about a Democratic primary that's been going on for almost a near you is just completely absurd.
LEMON: It is. It's ridiculous. I just don't -- I don't understand it. Daniel, at his rally in South Carolina the president tied the coronavirus response to his border policy. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We must understand that border security is also health security. We will do everything in our power to keep the infection and those carrying the infection from entering our country. We have no choice.
Whether it's the virus that we're talking about, or many other public health threats, the Democrat policy of open borders is a direct threat to the health and wellbeing of all Americans. Now you see it with the coronavirus. You see it.
(APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Is there any evidence undocumented immigrants have brought this over the border, Daniel?
DALE: There is none, Don, nor is there evidence that any of the policy proposals like Trump wrongly describes as open borders, like accepting more refugees, not building a wall, showing more compassion to asylum seekers, would have resulted in the virus spreading more widely.
This is the Trump playbook, we see it in election after election, he tries to portray immigrants as scary, not only in committing crime, but in bringing disease and other health issues. It's without evidence. LEMON: And people are cheering it, wow.
DALE: Yes.
LEMON: OK, the president talks several times about his wall tonight, still holding onto one of his favorite 2016 campaign promises. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: You know what they say now, OK, he's building the wall. But Mexico's not paying for it. Yes, they are, actually, they are, they are, they are paying for it.
(APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Still false, right?
DALE: It's still -- this will eternally be false. American taxpayers are paying for the wall. I said this over and over on your show. American taxpayers are paying through congressionally appropriated money plus billions of dollars Trump as himself seized from military programs.
He's hinted that there's some big reveal coming, we'll eventually learn how Mexico is paying. So, I guess I'll old out a smidgen of hope that he will have an explanation, but I don't have too much.
LEMON: President Trump in full reelection campaign mode tonight, making this false claim about prescription drug prices. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: People don't know but in the last year prescription drug prices came down for the first time in 51 years.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And that was with no Democrat help. If we had their help, we could low it by 50 percent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: What's the reality here, Daniel?
DALE: So, what Trump is doing here is both using an outdated figure and exaggerating what even that outdated figure said. So, here's what happened.
In 2018, one measure of prescription drug prices, the consumer price index, did show the first calendar year decline in 46 years, not 51. Still pretty good. But in 2019, that same measure showed about a 3 percent increase, 2019 is now last year. And so, Trump keeps citing this accomplishment that's now been replaced by a non-accomplishment. LEMON: OK. Wow. OK, thank you, Daniel, have a good weekend.
DALE: Thank you.
LEMON: Only hours left until South Carolina votes for their pick to lead the Democratic party. Senator Cory Booker is here to talk about who thinks -- who he thinks can win this race.
[23:25:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: And now to the state of the race. Voters will head to the polls for the South Carolina primary tomorrow. It is the last before Super Tuesday next week.
Joining me now to discuss is Senator Cory Booker, a former Democratic candidate for president. How you doing?
SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): I'm doing really well.
LEMON: You're getting more sleep I'm sure.
BOOKER: I have a lot more sleep. But I'm running again for reelection for the Senate now, so I went from president now to try to defeat my seat in New Jersey.
LEMON: It never ends.
BOOKER: Never does.
LEMON: Few short hours, South Carolina primary, you spent a lot of time campaigning, talking to voters. What do you see happening tomorrow?
BOOKER: I think there's going -- it's an exciting state. It always has been. When I was in the race, I was very excited about South Carolina, because you have a lot of African-American turnout and a part of the electorate that is pivotal for the Democratic Party in those Great Lake states.
So, this will be a major contest. I think with so much hand wringing, so much worrying, only 3 percent of the delegates have been assigned.
LEMON: Yes.
BOOKER: It all gets going. South Carolina then boom Super Tuesday.
LEMON: The majority of Democratic voters are black. This could be a change of course in this race.
BOOKER: Very much so in terms of suddenly going to Super Tuesday will be the same, African-American voters kicking in a very significant way. And remember, this is a critical for winning the primary, you have southern states coming online, you have states all the way up to Maryland, have majority primary voters, or African-American. But I also want to see what happens because, remember, if Hillary Clinton and I got the same amount of African-American turnout, in just three states that Barack Obama did, she would be president of the United States right now, such a key demographic. And so, this is a proving ground. Can you energize, engage, excite, ignite African- American support?
LEMON: All right. Let's talk a little bit more about that. Because Super Tuesday is just a couple days afterwards so then what is the strategy do you think moving forward, especially for candidates who don't happen to have a billion dollars in this world?
[23:30:00]
BOOKER: You -- it's a hard thing that you come out of South Carolina and now you have more states than most people have money for. And so a lot of it is going to be the narrative that gets baked after that. Who's got the perception of momentum? Who's got the perception of strength going in?
And I think a lot of it is going to be the narrative that you all do, that's going to be informing a lot of folks. So, strong finishes in South Carolina. And there won't be just one winner. Remember, others can pick up delegates, too. It's going to be very important going into this big, big delegate haul.
LEMON: Yes. So, you know, a lot of people -- well, not a lot of people, but many counted Biden out, right?
BOOKER: Yes.
LEMON: But it looks like he's going to do well. You don't know until the last vote is counted, right? Do you think he can win?
BOOKER: Absolutely. This is anyone's game and what has been --
LEMON: I don't just mean in South Carolina, but --
BOOKER: I know --
LEMON: -- you win South Carolina --
BOOKER: Clearly. No, I mean, he can win the nominee.
LEMON: Yes.
BOOKER: Anybody who's drawing conclusions about this primary outcome from three percent of the delegates, I just don't understand that. This is not a time to worry. It's a time to work, work for your candidate, work for the person you believe in, volunteer shifts, phone calls, contributions online.
All of these things going into the biggest part of this election when it really does kick in are really important. This is anybody's contest. We have seen already the life, death, life of candidates. This is it. Everything's on the line. This is the poll that matters. It is actually the day that people go to the polls.
LEMON: I always bring up John McCain. John McCain was flying on the private plane, I remember, and then all of the sudden, he's (INAUDIBLE), he's pulling his own luggage --
BOOKER: Yes.
LEMON: -- to the airport, carrying to the airport, then he becomes the nominee.
BOOKER: John Kerry was -- he became the nominee when he was -- pulled his campaign out, fired his campaign manager. Everybody said he was in free fall. He ended up pulling it out.
LEMON: So let's talk about the Trump campaign announcing this week they're open up community centers. They're trying to engage black vote. They're trying to get the black vote. They got this "woke" thing where they're targeting black voters. He only has to pull a certain number of black voters in order to win. Do you think he can pull enough to hurt Democrats?
BOOKER: Well, first of all, if people look at the facts, this has been a presidency with over racism, failing to condemn white supremacy that has attacked Betsy DeVos, shutting down the office of civil rights, stopping to protect African American kids, gutting the safety net.
I can go through all the things that fundamentally hurt me, even asthma rates which are disproportionately higher and hurting them, doing nothing about maternal mortality rates that are four times higher for African American women. I can go through all the things that this president is doing to actively hurt black and brown people, black and brown communities.
But they clearly are making a political play. You see that from their Super Bowl ad. You see that from the noise that they're making right now. Their goal is not to win the black vote. That will not happen. But it seems like their play is to do what they saw the last time. Either reduce black turnout, you see vicious, awful voter suppression activities going on, his Justice Department doing nothing to protect voting rights.
So you have them trying to do things to suppress the African American vote and to try to scrape and attract five percent, six percent, and to them that's a winning formula. Suppress, people take away voting rights, suppress votes through non-defensive Voting Rights Act and more, and then do things to see if they can get a few blacks to come on over.
LEMON: Do you think he can do it or they can do it?
BOOKER: Look, we've seen darker chapters.
(LAUGHTER)
BOOKER: The answer to this is not worry, it is work. I, for one, am going to be -- I've got my own race to run in New Jersey. I hope people support my campaign. But I'm out on the field doing everything I can to engage voters and get them out.
LEMON: Speaking of the race, you look at New Hampshire, and you look at the democratic calendar for president. Imagine if it was reversed and it started in South Carolina. Look at how it may have turned out for you and for Senator Kamala Harris.
BOOKER: Yes.
LEMON: You know --
BOOKER: Look, this is not the time.
LEMON: If it started in more diverse --
BOOKER: This is not the time. I think there should be a post mortem at the end of this election season after November about what the Democratic Party can do to make it more fair and inclusive. Right now, my goal is to inspire people to rally around whoever our nominee is going to ultimately be.
LEMON: On Wednesday, the House voted almost unanimously to pass the Emmett Till Antilynching Act which designates lynching as a federal crime. You co-sponsored the Senate version of the bill last year. A long time coming. It's finally going to happen.
BOOKER: So this is anguish in our country's history. It is unaddressed pain and hurt and wretchedness. There's been 200 attempts to pass this before, thousands of Americans between the 1800s and 1950s, thousands of Americans lynched and killed. This is business undone. Thank god we've done this.
It's passed in the House, passed unanimously in the Senate, bipartisan. Give a lot of credit to the leadership of Kamala Harris, a lot of credit to the bipartisan leadership of Tim Scott on the republican side.
[23:35:00]
BOOKER: Two of my -- first time in the history of America we've had three African Americans in the United States Senate. But what's exciting to me is that this is not just correcting the ills of the past. But remember, this would cover the hate crime against Matthew Shepard, LGBTQ folks, wherever two or people getting together to do hate crime like this.
We now have said finally, we put on a federal crime for everything from just smoking marijuana or possession of marijuana. This is finally saying for this heinous act, it's now the federal government says this is wrong, this is a day of justice, it's a day to rejoice, a day our ancestors finally breathe a sigh of relief for us getting this job done.
LEMON: It's not a time to be complacent. There are lot of work to be done in this country right now. LEMON: Don, I'm sorry. White supremacy is on the rise. Since 9/11, there have been more terrorist attacks coming from our own country, right-wing extremists, and white supremacists than we've seen from any kind of international terrorism.
This has got to be a season of love. We've got to get back to fighting for a more beloved community. We've got to do the things to protect folks from being lynched.
But ultimately, we've got to try to create within our culture and understand that we need each other and we got to come together, stand together, and make this the nation we say it is. Patriotism, at the end of the day, is love of country. You cannot love your country unless you love your country, men and women, all of them.
LEMON: Thank you, sir.
BOOKER: Thank you. Thank you very much.
LEMON: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:40:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: More now on the state of the race as South Carolina -- the South Carolina primary is just hours away. Let's discuss now with CNN political commentator, Mr. Mark McKinnon, the executive producer of "The Circus" on Showtime, Toluse Olorunnipa, White House reporter for The Washington Post, and Ron Brownstein, senior editor at The Atlantic. How did you guys like that? That was good, right?
RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: That was good, very dramatic.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Mark, I'm going to start with you. Hours away from the South Carolina primary and you are there. What is your sense on the ground? What are folks saying about how this might go?
MARK MCKINNON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, the conventional wisdom is that Biden has got little windows back, had the Clyburn endorsement which is a big deal, some polls were looking better, and a pretty good debate performance. That's all looking good.
And that Bernie, maybe that's who has deflated a little bit. Been out to a bunch of his rallies and there's not the kind of attendance that we've seen in some of the earlier states. My gut, though, is that while Biden may come out of here pretty well and give himself, you know, a comeback kid's story, I think the bigger story here, I am curious what Ron thinks, is that black turnout may actually not be that high. All of the events I've gone to just don't seem like turnouts that heavy. So Biden may be a good story out of here. There may be a longer term story for Democrats although the African American turnout was not that high. I also talked to the operation chaos people that are working for Trump. You know, this is a primary, it's an open primary, so Republicans don't have one since they cancelled it because Trump is the only candidate. So they can cross over and vote in the democratic primary. There is some meddling going on here which, of course, is very rare for South Carolina.
LEMON: He asked them to do that tonight at the rally. Go ahead, Ron. How was the turnout?
BROWNSTEIN: So far, the turnout has not been great for the Democrats. They had a solid turnout in New Hampshire. But in the two caucuses, they were disappointing. It's been sort of a challenge for Sanders. His core general election argument is that he's going to mobilize an impressive turnout. That is how he is going to beat Trump. We haven't really seen it so far in the primaries.
I do think South Carolina -- you know, the history of South Carolina is the candidate who seems to be at the head of the final round usually wins by even more. There's kind of top spin in the result in that way.
But even if Biden does get a boost out of South Carolina, the biggest thing Bernie Sanders has done since 2016, I think without question, is expand his support in the Latino community through a lot of very diligent organizing.
And that is something that could pay off big time on Super Tuesday in California and Texas, and allow him to blunt even a recovery by Biden in some of these southeast states with a big African American population.
LEMON: When was the fish fry? Was it today? Clyburn, did he have it? Did he do the fish fry? I thought he usually has it before the --
BROWNSTEIN: No.
LEMON: No, my bad.
BROWNSTEIN: Not right before, no.
LEMON: Not right before, OK. So Toluse, Democrats are making their final push in South Carolina. But Super Tuesday is next week. Bloomberg is looming. Senator Sanders holds a big lead in California and Texas.
TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST, WHITE HOUSE REPORTER FOR THE WASHINGTON POST: Yes, we could actually see a situation in which Bloomberg ends up taking some votes away from Biden or some of the other moderates and makes it easier for Sanders to come out of Super Tuesday with strong delegate lead.
That's not what Bloomberg thought he would be doing when he put hundreds of millions of dollars to the race. He thought he would be the sort of the Sanders killer. He could end up helping Sanders really consolidate his lead.
Biden obviously wants to have a strong showing on Saturday in South Carolina, hoping that that will catapult him into Super Tuesday. But right now, he's running up against a juggernaut when it comes to Bloomberg and his millions of dollars in all of these Super Tuesday states, and it could be a situation where they split the vote.
Sanders comes out on top and is really off to the races before next round of major races later in March, and then off to the races towards the convention.
So, Bloomberg could end up doing something he did not want to do, which is pave the path of Sanders to the nomination.
LEMON: All right. Mark --
BROWNSTEIN: Can I just jump in?
LEMON: Go ahead.
[23:45:00]
BROWNSTEIN: It really raises the question of what Bloomberg does the day after Super Tuesday. If he does not win any states, if he finishes behind Biden almost everywhere, certainly if he finishes well behind Biden in the delegate count, what would be the rationale at that point for going forward?
I mean, he basically presented himself as kind of the last ditch, you know, for the centrists of the parties to stop Sanders if in fact, as Toluse was saying, he is kind of inhibiting that. And Biden is clearly stronger as the alternative. It's not really clear what the rationale would be for Bloomberg going forward at that point.
LEMON: All right. Speaking of billionaires, Mark, I want to bring you in because you caught up with billionaire presidential candidate Tom Steyer for your show "The Circus." Let's take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They say you're helping like Bernie Sanders by taking away votes from Biden. What do you say to those voters? What do you say to that argument?
TOM STEYER, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'd say that Biden doesn't own those votes. And for everybody who's an institutional politician who thinks that institutional politicians from Washington, D.C. own votes specifically black votes, I'd say that's crazy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just from a strategic practical point of view, at the end of the day, there's an argument to say you're taking votes away from Biden or even from Bloomberg or --
STEYER: Bernie.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Do you think from Bernie? STEYER: I don't think there's any question about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: The billionaires, two of them, really are shaking things up in this race.
MCKINNON: Well, he's the real "X" factor here, Don. He's not only spent a lot of money but a lot of time, a lot of effort in organizing. Yes, he is a billionaire, but he has invested heavily in his philanthropy, in his banks, community development banks. And he is -- he's been very -- you know, one of the leaders on environmental justice, on climate change related to communities of color.
So, it's not just his money. I went to his rally yesterday. It was a very diverse crowd, a very passionate crowd. He's not going to win this primary, but he's going to be a factor here and he's going to take some votes away not just from Biden and Bloomberg, as you said, but maybe from Bernie as well.
LEMON: Yes. Toluse, the president hosted a black history month event yesterday at the White House. We saw the image of these leaders and supporters saying a prayer with the president. The president had this to say about the meeting.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We had a great event yesterday. An event that was so beautiful. Young African American leaders. One of the things I asked them -- and I've been thinking about this for a long time -- great people, great people, some of them are here tonight -- do you like the name African American or black? And they said 'black' all at the same time.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: No. True. I tell you.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: Because you say African American or black. And they said almost like immediately 'black.' But we had an incredible group of people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Oh, my god. That was the first time I heard that. Oh, my god.
(LAUGHTER)
OLORUNNIPA: Yes, I don't know what you say to that.
LEMON: He says he's been thinking about that for a long time, Toluse.
(LAUGHTER)
OLORUNNIPA: Yes, this is a president who talked about Frederick Douglass in the present tense, saying he's starting to get more and more recognition. Obviously, the president has a long and controversial history with black voters.
But I do think that, you know, in all seriousness, that his campaign is actually trying to make a case for black voters, specifically for black men, saying that they can sort of peel off some of the margins, maybe even shave two or three points off of the typical democratic margins and really put themselves in a stronger position.
That's why you see them going into community centers, putting up ads and merchandise, targeting black voters because they think that if they can at least get a few points off or even get some black voters to stay home and not vote for Democrats, they may be in a better position.
And they may be able to show some suburban white voters that the president is not the racist that many voters think he is. And I think that's really what they're trying to do with this very blatant and open public campaign for the African American vote.
LEMON: Can anybody tell me what the point of that question would be? Anybody? Dealer (ph)? I mean --
MCKINNON: Dealer (ph).
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Honestly, I mean, I don't really get it, to that crowd, like why on earth would you be asking that question in particular, to like -- OK. Go ahead, Ron.
BROWNSTEIN: I would say, maybe, you know, it's interesting. It's almost like he's trying to establish it as a conservative -- for conservative African Americans, you know, to reject the title, right? I mean the name. And it's sort of like a general -- it seemed to me like kind of a backward-looking comment like so many of the things he says like about Christmas, you know, we can say merry Christmas again. That's the way I took it.
By the way, there are Sanders kind of allies who argue that, in fact, the Trump threat to African American men and even more so to Hispanic men --
LEMON: Yes. I got to go, Ron.
[23:50:00]
BROWNSTEIN: He could pull away on that and that's a reason to nominate Sanders.
LEMON: That was like a question that people used to ask about 20, 30 years ago when people would say African American and they didn't understand why. But that is so far beyond. Are we really going there anymore? We're past that. Thank you. Have a great weekend, everybody. BROWNSTEIN: Thank you.
OLORUNNIPA: Thank you.
LEMON: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Next week, we reveal our first CNN hero of 2020. But first, here is an update on last year's hero of the year. Ethiopia's Freweini Mebrahtu was honored for her innovative efforts to end the stigma around menstruation. Now, CNN's recognition has helped her open minds and doors back home.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: The 2019 CNN hero of the year is --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Freweini Mebrahtu.
(APPLAUSE)
FREWEINI MEBRAHTU, 2019 CNN HERO OF THE YEAR: I just could not believe it. To work so hard for this long, I felt like, oh, it is really important.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
MEBRAHTU: Almost the entire town was waiting for me at the airport. I don't deserve it. But the cause deserves it.
The Ethiopian president, she's been wonderful. It's like, wow, I'm in the national palace to talk about periods. We have a lot of work to do. But the silence has been broken.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Watch Anderson Cooper's full update to nominate someone you think should be a CNN hero at cnnheroes.com. Thanks for watching. Our coverage continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
