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Don Lemon Tonight
Rep. Raul Ruiz (D-CA) Is Interviewed About The Action Taken By The White House In Combating Coronavirus; Too Early For Joe Biden To Declare As The Overall Winner; Bernie Sanders Uses New Tactic To Get More Support; Sen. Bernie Sanders's 30-Second Television Ad Featuring Praise From Former President Obama Omits Some Important Context; State Of The 2020 Democratic Presidential Race; An Alabama Man Is To Be Executed For Murders He Didn't Commit? Aired 11p-12a ET
Aired March 04, 2020 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[23:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.
We have a busy hour coming up, and here are tonight's big headlines.
Joe Biden's historic comeback on Super Tuesday putting a new spin on the Democratic race for the nomination.
Elizabeth Warren is still in the race, but for how much longer? Biden's base coming out in full force. Can he hold on to it as he tries to capture the nomination?
Are Americans doing enough to protect themselves from coronavirus as the outbreak grows? I'm going to talk to a California congressman who is also a medical doctor.
Bernie Sanders using Barack Obama in a campaign ad, but Obama hasn't endorsed anyone. We'll see how effective the ad is.
A man set to be executed tomorrow in Alabama for the murders of three police officers, but he didn't pull the trigger. Tonight, we'll examine the facts of the case.
But first, Super Tuesday changing the race for the Democratic nomination.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are the campaign to defeat Donald Trump. Every Democrat out there, and most independents and some Republicans understand the moral imperative to defeat Donald Trump. And I believe that the nature of our campaign, which is grassroots, is the campaign to defeat Trump.
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And this is a movement we are building. It is a movement. And we need that movement to beat Donald Trump. And to build a future we all know is possible. You know, I'm especially proud of our campaign. It is generating so much enthusiasm, driving up voter turnout all across the nation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So joining me now, Mark McKinnon, he is a former advisor to George W. Bush and John McCain, also Washington Post columnist Catherine Rampell, and senior editor at the Atlantic, Ron Brownstein. Mark is also the executive producer of Showtime's, The Circus.
So, Ron, what are you going to run this weekend? Reruns, nothing to run, nothing going on? Mark, I should say Mark. Sorry. I said Mark, not Ron.
RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: You gave me a show.
LEMON: I meant Mark.
BROWNSTEIN: What are we going to have to fill the air time?
LEMON: What a difference a day makes, huh?
MARK MCKINNON, POLITICAL ADVISOR: This is the most dramatic 48 hours' time in American in politics. I mean, starting with the -- well, let's go back a little bit to Clyburn which we just talked about. Ron, is there a more influential endorsement that you can remember in your history?
BROWNSTEIN: No, I mean, the only thing people talk about comparable is the Kennedy endorsement of Obama and Obama was already a strong candidate. I mean, there's no one who has taken a candidate who was in his, you know, compromised a position as Joe Biden was and give them a boost to this magnitude as Jim --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Ron, we were talking about that with Catherine just during the break here about the timing, right, Catherine? Did he, you know, the timing was perfect. She was wondering if he had done it sooner would it have helped Joe Biden. But I think everything sort of played out perfectly, sort of the buildup and then he did it. It was dramatic and authentic. And I think it really was perfect and it gave him the boost that he needed at the right time.
BROWNSTEIN: If he had done it earlier and lost some states in the interim, clearly the impact would have been diminished, right, I think that's clear.
LEMON: Yes.
BROWNSTEIN: And this could not have been -- look, he needed it and it detonated, and it really began a series of events that -- you know, the town hall, the debate, the win, the magnitude of the weight in South Carolina consolidating so many African-American voters.
[23:04:58]
And then that unbelievable 48-hour period with three former rivals. To me, you know, the contrast between all of these elements of the party coalescing around Biden while Bernie Sanders chose after winning New Hampshire and Nevada not to strike an inclusive tone, to say he was running against the Democratic establishment as well as the Republican establishment, to say that he was only going to pick a vice-president who was supportive of Medicare for all reaffirming his comments about Fidel Castro.
I mean, the contrast between those two things I think sent a pretty clear signal to the Democratic voters who had been skeptical of Sanders. And we talked about this a little last night, Don.
To me, one of the most striking things in the polling was, if you look at people identified as Democrats, partisan Democrats, Sanders lost them almost everywhere by 20 to 30 points last night.
If you're running, you know, it may be that if you're running to be the nominee of a party kind of condemning that party as a tool -- as kind of a corrupt institution, as a tool of kind of corporate malfeasance, may not be the best strategy.
LEMON: Yes. So seriously, Mark, walk us through the last couple of days. I said what a difference a day makes. But if you -- I mean, look at the last, we said the last 72 hours. But really, I mean, think about -- think about the momentum that happened and the people who decided at the last moment to go in to -- we say pull the thing, not many people pull it any more, they mark it. But think about that.
MCKINNON: Yes. You know, I mean, one question that a lot of us had was how much -- how many people early voted and might that -- might those late endorsements not have as much impact, but they clearly did.
And so, I mean, you had, you know, Pete Buttigieg, Amy Klobuchar, Harry Reid, and of course, Clyburn, which his endorsement also gave a little bit of tough love for the campaign which I thought was interesting, too. But it was just a cascade.
By the way, this is just a testament to me about how strategic voters are thinking in this Democratic primary. Voters and candidates.
LEMON: Yes.
MCKINNON: I mean, they're really thinking -- I mean, you had voters who were drifted to Bloomberg because they thought, Joe is kind of getting wobblier. Maybe not be the guy. Then as soon as he -- we had his first debate where he kind of drove his Ferrari out of the garage into a fire hydrant.
LEMON: Yes.
MCKINNON: And then they came back to Biden, so they're looking at it strategically.
LEMON: We had all this stuff when we talk about Ukraine stuff. I don't want to do the bidding of Trump because it's all -- it's kind of B.S. because --
CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Kind of?
LEMON: No. It's B.S. because Trump wants the media to do his bidding on Ukraine, on Hunter Biden, on -- because I really think Democrats see through that and they know that it means nothing because I don't think anyone -- any Democrat is going to go to the poll -- I was talking to people in D.C. today as I made my way back here. And they're like, look at Trump's children. They don't care. They don't care about Trump -- about Biden and Ukraine. They don't care.
(CROSSTALK)
MCKINNON: Well, the point is after all that's been heaped on Joe Biden --
LEMON: They're not thinking about it as they go to the polls.
RAMPELL: They still think he is the best candidate to go --
LEMON: It is just noise, noise.
RAMPELL: But it's pretty clear that Republicans are thinking about that. I mean --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: But Republicans aren't going to vote for Joe Biden.
RAMPELL: No, no. What I mean is Republicans who have some power to reignite some of these investigations, right? As soon as Biden once again became the front runner, they started trying to revive these conspiracy theories about him.
LEMON: Do you think it's going to matter when Democrats go to the polls, an investigation is going to matter?
RAMPELL: I don't know that it will matter to Democrats necessarily. But to the extent that there are gettable suburban voters, or what have you, I think the real challenge for those of us in the media --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: But shouldn't we learn about the e-mails? Because all of -- it's going to --
(CROSSTALK)
RAMPELL: You would think.
LEMON: Shouldn't we learn from that?
RAMPELL: You would think. I think the real challenge for those of us in the media is how do you douse these conspiracy theories without, to extend the metaphor, I guess, without giving them more oxygen. Right?
LEMON: Right. RAMPELL: And how do you put voters' mind to rest about things that
they should have nothing to worry about without repeatedly exposing them to the lie. I think this is the way Trump has figured out how to hack the system essentially.
And there is a lot of social science research to back this up. That even when you fact-check the lie, what people often remember is not the fact check and the fact the thing was wrong. They just remember the thing that was wrong.
LEMON: I think what you do is, you mention it and you don't delve into it too much and then you move on.
RAMPELL: Well, you -- well, I mean, what I have heard -- the metaphor that I have heard used is you use a truth sandwich. You lead with the facts. You talk about whatever the lie was, you brush it aside and then you return to the facts.
LEMON: Yes.
RAMPELL: And you talk about whatever the issues are that the candidates are actually running on and you try not to give as much air time to the nonsense conspiracy theories.
LEMON: So then now let's move on to Bloomberg and warren. So we've done our civic duty with that. Or our journalistic with that. So, Ron, let's talk about Bloomberg. I mean, he didn't waste any time today jumping out of the race.
BROWNSTEIN: Yes.
LEMON: That we were -- everybody is wondering what's going to happen? When is he going to jump? He did it. He put his support and his money behind Biden. How do you see this new alliance playing out?
BROWNSTEIN: Well, I think it was pretty admirable, right? I mean, there are not many people can spend half a billion, you know, as much money as he spent and then kind of pull the plug as quickly as he did.
[23:10:01]
I mean, he basically -- it seems like he meant what he said, that his main goal was to beat Donald Trump. He had a theory of the case that Biden would be wobbly and weak and that the party would be looking for an alternative to Sanders. It almost happened, except Biden revived in South Carolina and then all of the consolidation around him.
I think Bloomberg is going to be a tremendous asset for the Democratic nominee in the general election, kind of his own, you know, enormous super PAC.
We still have a primary to go through, you know. And you know, Bernie Sanders, I think Joe Biden clearly has the upper hand at this point, but it's not quite over. If you go back to 2016, Bernie Sanders ran very well in several of the industrial Midwest states. He won Michigan and Wisconsin. He was extremely competitive in Missouri and Illinois. In the first three contests, first four contests of this year, he did
win most of the non-college white voters. That got away from him last night. That was one of the most important things that happened. Biden beat him in most places among non-college whites.
But now Biden is going to have to defend that with Sanders making very clear he's going to come after him on trade, on his openness to entitlement as part -- entitlement cuts as part of a grand bargain in the past and other issues.
You know, it may be that the die is cast, but Biden still has to go through, I think a crucible in the Midwest over the next couple of weeks. Plus, he faces the process if Warren gets out of a one-on-one debate with Sanders, who has been a much more nimble debater, I think Mark would agree, Catherine would agree so far.
So that's kind of another, you know, uncertain --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And that's all well and good, Ron. Because that's on policy. And, you know, that's all substantive stuff that they should be debating about.
BROWNSTEIN: Right.
LEMON: But you know, what has been interesting to me is that people have been wondering is Bloomberg going to be the spoiler? Is he going to be the spoiler to Biden when he got into it, you know, thinking that he wanted to, somehow get -- you know, make Trump lose? Or somehow, he's going to make Trump win because he's going to be the spoiler.
Well, think about it. He may have been the thing that elevated Biden because then people saw how he performed on the debate stage and they said, well, you know, maybe Biden is the best bet.
MCKINNON: Yes.
LEMON: You know what I'm saying?
MCKINNON: Yes.
LEMON: You see what I'm saying?
MCKINNON: Yes, it's very ironic.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: In an odd way.
MCKINNON: Just the reverse happened. He's the guy that helped people turn back to Biden rather than away from him.
LEMON: Right. RAMPELL: Well, maybe. I mean, it's interesting. I feel like that Bernie bros were really angry that Bloomberg was in the race. And now they're really angry that Bloomberg is out of the race. I kind of can't keep track of the logic here.
I think, if anything, you know, this narrative that like the billionaires are propping up Bern -- excuse me, propping up Biden is misplaced, in part, because Bloomberg is your key point of evidence here. He spent $500 million and was if anything siphoning votes away from Biden, his poor debate performances notwithstanding.
So, to the extent that billionaires thus far have played much of a role in the race, I think it was intended maybe to hurt Biden, although obviously Bloomberg has changed his tune since then.
LEMON: I want you to take a look at -- this is a response from Mike Bloomberg's Twitter account to one of President Trump's mini tweet attacks on him today. And they tweeted this from the scene from "Star Wars." I'm not sure if you guys saw this. Watch this.
BROWNSTEIN: Yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your powers are weak, old man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't win on us. If you strike me, Don, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: I mean, this is where we are now in 2020. Do you think he's going to stay engaged like this to get under Trump's skin? This is for you, Catherine.
RAMPELL: Do I -- yes, I think --
MCKINNON: Yes.
RAMPELL: -- if Bloomberg has proven himself good at doing anything it is at pushing Trump's buttons. Whether that actually served to benefit Bloomberg is a separate issue, but he has been very effective at getting Trump to, to commit some unforced errors and say stupid stuff on Twitter. Not that that's so terribly difficult, but he's clearly very good at getting under his skin.
LEMON: I've got to go, but really quickly, I'm not joking. This is going to be the behemoth of a show, isn't it?
MCKINNON: It's going to be. We got the whole show ready already and where it's only two --
RAMPELL: That's dangerous, though.
MCKINNON: Yes. And it was going to be, when are we going to cut?
LEMON: You're like me forgetting days. Thank you, guys. I appreciate it.
MCKINNON: Thank you, Don.
Coronavirus is spreading in this country and the president is talking about it tonight. Why he says that he was afraid that he would look bad for letting Americans exposed to the virus come home.
[23:15:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: There are now at least 158 cases of coronavirus in this country. Earlier reported 159 cases, but that has been revised. President Trump saying tonight that he was concerned about the optics of repatriating Americans abroad who were exposed to the coronavirus.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I felt we had to do it. And in one way I hated to do it statistically, I hated to do it from the standpoint of having people coming in that's going to -- is it going to look bad? I wasn't worried about the other people catching it very much because our people are so good and we had quarantine set up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Joining me now is Congressman Raul Ruiz of the California, he serves as the Democratic co-chair of the coronavirus congressional task force and is a public expert with an M.D. from Harvard University, as well as a masters of both public policy and public health. We really appreciate you joining us. Thank you so much, Congressman.
REP. RAUL RUIZ (D-CA): Thank you, Don. it's good to be here.
LEMON: Listen, California's Governor Gavin Newsom declared a state of emergency this evening. And he announced that another cruise ship the Grand Princess is being held off the coast of California because 11 passengers, 10 crew members are symptomatic. You used to be an emergency room doctor. What do you think of these precautions?
[23:19:59]
RUIZ: Well, I think those are good precautions, first of all. And second of all, what the president said about caring more about how he looks than the health and how the American people feel is just abominable. It's not the leadership that we need right now in this serious outbreak that we're having.
Working in the emergency department during the H1N1 flu season, it's no joke. We have physicians out there right now. They're doing their best working extra hours in overcrowded emergency departments throughout the entire country. And having a president who minimizes this is hurtful, not helpful. What we need to do is to have a straight talk with the American people
to say that although this virus can produce mild symptoms, there are individuals who are older than 60 who have underlying illnesses like diabetes, heart disease, lung disease, weak immune systems that can get seriously ill and that can die.
So everybody should have the personal responsibility and social responsibility to make sure you wash your hands with soap and water for 20 seconds, to make sure you use hand sanitizers with 60 percent alcohol at least, to make sure that you don't touch your face, and that you clean your counter tops and stay away from people who are coughing and sneezing.
And if you do -- and if you are sick, then make sure that you stay home, that you stay away from people who I mentioned are at higher risk. That you wear a mask, and that if you're going to cough and sneeze, obstruct it completely with a tissue. Throw it away. And immediately wash your hands. And don't forget to wash your hands and use hand sanitizer.
LEMON: Can you just say something, answer something really quickly for me?
RUIZ: Yes.
LEMON: Because I've been having people ask me to be more specific when we say people with preexisting conditions are at more of a risk.
RUIZ: Yes.
LEMON: What do you mean by preexisting conditions?
RUIZ: Well, anybody who takes medicine for an illness is somebody with an underlying disease. It's people with chronic illnesses. And I'll just name you a few so the American people can really understand.
So, if you have diabetes, if you have severe asthma or emphysema, COPD, or if you've had a heart attack with congestive heart failure and have difficulty breathing when you walk. If you use oxygen. If you are taking medications for cancer that can weaken your immune system or if you have HIV/AIDS, your immune system is lower.
And this could be any age group. But if you combine that with the older populations, then the older that you are over 60, then the more at risk you are of getting really sick.
So, Don, this is what I would tell you. I would tell you to wipe your counters and your desk with Clorox or Lysol. Your phone especially. I would tell that you if you have an elderly parent or a family member who is sick, then take extra precautions to stay away from them if you feel like you're getting sick, and to make sure that every time you're around them, don't touch their face, wash your hands often so that you can protect them.
LEMON: OK.
RUIZ: It's up to -- yes.
LEMON: I got you. I want to get this question in because we're running out of time, Congressman.
RUIZ: Yes, absolutely.
LEMON: You were in today's coronavirus briefing with the vice president. Does this administration have control on this public health crisis?
RUIZ: You know, we're seeing a lot of change from before, but we are at a point where the threshold is very -- it's imminent and people are going to get sick.
I saw Dr. Sanjay Gupta who I know, I saw in Haiti when I was there taking care of the Haitians after the earthquake. And he showed those graphs where there is a certain threshold where this is going to spike.
And that threshold is dependent not only the characteristics of the virus, but the characteristics of our capacity as a society to contain and to mitigate the damage that this will cause.
And so, we asked the vice president, what are we going to do about the workers who don't have sick days and can't afford to stay home and are concerned about staying home when we're advising them to stay home?
What are we going to do about the health care work force who are going to have to be quarantined in underserved areas --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Did he address that?
RUIZ: He said that he was going to look into that. But we are, as Democrats, looking into legislation to make sure that that's the case. And passing $8.3 billion of supplemental aid is a clear message to the American people that we have your back. This is a down payment.
LEMON: OK.
RUIZ: We need to treat this aggressively and early.
LEMON: All right. Congressman, thank you very much. We appreciate you staying late. We can see that you're probably the only one or one of the only people left in Capitol Hill. Thank you so much.
RUIZ: Thank you.
LEMON: All right. Make sure you watch tomorrow. Anderson Cooper and Dr. Sanjay Gupta whole day CNN global town hall, "Coronavirus: Facts and Fears" live tomorrow night at 10 Eastern.
[23:25:00]
Bernie Sanders releasing a new ad full of praise for him, praise coming from the former President Barack Obama, but that ad is not as clear-cut as it seems.
Daniel Dale has the facts, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: After a disappointing Super Tuesday, Bernie Sanders' campaign has a new ad out highlighting comments made by President Obama.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Bernie is somebody who has the virtue of saying exactly what he believes, great authenticity, great passion, and is fearless. Bernie served on the veterans committee. Got bills done.
[23:30:00]
I think people are ready for a call to action. They want honest leadership who cares about them. They want somebody who is going to fight for them, and they will find it in Bernie. That's right, feel the burn.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: But there are a couple of issues with the ad. Joining me now is CNN's resident fact-checker Daniel Dale. When do you sleep, Daniel?
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Got your work cut out for you lately.
DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: Lately.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Let's start with the first line from the Sanders's new ad. But before you break it down, I want to play President Obama's full comments in context. Here they are.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA (voice-over): Bernie is somebody who -- although I don't know as well --
GLENN THRUSH, REPORTER, THE NEW YORK TIMES (voice-over): Right.
OBAMA (voice-over): -- because he wasn't obviously in my administration -- has the virtue of saying exactly what he believes, great authenticity, great passion, and is fearless.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So, now that we've heard that part in full, give us the context for these comments.
DALE: So the most important context is that the comments are not from an Obama endorsement of Sanders. It is obvious to us, but maybe not to every TV viewer. Obama hasn't endorsed anyone. That part of the ad, the beginning, was from a 2016 interview during the democratic primary in that election in which Obama was playing kind of the above the fray statesman and was offering kind words about both Sanders and his then opponent Hillary Clinton.
LEMON: All right. Let's move on to the next portion of the ad. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: I think people are ready for a call to action. They want to have honest leadership who cares about them. They want somebody who is going to fight for them, and they will find it in Bernie.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. So President Obama sure looked a lot younger in that clip. How long ago did he make those comments?
DALE: So, those comments are from 2006. So that's 14 years ago now when Obama, then an Illinois senator, was campaigning for Sanders when Sanders was running successfully for Senate in Vermont. Now, that's, you know, fair play, you might say you can use an old clip of praise in a current ad.
The thing is, though, the clip that follows it is Obama at the podium at the democratic convention in 2016. So hearing that voice over, you might think, oh, he made those comments quite recently, only four years ago. No, they're 14 years old.
LEMON: Yeah. Let's listen to them.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: We all need to get out and vote for Democrats up and down the ticket and then hold them accountable until they get the job done.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
OBAMA: That's right, feel the burn.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: So, again, that would have been the 2016 democratic national convention. He obviously wasn't endorsing Bernie there, right?
DALE: He wasn't. So the ad includes only the "feel the burn" part and has it follow the Obama praise from 2006 of Sanders's character, again making it sound like a 2016 endorsement. What was actually happening in 2016 was Obama was trying to get Sanders's supporters to vote for Hillary Clinton in their general election after the contentious primary. So there was a chant at Bernie after he praised those supporters. And then Obama said, feel the burn. But again, you know, this wasn't saying, you know, vote for Bernie Sanders in 2020. This was saying, please vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016.
LEMON: Yeah. In fact, I think the line before that, he was talking about, you know, like, less spending or something about cutting costs. And he said, this is something that even Bernie's supporters can get behind and they started cheering. And then he said, that's right, feel the burn, right? And so --
DALE: He praised the passion of Sanders's supporters for various causes.
LEMON: Yeah. All right, thank you so much. I appreciate it. Daniel Dale, get some sleep. Why is Bernie Sanders choosing this moment to cozy up to Obama? Does it have something to do with voters rallying behind Joe Biden?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: So now, the state of the race. Bernie Sanders is embracing former President Barack Obama for the first time in a new ad this week, that as black voters are really drastically reshaping the democratic primary race. So here with more to discuss is Bakari Sellers, L. Joy Williams, who is the president of the Brooklyn NAACP, and Keith Boykin. Hello, one and all. Good to see you. How are you doing?
BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, HOST OF "VIEWPOINT WITH BAKARI" PODCAST: Tired.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: I'm so tired. I can't believe I can even read the words.
L. JOY WILLIAMS, PRESIDENT, BROOKLYN NAACP: We have more months of this.
LEMON: Huh?
WILLIAMS: And we have many more months of this to go.
LEMON: The people at the airline, people are like, hey, you're back? Star flying.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Anyway, start giving the thing on the airplane. So, listen, Bakari, you heard Daniel Dale. He said the ad is misleading. I had someone on from one of the Bernie Sanders's surrogates on. But aside from that, Sanders's whole campaign is based on really being the anti- establishment candidate. He is even considered running against Obama in 2012. So why cozy up to the former president now? Why do you think?
SELLERS: Well, I think it is audacious. I think that this has been something that is the antithesis to what Bernie Sanders really is. Bernie Sanders is known for his consistency. He's been the same person for the last 40 years in elected office.
[23:40:00]
SELLERS: He's running against the establishment. So to embrace the quintessential establishment now, 44 Barack Obama, I think, is audacious. That's me being kind.
LEMON: One thing I do have to say, Ro Khanna was on here, Congressman Ro Khanna.
SELLERS: Oh, yes.
LEMON: I mean, Barack Obama was the insurgent candidate, you know, back in 2008. He was the insurgent candidate. He was --
SELLERS: Yeah. Barack Obama and Bernie Sanders have not much in common.
LEMON: They don't have anything in common.
SELLERS: Yes. And I do think that you have to look at the full context, the full picture. I mean, Bernie Sanders is someone who literally thought about and considered -- one of our former colleagues, Bill Press, was Bernie Sanders's confidant and talked about how Barack Obama failed progressives.
So what is happening here is that black vote, my mama and her friends, your mama, we always talk about this, black women of a certain age to be politically correct, are pointing out and choosing who the president of the United States should be, and they ain't voting for Bernie Sanders.
(LAUGHTER)
SELLERS: So what Bernie Sanders is trying to do is nestle up to Barack Obama. I mean, we'll see if it works. I know it ain't gonna work but that is what they're trying to do.
LEMON: You will not -- my mom is from Louisiana. So when you see the G-E-A-U-X --
SELLERS: Oh, I know.
LEMON: "Go Joe" t-shirts.
SELLERS: Yeah, that's what it is.
LEMON: That's right, or --
SELLERS: That's not Joe --
(CROSSTALK)
SELLERS: -- thinking it was Joe Biden.
LEMON: Joe for show comes from my mom.
SELLERS: I got you.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: But listen, President Obama has stayed out. He stayed out of the primaries, right? Something like this, do you think he's going to react to something like this or he should?
KEITH BOYKIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST, FORMER CLINTON WHITE HOUSE AIDE: Well, he reacted a few weeks ago. Last week, I guess, it was when Donald Trump, his campaign or supporters ran a misleading ad in South Carolina that suggested he was somehow, you know, taking a position against Joe Biden, and he wasn't.
I think what this reflects, though, is just how popular President Obama is. He's the most popular political figure in the country. Everybody wants to be associated with him. Even Bernie Sanders, who is campaigning as the anti-establishment figure, wants to be associated with the ultimate democratic establishment figure Barack Obama.
It also reflects, as Bakari was saying, just how important African American voters are to the electorate. I mean, people kind of dismiss that for the past few weeks. We talked about Iowa, New Hampshire, and Nevada. But there was not a significant population of African American voters in any of those states until you got to South Carolina.
And then suddenly, we realize, oh, well, maybe we have a different race. Imagine how different this whole race would have turned out if we had started with South Carolina instead of Iowa and New Hampshire.
LEMON: We made that perfectly clear. I think on this program, we talked about that all the time. We talked about the importance of African American voters and turnout and --
BOYKIN: But not everybody else. They had to fix it.
LEMON: -- if the race had started in other places that were more reflective of the Democratic Party and more reflective of the country. So L. Joy, hi.
WILLIAMS: Hi.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Let's talk about that because Biden ran away with black voters. I mean, they really helped his campaign. I mean, look at that. Super Tuesday really helped him. They have really helped him on Super Tuesday, big wins in Virginia, North Carolina, Tennessee, and Alabama. Does he owe his comeback? I don't even have to ask this question.
WILLIAMS: Yes, you don't have to ask that question.
LEMON: It started with James Clyburn and then it went from there in South Carolina.
WILLIAMS: Right. What is interesting to me about this misfire of everyone trying to use Obama is people liked you when they're talking about black voters. It's always some simplistic answer as to the reason why we are supporting a particular candidate.
It could be we're supporting Barack Obama just because he's black, not because he actually has policies and a fight that actually speaks to the voters at that particular moment.
And so putting him in an ad in this instance when particularly you had no ongoing connection, when you didn't -- you know, sort of weren't part of the Obama coalition as we describe it, is really a misfire in trying to appeal to black voters, thinking that you can just sprinkle some Obama on it and then black voters will come to you.
And we are very discerning. We know the reason why voters are flocking or black voters are flocking to Biden is, one, he's a known entity. We know him. And if anybody knows anything about trying to convince voters to come out for a particular candidate, having someone that people know, already trust and have a track record on, it is easier to do that.
I've already voted for him once before, right? And so convincing a voter to do something different than they've done in the past is also a leap -- a leap over a wall.
LEMON: I heard Reverend Al Sharpton say this morning, he stood by our guy, so we stood by him. Does that --
SELLERS: I think that's pretty simplistic. I know that Reverend Sharpton sometimes gets to the point of simplicity.
[23:44:53]
SELLERS: But one of the things that you were bringing up, which is completely accurate, is although it's not a simplistic reason we're voting for Joe Biden or Joe Biden got a large amount of African American votes, it's something we can drill down on, which is trust.
WILLIAMS: OK.
SELLERS: African American voters are pragmatic and they trust Joe Biden.
LEMON: OK. Let me ask you this because I got to go literally. How much time do we have, like, 15 seconds?
SELLERS: We have to go, too? I thought we had all night.
LEMON: OK. Listen. VP, who?
SELLERS: Kamala Harris.
BOYKIN: Kamala Harris or Stacey Abrams.
LEMON: L. Joy?
WILLIAMS: Black woman.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: I can give you a whole list. How much more time do you have?
LEMON: OK. All right, thank you all. I appreciate it. So tomorrow, Alabama is set to execute a man for three murders. Supporters say he didn't commit, including the man who confessed to the crime. That story is next.
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[23:50:00]
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LEMON: Tonight, last minute pleas in Alabama to spare the life of a man convicted of murdering three police officers. He is set to be executed tomorrow. But there is a major problem with this case. CNN's Martin Savidge has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's a fact no one disputes. Alabama is about to execute 44-year-old Nathaniel Woods for the murders of three police officers he did not kill.
June 17, 2004, three Birmingham police officers are gunned down, attempting to serve a misdemeanor warrant on Woods at a home in the city's west side. Woods had surrendered to police, when another man in the house, Kerry Spencer, opened fire with an assault rifle, killing officers Charles Bennett, Carlos Owen, and Harley Chisolm.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Never in my life have I ever imagined going to three funerals in two days and feeling the pain and hurt that we all experienced.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): The shocking murders left a city grieving. Spencer confessed to the shootings and said soon after his arrest that he had acted alone. He was convicted of the murders and sits on Alabama's death row. But for prosecutors, one conviction wasn't enough. They charged Woods with three counts of capital murder, accusing him of conspiring or being complicit in the killing of the officers.
LAUREN FARAINO, NATHANIEL WOODS'S ATTORNEY: In order for a person to be convicted on complicity, they have to be involved in a plan or a scheme to kill.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): Prosecutors alleged a calculating Woods intentionally lured the officers into the home, where Spencer was waiting.
FARAINO: Absolutely not. He was terrified when they came into the house.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): Woods was found guilty. And even though he hadn't fired a single shot, he was sentenced to death.
PAMELA WOODS, NATHANIEL WOODS'S SISTER: He thought it was the craziest thing in the world. Like how? How? He didn't do anything wrong.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): How much do you think race played a role in this case?
FARAINO: I think it did play a role. I mean, I think that if you look at victims, it's three white officers. And if you look at the people who are sitting on death row, it's twho black men.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): Woods's current defense team says his conviction was just one of many legal wrongs, including years of bungled appeals by other attorneys. Now, down to his final hours, Woods's family believes their only hope is for the public to convince Alabama's governor that killing a man who killed no one is wrong.
WOODS: I love my brother. People need to know about this.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): We want to know what the families of the murdered police officers thought of Woods. We reached two of them who said they either couldn't or wouldn't talk to us. But in a local radio interview last year, the granddaughter of the Officer Owen reflected on his loss and the hole it has left in all their lives.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): I remember how special he used to make each of his grandkids feel. That was something that he was so good at, making others feel loved and special.
SAVIDGE (on camera): What would you say to the families of the officers who died?
FARAINO: We are deeply, deeply sorry for what happened that day. But the murderer of their family members is sitting on death row. He has confessed. He is being punished. They don't need an innocent man's blood as well.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Martin Savidge joins me now. Martin, you actually spoke with Kerry Spencer tonight. What's he saying?
SAVIDGE: He was calling from death row, the same death row, of course, which Nathaniel Woods is spending his last few hours. You know, it's hard to imagine a man who has confessed to killing three police officers would have a guilty conscience, but it appears he does. But in this case, it is guilt to over what he believes is wrong, that Nathaniel Woods, in no way, had anything to do with the deaths of those officers. Here is some of our conversation. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SAVIDGE (on camera): You are saying that you are totally responsible for the murders of those police officers?
KERRY SPENCER, CONVICTED OF CAPITAL MURDER (voice-over): For the shootings, yes, I am. I'm the only one that shot anybody that day.
SAVIDGE (on camera): And Nathaniel Woods is completely innocent, you say?
SPENCER (voice-over): Absolutely. He didn't know I was going to shoot anybody. I mean, I put this on my life, on my children's lives. I mean, like I swear to god. I didn't know I was going to do to this, so how would Nate know? I mean this was a spur of the moment decision. We had no time to think about what the (bleep) was going to happen that day.
SAVIDGE (on camera): This was not a plan. You didn't conspire together?
SPENCER (voice-over): No. No man, that's just something they put out there. You see there was no warrant or nothing. They just made up a story for a jury to believe to convict both of us.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Wow.
[23:55:00]
SAVIDGE: Again, that is Kerry Spencer saying that Woods is totally innocent, that this was a spur of the moment, and that Spencer takes full responsibility for what happened. Alabama, he says, is executing the wrong person.
LEMON: Wow. Nothing -- nothing -- nothing anyone can do, Martin? Nothing?
SAVIDGE: The governor could intervene. That's what everyone is hoping for. There could be some sort of stay. There could even be just a temporary stay to allow a more formal investigation and look at this point. There are a number of other court actions. But right now, all eyes are focussed on the governor here in Montgomery.
LEMON: Wow. Martin Savidge, keep us updated. Thank you. Thanks for watching, everyone. Our coverage continues.
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