Return to Transcripts main page

Don Lemon Tonight

COVID-19 Infects More People By The Hour; Gov. Laura Kelly (D- KS) Is Interviewed About How They Are Dealing With The Growing Cases Of Coronavirus In Her State; Gov. Phil Murphy (D-NJ) Is Interviewed About The Conversation He Had With Vice President Mike Pence; Coronavirus Pandemic: Trump And Health Officials Caution Young People To Heed The Advice On Coronavirus; How To Stay Safe During Social Distancing; Sanjay Gupta Answers Viewers Question; Testing Done To Most Vulnerable Patients Due To A Global Shortage Of Supplies. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired March 18, 2020 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:00]

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: God bless you. Stay safe. Stay healthy. Stay together. Thanks for watching. "CNN TONIGHT" with D. Lemon right now.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: So, our conversation last night, when I said I appreciated our conversation that we had yesterday and what you were doing for your family, especially your mom. People were asking me what did you mean? Now they know.

So, a similar situation. My mom is not with me. My family is 100 miles away, close to your family as well. Mine is smaller. It's just one other guy and a couple dogs but it's safer to be away from the city I think where it's not so many people. But you know, how are you doing? How are you holding up?

CUOMO: Better than I deserve. But I get the frustration. I get the fear. I get the uncertainty. It makes a lot of people believe this can't be real. It makes other people believe it's more real than they're telling us. We don't have great information to give them.

I do trust Tony Fauci. I think we are blessed to have him in this situation because we know how people are sideways about government. But it's really hard for us to be covering a story when we know it hasn't even begun yet.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: It's a tough thing to know is coming.

LEMON: And we know the numbers are low because the testing really in essence hasn't really begun.

CUOMO: Yes. Well, it's a slow testing, it's spreading in different ways, it's spreading through communities. You're not going to contact trace it. There are a lot of cases that have happened that been resolved that weren't identified as this.

LEMON: That we will never know.

CUOMO: Right.

LEMON: And here's the thing, though. Here's when I was talking with one of my executive producers, is that, maybe some people would had it and they've gotten over and it maybe the numbers are high and we might learn through all of this that many people just get over it. Right? They just sort of barrel through it. And it's resolved.

So, once we get the testing and people are tested, maybe this will be something like the flu that we'll deal with every year and then the vaccine will come out and maybe that will actually help.

But what I feel is that our president is a numbers guy. He sees everything in numbers. You know, the stock market, the ratings, you know, the hand size and how he answered the question at the debate about, you know what, hand size is a correlation, you know what I'm talking about.

So, he sees everything in numbers. So, he won't like even the high numbers that come out of the testing so he doesn't want the actual testing numbers in many ways. So, I think that even if the testing shows that it's a high number of people have it and many of them get over it. He just doesn't want that to come out because it may actually be good. I don't know. That's just my thinking.

CUOMO: Here's the good news. He is not at the center of the equation. Any one of the briefings that you watch, this is bigger than him, he is not built for this, he has better people around him and he knows it. They're making the decisions.

Hopefully he will not hinder it. If he's a number guy, hopefully the number he avoids is the number one. And he realizes it can't just be about him. It has to be about everybody else right now. That's his job.

Jeh Johnson was on here, homeland security chief under Obama.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: He said this is our 9/11. We remember those days.

LEMON: I do.

CUOMO: We remember the fear. It's the closest I've seen the city to it since then.

LEMON: Yes. But, you know, 9/11. Here's the thing. Nine-eleven only closed the airlines nationwide. This is closing almost every single business nationwide.

CUOMO: It's crushing the economy.

LEMON: It is crushing the economy.

CUOMO: And people will say something. By the way, here's good answer from Tony Fauci. Hey, you know, Don Lemon, hysterical guy, swine flu, 2009, hello. Sixty-one million cases, 12,000 people dead. Don't rebel you crashing the economy. Simple math. OK?

And if you don't trust Tony Fauci, then you just - you just don't care about the truth. OK? So, here's the math. Do the math. Sixty million cases, 12,000 dead. OK. Sixty million cases, if it were 10 percent death rate, you would have six million. If it were 1 percent death rate, you'd have 600,000. All right?

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: So, this disease has at least a virus 2 percent death rate. Look at the exponential numbers involved. And it spreads faster and it's harder to treat and we don't have the same medicines. It's totally different.

LEMON: It is different. Not all pandemics are the same. Not all viruses are the same. You be safe.

CUOMO: I will be safe.

LEMON: I'll see you soon.

CUOMO: And I know what gets us through it.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: We pay attention. We push our government. We remember that we love each other more than anything else. And we'll get through it.

LEMON: Yes. We're all Americans at the end of the day and we will get through this. We'll hold our feet to the fire.

CUOMO: Americans.

LEMON: Americans. We'll hold their feet to the fire, that's what we do here.

This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.

Here is our breaking news and this is the latest. The latest numbers are just in. And I tell you about these numbers every single night. This is on the coronavirus. OK? This is what I have at this moment.

[22:05:00]

At least 8,736 people, 8,736 people have tested positive, 149 people have died, 149 people. And because seeing is believing, everyone, and I don't want to give you this to depress you. This is the reality. Let me put that into perspective for and you show you how fast those numbers are going up.

At the end of the show Friday night, please look at your television. On Friday night, there were 2,210 confirmed cases, 2210 confirmed cases. Monday night, 4465. Last night, 6,135. And as I am broadcasting to you at this moment as we are speaking, 8,736. As I've been telling you, this is not just about numbers. This is

about people. Our fellow Americans, or Americans, as Chris said. The point is that we are learning that more and more people are infected by this virus. More and more people are dying.

And if you are telling yourself that you could ignore it, if you're telling yourself that you could just go about your daily life the same way that you did last week or even a few weeks ago, take a look at your TV screen again. Look at that graphic again.

Because the fact is, every single one of us has to change the way we live our lives. The decisions we make every single day. Yes, there are inconveniences. Big ones. Schools are closed across the country affecting more than 42 million students.

Of course, their families, parents, and on and on. malls, restaurants, sport events, museums, libraries, houses of worship all shut down. Streets empty in major cities. Can you believe that? New York City is a ghost town.

The Dow closing below 20,000 for the first time since 2017. Nearly wiping out the gains made under President Trump. And you know he noticed. He touts it all the time. Of course, he noticed.

There are people whose jobs are in jeopardy and that is a serious problem that this country has to address. We have no choice. The facts are the facts. And we may be in this for the long haul, everybody.

CNN has obtained a 100-page federal plan that shows the Trump administration is making a contingency plan for a pandemic that could stretch up to, and I'm quoting here, 18 months or longer. Possibly including multiple waves of illnesses. Multiple waves of illnesses, possibly.

Again, I don't say this to scare you. Those are possibilities. They're not predictions. Nobody can say for sure how this is going to go. And we want our government to be preparing. To be prepared for all of this.

The Senate today approving a coronavirus relief package including free testing and paid emergency leave for workers. Congress is working on a massive phase three stimulus package that could come with a trillion- dollar price tag.

The president today doing something retired General Stanley McChrystal recommended on this very show just last night. Invoking the Defense Production Act to make up for medical supply shortages and deploy two navy hospital ships along the East Coast.

The beds on those ships will not be for coronavirus cases. They'll free up space in hospitals, on land, though at least one of those ships could take weeks to be ready.

But is all of this too little too late? That is the question. Defense Secretary Mark Esper wouldn't say when he talked to Jake Tapper earlier today. Watch this. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Shouldn't the president have invoked the Defense Production Act like in February?

MARK ESPER, U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Well, I don't know the timing of all these different things, Jake.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And with supplies like ventilators desperately needed, the president didn't have much of an answer for Kaitlan Collins' questions why is this taking so long?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Do you think for weeks we needed more ventilators, so why did it take so long --

(CROSSTALK)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Well, we knew -- it depends. It depends on how it goes. Worst case, absolutely. Best case, not -- not at all. So, we're going to have to see where it goes. But we are ordering thousands and thousands of ventilators.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: We're also learning tonight that two members of Congress, two members of Congress have tested positive for the virus. They are Republican Congressman Mario Diaz-Balart and Democratic Congressman Ben McAdams. Which just emphasizes the need for a lot more testing.

[22:10:04]

The World Health Organization says every single suspected case of coronavirus should be tested. Says that's the reason that we're behind in this epidemic.

And the fact is right here in the United States of America we are still nowhere near being able to do that. And there's more call for concern tonight. Dr. Deborah Birx, the White House coronavirus response coordinator says, there is reason to worry that some younger people aren't taking the virus seriously and they are getting sick as a result of that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DEBORAH BIRX, COORDINATOR, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS TASK FORCE: There are concerning reports coming out of France and Italy about some young people getting seriously ill and very seriously ill in the ICUs. We think part of this may be that people heeded the early data coming out of China and coming out of South Korea that the elderly or those with pre-existing conditions were those were at a particular risk.

It may have been that the millennial generation, our largest generation, our future generation, that will carry us through for the next multiple decades, there may be disproportional number of infections among that group.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And with his own task force concern that people aren't taking the virus seriously with shortages of tests, masks and medical equipment. The president who has been downplaying the virus for months comparing it to the flu says he's doing a really good job.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have said that you give yourself a 10 in terms of handling this crisis. How do you reassure Americans at home who don't trust you to handle a crisis of this magnitude?

TRUMP: Well, I think we're doing a really good job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Remember when he said this yesterday on live TV with millions watching?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: This is a real, this is a pandemic. I felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, today he says the coronavirus, quote, "snuck up on us."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I call it the unseen. The unseen enemy. You call it -- it's a thousand different terms. It snuck up on us. It did 128 countries.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, here's the thing. He can't have it both ways. He can't claim that he always knew it was a pandemic and the very next day say it snuck up on us.

I'll say it again. This virus doesn't care where you live, it doesn't care whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, it doesn't care whether you support this president or not. Eight thousand seven hundred thirty-six Americans are already infected.

We are all in this together.

CNN's Chief Political Correspondent, Dana Bash is here. I want to bring her in now to talk about this. Dana, thank you so much. I appreciate you joining us. Two members of Congress as I just reported --

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Don. LEMON: -- now testing positive for coronavirus. What do you know?

BASH: Just that. These are two members who like all members of the House have not been in the House of Representatives because they've been on recess this week. But they were late last week. So that's why the house physician, according to our Manu Raju is trying to map out exactly where these members were. And there's a big, big concern.

And look, there was already a concern, Don, among a lot of members. Some of them kind of afraid to speak up because understandably they were there doing their job trying to pass the massive stimulus bill, for example, that they did at the end of last week.

But, you know, talking about social distancing, they were trying to do it, but it's kind of impossible to do it when you are on the floor of the House of Representatives. There are, you know, hundreds and hundreds of people, never mind members but also some staff members and you're in very close quarters. And so, this may just be the beginning of members of Congress getting positive test.

LEMON: Dana bash with our developing news tonight. Dana, I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Governors across this country taking the lead on the coronavirus fight. Next, I'm going to talk to two of those governors. One of Kansas, the other of New Jersey who are making real world changes to help the people of their states.

[22:15:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: The coronavirus spreading rapidly across the United States. Now more than 8,700 confirmed cases. At least 149 deaths. President Trump says he feels like a war time president. But many of the nation's governors are the ones that are really taking lead in battling the outbreak.

I want to discuss now with Kansas Governor Laura Kelly. And we really appreciate you joining us, Governor. Thank you so much for doing this. I know it is a trying time.

GOV. LAURA KELLY (D-KS): You're welcome, Don.

LEMON: Governors are stepping into void here and really doing some great work. Your state thankfully has had far fewer cases than other states with big -- with big cities but you've already seen community spread. Your health secretary says that confirmed cases could be above 100 within a month. Is there still time to head this off, do you think?

KELLY: Well, we're doing everything that we can to head it off and to flatten that curve. I think you know that yesterday I ordered the schools to -- well, I did that Friday. Ordered the schools to stay closed for this week which essentially was adding an additional week to already scheduled spring break. [22:19:53]

And we've used this time between Friday and today to bring together the best and brightest teachers we've got in the state of Kansas who have developed the contingency plans that we will implement Monday where we will continue to keep our school buildings essentially shut. But we will start to offer alternative education opportunities.

LEMON: Yes. You were the first state to do that so you've been very proactive. But you also announced today that you're temporary banning evictions and foreclosures in your state until May 1st. I mean, that's going to be a big relief for anyone strained financially during this crisis.

KELLY: Well, that's the intent is to provide as much relief as we can for people in these circumstances. We've done a number of other things to ensure that while people are going through this uncertainty, while people are being laid off, while people are being asked to stay home, that we are providing other sources for childcare, other sources for financial support.

We're doing absolutely everything that we can to ensure that we support our Kansans.

LEMON: I've got to ask you this because everyone is wondering about, you know, where are the kits, where are the test kits? Your state has only about 500 testing kits and you'll be in short supply by this weekend. We've heard promises from the administration --

KELLY: True.

LEMON: -- to expand testing capabilities. Is the federal government helping you get more?

KELLY: Well, we did have an issue with that. We expected delivery of about 3,500 kits yesterday. It did not come at that number. But we've been in contact with HHS and we expect that we will receive more kits by the end of this week.

LEMON: Listen, understanding that, you know, the president even tweeted. But on the call the president said that the states need to, the governors need to step up, the states need to do more for themselves. Do you feel like the president has left, and the administration has left the states in charge, or to fend for themselves?

KELLY: You know, I think everybody has to step up. You know, we've got to all be in this together. I think all the governors have stepped up and are doing everything that they can --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: And even some mayors as well.

KELLY: -- to protect health and safety. And -- lots of -- lots of locals. Here in Kansas, we have, you know, we probably have one of the most sophisticated emergency management responses for a state our size. We have activated them and then brought in additional folks to come our public health system.

And all of that happens really on a local level. So, we've got -- we've got everybody working hard, working together so that we can address this, we can address this problem in a comprehensive, systematic way rather than slap dash.

LEMON: What do you think about the president invoking the Defense Production Act to help make up for medical supply shortages? I mean, he even said he can only do it, quote, should he be in -- he would only do it in a worst case scenario. But I think most people would agree that we need it now.

KELLY: We do. We absolutely have got to get more test kits, we've got to get ventilators available, we've got to get personnel protection equipment, the PPEs, all of that stuff we need to have brought to Kansas now so that it is ready for us when we need it.

LEMON: Governor Kelly, again, thank you so much. And best of luck to you and the people of your state.

KELLY: Thank you, Don.

LEMON: New Jersey is one of the states hit hard by the coronavirus. More than 400 confirmed cases and at least five deaths. I want to bring in now New Jersey's Governor, Phil Murphy. Governor, I appreciate you joining us. Thank you so much.

GOV. PHIL MURPHY (D-NJ): My pleasure, Don. Good to be with you.

LEMON: Listen, I got to be honest. You've had some very intense conversations with the White House and the vice president. Talk to me about those conversations. What are you asking for? And what are you hearing from them?

MURPHY: Yes. So, in New Jersey we started meeting and planning on this in January. We formed a statewide whole of government task force I think on February 2nd. So, this is something we've been trying to stay ahead of every step of the way.

As it relates to the vice president and the White House, the administration, the three asks really have been consistently. Number one, personal protective equipment, we need a lot of it. We're grateful for a fraction of it that we've gotten but we need a lot more.

Secondly, boots on the ground. FEMA in fact is helping us set up some drive through testing. And the army corps of engineers with us today and meeting with me tomorrow to look at expanding capacity in our health care system. And then the big one is economic health, economic help.

[22:24:57]

This is a main street crisis. Individuals have been devastated, small businesses. We as states have stepped into the void. We're going to need a ton of help from the feds. My gut tells me the region of New Jersey, New York, Connecticut, Pennsylvania we're probably going to need something on the order of $100 billion of block grants so that we're able to continue to serve these folks who have been impacted the most.

LEMON: Listen, the president just signed an economic bill into law tonight. How much was that needed? How much is that going to help you?

MURPHY: It's going to help, certainly it's something that will help with those who needed the most. Whether it's snap, unemployment benefits, going directly to the individuals. But we're going to need a lot more. As they said in jaws, we're going to need a bigger boat.

Our region is probably 15 to 16 percent of the entire nation's economy. Again, it's a main stream crisis for us to continue to be there for our folks and small businesses. We're going to need the feds to come in, in a big way.

And remember, all of this is a result of the fact that we are aggressively doing everything we can to proactively flatten that curve. That comes with a huge economic cost.

LEMON: Yes, absolutely. Governor murphy, listen, over 50 percent of New Jersey cases are hospitalized. And like the rest of the country, you need more hospital beds. Let's just be honest here. Are you going to be able to meet --

MURPHY: Yes.

LEMON: -- the demands for care?

MURPHY: Well, we're doing our best, Don. I mean, we've got, as I mentioned, the army corps coming in tomorrow. We've identified wings of hospital that have closed. We're looking at reopening hospitals in their entirety that have closed. We're looking at pop-up options.

We're looking at potentially dormitories where the low-level symptomatic folks may be able to go while schools are out. We've double a ton of steps to get ahead of this including we've canceled all schools for the foreseeable future. Time will tell.

But I know this. If we flatten the curve as aggressively as we're doing it, you know, we're restricting travel in our state that's nonessential between 8 p.m. and 5 am. We've shut gyms, theaters, bars, restaurants. If we could flatten that curve over here it will ease the pressure in our health care system over there and we've got to try to do both. This is an and/both moment.

LEMON: Listen, the World health Organization is saying everybody should get tested. What about tests? Are people who need them are they getting them?

MURPHY: Well, we're getting there. It's expanding. I mention that FEMA is helping us. We'll have our first drive-through testing in Bergen County open on Friday. That's the county that's impacted the most. We'll have another one ready to go a few days later. But we're going to need a lot more, Don.

It is getting more robust. So, our numbers are going up partly because of the community spread but also because a lot more people are getting tested. We're not there yet. But step by step we're in that, we're in that direction.

LEMON: Governor Murphy, listen. The governor are really stepping into the void and showing real leadership and we appreciate that and we thank you for joining us here on CNN. Thanks so much.

MURPHY: Thank you so much, Don.

LEMON: The Trump administration warning younger people might be more vulnerable to coronavirus than we thought. Dr. Sanjay Gupta gives us the facts about that and answers your questions, that's next.

[22:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: The Trump administration has a new warning today for millennials and Gen-Z.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DEBORAH BIRX, CORONAVIRUS RESPONSE COORDINATOR, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS TASK FORCE: There are concerning reports coming out from France and Italy about some young people getting seriously ill and very seriously ill in the ICUs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So Dr. Deborah Birx says many young people may be putting themselves at risk believing the virus wasn't a threat to them. Let's discuss now and answer some viewer questions with CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Dr. thank you so much, I appreciate you joining us. So, tell us what's happening that young people are getting sick.

SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, you know, some of the early data that came out of China, sort of painted this narrative that mostly people who are elderly and people with pre- existing conditions were the ones who are getting seriously or critically ill. I think for the most part, that is true. But we are seeing two things, Don that really jumped out of me.

One is now that you go back and look at these younger patients who had the infection but recovered and see how they are doing, many of them have recovered but when you really dig a little deeper you find that they may have 20 to 30 percent reduce lung function. They're recovered but they have a harder time going up a flight of stairs without losing their breadth or running down a block. You know, so, it's a different sort of definition of recovery.

And also we are hearing exactly what Ambassador Birx was saying. In other countries around the world including Italy, you're hearing about patients in their 40s and 50s who are becoming critically ill. Needing those breathing machines that we're talking about. So a much lower percentage still than people in their 70s or 80s. But it can happen. I think it is a really important point. I mean, people are not totally immunized against these disease no matter your age.

LEMON: Do they get better over time, the ones who had reduce lung capacity or is that stay with them?

GUPTA: Great question. And you know, Don, we don't know.

LEMON: Because it just happen, right?

GUPTA: We have been up to this in three months. Normally, when you asked me a question, I would say, Don, based on 10 years of data, based on 20 years of data, this is first time I think I had to answer questions that you ask me like this. We don't know.

LEMON: Yes. The surgeon general today said that young people should act like they have the virus. Why?

GUPTA: Behave as if you have the virus, because you're going to, it going to be to probably dictate a lot of how you behave. How you think about surfaces. How you think about your own body. You know, contaminating yourself or contaminating someone else. You know, I was really struck by this new study. And I want to read this line to you, Don. Because it gets so interesting.

Coming out of China. What they found was that four out of five people confirmed to have the coronavirus were likely infected by people who didn't know they had it. Four in five people who got the coronavirus were likely infected by people who didn't know they had it. Everyone should here that. That was part of the study that came out.

So people who didn't know they had it were the most likely to be spreading it. So, you know, it may not be as contagious when you're not sick, but it is becoming increasingly clear that you can absolutely still spread it. So we all got to behave as if we have it. It will dictate how you conduct your day and your activities.

[22:35:10]

LEMON: All right. I want to show you something now. I just want you to take a look at these images of crowds on packing the beaches in Florida. Listen, we were young and you know, naive, a long time ago. These are beaches, they are packed. But then there's this video in San Francisco. People just out for air. Can you go outside? I mean, what are the guidelines? Because you heard the mayor of New York saying, you may be going stir crazy. Go out to a park, because you're not in a confined place. So, what are the guidelines?

GUPTA: Look, you know, of course you can go outside. And people should get exercise and things like that. You have to keep a social distance away from people. I mean, look, this is, these are hard times for people, because they have to do things and live their lives in a different sort of way. But the idea that if you're going for a run. You go solo or at least stay a reasonable distance away from somebody. That you still stay really good about your hygiene. Did you wash your

hands before you saw somebody or touch somebody? If you're riding your bike or you're wiping down surfaces, I mean, I get no joy in having to tell people to conduct their lives differently in this way, but it makes a difference. We've seen that in different places around the world and even in this country during previous pandemics.

LEMON: Yes. I met the governor of New York, by the way. So, listen, Sanjay, viewer questions for you about kids and playing outside, OK? Can coronavirus be carried on shoes? Can my boys not playing soccer on grass at the park?

GUPTA: This is a concern.

LEMON: Not play soccer. Excuse me. Can my boys not play soccer on grass at the park? What do you think?

GUPTA: Right. I think they can play but the answer to the first question is also possibly yes. You could possibly carry this virus on your shoes. Again, some new literature coming out on this. Here's the advice. I mean, you take off your shoes before you go into the house and try to wipe those down as well. Anything that may have come into contact with surfaces. Just try to wipe that down. I mean, good news is this virus is pretty easily disinfected with many of these cleaners. You just have to do it.

LEMON: OK, another question is, how long does coronavirus last in the air? How long after someone coughs or sneezes is there risk?

GUPTA: So again, new information just coming out on this. Typically the most common mode of infecting or transmitting this virus is going to be through these respiratory droplets which are exactly what they sound like. The virus is inside these respiratory droplets after coughing or sneezing.

And people can either breathe that in, or those droplets get on the surface, you touch the surface, you touch your nose or your mouth, your eyes. But we also have learned that it can sort of get aerosolized for up to three hours in the air as well. We don't know how likely those viral particles are to cause disease. But the answer is a few hours, possibly.

LEMON: I heard, if you're in a more humid area, the aerosolize it goes down faster than if you're in a more air -- dry area, does that make sense?

GUPTA: That does seem to be the case. So warmer temperatures and more humidity.

LEMON: OK. This person asks, should I touch surfaces with my coat or sleeve which are harder or less convenient to clean or my hand which is much easier and convenient to clean? Dr. Birx, warn transmission of the virus from hard surfaces today. What is the safest thing to do, Dr.?

GUPTA: Well, you know, it can live on surfaces as we talk about, even up to a couple days in some of these surfaces. I think the best thing to do is to -- I think, Don, what you're doing, I think you told me earlier. Try and clean these surfaces as much as possible. If you can.

LEMON: You see that? I carry it around with me.

GUPTA: I think it is challenging to keep using your own clothing to do it. It could contaminate your clothing, then touch your clothing, touch your face. You see, you know the route of transmission now. But I think the two things, keep the surface that's you're touching clean. I wash my hands.

I let the water container run. Dry my hands. Turn off the faucet with the towel. Carry that same towel over to the door. Open the door, had the door open and then I throw the towel away. So, you know, you just have -- it is just, a lot of people do that. I think you just have to be more cognizant of it.

LEMON: Yes. This is one of those bleach pads, those disposable ones. And then when it gets dry, I just use another one. You know, I just throw this one away and use another one. I don't know if it works but it just makes me feel better. Thank you Dr. Gupta. I appreciate it. Thanks.

GUPTA: Anytime, Don. Yes.

LEMON: And make sure you join Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Anderson Cooper for a CNN Global Town Hall, "Coronavirus Facts and Fears" in partnership with Facebook live, its tomorrow night at 8:00.

Labs warning not only is there a shortage of coronavirus tests, but there are missing key components needed to run the tests. Next, we are going to dig into how this happened and whether it will be fixed any time soon.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:40:00]

LEMON: As the United States continues to struggle with testing capacity, the FDA announcing that there are now a total of nine coronavirus tests authorized for emergency use. One of the makers of those test says they have 150,000 tests ready to ship immediately. But as CNN's Drew Griffin reports, a shortage of the tests themselves isn't the only issue we're dealing with.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: In the cascading short fall of the National Response To Coronavirus, testing labs across the country are sounding the next alarm. Telling CNN there are shortages. Not just in test, but the components needed to conduct the tests. The head of the 51 hospital network in the West says, key parts are missing.

DR. ROD HOCHMAN, PRESBYTERIAN ST. JOSEPH, SEATTLE: In certain cases with the agents and some of the chemicals that are used and even in certain cases, is just the availability of the appropriate swab in order to take the sample.

GRIFFIN: It is the same story at New York Presbyterian Hospital.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There do continue to be some challenges around expanding the testing significantly at this point.

[22:45:00]

GRIFFIN: And at the University of Nebraska's testing lab.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're in the situation now where we actually don't have the reagents to do the extraction from the samples so that we can run the tests.

GRIFFIN: Health officials in multiple states tells CNN, they do not have enough tests for people who need them because of a shortage. In Minnesota, the state health agency is limiting testing to only the highest priorities specimens due to a national shortage of covid-19 laboratory testing materials. The Ohio department of health told CNN, they are only testing our most vulnerable patients due to a global shortage of supplies. And in West Virginia, the state health officer says, she had to scrape together supplies from flu tests.

DR. CATHY SLEMP, WEST VIRGINIA STATE HEALTH OFFICER: There's all kinds of chains of testing. There's swabs, there's extraction things, et cetera, et cetera. There are shortages on many pieces of it.

GRIFFIN: West Virginia still has a critically low number of tests. Military veteran Kenneth Hawthorne says he's been to the emergency room three times in the past two weeks, sick with a cough, fever, but tested negative for flu. He said he cannot get tested for covid-19.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They keep telling me that my wife and I, we're at low risk. So we weren't priority to take the test.

GRIFFIN: A major test maker Roche diagnostics corporation tells CNN, demand for its test is greater than our ability to supply it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did this happen?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I think we needed to rethink how we are going to deal with an epidemic or pandemic in this case. The minute there was an outbreak in China several months ago, that should have started a whole sequence of events going. Now, as everyone would say, that is the history. But what do we do now?

GRIFFIN: Industries are responding. Ramping up production in both LabCorp and Quest tells CNN they are greatly increasing the number of tests they can process per day. But in the meantime, the CEO of the Association of Public Health Laboratories calls the situation a huge problem. I'm really concerned that we are not going to have the capabilities to test those who really need and should get a test.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN: Don, the Food and Drug Administration told CNN, it's well aware of the shortages and is trying on provide information on alternative sources of reagents, extraction kits, swabs and more. But as one lab official told me, this is analogous to the run on toilet paper. Labs chasing dwindling supplies and hoping manufacturers can somehow fill the void and soon. Don

LEMON: All right. Drew Griffin, thank you so much.

My next guest is getting ready to brief senators on the response to coronavirus. And he thinks the delay in testing could have some dire consequences.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:50:00]

LEMON: The United States continuing to struggle in rolling out testing kits and supplies to fight the coronavirus. Joining me now to discuss is Tom Bollyky, the director of Global Health for the Council in Foreign Relations. He's also the author of the book plagues and the paradox of progress and we thank you for joining us, Tom.

Listen you're going to brief Senators on the Global Response to the Coronavirus tomorrow. That is as we're learning tonight of two members of the House testing positive and more are now self-quarantining. How likely is it that this spreads to the Senate?

TOM BOLLYKY, DIRECTOR OF THE GLOBAL HEALTH PROGRAM, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: I think it's likely that it spreads throughout the United States at some point. The estimates that we have for most leading epidemiologists is that we're likely to see eventually this virus spread to between 40 to 70 percent of the nation.

What's critical is that it doesn't spread to all those people at the same time because our health care system can't handle it. So, it's inevitable that we're going to see this among our representatives in Congress, we're likely to see it in our communities as well.

LEMON: So, what are you going to say when you brief Senators tomorrow?

BOLLYKY: So, understandably, our focus is on the domestic situation, rightly as it should be. But we shouldn't lose sight of what's happening internationally, that's because this epidemic is ultimately -- or pandemic is ultimately going to touch every nation. We're effectively all on the same epidemic curve together and U.S. policy makers and us as members of the public will do better in confronting this pandemic if we learn from those that are ahead of the curve of us.

LEMON: Yes. So, in Drew Griffin's report that ran just before the break just moments ago, he said it's not just a lack of tests but it's also the shortage of the components needed to actually perform those tests that makes this even more challenging.

BOLLYKY: That's right. So, 100 percent of the nations that have successfully tackled this pandemic have done so in the same way. They've done it with aggressive early testing. They've done it with identifying the people that came in contact with those with the disease, tracing them, isolating them, and adopting quarantine policies.

Everyone else is in the boat where we are adopting really broad based social distancing policies, shutting down public transit, public events, schools, things of that nature and doing our best to have our health systems prepared to search safely. There may be parts of the United States that are in that first category where we can do really aggressive testing and isolating, but there are definitely clusters of cases that are going to fall in that second category. What we know about countries that fall in that second category, if this spreads widespread, the results can be quite fearsome.

[22:55:00]

So, in Italy we're seeing 300 plus deaths per day. There are reports of churches no longer holding funerals. In Wuhan at the height of its outbreak, they were seeing death rates six or seven times the rate elsewhere in the country. What we know about this disease is that the health care demands lag the infection rate by around three weeks.

LEMON: Wow.

BOLLYKY: So, because the infection rate happens exponentially, it builds up like a wave for the health system. So, that's really important. The last issue that's going to be really important to communicate to policy makers but also to the general public is that what we're learning internationally is we are in this for the long haul.

Ultimately when control measures lapse and there's going to be some change in policies of course, around that, but if we are not vigilant around our control, we'll see again a resurgence of this virus. It spreads easily. It increases exponentially. Even in countries like Singapore or Taiwan or a territory like Hong Kong that have successfully have seen, controlled this outbreak have seen an increase in numbers of cases over the last couple of days when they started to let go.

What that means is until we build up immunity as a population or we have the vaccine or effective treatment, we have to remain vigilant. And neither of those things, the immunity or the treatment, are going to come any time soon.

LEMON: Yes, I think it's important to point out -- but I've got to run here. But you said that we have the United States has effectively lost two months due to poor testing roll out. Tom Bollyky, thank you so much. We appreciate you joining us here on CNN. Thanks.

BOLLYKY: My great pleasure. Thanks for having me.

LEMON: The number of confirmed coronavirus cases soaring to over 8,700 today. We've got all the latest news on the crisis. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)