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Don Lemon Tonight

CDC Advised People to Use Masks; Two More States Followed the Stay-at-Home Order; Interview With Gov. Jared Polis (D-CO) About States Competing With Other States And The Federal Government For Much-Needed Medical Supplies And Equipment; Pink Says She Tested Positive For Coronavirus; Colorado Governor Asks All Residents To Wear Non-Medical Masks To Prevent Spread Of Coronavirus; Removing The USS Theodore Roosevelt Captain Was Reckless And Foolish; Trump Administration Shut Down Early-Warning Pandemic Program Just Two Months Before Coronavirus Spread In China. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired April 03, 2020 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:00]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Technically, I guess, Isabel Walker (ph) is a guest on the last show as well, because well, she was present -- she wasn't present.

Anyway, Dr. Wayne (ph), congratulations to you and your family. It's ordinary. A little bit of happiness on a difficult day.

The news continues. Let's turn it over to Don Lemon and CNN Tonight.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.

Here is our breaking news. More than a quarter of a million cases of coronavirus in this country. Over 276,900. More than 7,000 deaths right now. More than 1,400 just today. More than a quarter of a million Americans are sick and more than 7,000 have died.

So tonight, the president announces new CDC guidelines, urging Americans to wear face coverings in public. The masks are important, not to protect yourself, but to protects others if you are asymptomatic and unknowingly carrying the virus. It is really important advice. Advice that could save lives. Advice that the president promptly says he won't follow and says you don't have to either.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So, with the masks, it's going to be really a voluntary thing. You can do it. You don't have to do it. I'm choosing not to do it, but some people may want to do it, and that's OK. It may be good. Probably will. They're making a recommendation. It's only a recommendation. It's voluntary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I wish he would think not about his own image, but about setting an example for the country. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What would people gain from wearing a mask and why are you opposed to wearing one yourself?

TRUMP: Well, I just don't want to wear one myself. It's a recommendation. They recommend it. I'm feeling good. I just don't want to be doing -- I don't know, somehow sitting in the Oval Office behind that beautiful Resolute Desk, the great Resolute Desk, I think wearing a face mask as I greet presidents, prime ministers, dictators, kings, queens, I don't know, somehow I don't see it for myself. I just -- I just don't.

Maybe I'll change my mind, but this will pass and hopefully it will pass very quickly. Now, with that being said, if somebody wants to -- most people can just make something out of a certain material. So, it's very well-designated. It's very simple to do. I won't be doing it personally. It's a recommendation, OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Vanity. He also refuses to even consider a nationwide stay-at- home order.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President, Mr. Fauci last night recommended -- said that every state should have stay-at-home orders right now. Do you agree with that? Should every state in this country have the kind of stay-at-home orders that we now see in places like Washington?

TRUMP: I leave it up to the governors. The governors know what they're doing. They've been doing a great job. I guess we're close to 90 percent anyway. And states that we're talking about are not in jeopardy. No, I would leave it to the governors. I like -- I like that from the standpoint of governing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, I guess I alone can fix this, that has gone somewhere else. He's leaving it to the governors. Dodging responsibility. Even though at least 96 percent of people living in this country are now under stay-at-home orders.

More and more states finally issuing those orders. Alabama and Missouri tonight ordering residents to stay home. That leaves just eight states, Arkansas, Iowa, North Dakota, Nebraska, South Carolina, South Dakota, Utah and Wyoming.

There's at least one big job on the president's plate that he won't leave to the states, though, and the job of blaming the former President, Barack Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIM ACOSTA, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: You were preparing for a pandemic -- this government were preparing for a pandemic, why is it we don't have enough masks? Why is it we don't have enough medical equipment in this country?

TRUMP: Previous administrations gave us very little ammunition for the military and very little shelf space -- let me just tell you, you know it, you know the answer. The previous administration -- the shelves were empty. The shelves were empty. So, what you should do is speak to the people from the previous administration, Jim, and ask them that question.

ACOSTA: Mr. President --

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: The shelves were empty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, he over-talked Jim there, but here's the point. This president has been in office for more than three years. If he had really prepared, remember, he has served now almost a full term, there would be no need to blame the former President Barack Obama.

But this president's gaslighting has worked so often for him that he and his base can live in an alternate universe. Remember the alternative facts?

[22:04:56]

A universe where everyone is shocked when a virus does exactly what viruses do. Viruses spread. Viruses go viral. Blows your mind, doesn't it? And on top of all that, it was his predecessor, the one he is blaming tonight, whose people actually trained the Trump administration on how to respond to pandemics. This is retroactive responsibility. The buck stops with Obama. Instead of the buck stops here. That's the new Trump motto.

And then there's this dog eat dog answer to the question of whether New York, with well over 100,000 people sick with the coronavirus, will have enough ventilators to keep people alive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Governor Cuomo is saying that New York may be days away from running out of ventilators. Can you assure New York that going into next week that they're going to have the ventilators that they're going to need?

TRUMP: No, they should have had more ventilators at the time. They should have had more ventilators. They were totally underserviced. We are trying to do -- we're doing our best for New York. You know, we have -- we have states -- we have a lot of states. We have territories, too, but we have a lot of states that have to be taken care of.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: They should have had more ventilators. That is brutal. And in this time of crisis, we've got to call out our leaders right now. Members of our government. When they don't -- when they aren't telling us the truth.

Here's the case in point, the president's son-in-law and senior adviser Jared Kushner. I want you to listen to what he said last night about the strategic national stockpile.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JARED KUSHNER, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR ADVISER: The notion of the federal stockpile was it's supposed to be our stockpile, it's not supposed to be state stockpiles that they then use, so we're encouraging the states to make sure that they're assessing the needs, they're getting the data from their local -- local situations and trying to fill it with the supplies that we've given them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Boy. That is absolutely not true, that the strategic national stockpile is just for the federal government. And what's up with Kushner calling it our stockpile? It's our stockpile. It belongs to the people of the United States. And the proof of that comes from our own fact checker Daniel Dale. I want you to listen to what he said after Kushner made that totally false statement last night.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Daniel, Kushner also said today that the strategic national stockpile is not for states to use. What is the truth here?

DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: I'm on the web site right now staring at my computer screen of the strategic national stockpile, and this is what it says, Don, on its first page. This is the intro.

The stockpile is a large supply of lifesaving pharmaceuticals and medical supplies for use in a public health emergency severe enough to cause local supplies to run out.

Then it goes on to say, when state, local, tribal and territorial responders request federal assistance to support their efforts, the stockpile ensures that the right medicines and supplies get to those who need them most.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: You need to know this. It gets worse, OK? That web site Daniel Dale mentioned last night, by this morning it was changed to match what Jared Kushner said. You see, what Kushner said wasn't true. It was, in fact, false. So, they changed the web site in order to make it match what he said. To cover up for him. This administration's attitude, don't come crying to us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KUSHNER: Don't ask us for things when you know that -- when you don't

know what you have in your own state. Just because you're scared, you asked your medical professionals and they don't know. You have to take inventory of what you have in your own state and then you have to be able to show that there's a real need.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Just because you are scared. Have a heart. Here's what the president says tonight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We have a stockpile -- it's a federal stockpile. We can use that for states or we can use it for ourselves. We do use it for the federal government.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: We can use it for ourselves? Who -- who is that exactly? Does this president, this administration even know how our government works? And as far as his insistence that nobody could have seen this coming, a lot of people actually did, including his own secretary of health and human services, Alex Azar, who said this as a biodefense summit a year ago, and I quote here.

"Of course, the thing people ask, what keeps you most up at night in the biodefense world? Pandemic flu, of course. I think everyone in this room probably shares that concern."

The president was asked about that tonight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Your own health and human services secretary was aware that this had the potential of being a very big problem around the world, a pandemic of this nature. Who dropped the ball?

[22:10:07]

TRUMP: Well, I always knew that pandemics are one of the worst things that could happen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, then, you should have prepared. You had ample warning. The bulk of a full term as president. The buck stops with you.

Our chief political correspondent is Dana Bash. Our White House correspondent is Kaitlan Collins. They both join me this evening. Good evening. Dana, the big news tonight is the CDC recommending face coverings in public but the president says he won't be wearing one, so masks, optional?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Look, this has been so incredibly confusing, and the surgeon general himself admitted that, said that word, confusing, from the White House podium today.

I was just communicating with an administration official who said there is just no way that the president will wear a mask. A couple of reasons, but on the practical side what they insist at the White House is that what the recommendation right now, the new one is intended to do is to prevent asymptomatic people who have the virus from spreading it to one another. He's gotten tests so he feels comfortable that he's OK.

That's a different question from the one that I think that you're alluded to here, Don, which is leadership by example. And that is obviously not something he's willing to do. But it does come -- this whole decision comes after a very, very intense debate, week-long debate that Anthony Fauci said right on CNN's air last night was pretty intense, about whether or not to change the guidelines, and there was some resistance at the White House.

LEMON: Kaitlan, a source is telling CNN that the CDC felt pressured by the White House to draft these guidelines. What can you tell us about that?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, they told our colleague Nick Valencia that actually they would have rather waited and made sure that this is the guidance they wanted to put out because initially, as you heard the surgeon general say today what Dana just referenced is, he basically said that was the best guidance that they had at the time when in early March he was telling Americans stop buying masks, it's not going to help you.

Now officials at the CDC say they felt pressured to put this guidance out. They actually wanted to wait and see. That comes after that very heated debate inside the West Wing over what to do about this.

Because you had officials telling the president that he should put out this guidance, that it will help stop the spread of the coronavirus, and you had other people telling the president it's going to lull Americans into a false sense of security.

They're not going to listen to this cloth, only mandate. And said they are actually going to go out and further threaten the supply of these medical-grade masks. So that's the question.

But obviously the larger question coming out of this, the president saying he's not going to follow it, does his own action undercut the guidance from the CDC because a lot of times people take cues from the president.

LEMON: So, listen, about this national stay-at-home order after Dr. Fauci called for one. Why is the president ignoring experts' opinions here? That's for you, Kaitlan.

COLLINS: That's a really good question. That's a -- that's a great question because you saw Fauci on CNN just last night saying he doesn't understand why there are states that have been reluctant to do this. Belatedly doing this. My home state of Alabama finally did it today after a lot of urging

from other officials that they should be doing it. But what's notable is that the president here I think realizes inside the West Wing they can't tell governors what to do in this situation. It's not enforceable whatever they say, but what the president says has a lot of weight on these governors.

I think it's nine of these governors that have not so far done this are Republican governors. So, it has an even more incredible amount of weight on them. So, what the president says matters, as we saw with Florida's Ron DeSantis this week who changed his opinion, he said citing the president's demeanor at that briefing.

So, it does make a different what the president says about this. But for right now he is giving cover to these governors, saying it's up to them to make the best decisions for their states.

And it comes, as you should know, behind the scenes health officials are telling the president they think all states should be following the same mandate, not just a patch work of certain states doing certain things in the medical experts' opinion.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: Right, Don, if I --

LEMON: Dana, will you follow up on that? Yes, go ahead. Go ahead, Dana.

BASH: Yes. If I may, I mean, I think what Kaitlan said I know is exactly right. And if just kind of look at what she said from the other side of it, which is, that the president is giving these governors cover.

The flip side of that is that the president doesn't want to be the one to tell these governors, all of whom are governors of red states for whom, you know, many of whom that the governors and more importantly the majority of the constituents think of it as anathema for the president of the United States to be putting this kind of -- using this kind of heavy hand on their states.

[22:15:03]

You know, the other thing that you need to keep in mind is that at the White House, at least I talked to a senior official tonight, who said what would we do? Would it be martial law? Which is a good question. I mean, how do you implement that?

But it doesn't have to be an actual executive order. It could be really use of the bully pulpit. The president standing at that podium for, you know, so many hours, you know, combined for this whole week and the past few weeks, he could just say, if it were me, I would do it, I think it's important to do it.

Just use his rhetoric, which is so powerful, as any president's is, but he doesn't want to do that. For a lot of reasons, but the fact that they're red states is something to keep in mind.

LEMON: It's interesting to me -- he continues to blame the lack of ventilators, Kaitlan, on -- and equipment on governors. Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We have a federal stockpile and they have state stockpiles. And, frankly, they were -- many of the states were totally unprepared for this. So, we had to go into the federal stockpile. But we're not an ordering clerk. They have to have for themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, he keeps using this ordering clerk line. I mean, what is this ordering clerk? Why is that? Why doesn't he see the power the federal government has here? As Dana was saying, he doesn't see the power of his pulpit. Maybe he does. Maybe for some reason he's punting with the governors, but he doesn't see the power of the federal government when it comes to the ventilators as well. What is -- what's happening?

COLLINS: Yes, and the other week he was saying we're not a shipping clerk for these states. Though he has said time and time again when these states do need backup, he says the federal government will be there, but, of course, we know the federal -- the national stockpile is running low on basically depleted of PPE gear and on ventilators they only have 10,000 left.

That is certainly is not the number that we've seen these state governors say that they are going to need going forward. I've asked some people close to the president why they keep putting this back on the states. They say it's pretty much basically a way for the president to deflect criticism of the federal government in this situation.

And you've seen that play out with these governors where there are certain governors who criticize the federal government, say they're not getting what they need and then the president comes out and says, well, they shouldn't be relying on us for everything they need.

And then Jared Kushner says the national stockpile is our stockpile, not the states'. Even Republican senators disagree with that. Cory Gardner said today he didn't know what Kushner meant by that because the stockpile belongs to everyone, it belongs to these states. That's its purpose, is to help back these states up when they need it.

BASH: Exactly.

COLLINS: So, much like with the guidance about the stay-at-home orders, it's really a way for the president to be able to leave this responsibility up to the states. So, if they don't have what they need then it can fall on the states' shoulders. If they don't issue these stay-at-home orders then it falls on the states.

And it's notable, Don, given the fact that the president has said he is a war time president, yet he is very often as we've seen on occasions deferring to states on matters like this.

LEMON: I mean, where would the stockpile go to? Family member and friends? When he says ours, I don't understand? Aren't states part of the United States and people, citizens of the United States?

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: The whole point of having the stockpile, Don. It's the whole point of having it.

LEMON: I don't really get it.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: The whole point of having the stockpile is for the federal government to use it for the states. I mean, no matter what it says in the -- on the web site, no matter how it's changed to, you know, match what Jared Kushner said last night, that's what it's for, full stop.

LEMON: Yes. That's the issue with, you know, having your kids as your adviser. All the best people. Thank you. I appreciate it.

The CDC now recommending Americans wear nonmedical-grade masks. My next guest is a top doctor and former vice president, Cheney's cardiologist, has some thoughts on that that you really need to hear. That's next.

[22:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: The CDC recommending Americans wear nonmedical-grade masks in public as officials report the most deaths in one day from the coronavirus. More than 1,400.

President Trump saying that new guidelines are voluntary and that he won't wear a mask.

Joining me now is Dr. Jonathan Reiner of George Washington University Hospital. He is the cardiologist to former Vice President Dick Cheney. Doctor, I'm so glad you're here. Thank you so much. These are important times. A lot of people are watching. They want good information and you're here to supply it, so thank you for joining us. I really appreciate it. You doing OK?

JONATHAN REINER, CARDIOLOGIST, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL: My pleasure.

LEMON: Yes.

REINER: I'm fine, thank you.

LEMON: You say that this is a watered-down recommendation, and it comes down to the fact that the administration knows that there aren't enough masks. REINER: Yes. You know, this is really a half-baked, completely

inadequate half measure that comes weeks too late. Look, I think the bottom line is the reason why we haven't had a firm recommendation from the CDC for people in public to wear masks is very simply and very sadly that we don't have the masks.

Don, if you look at how testing was rolled out in the United States, the first patient tested positive for the coronavirus on January 20th. And it took 51 days, that's a week short of two months, for us to test 20,000 people in this country.

And the reason why we weren't more widely testing and the reason why we had such stringent restrictions on who was tested then was that we didn't have the tests. So now, you know, weeks, many weeks into this crisis, into this singular public health crisis of our lifetimes, of the century, people in public aren't wearing masks simply because we don't have them.

We've known for a long time that masks prevent transmission. If you look at photographs from the Spanish flu pandemic 102 years ago, everyone in the street is wearing a mask. We wear masks in the operating room to prevent transmitting infection to a vulnerable patient.

[22:25:04]

Why would we not be wearing them on a -- on a packed subway train?

LEMON: So, Dr. Reiner, I just want to -- you're pretty clear to me, but I want to make sure the audience -- because sometimes they're doing other things.

REINER: Yes.

LEMON: And they're not paying attention as closely as I am. They have lives. I'm not saying that I don't, but I'm sitting here talking to you.

REINER: Yes.

LEMON: You're saying that everyone should be wearing masks when they're out in public. It should be mandated that we wear masks?

REINER: So, I work at George Washington Hospital right -- six blocks from the White House. And a couple of weeks ago the leadership in my place decided that all staff -- physicians, nurses and staff in the hospital would wear masks. Not to protect ourselves from -- from the patients but to protect ourselves from each other. Right?

We've known that about a huge proportion of people with the virus, anywhere between 20 to 50 percent of people with the virus have either minimal or no symptoms at all, and that's where a lot of the transmission comes from.

So, you wear a mask in public to protect, you know, your neighbor, the old man down the street, the person who has just had a kidney transplant. That's how you slow the spread of this virus, by wearing a mask in public.

What did they do in China? What did they do in South Korea? If you -- not only did they have draconian social distancing and quarantine practices, anyone in public was wearing a mask. Wearing a mask prevents or dramatically reduces the transmission of virus from one person to another. It should be required. So, we don't have a --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: All this time we've been getting the recommendations from the -- those experts saying it's not -- don't do it. It's, you know, it doesn't really -- it doesn't really do any good. It's actually worse for you because you touch your face more and on and on and on. They were wrong?

REINER: You know, they -- they were -- they were half right. Right? The mask is not designed to prevent you from getting the virus, although it might. You know, it might lessen the likelihood of somebody, you know, if somebody sneezed in your presence, it will prevent you from transmitting it to somebody else.

There was a really horrible -- horribly sad piece posted on social media this week. There was a bus driver in Detroit, his name was Jason Hargrove. A couple of weeks ago he posted a really angry message online because somebody without a mask came on his bus --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: And was coughing.

REINER: Sneezed.

LEMON: Yes.

REINER: Yes, coughed right on him.

LEMON: Ended up dying, right?

REINER: Yes, he died this week, right?

LEMON: Yes.

REINER: He died because passengers on a crowded bus coughed. Coughed in his face. So, think about a crowded subway line, and think about the lack of social distancing there. People have to get to work. They got to get on the subway. Everybody should be wearing a mask.

LEMON: Yes. I just want to --

(CROSSTALK)

REINER: Our government --

LEMON: Wait, say that -- I stepped on you. Say it one more time. Our government what? REINER: Our government needs to make that possible. That is what the

federal government is for. Instead, we're seeing what somebody described this week as Darwinian federalism, right? Survival of the fittest.

LEMON: I've got one more -- I've got one more that I want to ask you before I let you go.

REINER: Yes.

LEMON: I'm running out of time here. The president tonight addressed this drug, hydroxychloroquine. Listen to this.

REINER: Yes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Hydroxychloroquine, I don't know, it's looking like it's having some good results. I hope that that would be a phenomenal thing, but we have it right now in approximately now -- it's increased to 1,500 people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: You say that's downright dangerous, why?

REINER: Because the drug has toxicity. Right? The drug may be effective -- there is no one that is praying for this drug to be effective as -- and a game-changer in treating people who are sick with this virus than I am, but I need to see the data.

The drug can cause a dangerous heart arrhythmia in susceptible people. And if it's not taken under a physician's supervision, people are going to die. So, it may be that the risks are overshadowed by tremendous benefits. Fantastic. But we need to see the data.

We need to know the risk of taking the drug outweigh -- the benefit of taking the drug outweighs the risks. And, you know, the highway of medical investigation has been littered with drugs that seem good, but when you study them in rigorously performed clinical trials prove to be either ineffective or downright harmful.

[22:30:00]

And if we're going to prescribe this to hundreds of thousands of Americans, I want to know that it's going to help and it's not going to hurt.

LEMON: Dr. Jonathan Reiner, thank you, sir. You be safe.

REINER: You too. Good night.

LEMON: Good night.

We have some breaking news for you. You know the musical artist Pink says that she has tested positive for the coronavirus. In a statement that she put out, the singer says, quote, two weeks ago my three-year- old son Jameson and I are showing symptoms of covid-19. Fortunately, our primary care physician had access to tests. I tested positive. Well, Pink says after two weeks of sheltering at home, she has now tested negative and goes on to call it a travesty that coronavirus testing is not more widely available.

States competing with other states and even the federal government for much-needed medical supplies and equipment. I'm going to ask Colorado Governor Jared Polis what he is doing to get what his state needs as the number of cases rise. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:35:00]

LEMON: Dr. Deborah Birx from the White House coronavirus task force saying today one of the areas she's most concerned about is Colorado. So let's get right to the governor of Colorado, and that's Jared Polis. Good evening, governor. I know that your time is very valuable. Thank you so much. You're doing a great job, by the way, right off. So, let's talk about the situation there. Over 4,000 cases tonight. How are your efforts to fight this virus going?

GOV. JARED POLIS (D-CO): Well, holding up, but I'm glad it is drawing some national attention. We hope that leads to increased supplies. We're at about 823 people hospitalized, 111 deaths. We took action earlier. It would be worse. We were able to close our bars and clubs and restaurants before St. Patrick's Day, thank goodness, and we're doing our best every day. It's a struggle to get the supplies we need and scale up our hospital capacity.

LEMON: I was going to ask you, what about your medical equipment situation? Do the Colorado hospitals have the PPE and the ventilators that they need?

POLIS: Well, it's tough. We're competing against every other state, every other country. Now we're even competing against the federal government. We had some -- a good lead with a manufacture on vents at a fair manufacturer's price and they got swiped up by FEMA, so we're not getting them.

So, it was nice when we were just competing against the states. It's harder to also be competing against FEMA. We don't know yet what we're going to get from FEMA. We've been asking. We'd love a timeline and numbers. In the meantime, we're doing everything we can both domestically as well as internationally, Taiwan, Korea, China. We've just got some test kits in from Korea. So, we're innovative. We're doing our best to do what we can.

LEMON: OK. You mentioned FEMA. Let me ask you about, I was going to ask you about the stockpile controversy, that you know, you heard Jared Kushner talk about. But a Congressional source is telling CNN that many of the orders that your state placed, including the one for 500 ventilators, have been cancelled, because FEMA is snatching them up and you have to compete with the federal government to get what you need. So, so you just -- you mentioned that. What -- are you saying anything to the White House, to the federal government? Are they trying to comply or relent in any way? Do they understand how they're hurting you with this?

POLIS: Well, either be in or out, folks. That's kind of my message. Either you're buying them and you're providing them to the states and you're letting us know what we're going to get and when we're going to get them or stay out and let us buy them. We've got the most nimble, most dynamic team. We pulled in a bunch of leaders from the private sector. They're working on global acquisition.

But we can't compete against our own federal government. So either work with us or don't do anything at all. But this middle ground where they're buying stuff out from under us and not telling us what we're going to get, that's really challenging to manage our hospital surge and our safety of our health care workers in that kind of environment.

LEMON: This goes along with that. You know, Jared Kushner saying this national stockpile is for, you know, said it's our stockpile. It's not supposed to be state stockpiles. You need help from that stockpile, don't you?

POLIS: Well, I don't know what that means. We're a nation of 50 states and the territories, right? And so we're all on the same team here. We're on the same team as the federal government, our states. We're working closely with our local governments, with our hospitals. Every day each one of our major hospitals puts in the data in our online tool how many personal protective equipment they have, how many hospital beds, how many they've built, how many vents they have. We're sharing together as a state. We'd love to see more of that same spirit nationally. I think it could save lives and you can also reduce the duration of this economic disruption. Which is just really -- you know, really devastating people's abilities to support themselves.

LEMON: Governor, thank you. I appreciate having you on. We'll have you back, of course.

POLIS: And everybody wear masks. We're going to wearing masks in Colorado. Everybody's wearing masks. It's cool. It saves lives and we all need to do it when we're out.

LEMON: Yes, the president laid out the CDC guidelines, but you guys did it -- you announced your own guidelines, and you have everybody wearing masks.

POLIS: No matter where you live. Whether your governor wants you to or not, wear those masks to save lives.

LEMON: Jared Polis, thank you, sir.

POLIS: Thank you.

LEMON: A Navy captain getting this sendoff today after he was removed from his post for warning his sailors that they were in danger with coronavirus spreading on board.

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LEMON: A moving show of support today for a departing leader. Sailors from the USS Theodore Roosevelt giving a rousing sendoff to Captain Brett Crozier as he departed his ship for the final time. Captain Crozier was relieved of his duties yesterday after raising the alarm about the coronavirus outbreak on board his ship in a memo to Navy leadership. That set off a firestorm.

Joining me now, CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr and retired Navy Rear Admiral John Kirby. Good evening. Good to see you. Goo to see both of you safe and healthy. Barbara, you first. The Navy isn't accusing Captain Crozier of leaking the memo, so why is he relieved of his command?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, what they are saying inside the Navy is that they had a loss of confidence in him, because he sent this memo out, they say, to a large number of people, and basically revealed information and that he exercised bad judgement in the Navy's view in sharing all of this information. And he didn't share it, they say, with his chain of command. His admiral was just down the hall in the carrier -- on board the carrier and they say he didn't share it with them. That led an acting Navy secretary to say he had a loss of confidence, that he simply couldn't trust the judgement of the captain, but look at that video.

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The crew, or at least the hundreds of sailors out on deck that night, they did not have any loss of confidence in Captain Crozier. They came out. Word clearly spread through the 4,000-person crew that he was about to depart and so many came out to give him the sendoff that they felt he deserved.

LEMON: Imagine how that felt. I'm sure that meant a whole lot to him. John, an opinion piece tonight on CNN.com. Here's what you write in part. You said removing the USS Theodore Roosevelt captain was reckless and foolish. Why was this the wrong call?

REAR ADM. JOHN KIRBY (RET.), CNN MILITARY AND DIPLOMATIC ANALYST: Mostly the reason I wrote that part of the piece, Don, was because of the timing of this. I mean, here we are with an aircraft carrier in the middle of trying to offload thousands of sailors in Guam, because he's got an epidemic on board and to go through a transition of leadership only is going to make things more unstable. It's only going to exacerbate the fear and the uncertainty that the sailors and the families are having.

So, I think the timing was particularly bad here. I also didn't find their justification all that convincing, at least not know. They've got an investigation going on. We will learn more next week. And look, if he leaked this thing, well, that's a whole different matter. But I don't think they made the case strongly enough that what he did was egregious enough that warranted him being fired like that.

LEMON: What goes through your mind when you see the sendoff he got from the sailors on that ship? Because when I said that probably meant a lot to him, I heard you go -- I heard you sort of mumble there.

KIRBY: Yes, I tell you, I've been around sailors my whole life, Don. My grandfather was one. My father was one. You cannot BS a sailor. They don't just know good leadership when they see it, they feel good leadership when they see it. And you can really feel and you can hear it in that video how much they adored this man and how much they appreciated his leadership and what he did for them, and I think that just comes through. And I can't think of a single tribute that that man will ever get in his career, however long he'll still serve, that will mean more to him than that.

LEMON: I mean, look at that, John. All of those men and women there.

KIRBY: Yes.

LEMON: Just aboard --

KIRBY: It's incredible.

LEMON: Yes. It's incredible.

KIRBY: And it speaks volumes about what kind of leader, the kind of naval officer he is.

LEMON: That has no impact, no effect on the brass?

KIRBY: Well, apparently not? I mean, Mr. (INAUDIBLE) made this decision. I mean, I don't think it impacted him previously, and that's a shame. But, you know, look, they got an investigation going on. We'll see what they turn up. Again, I just don't think the case was that solid.

LEMON: Barbara, U.S. Defense officials telling CNN this morning that 137 soldiers from the USS Theodore Roosevelt have now tested positive for the coronavirus. Speaking of the investigation going on. That is representing more than 10 percent of all cases across the U.S. military. So, what steps -- the U.S. Navy, what are they doing to battle that spread?

STARR: Well, on this ship, this goes to the central concern that the captain apparently had. He wanted things to go much faster. They're trying to offload, first of all, to get those who are sick off the ship, get them to medical care, get those who have symptoms isolated and get them taken care of.

But they're also trying to get off a large number, hundreds of additional essential crew members so they can be in quarantined, essentially, or isolated for 14 days, determine that they don't have the virus and get them back on board. It's a bit of a mystery right now. The captain clearly knew this was going on, but he also made very clear in his memo that he just didn't think things were moving fast enough, and paraphrasing his words, he said this is not war and he didn't want to see any of his sailors die, he wanted this to move much more quickly than it was.

The Pentagon, for its part, saying they knew about, you know, that these sailors were ill and that they were moving additional medical care and additional aid out there and that they were moving very fast.

LEMON: Barbara Starr, Rear Admiral Kirby, thank you very much. I appreciate it.

KIRBY: Thank you, Don.

LEMON: The Trump administration shut down a program to detect pandemics early that included working with a lab in Wuhan, China, two months before the coronavirus outbreak. That story is next.

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LEMON: The Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar defending President Trump's readiness for a pandemic. But the administration's actions don't support that. Among them, the shutdown of a pandemic early warning program weeks before the coronavirus started spreading in China.

Let's discuss now. Los Angeles Times Science and Medicine reporter Emily Baumgaertner is here. We're so glad that you're here to talk about this reporting, about your reporting. So, listen, you reported on this program aimed at training scientists in China that was shut down by the Trump administration. Tell us about it, and why it ended just two months before the coronavirus.

EMILY BAUMGAERTNER, LOS ANGELES TIMES SCIENCE AND MEDICINE REPORTER: Sure. So this is a program that examines the intersection of animals and humans in nature. So this is a research program. Researchers are out in the field taking samples, trying to understand what viruses are circulating in animals that we haven't seen in humans yet, and which ones are most likely to jump over in to humans and perhaps launch into a pandemic.

So this is a program that was on a grant cycle. I want to be very clear. The Trump administration did not gut a permanent program. They just finished up a program and chose not to renew it. And that was two months before this pandemic. So some would say pretty bad timing.

LEMON: Yes. And one of the labs involved, am I right, is in this program, was in Wuhan where the virus started?

BAUMGAERTNER: There were labs all throughout the world who worked with the USAID on this. One of them was the virology institute lab right in Wuhan. That was in fact the lab that identified this virus very quickly. So some of the researchers in the program say that although it was shut down, that is the silver lining. The lab that they trained themselves was able to identify this.

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LEMON: You have spoken with people involved in this program. They say closing it was incredibly shortsighted. Why do they say that?

BAUMGAERTNER: So, the purpose of the program is, as the title suggests, it's called predict. It's to predict future pandemics. So the little bit of funding that's left, $2 million out of $200 million, that's being used to address this current pandemic to try to squelch it. But it's not working toward identifying the next pathogen, the next one that will jump over into humans and containing it.

So, a lot of researchers who were involved in it say you need to continue funding this kind of research so you can prevent these kind of things on the front end rather than being very reactive when it finely lands in the human host.

LEMON: Emily Baumgaertner, from the L.A. Times, thank you very much. I appreciate it. Be safe out there.

BAUMGAERTNER: Thank you.

LEMON: Breaking news. Under cover of the coronavirus crisis, the president settling scores with a perceived enemy from his impeachment. That story next.

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