Return to Transcripts main page
Don Lemon Tonight
President Donald Trump Says He Will Use Defense Production Act To Increase Swabs For Testing; Asymptomatic Coronavirus Cases At Boston Homeless Shelter Raises Red Flag; President Donald Trump: Deal On Small Business Package Could Come Tomorrow; More Than 3/4 Of A Million U.S. Coronavirus Cases, More Than 40,000 Americans Have Died; Iowa Mayor Has Been Sounding The Alarm On Coronavirus For Almost A Month. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired April 19, 2020 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: --you know isolating and doing all right things. I worked nearly a full week you know when you are feeling kind of not totally yourself but other things and all the stories we tell ourselves and my husband turn off the heater than I before I was like irked at him because that's why - I wasn't feeling well. And then--
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Uh-oh. Did we lose her? Oh, no Brooke. Can we get her back? No? All right we'll try to get Brooke back. But you should read her piece. It's on cnn.com. It's called "How fighting Coronavirus taught me about the gift of connection."
And again she says over the two weeks, the fever, the chills and aches would sometimes leave just long enough to fool me into thinking I was finally recovering she says. And then they would revisit me with a vengeance I never knew when it would end. It was relentless, scary and lonely.
And she said the isolation was worse than the body aches. So there she is right there. So Brooke is recuperating. She says she hopes to be back at work - I think she said may be by the 27th or something like that. But she has to get checked and she has to go a certain number of days.
She has to test negative for a certain number of days. And we're hoping that her husband stays okay as we know Chris Cuomo's wife has now tested positive for the virus. So we're hoping that her husband James will continue to test negative for the virus because he's been taking care of her cooped up in the apartment now for I think she said this was his 17th day.
So we're sorry about the connection with Brooke Baldwin. But as you can see she's doing fine now and we hope that she continues to do well. So Brooke take care of yourself. Sorry about that connection. It happens with technology. We'll move on now and begin the next hour of "CNN Tonight". This is "CNN Tonight" and I'm Don Lemon. It is just after 9:00 pm here on the East Coast. And here's the latest on the Coronavirus pandemic. We have reached another tragic milestone. There are more than three quarters of a million cases in the U.S. tonight.
More than 40,000 people have died and in the face of all that, the President is passing the buck again tonight claiming that testing for the Coronavirus is his words, a local thing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: You must remember that the Governors wanting to have to have total control over the opening of these states but now they want to have us the Federal Government do the testing. And again testing is local you can have it both ways. Testing is a local and it's very important.
Its great but it is a local thing and we're going to get - we're going to get it done to a level at a very short period of time because all of these swabs are coming in all of the necessary materials a lot them as I said are already there but a lot of people don't know that yet.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So the President claiming testing is a local thing, dodging responsibility but it was just last month that he falsely insisted that anybody needs a test gets a test.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Anybody that needs a test gets a test. They are there, they have the tests and the tests are beautiful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: The fact is when the President said that on March 6th, 15 people had died of the Coronavirus in this country 15. Tonight more than 41,000 Americans are dead and we still don't have the testing we need. The testing that President insisted was available for anybody who wanted it on March 6th.
And speaking of wanting to have it both, the President who has been picking a fight with Governors over when to reopen their states tonight, well he praised them. Even as he has been encouraging protests against stay-at-home orders that are so far, the only thing that can slow the spread of the deadly pandemic.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: You're allowed to protest. I watched the protest and they were all six feet apart. It was a very orderly group of people. But some have gone too far some Governors have gone too far. Some Governors have gone too far. Some of the things that happened are maybe not so appropriate.
And I think in the end, it's not going to matter because we're starting to open up our states. And I think they are going to open up very well.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Okay, I'm not sure which protests he's looking at, but look at the ones up there on the screen that we have. Again these protests don't have to lie to you. He said they were six feet apart. Does this look six feet apart to you? It's not.
The number of protesters you see here pales in comparison to more than 40,000 Americans who have died from the Coronavirus. And the more than three quarters of a million cases in this country.
A new poll finds that 58 percent of registered voters are worried that the U.S. will loosen restriction too soon. Only 32 percent worried that it would take too long. We need far more testing before we can start reopening states.
[21:05:00]
LEMON: Experts say we need half a million tests every single day. And we don't have that. We're not even close. We need to be testing. Not just people with symptoms, but people with no symptoms at all people who might have absolutely no idea that they could spread the virus to vulnerable neighbors, to family members and co-workers.
We need facts to be able to make decisions about when it's safe for people to go back to work, back to school, back to church, back to being with friends and team.
Joining me now is White House Correspondent John Harwood and our fact checker Daniel Dale also Senior Washington Correspondent Jeff Zeleny. Gentlemen hello good evening to all of you appreciate you joining us.
John, I'm going to start with you first. The death toll in the U.S. has topped 41,000. 8 days ago it was at 20,000. Just eight days ago. Those numbers are shocking they're terrifying but that wasn't the focus of tonight's briefing, was it?
JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: It wasn't, Don. And I do think we need to point out there were two bits of news on testing, which is the top issue that the President offered tonight. One is getting close to a deal between the administration and House Democrats on not only this Small Business Loan Program that's run out of money, but also $25 billion additional for testing.
That's needed. He also said he's going to use the Defense Production Act to accelerate the production of swabs that are a critical component in testing so small steps in the right direction. But the striking thing about this briefing was that it was focused mostly not on the needs of the American people, but on the needs of the President's ego his reelection campaign and his reputation.
He's seen very harsh judgments of his own performance in news coverage from other political leaders, from Governors saying he's not doing his job. From polls two-thirds of the American people in a few survey said he was slow on Coronavirus. Only 36 percent in an NBC "Wall Street Journal" poll today said they trust the President on Coronavirus.
And so what he spent the briefing doing was trying to say to the American people, no, no, no listen please, I have done a good job. He read out a "Wall Street Journal" column praising him. He played a clip in the briefing room of Andrew Cuomo the Governor of New York saying positive things about him.
Trying to persuade the American people and persuade himself that he really hasn't done as poor a job as people said about him. It's not what you expect to see from the political leader whose job it is to take all of us out of this nightmare.
LEMON: Daniel Dale I want to bring you in. The President has been claiming that only Democratic Governors are complaining about the testing situation. What's the truth about that?
DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: That's not true at all, Don. Just today we had a plea from the Republican Governor of Ohio Mike DeWayne on television asking if anyone from the FDA is listening and could help them acquire more of the critical reagent needed to conduct Coronavirus tests.
We have also heard in the last week from the Pete Ricketts the Governor of Nebraska and just today we had the Maryland Governor Larry Hogan on CNN talking about problems with the testing situation I believe your team has that clip ready.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. LARRY HOGAN, (R-MD): I think states are all working hard on their own to find their own testing. Lab capacity has been increasing. But it's not accurate to say. There's plenty of testing out there. And the Governor should just get it done. That's just not being straight forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DALE: So Don this is not a partisan issue. We are hearing from Governors around the country from both parties that they lack both the number of testing need to safely reopen and the critical materials for those tests. So no, it's not just the Democrats.
LEMON: Jeff Zeleny, you were in Michigan this week you saw those protests firsthand. They have since sprung up all over the place even against GOP Governors. Are these organic protests? Who is organizing them actually?
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Don there's no question these are not organic protests. Most protests on both sides aren't organic. They start with the group they start with some type of essential. But in these cases, in the Michigan case which really got so much attention there in Lansing, Michigan, on Wednesday.
As they began to spread across the country, it was organized by the Michigan Conservative Coalition which was essentially an early group that organized the tea party movement. We're really almost a decade ago.
Also the Michigan Freedom Fund which is loosely connected with the Divas Family of course the Secretary of Education. She's from Michigan a long time Michigan wealthy conservative donor so they say that they just promoted this on Facebook. They didn't organize it.
But Don the reality is these are not organic protests. That doesn't necessarily take away the anger the real anger. There's real anger out there no question. As I was you know watching these protesters from afar as far as we could in Michigan on Wednesday of this week and as we saw them across the country, yes many of them came because you know they just wanted to protest.
[21:10:00]
ZELENY: You know they were supporting President Trump. They were supporting a variety of issues. Pro-militia Anti-vaccination, pro life other things, but they were also some business owners out there who say, look, the stringent restrictions are hurting businesses.
So yes some of them are actual people just coming because they are frustrated. Of course everyone is frustrated by this. But this systemic organization we're seeing in capitals across the country is no doubt being organized by a loose connection of groups and is very - of the tea party group like I said from about a decade or so.
We saw them in capitals across the country we will see them again next week here. So this is not something that is happening organically. But Don the odd thing is they are protesting in many cases the President's own policy.
The White House's own guidelines here. If you look at the guidelines saying these three phases of opening up, none of these states are actually ready for this to be opened up. So that's what is so odd. You see someone waving a Trump banner in air as we saw in Lansing, Michigan.
In fact, they are protesting the President's own policy. So it would take the President himself to shut this down of course he has no interest in doing so Don.
LEMON: Hey Jeff, I got to have a doctor standing by there. I know you weren't in all places at all times as you observe these protests. Did you see anybody getting fined or kicked out or arrested in any of these protests by authorities?
ZELENY: Not really. I mean, there was one small arrest in Michigan we saw just because someone was breaking the law in a different sense. But people were standing close to each other. No masks. Police were sot of letting them do their thing. This is sort of a balancing act that Governors on both sides were doing.
They are not going to be arresting these people for speaking up, but the reality here is the President, as we saw from the White House on Friday, they are saying liberate Michigan. Liberate Minnesota, liberate Virginia. He's inciting these protests. So as we head into this week Don, there are many more scheduled that's the issue here. He's doing nothing to shut this down. And in many cases they are protesting what his policies are actually saying. So that's the issue here. Republican Governors and Democrats are like you are seeing give us some time here.
LEMON: The only reason I ask is because there are people all over the country who are being fined because they aren't wearing masks. I saw someone getting kicked off a train because they weren't wearing a mask.
People were being arrested because they're surfing and yet you have these people out there unmasked who are protesting not getting fined or not getting arrested. I'm just wondering what the fairness is in all a that? Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
Now I want to bring in Dr. Harvey Fineberg who was the Chair of the standing committee on Emerging Infectious Diseases and has advised the White House on Coronavirus. Doctor thank you so much. I appreciate it. This is from the CDC website. I want to read it here and then ask a question.
A study out of China suggests that an air conditioner could have contributed to the spread among three families eating in a restaurant. The yellow filled circle A-1 that you see up there on the screen shows the person with the initial infection while the white filled circles are people that later became infected.
The distance between each table is about three feet. And there's an air conditioner by where families sat. The study said the only known source of the exposure for the infected people in families B and C was patient A-1. So when you see this, what does it tell you about how infectious the Coronavirus is?
DR. HARVEY V. FINEBERG, CHAIR, STANDING COMMITTEE ON EMERGING INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Don, we already know this is a very infectious virus. It's spread by respiratory droplets of different sizes. Some are visible, some are invisible, some could be so tiny that they literally float in the air.
Normally those tiny ones especially outdoors they dissipate or diluted in the open air. But in a situation such as you described the closed room, movement of air flowing from that air conditioner, across the table with the index case, who was infected and then finding those individuals from the family sitting at the adjacent tables directly downstream from the air flow, it's is consistent with this idea that the virus can stay infectious in those droplets and in those cases they were small enough to be carried by that air flow from the one table to the next, to the next.
LEMON: So doctor what does this mean as we are thinking about opening things up in this country? I mean, if this can be spread by air- conditioning, that's alarming.
DR. FINEBERG: Keep in mind Don this isn't that it was spread in the circulation of the air conditioner. This could simply be the flow of air. It could have been the fan. It could have been breeze from a window. It's all the same downstream from the source.
[21:15:00]
DR. FINEBERG: But your point is really important because in opening up in employment, we have to be aware of how do we protect employees, customers, students, visitors, in any business or any other enterprise. And that means distance because proximity is a risk. It means limiting the duration of exposure.
So long meetings are worse than short gatherings. It means limiting the number of people who get together because the fewer the numbers the lower the risk that someone would be infected. It means that adjusting the physical environment in ways that would help people stay safe.
And maybe introducing practices like everyone wearing a mask or even checking temperatures of people as they come into the building that day. So there are a lot of things that we could do constructively that would enable us to get back to a more nearly normal way of business and function, but it does mean we're going to make some changes in order to remain safe during this time.
LEMON: Not only is this virus highly infectious, we're also learning that many people with Coronavirus are there asymptomatic. How does that complicate the fight against this virus?
DR. FINEBERG: There are a number of reasons this virus has been so insidious. First, it is infectious between human to human. That's been obvious. But not every virus that makes this transition from another species to humans has that infectiousness. So that's number one.
Number two is the incubation period is long enough to allow people to be completely asymptomatic already infected and travel from any point on the planet to any other point bringing the infection with them.
The third point is what you're describing now. We have learned that patients who are asymptomatic, that's individuals who are perfectly well, no fever, no aches, nothing wrong with them an at that point in time are still capable of spreading the virus because it's become already infectious from them.
So these are the kind of features added to the severity of disease among many people, especially the older population that make this a really, really dangerous pandemic.
LEMON: Doctor, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
DR. FINEBERG: It's a pleasure Don.
LEMON: The last two days were the deadliest in Massachusetts so far. 159 people reported dead on Friday 156 on Saturday. Here's what the White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator Dr. Deborah Birx says about the situation in the bay state.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DR. DEBORAH BIRX, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS RESPONSE COORDINATOR: We watch every single metro county in a very granular, granular way. You have to look at it that way. We're a series of small epidemics across the United States. We're still very much focused on Boston and across Massachusetts where the epidermis continue to spread across Massachusetts as well as in Boston.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEEMON: Boston's Mayor Martin Walsh joins me now. Mayor, thank you so much. Sorry we just read that often is awful. Thank you for joining us. You just heard Dr. Birx Boston is the Coronavirus hot spot right now. Do you have what you need to deal with the surge in cases?
MAYOR MARTIN WALSH, BOSTON: Well, no not at all. You know testing a couple guests back were talking about testing. Governor Hogan was mentioning it. I know that our Governor of Massachusetts Charlie Baker. We need more testing. We need more swabs. The President talked today that we're going to have more swabs than we know what to do with.
Certainly we could use some of them here in Boston and Massachusetts. I think the talk of pushing us back and getting us back up and running certainly we all want to be up and running again. There's no question about it.
Boston had a very hard economy prior to the Coronavirus, but we also have been careful. We have 175 people in Boston in the City of Boston dead. 5500 cases and they are going up every day.
LEMON: There was an outbreak at a Boston homeless shelter which prompted officials to do more testing. Out of nearly 400 people tested, 146 tested positive and they were all asymptomatic. Doesn't this show how important it is to test everyone in the city or is that enough to test many people?
WALSH: Testing is key and we're testing people in homeless shelters. We're testing people in nursing homes. And what we really have to do is start testing people who don't live in nursing homes and who don't live in homeless shelter to see what's happening with regular Bostonians regular Americans if you will.
We're fortunate here in Boston that we set up a real strong network for our homeless community. We have 1,000 beds ready to go so we're able to handle it. But we're seeing these outbreaks in group homes, but we still don't have at least as far as I see - I don't feel we're comfortable both at numbers we have right now to see the average person living in an apartment or in home.
LEMON: Let's be honest here. Social distancing is obviously very difficult and as you said a group home and in homeless shelter. How are you handling this problem in Boston Mayor?
[21:20:00]
WALSH: You know today was a 60 degree day. A lot of people were disappointing. There were people out golfing there were people playing soccer there were people gathering. I think right now not understanding the severity of what's happening here in the country and in Boston and Massachusetts is just wrong.
And while I have a national audience, social distancing is the key. If we want to stop Coronavirus, we can listen to all the leaders talk all they want about how great they are. You stop Coronavirus by social distancing. That's the only way it's going to happen.
LEMON: Mayor, good luck to you. Come back and tell us what you need. Okay, be safe.
WALSH: Thanks Don.
LEMON: Thank you very much. More than three quarters of a million cases of Coronavirus across this country and the crisis is battering businesses everywhere. The President itching to reopen America but what will happen if states open too soon?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:25:00]
LEMON: The U.S. has now surpassed 40,000 deaths in the Coronavirus pandemic, but the Governors of some states have not been hit hard by the outbreak are taking the first steps to reopen. Although medical experts across the nation say more testing is needed before that happens. Here is CNN's Natasha Chen.
NATASHA CHENN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's been 50 days since the first Coronavirus death in the U.S. tonight that death toll is more than 40,000. Nearly double from a week ago, yet with 22 million people who filed for unemployment in the last, there are increasing calls for and indications of America soon reopening.
Florida is reopening beaches. Texas is rolling out plans to soon resume commerce and people are protesting in several states against stay-at-home orders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Freedom and liberty. We're losing it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: President Trump is itching to reopen America.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We're going to start to open our country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: Not just to reboot an economy in free falls, but with his poll numbers sliding and an election just months away, to resume a treasured pastime. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well, I hope we can do rallies it's great for the country it's great spirit it's great for a lot of things.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: But Trump has acknowledged it's the Governors who are the authorities when it comes to reopening society.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Governors will be empowered to tailored approach that meets the diverse circumstances of their own states. Every state is very different.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: And many of those Governors from both parties have said it won't be safe to reopen until the Trump Administration extends the one critical lifeline.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. RAY COOPER, (D-NC): More help is needed from the Federal Government on testing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We simply have not had enough test kits.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We Governors are doing the best we can with what we've got.
GOV. ANDREW CUOMO, (D-NY): The President doesn't want to help on testing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: Trump fired back calling the Governors complainers and saying he's already created, "Tremendous capacity when it comes to testing".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: They don't want to use all of the capacity that we have created. The Governors know that. The Democrat Governors know that. They are the ones that are complaining.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: Republican Governors have been sounding the alarm too.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOGAN: To try to push this off to say that the Governors have plenty of testing and they should just get to work on testing. Somehow we aren't doing our job. It's just absolutely false.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: And just a day after Trump sent a trio of tweets urging his supporters to "Liberate Minnesota, Michigan and Virginia", all states governed by the Democrats, he openly supported the actions of the protesters who have chosen to disregard social distancing measures while millions more heed the expert's advice and stay at home.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I just think that some of the Governors have gotten carried away.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: Offering only blame instead of the assistance Governors say they so desperately need.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CUOMO: Don't pass the buck without passing the bucks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: Already we're starting to see one state planning to reopen some things this week. According to the Charleston, South Carolina, paper "The Post and the Career" the Governor there is expected to announce tomorrow that beach goers and visitors will be a allowed public access to rivers and lakes and that retail stores that have been closed for two weeks will be allowed to start accepting customers purchasing clothing, furniture and jewelry according to the new order. Don back to you.
LEMON: All right, Natasha Chen thank you very much. Businesses that want to reopen are coming up with plans to do that safely. We're going to dig into what they need to ensure the health and safety of their employees, that's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:30:00]
LEMON: President Trump saying a deal on additional funding for small businesses could happen tomorrow that as businesses across the country grapple with how and when to reopen?
Let's discuss CNN's National Security Analyst Juliette Kayyem is here and Joe Allen he is Assistant Professor at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health. He's also the author of the book "Healthy Buildings". That is important this day and age, right.
Good evening to both of you. Juliette, there's so many focus on PPE and testing and how we don't have enough of either and employers and employees want to have these things available before they consider going back?
JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Absolutely. I want to make it clear there are lots of people working. They are working for us through the supply chain for transportation, for all the critical infrastructure and essentials that we need. So we are grateful to them and obviously, the first responders and health workers.
So now we let the second tier of the workforce and some of those people are going to have a choice about whether they even return to work. This is sort of the amazing thing over the last month or six weeks.
A lot of employers are going to determine, look, this thing that we did want to do which is have everyone work at home is cheaper, people are productive, they are going to come in and they are going to be at risk because they have been on public transport and they are going to be together.
So you're going to see a lot of creativity in this time period the next couple years until possibly we have a vaccine. We are employers who can and are not bringing people into the office.
LEMON: People are going to save a lot of money on pants?
KAYYEM: Yes. How did you know?
LEMON: We needed that.
KAYYEM: That's my gray sweat pants right there.
LEMON: I have got blue ones on right now. What about you Joe? Are you wearing sweat pants or jeans?
JOE ALLEN, ASSISTANT PROFESSOR OF EXPOSURE ASSESSMENT SCIENCE, HAVARD: Not telling. I'm comfortable.
LEMON: Right, good. So Joe listen you study strategies for safety in the workplace. What other kinds of plans and safety measures do businesses need before being comfortable with reopening?
[21:35:00]
ALLEN: Yes, actually there are some steps we can take to manage this as we think about when the time is right to get back to work. The way I think about it is the layered defense approach. I know Juliette mentioned PPE. In my field we think about hierarchy of controls. And actually PPE is the last line of defense.
So in that hierarchy, there are five steps. The first one is you eliminate the hazard. So we could all stay at home and eliminate the hazard and most of us that should but that's not going to restart our economy.
The next step is substitution. So businesses need to identify who are the core people that need to go back to your business to keep it running. Next after that are engineering controls. This is where healthy building strategies come in. Higher ventilation rates, enhanced filtration, use of portable air purifiers and other technology. The next layer of defense in this hierarchy of controls are administrative controls. So here this is where we think about de- densification of our de-densifying our buildings. Can you work go to A, B days? Can you do work in shifts?
How can you're going to handle queues at the elevator? And very last is PPE. It is the least effective but it should and can be used. And I imagine we'll be very comfortable seeing people in masks and places in buildings and in elevators.
LEMON: That's very interesting. And you're talking about - that's where we need to go next. Good points. How long does it take businesses to build that, to do that, to put that into place?
ALLEN: I'm already working with businesses right now. Look I think we have to listen what Martin Walsh said too. The first thing we have to do here is maintain social distancing so we don't overwhelm our health care system.
But when that time is right, we can start to ease back into the workplace and good companies right now are making those plans. That's the right thing to be doing to thinking about all of these hierarchy of controls layer of this defense but to be clear and they have to be clear in this, there's no such thing as zero risk. The goal here is to layer defense to drive down risk. But they will never be zero risk here.
LEMON: So Juliette, that's the next - that's where we're going, right?
KAYYEM: It's exactly. This is the period. Joe and I worked together. He's in the building space. I'm in the Homeland Security space but we talk about it in terms of adaptive recovery. What we are looking at for the next couple years until there's sort of a final solution is each day is going to be slightly different.
It's not going to be a typical recovery because we're going to have to manage around, work around, to live with this virus. You'll want to reduce the risk to the extent you can. One perfect way to do that for employees that have choice or employers that have choice is clearly going to be key.
But a lot of them at home or right you know split the times that they are together. You want to minimize the lots of people together. It also means - its cubicles are back. You're not going to have these open to floor plans.
And also I just want to say something about health insurance. It's really important that employees feel that employers or have protections for employers so that they come forward. Because if they don't come forward, they're going to come into work and they're going to get everyone else sick.
This is what we're seeing in some of the plants like it at a meat plant. So that you want to do is you want to make sure that people have incentive to stay home if they are sick? If you don't do all of these things, right if you're not a responsible employer you're shutting down. You're shutting down because once one person has it, a couple hundred have it.
LEMON: Thank you both a fascinating conversation.
KAYYEM: Thank you.
ALLEN: Thanks Don.
LEMON: The President is called this crisis unexpected and says it came out of nowhere. But my next guest went back to the original sources to trace what the President was really doing at the time? How many warnings did President Trump ignore? That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:40:00]
LEMON: So the President says nobody could have seen the Coronavirus crisis coming. But we're learning about warning after warning after warning, all of them missed opportunities to respond to the threat earlier.
Let's discuss now with Garrett Graff who is CNN Contributor and the author of "A wired article" just this week an oral history of the pandemic warnings Trump ignored. Garrett good to see you. Thank you so much. The President said nobody expected a crisis like this. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Its unforeseen problem came out of nowhere. This was unexpected.
I would view it as something that surprised the whole world.
Nobody ever expected a thing like this. Nobody ever heard of anything like this. Not since 1917, more than 100 years ago has anything like this happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: But in your piece, you layout evidence that there were scores of warnings and that Trump's three predecessors spent a lot of time and effort on the pandemic threat. Walk us through that.
GARRETT GRAFF, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, WIRED: I have to say I was sort of surprised by the depth and the precision of these predictions and warnings over the last 25 years going back to President Clinton's first engagement on pandemics. W. Bush spent a lot of time on this. President Obama spent a lot of time on this.
And I would be the first to say and they would be the first to say that things weren't perfect. The U.S. government's pandemic planning was not perfect, but step by step, it was getting better until the Trump Administration came along.
And the Trump Administration did away with many of the plans and protocols that had been in place. And in fact even that was visible early. I found a letter that Senator Warren and other lawmakers sent the Trump Administration just seven weeks into the administration warning that the Trump Administration's actions and in actions were going to compromise our ability to respond to a pandemic.
[21:45:00]
GRAFF: Just seven weeks into the administration.
LEMON: Interesting. I want to talk about the Biden Campaign. Targeting Trump's leadership and an ad focused on the President's response to Coronavirus and failure to get China to be more transparent. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Trump never got a CDC team on the ground in China. The travel ban he brags about, Trump let in 40,000 travelers from China into America after he signed it not exactly airtight. Look around. 22 million Americans are out of work.
And we have more officially reported cases and deaths than any other count country. Donald Trump left this country unprepared and unprotected for the worst public health and economic crisis in our lifetime. And now we're paying the price.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: The Biden Campaign turning the tables on the President there because Trump has been trying to say that Biden is the one who is too cozy with China.
GRAFF: Yes, and it's hard to believe that this administration could get away with saying Joe Biden is soft on China, given the extent to which President Trump is on record praising China over the course of this entire Presidency, let alone just in the last couple months during the pandemic.
LEMON: Garrett Graff, thank you so much for coming on and thank you for your reporting. We appreciate it. Thanks so much. The Coronavirus hot spots are popping up in different pockets of the country.
My next guest has been sounding the alarm a about his town for a month now. We're going to go to Waterloo, Iowa where an outbreak at a Tyson Food's Plant is having a major impact on the community there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:50:00]
LEMON: America's major cities have been hit hardest by the Coronavirus pandemic, but the CDC reports the disease is present in all 50 states. So let's bring in Mayor Quentin Hart of Waterloo, Iowa. He is dealing with a potential outbreak at a local Tyson's Food's Processing Plant.
Mayor, it's so good to have you on. Listen the Governors and the Mayors have really been stepping up, doing a great job. So thank you for joining us, thank you for the work you're doing and let's talk about this now. So tell me what's happening at Waterloo? Tyson Foods Processing Plant, this processing plant, how many workers there have tested positive for COVID-19?
MAYOR QUENTIN HART, WATERLOO, IOWA: So the challenge is the numbers that come down from the state don't necessarily end up at my desk. So right now probably April 10th, we probably had about 21 cases. Today are about at 192 cases.
We've had a couple of deaths also that occurred. But the most interesting part about that, 50 plus percent at least are all cases that have come from the Tyson's Plant.
LEMON: And do you think the numbers aren't accurate? Do you think you have more cases?
HART: Well, I think the numbers are - the numbers have a lag. So you probably have about a day and a half to two days of catching up to do with those numbers. But those numbers, if they were current in all the testing we're in, they would be way over a couple hundred people.
LEMON: Let's talk about the Governor, because Iowa Governor Kim Reynolds said that she would be instituting new screening measures for workers. But you and other local officials say that the plant should be shut down.
HART: So the interesting part, the Governor and I have always had a decent relationship, still do. But right now even with the new testing that she indicated to me directly that they'll be doing, it's probably too late.
This isn't a potential outbreak, this is an all-out outbreak. Tyson's has been an incredible employer in this local community, but right now people are absolutely peed off, this is an incredible mess right now that we're in.
LEMON: So what do you want to see happen?
HART: I need the place like the local officials along with me ask that it be closed down, that everyone is able to be screened. Right now only those that are symptomatic are the ones that are receiving, but what I am told by health officials, the ones that are asymptomatic are the ones that are spreading this the most.
And if you have a plant where and if you have a plant where people are afraid to go to work, where we have repeatedly asked the local officials, myself and others have asked to close this place down and test people, plain and simple.
You know, people that are working at this plant are our neighbors and our sister, and this virus doesn't discriminate. You have people from various countries. Some of our immigrant neighbors, Congolese, Bazmee and Burmese, African-Americans and we know disproportionately the impacts overall to their health are more severe.
LEMON: I'm sure you've seen the statement put out by Tyson. I would want to put up on the screen and if I have time to read all of it, but they say that the safety measures in their plant, they want to follow the protocols that they put in place, including taking temperatures and on and on, restricting visitors' access.
They're doing everything possible to keep team members safe, and in your opinion, that's not enough. Quickly, please I'm about to run out of time. What do you think?
HART: If my mom weren't watching this right now, I'd tell you how I really feel. It's too late. Close the plant down. Get everyone tested.
[21:55:00]
HART: Get them healthy, clean the plant, and then open it back up.
LEMON: Mayor, again, I know you have a tough job on your hands, but, again, the Mayors are doing a great job. Please keep us updated what's happening with the cases in your town and also what's happening with this Tyson plant? Mayor Quentin Hart of Waterloo Iowa.
HART: Thank you.
LEMON: Thank you very much. And thank you for watching everyone. Be safe. Our coverage continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
