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Don Lemon Tonight

More Than 1,150,000 U.S. Coronavirus Cases, More Than 67,000 Deaths; More States Loosen Restrictions As Death Toll Rises; Birx: Michigan Protests Were 'Devastatingly Worrisome'; Trump Claims Intel Didn't Warn Him About Virus Until Late Jan; CNN: Trump Claims Intel Didn't Warn Him About Virus Until Late Jan; Kudlow Tries To Defend February Comments That Coronavirus Was Under Control. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired May 03, 2020 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[20:00:00]

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon. Here's our breaking news. There are now more than 1,150,000 cases of coronavirus in this country. More than 67,000 Americans have died.

And if you are having trouble wrapping your head around that number, well, I want you to think of this. More than 13,000 people died in just the past week. Just since last Sunday. So don't let anyone tell you that this is over, because it is not.

The coronavirus is still killing thousands of Americans every single week. We still don't have the testing we need, and that is a disgrace, quite - quite frankly, nearly two months after the President promised anybody who needs a test gets a test.

And we're still a long way away from a vaccine. But governors across the country are under pressure to open up, and get their states back in business. More than 30 states have started reopening businesses and easing stay-at-home orders. More to come this week.

But as more and more reopen without even having met the President's vague guidelines, I want you to listen to what the President said moments ago about the projected death toll.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean, I hear 80 to 90.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I used to say 65,000. And now I'm saying 80 or 90. And it goes up, and it goes up rapidly. But it's still going to be, no matter how you look at it, at the very lower end of the plane, if we did the shutdown.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: But that is after Dr. Birx -- Dr. Deborah Birx - claimed today that the White House had always projected 240,000 deaths from the coronavirus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DR. DEBORAH BIRX, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS TASK FORCE COORDINATOR: Our projections have always been between 100 and 240,000 American lives lost. And that's with full mitigation, and us learning from each other of how to social distance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So that's what you call a contradiction. But this isn't the first time the President contradicted his own experts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: It's looking like it's heading to 50,000 or more deaths. Deaths, not cases. 50,000 deaths. So we're talking about maybe 60,000 or so. That's a lot of people. But that's - 100,000 was the minimum we thought that we could get to. And we -- we will be lower that than number.

We would have had millions of deaths instead of -- it looks like we'll be at about a 60,000 mark, which is 40,000 less than the lowest number thought of. Now with all of the death that we've seen, and 50 or 60,000 people heading toward - right now it's at 40 -- but 50 or 60,000 people, probably over 50, for want to see(ph).

Yes. We've lost a lot of people. But if you look at what original projections were, 2.2 million, we're probably heading to 60,000, 70,000.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. And let's not forget this stunning statement from the President's own son-in-law and his senior advisor, Jared Kushner, calling the administration's coronavirus response "a great success story."

(START VIDEO CLIP)

JARED KUSHNER, SENIOR ADVISOR TO THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're on the other side of the medical aspect of this. And I think we have achieved all the different milestones that are needed. So the government - federal government - rose to the challenge, and this is a great success story.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: This is no success story. Not while deaths are still climbing. But the President tonight is trying to pivot to reopening the economy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I think we're going to have an incredible following year. We're going to go into a transition in the third quarter, and we're going to see things happening that look good. I really believe that. I have a - a good feel for this stuff. I have done it for a long time.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: So I've said it before. Everybody wants the economy to - to come back. Come on. People are hurting. Millions of jobs lost. Millions of people not sure where to get the money to pay the rent and put food on the table.

But the President wants to be able to showcase an economic recovery. It's his ace in the hole with election day just six months away. And he just can't seem to muster the kind of compassion that we need from our President, with more and more Americans getting sick, and more and more Americans dying.

He is longing to get back to crowded campaign rallies, all right? See where he says, "Hopefully our Country will soon mend. We are all missing our wonderful rallies, and many other things." No, we're not. He's bragging about his golf courses.

And then there's this. One of the most transparent and ludicrous attempts at distraction that we have seen from a President who has got a - a million of them. Retweeting an utterly absurd claim by a conspiracy theorist that the former President, Barack Obama, was behind what he calls "the Russia hoax".

This one is really a new low from a President who goes low all the time. It is obviously completely untrue. It's a disturbed fantasy. And just as obviously, he doesn't really expect you to believe it.

[20:05:00]

He just wants to turn the page. To get you to think about something, anything, other than one of the worst crises in this nation's history. Look in the mirror, Mr. President, it's you. And this is nothing but a shameless attempt to distract from your own administration's mishandling of a crisis that's cost over 67,000 American lives.

And by the way, you were warned a about a pandemic like this by the Obama administration, yet at a time when we need leadership, when we need compassion, this is the crap you're that pedaling. Conspiracy theories? Like I said, it is shameful, but thank goodness there is a president, a real president that is showing compassion for his fellow Americans and it is not President Trump, it is former president George W. Bush with a message full of images of and concern for all Americans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let's remember that the suffering we experience as a nation does not fall evenly. In the days to come, it will be especially important to care in practical ways for the elderly, the ill and the unemployed. Finally, let us remember how small our differences are in the face of this shared threat. In the final analysis, we are not partisan combatants, we are human beings, equally vulnerable and equally wonderful in the sight of god. We rise or fall together. And we are determined to rise.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: And how does President Trump respond? Predictably he makes it all about him, about his wounded pride, his constant airing of grievances, tweeting that former President Bush didn't defend him on impeachment. The president's impeachment trial ended in his acquittal on February 5th.

The next day the first American died of the coronavirus. More than 67,000 Americans have died since then. How about thinking about them for a change instead of nursing your grudges? How about showing some compassion? Former president bush did it. So did former president Barack Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Hi, everybody. Let me start by saying the obvious, these aren't normal times. As we all manage our way through a pandemic unlike anything we have seen in a century, Michelle and I hope you and your families are safe and well. If you have lost somebody to this virus, or if someone in your life is sick, or if you're one of the millions suffering economic hardship, please know that you're in our prayers.

Please know that you're not alone, because now is the time for all of us to help where we can and to be there for each other as neighbors, as co-workers and as fellow citizens. In fact, over the past weeks, we've seen plenty of examples of the kind of courage, kindness and selflessness that we're going to need to get through one of the most difficult times in our history.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Boy, oh, boy, that's leadership. That's compassion. It's too bad that President Trump can't show either. By the way, what is it about President Obama that really gets under your skin? Is it because he's smarter than you? Better educated? Made it on his own, didn't need daddy's help, wife is more accomplished, better looking. I don't know, what is it? What is it about him? That he's a black man that's accomplished, became president. That he punked you on the whole birth certificate thing. What is it about him? Just wondering.

Let's bring in White House correspondent Jeremy Diamond and also Dr. Jonathan Reiner, the co-director of the cardiac catheterization program at George Washington University Hospital. Good evening to both of you. Jeremy, I'm going to start with you. I want to get your reaction to something we heard from the president tonight. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I really believe you can go to parks. You can go to beaches. You keep it -- you know, you keep the spread, you keep -- you stay away a certain amount.

[20:10:00]

And I -- I really think the public has been incredible with what they -- that's one of the reasons we're successful. That's one of the -- if you call losing 80 or 90,000 people successful, but it's one of the reasons that we're not at that high end of the plain as opposed to the low end of the plain

REPORTER: That number has changed, Mr. President.

TRUMP: It's going up. No, it's going up.

REPORTER: You said that 60 -- you said 60, 70, 90 -- or 80 or 90.

TRUMP: I used to say 65,000, and now I'm saying 80 or 90, and it goes up, and it goes up rapidly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, the president has had to acknowledge the reality that the death count keeps going up at the same time he is calling for states to open. So what gives here, Jeremy?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, I think this is just the latest instance of mixed messaging, which, of course, has been the story of the president's response to this coronavirus crisis from the very beginning.

We have seen the president try, on the one hand, to offer hope, sometimes hope that turns out to be false hope, while at the same time also having his government put in place these social distancing guidelines, trying to encourage people to slow the spread of this virus and to flatten that curve.

I presume, Don, that the president will have to unfortunately update his estimates of the death toll once again and that's because we heard Dr. Deborah Birx, the White House's coronavirus coordinator this morning, saying that the White House, as far as the medical experts are concerned, they haven't altered their projection at all from what we originally heard which was a hundred to 240,000 deaths in the United States due to coronavirus by the end of this pandemic.

We have seen the president, though, try and gloss over that, try and suggest that things are better than indeed they are. And again, what the president's advisers and allies will tell me, Don, is that this is the president trying to provide hope, trying to encourage Americans to continue doing what they're doing, to show them that what they're doing is effective.

But at the same time, Don, what we're seeing is that many of the president's supporters are simply listening to his message that, "Look, we're on the other end of this, you know, things are getting better." And they are then coming out and protesting and urging some of these Democratic governors, in particular, to begin reopening their states, even though the medical experts say it's not time yet.

LEMON: Doctor Reiner, I want to bring you in here. I mean, you are the expert here. The president seems to be saying that it's safe to go to the parks and the beaches. Does that argument make any sense to you? DR. JONATHAN REINER, CO-DIRECTOR OF THE CARDIAC CATHETERIZATION

PROGRAM, GEORGE WASHINGTON HOSPITAL: No. And, I think, in some ways it really betrays the -- really, hundreds of thousands of people in the United States who work in hospitals day and night to try and save lives.

I went to the hospital yesterday morning to do an emergency procedure, and all of my teammates are wearing masks, and all the nurses in the ICU and the staff everywhere were wearing masks.

And we're wearing them to protect each other. And when I walked out onto the street, the streets of D.C. were really filled with people yesterday, and I really felt betrayed. I felt that -- and many of these people were not wearing masks.

So, whereas in this building people are really struggling at personal peril to -- you know, to save lives, yet the message that the population, that the public is getting, is much different. It's a mixed -- it's a mixed message.

It's the president saying he wants to see full restaurants and sporting arenas filled with people and people on beaches and parks, and I'm telling you that that's contributing to the loosening of social distancing and it's going to cost lives.

There are still over 2,000 deaths per day in the United States. Two thousand deaths per day. We're going to blow past the IHME latest estimate of 72,000 deaths by August 1st, we're going to blow by that on Tuesday. So, this is coming from the top and it's incredibly destructive. Everyone in medicine knows this.

LEMON: Yes. I've noticed that being out and about today as I was coming into work, many people not wearing masks.

REINER: Yes.

LEMON: There were more people out in New York City today. I saw people on the street, many of them not wearing masks, and I said, "What was this all about if people are going to be out and about, and then the possibility that they're going to continue to spread, or to spread this once again.

Can we talk about the president continuing to cheerlead, doctor, this hydroxychloroquine, despite the FDA putting out a warning about it. Listen, there's more to be tested about this hydroxychloroquine. Who knows what's going to happen when there are randomized tests. But he says he keeps getting calls from people who credit it with saving their lives, but what does the evidence show about this treatment so far?

REINER: Well, we have no evidence that it really makes any positive impact in a COVID-19 patient. To the contrary, we have evidence that in some circumstances, it can create dangerous heart rhythm abnormalities. So, there really is no data to support it.

The one drug that now does have some efficacy data is remdesivir. But these anecdotes that the president keeps touting are just that: anecdotes. And the plural of "anecdote" is not "data," it's just anecdotes. They're really meaningless, they mean nothing --

[20:15:00]

LEMON: You've heard nothing from doctors and hospitals who are saying that they're using this with great result?

REINER: No.

LEMON: No. OK. Jeremy -- and tonight the president continues to try to deflect and distract from the coronavirus story, and pointing fingers at others?

DIAMOND: He certainly is, Don.

And this is something that we have seen, of course, the president do repeatedly. He has refused to accept any responsibility for any of the number of failings of the administration's response to the coronavirus crisis from January and into February, particularly that month of February, where we saw very little action from this administration.

Instead, what we have seen from the president are repeated attempts to try and deflect blame onto others. Sometimes, there's some merit to what the president is talking about, particularly when you look at China, for example. There are certainly certain things that China did not do, certain things that China did not disclose to the United States and to other countries that they should have.

But, again, you have to look at it in totality, in terms of what the president is trying to accomplish here. And it's not just China, of course, because the president also pointing the finger at the World Health Organization, and even some of those governors.

We heard the president tonight during that town hall on another network criticizing Governor Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan, criticizing Governor Jay Inslee of Washington, because -- why, Don? Because they are asking for more things from the federal government, because they are asking for more supplies, for example.

So this is part and parcel of the president's strategy here, and, again, to this notion of, you know, the mixed messaging that he offers, the president is not focusing on telling Americans, you know, what they need to be aware of, what they need to do in order to slow the spread.

He prefers, instead, to deflect blame onto others, and to really be the person championing his own success and own self-congratulations, because he feels like he's the only one who can get the message out of what he views as his own success.

LEMON: And even at times blaming his own intelligence community -- the intelligence community, as well.

Thank you very much for that, Jeremy. Thank you, Dr Reiner, as well. Appreciate both of you. A brand new projection for coronavirus deaths in this country, and

this number is disturbingly higher than the model the White House has been using. We're going to talk to the scientists behind this new model. That's next.

[20:17:25]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: A model highlighted by the CDC predicting that coronavirus deaths in the U.S. could surpass 160,000 by August. That's significantly higher than many other models, including one frequently cited by the White House.

Joining me now is ,the creator of the model at covid19projections.com. Covid19projections.com. I appreciate you joining us. Thank you so much, sir.

YOUYANG GU, DATA SCIENTIST, COVID19PROJECTIONS.COM: Yes.

LEMON: So, listen. Your -- yes. Your model shows deaths per day staying near 1,000 all the way through July. You're projecting more than 163,000 deaths by August 4th. But the I -- IHME model often cited by the White House only projects 72,000 deaths by that point. Why is there such a big difference?

GU: Yes. First of all, thank you for having me on the show, Don. It's -- it's an honor. And I - I think -- you know, I - for our projections, we think the U.S. will reach 70,000 deaths on Tuesday, I think as someone mentioned earlier. 80,000 by around this time next week. And 100,000 deaths most likely by the end of May.

And we currently estimate about a 50/50 chance of the U.S. surpassing 150,000 deaths by August, with a range of anywhere between 100 to 300,000. Now I want to stress the importance of using a range or probability rather than an exact number, because there are a lot of uncertainties that can affect the course of the epidemic between now and August.

LEMON: OK. So I got you. So, Youyang, if - if your -- if your model accounts for states reopening, and we're seeing more and more states starting to do that, does that suggest that states reopening now will have a devastating effect on - on the death rate?

GU: I think it's right now a little early to tell. I think we'll definitely have more clarity as more data comes in in the next coming weeks. And for now, we are - to the best of my knowledge, we're the only model that accounts for state by state reopenings.

So if you visit our website, you can see when each state plans on reopening, and how that will affect infections and deaths in the days and weeks following that. And we think that, for many states that are reopening, that there will be potentially an increase in the number of infections as a result of this reopening.

LEMON: OK. So you take that into account, states reopening. You predict that U.S. deaths will likely surpass 100,000 by May 27th. That's -- that's just over three weeks away. Is there time left to avoid that kind of number?

GU: That is hard for us to know right now. I think it's important that states continue to - to impose guidelines in place to limit the number of social interactions. So continuing social distancing guidelines, that will help us keep that number low.

And I think, end of May, right as of now, is our best estimate for when the U.S. will surpass 100,000 deaths.

[20:25:00]

But again, a lot of things can happen over the next few weeks and the next few months. That can change our projections, and so we try to make new projections daily to account for new data that are coming in.

LEMON: OK. You're a data-driven person, but have you -- have you been watching the news at all and seeing the pictures coming in from across the country?

GU: Yes, I try to follow the news that is important with you guys.

LEMON: OK. So if you're -- if you're seeing all the people who out on the beaches and the people who out in Central Park and the people who out on sidewalks and you heard the doctor before you on saying, I saw -- I went out today and walked -- I was in Georgetown and I saw all people walking without masks. I saw a lot of people in New York city without masks. I saw a lot of people on Long Island without masks.

When you hear all those things, well, can that potentially change your model even I know you're looking at just, you know, the data, but if you're looking at these pictures and people's behavior, does that factor into -- can that factor into your projections?

GU: I think it's hard to make any kind of conclusive judgments based on just a few, you know, pictures or videos because those are very specific and they're not necessarily indicative of the entire state or the entire country. I think many people have been following social distancing guidelines and that's the part we don't see so it's hard to say. But often we have to look at what the data that's coming in --

LEMON: Yes.

GU: --and that's what we're using to make our projections.

LEMON: Yes, again I'm not saying don't look at the data, but that shows --

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: -- No, no, I understand what you're saying but that shows --

GU: It's worrisome, yes, no, I agree that's it's worrisome for sure.

LEMON: -- Yes, it shows people's behavior once things start to open up, right, even if you open something up and you say, "I need you to social distance and I still need you to wear masks and then once that you do it, they don't socially distance and they don't wear masks, I'm wondering if that -- if you look at that and that's, as you said, worrisome and that factors into anything that you're doing.

But thank you. I understand what you're saying.

GU: Yes.

LEMON: Thank you very much. I appreciate it, Youyang Gu. I appreciate it, thanks so much.

GU: All right, thank you.

LEMON: Thank you.

GU: Thank you for having me, Don.

LEMON: Absolutely. So as Jeremy Diamond reported earlier, the President's making claims about when he was warned about the coronavirus claims that aren't true. So, Jake Tapper's been investigating what really happened during the country's fight against coronavirus for a special that airs at 10:00 p.m. tonight. And he's going to tell us about that. He's next.

[20:27:40]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:32:00]

LEMON: More than 67,000 Americans have died of the coronavirus, that number going up every day, as the president is trying to deflect and distract, while airing his grievances over not getting credit for what he would like to think is a success story on his coronavirus response.

Joining now is Jake Tapper, CNN's Chief White House Correspondent, and the host of "STATE OF THE UNION." Hello, sir, good to see you.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good to see you, Don.

LEMON: The president is blaming China and everyone else, trying to distract, even launching baseless attacks against the former president, Barack Obama. In a way, this is nothing new, but, I mean, we're in the middle of an absolute crisis. Where is the leadership? Where is "The buck stops here with me, at the top"?

TAPPER: Well, that's one of -- I mean, certainly, you don't ever hear that kind of language of Harry Truman, "The buck stops here," from President Trump.

But that's one of the things that we're trying to get into in the documentary this evening, "The Pandemic and the President," as to what did the president know, when did he know it? What did he do, what should he get credit for? What did he not do? What needs to improve? Because, as you know, Don, you know, this is not the end of the

pandemic. I -- I sometimes -- I turn on other channels, and it's almost as if they are broadcasting from a different planet, where this crisis is over, it's been averted. It is not, sadly. I wish it were. This is going to keep going.

The death toll is almost 70,000, the predictions now are that it will pass 100,000 relatively soon, and we need to figure out what has worked, what has not worked. And one of the things that has not worked is President Trump and other leaders not being straight with the American people about what's exactly going on.

LEMON: I was watching you, Jake, and you had his chief economic adviser, Larry Kudlow, on "STATE OF THE UNION" today, defending his comments back in February, that the coronavirus was under control.

Let's watch a clip, and then we'll talk about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, UNITED STATES NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: My quote was at that time there were very few cases. Then, as the virus spread exponentially, in ways that virtually no one could have predicted, of course we changed our mind.

This sort of ankle biting that's going on in Washington is just incorrect. You have to deal with the information at hand, and when the information changes, you change.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Listen, but Jake, you held him to account on number of things, but health experts predicted that the virus was going to continue to grow exponentially.

TAPPER: Yes, I mean, when he said that it was contained, that was the same day that Dr. Nancy Messonnier said that the American people needed to understand that there was going to be a severe disruption in their lives. I mean, there were people, health experts in the Trump administration, saying this was going to get worse, this was a very serious problem.

[20:35:00]

There were health experts saying that physical and social distancing were steps that needed to take place on a national level as soon as possible. So what he said there was not accurate. There were plenty people in the administration, and plenty of pandemic and epidemiologist experts who had, for years, been warning about this very type of situation, who from January on through were saying this was going to become a crisis.

And or course - look, and Larry Kudlow is an economist. He's there to try to keep the economy open and running. The fault's not necessarily on him for saying something wrong about medicine.

LEMON: Right.

TAPPER: The fault really - the buck does stop with President Trump. I mean, he's the one who should have been listening closer, better, to his health experts. But ultimately in February, and until mid-March, he was listening more to the economists, who had a rosier view of the health, even though that wasn't their area of expertise.

LEMON: Yes. I want to talk to you, Jake, about this new Washington Post piece, where - that - where we learned about a coronavirus model. It was created by Kevin Hassett, one of the President's economic advisors, that predicted far fewer fatalities.

The Post is reporting that - that this model, "It affirmed their own skepticism about the severity of the virus and bolstered their case to shift the focus of the economy, which they firmly believed would determine whether Trump wins a second term."

I mean, the President has certainly been focused on the economy lately. And we haven't really seen him in a briefing. I don't think they've held a briefing in - in a couple of days now.

TAPPER: One of the things that is a real tension, and this would be with any President, is the tug of war between the people who want to keep the economy going, who people - the people who - who want to believe the best in terms of the health scenarios, and those on the health side, who are saying, "No, this is going to get worse. This pandemic is going to spread."

And that's a tug of war that would happen with any President. Now President Trump chose, in all of February and too much of March, to listen to those who said, basically, "Keep things going. It's all going to work itself out."

Ultimately he relented, and listened to his health experts - Dr. Fauci, Dr, Birx, Dr. Redfield, and others. But now I think there's a real concern that, once again, we are going forward, and so many states are reopening without really listening to the health experts again.

And I - I am concerned. I mean, health experts are saying - I'm no epidemiologist, I don't know - but health experts are saying, "Look, we have to keep the - the measures going. We have to do widespread testing. We have to do contact tracing. We have to isolate the virus. We can't just, like, open the doors, and hope everything is going to take care of itself."

But right now, it feels like too much of what's going on is built on impatience and hope. And that's what got us into trouble in February, that kind of attitude. Hoping that this thing would just go away.

LEMON: Yes. I agree with that. And by the way, when I said "briefing", I meant - just to be specific - coronavirus briefing, because Kayleigh McEnany did have a briefing on Friday.

TAPPER: Right. LEMON: For the first time in over a year. So, listen. In your news special report tonight - it's at 10:00 p.m., by the way - The Pandemic and the President, you get into how the strategy of down playing the coronavirus also got picked up in the right wing media ecosystem. Let's take a look, and then we'll discuss.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AINSLEY EARHARDT, FOX NEWS HOST: Why is everyone panicking?

TAPPER (voice-over): Then there was the pro Trump media, which turned the pandemic into a conspiracy.

JESSE WATERS, FOX NEWS POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I'm not afraid of the coronavirus.

SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: They are just looking for any way possible to bash President Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're basically accusing the rest of the mainstream media of fear mongering. They're saying that - you know, Democrats and the media are just blowing this up, because they want to create more chaos for the President.

TOMI LAHREN, FOX NEWS POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I am far more concerned with stepping on a used heroin needle than I am getting the coronavirus.

TAPPER (voice-over): This disinformation took such a hold on a segment of the public. New polling data began to worry leaders in the President's party.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What the polling showed was that Republicans were taking this virus far less seriously than Democrats were. And what Newhouse(ph) circulated to Republicans was that the tone and their message had to change on coronavirus, because denial was not going to be a tool for survival.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: So, Jake, listen. I really believe that the President sets the table, right, as to how people feel, because they listen. He's the leader. People listen. So tell us more about, you know, the - the special report, and how the conservative media pushed the President's preferred narratives.

[20:40:00]

TAPPER: Well, one of the things that's important to point out is that it wasn't just conservative media in January and early February that were talking about -- that maybe the coronavirus was something that we didn't have to worry about, that we didn't have to panic about.

There were a lot of people saying that: left-wing media, right-wing media, down the middle-media, people on CNN were saying it does -- it does look -- this is as of January or early February that the regular flu, the seasonal flu, might be more of a concern.

Now, that changed, the facts changed, and those clips that I just aired from the special, those are all from March. And what happened was, at a time when the media, the mainstream media and health experts, and politicians -- not just Democratic politicians, but politicians in general -- were saying to President Trump, "You need to take this more seriously, we really need to have a national approach to this."

That's when President Trump, and the people who are supportive of him, at "Fox" and other places were saying, "This is all just another effort to take him down." And that wasn't true, obviously. The people were legitimately concerned that not enough was being done and that President Trump was downplaying this.

And you heard in that clip there became a partisan split in how seriously people were taking the threat of the pandemic, with Republicans not taking it seriously. And that's when Republicans stepped in, other Republicans stepped in, and said, "Look, we really need to do something about this because Republican voters are not going to take this seriously.

And as with President Trump, with all things President Trump and "Fox", it's hard to tell. It's a Mobius strip, you have no idea where one starts and the other begins. But at the end of the day, it was all feeding on itself, the idea that people who were severe -- seriously concerned about the severe health crisis were doing so to score cheap political points and not because there was an actual pandemic that was killing thousands of people in China and then in Europe.

LEMON: Yes. Jake Tapper, I look forward to seeing you tonight. Thank you, sir, for joining us, we appreciate it. Good to see you.

TAPPER: Thanks Don, good to see you, sir.

LEMON: Thank you. Thank you, and you be safe.

Make sure you stay with CNN tonight, CNN's special report, "THE PANDEMIC AND THE PRESIDENT" it airs tonight at 10:00 p.m. Jake Tapper, the anchor of "THE LEAD" and "STATE OF THE UNION", and our chief Washington correspondent. Thank you so much and we will be tuning in.

Up next, workers at meatpacking plants hit with coronavirus outbreaks speaking to CNN, what they're saying about the conditions in these plants and whether they'll -- they feel safe or not.

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LEMON: The coronavirus pandemic having a major impact, not only on the meat processing industry in the U.S., but on cattle farmers, as well.

CNN's Omar Jimenez has that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's a farm in its fifth generation, but one that's never operated in an environment like this.

TERRY QUAM, MARDA ANGUS FARMS: We'll make the changes we need to make.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): Terry Quam is an Angus beef cattle farmer in Wisconsin, and represents the first link in a farm-to-table food supply chain with segments on the brink of crisis.

JIMENEZ (on camera): How concerned are you, specifically?

TERRY QUAM: There's no handbook for this. There's no answer of when things are going to come around and be normal. When will people get to back to the restaurants, and eat the healthy beef that we produce at the restaurants?

JIMENEZ (voice-over): Quam has mostly been affected by the stay-at- home orders, but he also markets to meat packers, the same types of facilities that are now seeing coronavirus outbreaks across the country, including in Brown County, which includes Green Bay, Wisconsin, where more than half of all confirmed cases in that county stem from meat packing plants.

(SPANISH)

Filiberto Martinez says he was concerned workers like himself weren't being given enough protective equipment, so he said something about it, and now he's unsure if he's been suspended or fired.

FILBERTO REYES MARTINEZ, MEATPACKING PLANT WORKER (through translator): I don't think I did anything wrong. I simply asked for more protection and more safety, so that myself and everyone who works there don't get infected or lose their lives.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): Martinez says he, along with the workers' rights group Voces de la Frontera, filed a complaint to the occupational safety and health administration, claiming they were having to work at a faster speed due to less workers being present, and that their PPE was getting so wet with sweat some was dripping onto the raw meat.

MARTINEZ (through translator): One of our co-workers next to us, we saw him sick. "You know what? If you're feeling bad, why don't you go home and go get checked?" He said, "No, I don't have anything." But like I said, there's a fear that this person had to lose the benefits of his job."

JIMENEZ (voice-over): It's a balance workers across the country are trying to find.

ERNEST LATIKER, EMPLOYEE, TYSON FOODS: They told me I have a better chance of catching the coronavirus going out to Walmart than at Tyson. "Come to work, you're safe."

JIMENEZ (voice-over): Tyson told CNN they couldn't address the specific situation as described, but that particular Tyson plant in Iowa closed with over 150 confirmed cases tied to the facility. This, as thousands of other workers in the U.S. have either shown symptoms or been hospitalized.

And with President Trump's executive order compelling these locations to reopen or stay open, workers are caught in the middle.

MARTINEZ (through translator): Who wants to die? I think no one. And so it's not the same thing to be in the danger versus when you're when you're looking at the danger."

JIMENEZ (voice-over): The effects have been noticed at grocery stores, too. Kroger, for example, putting limits on some meat purchases, tied to shopper demand.

Back on the farm, the worries are less about what people are eating and more about finding places to sell.

QUAM: When mother nature throws us a curveball, you've got to figure out a way to get around it, and work with it, and take care of business.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): And the business of keeping America fed is being tested, alongside the health of the many who make it a reality.

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LEMON: That was Omar Jimenez and he's got more, next.

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LEMON: Omar Jimenez joins me now live and, Omar, we just heard your reporting about the about the impact of coronavirus on cattle farmers and the meat processing industry. Man oh man! what a report. What else have you heard from workers in some of these plants?

JIMENEZ: Look, there are a lot of workers we spoke to that we weren't able to put in that story simply because they didn't want to be identified for fear of getting either fired or suspended, like we saw with Filiberto Martinez there.

[20:55:00]

And one of them told me that they are pessimistic about trying to keep some of these places open, even under President Trump's executive order.

One of the workers I spoke to actually contracted coronavirus himself. He's been at home recovering. And he says it's just going to be difficult based on how closely these workers have to work together in some of these places, to give you an idea of some of the position that these workers are now in. They are dealing with the coronavirus pandemic first hand.

Another worker I spoke to - while her - her family member wasn't in a plant herself, a family member died. So a reminder of some of the risks of working in this environment are all around. But at this point, they are walking a very fine line with seemingly no choice in some cases - Don.

LEMON: All right. Omar, stay on top of this story. Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

The coronavirus death toll rising to more than 67,000 people. Yet more than 30 states are easing some social distancing restrictions. Will this cause a new surge in cases? Stay with us for the very latest.

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