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Don Lemon Tonight

President Trump's Quick and Easy Way to End Racism; Rep. Colin Allred (D-TX) Was Interviewed About President Trump's Comments in Dallas About Police and Race Issues; Lindsey Graham Backs Top General's Apology For Appearing With Trump After Force Used On Protesters; Interview With Mayor Kate Gallego (D-PXN) About The City Of Arizona's Health Care System Will Be Overwhelm; Top Generals Says Appearing With Trump After Protesters Were Forcibly Removed Was A Mistake; Arizona Governor Says State Still Has Adequate Hospital Capacity Despite Jump In Coronavirus Cases. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired June 11, 2020 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:00]

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: Cops are more likely to pull black drivers even when you adjust for day time and night time stops that may make it hard to tell who's driving.

People of color are more likely to be searched while stopped even though whites are more likely to actually have drugs on them. Our prisons overcrowded. Filled with a disproportionate number of black faces, harsher sentences, less effective counsel, more police encounters in their communities. That's what you get, more in the prisons.

Blacks are more likely to have the cops called on them. Officers are more likely to use force on them. And while the vast majority of the time those cases don't make the news and don't end with those losing their lives, still happens.

And when someone does die at the hands of a police officer, they are more likely to be black. Two reasons someone like Larry Kudlow would say they don't see systemic racism in this country, one, because in his word, he doesn't see it.

But I believe the real reason is he is following Trump protocol. Lie, deny, and defy. Trump is not the first to play this division in our society as I just argued it. It is built in. The challenge is to change it. And that is going to require something that Kudlow, Trump and Coe don't appear to have, the will to create a more perfect union. I'm late.

Thank you for watching. CNN Tonight with D. Lemon right now.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: More perfect union. I said it to you last night. It's -- I call it white mansplaining. You know how do you mansplaining to women? This is white mansplaining the injustices that people they have no idea about are facing. That's all it is.

The very simple thing is if you really want to understand racism in America, just think about your phone. Right? Or your car or your computer. When you -- the factory reset in America is whiteness. Is, two cars, the American dream, which was built on what, on whiteness?

And so, once you think about it like that, if you are any other ethnicity, the factory reset is not you which means the norm is set to your standard. And people who look like you, which means it favors you. The app -- everything favors you. So, it's just that easy. And he doesn't know or they don't know or they don't want to know because they are, what? They are benefiting from systemic racism.

CUOMO: Well, I think that with Kudlow and Trump, I think it's more than just about what they benefit from personally. It's what they don't want to deal with politically. I don't believe that Trump and Kudlow see any upside to taking on this fight.

LEMON: Yes.

CUOMO: They'd rather talk about force, dominate these people, these radical lefties which is what they want them all to be which is why they love Seattle because that thing is like a postcard to the right in terms of making the case against the left. And there's no upside for him because he doesn't believe these people vote for him anyway.

LEMON: I don't think it's about left. I think they're ignorant. I just think they're ignorant. I think they're old and they don't want to change. And they're set in their ways and they are benefitting --

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: Why do you think they're all over Seattle on Fox News?

LEMON: What?

CUOMO: Why do you think Fox News is focusing on Seattle so much and why the president keeps talking about that?

LEMON: I don't really care about Fox News. He and the president what he keeps talking about, I don't really -- it's hard to take him seriously in this moment. Because he is not -- he is not meeting the moment. And I think that he is appealing to a very small section of this country. Most of the people don't want to be stuck where he is and where Larry Kudlow is.

I mean, they are -- they're dinosaurs on so many ways. They are out of touch with the American people. And --

CUOMO: That's the hope. That's the hope.

LEMON: No, they are. They are. Trust me.

CUOMO: That's the hope.

LEMON: They are.

CUOMO: Because the minority cannot solve this problem themselves. LEMON: No. Blacks can't solve this problem. But I want to be

optimistic about this because I obviously, you know, I think blacks can't solve the problem. But I think that we're at a different point now where white people actually are saying I want to change. I want to do better.

They're not denying that there is racism anymore. The only people who are denying it are the relics. Are the people like Trump and Larry Kudlow and I don't really give a damn what Larry Kudlow says about race. He doesn't know much about money, what he does now. So why would I care about what he says about race.

And this president, I don't really care what he says about race because he is the birther in chief. He is the sons of bitches in chief. He is the shithole countries in chief. So, I don't really care what he has to say about race because what he says is irrelevant. It's ignorant anyway.

So, you know, whatever. All I can do is call him out on his ignorance. And that's what I'm going to do right now. Except that I have some breaking news, Chris. OK?

So, everybody, stand by.

This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon.

Here's our breaking news. Racism is solved. Racism is solved. At least it will be. It's going to go very quickly and very easily. You don't believe me? Just listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[22:05:00]

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have to work together to confront bigotry and prejudice wherever they appear. But we'll make no progress and heal no wounds by falsely labelling tens of millions of decent Americans as racist or bigots.

We have to get everybody together. We have to be in the same, same path, I think, pastor. If we don't do, we have -- we have problems. And we'll do that. We'll do it. I think we're going to do it very easily. It will go quickly and it will go -- it will go very easily.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So -- this is why I said -- the president actually says that we're going to fight racism very easily and very quickly. He's going to do it quickly and easily. Man. Wow. I wish that was true.

Except that it has been 400 years after the first enslaved black people were forcibly brought to this country, centuries of blood and oppression. Decades of black people fighting and dying for our rights. Seventeen days of protests in the streets, very easily and very quickly.

It's almost as if this president doesn't even know what racism is. It's almost as if he doesn't even know what a racist is.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Are you racist?

TRUMP: I'm least racist person that you have ever met. I am the least racist person.

LEMON: Are you are bigoted in any way?

TRUMP: I don't think so. No. I don't think so.

(END VIDEOATEP)

LEMON: I'd like to introduce that man to Donald Trump.

And at a moment when America desperately needs to hear from a leader, a leader who is not afraid to condemn police violence against black Americans, we get this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You always have a bad apple no matter where you go. You have bad apples. And there are not too many of them. And I can tell you there are not too many of them in the police department.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: God. If there is one argument that we need to retire, OK, everyone, please listen. One argument that we need to retire from this entire conversation, please stop it. Is that whole bad apples idea? OK? Let's just stop that.

Listening to him, you might almost think that you're listening to Fox News where America is locked in a battle between good guys in blue and the bad guys looting and burning instead of thousands of our fellow Americans out there protesting for their rights, peacefully now, most of them peacefully the entire time. Right?

We all know that police violence put their lives -- police, excuse me, put their lives, police officers on the line all the time. We've heard from them a lot. On this show and we're going to continue to do so.

Because the work that they do is extremely vital. But we're talking about what those people are protesting about there. They are protesting about the system. Systemic racism that pushes black people to the ground, gasping I can't breathe.

It's what those Americans taking to the streets are fighting against. But to this man, to this president, it's all about him being a tough guy. Dominating the streets.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I made the statement we have to dominate the street. And they said that's such a terrible thing. Well, guess what? You know who dominated the streets? People that you don't want to dominate the streets and look at the damage they did.

So, I'll stick with that. And I think most of the people in this room, maybe every person in this room will stick with that. We're doing it with compassion if you think about it. We're dominating the street with compassion.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. What -- what is dominating the street with compassion? Think about that. We're dominating with compassion.

Let me ask you because I'm not sure. Is that right there -- is it gassing peaceful protesters so you can march across Lafayette Square for a photo-op? Is that dominating with compassion?

And yes, America, think about this. People who are out there exercising their First Amendment right gassed in America, gassed, dominating the streets with compassion. Is it threatening to send the military into states and communities across the country to put down protests? Is that dominating with compassion?

It is spreading false conspiracy theories about a 75-year-old protester pushed to the ground by police, who is hospitalized still with brain damage? That must be dominating -- that's compassionate if you're looking at the pictures. That's what dominating with compassion is?

[22:10:06]

That's why I said it's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. This whole thing honestly is about -- did your mom ever teach you about self- awareness? No self-awareness. And he is being allowed to get away with it from his own party and from supporters, complicit. No compassion. No self-awareness.

It's all about being a tough guy. Not a real tough guy but portraying a tough guy. An image of a tough guy, what he thinks a tough guy is like. This is tough. Hold up my bible, it's tough. That's what he thinks a tough guy is.

We know from our reporting that the president is upset that it got out he had to go to the bunker in the White House. We know it's ironic that the border fence the president promised that he would build now, it surrounds the White House.

He finally got his border fence and it's around his house. Well, it's actually the people's house. It's now the people's fortress. So, you got your border fence or wall, whatever.

But the president calls the crowds in Minneapolis who were gassed and the ones in I should say Washington, right? The ones in Washington, a beautiful scene.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: It was like a knife cutting butter, right through. Boom. I'll never forget. You saw the scene. On that road wherever it may be in the city, Minneapolis, they were lined up. Boom. They just walked straight. And yes, there was some tear gas and probably some other things and the crowd dispersed and they went through. By the end of that evening, and it was a short evening. Everything was fine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Did you hear that? There was some gas. Boom. Right down the middle. Can we please replay that, please? Let me know. I want you to hear that from your president. This is your president talking about protesters in Minneapolis, did the same thing in Washington, gassed them but your president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: It was like a knife cutting butter, right through. Boom. I'll never forget. You saw the scene. On that road wherever it may be, in the city, Minneapolis, they were lined up. Boom. They just walked straight. And, yes, there was some tear gas and probably some other things and the crowd dispersed and they went through. By the end of that evening, and it was a short evening. Everything was fine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Boom. Right down the middle. People gassed. That's dominating with compassion, everyone, all that from an event where the president was supposed to be discussing justice and disparities.

And then there is President Trump's upcoming campaign rally on June 19th which is Juneteenth in case you didn't learn this in junior high school or high school history. Juneteenth is a day that marks the end of slavery in this country.

And he's having it in Tulsa, something else you may not have learned, maybe you did, but most -- a lot of this is not taught. This is in Tulsa where in 1921, hundreds of African-Americans were killed by a white mob in the section of the city known as Black Wall Street.

They called it Black Wall Street because these were black people of means. In 1921, making it -- making their own way. Successful black people and the white mob couldn't take it. So, they started killing people and burning. They couldn't take it. A self-possessed black person was just too much for them. Not to mention an entire community.

But Kayleigh McEnany says Juneteenth is a meaningful day for the birther in chief.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: It's a meaningful day to him. And it's a day where he wants to share some of the progress that's been made as we look forward and more that needs to be done, especially as we're looking at this police reform.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I got to hand it to her for that. That was a good spin, Kayleigh. It's also magical thinking, the kind of magical thinking fantasy land where President Trump will solve racism quickly and easily.

So here we are. This is where we are now, thousands and thousands of Americans crying out for justice, crying out black lives matter, and a president who refuses to hear it.

[22:15:06]

A president who, let's not forget, launched his career with that racist birther lie that President Obama was not born in this country, who said there were very fine people on both sides in Charlottesville, who called black athletes peacefully protesting by taking a knee, his words, sons of bitches.

Racism is so deeply engrained in everyday life in this country that even more than two weeks of protests haven't really made a dent at this point.

There's Ohio State Senator Stephen Huffman, a practicing physician, no less, who had a hearing on a proposal to declare racism a public health crisis in his state. Well, he said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE HUFFMAN, OHIO STATE SENATOR: Could it just be that African- Americans, or the colored population, do not wash their hands as as other groups? Or wear mask? Or do not socially distance themselves? Could that just be the explanation of why there's a higher incidence?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK, look. I don't like to beat people up for words. But come on, man, the colored population. What is this, 1950?

He did apologize for his comments in an e-mail to CNN. But, sir, you are a doctor and a lawmaker. Be best. And really, we -- we don't wear masks. I'll tell you who doesn't wear masks, that is the President of the United States.

The president was supposed to be talking about justice disparities today in Dallas, instead he was shrugging off bad apples in police departments vowing to dominate the streets with compassion.

I'm going to ask Texas Congressman Colin Allred what he thinks about all this. That's next.

[22:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: President Trump praising THE police response to the protest over George Floyd's killing at an event billed as a discussion about injustices and American communities.

Joining me now is CNN's White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins. KAITLAN, Good evening to you. This roundtable is supposed to be about justice disparities. But the president made it clear he is more about his -- it's more about his law and order stance and about addressing racial injustice or even the existence in this country.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And the question is, you know, what is the president going to do going forward to match the moment that we're seeing happen throughout the rest of the country.

You know, right now, on Capitol Hill you're seeing Republicans and Democrats try to hammer out some kind of answer for the demands for police reform. But what the president hasn't done is really offer what he would back. And that, of course, is critical to what Republicans are going to support.

And so today the president was more specific, Don, about what he wouldn't support than what he would. He did confirm what we have reported that there is an executive order in the works at the White House. Though he only talked about really it being about better practices for police officers. He didn't really delve into specifics over to what those better practices will look like beyond a mention about excessive force.

So, there are just still so many questions about what it is that president is going to support. And when it comes to legislation which they senators have said they're going to need in addition to whatever executive order they're crafting, the White House has not said which measures it will back yet.

LEMON: All right. Kaitlan Collins at the White House this evening. Kaitlan, thank you very much.

I want to discuss a lot of what's going on with Congressman Colin Allred who represents the Texas district that includes northeastern Dallas. Colin, I should say, Representative, thank you so much. I appreciate you joining us. Are you doing OK?

REP. COLIN ALLRED (D-TX): I'm doing OK, Don. Thanks for having me on again. Sorry it's under these circumstances.

LEMON: Yes, of course. And I agree with that. So, the president is showing more compassion for police than protesters and black Americans, what do you make of his comments in Dallas today?

ALLRED: You know, Dallas is I city that's hurting. We're now a top five hot spot in the country for COVID-19, new cases. And those cases and COVID-19 in general have hit the African-American community hardest and, of course, we're still grieving what happened, the murder of George Floyd.

And we are a city that needed to have a president if you're going to come to town, come in town and try to heal some of our divisions, bring us back together. That's not what we saw today. LEMON: Yes. So interesting to me though, is that you were not invited

to the roundtable. And the president is in your district. Three top law enforcement officials from the Dallas area also were not invited. All of them black. How serious can the president be about police reform even if he didn't invite you if he didn't even care about your input?

ALLRED: Well, obviously, I didn't hear from leaders in Dallas who are trying to solve some of these crises and bring our community together. And I think that's a shame. Because he would have heard some of the things that are working and some of the things that we need help getting done.

And you know, I can't speak for what the president is think. But I know that we have a lot of work to do not only in Dallas but across this country. And to do that, we are going to have some uncomfortable conversations. And that includes the President of the United States.

LEMON: Yes. So to that effect, when you see President Trump ignoring calls to change systemic racism, some of his own advisers denying that it even exists. Do they even understand what is going on right now in this moment?

[22:24:55]

ALLRED: Well, clearly, they don't. I take no joy in saying that, Don. This is not something that I want to have in the leader of our country in this difficult time. I'd like us to have someone in place who recognizes the challenges we face but also recognizes the inherent strengths that we have as a people and that we can draw on those to maybe move forward.

But this president is not living in reality right now. And he's not facing what's happening in this country. In fact, he's going around throwing gas on the flame. And, you know, that's not what we need from a president. That's not what we need from leaders right now, especially when there is so much hurt and there is so much pain with COVID-19. And now this murder just holding up a mirror to our society and showing us the things we have to work on.

LEMON: He's actually at this point, he is the hindrance. He is the one that is blocking progress. He thinks that is helpful. I actually think if he were to embrace the moment and admit that he's made -- he's had some issues of missteps with racism, I'll just -- we'll just say missteps, I think it could help him. But he can't. He doesn't see that in this moment because he's trying to appease a very small group of his supporters.

You're a former NFL player. So, I have to ask you about what you're seeing in sports. The NFL admitting that it was wrong about the player protest. You have NASCAR banning the confederate flag. Should this have come a long time ago?

ALLRED: It should have. It should have. You know, when all of this was happening, you know, I played with and against some of the guys that this president attacked, I played against Colin Kaepernick who lost his ability to earn a living because of what is happening.

And when all this was going down, you know, I said, well, you can disagree with what these players are trying to say. But we shouldn't as Americans disagree about their right to say it. And that was the real failure.

I think on the NFL's part, on any other sports league's part. It wasn't that they had to agree with what the players were saying. It's that they didn't give them the ability to express and that they even clamp down on them even in Colin Kaepernick's case, removed his ability to play the sport that he trained all his life to play.

That was unacceptable. I think more than an apology is needed. And you know, I can't tell you how frustrating it is to now see some of these folks coming forward. But at the same time, you know, we'll take it.

LEMON: Congressman Allred, thank you for your time. Be well. Stay safe.

ALLRED: You too, Don.

LEMON: Some Republicans distancing themselves from the president over one of his key issues. How some are pushing to remove confederate names from the military bases even as the president refuses. That's next.

[22:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: An increasing number of top Republicans distancing themselves from President Trump over his protest response. Staunch Trump defender, Senator Lindsey Graham saying, he backs the joint chiefs chairman, after General Milley apologized for appearing with the president after peaceful protesters were gassed near the White House. I can't believe I'm saying that peaceful protests were gassed in America. It doesn't sound very American.

Here's what he said, he said I have nothing but deep admiration for the total confidence of General Milley as chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. I support his statement in both substance and spirit regarding the recent presidential visits to -- visit to St. John's.

So, let's discuss now. Former Congressman Charlie Dent here and former New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu. Gentlemen, thank you so much, I appreciate it. Charlie, I've got to start with you, because I'm wondering if top GOP lawmakers and staunch allies like Graham breaking with the president, top military brass doing the same thing even within the administration, are they recognizing that something that this president is not seeing about where we are right now?

FMR. REP. CHARLIE DENT (R-PA), CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Of course. Certainly Secretary Esper and secretary of the army as well, they both said they were open to renaming -- renaming some of these military bases. Certainly General Milley, a former Secretary Mattis and again Esper, they all were, I think, you know, deeply troubled by what happened with that stunt, that photo-op that was shameful and awkward at the same time.

And really put the Department of Defense and uniform military in a terrible predicament. And I think, you know, my hats off to General Milley for saying what he said. And Esper put distance between himself and the president as well. And I suspect their jobs are now at risk. But they are certainly feeling something and seeing something that the president is not.

LEMON: So, this is what -- Mr. Landrieu, this is what Charlie was just talking about. Republicans signaling that they're reopen to renaming military bases named after confederate leaders. Let's listen and I'll get your response.

FMR. MAYOR MITCH LANDRIEU (D-NOLA), CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Sure.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think this is a step in the right direction. This is the right time for it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As far as military bases, entirely reasonable to be able to study it and make an evaluation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not opposed to it though.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: You know as well as anyone that this is a hot button issue. And it's been so in the south for quite a long time. So why now? What's happening?

LANDRIEU: Well, it is quite extraordinary to hear those individuals say that and I think it is maybe in response to the president abusing the power of his office and getting the military to do something that should not done -- should not have done by declaring the streets of America a battleground and American citizens enemy combatants.

I was very thankful that General Milley, you know, backtracked and apologized, he did what he did. But now that we're talking about the confederate monuments and systemic racism. And the almost indefensible situation where we have military bases named after generals that fought across -- against our country. I think it is refreshing to finally have Republican leaders standing up and saying, you know what? There is a way forward and we want to be part of it. Because we want to be on the right side of history.

LEMON: Yes, listen. You've always been very up front about this and you spoke to me about it. You actually write about it how much flack you got for early on being on the right side of this issue when it comes to monuments and flags and so on and so forth. So I would imagine seeing these Republicans staunch Republicans and Trump supporters usually say this, it must be kind of an out-of-body experience for you.

[22:35:17] LANDRIEU: Well, you know, as I said from the beginning this is really

not a partisan issue. This is about are you for America or are you against America? It was curious to me that people try to make it a partisan issue back then. But of course the issue is really about race. Those monuments are up. Those names are there for a particular purpose. And that's to send a message to African-Americans in the south. That notwithstanding the fact the confederacy lost the war that some people were still in control. That was wrong then. It's wrong now.

And the case is actually the easiest to be made about the names for the military bases. We have had massive numbers of military heroes that fought in battles on behalf of the United States of America. And to ask the young person, who is going to be a service man or woman, especially an African-American to walk through the gates of a military base that is named after a confederate general.

Whose mission it was to destroy the United States of America over the cause of preserving slavery is just seems inconceivable to me. So, I'm very thankful that everybody is coming along. And it's not a partisan issue, it's about what about America is all about and I would just say it's about time and a little bit late.

LEMON: Charlie, I'm wondering, because the president is warning GOP senators about moving ahead with a plan to remove the confederate names. Is that going to work this time you think? Or is it this different?

FMR. REP. CHARLIE DENT (R-PA), CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think this is different. Mainly because you have the leaders of the Defense Department saying this should happen. They want to engage the conversation and that is very helpful, Don. The reason I say that, I met with Secretary of Defense Bob Gates, you know, and conducted a worldwide survey among the troops to discuss the repeal of don't ask don't tell. That really laid a very good foundation for Congress to actually repeal the act.

And we did it without any disruptions from the Arm Forces, you know Readiness Recruitment Detection, none of that was affected. I think the same thing can happen here with these bases, the Defense Department leads the conversation. I think, Congress will have to vote. (Inaudible) recommend that we rename this bases for more appropriate soldiers. They're playing that we can name it, to name a base after Braxton Brag and (Inaudible) Benning and some of this are just outright racist.

And I think today's -- and today, this shouldn't happen. And so I think everybody can come to an agreement here. So the Defense Department is key. That they want to lead on this. They open the conversation. Congress passed the following. I think it will happen with a big vote.

LEMON: Thank you, Charlie. Thank you, Mayor. I appreciate it. See you guys soon.

LANDRIEU: Thanks for having me. Sure. DENT: Thank you.

LEMON: The country's top general apologizing for appearing with the president after peaceful protesters were cleared out with tear gas. The general's words next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:40:00]

LEMON: America's top general apologizing today for appearing with President Trump after peaceful protesters were forcefully cleared from outside the White House. The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff General Mark Milley now says it was a mistake.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENERAL MARK MILLEY, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF CHAIRMAN: I should not have been there. My presence in that moment and in that environment created a perception of the military involved in domestic politics. As a commissioned uniformed officer, it was a mistake that I learned from. And I sincerely hope we all can learn from it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Joining me now to discuss is retired General Wesley Clark. He is a former NATO supreme ally commander. General, that's big. And good evening, by the way.

RET. GEN. WESLEY CLARK, FORMER NATO SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER: He should have made it. He made a mistake. He owned up to it. He made it in front of a bunch of officers. It got wide distribution I think in the Arm Forces by this point. It was the right thing to do.

LEMON: So, why do you think -- do you think he apologized because the right thing to do or was there any kind of pressure on him to, you know, that he would do this? And why do you think he did it in the first place and was there pressure to apologize do you think?

CLARK: Well, I haven't talked to him. But I have, you know, followed this extremely closely. I've seen people in this positions before. My guess is he was a little uneasy. But he followed the crowd across the street. That was his boss. The Secretary of Defense was going over there. Milley followed him across. He may not have understood what was going to happen with the photo-op. He may not have understood everything that was going on around him at the time. But he did want to see the soldiers that were out there. That's what he says. It's a reasonable -- that's reasonably correct.

I think he got a lot of pressure afterwards from retirees, from his own staff saying, boss, you made a big mistake. And this really looks bad. And I think he realized that too. I think he really sweated it out. And he and the Secretary of Defense both tried to distance themselves from the White House.

Now I think there's been a lot of pushing and shoving behind the scenes back and forth with the White House about how much distance they have. So, I don't think the White House was particularly happy about his apology.

LEMON: Of course not.

CLARK: I think he could have gone to the Congress. He could have said it in the Congress. It would have been more powerful. But they didn't go to the Congress this week. Which was requested. And so, he got it out. And I think it was really important.

LEMON: Let me ask you, listen, I'm all for, listen, nobody is perfect. I'm certainly not perfect, right. I make many mistakes every single day of my life. And I think that people should be granted second, third, fourth chances. But do you believe either General Milley or Secretary Esper should have resigned after that stunt outside the White House?

[22:45:06]

CLARK: You know, that's a tough call, Don. Usually military guys don't resign. And if you look at other generals who made other mistakes, they tend not to resign. They tend to believe that they learned from the mistakes. They'll be better and do a better job staying with it. I think in Milley's case this has been a shearing personal experience. And he won't forget it.

If he does stay in that position, if he's re-nominated for another two years, if he's passed on by the Congress, he's going to be a man who is much more prepared to stand up to the president than he was previously. Because he felt the grief and the pain when he got sucked into the politics of the moment. I don't think he'll make that mistake again. I certainly hope not.

LEMON: Well, listen, you know when someone is being sincere, right? And he looked extremely sincere in his apology. And as if he had learned his lesson. You know, you get a sense of that. I'm so glad that you're here to help guide us through this. Thank you very much. We appreciate your time and your expertise and your service for the country. Thank you.

CLARK: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Thank you. At least 12 states are seeing rising rates of coronavirus hospitalizations. At least 12 states, including Arizona. The mayor of Phoenix says that they opened up too soon and she's worried. And she joins me live. She's next.

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[22:50:00]

LEMON: OK. I need everyone to pay attention to this because this is still happening. There are new cases of coronavirus on the rise in 20 different states. One of those states is Arizona. Announcing 1,400 new cases today. But despite the alarming rise, the Arizona Governor, Doug Ducey, saying tonight his state still has enough hospital capacity. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. DOUG DUCEY (R-AZ): We'd like to assure the public that we have the available bed capacity and surge plans are in place to continue to serve the people of Arizona. We are well prepared to manage an increase in patient volume.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So let's discuss now. There you see her, the mayor of Phoenix, Mayor Kate Gallego who says to please call her Mayor Kate, so I will do that. So, mayor, thank you for joining us. Cases are up. Hospitalizations are also up. The governor is assuring the public that it's under control. But you think this is really going to strain the health care system in Arizona.

MAYOR KATE GALLEGO (D-PXN): I do. When I talk to public health professionals and our doctors and nurses, they tell me they are deeply concerned. They are worried that our public thinks covid-19 is something that we have defeated. While at the same time, 27 percent of all the cases we've had of covid-19 in my county were in the last week.

LEMON: Wow.

GALLEGO: Transmission is up 40 percent. Hospitalizations up 50 percent. We are going in the wrong direction.

LEMON: Well, what's happening? Why do you think that's happening?

GALLEGO: We were one of the last states to go to a stay-at-home order and one of the first to come out. I'm concerned that people are getting mixed messages about how serious this is. We see people who are out in our community grocery shopping, doing essential activities but not in a mask. Really the mixed messages have been difficult.

I think some people thought, oh, flu goes away in the summer, so will the virus. We don't need to worry. We opened up against CDC guidelines with huge amount of services including we went straight to nightclubs being open so people were up close and personal dancing.

LEMON: Wow.

GALLEGO: We have elected officials who are not wearing masks and not modelling good behavior. And I think the mixed messages are confusing our residents.

LEMON: Well, I mean, you were very blunt earlier today and saying what you said now, you said that quite simply that the state opened much too early and that they're seeing the consequences of that. There's the video of what you're talking about. The restaurants. We don't have the dance clubs were people are dancing around. But there you have it. You know, with parts of the economy already re-opening, if the number of cases, if that number continues to climb, is it too late to walk that back, shut these things down again? GALLEGO: For our economy, to really recover, people both have to feel

safe and be safe. I talked to so many people who aren't sure what to do and they're very cautious. That includes a lot of our older residents and includes people who have considerable spending power but aren't using it. So, to me, safety and economy go hand in hand. The cities and states that take this seriously will have better recoveries.

But these mixed signals, our hospitals saying that they really are worried about life-saving equipment, people aren't sure what to do, companies aren't ready to invest. It's really an uncertain time. And I think my duty as mayor is to speak honestly with the people I represent and tell them what public health professionals are telling me. We are still actively fighting covid. It is increasing in numbers of cases and our percentage of tests that are positive are also increasing.

LEMON: Wow. You know, mayor, we saw large gatherings just two weeks ago for memorial weekend, Memorial Day. We've seen protests across this country every day since then. Do you think other cities and states are going to begin seeing these surges like you are?

[22:55:00]

GALLEGO: I'm concerned that we didn't follow CDC guidelines and we just went to re-opening a huge number of things right of way. So, for example, I spoke about the nightclubs. The Centers for Disease Control said start with restaurants then go to bars, but with some spacing. We went straight to everything. As long as you serve some sort of food including a food truck, you're considered a restaurant and could open.

And I think that sent a signal we're home free, we don't need to worry about social distancing. I understand people are eager to go back to normal, but my message is that we still have to fight this virus. Masks are going to be part of our life for a long time. We need -- we don't have a vaccine yet.

But we do know that these interventions can save lives. When we went to stay-at-home, we slowed the spread. You can see the curve decline and the virus spread more slowly. We contained it and now public health officials are saying we've undone the important work we did in April.

LEMON: Mayor Kate. Thank you for coming on and getting the word out. And fighting for the citizens of your city. We appreciate it. Thank you and be safe. Be safe.

GALLEGO: Good advice.

LEMON: Don't go anywhere, we have lots to talk about and we'll do it right after the break.

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