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Don Lemon Tonight

Coronavirus Cases Are Increasing In 38 States But The President Claims The Crisis Is Being Handled; Dr. Birx Tells People In Florida Who've Spend Time In Crowds In Past Few Weeks To Get Tested For Coronavirus; Coronavirus New Record For Single-Day Cases, 51,504; Texas, Florida Showing Major Surges In Coronavirus Cases. July 4th Amid a Moment of Reckoning for the United States; CNN Investigates the Influence of Police Unions; Protests Over the Killing of George Floyd All Across the Country are Calling attention to Police Misconduct, and Also the Role That Police Unions Play. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired July 02, 2020 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: OK? Surrender the me to the we. Interdependence day, sounds great.

Thank you for watching. CNN Tonight with Laura Coates, the upgrade starts right now. Interdependence day. I didn't think of it, but I love it.

LAURA COATES, CNN HOST: I love it too and I really applaud that. Barista for asking the question. And I love the fact that it was turned on her. She thought that she was going to get an outpouring of support to criticize this young man. Instead people are saying, no, do you have a mask? And applauding came in really, I mean, putting their money where their mouths are about this issue. It seems like a very easy thing to do. I mean, you don't need the macchiato as bad as people need some air in their lungs, right?

CUOMO: Listen. I'm a little bit Starbucks stupid, but I will tell you -- so I don't know all the terms the way I should, but I'll tell you, the time has come for people to stop running from the reality here. Even the president. He's not a leader, he's a follower, but he's talking the talk about masks because it's a big deal. Wash your hands, stay away when you can and when you can't, wear a mask. It's all we have going for us. That and surrendering the me to the we, Counselor Coates.

COATES: I mean, you got to join the bandwagon when you're left in the desk, right. You heard what Harry was talking about with these issues. And in case you need some advice, I get a matcha latte with almond milk from Starbucks, and I don't do the whole venti crime day where I just say medium or large. Thanks.

CUOMO: Of course, you do.

COATES: I do it with a mask on at the drive-thru for the record.

CUOMO: And look. Putting a mask on that face is a crime. So, if you are willing to do that to the rest of us, it must be for the higher cause.

COATES: Let's not argue. Let's not argue. I'll disagree today. Thank you.

CUOMO: Have a good night.

COATES: Thank you, Chris Cuomo. This is CNN Tonight. I'm Laura Coates in for Don Lemon. It's been a week of record-breaking numbers not in a good way. Coronavirus cases soaring in state after state after state. Florida reporting more than 10,000 new coronavirus cases just today. And now you have the governor of Texas ordering 95 percent of all Texans to now where masks in public.

Governor Greg Abbott had previously barred local officials from penalizing people who didn't do that. Now Texas is reporting its highest number of cases in a single day just yesterday. That's not all. Los Angeles reporting more than 2,000 new cases for not even the first, second or third but the fifth straight day in a row.

But in the face of all of that, the president is in denial. And the fact is he's trying to deceive you, ignoring the facts, ignoring the fact that cases are soaring, not just in one place but across the south and the west. Ignoring the fact that more than 128,000 people, human beings, Americans have died. And saying this to you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The crisis is being handled.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Even he had to pause for that. The crisis is being handled? We've seen well over 2.7 million cases of coronavirus in this country. More than 128,000 people have died, and that is -- I don't know what sort of imagination you would need to have to think that's being handled. Dr. Anthony Fauci also contradicting the president today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: I think it's pretty obvious, Howard, that we are not going in the right direction.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Obvious, it is obvious. Dr. Fauci going on to tell the BBC that, frankly, this country reopened too soon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAUCI: In the United States, even in the most strict lockdown, only about 50 percent of the country locked down. That allowed the perpetuation of the outbreak that we never did get under very good control.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: And the fact is at least 38 states, more than 60 percent are seeing increases in the rate of confirmed new cases. That's not going in the right direction, no matter what President Trump says. Even the vice president, who just a few days ago was proclaiming we had flattened the curve is now singing a slightly different tune. And we see why.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will slow the spread, we will flatten the curve.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: We will flatten the curve, he's saying. The reality is we have not flattened the curve yet. More and more Americans are getting sick. More and more Americans are dying. And then there's this stark warning from Dr. Deborah Birx to the people of the state of Florida. If you've spent time in a crowd in the past few weeks, you should get tested right now.

[23:05:09]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DEBORAH BIRX, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS RESPONSE COORDINATOR: If you've participated in a large gathering in the last four weeks, we ask all of you to come forward and be tested because the level of asymptomatic spread.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: And with all of this, the president who should be leading us, who should be really modelling life-saving behavior and calling on every single one of us to wear a mask and practice social distancing, he's putting the health of more than 7,000 people at risk. So he can stage a fireworks show at Mt. Rushmore tomorrow night. I'm talking about thousands of people crowded together to watch. No social distancing, no masks even required. And that's not all.

The president and first lady are hosting a flyover with fireworks displayed at the White House on Saturday. The national mall is going to be open to the public to view it all. The mayor of Washington, D.C. has been begging people not to go, but the White House doesn't care that this event goes against CDC guidelines that tell you very clearly to avoid crowds like this.

Now, I love a good fireworks show, my kids love a good fireworks show, and we all know the Fourth of July is a time to show our patriotism, but isn't true patriotism standing up for our fellow Americans, protecting their life, their liberties and their pursuit of happiest, isn't that what our government is supposed to be all about? I mean, the Fourth of July is more than just about a revolutionary period. Wasn't that little pamphlet that said common sense? Don't even go into it. Just look at the title. Common sense. Can we use it? I mean, it feels like this president cares more about the appearance of patriotism than the real thing.

I want to bring in CNN White House correspondent, John Harwood and CNN medical analyst Dr. Amy Compton-Phillips. Thank you for both of being here. I'm glad to speak to each of you today.

John, you know, the president is claiming that the coronavirus is being handled is the word he's using. I wonder by whom. And I'm wondering what map he's looking at because the map that we are seeing showing, shows the opposite picture. What's happening?

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Laura, he's not looking at the map. He's taken the map, and he has put it on the shelf and he's decided that other people are going to take care of that. He's made the strategic decision that the economy is what his strong suite is and he's going to talk about. He had a news conference today at the White House. You cud call it a news conference, I was there. He came in to tout the strong economic numbers today, the 4.8 million jobs added by the economy during the month of June. That is good news, no questions about it. But he didn't take questions for the reason that he knew he was going to get questions about the surging coronavirus, he was attacking reference to face coverings --

COATES: And actually, John, I'm sorry, John. While I have you, for a second, excuse me, we have breaking news that is just in. Speaking of that surge, a new single-day record of coronavirus cases, we are now are up to 51,504. Speaking of this, 51,504. Can you imagine? And the president seems to still be in denial?

HARWOOD: Well, that's exactly what the situation is. And the president, he said it's being handled, it's being gotten under control. Obviously it is not. But he's decided that's something for other people, not for him. And the price that's being paid is that as Anthony Fauci said today, we've had a scatter shot response to the virus. We haven't had a unified response. The countries that have done better have had a widespread lockdown.

The United States only locked down 50 percent of this spring. And so the president is hindering his ability to respond to the coronavirus and it's self-defeating in the sense that the longer that goes on, the more it's going to erode the economic gains he was trying to celebrate today.

COATES: Well, Dr. Compton-Phillips, I want bring you in here. Because he's right. Dr. Fauci is totally contradicting the president's claims that this is being handled. I mean, he's saying we never really got the virus under control in the first instance and we certainly aren't going in the right direction. I mean, are things going to get a lot worse if the president doesn't listen to the experts like Fauci doesn't try to gain a semblance of control over this?

DR. AMY COMPTON-PHILLIPS, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST, TREATED FIRST U.S. CORONAVIRUS PATIENT: Things are likely to get worse even if the president does listen to Dr. Fauci at this point because there's so much of the virus in circulation. And that is the fundamental problem. So, if this is being handled, it been fumbled. It's not been handled well. You know, my suspicion is our president

probably wishes he had a mulligan at this point. Because wat we needed to do was be able to get the level of virus in circulation significantly down into a lower level, in the same way that they did in other countries like Italy and Spain that had early outbreaks.

[23:10:17]

Right? They had a very intense lockdown, really shut down transmission before they started opening. And we didn't do that. And because we didn't do that, we never dropped down, we got level and now we're spiking again.

And now if we lock down again, we have longer to go to really tamp down what it is, and that's why it's so important for us to actually start seeing some leadership, not just at each individual county and each individual state but across the entire country. We have to do that to get out of this mess.

COATES: You know, I refuse to be a complete pessimist, but I absolutely hear what you're talking about and I certainly hope that if the ship has sailed, this doesn't have to be the titanic, right? There can be incidences, we can actually get something or some way that actually land this plane here. Sort of confuse analogies here, but John, let me ask you, President Trump's moving ahead with his Fourth of July, Mt. Rushmore celebration, and more than 7,000 people, to the doctor's point, there's not going to be social distancing or masks required. And we're talking about leading by example. You know, what she's saying is absolutely true. How is this leadership from this president?

HARWOOD: Well, it's not leadership. And one of the things we've talked about consistently with President Trump is his focus on himself above the interest of others. Now, the president wanted that rally in Tulsa, he wanted to get out of the White House and hear people cheering him, so he went even though it was not particularly safe to do so. Six advanced people, two secret service agents tested positive. A bunch of people went in quarantine, the rally was one third full.

He wants to go to Mt. Rushmore and have an event that looks normal, that doesn't have people with masks strapped on that doesn't have people spread out. He's interested in the cosmetics of the situation. And it is pretty obvious from the spread of the virus that that is a dubious thing to do. We just heard today from the Washington Post this evening that eight secret service agents have tested positive since working on a visit by Vice President Pence to Arizona.

Again, the president says I want my vice president moving around, I'm running for reelection, Arizona is a swing state so he moves him out there and secret service agents are getting sick. That's bad for them but it also sends a message to Americans that it is not safe to congregate. And again, that's where it becomes self-defeating because that's going to erode the economic comeback that the president wants to see. He's just thinking only in the short term, not beyond it.

COATES: It's also bad for the security of obviously the vice president and the president of the United States to have fewer secret service agents able to protect them. God forbid something happens to a leader in this country. Dr. Compton-Phillips, South Dakota's governor, speaking about pessimism and enthusiasm, he's quite enthusiastic about this event. There's not even an extensive hospital system in South Dakota. So, what's going to happen to these people in South Dakota and anyone, by the way, who travel to there or from there and this location?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Well, they put themselves at higher risk. And again, this is all about managing the odds, right. So, outside is better than inside. Going to a rally outside at Mt. Rushmore is going to be a lot better than going to a rally at an arena in Tulsa. So, that's an upside. But the closer you are to other people, even when you're outside, if there's wind blowing. If you're breathing the same air as somebody positive, you're at risk at getting the virus, right?

So, that's why social distancing is important. Further apart is better than closer together. And best of all, wear a mask. It is one of the few things we can do to actually get life started up again while we start going about our daily lives. So, if we had rallies outside that people were far apart and wearing a mask, the risk would be dramatically lower. But you have to actually admit that there's a problem to start applying new solutions.

COATES: John Harwood, Dr. Amy Compton-Phillips, thank you both so much. I was glad to have talks with you both today. I appreciate it.

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Thank you.

COATES: You know, cases are soaring in Florida, 95 percent of Texans now required to wear a mask. I'll talk to the mayors of Austin, Texas and Miami Beach and hear from them next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:15:00]

COATES: Our breaking news, this country seeing its highest single day of new coronavirus cases. There's 51,504 reported tonight. The previous record, if you remember, was set just yesterday. And now more states are dealing with unprecedented surges in coronavirus cases, including the great state of Texas where Governor Greg Abbott is now ordering nearly every resident to wear a mask in public. He's saying the goal behind this mandate is to be able to continue to open up. Joining me now, Austin mayor Steve Adler. Welcome, mayor. I'm glad to talk to you this evening.

MAYOR STEVE ADLER (D-TX), AUSTIN: Laura, it's good to be with you.

COATES: You know, Mayor, Governor Abbott mandating mask after facing a lot of pressure for weeks, but the virus has been surging and you know in Texas you've got nearly 8,000 new cases that were reported just today. Is this too little too late or right on time in your opinion?

ADLER: Well, I tell you we're hoping it's not too late, but we're real concerned about it. On the trajectory that we're on right now in Austin, our experts and scientists tell us that our hospitals could be overwhelmed here in the next two, two and a half weeks. We're hoping that what we're seeing now is going to help stem that tide, but we're concerned.

COATES: Now, is that why you're considering maybe having a 35-day stay-at-home order? And if you are, when will you decide if that's a necessary course of action for Austin to take?

[23:20:08]

ADLER: You know, we're working with, again, the scientists, the modelers, the doctors to try and follow the data. You know, the behavior started changing about a week ago. We're hoping with the governor finally giving us this tool they'll continue to change. Hospitalizations is a lagging indicator so we'll be taking a look at the impact that this has on cases and on other things in the city, but we'll probably have to make a decision next week as we continue to watch those numbers.

COATES: And that's of course coming after a holiday weekend. We know it's almost here, it begins really tomorrow. What's your message to people in your community who want to go out and celebrate right now?

ADLER: We're trying to get as loudly stated all around the community as we can that we cannot do a repeat of what we saw at the Memorial Day weekend. We had a spike after that and this has to be -- this has to be different. And I think our community's in a different place now than we were on Memorial Day. I think people are actually seeing the direct repercussions of the conduct and the action.

So, we're -- we have a community I think that's more engaged. We also now have tools that we didn't have Memorial Day, as allowed by the governor, to be able to shut things down. And we were able to do that here with a couple concerts. They're just springing up, there are still a lot of people confused by the mixed messages coming out of Washington as to just how serious this is.

COATES: Those mixed messages, they have had so many repercussions. Mayor Steve Adler, thank you.

ADLER: Thank you.

COATES: You know, Florida is also shattering a single day record for its new cases reporting more than 10,000 today. And here to discuss is Miami Beach Mayor Dan Gelber. May Gelber, I'm glad to speak with you this evening. You know, Miami Dade County a major hot spot in Florida. There's now a 10 p.m. curfew that's in place across the county, you got masks that are mandatory, liquor stores are closing at 8 p.m., but is there a point where you might have to consider to what I was just talking to the Austin Mayor Adler about that stay-at-home orders need to come back into place?

MAYOR DAN GELBER (D-FL), MIAMI BEACH: Well, certainly if our hospitals are so overwhelmed, by that we cannot give people the care they need, that's not even a choice at that point, you've got to do it. The problem with this virus is because it sort of bakes in two weeks before you actually see it, you've got to try to find these metrics early so you can make your decisions. Because if you wait for it to present itself with all of its sort of flurry of hospitalizations and folks on ventilators, and you end up too late.

The thing has lapped you once or twice and you haven't even really left the starting gate. So, we're moving pretty quickly and we're really thinking about rolling up that carpet with all those new measures you just mentioned. It's very troublesome in South Florida.

COATES: Of course, the thing is unlike what's happening maybe in Texas, you've got of the Florida Governor Ron DeSantis who is still holding out on that statewide mask mandate. But when without that, mayor, I mean, people can bring the virus to Miami Beach, from other parts of the state. We're heading into the holiday weekend. Does the governor need to reverse course and issue that statewide mandate to help?

GELBER: I think we need a statewide mandate, and I'll tell you why. We have actually have a mandate to wear them. And in my city we actually fine you $50. I was in the legislation when we imposed the seat belt mandate. And the moment we did it, people started following that rule without enforcement, because there are plenty of people in the world in our communities who follow rules. So, that message is so important.

Forget about travel from county to county. Just merely consistency in messaging from leaders, not just, by the way, in the state but obviously the mixed messages as Mayor Adler said coming from Washington has been horrible because a lot of people seem to think this is a political statement, which is absurd, but they don't want to wear a mask because somehow it lets you know that you're for one party or the other and that of course is just silliness.

COATES: Well, you should be for the human party at some point in time, right? I mean, today speaking of humanity, you know, my heart breaks because we learned that an 11-year-old child, an 11-year-old in Miami Dade has now died. Florida's now youngest coronavirus victim. Are you worried about what could happen to more young people if this spread is not slowed? For a long time we didn't think it would happen to children in the same way and now an 11-year-old has passed away?

GELBER: More than a thousand people have died in just Miami-Dade County and probably 4,000 have been hospitalized and many of them recently have been young people under the age of 40. And hospitalization is no picnic. Its weeks, it feels horrible from what I've been told.

[23:25:08]

And so I am worried about all of it. There's just too much virus in the community right now. And frankly, I can't -- you know, we had D.J. Caleb today, put out a statement. We are trying to reach people who seem unreachable and I don't get it, because we have a hurricane coming toward us, which is a natural disaster, everybody, you know, salutes and jumps in line because I think all the leaders tell them to do the same thing. But it's just really been difficult without the support up and down the chain of command, so to speak. COATES: Of course, it is. Mayor Dan Gelber, thank you so much. I see a

Dwyane Wade jersey behind you. You're a man of hope still. Maybe he'll come back into the league at some form or fashion.

Back with me Dr. Amy Compton-Phillips. Dr. Compton-Phillips, you know, this chart is showing and you heard from both mayors. This chart is showing just how bad Florida and Texas have gotten compared to say, New York, which was the early epicenter that everyone referred to in the entire country. So now, I mean, Dr. Fauci is saying that this is way beyond the worst spikes that we've seen. So, what's the danger of now having multiple states, multiple epicenters that have these kinds of numbers?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Yes, well, the reason that we do contact tracing is because you want to isolate where the disease is and then sequester those people who actually have the germ, right. And the problem is when we have it so many places and so spread out, we can't control it at a point-by-point basis and that's when those lockdowns come back. And that's what we'd all love to avoid.

Nobody wants to lock down the entire country again. And so, but how do we stop this transmission without resorting to that brute force tool and that's what these mayors are really trying hard to do. So they are using the much more pinpoint, wear a mask, shut down restaurants, minimize the indoor kinds of areas that you can rapidly transmit the virus. And so, by doing those kinds of smaller things, we can hopefully avoid going back to where we were in March and April.

COATES: Dr. Amy Compton Phillips, everyone got to play their part to land this plan, thank you for yours.

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Thank you so much.

COATES: Celebrate the Fourth of July with Don Lemon and Dana Bash. They've got fireworks and an all-star musical lineup including Jewel, Barry Manilow, C.C. (inaudible), Don Mclean and many, many more. Make sure to watch inside CNN's Fourth of July in America live starting at 8:00.

And up next, ahead of the day, celebrating this country's independence, what's the president doing? Stoking racial tensions and showing not all Americans have equal freedoms, even now.

[23:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COATES: July 4th is different this year. I mean, everything is different this year because of the pandemic. Celebrations included. But we're also in the middle of a national reckoning on race in this country. The week of mass protests following the death of George Floyd show, well, July 4th doesn't represent true independence for everyone in the U.S.

Joining me now is Michael Higginbotham. He is a professor of constitutional law at the University of Baltimore and author of "Ghosts of Jim Crow: Ending Racism in Post-Racial America." Also joining us is CNN political commentator Bakari Sellers. He is the author of "My Vanishing Country."

Gentlemen, you both have phenomenal books. I really encourage everyone to read. I will begin with you, Michael, if I can. Professor, I mean, the president is making protecting confederate monuments a top priority. He is calling Black Lives Matter a symbol of hate. What is the motivation here? Why deliberately stoke racial animosity and try to pit people against each other? What playbook is this?

MICHAEL HIGGINBOTHAM, AUTHOR, PROFESSOR OF CONSTITUTIONAL LAW AT UNIVERSITY OF BALTIMORE: This is what the president's playbook has been since 2016 when he came down those escalators and called Mexicans criminals and rapists. The president is about division and distraction, division and distraction.

That's what he's done with immigration, build a wall. That's what he's done with coronavirus, don't wear the mask. That's what he's done with racial equality, protect confederate monuments.

So, what I would suggest the president needs to do is stop worrying so much, stop protecting stone and marble statues and start protecting living Americans.

We're in a pandemic, as has been mentioned all evening. We've got 125,000 deaths, we've got over three million that are subject to the virus, and the president needs to start protecting the living. So, let's get a national policy, Mr. President, on the pandemic, and let's start wearing a mask.

COATES: I mean, Bakari, the irony should not be lost on people that a pandemic that has a disparate impact on black and brown people in this country is now being talked about by a president who is stoking racial tensions. How do we celebrate this country on Independence Day, Bakari, when it's very clear that not everyone is afforded the same freedoms?

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, we've been here for 401 years, so let's be remindful of that. But also let's understand that we are people of perseverance, we are people of hope, we are people of faith.

And so while we have the president of the United States who is here stoking fear, as Michael said, we've had the less dramatics, we've had the Bull Connors, we've had the George Wallaces of the world, and Donald Trump is just another one in the long line of those individuals.

[23:35:10]

SELLERS: But we've always persevered. And so while we are celebrating July 4th, what I really want us to do is celebrate Tulsa, Oklahoma. What I really want to us do is celebrate the Orangeburg massacre, February 8 of 1968. What I really want us to do is understand who Sarah Mae Flemming is, who set down 17 months before Rosa Parks. I want us to understand our true history as we celebrate this July 4th and get out of this messiah complex. There's nobody coming to save us. But we do have the heroes and we can stand up like we're seeing all across the country in every single state right now and create the change we want to see.

COATES: You know, it's a fascinating point, especially the idea that we are all in this together. But someone got to actually try to land the plane. Everyone can't be both passenger and pilot. Someone has to take the lead on these issues.

Bakari, on this notion, you know, a source is telling CNN that the NFL is planning to play the song "Lift Every Voice and Sing," which we know is referred to the Black national anthem before every game and week one of the season. This does speak to some awakening, but superficial or what?

SELLERS: Yeah, yeah. So, please, with our due respect to all the city officials, black, white, and otherwise, Democrats or Republicans, to black folk and white folk alike, do me a favor, please stop writing "Black Lives Matter" on everything, stop singing the negro national anthem, and let's actually start focusing on eradicating systemic injustice and institutionalized racism.

Those are the things we have to focus on. Painting something on the street will not effectuate the change we actually need. And so while it may be good aesthetically, it's not going to make sure that my children will actually have a better future than the one they have today. So, that's my only point. This is all good and dandy, but it doesn't actually effectuate the change we want to see.

COATES: So Michael, I see you nodding. What is your opinion?

HIGGINBOTHAM: Well, this is our racial moment of truth, no question about that. I agree with Bakari. What we need to do is we need to have some substantive changes. We need to pass some laws protecting individuals against discrimination. We need to change some bad policies and practices.

We've got, you know, tremendous disparities not only in the criminal justice system but across the board in education, in economics, in health care, and COVID-19 has highlighted these disparities.

In eight and a half minutes of a police officer, his knee on George Floyd's neck has showed us the consequences of not doing anything about these disparities. So we need to pass some laws quickly to start protecting individuals against race discrimination.

COATES: Michael, Bakari, thank you. I wish we had more time to talk. We'll talk again.

SELLERS: Thank you.

HIGGINBOTHAM: Thank you.

COATES: As the country erupts over police reform, why are so many officers still on the job after all the bad behavior? CNN investigates the influence of police unions. That's coming up, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:40:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COATES: Critics say police unions are often responsible for preventing officers from being disciplined or even fired for misconduct. Are they standing in the way of the real police reform people are asking for? Well, CNN's Drew Griffin has the investigation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): Yeah, this is peaceful (ph) --

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The words coming out of this San Antonio police officer's mouth are awful.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): You know what's (bleep)? The way you were raised.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): A young black man in a San Antonio, Texas mall in 2018 is being arrested for trespassing. When he asks why, the officer says this --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): For being (bleep).

GRIFFIN (voice-over): As shocking as it sounds, the bigger shock is the officer is still on the job.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): You can get out. Let's go run. Do something.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): So is an officer who un-cuffed the man and challenged him to a fist fight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): (INAUDIBLE).

GRIFFIN (voice-over): An officer who tried to give a homeless man a sandwich made of feces had his firing overturned. It took a second poop incident to get rid of him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): You react, I react.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): These officers and many others were fired and all of them got their jobs back. Thanks to a police union contract and state law that leaves final punishment of law officers in the hands of an arbitrator, who is often chosen in a way that favors the police. San Antonio Mayor Ron Nirenberg has had enough.

MAYOR RON NIRENBERG, SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS: These are crimes of moral turpitude and you would expect that in any profession, the bear is to wait (ph) a public accountability that this would be a one-and-done- type offense. Yet the cases in which the chief's discipline has been clear have been overturned in these arbitration hearings, and people are rightly outraged by it.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): Fired San Antonio police officers were able to get their jobs back in 42 percent of the cases that went through arbitration. That includes one cop who was reportedly fired six times.

NIRENBERG: It's egregious.

STEPHEN RUSHIN, PROFESSOR, LOYOLA UNIVERSITY: San Antonio is one of the most deferential to law enforcement interests.

[23:45:00]

GRIFFIN (voice-over): Loyola University Professor Stephen Rushin analyzed more than 650 police union contracts.

RUSHIN: We have across the country in many cities made bad deals with police unions, bad deals that make it difficult for us to investigate police misconduct.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): The bad deals, according to Rushin, include giving the officer 48 hours or longer before being questioned, allowing officers to see all the evidence before being questioned, ignoring an officer's past disciplinary actions, and in some cases, banning any discipline where complaints aren't filed in a timely fashion.

L. SONG RICHARDSON, DEAN AND CHANCELOR'S PROFESSOR OF LAW, UC IRVINE SCHOOL OF LAW: And frankly, police unions have much more protection than other government or other public unions.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): Case in point, Minneapolis. The officer charged with murdering George Floyd had a long history of complaints but was still on the force. A CNN analysis found just 1.5 percent of the thousands of complaints filed against Minneapolis police in recent years resulted in any serious discipline.

RAYMOND THOMAS RYBAK, FORMER MINNEAPOLIS MAYOR: I have seen too much.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): Former Minneapolis Mayor R.T. Rybak fought his city's police union for years.

RYBAK: And so it is time right now for elected officials to stop treating them like a traditional union.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): The unions, of course, tell a different story. Detective Mike Helle is president of San Antonio's Police Officers Association.

MIKE HELLE, PRESIDENT, SAN ANTONIO POLICE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION: Is police reform necessary? Sure it is. Do we need to have transparency? You bet we do. We should always have transparency in our police department. But the only thing that we are and have negotiated for and we continue to hope for is that we just have a fair process, right?

GRIFFIN (voice-over): Helle believes the current contract is fair, the state protections for police are balanced, and told us there is currently not a single bad cop on the San Antonio police force.

HELLE: There's nobody that wants bad cops in our department.

GRIFFIN: Do you believe him, that the union doesn't want these bad cops on the force?

NIRENBERG: I want to believe him, but until these provisions change, then we are left in the situation where it looks like the union politics is against the general public's best interest.

GRIFFIN: Laura, there's already a push to change both state and federal laws involving policing, but changing police union contracts, that's tougher, say most of the experts we've talked to. It involves renegotiating tough contracts in local politics.

And without strong support from the public and from local politicians, it rarely gets done. They are renegotiating in Minneapolis right now. San Antonio's contract begins negotiations next year. Laura?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COATES: Drew Griffin, thank you. Great reporting. Next, Philadelphia's former police commissioner tells us his experience with unions.

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[23:50:00]

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COATES: Protests over the killing of George Floyd all across the country are calling attention to police misconduct, and also the role that police unions play.

Let's discuss now with CNN law enforcement analyst Charles Ramsey, who is also the former Philadelphia police commissioner. It is nice to see you, commissioner. How are you?

CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I'm doing well. Thank you.

COATES: You know, we talked about this very issue. And as our Drew Griffin just laid out for us, there are countless incidents where police unions, they step in, they prevent cops from facing discipline from misconduct. I mean is that the way that it's supposed to work?

RAMSEY: Well, I mean, you would hope that it wouldn't work that way. First of all, I'm very glad you showed that piece because a lot of people just don't realize how strong these unions have become over the years.

And it makes it very difficult for a police chief to administer discipline, whether it's a 10-day, 15-day suspension or termination. I mean, I've had officers that I fired more than once for different infractions. Simply because you fire them, it goes to arbitration, and they get their jobs back. And some of these decisions that are made by arbitrators are absolutely ridiculous. And they go unnoticed. I mean, they're not published to where people can actually read the rationale behind the decision. And I think that's wrong. Because if they actually saw what went on behind closed doors, people would be more upset than they are right now, quite frankly.

COATES: Well, that's a scary thought. People are enraged right now. But, you know --

RAMSEY: Right.

COATES: I want to ask you about a disturbing incident that we first reported last night on this very program. Termination proceedings have begun against a Miami-Dade cop, who -- when this video surfaced of him striking a woman, who had become upset after missing her flight.

RAMSEY: Right.

COATES: I want you to watch this video.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I really should. You're acting like (INAUDIBLE). What you gonna do?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Now, that woman was then arrested on charges of battery against the officer, and also disorderly conduct. What -- what's your reaction, commissioner, to what you just saw?

RAMSEY: Well, the chief did the right thing. My understanding is he's already started termination proceedings. But this guy, I believe, is an 18, 20-year veteran. I mean, how many other cases does he have, where he should have been disciplined?

[23:55:00]

RAMSEY: I don't know the man. I don't know anything about Miami-Dade, in particular. But it's just one example of people that have no business being police officers. I mean, we're human beings. Everybody has a bad day. But to do that, I mean, it was no -- there was no reason to do anything even remotely close to that, in that situation.

I mean, people get in your face all the time. I mean, it is part of what you have to tolerate as being a cop. I mean, it's like being on a protest line and having people yelling and screaming, talking about your parents and everything else you can imagine. But you have to remain calm and you just cannot afford to have something like that happen. That's embarrassing, actually.

COATES: That's not what we saw there. Thank you, commissioner. I appreciate your time there. And also, thank you, all, for watching. Our coverage continues.

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