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Don Lemon Tonight
White House Aide Tested Positive for COVID-19; President Trump Awaiting Test Results; Hope Hicks is Symptomatic and Feeling the Virus; Former Rep. Beto O'Rourke (D-TX) Blames Trump; President Trump and First Lady Melania to Quarantine. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired October 01, 2020 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[22:00:00]
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: She's safe. So, tomorrow night Dr. Fauci big block a time to go over everything that matters so we know where things stand. I hope you join us. OK?
Favorite time of the night, time for CNN Tonight with its big star, Don Lemon.
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: So, we have some breaking news, Chris Cuomo, and something that you would know all about because you actually had COVID yourself.
CUOMO: What?
LEMON: Still dealing with the long-term effects of it, but it's actually pretty serious. What if I told you that the President of the United States is awaiting a COVID test because he may have been exposed to COVID by Hope Hicks? That he has had a test and they're waiting. And here's the big thing, he may self-quarantine, he and the first lady. What if I told you that?
CUOMO: First of all, responsible. And that is the protocol. Two, took too long. One, not only should we have found out about this on Wednesday night when they did because she was in contact with a lot of people and we have one commander in chief. But, two, why is he waiting on a test now? Why haven't they tested him already? This is the President of the United States. He couldn't get tested any sooner than this.
LEMON: Well, he is saying tonight -- I think -- I think this is extraordinary because we have the President of the United States who says I cannot. I just can't see sitting there at the Resolute desk wearing a mask. And then -- you know, after some time, he was forced into wearing it, just a couple of times. I think we've seen him wear it two, maybe three times, all of two or three times.
And then, you know, going on to have rallies in places that are spiking at the moment or have surges in COVID cases at the moment and then having Hope Hicks, who has been in very close contact with the president on Air Force One, in meetings, in the West Wing, so on and so forth. And now he is admitting that he has been tested and now going to
possibly have to self-quarantine, he and the first lady. I just think it's extraordinary because for so long he was saying it's a hoax. This is going to go away. People shouldn't have that big a concern, especially when it's outside in the warm months. And now we have this possibility with the president. We certainly hope that he and the first lady are OK and we hope that Hope Hicks is OK.
CUOMO: And their kids.
LEMON: And their kids.
CUOMO: And their son.
LEMON: And anyone who has been near them.
CUOMO: So, look, it's also a window into how screwed up our testing is. The timeline doesn't make sense. That could just be simple political
obfuscation. They're trying to throw us off about it. I can't believe they would know that Hope Hicks is positive and still let her go.
LEMON: Since Wednesday.
CUOMO: It's too dangerous.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: But if they say they found out Wednesday night, I thought they were all tested in the mornings.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: I can't believe the turnaround is that long for the White House. Talk about a sad commentary about the testing adequacy in this country.
LEMON: Yes,
CUOMO: So, if they tested later so they got the results later, they say she quarantined on the way back Wednesday night. Do we believe that?
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: Or is that a convenient way of them saying, no, we always took care of it the right way?
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: It's suspicious. Then 24 hours they tell us nothing. And now 24 hours, the president hasn't been tested?
LEMON: Yes. Well, listen, I think that's important. I think the big news, again, is the president may have to self-quarantine, and --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: But that's how it should be.
LEMON: That's how it should be.
CUOMO: And if she had had a mask on.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: And if he had had a mask on, the chance that she would be sick --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: But this is -- this is more about a person at the top setting the example. If the president had said -- if he had made it mandatory in his meetings when he's in contact with her to wear a mask, then we may not be in this situation.
CUOMO: Just needed to pull a Biden.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: If he had had that mask on everywhere, nobody would be making fun of him because he's the only one who makes cracks about masks.
LEMON: Yes. And just back from a big rally last night.
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: And he'd be much safer.
LEMON: When they figured this out. And who knows --
CUOMO: And is he still going to go to the rallies or is he going to self-quarantine?
LEMON: That's the big question.
CUOMO: Because just because he tested negative tonight --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: I got to run, though.
CUOMO: -- though, Don, remember, doesn't mean he doesn't have it.
LEMON: Yes, that's true. That's true.
CUOMO: That's how testing works.
LEMON: I got to get to -- I got to get to Kaitlan --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: Go ahead, brother. LEMON: -- and also Jonathan Reiner. So, thank you very much, Chris.
I'll see you soon.
This is CNN Tonight. I am Don Lemon.
And here is our breaking news. The President of the United States awaiting the result of his COVID test after his top aide, Hope Hicks, tests positive for the coronavirus.
Let's go right to CNN's White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins and our medical analyst Dr. Jonathan Reiner. Good evening to both of you. Break -- this is the breaking news, Kaitlan. So, let's play what the president just said about this --
(CROSSTALK)
Good evening, Don.
LEMON: -- on Sean Hannity, and then we'll discuss. Here it is.
(BEGIN VOICE CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So, she did test positive. I just heard about this. She tested positive. She's a hard worker, a lot of masks. She wears masks a lot, but she tested positive. And I just went out with a test. I'll see, you know, because we spent a lot of time -- and the first lady just went out with a test also.
[22:04:56]
So, whether we quarantine or whether we have it, I don't know. You know, it's very hard. When you're with soldiers, when you're with airmen, you're with the marines and I'm with -- and the police officers, I'm with them so much. And when they come over to you, it's very hard to say, stay back, stay back. You know, it's a tough kind of a situation. It's a terrible thing.
So, I just went for a test and we'll see what happens. I mean, who knows. But you know Hope very well. She's fantastic and she's done a great job.
But it's very, very hard when you are with people from the military or from law enforcement and they come over to you and they want to hug you and they want to kiss you because we really have done a good job for them. And you get close and things happen.
I was surprised to hear with Hope, but she's a very warm person with them and she -- she knows there's a risk, but she's young, and I just -- I just went out for a test. They just do it. It will come back later, I guess, and the first lady also, because we spent a lot of time with Hope, and others. So, we'll see what happens, but I'll get my test back either tonight or tomorrow morning.
(END VOICE CLIP) LEMON: OK. So, Kaitlan, he gets the test back tonight or tomorrow morning. You would have the news on that, I'm sure, as soon as it happens. So, he's awaiting those results. This is a major, major development.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I mean, Don, it's shocking. That is the president admitting on television in an interview that he just did that he does not know if he has coronavirus and whether or not he got it from a top aide that he works very closely with.
Now, for just time purposes here, we found out -- it was about two hours ago that it was first reported by Bloomberg that Hope Hicks had tested positive for coronavirus. We reported it and confirmed it shortly thereafter. We've seen the news developments since then.
And the president is saying that as of 10 p.m., he does not know if he has coronavirus. He says he hasn't gotten the results of his test back yet, and the White House has the tests that can let you know in 15 minutes or so whether or not you are positive or negative.
So, it's not clear why the president still doesn't have a result, but, of course, that's a major question because this happened yesterday, of course. We know that she was on the plane with the president to his rally in Minnesota yesterday. She flew back. Cuomo is saying that she quarantined on the plane. And was seated separately from other people and that they found out yesterday.
Of course, a lot of people didn't find out until today. But the question is, if the president was around someone who tested positive for coronavirus, he still went to a fund-raiser at his golf club in New Jersey today that was indoors, Don.
And, of course, the president does not wear a mask. We are very well- aware of that. And so, it's just shocking to hear the president say that he did go to a fund-raiser today, but he does not know still as of 10 p.m. whether he tested positive and got a negative result.
LEMON: And Kaitlan --
(CROSSTALK)
COLLINS: And, of course, a negative result doesn't guarantee anything.
LEMON: Also, Kaitlan, here -- this is -- we're looking at images where we saw some video. And this is a Getty image of them walking I'd imagine towards marine one. Is it towards or away? I'm not sure. But it doesn't matter.
COLLINS: Yes. Towards Marine One.
LEMON: Towards Marine One.
COLLINS: That's what that is.
LEMON: No one -- no one wearing a mask. There's Hope Hicks not wearing a mask. There is Stephen Miller, no mask. There is Jared Kushner not wearing a mask and everyone in close contact.
So, it's interesting because he is saying that she's, you know, in contact with people in the military. They want to hug her and so on and so forth. That sort of behave -- behavior should be discouraged by the president, the administration. That goes against their own guidelines of what people should be doing at the moment. She is traveling with the president. She traveled with him as recently as yesterday. Go through this timeline with us, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: But also, the other result or the other guidance that you get from the president's own medical experts is that if you come in close contact with someone who has tested positive, you should quarantine. The president has clearly come into close contact with Hope Hicks because they got on that helicopter. It's a very small helicopter and they all rode together.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Shouldn't Jared Kushner, shouldn't Stephen Miller, shouldn't they be quarantining at well?
COLLINS: Yes, and we're still trying to report out whether or not these aides are going to quarantine, but also the president still went to an event today knowing he had been around someone who tested positive. He's got another rally scheduled in Orlando tomorrow night. He's got more rallies scheduled in Wisconsin this week.
So, it is raising so many questions about the president. He was trying to defend the fact that Hope Hicks got coronavirus and, of course, it's a highly contiguous disease. That is what medical experts have been saying on CNN since everywhere --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And there's the president, Kaitlan, I don't mean to interrupt you. There is the president getting on to Marine One, a confined space, not wearing a mask, right after the -- his aides got on the plane as well, and the person who has tested positive, confirmed to test positive for coronavirus, Hope Hicks. Getting on to -- well, he got on before and they're coming in after. So --
(CROSSTALK)
COLLINS: Yes, and, of course, Hope Hicks --
LEMON: Go on, Kaitlan.
COLLINS: Don, I just got to say, she's very close to the president, one of his closest confidants, not just a top aide in the West Wing. Obviously, the precaution people wanted to take is not get the President of the United States infected with coronavirus, but this just raises so many questions about the president's actions here.
[22:10:03]
And the nonchalant manner in which he was talking about tonight, come into contact with someone who did test positive. We were told behind the scenes after his valet tested positive, he was not nonchalant about the matter, so it just raises so many questions like whether or not the president is still going to get on the plane and go to Florida tomorrow.
He said in that interview he doesn't know if he and the first lady need to quarantine. And basically, said they'll find out tonight or in the morning.
LEMON: Well, listen, those rapid tests take about 15 minutes. We're going to get to the medical angle of this and get the facts on that with Dr. Jonathan Reiner in just a moment, but, Kaitlan, I just want to stay with you for a minute here.
Two things, I understand from my source that she is -- she's feeling the symptoms and she is quarantined at home right now, correct?
COLLINS: Yes. So, she is symptomatic. This is not one of those cases where you just found out because you've been tested as we know so many people have. She actually has symptoms. We're told by multiple sources. Of course, you have one as well.
She is at home in Washington, quarantining, we're told. But the question is whether or not the Jared Kushner's, the Dan Scavino's, the other people who were, you know, right there with her getting on the plane yesterday and riding with them to Minnesota, not a short plane ride and coming back, what they're going to do to take precautions as well, because that is the guidance. If you come --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And Kaitlan.
COLLINS: -- in very close, sustained contact you should quarantine.
LEMON: Kaitlan, this is as close to the president as you get. This is as close.
COLLINS: Yes. No one is closer to the president in the West Wing with the exception of his family members than Hope Hicks. She works incredibly closely with the president. She does not often wear a mask when she's inside the West Wing or on Air Force One, we're told by sources.
And she was part of the debate prep as the president was getting ready for Cleveland. She went to Cleveland. She went to Minnesota yesterday. She's traveled with him a lot in the last several days so, of course, that's going to raise a whole slew of questions for the medical experts and about the president's schedule.
And it just goes to show this is something we hear in the White House, that they say they don't need to wear a mask and they don't need to social distance because they're tested regularly. Testing does not give you immunity to coronavirus. And so, we are seeing it point- blank, just because you are tested on a daily basis does not mean you're not going to get coronavirus. So, they'll somehow find out in this advanced way where you won't be
able to infect other people. This is exactly what experts have been saying is the problem with the White House strategy. We are seeing it come to life here with the president saying he does not know if he's negative or if he's positive.
LEMON: Yes. Listen, for those of you who are just tuning in, here's the deal. Hope Hicks, who is a top aide to the president, works very closely with him in the West Wing, travels with him. There you see her there in that photograph, getting -- boarding Marine One on Wednesday with the president. No masks. No one wearing I mask on to the helicopter.
And then now she has tested positive. The President of the United States and the first lady, according to the president who just did an interview, both just had COVID tests and are awaiting the result.
As Kaitlan said so aptly just a couple of minutes ago, the President of the United States has had a test, does not know if he is positive or negative for coronavirus at this moment. He's awaiting the results and they both, the first lady and the president, and maybe those who have been in close contact with him may have to -- and Hope Hicks. May have to self-quarantine.
Another question for you, Kaitlan, and, doctor, we're going to get to you in just moments. Plenty of time here. He -- this president often makes fun of Joe Biden for wearing masks, right? But he was in fairly close contact with Joe Biden and others the other night at the debate. What about those people that he may have put in danger?
COLLINS: That's the question. And that is why medical experts say to take these precautions. And also, look at what the president has been saying in his public comments.
Today he just said that we are nearing the end of coronavirus. Hours later, we find out that one of his top aides and closest confidants has tested positive for coronavirus.
It goes to show we are not near the end of it. We are very much still in the middle of it, as experts have said, and that is why there has been so much focus on the White House throwing caution to the wind and their scatter shot approach to dealing with COVID.
Because for a period, you had to wear a mask to get into the West Wing, but you didn't have to wear it when you were at your desk. They've totally done away with that notion. For a period, most people -- a lot of people were getting tested. They were doing temperature checks. That has gone away and now it's only the senior staff that meets with the president that's getting tested.
So, they have taken this approach that has been all over the place when often people who work for cabinet secretaries or top officials don't want to wear a mask because their boss isn't wearing one and, of course, the person who does that the most is Donald Trump.
If he insisted everyone who came into the oval office had to wear a mask, things would be different, but he doesn't do that. He says he wears a mask when it's needed. Of course, in his opinion, that's on very few occasions and he mocks his opponent, his political opponents for wearing masks, even though health experts have said that's what you should do.
[22:15:05]
And so, of course, this is not Hope Hicks' fault. This is a highly contiguous disease. That is what we have been told by the medical experts for going on, you know, what is it, eight months now? But, of course, the questions it raises is the precautions that they are not taking inside the West Wing to protect the leader of the free world from getting coronavirus.
LEMON: And that is what we have been reporting for months and months and months and the president has been calling it fake news and saying it's a hoax.
Dr. Reiner, thank you for waiting patiently. Now let's get to the medical part of this.
JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Sure.
LEMON: You're the expert. I have a lot of questions for you. First of all, as you see the video there of them getting on to Marine One with the president not wearing masks. Are they possibly exposed as well? Do they need to self-quarantine? Do they need to have tests?
REINER: Yes, absolutely. So, what we know is that your -- you become contiguous probably 48 hours before symptom onset. So, we know that Ms. Hicks -- and by the way, let me just start by saying I wish Ms. Hicks the best. I wish her a speedy recovery, as I'm sure everybody does.
But she became symptomatic, apparently, last night. So, we know that she was likely contiguous as early as Monday night and she's been with the president all week.
Now, Marine One is a very -- is a very small aircraft. So, everyone on that aircraft has been exposed to the virus. We know that. Well, with clarity. And I would suggest that a lot of people on Air Force One have been exposed to the virus.
CDC guidelines for this are pretty clear. Everyone who has had a close exposure to somebody who is a -- has a -- is a known infection should quarantine for 14 days. So, the entire staff who traveled with the president this week should be quarantining for 14 days. The President of the United States should be quarantining for 14 days.
Important for the continuity of government is that the president and vice president should not be together now for 14 days. To prevent both the president and the vice president from contracting the virus. The president's trips should be cancelled. It was irresponsible to plan a trip to Wisconsin, which is the hottest of the hot zones in the United States before this. Now you can't bring a team of people who likely have been exposed to
the virus to -- already to a hot zone. The trips -- all those trips should be cancelled. This is just -- this is standard practice now. It would be irresponsible for the president to do anything other than that. Testing negative today, which I hope he is negative today, doesn't mean he'll be negative tomorrow or the day after.
LEMON: Yes.
REINER: The incubation period for this virus is anywhere between 5 and 14 days.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Doctor, we're going to --
REINER: One of the things I'll say --
LEMON: We're going to stay -- we're going to stay with you, doctor.
REINER: Yes.
LEMON: Kaitlan, thank you. Kaitlan is going to go do some more reporting for us and then she's going to get back to us.
REINER: Yes.
LEMON: But here we are with the breaking news about Hope Hicks and the president and the first lady now getting COVID tests. Hope Hicks is now a top aide to the president, very close, has now tested positive for the coronavirus, is, according to sources, at home and also feeling the symptoms of coronavirus.
According to our Dr. Reiner here, the -- it's 48 hours before you start feeling the symptoms that you are the most contiguous.
My question is now, I'm sure the Biden folks are asking if they should be thinking about whether the former Vice President Joe Biden had any potential exposure. That he may have been exposed. I know the podiums were far apart, but they were in the same room, air conditioning, duration, swirling around, yelling at each other for 90 minutes with, you know, the air swirling there. That is not good. So, what do you make of that, Dr. Reiner?
REINER: Yes, so you're probably most contiguous the day you develop symptoms, but you are contiguous likely for up to 48 hours before that, which would certainly include the debate night.
Look, the Trump team refused to wear masks in the hall. That -- you can see how outrageous that was. It was outrageous before we knew that a member of that team was already positive.
I think that the risk to the vice president, you know, in that hall, not within six feet of Ms. Hicks is likely small. I'm sure his team will surveil him closely. If he did not have a close contact with her, if he was not within six feet of her then he does not need to quarantine.
But the entire team with the president should be quarantining for 14 days. That's CDC guidelines. It is -- it's not debatable. The virus -- the virus has a 5 to 14-day incubation period.
One other thing I want to say about testing of the president is that undoubtedly, they know whether the Abbott I.D. now test, the rapid test is positive or negative.
[22:19:59]
If they're not releasing the result, it may be that they are verifying either a positive or negative test with the -- a more sensitive, a more reliable PCR test. That takes about an hour and a half to come back, which they would undoubtedly send out to Walter Reed and wait for the results.
So, the president may be waiting for it to be confirmed, either positive or negative before discussing that.
LEMON: So, you think they already have a result?
REINER: No, he undoubtedly has the result. The result is a 15-minute test so they already have the result. If -- you know, if I were testing him, I would test him both with the rapid test and then the more gold standard test which takes about 90 minutes to get back, and undoubtedly, they're doing that.
LEMON: OK. So, if he was just recently exposed, right, say the other night or, you know, in the West Wing, whenever, the other night, Wednesday. Well, they know she tested positive on Wednesday. But would he know by now? Would he -- would he test positive? Or even if he tests negative at this moment, does it -- does that still mean he doesn't have it? Because he --
(CROSSTALK)
REINER: So, it would depend on when he -- so it would depend on when he contracted it.
LEMON: OK.
REINER: First of all, I hope the president does not have the virus.
LEMON: And I said that at the top of the show. We hope all of them are OK. We said that. And this is not, you know, anyone can get it. You or I can get it.
REINER: Anyone can get it.
LEMON: Even if we are -- even if we, you know, do everything right, sometimes people get it. But this is, as you know, about this administration and really about the president because it comes from the top. The president has downplayed the wearing of masks and social distancing and opening back up, and on so. And look at the picture there. Stephen Miller just kind of smiling and
Hope Hicks there is kind of -- Jared Kushner, Dan Scavino, walking on to Marine One, just kind of smiling. No masks. Just walking.
REINER: Right.
LEMON: And the president gets on no mask as well. So, go on.
REINER: So, it depends on when the president contracted the virus. Or -- so if he was infected with the virus on let's say debate night, Tuesday night, then he would be negative today, probably. He would still probably be negative today. This is why we, you know, the incubation period for the virus is somewhere between 5 to 14 days. I think that --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: That's why he needs to quarantine then? That's what I think.
REINER: That's why he needs to quarantine.
LEMON: Let me ask you, what about the -- what about the folks on Marine One? What about the pilot? What about the -- the military folk who greet him or who also ride with him? All of the people who are in contact with the president?
(CROSSTALK)
REINER: They should all be out of commission.
LEMON: Anyone in the West Wing should be out of commission?
REINER: Anyone who was in close contact with Hope Hicks, anyone who was in a room with her within six feet for more than 15 minutes should be on home quarantine for 15 -- for two weeks.
LEMON: What if they were -- what if they were not in contact with her but were in contact with Stephen Miller o Jared Kushner or President Trump?
REINER: No, if they were in contact with a secondary contact, they just need to monitor their own symptoms. They don't -- they do not need to quarantine, but if they had a first-person contact with her, they should be quarantining for 14 days. It's -- it's not -- it's not debatable. It's just solid practice. This is how you keep the virus from -- from spreading.
LEMON: But, listen, I got to get a break in, but just your overall -- what do you -- what do you make of this, doctor? What is your overall --
REINER: It was bound -- it was bound to happen. It was bound to happen. Look, everywhere I go and everywhere my teammates at work go, when they're outside, we wear masks, everywhere. We, you know, we walk from the hospital to our offices wearing masks. We don't have in- person meetings anymore. We Zoom everything because we know what this virus can do.
And when we're -- are, you know, in close contact with each other, we wear masks. We wear face masks, face shields in clinic now. We take this seriously. The virus doesn't care if you don't take it seriously. It's an incredibly contagious pathogen. Everyone in close contact with Hope Hicks should quarantine for 14 days. It's not a punishment. It's public health.
LEMON: Doctor --
(CROSSTALK)
REINER: And the continuity of this government requires that.
LEMON: Yes, it's their own guidelines, but do as I say, not as I do. Again, you were right to point out, as I did in the beginning, we hope, certainly hope they're all OK and we hope the president and the first lady test negative and everyone else.
REINER: Right.
LEMON: But their own guidelines say that they should be wearing masks and distancing, and just from the video you see there and from the White House reporters, they don't do it.
So, doctor, stand by.
REINER: Sure.
LEMON: We're going to continue on with our breaking news here. More to come on the breaking news. Top Trump aide Hope Hicks has tested positive for the coronavirus. The president of the United States and the first lady awaiting their own COVID test results.
[22:25:07]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: So, we are back now with our breaking news. And we're getting more information on it by the moment here.
The President of the United States awaiting the result of his COVID test after his top aide, Hope Hicks, tests positive. We understand that she is feeling the symptoms from the coronavirus and is at home now, one would imagine self-quarantining.
I want to get to our White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins who is getting information on this. Kaitlan, listen, we're getting this new information in. What do we know about the president and the first lady and any other people, like the vice president, who could have been exposed? And will the president quarantine?
COLLINS: Those are still open questions, and the president floated a quarantine tonight, but the main headline, Don, is that we don't know if the president has coronavirus because he said in an interview with Sean Hannity tonight where he phoned him that he has taken a test. He said he took one tonight, as did first lady Melania Trump, but he
said they have not gotten their results back yet, and he said maybe they would get them back tonight, maybe they would get them in the morning, but the bottom line is the president doesn't know.
[22:30:05]
So, of course, this is raising so many questions about what he and top aides are going to do. But let's just focus on the president's schedule because today he did go to a closed-door fund-raiser at his golf club -- at his golf club in New Jersey where he was there meeting with donors, obviously behind closed doors.
The president was not wearing a mask, I'm told. And so that was after he rode on Air Force One yesterday with Hope Hicks. And as you can see from these pictures, that's leaving the Oval Office and going to get on Marine One. That's about a 15-minute ride on Marine One to get to Andrews.
So, they were on the plane -- on the helicopter for about 15 minutes and then they were on the plane together for a number of hours before they found out that Hope Hicks had tested positive for coronavirus, one of his closest aides.
So, the question is what he is going to do once he gets that result? It's an open question whether or not the White House will actually tell us when he gets his results.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: But Kaitlan, there is no question, though. Because even if he -- you heard Dr. Reiner who said, you know, even if he was exposed -- it depends on when he was exposed as to when he would test positive because he could have been exposed very recently and he may not test positive. The question is, is he going to self-quarantine? Because he absolutely should.
COLLINS: He floated it tonight but he certainly did not even come close to committing to quarantine. And we should note he did not quarantine after his valet tested positive. That's the person who handles his food, his beverages, helps him with his clothes. He didn't test -- he didn't quarantine then.
He didn't quarantine when a top aide to the vice president tested positive. He didn't quarantine when his national security adviser test positive. So, if the past is precedent, he is likely not going to quarantine, based on what he's done before.
Now, whether the fact that it's Hope Hicks, someone who is so close to him changes the calculus, that still remains to be seen.
LEMON: Well, listen, he's clearly been exposed to it. And as I understand from sources is that Hope Hicks is really, really sick. And hopefully she will be OK. I think sources think that she will be OK, but she is suffering from the effects of coronavirus at this moment. LEMON: And here we -- here we go. Kaitlan, listen, I want to get this
break in. But you've been there at the White House. You've been questioning the president. You have been questioning his aides. You have been questioning Kayleigh McEnany about this. Basically, the White House, this administration playing Russian roulette with the coronavirus. Basically, daring the virus to catch him.
COLLINS: It's been a scatter shot approach at best. They do not follow the protocols that you see in basically every other workplace in America where people are going back to work when it comes to mask and social distancing, and the one thing, Don, that they rely on, is testing.
And they say, well, we get tested every day so we're OK. Well we see with Hope Hicks just because you get tested doesn't make you immune from coronavirus. It doesn't make your chances of getting it less likely. And you see that even if you are tested on a daily basis, there can be a day where you do test positive and the question, of course now is what the president's result is going to be.
LEMON: And, Kaitlan, one really important question I think that everyone should know because we should have known, the American people should have known. If they knew by Wednesday, since Wednesday, the American people should be alerted because it's important to know the health of the president. Any official word from the White House? Anybody saying anything?
COLLINS: The only thing --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Kayleigh McEnany?
COLLINS: The only thing -- nope, the only thing we got was a statement from Judd Deere, a press secretary, who was telling us the precautions they take, but they were not the ones to first inform us of this. This was first reported in the media by Bloomberg and then confirmed by other outlets that Hope had tested positive.
So, it's not clear if the White House would have even told us if reporters had not first reported it, as has been the case with every other person in the West Wing who tested positive.
LEMON: Makes you wonder if they'd report it if the president actually had coronavirus but was -- didn't show symptoms. So, Kaitlan Collins, thank you very much.
Our breaking news tonight, the President of the United States of America awaiting his COVID test results after a top aide, his top aide, Hope Hicks, tests positive. And sources say she is experiencing symptoms and no one is closer to this president than Hope Hicks.
She has worked with him since his time in Trump Tower as a real estate developer.
We'll be right back. [22:35:00]
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LEMON: So, here's our breaking news tonight. The President of the United States awaiting his COVID test results. Not sure if he is positive or negative at this moment for the coronavirus. His top aide Hope Hicks has tested positive. Sources say she is experiencing symptoms. Right now, no one closer to the president as far as working than Hope Hicks besides his family.
So, listen, I want to get to Dr. Jonathan Reiner quickly. Jonathan -- Dr. Jonathan Reiner, it's interesting because, you know, we've been talking about getting these results within 15 minutes. If the president was negative, wouldn't they have come out? One would think, I should say, they would have come out and told us by now. So why the delay? What do you think is going on?
REINER: Either confirming either a negative or a positive result with the more definitive study, which takes about an hour and a half.
LEMON: Does it -- but they have known since --
(CROSSTALK)
REINER: I think they can come out --
LEMON: -- Wednesday and the president -- let's see, so the president was on Fox News at about 9 p.m. and he had heard about it before he went on Fox News. So that is, you know, an hour and at least 30 minutes ago. So that's maybe two hours. And it takes 15 minutes. Wouldn't by now they would have some idea about something?
REINER: Probably. But when they come out and either say the president is negative or the president is positive, they have to be sure about that. You know, we saw recently with -- I believe it was the governor of Ohio who tested positive and then they rechecked it and he was negative, and there was a lot of confusion.
[22:40:07]
You can't have that with the President of the United States. If you tell the public the president is negative, he has to be negative. So, they may not be relying on the Abbot I.D. now test. They may want, you know, the full, you know, lab PCR exam for that. And that's what I'm assuming they're doing. They're confirming whatever test they've run.
But don't forget, the president almost certainly would have been tested last night. If -- if she was positive last night, they would have tested the president last night. And they would have tested him again today. So, there are results which have -- which have been acquired. But if he was tested tonight, they're waiting for a confirmatory test. I know that with certainty.
LEMON: Listen, doctor, explain to -- I'm not a doctor. I can explain to you why this is so important, but I think it means more when it's coming from your lips, why this is so important for our viewers, for Americans and the world when you hear the President of the United States of America is awaiting his COVID test results and is not sure if he is positive or negative. Why is this so important?
REINER: OK. So, it's important, Don, on multiple levels. So, let's talk about the personal level for the president. It's important because he'd in the highest risk group. You know, he's over the age of 70, he's obese, and, you know, he has the highest risk of dying should he contract this virus.
So, on a personal level, that's -- there are important consequences for him, should he acquire this virus. But on a national level, look, the president has been running these rallies since the beginning of the summer, both indoors and outdoors. Without social distancing and without universal masking for his attendees and, you know, I've become like a broken record coming on your show and others saying how irresponsible that is.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Every day for eight months now we have been saying all that. But, sorry, go on, doctor.
REINER: And, you know, you know, we were talking today about, you know, Wisconsin and the plan to go into a state which has a 22 percent positivity rate. A state that has -- had their COVID mortality increase by 50 percent over the past couple of weeks and do a rally with unmasked people who believe the president. They believe him that this is not such a big deal.
The -- imagine if the president had come out eight months ago and said this is a really big deal. And we're going to take care of each other. We're going to mask up. We're going to stay home if we get sick. We're not going to gather in big crowds and we're going to put our country back together. We'd be in an entirely different place now.
LEMON: Right.
REINER: But even with the virus surging through the summer, he didn't do that.
LEMON: Yes.
REINER: Look, I have no schadenfreude about this. I want the president to be negative, but I want the public to understand that this virus is real. And if you go out in public you need to have a mask on.
LEMON: Yes.
REINER: If you have a mask on, you will not get this virus.
LEMON: Well, listen, none of us should be. And again, we hope that the president and the first lady and everyone who's been around him we hope that they are OK, and, of course, Hope Hicks as well.
Doctor, thank you very much. And just as the doctor was saying about -- about the president's schedule. This is what the president did this week -- thank you, doctor. We appreciate it.
REINER: Sure.
LEMON: I've got these guys. So, listen, he went to the debate on Ohio, that was on Tuesday. Then Minnesota, he went to that rally. Today we're told by Kaitlan Collins he went to a fund-raiser in New Jersey and she was told, that was inside, she was told that he was not wearing a mask.
He is supposed to have two rallies in Wisconsin this week and then tomorrow he's supposed to have another rally in Florida. Now, listen, I don't know if this is the right hand not knowing what the left hand is doing. But on Friday, we just got the schedule, just came out, 10.42 from the president's schedule here.
At 10.30, the president receives his intelligence briefing in the Oval Office. At 12.15, the president hosts a phone call on COVID-19 supportive vulnerable seniors with the White House at 2.40, fund- raiser at Trump International Hotel. Then he flies om Air Force One to Florida, then he has a campaign rally in Sanford, Florida, and then he flies on Air Force One back to D.C.
So, the president obviously gets around. That is his business, to conduct the business of the country. And this is campaign season. So, he's in contact with a lot of people, and he has been in contact with a lot of people, and potentially in contact if he follows the schedule.
But there is no doubt that this president should be self-quarantining at this point.
I want to bring in someone now who has been standing by very patiently, and that is former Texas Congressman Beto O'Rourke, who was a candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination.
[22:44:58]
Congressman, thank you. I'm sure you understand how this goes. We've got some breaking news, so we have to get it on the air and we've got to do it thoroughly.
But so, before we talk about, you know, voting in Texas, I've got to get your reaction to the president and this breaking news. He says he is still awaiting his coronavirus test after Hope Hicks tests positive. There is a serious risk of exposure to the president here. Give me your reaction to this breaking news story, please.
FMR. REP. BETO O'ROURKE (D-TX): Look, I hope that Hope Hicks is OK. I hope that the president and his traveling party are OK, that they're not infected. I hope that he does not expose anyone else and follows the best public health guidance and medical guidance.
I don't think he will. If past performance is a predictor of future performance then he's not going to.
And, look, let's -- Don, let's remember, this guy is in large part responsible for the deaths of nearly 210,000 of our fellow Americans, nearly 16,000 of my fellow Texans, almost 600 of my fellow El Pasoens. We are 4 percent of the globe's population. We are 22 percent of the globe's active cases, almost a quarter of the deaths, and that's not by force of God or Mother Nature, but the miserable leadership of one man, Donald Trump, and every Republican senator who enables him, every Republican governor like Greg Abbot follows in his footsteps.
He has cause this this to happen. And so, while we're concerned about him as we should be. He's the President of the United States. Let's also think about everyone who is sick right now, everyone who has lost a family member, all those who are struggling right now against this pandemic with no help, no strategy and no plan from the president.
LEMON: And I just want to point out because you know how some things are taken out of context and you were misquoted. Congressman O'Rourke did say in part. He is not saying the president is responsible for every death in this country. He is saying in part because of his -- what you deemed his lack of leadership on this subject, correct? On the pandemic.
O'ROURKE: Clearly.
LEMON: Yes.
O'ROURKE: Absolutely. For him to know and tell Bob Woodward that eight months ago how deadly this virus and this pandemic is, for him to go out publicly and gather people without masks and to mock those who do wear masks and to ignore the best public health guidance and thereby infect our fellow Americans, many of whom would end up dying from COVID-19, yes, he bears responsibility for many of those deaths.
LEMON: OK. I need to stand you by. I'm sorry, Congressman. I have to get some breaking news right now. I want to go to CNN's Kaitlan Collins on our breaking news. As I understand, Kaitlan, the president is going to quarantine, is that correct?
COLLINS: Yes. This is notable because this is not something the president has done when anyone else around him has tested positive. Don, he just tweeted that he is still waiting on his test results, so is the first lady. And he says in the meantime we will begin our quarantine process after noting that Hope Hicks, of course, had tested positive.
Don, I don't know exactly what this means, but it is telling that the president says they took a test tonight, they don't have the results still here almost at 11 o'clock, over an hour after the president first said they were waiting on the results. And we know the White House has the 15-minute tests at their disposal. It's what they use to test people every single day.
Yet, the president says he's still waiting on his result and he's going to quarantine. And, of course, this comes just moments after you've just read his public schedule for tomorrow which had a fund- raiser and a roundtable and a public rally, of course, in Florida. And the president seems to be saying he is going to cancel that if he's going to be quarantining. But it just raises questions, Don, about whether or not the president
got a rapid test tonight and what the result of that was. Because typically they would be able to say right away, yes, it was positive or, yes, it was negative.
And as you noted, that still raises questions about whether or not he should be quarantining, but it's notable that right now he says he is going to go into this quarantine process because Hope Hicks tested positive, something he has not done in the past when other people who still work pretty closely with him have also tested positive.
LEMON: Our Kaitlan Collins reporting the breaking news. And, Kaitlan, stay with me just for a moment. Kaitlan just reported the news about the president tweeting tonight. Hope Hicks has been working so hard, without even taking a small break, has just tested positive for COVID- 19. Terrible. The first lady and I are waiting for our test results. In the meantime, we will begin our quarantine process.
It's certainly a turn of events here, Kaitlan, when you hear from the President of the United States, when you go back and look at the public record of him and his handling of this virus.
[22:50:00]
And the statements he's made about the virus. That it's going to go away. That it is a hoax. That he doesn't want to wear masks. That people should be opening up. That people's personal liberties were being taken away.
Making fun of the former vice president about wearing masks and so on and so forth. And now he is in a position where he has to self- quarantine because he does not know if he is positive or negative at this moment for the coronavirus.
COLLINS: And Don, he says he doesn't know, but it really does raise questions about what he knows and if he's been tested and if he's gotten any results from the rapid test and has since taken the other test, which of course can take several hours. There's difference in those two tests.
And we know that sometimes with the rapid test they can have false positives. They do not have a 100 percent accuracy rate. That's what medical experts have said.
But it just really raises questions, because the president -- I cannot stress enough -- has never quarantined before when the person who handles his food and beverage tested positive, when his national security adviser tested positive, when the vice president's communications director tested positive, but now with Hope Hicks testing positive -- something that we should note was first reported by the media not announced by the White House then later confirmed by the president, he now says he's going to quarantine.
So, it really does raise questions. And of course, this is crucial to public knowledge knowing the president's health and whether or not he's tested positive for the coronavirus. So, the White House has not committed yet to giving us the result of
what the president the outcome of his test is going to be. But it's notable that he says he and the first lady are going to quarantine. And what that means for staff? Can they still come to the White House? Can they still come into the residents of the White House? Is he still going to go to this rally tomorrow? It sounds like a no, but it's raising a whole slew of questions about what's been transpiring in the last few hours to lead the president to make this decision.
LEMON: All right, Kaitlan, I want you to stand by. Kaitlan Collins with our breaking news. The first lady and the president of United States will begin their quarantine process after his top aide tests positive for the coronavirus. He and the first lady, according to him, they're awaiting the results of their tests.
Dr. Jonathan Reiner is here as well as our Kaitlan. Is Kaitlan going to stay with us? She's going to get new reporting, right? Is she going to continue to report right now? OK, so we'll get back to Kaitlan. She's going to go and work on some reporting. I'll bring the doctor in.
Doctor, so let's do some contact tracing. According to Kaitlan and our White House team, I think the vice president was in contact with the president and in the, I think in the West Wing or in the Oval Office as of two days ago.
You see Jared Kushner. You see Hope Hicks, Dan Scavino, Stephen Miller all getting on to Marine One after the president gets on, no one wearing masks. They're getting into a confined space. A small confined space, and then going to Air Force One, which is a bigger confined space. You're saying everyone who has been in contact with Hope Hicks or in these situations should be quarantining right now?
REINER: Yes, everyone should be quarantining now and I'll go even further and say that the speaker of the House should be protected in isolation now, because it doesn't violate the rules of physics now for both the vice president and the President of the United States to get sick.
And if the -- you know, the continuity of government requires that we have a clear leader here, and it's very possible that the president and the vice president can both become sick right now. So, I would limit activity for the speaker of House, make sure that she's really isolated and in a relatively sterile environment.
LEMON: What do you make of the president now saying that he and the first lady will now begin their quarantine process?
REINER: It's the right thing to do, and I applaud them for doing that. But let me just say that at least the initial test result for the president is back. You know, this hasn't been set off to quest and he's going to get it back in two to three days and wait for his doctor to call him. They have the initial test result.
At some point this evening it would be irresponsible for the White House and the White House physician not to inform the public of the president's status tonight. Almost certainly the result, the molecular more sensitive test will come back very shortly if it's not already back to confirm the earlier test this evening, and the public should be told whether the president is positive or negative. It should be done tonight.
[22:54:59]
The result will be available tonight. It won't take till the morning. This is not a send out. So, it means something if we don't hear about the president's status tonight.
LEMON: Yes.
REINER: Because you would certainly tell the public he's negative.
LEMON: Yes. Say that one more time clearer for our viewers again.
REINER: They will have the president's COVID testing shortly, and with a confirmatory test, I'm sure. That result should be clearly communicated to the public tonight. I hope it's negative. And if it's negative, the public should be told that. The public deserves to know that. If he's positive, the public should know that as well.
LEMON: Doctor, I want you to stand by. I want our viewers to stand by as well.
REINER: Sure.
LEMON: Lots of breaking news. We're getting developments on the president, the situation that's happening at the White House right now. The president and first lady beginning a quarantine, their quarantine process after his top aide Hope Hicks tested positive for the coronavirus.
She is at home now feeling the symptoms. We're understanding that she is fairly sick. But hopefully she will be OK and the president and the first lady as well. But at this hour, according to the President of the United States, he does not know if he's positive or negative for the coronavirus and he's awaiting a result of a test.
We'll be right back.
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