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Don Lemon Tonight

Don's Take On The Presidential Candidate's Town Hall; Biden Makes An Impassioned Plea For Health Care; Trump Makes Biden Campaign's Point On Social Distancing; Sen. Perdue Willfully Mispronounces Sen. Kamala Harris' Name; Trump Campaign Is Always Trying To Make Black People Seem Foreign; Trump Takes His Superspreader Tour On The Road; Obama To Campaign For Biden In Philadelphia On Wednesday. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired October 16, 2020 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: All right. I got to end the show on an apology. CNN Tonight starts with D. Lemon right now and I am off my game, man. I've been doing you dirty with time all week long and I apologize. I don't mean to disrespect your show. It is my favorite show on the network.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: It should be because it's the best one.

CUOMO: I agree.

LEMON: Other than you know 360 and Cuomo Primetime.

CUOMO: No. Yours is the best, Don. Yours is the best. You're the only one with a unicorn.

LEMON: So, interesting conversation with Cube, but there's a lot more to it than what happened, what you guys talked about.

CUOMO: How so?

LEMON: Well, there is a reason that African Americans are not drawn to, most African Americans are not drawn to or open to what this administration is doing or saying. One must be careful. Let's put it this way.

I had a conversation the other day and I won't give it away with Oprah. And she talked about the power of a platform. Right? Just a phone conversation. Power of a platform. So, if you are someone like Ice Cube and you have the platform that you have and I don't want to disrespect him. You know, he is very accomplished. I've only met him a few times. Nice guy.

But one needs to know what one is talking about. One needs to educate one's self on just what is, other than the basics about capital which is important, about voting, which is important, and so on and so forth. So, you have to be careful who you align yourself with. So, you have to educate yourself about that.

What is happening with the Trump campaign and they had admitted it is that they need African American votes to win. This is just to win for them. So what they are doing is trying to pit African Americans against Hispanics or against immigrants by saying the immigrants are taking your jobs. They are trying to appeal to African American men I should say, men. They know that they cannot get the women, so they are not targeting African American women. They are targeting black men.

Immigrants are taking your jobs. And don't you want the money because you need to build wealth and blah, blah, blah, blah. So there is sort of a too cute by half aspect of what they are doing. There is the money as you so rightly pointed out in the Trump plan does not -- it is not specifically earmarked for anything. It's not specific.

CUOMO: Certainly not for blacks.

LEMON: Certainly not for blacks. That black thing, that's another thing. I'll get to that. If you listened to the town hall last night what Joe Biden said, what he is talking about is he has specifics on how he is going to help the black community, where the money is going to go to, what kinds of coalitions he is trying to build. Trump, the Trump plan does not have that.

So the black thing. Here's the problem with that. I understand what he is saying about black people and about the descendants of slaves. Again be careful who you align yourself with because this ADOS, African Descendants Of Slaves, a lot of Russian bots, a lot of bots online targeting, doing the dirty work of Russia for that.

CUOMO: Right.

LEMON: And to discriminate I think -- it is OK to point out that you are a descendant of a slave, don't get me wrong. That's fine. And some people are not. And that doesn't make one person less or more black than another person. But to discriminate against someone to say, well, we just want this because we are black in this way, I think is discriminatory.

Because people of color, there is power in numbers. It should be, there is nothing wrong with having a plan for black America and not just black Americans who are Descendants of Slaves, because this country, when someone sees me on the street or a black person is going for a job or for housing or for a loan they don't look at on your application it does not say if you are a Descendant of Slaves.

[22:05:22]

CUOMO: Right.

LEMON: It just says you're African American or you're black.

CUOMO: Right.

LEMON: So, that should be enough. So, you know, I just think that people need to be educated. You have to understand, be cognizant of how you may be used by certain people for a certain effect. And that's it. But there is a whole lot to, there's a read, there's a whole lot to why people are upset with Cube and it's not because he is talking about building capital. And quite frankly when I heard the name it reminded me of Newt Gingrich and the contract with America, it was like --

CUOMO: Well, I think -- I don't think that is a coincidence necessarily but that was a huge boost to the Republican Party both in terms of its determination and its structure.

LEMON: One more thing I forgot.

CUOMO: Go ahead.

LEMON: And also, because they can't get women, they are also trying to in some way pit African American men or black men against black women, right? And that's why I hear this talk, you know, in the barber shop all the time. You know, I live up town. I hear this kind of talk all the time especially from black men and I think that people need to know what they're talking about. And more importantly know what they're voting for.

CUOMO: Right.

LEMON: OK? All right. Go on. Sorry.

CUOMO: I would only say. I agree with everything, obviously. I mean, you know, you've helped me greatly in understanding my education of a lot of the racial aspects of current issues. You and a lot of other friends of color that I have. And I think it's important because a lot of times perspective is a big place of where you start in terms of when you read the same document.

But when you read the contract with Black America, there's a whole panoply of different things he has in it. I don't think that -- I can't say that Ice Cube has an obvious deficiency of perspective about anything. Everything that he lays out in the document is pretty solid in terms of the need.

The only thing I will give him in his defense that I didn't understand until I talked to him is, I don't believe that he sees himself as affiliated with the Trump campaign.

LEMON: No. He said that many times. You said that --

CUOMO: That anybody wants to talk to me I'll talk to them. Biden said I'll do it after. They said they would do it now, so I gave it to him now.

LEMON: Yes. He said that, and that numerous conversation that are online.

CUOMO: But that makes a lot of the criticism unfair because a lot of the critics are saying you sided with Trump.

LEMON: No, but you didn't hear what I just said. CUOMO: No, not you. I'm saying, but I'm saying -- he's getting hit

with that a lot.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: There is nothing wrong with that. Again, I said, there is a reason why most black people don't align themselves with the Trump philosophy.

CUOMO: Right. Obvious reasons.

LEMON: And for obvious reasons. And I think that -- listen, quite frankly, Cube, you have to recognize that. I respect him and if he is listening or watching that he is trying to ultimately help people, but it is important in the way you do it as well. And with whom you do it.

And, you know, I just think that you have to be careful about being used because if it's truly -- if it was truly just about helping people the person who tweeted it out and said, oh, thanks for helping or whatever, the Trump representative did, wanted black men to know, because Cube is a rapper.

And he has a lot of black support especially from men. Wanted people to know that. And again, it is too cute by half philosophy. I think it is quite obvious with what is going on but there you have it. That's how I feel about it

CUOMO: I appreciate your take.

LEMON: Thank you, sir.

CUOMO: Especially when I owe you time.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: I'll see you later.

CUOMO: All right. I love you. Have a good weekend. Spent time with me.

LEMON: I love you more. I will see you this week and I promise. This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon. 18 days to go until Election Day with more than 20 million ballots already cast. Side by side picture of the two campaigns well, tells you everything you need to know. Everything you need to know.

One campaign lives in reality. The reality of COVID America. With socially distanced events and realistic policies to battle the pandemic. One lives in a super spreading unreality show with a president who never mentions more than 218,000 dead Americans. He never mentions that.

But I want you to listen to Joe Biden making an impassioned plea today for the kind of health care Americans desperately need in these pandemic times. The kinds of health care his son Beau had.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, 2020 U.S.

PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He made it almost 16 months. Toward the end -- this is not about me. It's about all of you. I consciously thought to myself. What would it feel like if they were able to walk in and say, Mr. Biden, you've outrun your insurance coverage?

[22:10:22]

Suffer the last two or three months in pain on your own. Lots of luck. Because that's happened before. Long term complications from COVID will become pre-existing conditions joining asthma, diabetes, even pregnancy is a pre-existing condition before. It allows insurers to jack up your premiums or deny coverage all together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. So, you heard -- listen, you heard that. Very calm. Very presidential. Compare that to the president tonight talking about the Biden campaign's social distancing and accidentally making their point for them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The circles not only they are big, although I love the artistry because the guy really does a nice job. You know I'm into that stuff. It's very neat. Very round. Beautiful. Solid. I mean, it would be impossible to catch anything if you're in one of those circles because you are so far away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, that's why they have those circles. So it's impossible to catch anything. And take a look at this. This is the president in remarks about protecting America's seniors. He puts them at risk with an indoor event. Those seniors cheering and clapping. Few masks in evidence here. Looking at that you'd almost forget that there is a pandemic raging in this country, which is exactly what the president wants.

He wants you to forget all about the worst pandemic in a century. He just expects you to believe him when he says against all the evidence, we're rounding the turn. Rounding the turn to what? Another million cases by the end of the month? Another thousand dead Americans by the end of tomorrow? This is Chris Christie. I want you to listen closely here. Who trusted this White House to tell him the truth about the virus? And about the testing he thought would keep him safe.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), FORMER GOVERNOR OF NEW JERSEY: It was a mistake. You know, I was led to believe that all the people that I was interacting with at the White House had been tested and it gave you a false sense of security. And it was a mistake.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: It was a mistake he says. It was a mistake. And he paid for

that mistake with seven days in the ICU. And he's warning Americans to do what he didn't do and that's wear a mask.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIE: We need to be telling people that there is no down side to wearing mask. And in fact, there can be a great deal of upside. And I think if we all do that, that's one of the things we can contribute as Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: No down side to wearing a mask. It is a huge upside. Tremendous upside. Heard that? Chris Christie. He and the president. He is a supporter of the president. And that's what he is saying. That is a warning the president is ignoring tonight as he takes his super- spreader tour to Macon with another packed crowd, hardly any masks in evidence. And in a state where the virus has killed more than 7,500 people. He is acting like nothing is wrong. Just having fun.

Like Trump supporter Georgia State Congressman Vernon Jones, look at that. Oh, my god. Crowd surfing before the president took the stage. And then there is Senator David Perdue. OK, everybody. Listen closely. Following the president's lead, woefully mispronouncing the name of his colleague who happens to be on the Senate Budget Committee with him. That is Senator Kamala Harris.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. DAVID PERDUE (R-GA): Then tomorrow what Kamala or Kamala, Kamala mala mala, I don't know. Whatever. Then tomorrow what Kamala or Kamala, Kamala mala mala, I don't know. Whatever. Then tomorrow what Kamala or Kamala, Kamala mala mala, I don't know. Whatever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. So we played it a couple of times so you could hear. You just heard what I heard and saw what I saw, right. You did. So keep that in mind as I now tell you what Senator Perdue's office tells us tonight. They claim that he simply mispronounced her name, didn't mean anything by it. You heard him. He said her name four different ways and then tacked on a mala-mala-mala. I don't know whatever. That is what he said trying to be funny, scoring cheap laughs.

It's disrespectful. And their statement insults your intelligence. So, even though Senator Perdue's office has clearly given us a bad faith explanation. I'm going to help a brother out here. OK? So what is this on your screen? Look at some punctuation marks. That is a question mark. OK? Now what is this? Next to the question mark? That is an exclamation mark.

[22:15:04]

So what is this now next to the question mark and the exclamation mark? That is a comma. Kamala, add a la, Kama plus la is Kamala. So, think about a simple punctuation mark. A comma and then a la. Kama-la. So easy. There. I fixed it for you, Senator. You're welcome.

But this is right in line with the president's mocking his perceived political enemies. This campaign is always trying to make black people seem different, foreign, un-American, suspicious. Just listen to the garbage the president is spewing tonight about Congressman Ilhan Omar.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: If you look at the House with Pelosi and these people, it's like they hate Israel. And they believe in Omar who came in here maybe illegally.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So Congresswoman Omar was born in Somalia, came to the U.S. on refugee status. When she was 12 years old after spending years in a refugee camp in Kenya. She did not come here illegally and is fully a fully naturalized U.S. citizen. You don't have to like her. But you definitely don't need to smear her.

All that as the president is taking his super-spreader tour to Wisconsin tomorrow where they now have a positivity rate of more than 26 percent. Don't look for a whole lot of masks or social distancing there either. And if you're still not convinced the White House learned their lesson from their original super-spreader event, take a look at this photo.

The White House. There it is. Incredibly is using this photo of the nomination event for Amy Coney Barrett to promote their fall garden tours. Yep. It's the very same event that we now know was a super- spreader that infected multiple people. Look at those names there on your screen.

And that's where we are tonight. With more than 8 million cases of the coronavirus in this country. More than 218,000 Americans dead. And with 18 days to go until Election Day. That's where we are.

The former president Barack Obama is hitting the campaign trail for Joe Biden. He is going to do that next week. The day before was scheduled to be the final presidential debate. CNN's Dana Bash and former presidential candidate Andrew Yang are here to break down the state of the race 18 days out. They are next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:20:00]

LEMON: Well, there is only 18 days until the election Trump and Biden battling it out in key battleground states. The president holding a series of campaign rallies in Florida and Georgia. Rallies that could be potential super-spreader events. There was little social distancing and few people wore masks.

Joe Biden holding two campaign events in Michigan slamming Trump's handling of the COVID-19 pandemic and its dire impact on the economy and calling for unity in America. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: Everybody knows who Donald Trump is. Let's show him who we are. We choose hope over fear. Unity over division. Science over fiction. And, yes, truth over lies. It's time to stand up. Take back our country. God bless you all and may God protect our troops. Go get them. We can do this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I want to bring in now CNN's chief political correspondent Dana Bash and political commentator Andrew Yang, the former Democratic presidential candidate who will be campaigning for Joe Biden in Pennsylvania this weekend. And by the way, every time we hear a sound bite with Joe Biden, when he's giving an event, that's because they are socially distanced, a lot of them drive-thru or drive-up events where people sit in their cars and when they like what he says they honk their horns. So, I just had to explain that. Because every time I --

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Just like when you walk down the streets.

ANDREW YANG, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That's true.

LEMON: People are like oh, get out of the way. You're ugly.

(LAUGHTER)

OK, so listen. Hello to both of you. Dana, President Trump in an effort to make fun of Biden tonight accidentally made the point that Biden's event with circles drawn on the ground for social distance that they are safer. You can't make this stuff up now.

BASH: He has been mocking Joe Biden for following the guidelines of his own federal government for months now, Don, whether it's masks or social distancing. I mean, the whole set of moniker of him being in the basement. That's where that came from, it came from Joe Biden being socially distant and following the rules at the time it was the lockdown.

And now it's just basic protocol that the rest of us follow on our everyday lives. And the president still thinks that that works for him but there is very little evidence in basic political data that he's right.

LEMON: Andrew, you're heading to Pennsylvania to campaign for Biden on Sunday. President Obama will be in Philadelphia next week. Biden town hall was in Philly last night. Big, big focus on Pennsylvania.

YANG: Pennsylvania is a key battleground, Don. And if it goes to Joe which I expect it will, it's going to be very hard for Trump to reach 270 electoral votes. You showed a clip of Trump in Georgia tonight. That is the last place that he wanted to be, because that means they had to spend precious candidate time and energy defending a state that you would think would be solidly red and uncontested. And that is the problem for Trump is his map just keeps spreading,

where Joe is competitive in places that Trump would have liked to have put away weeks ago. It is one reason I think Joe is incredibly well positioned for election night. And this is more election month than election night. Because as you said we're already voting.

LEMON: Yes. And every day I'm surprised that the number of people I'm seeing in those lines voting early. I mean just out there socially distancing and voting, you know, before November 3rd. Dana, President Trump is taking notice that the former president is hitting the campaign trail. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Oh, I got an emergency call today. They said sir I'm sorry to tell you President Obama is going to start campaigning for Sleepy Joe. I said, so what's the problem with that? I said, is that good or bad? Because I think it's a good thing.

[22:25:07]

Because you know they did a lousy job. And I wouldn't be president of the United States if they did a good job. I wouldn't be -- I probably wouldn't have run. And if I did I probably wouldn't have won. You know? So it is one of those things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So great reporting. I watched your reports when you were in Pennsylvania. You were just in Pennsylvania. Can President Obama make a difference here?

BASH: Absolutely. I mean, Pennsylvania was blue twice when President Obama was running. In fact, it had been blue for almost three decades until Donald Trump's surprise win in 2016. President Obama is incredibly popular there as he is in other states. Obviously, you know, he is going to go and try to increase the margin of the Democratic vote but also independents and people who were Republicans, even Obama/Trump voters. They exist.

They are out there and they are in places like Pennsylvania so absolutely he can help. That clip from the president was so classic, Don, because he is right. He wouldn't be president without President Obama because he wouldn't have run because he was obsessed with Obama and obviously it was his conspiracy theory about Obama that got him traction with a certain segment of the population and he never looked back.

LEMON: Yes. With the supporters, many of the supporters he has now. Listen, I want to put up some polling for you Andrew, to respond to. This is out of Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin. Biden is up here. You also have the Biden campaign out spending, right, in these states. And so he is working to rebuild the blue wall that crumbled in 2016. Do you think it's working? What do you think?

YANG: I think it is working. We have to work our hearts out over these next 18 days. We can't leave anything to chance. But we are incredibly well positioned. Because if you look at the numbers in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, even places like Iowa and Ohio that Trump won significantly in 2016 they are all either competitive or Joe has a steady lead.

So the blue wall is going to grow. I mean, you're seeing Democrats competitive in places like Texas. Texas right now I saw a poll that said Texas is tied and that obviously would be a complete game changer in this cycle and for cycles to come if it became a purple state.

LEMON: Andrew, are you concerned though that this could have the opposite effect of what you want all of this early voting and talk on TV about Biden is ahead and this is great and the numbers and the people say well I don't need to go because he's winning?

YANG: Well, I am the math guy, Don. The numbers look great. Like again, that's why I said we have to keep working hard.

LEMON: But is that the message you want for people who haven't gone to the polls already that the numbers are great? Shouldn't Biden and you guys be saying or running as if he is behind 10 points?

YANG: We should be acting that way but the turnout levels are going to be -- they are saying the highest since 1908. I'm not concerned about Americans staying on the sidelines.

LEMON: That could be Trump supporters.

YANG: There are so many people that had been chomping at the bit to get their votes. You are even seeing those lines you're talking about, Don. People are waiting for hours to vote early.

LEMON: Yes, but those -- a lot of those people could be Trump supporters.

YANG: And turnout is a good thing in a democracy no matter what side it's on. But in this case I am going to suggest that a very high turnout level bodes very well for Joe and Kamala.

LEMON: Yes. Go ahead, Dana

BASH: I just want to say that I think you're making, the point you're making is right and valid given where Joe Biden was tonight. I mean, obviously, it's a bigger deal than Donald Trump felt that he had to go to the formerly red state of Georgia 18 days before an election.

But Michigan the Democrats thought was pretty comfortably in Joe Biden's column, but the polls apparently internally and certainly externally show a different story that it is very competitive which is why Joe Biden is a very sort of aggressively trying to avoid the mistake that Hillary Clinton made four years ago which is not going back to Michigan and losing Michigan.

So that's what Joe Biden did tonight exactly what you are suggesting, Don, campaigning there as if he could lose which is what a candidate is supposed to do. LEMON: Yes. Thank you both. I appreciate it. Have a great weekend. See

you soon.

BASH: Bye, Don.

LEMON: The president practically begging women to vote for him. Yet tonight he is attacking Savannah Guthrie for her looks. Savannah Guthrie, NBC. She did the town hall, moderated or questioned the president last night. So how is this going to fly with female voters?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: And in Savannah it was like her face, the anger, the craziness. I mean, the craziness last night. And I said good-bye. I said, great job, Savannah. You did wonderfully. Good job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:30:00]

LEMON: So I want you guys to pay attention tonight especially the men who are watching. The girl dads, the husbands. Pay attention to this. It's important. So just 18 days until the election and President Trump knows he is in trouble with women. It's obvious because he is basically begging for their votes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Suburban women, will you please like me? Please. Please. I saved your damn neighborhood. OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, the latest national poll has the president with low, low support from female voters. Meanwhile, Joe Biden has almost double the support and the anti-Trump Republican group the Lincoln Project seizing on the president's weakness asking voters to think about the young women in their lives when casting a ballot pointing to the president's pattern of misogyny. Here it is.

[22:35:17]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now imagine how she feels when she watches women being verbally attacked.

TRUMP: What a stupid question that is. What a stupid question. But I watch you a lot. You ask a lot of stupid questions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Maligned.

TRUMP: And this monster that was on stage with Mike Pence who destroyed her last night by the way. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Belittled.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm not thinking --

TRUMP: That's OK. I know you're not thinking. You never do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm Sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Harassed.

TRUMP: Blood coming out of her (inaudible).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Insulted.

TRUMP: I'd look right at that fat ugly face of hers.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your daughters are listening and absorbing that message right in front of your eyes. Now imagine a different future for her. A future with a president who doesn't just value a female voice but chooses one to be his right-hand woman.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And that pattern of behavior continues. Listen to President Trump say this. Seemingly about NBC's Savannah Guthrie following the town hall she hosted with him last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I had a lot of fun last night with that. That was a nice -- that was a nice evening. A nice pleasurable evening as I have somebody going totally crazy last night. But I told you, I told you that. She told me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, she was not going totally crazy. She was doing her job as a journalist and because the president doesn't like that he is hurling sexist insults. Listen to him tonight attacking Guthrie at his rally in Georgia.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: And in Savannah it was like her face, the anger, the craziness. I mean, the craziness last night. And I said good-bye. I said great job, Savannah. You did wonderfully. Good job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: He is who he is. Next, a woman who has spent the last three years speaking with dozens of women who voted for Trump in 2016. Sarah Longwell tells us what these women are saying about him now after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[22:40:00]

LEMON: President Trump down in the polls among female voters against Joe Biden. He needs to win them over in the next 18 days. Can he do it is the question. Joining me now is Sarah Longwell strategic director and founder of Republican voters against Trump. Sarah, so good to have you on. Thank you for joining.

SARAH LONGWELL, STRATEGIC DIRECTOR/FOUNDER, REPUBLICAN VOTERS AGAINST TRUMP: Thanks for having me.

LEMON: So, let's get into it. Women helped carry Trump into the presidency the last time around. Is his behavior right now winning women over?

LONGWELL: No. It is not winning women over. But I think the biggest problem for the president is he is failing to speak to the issues that are top of mind for women. I mean, the fact is we're in the middle of a pandemic. There's been an economic crisis. A lot of these women their kids aren't in school or they're doing school virtually. They haven't been able to go visit their sick parents. Somebody in their family has been furloughed.

They have real concerns. They have felt the personal consequences of the last six months. And the president doesn't talk about those things. He talks about Hunter Biden's hard drive. He talks about conspiracy theories. Mainly he talks about himself. And I think what women are looking for right now is answers, right?

They want plan. They want to know if there is going to be a vaccine. His help on the way. I mean, something I hear from these women especially in the last group I just did, you know, just like, you know, before there was money coming in and the government looked like it was going to do something but then it just stopped. And I think, you know, people feel kind of abandoned. And it's not --

LEMON: Well, let me just ask you here. And I want you to continue on with what you're saying but I want people to know that you host focus groups with female voters many of whom supported Trump in 2016. And you know, why have some of them turned against the president? You are speaking about that now. About what you are hearing, because as you said, my kids aren't in school. I'm having to, you know, teach them myself at home and they are learning on Zoom. And you know, so what are you hearing from them? Why is that?

LONGWELL: Yes. I've done about 50 focus groups over the last let say three years. And I've watched Donald Trump alienate these women in real time. And to be clear they're all Trump voters. They are all 2016 trump voters. And you know, I screen them to find the people who rate the president as doing a very bad or somewhat bad job. Because I'm thinking about who is gettable, who is persuadable.

But as I've been talking to these women, you know, for a long time back in 2019 people were still kind of hanging in there. They were still with him. The economy was OK. They didn't like his behavior. Hated the tweeting. Did think, you know, that he just didn't behave himself well. Wasn't presidential. Wasn't professional but things were going OK in their lives.

But what I saw, you know, in March and April and especially July, really that is when I saw the bottom fall out, because it was again, it was the personal consequences. Their lives were being impacted. It wasn't like an abstract foreign policy thing like Ukraine. You know, the economy was doing very badly. And they couldn't go anywhere. You know, so the personal consequences.

And the thing was I think the president would have done better with these women if he had looked like he was trying. I mean, this is what they say all the time. They're like he just doesn't seem like he cares. They care about the coronavirus. They want to see people wearing masks. You know, one of the things that just, forget the horse race politics of it for a second. There is a tremendous amount of personal pain out there. The stories when I ask people, you know, how do you think things are going in the country?

[22:45:04]

They all say it is going very badly but mixed in there they also talk about their own lives and how they couldn't visit a parent who died. Or how they can't take their sick child into the doctor. Or how they're recovering. They're going through chemotherapy and they can't go to the store because people don't wear masks.

And so it is that frustration that when it seems like the president is then downplaying the thing that is most impacting their lives and doesn't seem like he is trying, that's where he is really losing people. And I'll tell you just one other thing which it surprised me a little bit. Doesn't surprise me about coronavirus or the economics but the George Floyd killing really was a turning point for a lot of these women.

LEMON: You are reading my mind.

LONGWELL: They just, here's the thing. They felt like when the country is this divided what they want from a president is some, just at least pretend to try to unify the country, but instead what they talk about is how not just how divisive he is but how he makes everything worse. They often use the phrase, he's like pouring gasoline on the fire.

And they, themselves, want, you know, they're not -- they want there to be a new way of talking about race. Like they genuinely feel like there is a racial problem in the country and they want to see the president do something about it. For him to make things worse that was actually a big thing with a lot of these women

LEMON: I agree with what you are saying 155,000 percent. And I have said before that that was an incredible opportunity for the president during the George Floyd protests and the killing I should say, for him to bring the country together. An incredible opportunity to make a difference with race, systemic racism in this country.

Instead he went the other way and said, well, he doesn't believe there is systemic racism and he doesn't believe that there is unconscious bias and policing and on and on and on and it is just not helping. And then what he is not understanding and what many people aren't understanding with what you are saying is when George Floyd called out for his mother as he was dying, that resonated with everyone but especially women, Sarah.

LONGWELL: Yeah. And I'll tell you, you know, there is this woman who was a repeat person. I saw her back in 2019 and she said she was going to vote for Trump. You know, she said better the poison you know than the poison you don't know. And I really -- that stuck with me as a rationale.

But I saw her again in July. And she was clearly against the president now. And I asked her why. And she said, I just watched what the police did to that man and it made me so sad and the president didn't seem to care. And that was the thing that really turned her off.

And I just heard things like that over and over again. You know, I have a lot of women tell me that they're pro-life. That is why they've always voted Republican. But that they are starting to rethink what it means to be pro-life because being pro-life also means caring about --

LEMON: The people who are --

LONGWELL: -- it means black lives matter. It means people -- prison lives matter. You know, it means that all different kinds of life --

LEMON: All lives, right.

LONGWELL: It is interesting how the frame on some of these things has shifted with a lot of these women. And it's interesting, too, I mean, look, I don't want to overplay it. There's absolutely people who are sticking with the president.

LEMON: Right. I got to run, Sarah.

LONGWELL: Even these people who don't like him. Oh, OK. I'm sorry.

LEMON: No, finish your thought. Some of them think what?

LONGWELL: Some of them think Democrats are worse and that is why they're sticking with the president but he is losing a lot of these women and that I think is going to be his margin of loss.

LEMON: We've gone long. Just yes or no does he have time to make it up in 18 days, to win these women?

LONGWELL: No.

LEMON: OK. Thank you, Sarah. Fascinating. We will have you back. I appreciate it.

LONGWELL: Thank you.

LEMON: We'll be right back.

LONGWELL: Bye-bye.

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[22:50:00]

LEMON: Well, the election is just 18 days away and you got to plan your vote. OK. Plan your vote. Plan your vote. And in some cases that also means that you have to protect your vote. A record number of people are choosing mail-in ballot due to the pandemic. But the New York Times is reporting that some votes in Ohio and Pennsylvania are experiencing delays. The company responsible for printing these absentee ballots has been overwhelmed and it is owned by Trump supporter.

Joining me now, the New York Times politics reporter behind this story is Reid Epstein. Reid, I really appreciate you joining us, this is a very important story. So, thank you, thank you, thank you. What can you tell us about this ballot delays?

REID EPSTEIN, POLITICS REPORTER, NEW YORK TIMES: Well, Don, a lot of these counties in Ohio and Western Pennsylvania, voters who requested absentee ballots over the summer, they were supposed to be mailed out on October 6th. And here we are on October 16th and there are voters who I talked to as late as of this afternoon who still have not received their ballots that they requested.

LEMON: So, let's explain to our viewers the company was flying a Trump's flag outside their headquarters. They're in the business of distributing absentee ballots. Is there any reasons to question why they were delays?

EPSTEIN: You know, the company says that it was overwhelmed by the volume of absentee ballot requests. It said that the counties in their estimates of how many they would need low ball the number that those -- that they actually needed. And essentially what they were saying was it no one could anticipated the high volume of requests which of course, everyone anticipated it and had been warning about throughout the summer and fall.

And so the result is you have a company that has not able to fulfill the promises that it made to these counties and you have tens of thousands of voters who are left waiting for absentee ballots that haven't arrive.

LEMON: So, real quickly, did they mention or explain the Trump's flag and did they understand how or what was going on with that?

[22:55:05]

EPSTEIN: No, the CEO of the company told me was that he and his brothers are Trump supporters. They were not shy about being Trump supporters. And they felt that they were making a personal choice by raising the Trump's flag at their building and not necessarily a corporate's decision. Of course, you know, it is fairly easy to see that. Not being the case given that the flag was at their corporate headquarters and not in their personal (inaudible).

LEMON: Not in their personal homes. Exactly. So, what is -- is there a contingency plan, quickly if you will, for the people who have not gotten their ballots?

EPSTEIN: Well, the people that haven't got their ballots, they can, they are continue to plan is to go vote in person and of course, requesting their ballots in the first place was at some level a means to avoid that. The 16th counties in Ohio that had contracted with this company, eight of them had pulled out their contracts just this week, and are either printing them on their own or finding some alternative means to print and distribute ballots to their citizens.

LEMON: All right. You got to be careful out there. And we'll continue to report on all of these things that are happening when it concerns your vote. Thank you, Reid, I appreciate it. You be well.

EPSTEIN: Night, Don.

LEMON: The president is heading to Michigan and Wisconsin tomorrow where Joe Biden is holding a significant lead in the polls with 18 days until the election. Stay with us.

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