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Don Lemon Tonight

Amy Coney Barrett Sworn In As Supreme Court Justice; Millions Of Ballots Already Cast Eight Days Before Election; Minnesota Reports Three COVID-19 Outbreaks Related To Trump Campaign Events In September; Biden And Harris Campaigning This Week In Key States; Stocks Tumble As Coronavirus Cases Surge Without Stimulus In Sight; Texas Sees Massive Early Voting Turnout And Skyrocketing Coronavirus Cases; U.S. Records More Daily COVID-19 Cases In Past Week Than Any Week Since Pandemic Began. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired October 26, 2020 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Eight days, eight whole days until Election Day. And we have late breaking news, Amy Coney Barrett is now the newest justice on the United States Supreme Court. She was confirmed by the Republican control Senate just tonight by voting 52 to 48. And sworn in by Justice Clarence Thomas during a ceremony on the side lawn of the White House.

And as we countdown to Election Day, both President Trump and Joe Biden on the ground campaigning in Pennsylvania, one of the most important battleground states where Biden is leading in the polls.

Let's discuss now, CNN White House correspondent John Harwood is here. And former White House communications Director, Anthony Scaramucci. Better known as, the Mooch. Good evening gentlemen, good to see both of you.

John, eight days left can you believe it? I mean, it is really just a week, right? President Trump has a crazy campaign schedule this week, multiple events a day. It's not too late for the president to turn this race around. But, time is running out. What are they saying at the White House?

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, they are scrambling and making the best of it, and saying that the polls are off and they've got a ground game that's going to work. But it is going to be very, very difficult for them. It is more likely, as we sit tonight that Joe Biden wins a landside that it is that Donald Trump wins as quicker of the kind of that he won in 2016.

If you look at the map, Joe Biden needs most -- first and foremost to hold all the Clinton states from 2016, and the polls indicate he is going to do that. And then, win the three Roosevelt states that Donald Trump narrowly won to squeak out that Electoral victory. Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania. And all three of those, he has got a lead of five points or more. And he is at, or above 50 percent in the polls.

Both of those are very significant and different from the situation that Hillary Clinton found herself in at the end of 2016, where she had a lead and it vanished at the end.

LEMON: But, John, you know, it ain't over until it's over. Back in 2016, exit polling from Wisconsin and Michigan, two states that propelled Trump to victory showed early deciders went for Clinton, and then late deciders went for Trump. But with you know, the unprecedented early voting this time around, are there enough undecideds left to make a difference for Trump?

HARWOOD: Probably not. And there are two elements to that, Don. One is the number of undecideds, and throughout this fall, unlike in 2016, it had a much narrower range of people who were saying that they were thinking about a third party or undecided. In 2016, that was 10 or 12 points through the campaign, and then at the end of the campaign when that shrunk down to about six points in the final third party vote.

That vote distributed to other people along with the undecided and it went to Donald Trump. This year there is much less of that, straight vote around for Donald Trump to pick up and make up the gap.

The second issue is, early voting versus Election Day voting. Democrats had place a big emphasis on mail-in voting and early voting and they banked a whole lot of votes. Republican are counting on in- person voting, and all the polls indicate that they are going to have advantage on Election Day.

However, this pandemic is peaking right as we get to an Election Day. So, they have got a serious downside risk of people deciding that it is too scary to show up on Election Day. Most of the Trump base will come out, but there is a risk for Republicans if the pandemic gets really bad in states that matter.

LEMON: Anthony, I want to bring you in because you were out on the campaign trail in Pennsylvania today. When you talk to people on the trail, what do they want to know? How are they feeling about this choice that they face now?

ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF COMMUNICATIONS, FOUNDER/ MANAGING PARTNER, SKY BRIDGE CAPITAL: It's a scary time, I mean, I just want to echo what John's saying, I think that you have to recognize that this is totally different than 2016. Remember I was on that campaign, I saw the energy, I saw the momentum. He does not have that, he has crowd sizes, they are smaller than the crowd sizes that he had before.

Let's just take Scranton, Wilkes-Barre where my parents are from. My dad grew up in Plains, Pennsylvania that is the third largest city. That would have gone to President Trump decidedly in 2016. Joe Biden is from that area. And so those people are mostly long Joe Biden. And so, Governor Randell I think is ultimately going to be right, he is going to win Pennsylvania.

And the president correctly said today, I think or yesterday that he has to win Pennsylvania. It is basically over if he does not win Pennsylvania. So, I will be spending a lot of time in Pennsylvania over the next seven days. Super happy about that. He is not going to win Philadelphia, as you guys know. It will be more of a struggle in Pittsburgh, and Joe Biden from Scranton, I think is really going to do a number on the president.

LEMON: I want to ask you this, Anthony, because John just mentioned coronavirus. Tonight, in Minnesota.

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Minnesota is reporting that their -- excuse me, three COVID-19 outbreaks related to Trump campaign event -- or Trump campaign events in September, what about the negative headlines Anthony? That Trump is getting for being reckless holding these mass rallies. Can they be costing him votes?

SCARAMUCCI: I think that they are costing him votes. I think it is either a turn off to people that voted for him in 2016, or it is energizing people that want him out of office. And again, I just want you to really think about this, I like Secretary Clinton personally, but she was the polarizing candidate in 2016. Mr. Trump's three and a half to four-year record of wrecking the economy, literally running a death cult, makes him the polarizing candidate in 2020. And this is the main reason why he is going to get trounced in about eight days.

LEMON: John, the White House is dealing with its second COVID-19 outbreak in a month. So, why are they hosting another spectacle? Hundreds of people there for Amy Coney Barrett on the south lawn? What gives here?

HARWOOD: Well, in general, to begin with, the White House is reckless on the coronavirus. They are trying to convey the impression that we have gotten over it. That things are fine. We heard from Mark Meadows over the weekend, we are not going to control the pandemic. They are not trying and they are not pretending to try. That's first.

Second, this is a rare piece of good news for President Trump. The Republican Party, and his base. Pretty much everything has gone wrong for the president in the campaign, largely because of his own behavior, but the opportunity to get a third Supreme Court justice is one that was very important to his party, to the conservative Christian community that he represents, and President Trump doesn't really care about the issues in front of the Supreme Court except his name would affect cases involving him.

Potentially liability or disclosure with his tax returns, or the election outcome. So, he does not care about the conservative agenda on the court, but, he does care about getting winds, and getting people in his base happy with him. They are happy with him tonight, he wanted to celebrate, and Amy Coney Barrett went along by participating.

LEMON: Yes. I will put up the schedule here Anthony, were you Biden and Harris heading to Georgia and Texas this week. going to -- what that tell you about their strategy that they are heading to traditionally red states so close to Election Day?

SCARAMUCCI: So, I love the strategy, there are people's suggesting that he should be sitting in Pennsylvania. But he's also signaling that he knows some of his internal polling that he is confident in Pennsylvania, and he wants to put the heat on the president in Georgia and Texas which will drain whatever is left with the president treasury there.

I think it is also important to point out here though, that is a pre- court nomination. It could be another tipping point for the president against him. I think people are furious on a Democratic side and very passionate about voting. You can see it by the long lines. You can see it by people willing to wait up to 10 and 11 hours to vote, Don.

And I think that's going to be another thing that backfires on him. People are going to look back analyze and say well, that got people on a Democratic base side really fired up relative to the Republicans.

LEMON: Thank you gentlemen, I appreciate it. John, good to see you outside as well. Wait, he is outside. Thank you. I appreciate it. See you both.

Also, before we go, I just want to bring in CNN economics commentator Catherine Rampell. Catherine hello, good to see you indoors, socially distancing and being safe. So, listen, let's talk about the DOW. Because there was some scary day at the DOW today. It closed down 650 points. Is Wall Street catching up to where Main Street has been for a while that help may not be coming in terms of aid to the economy?

CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: I think that's a big part of it. There are few reasons why markets have been spooked recently. One, of course, is that coronavirus cases here are on the rise. Another is that coronavirus cases in Europe, which has many countries that have handled the pandemic well competently. Those are on the rise too. Suggesting that there may be cold weather affects that make this pandemic spread more quickly and that could come to the United States as well.

Though, the fact that of course, there have been a lot of hope that stimulus talks were going to resolve themselves. A lot more aide will be coming, markets were buoyant on that expectation. Right now, it looks like Mitch McConnell has no intention of ever bringing this to the floor. He has already adjourned that in the Senate until after the election. And that will heavily way on the economy.

So, I think you see markets freaking out, which of course is bad if you have a 401(k). It's bad if you have investment in the stock market. But it is also probably bad for Donald Trump. Donald Trump's closing argument has been, hey, you know, things may not be going great, but look at your 401(k). And of course, when markets are crashing, that doesn't hold up so well for him.

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LEMON: Yes. I am not sure if I get the strategy of what Mitch McConnell is doing right now, because of people have an economic drain on them. And the leader, and the leader that they have in place is seen as causing that drain. I am not sure that that is such a smart strategy.

RAMPELL: Well, I mean, it could just be that he has written off Trump's chances of winning this election. I mean, I don't know how cynical to be about of all of this, but it is quite possible that he doesn't want to help the economy if he expects that a president Joe Biden will be coming in soon and inheriting an (inaudible) economy that has been drained of additional this will help.

But who knows, you know, there are now a lot of members of his party who don't like additional spending. So, maybe it is more ideological, but I suspect that a lot of it is motivated by, you know, a desire potentially to undermine Trump's successor.

LEMON: Maybe you are right, the priority was getting their justice as well. And we saw that comes to accommodation tonight.

RAMPELL: Absolutely.

LEMON: Thank you Catherine, I appreciate it. Amy Coney Barrett could have a huge impact of cases coming before the Supreme Court, but this is not really going to help the new justice with her efforts to be seen as impartial. House judiciary committee Republicans with this gloating tweet tonight, Amy Coney Barrett confirmed, happy birthday Hillary Clinton. And despite their hypocrisy over the handling of this vacancy, tonight Republican Senators got their way and gave themselves, and their new justice a round of applause.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On this vote, the ayes are 52, the nays are 48, the nominations of Amy Coney Barrett of Indiana to be an associate justice of the Supreme Court of United States, is confirmed.

(APPLAUSE)

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LEMON: Amy Coney Barrett officially sworn as a Supreme Court justice cementing a 6-2 -- 6-3 excuse me, conservative majority and marking a third of the court appointed by President Trump. Her confirmation coming at a time when the stakes could not be higher.

The Supreme Court ruling just a short time ago against extending the deadline to count mail-in ballots in the swing state of Wisconsin and many more election related cases critical to Americans who want to protect their vote are on the horizon now.

And Barrett's first week, the court will look at election petitions in Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Minnesota as well as cases on Trump's taxes and on abortion. As if all that weren't important enough, remember that the court will begin considering the future of Obamacare on November 10th.

Let's discuss now. The person who knows all about this, can answers some questions as CNN senior legal analyst and that is Laura Coates who joins us now. Laura, thank you so much. So Barrett's swearing in was another big gathering at the White House during a surging pandemic. Give me your read on the whole scene and the fact that we didn't see Chief Justice Roberts there.

LAURA COATES, CNN INTERNATIONAL LEGAL ANALYST: I mean, we didn't see the chief justice that what was clearly really a politically motivated and had the air of partisanship at the actual event? Well, that is should not be shocking to people. But what was shocking I think you noted at the beginning of the hour of your first hour, was that you actually have an impeached president who has now appointed a third of the current Supreme Court and also that not a single mask was worn among the people who were highlighted in the actual event.

It does not bode well for having a role model type of example. What also made of this, Don, was the idea that look how quickly the Senate is able to work. We're talking about one person. And look how slowly they work when you're talking about an impact on tens of millions of people. People should forever remember this as what the absence of red tape can really do for efficiency in this government.

LEMON: It shows you what's really important to them. That was a very astute analysis there, Laura. Listen, so bear its impact on the court could be huge. There are so many issues to come before the court like tonight Supreme Court ruling in Wisconsin. Does she stand to change the outcome of these cases?

COATES: She certainly could and remember she went to great lengths in her confirmation hearing as every other Supreme Court confirmation hearing nominee has done, which is to say, they're not going to do and provide me hints so forecasts or predictions, paraphrasing the late Justice Ginsburg. But the idea that she could have an impact on a number of cases you outlined is quite clear, particularly in respect to two main ones, including Roe V. Wade, in its state, and of course the (inaudible).

Why? Not because we're picking them out of the sky but because she now only has written as a professor about these two areas of the law, but she's also offered some legal analysis on opinions on each as a member of the Southern Court of Appeals and she's alluded to wanting to -- to have more insight and more of an input particularly as it relates to Roe V. Wade.

And so, we're looking at these as really as sort of under the microscope of the types of cases that she certainly could impact. But I'll note, even at her actual speech tonight at his event which is not odd to have a swearing in ceremony in general. What's odd is to have all of the fanfare in the way that it was done at a place that was is way kind of a superspreader.

But she noted that she is -- it would be a dereliction of her duty if she were to follow her own preferences, her own policy preferences as a Senator might. And a dereliction of duty if she did so as a judge. So, I guess the jury is really out on this and I hope that her words will continue to guide as opposed to this being simply a perfunctory statement that one makes when they've already had a seat in the table.

[23:20:00]

LEMON: We talked about the decision in Wisconsin, but I want to talk about what's happening in Pennsylvania. So, Chief Justice Roberts last week voted with liberals upholding a state court ruling in Pennsylvania that extended the mail-in ballot deadline there. But he sided with the Conservatives over this Wisconsin case that we talked about a moment ago, which came from a lower federal court, what is his reasoning Laura?

COATES: Well, what's so odd about is, the last one didn't give us much info. Remember it was a four to four decision. Which means that they didn't offer any insight as to why they're leaning that way in Pennsylvania, literally because they were aware of a pandemic and the ideas of being able to have votes counted and tabulated even in spite of the delays of the postal service was predicted.

But now we have more reasoning here. And the reason they did it under Neil Gorsuch as who wrote the majority opinion is the idea that look, we don't want to be in the business of interfering with what's supposed to be the state legislature's prerogative, their purview, their wheel house, which is to run elections.

And the closer we get to the election, the more that we weigh in. The more our thumb goes on the scale. That's their thought. Now, Court Justice Kagan, had I think the more appropriate analysis in this and the dissent to say, look people by no fault of their own may not even get their ballots in time to turn them in by the deadline and so why not take that into account?

There are instances where we have to essentially weigh in. Even if we don't prefer do so at this time. This is probably one and it hauntingly reminds me of what the late Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Where we have to do. This reminds me of a time the delay Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg had to say back early for the primaries in places like Iowa and said look, we are making people choose between their health and the state of our democracy and their right to vote. And that's not a comfortable place for anyone to be in.

LEMON: Laura, thank you, I always appreciated it. I'll see you soon.

COATES: Thank you.

LEMON: So, the Trump campaign is circulating a video on social media claiming to show the former president -- Vice President, excuse me, Joe Biden confusing his opponent with former President George W. Bush. But facts first, OK? What the president supporters are telling you is that Biden was being interviewed by George Lopez. This is the full context.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to know like, if someone is undecided or maybe think about not voting, why should they vote, and why should they vote for you.

JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, 2020 U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, first of all the, the reason they should vote is that there's a lot on the ballots this year. I mean, this is the most consequential, not because I'm running, but because who I'm running against.

This is the most consequential election in a long, long, long time. And the character of the country in my view is literally on the ballot. What kind of country were going to be? Four more years of George, George, if we are going to find ourselves in the position where, if Trump gets elected, we're going to be in a different world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So the president's continued to push that misleading message at a campaign rally today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: But you know what he did yesterday? He called me, you know, he called me George yesterday. He didn't remember my name, I'm insulted by it. Was I supposed to be happy or was I supposed to be sad? He called me George? And then I hear the reporters sort of said, no, no, no it's not Georges, Donald.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So joining me now with more on the story is CNN reporter Donie O'Sullivan. Donnie, tell us more about how the Trump campaign has been spinning this moment.

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: Hi, Don, of course the irony here is that this all comes just a few days after Trump released his full 60 minutes interview on Facebook ahead of it broadcast it on CBS because he was afraid that CBS would misleadingly edit it. Look, you know, we often hear from the Trump campaign anytime they get fact- check or Facebook or Twitter sometimes put a label on their post if things or false.

The Trump campaign will say, well, let people make up their own mind. Let people see the video, or see the tape and let them make them up their own mind. But it's very hard for people to make up their own mind if they don't have access to all of the information. And we can show you, I think some of the places that the Trump campaign has been posting this clip today on YouTube, on Twitter, on Facebook.

The president's son of course has shared it and of course President Trump himself. But the clip they're posting is missing a very important piece of contexts, which is the first half of that interview. We show that full clip there, they cut out the bit where he is speaking to George Lopez. So they make it appear as though Biden has pulled the name George out of the blue, but actually he's having a conversation with a man named George.

Now one of the more incredible things about all of this of course, Don, is of course the Trump campaign is doing this, they're in the final few days of the campaign, they'll attempt to do anything I guess, but the social media platforms who have been talking for years about how they're going to tackle misinformation on their platforms aren't doing anything about this.

[23:25:07]

I asked YouTube, Facebook and Twitter tonight and this type of editing, this type of misleading editing about the candidates for president just days before the election is not against any of their rules despite getting millions of views online.

LEMON: Yes, and it should Laura (inaudible) say he was being interviewed by George Lopez, not interview. But any -- so we apologize for that. But listen, and I'm watching Fox News as well earlier today, Donie and they were saying the same thing and then watching Fox again tonight saying the same thing. And as I understand there may had been other media outlets who had to either retract or explained why they had aired the story, mistakenly aired the story earlier in the day.

O'SULLIVAN: That's right. I mean, that is what good news outlets do. If they make a mistake, they'll come back and correct it. They will say, you know, here is where we made a mistake. And we see aired this footage earlier this morning, and later came back to say, you know, we didn't mentioned George Lopez was actually the interviewer there. We should have told our audience about that. That is an important piece of information.

And Don, I've been traveling to Trump events at all across the country. I'm going to one tomorrow and these videos are having an impact. People see these videos and it plays into their beliefs, it plays into the narratives the Trump campaign are trying to push. And this is something the Trump campaign has been doing a lot, trying to attack Biden and Biden's fitness for office, as they would see as -- using either false, misleading or just totally fake videos.

I mean, a few weeks ago, a White House Dan Scavino (ph) posted a video that made it appear as though Biden was falling asleep in a TV interview. The TV interview never even happened.

LEMON: Yes. All right, well, thank you Donie. I appreciate that. Thank you, sir. Texas is surging in both early voting and coronavirus cases. How will it all play out on Election Day? Julian Castro, there he is. He is here next. Plus over 40,000 people hospitalized. The average number of new daily COVID cases in the U.S. It's now at its highest point of the pandemic.

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[23:30:00]

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LEMON: Eight days away from Election Day, and Texas is in play. Early voting in the Lone Star State absolutely exploding with get this: More than 7.3 million votes already cast, but as voter participation surges in that -- in the state, so are coronavirus cases.

Texas seeing daily case rates not reached since the summer -- not reached, I should say, since the summer, excuse me, and nearing California for the most COVID cases in the country.

ICUs in the state are packed, hitting full capacity in El Paso County, where the county judge has issued a curfew.

Those soaring coronavirus numbers could be unsettling for late -- later voters who will need to stand in long lines to cast their ballots in the state's most populous counties.

I want you to take a look at the numbers, these numbers right here, early voting in 2020 versus votes cast in those counties in 2016. Early vote numbers already catching up to the total votes cast in the last election, right? The total in the entire last election.

To break through, Joe Biden is going to be looking to drive up his numbers in Harris County, home to the city of Houston, Dallas County, and the Tarrant County, where the city of Fort Worth is located.

So let's talk about all this. A man who knows Texas, right? He knows all of these things. He is the former San Antonio mayor, Julian Castro. He also served as HUD's secretary under President Barack Obama.

I'm so glad you're on to talk about what's happening in Texas because if anybody knows, you do, Julian, so thank you for joining us. So, we have this huge --

JULIAN CASTRO, FORMER TEXAS MAYOR, FORMER SECRETARY OF HUD: Good to be with you.

LEMON: -- early voting numbers. But there could be a lot of excited Trump voters coming out to vote, as well. So, how do you see all these things unfolding there in -- in Texas?

CASTRO: Well, look, you know, as you know, Don, for years now, we have heard about Texas and its potential to turn blue, the fact that it was undergoing demographic changes.

I think two things are happening, those demographic changes that people have been writing about and talking about for 15 or 20 years, and then in Texas, like in most states, the Suburbs are abandoning Donald Trump and the Republicans.

There is also something else going on. The most compelling figure that I saw in the last few days about Texas turnout was yesterday, That Texas leads with the highest percentage of the overall vote that is by people 18 to 29, 24 and a half percent, which is surprising, but I think is in line with the huge numbers that we have seen out of Harris County, which is basically Houston and the suburbs, and some of the other counties that have big university populations.

If that is true, if that is accurate, then to me, those are not Trump voters, those very much are Biden-Harris voters, and this state is the biggest swing state of 2020.

LEMON: Wow! Wow! So, what then -- what is the impact, Julian, of the surge in coronavirus cases there, all happening at the same time?

CASTRO: Well, of course, there's the human impact. You know, the health care impact that we are is seeing in El Paso, with the number of infections, hospitalizations, deaths. And the political impact, I think, is exactly what Donald Trump and Mike Pence don't want.

They don't want people to be reminded that eight months later, we're still having to grapple like no other country in the world with this pandemic because this administration was not prepared because it called it a hoax, it dismissed it, they said we're turning the corner, and that was eight months ago.

[23:35:00]

CASTRO: And still, just yesterday, the chief of staff to the president said we're not going to get control of this pandemic, when clearly other countries have found a way to contain it to get control of it.

It reminds them of the weakest part of this administration's case for re-election, and I think that those two things are very much related, the fact that you have the highest number of cases or basically tied for California here in Texas, and you are seeing so many people turn out during this pandemic, even risking their health sometimes to go vote against Donald Trump and Mike Pence.

LEMON: You know, uh, one of the things that Democrats are concerned about, Julian, is whether -- whether President Trump is running stronger with Hispanic voters. Why does the president's message resonate with some Hispanic voters?

CASTRO: We know that the Hispanic community is not monolithic either in terms of country or original national origin or ideology. You know, it's not -- no surprise that here in Texas that you have seen the Hispanic community be a little bit more conservative than you might find in California, Colorado, Arizona, and other places.

But it's also true that these polls have consistently undercounted the percentage of Hispanics that supported the Democrat. That was true in 2016 with Hillary. I think that was true in 2018 with Beto O'Rourke against Ted Cruz. And I think it is going to be true in 2020.

I believe that the Hispanic community is among the folks who are coming out big in places like Harris County, which is a very Hispanic county. And that on Election Day, we are going to find out that, in fact, Joe Biden is running very strong with Hispanics.

LEMON: Mm-hmm. Thank you, Julian. I am looking at you. You haven't looked -- I haven't seen you as rested as you look now in the last two years --

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: -- so getting off the campaign trail. You are now back to yourself.

CASTRO: That's right. Having fun now. Having fun.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: It is good to see you. Thank you so much.

CASTRO: Take care.

LEMON: Thank you. My next guest says that he was wrong about the 2016 election. But even so, he is doubling down now. Fareed Zakaria is going to tell you why, and he is next.

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[23:40:00]

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LEMON: So Vice President Mike Pence is ahead of the coronavirus -- the White House Coronavirus Task Force, flouting public health guidelines, still campaigning after being exposed to people who have tested positive for the coronavirus, at least five people in his inner circle, including his chief of staff, testing positive.

This coming after an earlier outbreak at the White House and infecting not just President Trump but more than a dozen other staffers, the Rose Garden ceremony for Amy Coney Barrett at the center of all that, of that spread.

And tonight, President Trump is hosting another large gathering for the new Supreme Court justice. Those White House cases are among the 8.7 million cases in the U.S., the most in the world. This country is also leading the globe in total of deaths at more than a quarter of a million.

Let's discuss now. Fareed Zakaria, the host of "Fareed Zakaria GPS" and more importantly, he is the author of the new book, "Ten Lessons for a Post-Pandemic World." Fareed Zakaria, thank you for joining. I appreciate it.

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST: Always a pleasure, Don.

LEMON: Let's talk about the vice president going ahead with his campaign, despite staffers testing positive, the White House hosting another gathering tonight. What does it tell you about how the Trump administration sees this -- this pandemic?

ZAKARIA: Well, it is the most vivid symbol of the complete collapse of a strategy to deal with the pandemic. There is no other country, any -- no other advanced country that is holding these kinds of events, whether they would be the swearing-in ceremony or the announcement ceremony, the super spreader event in the Rose Garden or these campaign events.

Notice, Angela Merkel is not doing this. Even Boris Johnson is not doing this. Emmanuel Macron is not doing this, the Japanese prime minister. This is a uniquely American thing.

And I think this is one of the points I wanted to get across in my book, which is that we have handled this almost uniquely poorly. You got -- you pointed out our death rate, 225,000.

LEMON: Mm-hmm.

ZAKARIA: Germany, another big, advanced, industrial country has 10,000 deaths. In other words, it is 1/20 of our number. And the point is, as Mark Meadows says, they have lost control of it. They have lost control of it for the country. They have lost control of it for the White House.

You know, the secret service is meant to protect the president and the vice president. They have not been able to protect them from a disease that has a 1 in 10 chance of killing them.

LEMON: Mm-hmm. Wow! I want to talk about your column. My, gosh, Fareed, is there any can you do one more thing in your life?

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: You got the book, you got the column, and you got your TV show. So in your latest --

ZAKARIA: I'm an immigrant. I got to work hard.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: So, listen. Let's talk about your column. You say that you were wrong that Trump would lose in 2016, but you're doubling down in 2020.

[23:45:00]

LEMON: So, what makes you so sure about that?

ZAKARIA: Look, honestly, I'm not sure, but I think we -- as somebody who has been a commentator for years and years, I feel like I owe it to my viewers, my readers, to be honest with them and level as to what I think is happening.

And I have a sort of alternate history of the last four years. I think the truth is a majority of Americans have never approved of Donald Trump. He has the lowest approval ratings of any president since we started counting. And we started counting in the 1940s.

So, this guy is off the charts in terms of his unpopularity. He got lucky in 2016 because he ran against a -- the second most unpopular candidate in American history, in modern American history, Hillary Clinton, rightly or wrongly, that is what the numbers show you, and because of the Electoral College in three states, he won.

I don't think it's going to happen again for all the reasons you are discussing. But the most important part, Don, is, you know, I don't want -- I want to believe in the America that I came to as a kid, as a scholarship student. I want to believe in the America that has welcomed me my whole life.

I want to believe in the America that has tried to understand what went wrong with things like slavery and segregation and write them and talk about them. That is the America I know. I want to believe in it. So, you know what, I may be wrong, but I think that you got to go with, you know, what is in your heart.

LEMON: I had that conversation this week with a couple people and we were saying, you know, we're almost there, we're past this whole thing, and I said, are we really? Are we? I am like you. I hope that we are. And when I see people out there in line, I mean, it is just the demographics of the people who are voting and people dancing.

I want to think that we are, but one -- listen. One never knows. I call 2016 -- I called it an electoral fluke. I am not sure what you called it. But I thought it was an electoral fluke where, you know, there was just some weirdness that happened in the universe and all things came together for this president.

But this lensed itself to your book. It is called "Ten Lessons for a Post-Pandemic World." In one of those ten lessons from this pandemic is that it is a quality of government that matters, the quality of government that matters, not the quantity.

And you say there is ample evidence that American government has been failing for a generation. Why have we fallen so behind, Fareed?

ZAKARIA: Ever since Ronald Reagan became a new conventional wisdom, which was that the government can't do anything right. The federal government is the problem. The nine most scary words in the English language, Ronald Reagan said, I am from the government and I am here to help.

(LAUGHTER)

ZAKARIA: Steve Bannon comes in and he says the goal of the Trump revolution is to deconstruct the administrative state. So for 40 years, you have been defunding, delegitimizing, and demeaning government. Never mind that this is the same federal government that electrified America, that built the interstate highway system, that desegregated the schools, forced for housing policies upon neighborhoods.

You know, we forget all the amazing things the government does and we focus on a bridge to nowhere, here or there. The result is when you have a pandemic and if you have been busy at work trying to destroy the federal government for 40 years and the Republicans have been in charge for a lot of it, guess what, it's not going to function very well.

And the places that have done well, in East Asia, they fund their governments, they respect them, the social trust in them, and as a result, when there is an emergency, those governments function.

LEMON: Fareed, thank you so much. I have the book. It is fabulous. Thank you. The book is called "Ten Lessons for a Post-Pandemic World" by Fareed Zakaria. Thank you, Fareed. We will be right back.

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[23:50:00]

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LEMON: With just eight days to go until Election Day, coronavirus cases are surging across the country. Take a look at our trend map. Not a single state is green. The best we can say about the situation is that 13 states are holding steady. Thirty-one states are increasing while six have seen a 50 percent increase from where they were last week.

And after two-straight days of 80,000 new cases on Friday and Saturday, the seven-day average of new cases in the United States is at its highest since the pandemic began.

CNN's Erica Hill reports now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR AND NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): More Americans hospitalized, more new infections, more lives lost. The average number of new cases in the U.S. is now nearly 69,000 a day.

WILLIAM HASELTINE, FORMER HARVARD MEDICAL SCHOOL PROFESSOR: We are looking forward to a number of record weeks in the very near future. It will drive this daily rate above 100,000.

HILL (voice-over): Thirty-seven are reporting an increase in new cases over the past week. Twenty-one is posting their highest, seven-day averages to date.

South Dakota's positivity rate for tests returned on Monday, 23 percent.

ASHISH JHA, DEAN, BROWN UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Literally, we've never given up on a virus like this before.

HILL (voice-over): With no national plan, experts are working overtime to fill the void.

ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: If people are not wearing masks, then maybe we should be mandating it.

HILL (voice-over): Former FDA Commissioner Dr. Scott Gottlieb pushing for a temporary nationwide mandate in a new op-ed, noting states should be able to choose how to enforce a mandate, but the goal should be to make masks a social and cultural norm, not a political statement.

[23:54:58]

LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: We actually have a narrow window of opportunity right now to stop the explosive spread that is coming.

HILL (voice-over): Pennsylvania's secretary of health urging residents to limit all holiday gatherings.

RACHEL LEVINE, PENNSYLVANIA SECRETARY OF HEALTH: We need to think about more and more gatherings being virtual or only staying with -- with your family that you -- that you live with.

HILL (voice-over): Four confirmed cases at this Arizona middle school, prompting two-week quarantine for hundreds of students and staff.

Chicago is adding a new curfew as numbers there rise.

Illinois's director of public health breaking down over the weekend.

NGOZI EZIKE, DIRECTOR, ILLINOIS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC HEALTH: We are reporting 3,874 new cases, for a total of 364,033 confirmed cases since the start of this pandemic. Excuse me, please.

HILL (voice-over): The Utah Hospital Association warning it may soon need to ration care.

TOM INGLESBY, DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR HEALTH SECURITY, JOHNS HOPKINS UNIVERSITY: That would affect not just people who have COVID but people who need to go to the ICU for other medical purposes.

HILL (voice-over): El Paso, Texas adding a two-week curfew as hospitals and ICUs reach capacity.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've had significant spike to the point that our hospital capacity is really tapped. We're probably at the end of our rope there.

HILL (voice-over): The convention center being converted to a hospital to help manage the surge, which shows no sign of slowing.

FAUCI: It's kind of semantics. You want to call it the third wave or an extended first wave. No matter how you look at it, it's not good news.

HILL (voice-over): Erica Hill, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Erica, thank you so much. And thank you, everyone, for watching. Our coverage continues.

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