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Don Lemon Tonight
Joe Biden Pick Former Rivals To His Cabinet; Trump Upset With Mitch McConnell's Acknowledgment Of Joe Biden; Chris Christie's Best Life Lessons; People Waiting For Presidential Pardon; President Trump Leaving A Footprint Of Anger; COVID-19 Affects People Of Color. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired December 16, 2020 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[22:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: Thank you, my brothers and sisters. It's time for the big show. "CNN TONIGHT" with the big star, D. Lemon.
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: the big show. Right about that. Hey, I like your honorable thing earlier. You know what, I thought it was great. You know what I thought about? Nobody's moaning about being called the honorable or honorable, but they are all, you know, saying that Joe Biden should not be called that. She needs to get rid of that doctor title when they are lobbying called honorable. Nobody said that. So, so much -- so much hypocrisy going around.
CUOMO: Sometimes they don't even know it. They don't know that they are just pissed that it's a woman, you know?
LEMON: Nobody said we shouldn't call Dr. King, Dr. King anymore? I mean, you know, they are not mad about that, are they?
CUOMO: I don't even think it's mad. I just -- I just think that it's become so reductive. Opposition and politics has become such currency. I mean, this stuff I learned today, I almost cried on the show tonight.
LEMON: Why?
CUOMO: Because I am --
LEMON: You were channeling me?
CUOMO: -- I actually believe that part of the nonchalant, forget the masks, forget your, come on, come to the rally, come on, let's come together, we got to live, I think it was this herd immunity thing. I think that they were trying to get people sick.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: Now, I know all the fringe righties are going to say that I am accusing somebody of homicide. That's not what I mean. I am saying their policy at the end of the day was it doesn't matter if people get sick. We'll work our way through it. That's what herd immunity is. And time matters more than the toll because if we get through it faster, the economy will recover sooner, life will be better sooner, so let them die, if they die, it is what it is.
LEMON: You are not wrong. There's -- let them comfort you because that's exactly. And I'm going to talk about it in a couple of minutes here.
CUOMO: It hurts me.
LEMON: The quote says, we want them infected. What does that mean? that means you are trying to get people sick.
CUOMO: It explains why you would say something that seemed irrational --
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: -- which don't worry about the masks.
LEMON: I got to tell you --
CUOMO: Don't worry about the separation. It never made sense. It does if you want people to get sick.
LEMON: Do you remember we had this conversation not that long ago, and I said, you know, some of my friends who are in red states, and we were talking specifically about the virus, right, and I said I just, I can't talk to them. I have to get rid of them because they weren't making sense, right?
One of my very dear friends started talking about herd immunity. And I kept telling him that's not how herd immunity works. Herd immunity works with a vaccine. You don't just send people out to get sick and die in droves.
CUOMO: You can, but that's what happens.
LEMON: People die in droves.
CUOMO: Yes, that's what happens.
LEMON: So, I'm with you. I don't -- I don't really understand it. But I am, I'm going to pull a Chris Cuomo on this and I'm going to be a glass, a glass half full and I am going to hope that we can come back to reality. I -- I don't -- I'm hopeful. Let's put it that way, that we can get people to actually start believing in science again, to believe in doctors and the scientists and to become honorable again. How does that sound to you?
CUOMO: It sounds great because they are acting with no honor.
LEMON: No.
CUOMO: That guy, that Senator Ron Johnson, I'll give you half my show to come on and you make me a case that that hearing was worthwhile and the basis of what it brought forward for people. I'll give you half the show, senator, because you are just going to smile your way through and say, I don't know what's wrong with it. You know --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: That was a grievance hearing.
CUOMO: You know what's wrong.
LEMON: That was -- he wanted to, you know, I can't believe you did this.
CUOMO: Yes.
LEMON: It's like not even worth watching. I didn't even watch it. It's ridiculous. You know what it was.
CUOMO: DeMello (Ph), give me it. Come on the show. I'd love to have the conversation.
LEMON: Yes. You know we feel differently about that. You like to challenge them. I don't like to give them the air time.
CUOMO: I think you've got to expose it. Because if anybody has got a chance of being open --
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: -- when you see the flagrancy, you know, even someone a genious like Ted Cruz, I guarantee you they'll never talk about it again after the election, he is a liar and he knew it.
LEMON: You said genius.
CUOMO: He is. I mean, the guy has a crazy pedigree. Dershowitz says he is one of the smartest guys he taught at Harvard Law.
LEMON: OK.
CUOMO: I'm just saying there.
LEMON: There is a thin line. That's the song goes between love and hate.
CUOMO: Yes, I know what it is. Thanks.
LEMON: There is a thin line between that and crazy. Thank you, Chris. I shall see you soon.
CUOMO: I love you, D. Lemon. That I know.
LEMON: More than you know.
CUOMO: You are -- you are honorable.
[00:04:58] LEMON: More than you know. Hey, listen, I got to tell you, be careful out there. The weather is bad in New York. We are in the middle of a nor'easter. So, on your way home, wherever you are going, wherever you are about to do, be safe.
CUOMO: I am going to push cars out of snowdrifts.
LEMON: Yes, all right. Go help some folks.
This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.
We've got some breaking tonight. And I hate to, I've to tell you this can get it out of the way and then I'll tell you. The news is terrible. OK? Just being honest. It is the deadliest day of the pandemic so far with more than 3,500 deaths reported today.
We also hit the highest number of new reported cases today. I don't have to tell you, you know, you're experiencing along with me that it's been a rough couple of weeks, rough couple of months. Really, it's been a rough year, OK?
But it's almost over. This is the part I'm trying to -- I'm trying to be hopeful and positive because we are getting there. America is moving ahead. We have a new president-elect. He is making history. While the current president is hunkered down in the White House plotting revenge, but no matter what he does, he cannot turn back the clock. Can't do it. He can't change the reality that Joe Biden is about to become the president. He is the president-elect now. He is going to take office in 35 days and he is forming his government.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Our cabinet doesn't just have one first or just two of these firsts, but eight precedent- busting appointments, and today a ninth, the first ever openly gay nominee to lead a cabinet department and one of the youngest cabinet members ever. The Biden/Harris cabinet will be an historic cabinet.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): Biden's former rival Pete Buttigieg saying this today about his history-making nomination.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE BUTTIGIEG, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY NOMINEE: I'm also mindful that the eyes of history are on this appointment knowing that this is the first time an American president has ever sent an openly LGBTQ cabinet to the Senate for confirmation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): And as, again, on the positive side, as America moves ahead, we are moving ahead, the current president wallowing in revenge in the final days of his administration. He is angry at anyone who doesn't stand by his dying cause, angry at Mitch McConnell, Mitch McConnell of all people, for admitting the reality that Joe Biden won, angry at Biden for winning, plotting revenge with demands for a special counsel to investigate his baseless allegations of voter fraud even though his own soon to be former attorney general said there is no there, there, and demanding another special counsel to investigate Joe Biden's son Hunter.
And if you are not a dead-ender like the Senate Republicans who held a hearing today to give oxygen to his utterly debunked election claims, prepare for an onslaught of mean tweets.
One Trump advisor telling CNN, quote, "he is throwing an f-ing tantrum." That's a quote. I didn't say it. That's what they said, throwing an f-ing tantrum about leaving the White House. What do you expect from a president who has never been able to accept reality, who calls everything he loses, even elections he won, rigged?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, it's a rigged election. Now I'm winning by a lot.
I'm afraid the election is going to be rigged. I have to be honest.
Watch the polls because this is part of the crooked system, it's part of the rigged system that I've been talking about since I entered the race. I understand it. It's a rigged system.
This is, as I've been saying, a rigged system.
This is a rigged -- this is a rigged system. This is a sick system from the inside.
We have a rigged system in this country and we have to change it. Terrible. Terrible.
They call it the rigged witch hunt. I think that really hurts our country and it really hurts our relationship with Russia.
I mean, what kind of a rigged deal is this?
It will be a rigged election or they will never come out with an outcome. They will have to do it again, and nobody wants that.
HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER UNITED STATES SECRETARY OF STATE: There was a time when he didn't get an Emmy for his TV program three years in a row and he started tweeting the Emmys were rigged against him.
TRUMP: Should have gotten it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): I know it hurts, doesn't it, when you look at that? It's embarrassing if you fell for it. If you fell for that, you are like, how did I fall for that? Look at that guy. It's pathetic, reeks of desperation. Everything is rigged. It's rigged. I was robbed. Come on. It's rigged. Now he is angry about losing a job that he isn't even doing. He is
surrounding himself with yes men and women at a very sad cabinet meeting. No one from the DOJ, no one from the Pentagon, no one from the State Department or CIA even showed up. Nope. It's over. Thirty- five days.
[22:10:05]
The only thing that seems to interest him is handing out pardons like some kind of Santa Claus, so many people lobbying for pardons. The White House has a spreadsheet just to keep track. And to the surprise of absolutely no one, officials say a preemptive pardon for Trump himself has not been ruled out. Even his Mar-a-Lago neighbors don't want him.
They don't want him. They say he is not allowed to live there. He can't live there permanently under an agreement that he made even when he converted the state to a private club. He did it himself.
And that on the eve of what could be emergency use authorization for a second vaccine, with shots going into arms across the country on the deadliest day of the pandemic so far, we are learning more tonight about just how callous his administration, this president has been about the lives of millions of Americans.
We talked about this, Chris and I. If you thought they were just negligent, incompetent, it's really worse. It's deliberate. Internal e-mails now revealing a former top Trump appointee repeatedly urging herd immunity to the CDC and HHS and encouraging more infections, saying this. And I quote, OK?
This is a quote. "Infants, kids, teens, young people, young adults, middle age with no conditions, et cetera, have zero to little risk. So, we use them to develop herd. We want them infected. We want them infected. We use them."
We use them. Hang on to that one. That happens a lot. It's happening now, as a matter of fact. Send me your money. I guess we could tell that by their actions, right? But if it's so shocking to see, it's really a shock still to see it in black and white. Now even though they said it, while at the same time denying it for months, listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT ATLAS, SENIOR FELLOW, HOOVER INSTITUTION: We like the fact that there is a lot of cases in low-risk populations because that's exactly how we are going to get herd immunity, population immunity.
The more immunity in the community, the better we can eradicate the threat of the virus, including the threat to people who are vulnerable. That's what herd immunity is.
TRUMP: Once you get to a certain number, you know, we use the word herd, right? Once you get to a certain number, it's going to go away.
ATLAS: I have never advised the president to push a herd immunity strategy. I have never told the task force that I advocated a herd immunity strategy.
TRUMP: You'll develop herd, like a herd mentality. It's going to be -- it's going to be herd developed and that's going to happen.
ATLAS: No one is advocating pursuing a herd immunity strategy. That has never been advocated to the president by me. He has never advocated that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): And these people, right? What else could you possibly expect from a president who said this?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: People were saying maybe we shouldn't do anything, just ride it. They say, ride it like a cowboy. Just ride it. Ride that sucker right through.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): You are going to miss that, right? This president and his administration didn't just stand by and watch. They advocated a policy that said we want them infected. Did you get what you wanted? Do you know that is a pandemic, right? This is a pandemic right now. That infections lead to deaths that you cannot control who lives and who dies when a deadly virus is on the loose.
Every real expert said herd immunity was a farce. Every real expert said they're real. Let me do that again. Every real expert said that there would be a second wave. But what do you need experts for when you've got the Trump administration?
Exactly, here is the proof, there is always a receipt for everything. Exactly six months ago tonight the vice president wrote this in a Wall Street Journal op-ed, and I quote, "the media has tried to scare the American people every step of the way and these grim predictions of a second wave are no different. The truth is whatever the media says our whole of America approach has been a success.
[22:14:57]
Really? Vice President Pence, chairman of the coronavirus task force. Why don't you take a closer look at your record of success. On the day the vice president wrote that six months ago, 23,693 daily cases were reported. Now we are seeing almost 10 times that number every day.
On that day six months ago, 119,881 Americans were dead from this virus. Tonight, more than 307,000 Americans are dead. Even for a White House full of liars, it's really hard to swallow that. Like I said, it's been a rough year. But it's almost over. There is hope. And I am not the only one who thinks that.
I want you to take a look at the Christmas card from the former president George W. Bush and former First Lady Laura bush, a painting by the former president of the Statue of Liberty. It's right on the front. Part of his art collection celebrating immigrants with a message, may the light of the holiday season shine bright in your heart now and throughout the New Year, a pointed message about a hopeful New Year from the former president.
And the current president can't turn back the clock no matter how hard he tries. He is a defeated president who is still fighting a battle he lost, but is he ever going to accept reality with his enablers putting on a show like today's Senate hearing over his bogus election fraud claims?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNKNOWN: I think we're past the point where we need to be having conversations about the outcome of this election.
I would appreciate more support from my own party, the Republican Party, to call this stuff out and end it.
[22:20:00]
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): A little more than one month left in office, and sources say President Trump is trying to weaponize the Justice Department. He wants two special counsels appointed, one to investigate Joe Biden's son Hunter Biden and another to look into the president's false claims of massive election fraud.
The outgoing Attorney General Bill Barr says there is no evidence of fraud. Trump said to be lashing out and throwing temper tantrums inside the White House.
So, I want to bring in Jim Messina, a former Obama campaign manager, and Stuart Stevens, the former chief strategist for the Romney presidential campaign.
Gentlemen, so good to see you. Thank you for joining. I hope that you are being safe. You are not part of the nor'easter, so you are both west so you're doing OK. But thank you. It's good to see both of you.
Jim, President-elect Biden, he is moving forward, adding to his cabinet. Congress trying to get the stimulus deal done. Trump has been on revenge, settling scores, but the clock is ticking, right?
JIM MESSINA, FORMER OBAMA CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Absolutely. If you look at the economic numbers and you look at all of the things that we have to do, it is unbelievable that you got a president who is spending all of his time sort of in this self-diatribe acting like a child, racing around the West Wing of the White House throwing a fit instead of digging in and figuring out how to move these negotiations forward on a stimulus packaging.
The reason why they are going to get to a deal tonight or tomorrow, Don, is because he stayed out of it. But it's pathetic. At the same time, you have a president-elect who is doing exactly what he promised, which is appointing a cabinet that kind of reflects America, that is moderate, that is mainstream, that is focused on science and actually getting together a government that can fix some of these problems that this guy has caused over four tumultuous years.
LEMON: You know, to you again, Joe Biden's vice president is really one of his top rivals now. Today he is officially named another top rival, Pete Buttigieg to his cabinet. This is going to be a very different type of presidency and it's going to happen in just a few weeks.
MESSINA: Yes, it's really true. You know, one of the first books --
(CROSSTALK)
STUART STEVENS, FORMER CHIEF STRATEGIST, ROMNEY PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: You know, look,
MESSINA: -- that Barack Obama --
LEMON: That's for Jim, Stuart. Give me a second, I'll get to you.
MESSINA: Yes, one of the first books that Barack Obama asked us to read in the White House was team of rivals, about a bunch of people from different political persuasions who all were working together to get something done. I think Biden has done exactly what he had to do, which is pick the best and the brightest.
So, it's OK that Pete Buttigieg was against him, it's OK that Kamala Harris was against him in the primary. He said what are the best people to do these jobs. And I think he is just building a cabinet that makes me so hopeful about the future.
You know, Governor Granholm, the former Michigan governor, is probably the most competent and one of the best people I've ever worked with in world politics. And the fact that she is in this cabinet just fills me with hope about what we can actually get done in the next four years.
LEMON: Go ahead, Stuart. I know you want to weigh in.
STEVENS: Look, I think probably if you took a general I.Q. test and everyone stood up the I.Q. of the cabinet, probably it went up like 30 or 40 points. This is a government that is competent and people who actually want the job because they want to do something.
You know, I've always been a believer that one of the great benefits of a civil society is not having to think about who is president and not really having to think about the government and Donald Trump has denied us all of that pleasure.
LEMON: Amen.
STEVENS: To just go about our lives. So, my hope is in three, four, five months every story isn't a Washington story. That the government is going to be running, it's going to be doing what it's going to do, you're going to have serious people and you're going to have serious problems that are being solved. It's just a night and day difference as to which party sees itself as
a governing party. Republicans are having these absurd hearings. When more people are dying every day than 9/11, it's just an absolute abdication of the oath of office, I think.
[22:25:08]
LEMON: It's a holiday season, and I know the man upstairs is very busy, but I hope he is listening to you, Stuart, because of what you said, it makes total sense. I think it's everybody's wish.
Stuart, how to deal with the soon to be former president that won't go away? I mean, he is attacking McConnell for acknowledging Biden's victories. He is griping about everything. That behavior isn't going to end.
STEVENS: No, look, Donald Trump is never really good about Donald Trump, he is never going to change. It's how, it's about other people, it's how you react to Donald Trump. If the Republican Party could even just have a shimmer of a backbone and stand up to him and say this is not who the party is, we are not going to listen to this.
But, I mean, look, you have 117 congressmen signing on this document which is really a political statement, not a legal brief, trying to overthrow a not very close election. It's really, it's really extraordinary what's happened here. The Republicans have just walked away from being a serious party.
LEMON: Jim, the former governor, Chris Christie, the former governor of New Jersey out with a new video urging Americans to wear a mask. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FMR. GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R-NJ): This message is for everyone. It's for all those people who refuse to wear a mask. You know, lying in isolation and ICU for seven days I thought about how wrong I was to remove my mask at the White House.
Today, I think about how wrong it is to let mask-wearing divide us, especially as we now know you are twice as likely to get COVID-19 if you don't wear a mask. Because if you don't do the right thing, we could all end up on the wrong side of history. Please wear a mask.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): So, I want to know where you stand on this. Listen, you know, he is always outspoken. This is coming out only after the Electoral College voted. Is this in some way imagery he had ever since he endorsed Trump back in 2016?
MESSINA: My God, of course it is. I feel the same way when I see this video as I did when I saw Mitch McConnell on the floor of the Senate congratulating Biden. It's like, where were you when this stuff mattered? Where were you when people were looking at you as a leader? Like, why are we still calling you a patriot, because you are not. Like, thank you for your death row conversion here.
But it doesn't do anyone any good because of your reckless behavior and the fact that you continue to support this president and told everyone it was OK not to wear a mask.
So, I'm just kind of sick of a bunch of these people who are looking for, you know, redemption and don't want the history books to write what the history books are going to write, which is they were in collaboration with this guy who tried to pull down our democracy.
LEMON: Stuart and Jim, I appreciate both of you joining us. Thank you so much. You guys be safe. I'll talk you to soon.
President Trump lashing out and refusing to accept reality as the door closes on his presidency. What could we see in the final weeks? His niece, Mary Trump, joins me next.
[22:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON (on camera): President Trump deep in denial about his election loss in the waning days of his presidency. Sources telling CNN he is out for payback over the Russia investigation, pushing for special counsels over Hunter Biden and his bogus election fraud claims. The White House is also inundated with pardon requests. One source saying it's turned crazy.
So, what is in store for the last few weeks of the Trump presidency?
Joining me now the person who knows him very well, and that is Mary Trump, his niece, and the author of "Too Much and Never Enough." Hi, Mary, good to see you. Thank you for coming on.
MARY TRUMP, PRESIDENT TRUMP'S NIECE: Hi, Don. Great to be here.
LEMON: So, we're less than five weeks until Biden's inauguration. I guess my question for you is, what do we look out for from your uncle between now and January 20th?
M. TRUMP: More of the same, but also, we should look for things to get worse as well because as you just mentioned, he is spending all of his time looking to settle grudges. He is looking to continue to undermine the incoming administration, and he is looking to use the power of the Department of Justice in order to hurt President Biden with these ridiculous and incendiary special counsel requests.
But, I mean, I say, as far as that goes, fine, then let's have a special counsel look into my adult cousin's potentially criminal behavior. Let's have a special counsel look into the fraud that Donald Trump committed during this election.
So, you know, he is going to do what he is going to do as far as that goes. I think we also need to pay attention though to what he isn't doing. Three thousand people are dying every day. The Russians are hacking into our system in a far-reaching and extraordinarily dangerous way. What is he doing about it? Absolutely nothing.
LEMON: But don't you think, I mean, when you think about people who exhibit that type of behavior, the closer it gets to the time when he realizes that, you know, once I get on Marine One or however he leaves, I am not sure if he is going to leave, they may have to yank him out of there --
M. TRUMP: Yes.
LEMON: -- the he realize that his relevancy is going to diminish like just immediately.
M. TRUMP: Yes.
LEMON: And for him that must be frightening, that he is no longer relevant, the media so no longer going to cover him. Don't you think he is going to get more outrageous as it gets to that deadline?
[22:35:00]
M. TRUMP: For sure. There is no doubt about it. But while he is being outrageous, you know, Americans are still continuing to die because he is doing nothing and Russia is still gaining access to incredibly sensitive information.
But as I have said, he need -- we need to be prepared for anything --
LEMON: Yes.
M. TRUMP: -- because he is a very desperate man. And it's interesting that you point to his fear of irrelevance. That's down to the media. Like any other outgoing administration as of January 21st, he should no longer be the center of attention.
But the other thing that he's also desperate about is all of the potential, the potential lawsuits he is looking at, the potential state-level charges he is looking at and the potential financial situation that he may find himself in when his hundreds of millions of dollars of debt start to get called in.
So, we need to understand that he is going to do anything he can to change the subject and he's going to do anything he can to cling to the power of the Oval Office, which right now is the only thing protecting him --
LEMON: That's it.
M. TRUMP: -- from criminal charges.
LEMON: Yes. And that makes him feel safe. That's what I'll say about that. So, I want to ask about potential pardons. They could be going to family members, close allies, even the president himself. For him it's not about whether someone was wrongly convicted or if a pardon is justified in any way. It's about the power he holds to give these out.
M. TRUMP: Yes, absolutely. I think there are different categories. Some of it is just pardons to drive the rest of us crazy and demoralize us. Now you know, the Flynn pardon is a good example of that. But you're right. It's also a tool to protect him from people, you know, giving evidence against him potentially.
So, we need to realize that he is going to try anything. He'll try to -- he will definitely try to pardon his children. He will try to pardon himself. And he is going to, in cases like that, be giving blanket pardons. So, we're not even going to know exactly what it is he is pardoning people for, which, in my view, is a red flag.
LEMON: Mary, it's always a pleasure. Be safe and have a happy holiday. Happy holiday season. I'll see you soon. Be safe.
M. TRUMP: All right. Thanks so much, Don. Take care.
LEMON: Thank you. A scary time in this country. More than 3,500 coronavirus deaths reported just today. The virus while it's really hurting communities of color, especially Black Americans.
NBA Hall of Famer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar joins me to talk about the color of COVID and why it's so important to get vaccinated.
[22:40:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON (on camera): So here is the breaking news, everyone, the U.S. seeing its deadliest day of the pandemic so far, over 3,500 deaths. The country also reporting the most cases in a single day, more than had 242,000. And for the 11th day in a row, record levels of hospitalizations.
But there is some promising news. The CDC says more than 2.9 million Pfizer COVID vaccines have already been allocated across the country. And another vaccine is on the way. Dr. Anthony Fauci says Moderna's COVID-19 vaccine could receive emergency use authorization as early as tomorrow.
Operation Warp Speed says 20 million doses of that vaccine will be delivered by the end of the month. Vice President Mike Pence announcing plans to get the coronavirus vaccine on camera and it will happen on Friday, he says. President-elect Joe Biden though, planning to get his shot for all to see early next week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: I don't want to get ahead of the line, but I want to make sure that we demonstrate to the American people that it is safe to take. I'll be -- they are working on that plan right now, and when I do it, I will do it publicly so you all can actually witness my getting it done.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): And joining me now, NBA hall of Famer Kareem Abdul- Jabbar. He wrote a very important piece for WebMD, black lives matter. Our lives are at risk, the healthcare system and everyday individuals have to do a better job to protect us.
Thank you so much. I appreciate you joining us. I know it's a very tough time for a lot of folks. So, I'm glad that you're here.
Americans are more likely, Black Americans are more likely to contract COVID because of pre-existing conditions, sir. You were very open about your own pre-existing conditions. What are they, and is this scary for you when you see, you know, the surge all over this country of COVID?
KAREEM ABDUL-JABBAR, NBA HALL OF FAMER: Well, good evening, Don. Thanks for having me on.
It's scary for everybody, but I think it's time for people to step forward. I have tried to work now with the UCLA health as their health ambassador because this is a very important issue for me. I have my own health issue. But in the Black community, health issues across the board are important, and often not discussed and no one talks on how to cope. So, I am glad UCLA is reaching out and I'm glad I can be a part of that.
LEMON: Yes, I want to talk to you about something that you wrote for WebMD. But let me ask you a couple of questions before that. Do you plan on getting vaccinated, sir?
ABDUL-JABBAR: I definitely am going to get vaccinated. I could ask my son were 20, which he feels is the best one. But, yes.
LEMON: Yes.
ABDUL-JABBAR: I'm definitely going to get vaccinated. People who don't want to follow the science and go with vaccination are being foolish and ignoring the best path to getting well and not having to be impacted by COVID-19.
[22:45:04]
LEMON: You say the healthcare system needs to do a better job for Black Americans. What do you think needs to happen right now in this crisis?
ABDUL-JABBAR: I think outreach is absolutely essential. Again, that's why I'm with UCLA health. But the fact that healthcare systems can reach out to minority communities and the black community and let them know that they care and that the vaccine is safe and effective, that's going to go a long way to overcoming maybe traditional suspicions that go back some ways in the black community because of irresponsible things that have happened to blacks in the past that were committed by medical professionals.
LEMON: You know, Kareem, you say that the pandemic has highlighted just how malignant the system is. This is what I want to talk to you about. Here's what you wrote. You said the problem with pulling any single thread, COVID-19, health risks, job opportunities, is that each thread is a single strand in the giant quilt that smothers the black community. One thread leads to another to another to another, each forming an interlinking pattern that seems impenetrable and unassailable.
Listen, quite honestly, you and I are privileged, but even so, there are mass inequities in the system. Can you explain that?
ABDUL-JABBAR: Absolutely. It we start at the beginning. Poor educational opportunities in the black community, which lead to blacks not getting access to good-paying jobs, both of which lead to blacks not being able to access adequate and effective healthcare.
In addition to that, being at the bottom of the totem pole economically means that blacks have to take more risky jobs. They have to use public transportation. All of these things contribute to an increase in morbidity. Blacks are not as healthy as other Americans and they die earlier for these reasons.
LEMON: And they are in jobs where they have to be in contact with a whole lot of people, and that's just --
ABDUL-JABBAR: The whole groups of people who aren't masked --
LEMON: Yes.
ABDUL-JABBAR: -- and who aren't practice -- doing safe practices when they are around other people.
LEMON: Yes. Right now, for a lot of Black Americans it's really all about survival, Kareem, surviving COVID, keeping a job, putting food on the table. What's your message to people who are struggling right now?
ABDUL-JABBAR: To have faith, to have an idea of what works. So, follow the science. Do what common sense tells you to do. That's absolutely essential. And do everything you can to get some assistance with regard to analyzing and treating any conditions that you might have.
LEMON: In in a Washington Post op- you write that you are excited that Joe Biden will be president and that he is prioritizing, taking on systemic racism. You also say that you remain cautious. Why? Why do you say that?
ABDUL-JABBAR: Well, you know, we've seen a lot of times where the talk sounds good and nothing gets done. You know, we've gone through that too many times. But I think especially the consciousness that the Black Lives Matter has caused in America and forced the conversation, I think that conversation is a good conversation, even though it's tough. We got to have it. We got to figure out solutions and the only way to do that is to communicate. So, I'm all for that.
LEMON: So, on that subject, I have to admire the shirt that you are wearing because I always say the same thing. I don't know how much you watch me or not, but make a friend that doesn't look like you and you might change the world. It is so true, Kareem.
ABDUL-JABBAR: It's something that I discuss with Bruce Lee. We were able to come to an agreement on a lot of things. Of course, he had to deal with the same difficulties, racism. He was an actor trying to just get by in showbusiness. But he had to deal with the same things that a Black American had to deal with.
LEMON: Yes.
ABDUL-JABBAR: Amazing, and yet not -- doesn't really surprise too many people.
LEMON: Yes. Thank you so much. I always appreciate having you on, and sharing your wisdom with our viewers. Thanks so much.
ABDUL-JABBAR: Well thanks for having me, Don. Stay healthy.
LEMON: Thank you. And listen, I have a programming note. Make sure you join me with Dr. Sanjay Gupta, Friday night, it's at 10 for a new town hall, the color of COVID, the vaccines. We're going to speak with Dr. Anthony Fauci and the surgeon general Jerome Adams about vaccine skepticism in communities of color and how to boost confidence. Friday night at 10 p.m.
GOP senators holding a sham hearing on what they call election irregularities. But let's call it what it really is. Complete lies. And it's all geared towards an audience of one.
[22:50:03]
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LEMON (on camera): So, take this. President -- some of President Trump's diehard Republican supporters in the Senate putting on a show today for the president, Fox News, and the base. The setting is a hearing of the Senate homeland security committee. Its chairman Wisconsin's Ron Johnson calling it an examination of so-called irregularities in the 2020 election.
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SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): But even though courts have handed down decisions and Electoral College has awarded Joe Biden 306 electoral votes, a large percentage of the American public does not believe the November results are legitimate.
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[22:55:01]
LEMON (on camera): Well, Senator Johnson is right about that. A lot of Republican voters don't believe the results of the election because people like Trump and Johnson and others keep repeating lies that there was massive fraud. There wasn't. Even Attorney General Bill Barr says there's no evidence of fraud and now he's out of a job. But the point of Johnson's hearing was to give a platform to Trump's old grievances.
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JOHNSON: There are many reasons for this high-level skepticism, it starts with today's climate of hyper partisanship, it was only exacerbated by the persistent efforts to delegitimize the results of the 2016 election. The corrupt investigation, the media coverage of the Russian collusion hoax reduce faith in our institutions.
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LEMON: Well like I said, playing in the audience of one. Trump was paying attention, tweeting that Johnson was doing an excellent job and Johnson had helped from two other big Trump supporters pushing more lies.
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SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): But the fraud happened, the election in many ways was stolen.
KEN STARR, FORMER U.S. SOLICITOR GENERAL: Some of these concerns are, how did dead people vote accepting that allegation from Nevada? It is because of an adequate safeguard. Something the dead person didn't walk into the ballot -- into the voting booth and vote.
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LEMON (on camera): Really? OK. Ken Starr was part of Trump's defense team during the impeachment trial, one Democratic Senator, Gary Peters of Michigan calling out today's hearing for what it was, a sham.
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SEN. GARY PETERS (D-MI): Whether intended or not, this hearing gives a platform to conspiracy theories and lies and it's a destructive exercise that has no place in the United States Senate.
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LEMON (on camera): They were mad about that. Meanwhile, you know what they didn't talk about today in that hearing? The massive attack on the United States by Russian hackers. The United States still has real enemies and foes and the more the leadership of the country focuses on fake conspiracies, the happier they are.
Joe Biden moving ahead with his cabinet announcements, as for President Trump, he is having what one adviser describes as a f-ing temper tantrum.
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