Return to Transcripts main page
Don Lemon Tonight
President Biden Condemns Hate Crime; Rep. Chip Roy Talks About Lynching and Complains About Cancel Culture; Asian-Americans Fear for Their Lives; Ammon Bundy's Group a Threat to Democracy. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired March 19, 2021 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[22:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: I'm late heading into CNN Tonight. You know what? I don't care, I am going on vacation and D. Lemon is not going to be able to find me.
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: I already know where you are going.
CUOMO: No.
LEMON: I have your full itinerary.
CUOMO: Please, you can't even spell itinerary.
LEMON: I'm going to tell everybody. Here's where you are going. Chris will be at the such, and such, and such on this day. I already know, Christina told me.
CUOMO: I gave her a story to feed you. We're a team.
LEMON: Man, what a week, right? Crazy.
CUOMO: Every week. Every week is something new as my Spanish friend always tells me, siempre algo. Always something. But yes, I am not doing a special on Monday night about how we're dealing with hate within minority communities because I will be on vacation. Spring break, I'll be doing it to try and get a little bit of the verb, the vim and vigor, and then I will be back.
LEMON: Well, we are going to miss you but there is always a lot of news to cover and we -- when you are gone and when you come back, the news will always be here.
But I got to tell you, everyone needs a break a little once in a while especially after you consider how -- how hard we have been working over the last couple of years. Because I actually thought maybe there would be a bit of a break after the election but then, you know, it was a fraud and we had to continue work there and there was an insurrection and we had to continue to work harder and we are still in the middle of a pandemic, and on and on. Listen, the news never stops, and we are here 24 hours a day. But I do
have to say, Chris, that I had been and don't let this go to your head. I am not talking about your TV show. I'm talking about your radio show -- radio show. I have been -- I've never been more interested on your radio show like sometimes --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: Than when you were on it?
LEMON: No, no, no. I'm not saying that. And not because I was on this week, but sometimes I just want to reach through the -- because I listen to it on my phone and I just want to --
CUOMO: Yes, I got your little hater raid that you sent me. I spoke to the audience about it.
LEMON: But even beyond that. We need to talk about some things. We need to have a -- we need to have a conversation. We need to have a --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: I'm ready. I'll give you the let's get after it hash tag. I'll eat you for lunch every day. You pick the topic I'm happy to do it.
LEMON: No, But I do enjoy going on there because we are even more candid there. And I don't know why, it's because of the cameras. I mean, look, we are pretty candid here. But sometimes the cameras can be a hinderance. Don't you -- don't you know? People in front of camera --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: I do. I also think it's a different time universe.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: You can take your time --
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: -- and you can talk about things and you get that instant feedback from callers. So, it's just a different dynamic and it's really nice to have both. But you know, you and I talk about this all the time in person and it matters just as much in public.
We have always been shocked that this resonates with people because we were so discouraged from doing it in the beginning. And because it is so natural for us to have the relationship we have.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: And on one level it's a little sad that there is such a unicorn nature to it for so many people. Like I can't believe how you guys get along even though it doesn't seem like you agree on everything.
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: And that's a rarity, whether it's color --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Or we don't really get along. I'm faking it.
CUOMO: -- tight perspective. It's weird.
LEMON: I'm faking it. Wait until I follow you on the radio, I got a surprise for you. You are going to get -- you are going to get it so I will be able to rebut everything you do.
CUOMO: Listen, I've always told you, I fear no competition especially the one that you are involved.
LEMON: I am having fun. Don't think that I'm getting a serious satellite radio show. I have enough jobs. I've got books. I've got --
(CROSSTALK)
CUOMO: I don't know that you can --
LEMON: Thank you, sir. Have a great night.
CUOMO: D. Lemon, I love you. And I got a great feedback about the segment --
LEMON: Yes.
CUOMO: -- because the book is the right message at the right time. If only you have a copy to show.
LEMON: Thank -- I don't have it with me.
CUOMO: What?
LEMON: I was late.
CUOMO: Be well. I am always a call away.
LEMON: It is resonating. I am very happy. And thank you so much. I love you. Have a great week off. I'll see you soon.
This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon.
So, if you are watching, are you, come on, people, are you watching? Stay it with me. Gather yourselves. It's the end of the week and you got to get ready for another one, right? But even though it's the end of the week there is still a lot to talk about because we are in a precarious time right now, whether we're going to move forward to a perfect union or are we going to backslide into hatred and bigotry and racism.
[22:05:09] It's going to get worse. Because we just can't sweep all of this any of it under the rug. We can't pretend anymore. We can't pretend that we don't see it, we can't pretend that we don't hear it. And I'm talking about the hate and the division in America right now. We need to take care of it. It's got -- we got to do it. No other choice.
In the wake of that shooting spree in around the Atlanta area that killed eight people, six of them Asian women, millions of Asian- Americans are terrified that they or the people they love will be the victims of the next explosion of violence.
I can't tell you how many friends or acquaintances, people I've heard from saying that they are afraid to go out and won't take the subway in New York City and won't go grocery shopping, they're ordering everything in.
It's a shame. This should not be happening. This is America, the greatest democracy on earth. Freedom. Liberty. Right? Isn't that what we're about? Finally, now we do have a President, Joe Biden who is condemning the hate in America. He's condemning this particular situation without explicitly saying it that it was a hate crime. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Whatever the motivation, we know this. Too many Asian-Americans have been walking up and down the streets and worrying, waking up each morning, the past year failing their safety and the safety of their loved ones are at stake. They've been attacked, blamed, scapegoated, and harassed. They've been verbally assaulted, and physically assaulted, killed.
Documented incidents against hate against Asian-Americans have seen a skyrocketing spike over the last year, let alone the ones that happened and never get reported. It's been a year of living in fears for their lives just to walk down the street.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So, the Vice President, Kamala Harris, the first female, first Black, first South Asian vice president, not naming names but saying Asian-American have been scapegoated ever since the start of the pandemic by people in power.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: For the last year we've had people in positions of incredible power scapegoating -- scapegoating Asian-Americans. People with the biggest pulpits spreading this kind of hate. Ultimately, this is about who we are as a nation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: We know who exactly who's she's talking about. Come on, you know. But you know the former president is gone, we know where the hate comes from. We know it's still festering, and we know what happens when hate is allowed to fester. We've seen Charlottesville.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROWD: You will not replace us! You will not replace us! Jews will not replace us!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: We have seen the capitol insurrection. We have seen it in the deaths of Ahmaud Arbery and Breonna Taylor and George Floyd that drew millions of Americans into the streets to protest just last summer. Ambassador Linda Thomas-Greenfield at the U.N. today calling for an end to white supremacy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LINDA THOMAS-GREENFIELD, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: This year the senseless killing of George Floyd, Breonna Taylor and so many other Black Americans sparked a reckoning of racial justice. A movement that spreads across the world. Black lives matter. And because black lives matter, we need to dismantle white supremacy at every turn.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: We know what bubbling under -- what's bubbling under the surface in America. We know what's just waiting to come out in the open. Maybe not, sometimes not even waiting, really. Right?
Like when congressman, a congressman starts talking about lynching and going on and on about Chinese communist in the middle of a hearing on discrimination and attacks on Asian-Americans. Now, Congressman Chip Roy says that of course, I mean, of course, he is. Right? He's a victim. He's a victim. He's a victim of, wait, you know, right? Wait for it, cancel culture.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. CHIP ROY (R-TX): I think the criticism is the left's spinning up cancel culture as they always do. I was very clear, crystal clear actually, and saying that I am for justice and I'm against policing speech.
[22:10:04]
That's what yesterday was about. And people are trying to turn this into some sort of cancel culture event. Hey, happy Easter. And that's nothing unusual in this town, that's what's happening.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Look, Congressman, you can say whatever you want. But if you say something that's bigoted or racist, you got to suffer the consequences. That's not cancel. That's actually -- it's actually -- it's actually how the first amendment works. That you can say something and people can find it offensive and then they can respond because if you don't allow them to respond, what does it mean? That you are trying to cancel them. See how that works?
But because you can't openly a bigot anymore, because people call you out on it when before you can just do it in your silo and no one would say anything and now people say enough is enough. And so, you feel entitled to be able to act in the way that you did before there were consequences. But now people have little tolerance, or very little tolerance of bigotry especially after the last administration and the last president promoted it.
See how it works? It's called logic. So, go on, continue to say bigoted stuff and people will call you out but that's not cancelling you. You are still a congressman, are you? You just don't want to be held accountable.
So, let me be crystal clear. OK? This is not about cancelled culture. I'm being cancelled. I'm being silenced. Chip Roy is United States' Congressman, he's done nothing but talk for two days. So, he's not being silenced, he's not being cancelled. He is the one two brought up lynching.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROY: We believe in justice. All right? There's an old saying in Texas about, you know, find all the rope in Texas and get a tall oak tree. You know, we take justice very seriously. And we ought to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: OK. So, lynching is not justice. Lynching is one of the most horrific crimes perpetrated against people of color in this country's history. It has nothing to do with justice. He is the one who brought up Chinese communists right smack in the middle of the hearing that was supposed to be about protecting Asian-Americans from hate crimes. he did it. Protecting Asian-Americans from hate crimes and discrimination.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROY: I'm not going to be ashamed to say that I oppose the Chicoms. I oppose the Chinese Communist Party. And when we say things like that and we are talking about that, we shouldn't be worried about having a committee of members of Congress policing our rhetoric.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So those are his words. OK? And we know words matter. fact first on this show. Studies show that hate against Asian-Americans rose as a result of the pandemic. The then the president calling it the China virus. Words matter.
So, I want you -- I just want you to listen again, OK, to this. It's from our former President George w. Bush. We talked last night how it's so rare for him to speak out that he is speaking out now. But here is what he says about the capitol insurrection.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I was sick to
my stomach and then to see our nation's Capitol being stormed by hostile forces. And it really disturbed me to the point where I did put out a statement.
UNKNOWN: Yes.
BUSH: I'm still disturbed when I think about it. It undermines the rule of law and, you know, the ability to express yourself in peaceful way is in the public square. This was an expression that was not peaceful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: That's really stunning. The former commander-in-chief calling the insurrectionists hostile forces. Those hostile forces defended by far too many in the GOP right now, the new Republican Party. Trump and QAnon base.
[22:14:57]
I have a legitimate question, OK? What -- what is wrong with the right? How? Why? Why would they spend their week while America was reeling from the brutal crime in Atlanta and Asian-Americans terrified? How do they do it? Why would they spend their week talking about being cancelled because some of them were saying and doing bigoted things, right?
How and why would they spend their week doing this? Fourteen House Republicans refusing to condemn a military coup in Myanmar. Think about that. They are the pro coup conference. Myanmar's military tried to justify seizing power by alleging widespread voter fraud during their November election. Voter fraud, huh?
Can you believe there are people in our government, people in this country who refused to condemn a coup? Well, maybe you can.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNKNOWN: Something with Biden is like, he's like puppet president. The military is in charge. It's going to be like Myanmar, what's happening in Myanmar, the military is doing their own investigation. In the right time they are going to be restoring the republic with Trump as president.
UNKNOWN: In different country --
UNKNOWN: What's going on in Myanmar right now. The government took over and they're doing reelection.
UNKNOWN: Would you like to see it happen?
UNKNOWN: Absolutely.
UNKNOWN: I would like to see it happen.
UNKNOWN: Really?
UNKNOWN: Yes.
UNKNOWN: You know why? Because the election was stolen from us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Why do they believe that? Why did they believe that? Wait, hang on. Why did they believe that? Because their elected officials, the president, number one, told them that over and over and over and over again. Now they're saying well, people don't have confidence in our election. Of course, they don't because you told them not to.
And now you are trying to do all -- implement all of these voter disenfranchisement laws, suppression laws all across the country because you want to have integrity in the election when this was the most secure election in American history.
You, lawmakers, are responsible for misleading those people. So, they said it. There it was that they were saying the big lie that they were repeating. The big lie that has infected the Republican Party. That's why 14 members of what -- once was the party of Lincoln can't even mange to condemn a military coup because the party and its base are still under the spell of a disgraced, twice impeached one-term president.
This is about truth. Or maybe I should I say this is about a lie? Because if people were acting on the truth, then there would be no need for an insurrection. While America is reckoning with the hate he left us with, that is what's going on. It's about a lie. Hate that's there right now. It's all in plain sight. Hate that poisons us and can erupt into violence anywhere at any time. What will President Biden do to stop it? That's the question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: Hate and violence often hide in plain sight. And it's often met with silence. That's been true throughout our history. But it has to change because our silence is complicity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[22:20:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: President Biden and Vice President Harris meeting in Atlanta today with Asian-American leaders three days after the shooting spree that killed eight people, six of them Asian women. The president condemning the increasing attack on Asian-Americans since the pandemic began last week, saying the country cannot be silent as hate crimes against Asian-Americans skyrocket.
I want to bring in now Georgia State Senator Michelle Au, who was part of the group that met with the president and the vice president. So, I'm so happy to have you here, and I'm so interested to hear what you talked about.
So, talk to me about your conversation -- Good evening, by the way, I'm getting ahead of myself. Talk to me about your conversation with President Biden and Vice President Harris. What did you say to them and are you satisfied with their response to you, Senator?
SEN. MICHELLE AU (D-GA): Thank you, Don, for having me, and thank you for asking about our conversation.
First of all, I want to frame the fact that it was incredibly meaningful to us to have both President Biden and Vice President Harris come to Atlanta and spend really, a significant amount of time on their very short visit with Asian-American leaders from the community speaking about these issues.
And I say it very significant because often what people in our community have felt not just in the past few months, not just in the past years, but really, over many years and many decades is that problems in our community tend to be overlooked, minimized, and that our voices are not heard and that people in our communities are not seen.
So, having the president come and specifically speak to us made a huge amount of impact in our communities.
LEMON: Talk to me, you said voices in your community overlooked, minimized, not heard and not seen. Tell me, why is that, what do you think that is?
AU: Well, I have a lot of theories as to why this is, but you know, obviously, race theory in America is very complicated. But there is this model minority niff that is very pervasive in American society that it has to do with Asian-Americans.
And I'm sure we've all heard this myth before. We all live inside this myth that Asian-Americans we are monolithic and that we are nearly uniformly successful in society, that we're all doctors and lawyers, and that we're high-income, and you know, what kind of problems could you guys have.
And oftentimes people will point to this myth, not point to actual Asian-Americans but to this myth, as a way to really drive a wedge between Asian communities and other communities that we live and work alongside. The Latinx communities, the Black communities, these kinds of things.
[22:24:59]
As a way to weaponize this myth against other communities and to further the excuse to, you know, to really practice racism against this society, is to saying look, this group is so successful. All you have to do is work hard to succeed in America.
So clearly, there is not racism, it's just a lack of will or a lack of hard work. This is clearly not true but that's how this myth is used and that's why people don't listen when Asian-Americans talk about their problems.
LEMON: You are talking about a divide and conquer strategy there, right?
So, CNN is learning that Biden acknowledged that former President Trump -- acknowledge the former president's role in the rise in hate against Asian-Americans. Talk to me about that.
AU: Yes. President Biden was very frank, I think, more so than we've heard on the campaign trail about the fact that the previous administration really not just failed to condemn racism against Asian- Americans but actually fomented behaviors and racism and violence against our people by using the very course and just blatantly racist language that we've heard in the past.
And not to amplify it, but you know, we have to look at what we're talking about calling the coronavirus the China virus, calling it kung-flu, you know, you know, and even his staff following his lead, saying even when President Trump himself condemns the coronavirus pointing to China and saying it's their fault that our president is sick. I mean, it's a really ridiculous framing of this problem.
LEMON: So, you mentioned it just a little bit earlier but I want to talk deeper about it because the day before the shooting spree, you spoke to your fellow state senators about the rise in anti-Asian violent and you had this message. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AU: The motto of the United States is E pluribus unum. It means out of many, one. Asian-Americans are part of our country's plurality. We are some of the many and we are part of that one. And all I'm asking right now as the first East Asian state Senator in Georgia is simply to fully consider us as part of your communities. Recognize that we need help, we need protection, and we need people in power to stand up with us against hate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: And then the next day, right, that happened. You are talking -- you are talking about the model minority and also just the Biden strategy, but you went a little bit deeper what you were saying there. And then the very next day --
AU: Yes. One doesn't want to be right about these types of things, but I want to note one thing. Is that a lot of people are looking at the talk I gave from the well of the Senate the day before the shootings and saying, wow, how do you feel about this prescient talk you gave the day before?
And what we need to realize is this is not prescience. I was not pointing to things that might happen in the future. I was pointing to things that have already happened in the past. Both in the past months, in the past year over the pandemic, but really over the past decade and centuries in the United States.
None of this that is happening is new, we just haven't been paying attention to it hard enough.
LEMON: Yes. Can I ask you a question? I know it deserves a much longer answer, but if you can succinctly tell me. I always believe that the first thing to do is to listen, right, in these situations. So, what would you like -- and then action is required? One must do the work. What would you like people to hear in this moment, Senator?
AU: What I would like people to do in this moment with this crime and with other crimes that are similar is to really start focusing less on the perpetrator of the violence, stop amplifying these voices of hate. Stop being so fascinated with his history and why did he do it, you know, all this sort of like lurid fascinations with the murderer.
And really consider the stories of the victims that he killed. Right? Because when we concentrate on the shooter and ignore the voices of those that he killed, we are perpetuating this phenomenon of his victims who were Asian women being invisible. And that has been a lot of the problem all along with our Asian community.
LEMON: Thank you very much, State Senator Au. I appreciate your time. We'll have you back. Be well.
AU: Thank you so much, Don. Have a good night.
LEMON: You, too.
Republican lawmakers making all kinds of head scratching comments from rejecting science to trying to rewrite history over the 2020 election? What's wrong with the right? I want you to listen to a top Republican adviser next.
[22:30:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: We're back now. Mark McKinnon is here. He is a former adviser to George W. Bush and John McCain and the executive producer of The Circus. Sir, good evening to you. Thanks for joining. We have a lot to talk about. Let's get right to it.
So, Mark, Rand Paul is calling Dr. Fauci a government worry wart. Kevin McCarthy is trying to rewrite history by saying that he never backed Trump's efforts to overturn the election. And Chip Roy is complaining the left is trying to cancel him after he brought up lynching at a hearing on Asian-American hate. What is going on with the GOP? It just seems to get worse.
MARK MCKINNON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Don, I feel like I'm witnessing the death of the modern Republican Party. I mean, it is a smoking husk of a shell of itself, it's a corpse that's just the last rights. I mean, they may win the next, you know, off-term congressional elections in 2022 but I don't think we're going to see Republicans win a majority, and presidency, maybe in my lifetime unless it's dramatic change.
The problem is that Donald Trump picked the scab of a sort of recessive racism and made it a dominant gene in the Republican Party. And the thing that strikes me about Chip Roy's comments this week, and Ron Johnson's as well, Don, which you talked a lot about, is that it's gone from being sort of an embarrassing reflex of, you know, sort of just behavior over the years to something that's intentional.
[22:34:59]
I mean, Ron Johnson, these people are not making these -- they're not sort of -- these are not accidental sort of like, you know, things that are slipping out. They are thoughtful and they are intentional.
And so, it's clear to me that these Republicans and Republicans that are dominating, certainly, you know, the power structure of the Republican Party now and the Trump wing of the party, are intentionally racist. Because it just become a racist party. And it's not even debatable.
LEMON: What does that mean? I mean, Intentional --
MCKINNON: Well, --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: -- intentionally racist.
MCKINNON: What it means is that the sort of things that Ron Johnson is saying that Chip Roy is saying is -- this is something that they thought about and said out loud. You know, it's almost something that you never say out loud much less to the media --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: You are saying this is a deliberate strategy?
MCKINNON: I think it's a deliberate strategy and here's why. I think that Donald Trump hit that weird hinge point in history where there were enough Americans that responded to his message about being afraid of the future, that other people, that the complexion of America is changing, and by complexion I mean literally the complexion of America is changing, and he scared the hell out of white people to say that, you know, your way of life is changing.
And that's just the way it's going to be. And we should adapt to it. I mean, that's what Joe Biden said and that's what Barack Obama said. But Trump said, no, we're not going to adapt. We're going to go back. And then he pulled inside straight and got enough white voters to elect him president.
And what's happening now is that the rest of the Republican Party thinks that they can pull the trick again. But they're in a -- they're in a demographic cul-de-sac now. You can't keep finding enough white voters by simply doubling down on racism. But they think they can.
LEMON: Yes. I've been saying all along, the demographics of the country are changing by 2040 or 2045 will be a minority majority country. And the demographics are just not on the side of the Republican Party at this point. They're going to have to do some changing or they're going to become extinct. Right now, they think they are in their glory. Right? That this is great. But time --
(CROSSTALK)
MCKINNON: Well, they think they can try and pull off the trick that Trump did again. And they're not going to be able to. And to your point, you know, back in 2012 there was the Republican autopsy. It was pretty clear then. And George Bush talked about it and Romney did about we got to expand this is or we're going to go extinct. And Trump, the Trump wing of the part is doing just the reverse.
LEMON: Thank you, sir. I always appreciate the look, the hat, the wardrobe, and the fire. Bringing the fire.
(CROSSTALK)
MCKINNON: Back in the hiding --
LEMON: The fireside chat. Thank you, Mark. I appreciate it. Have a great weekend.
So, Ammon Bundy is known for high-profile standoffs with law enforcement. Now he is drawing attention over his social media platform that can call out anti-government protests if you ask for one. OK? A CNN Tonight investigation just ahead.
Plus, a Trump wax figure gets taken off display after taking a beating.
[22:40:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Anger at coronavirus restrictions by state and local governments like mask wearing has prompted one man you probably already heard of to channel his energy into a new movement by harnessing social media.
Ammon Bundy is no stranger to confrontation with government authority. His group is called People's Rights. And it allows members to use the platform to drum up a protest. But experts warn there is a potential for violence.
Evan McMorris-Santoro has our CNN Tonight investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNKNOWN: He did not fail you.
(CROSSTALK)
UNKNOWN: We've been here.
EVAN MCMORRIS-SANTORO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This was the scene on Monday when Ammon Bundy and his followers were involved in a confrontation on government property. Bundy stood outside a Boise, Idaho courthouse refusing to wear a mask required to enter. Inside, a judge waved to start Bundy's trial on charges including trespassing stemming from another confrontation last year when Bundy refused to leave the Idaho Statehouse.
The judge on Monday ultimately cited Bundy for failure to appear and had him arrested. A week before the altercation in Boise, Bundy was on a tour of Utah to recruit supporters and rally new ones. A crowd he addressed at (Inaudible) in Xavier County was feeling itself for dark days ahead. Store food, buy generators, and keep your guns handy, they said here. Something bad could be coming soon.
JPY BINGHAM, BUNDY SUPPORTER: Well I think that our rights are being challenged in this great and wonderful land.
UNKNOWN: Ladies and gentlemen, Ammon Bundy!
(CROWD CHEERING)
MCMORRIS-SANTORO Bundy is at the center of a new movement.
BROOKE: BUNDY SUPPORTER: It's a bonus to be able to meet Mr. Ammon and to hear his information and his take.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: What do you like about him?
BROOKE: He is a rancher. And he is honest. And he keeps his word.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Bundy comes from a family whose name has become synonymous with armed confrontations with the government.
UNKNOWN: This is our land.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: In recent years members of his family have occupied federal lands in Oregon, and Nevada which led to high proposed and also law enforcement.
UNKNOWN: Back off, you're going to get --
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Both of those landed the Bundy's in federal court. In Oregon, Ammon and a brother were acquitted on firearms charges and conspiracy to impede federal workers. In Nevada, they and their father were accused of using armed force against law enforcement in a battle over cattle on federal land. The case ended in a mistrial.
Since the start of the pandemic Ammon Bundy has been working to organize people who were angry over restrictions.
AMMON BUNDY, FOUNDER, PEOPLE'S RIGHTS: Without a mask? Yes.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Last year, Bundy created a private social media platform for people who think pandemic rules and guidelines are part of a government plot. The idea is that members can drum up a protest with the click of a mouse.
(CROWD CHANTING) MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Bundy calls the group People's Rights.
BUNDY: This network was built to communicate with people, one, to educate them, or at least to gather to be educated and also to activate. And say, look, the governor doesn't have authority to do these things. We've never gave him that authority. And so, don't comply.
[22:45:06]
Let's get together. Let's have church. Let's meet. Let's -- let's exercise our rights in a way that we have the right to exercise them.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Confrontations, sometimes physical ones, have been a part of People's Rights protest all year. Bundy says his supporters are just exercising their constitutional rights, but he doesn't take violence off the table.
BUNDY: That has to be the very last thing. And there's plenty of ways to respond before that.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Experts say, in the wake of January 6th, People's Rights is a growing threat.
ERIC WARD, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR AND SENIOR FELLOW, SOUTHERN POVERTY LAW CENTER: The organization seems to be saying, we will participate in Democratic practice only as long as Democratic practice works out in our favor. When it doesn't to work in our favor, the organization seems to be suggesting we will then use arms, or the threat of arms to get our way.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Facebook removed a number of People's Rights pages last year after classifying the group as a militarized social movement. Bundy rails against, what he calls, big tech censorship.
BUNDY: They wiped Parler off of --.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Bundy and his supporters have been particularly active in the western states. In Idaho last year, in addition to storming the statehouse, Bundy and his supporters have confronted public health officials.
BUNDY: This is not your building.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Meetings have been shut down. Protesting outside homes is a Peoples Rights tactic.
BUNDY: Maybe you make schedules in your area that you are going to have 10 people there, you know, 24/7. They hate it when you do this.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: This woman, left her local board of health after an incident where demonstrators harassed her family.
UNKNOWN: My 12-year-old son is home by himself right now, and there are protesters banging on the door. OK? I'm going to go home. MCMORRIS-SANTORO: In Nevada, a man who said he was a member of the
group was arrested in February after he allegedly called for the deaths of two members of law enforcement on Facebook.
UNKNOWN: I can tell you --
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: In St. George Utah last December, a group including an area People's Rights leader challenge the mayor in person over mask mandates.
UNKNOWN: You should tell us what we need to take outside of wearing a mask to bed at night.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Chuck Goode is the chairman of the local Democratic Party.
CHUCK GOODE, CHAIRMAN, WASHINGTON COUNTY DEMOCRATIC PARTY: This uncomfortable feeling about the mask or doing vaccines is a very selfish kind of thing. They're not keeping out people's rights. They are putting themselves above the rights of other Americans.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Troy Anderson is an army veteran, an activist in St. George. He says the pandemic and anger over presidential politics, is fueling something out here that should not be ignored.
TROY ANDERSON, RESIDENT, ST. GEORGE, UTAH: People like Ammon Bundy, they are opportunists. You know, whether he is trying to gratify his ego, he is definitely playing on people's fear. And of course, that's the dangerous thing.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: So, would it surprise you then if the next one of these insurrections is, you know, building in the hills of southern Utah?
ANDERSON: It wouldn't surprise me because, unfortunately, this happens. There are those charismatic people that come along, and, at some point as a nation, people have to become more informed and look at things for themselves, and stop looking to one or two or a few people to have all the answers.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Bundy showed us a daily tracker of the People's Rights app that registered more than 51,000 members.
BUNDY: We are organizing in 37 states. We have 405 areas.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: The Southern Poverty Law Center which tracks extremist groups list People's Rights membership at around 20,000. But both Bundy and his critics agree. People's Rights is growing. Anti- government rhetoric plus misinformation on social media, plus online organizing can lead to violence. Experts fear Bundy is providing the tools that could harness the anger again like we saw on January 6th. And those who has faced People's Rights say everyone needs to pay attention.
GOODE: You should take them very seriously. They are playing with fire. You don't use military weapons and deceive people the way they are. This may not have a happy ending if we don't wake up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Evan McMorris-Santoro joins me now. Evan, incredible report. Thank you so much for bringing attention to this. My question though, is, and I have many but get this one in here. Let me just get this one in here. The end of the pandemic, is that going to put a dent in any of Bundy's efforts?
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Well, Don, that really is the most important question. Because there is no question that Bundy has used the pandemic to recruit people for this group. When you go out there into Utah like I did, everyone who was in his meeting just talking about restrictions and masks and things like that.
[22:49:59]
But as we see the pandemic coming to an end, I asked Bundy, look, this stuff is receding, does that mean that People's Rights retreats? And he says no, not at all. You know, he doesn't envision a imagine a world where the rights get given back and the things that he says.
But the reality is, the pandemic is a recruiting tactic for a guy who has been activist for a very long time. Now, add it in a new way, Don.
LEMON: I kept watching the whole time, I kept saying, why? Why do they think their rights are being restricted? I never could really get it. It just, it seemed like a faux controversy and a group that built on lies.
And it's fascinating. Thank you, Evan. I appreciate it.
Political passions are getting pretty heated these days. But do you have to take it out on the statues? Why the wax Donald Trump needed security. That's next.
[22:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: So, take this. A watch figure of President Donald Trump at a San Antonio museum moved to a storage room because patrons keep beating the thing up. Yes, a manager from Ripley Entertainment confirming to the San Antonio Express-News that visitors punched and scratched the figure, inflicting so much damage that management had it pulled from public view.
The wax figure seen here on display with Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong- un was at one point relocated to the lobby so that staff could keep a better eye on him but that didn't stop the attacks. So now he's in the back room with George Washington and others.
Trump won't likely be put back on the floor until a figure of President Biden is put on display and wax Biden might have to watch his back, too. Because the museum officials are saying this. That we've always had trouble with the presidential section. Because no matter what president it was, Bush, Obama or Trump, they've all had people beat them. Ears were torn off Obama six times. And then Bush's nose was punched in.
People, what are we doing here? I know politics can be frustrating. I totally get it, right? But please leave the watch presidents out of it. Violence is never OK. Not even on wax figures. Boy, those things are so creepy looking. Anyway. No ifs or buts. No violence. So, if you see a president you like or dislike in any form, take your selfie, move along. It's kind of weird to look at though.
OK. So, President Joe Biden condemning hate in America after the spa shootings in the Atlanta area that left eight people dead, six of them Asian women. The president says silence is complicity.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
