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Don Lemon Tonight

Ten Killed In Shooting At Supermarket In Boulder, Colorado Supermarket; Former Prosecutor On Capitol Attack Investigation: Trump May Be 'Culpable' For Insurrection; AstraZeneca Vaccine 100 Percent Effective Against Severe Disease; CDC Chief: Variants Could Spark Unavoidable Surge; Trump Lawyer Sidney Powell Argues 'Reasonable' People Wouldn't Believe Her Election Fraud Claims. Aired 12-1a ET

Aired March 23, 2021 - 00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[00:00:00]

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: And it certainly, sitting here listening to it, just really puts me on edge.

But I can only imagine what they could have been going through, at that moment. But when you heard that call for help go out, officers taking fire, returning fire, you had police officers, both at the local, state and federal level, all, responding to that location to provide necessary support to all those that are there and try to save lives.

So it's -- it's very surreal just listening to that audio. And particularly, for those of us who have responded, to those over the years of our careers, it's just a feeling and an intensity that you never lose.

But here, again, my heart and prayers goes out to -- to those who lost their lives. And also, the men and women who -- who responded to that scene there, in Colorado, the bravery and the courage that they showed tonight.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Cedric, let me ask you about the -- those who survived. And those -- the witnesses there. I -- I don't know if they would be interviewing them, this late. I know that they are, you know, trying to get as much as possible out of the suspect.

But what are officials going to ask witnesses?

And what will they learn from them?

ALEXANDER: You know, each witness is going to be different. There may be those, tonight, who may be in a much better place to respond to some of the questions. Colorado is, I think, Mountain time, if I am not mistaken.

LEMON: Mountain time.

ALEXANDER: Yes. They're not -- it's not late-late. For some, they may be able to answer questions. For others, what the officers will allow them to do is to go home and take some time for themselves and come back to be interviewed, at some other time.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: But, Cedric, doesn't it change over time?

Because we're -- you know, the more -- I have been doing this for a long time. And just the -- just the -- I think that the reason I asked you the question, earlier, about the videotape, is because eyewitnesses are often unreliable, especially, during a stressful situation. You know?

You know, everyone thinks, in a case, you got an eyewitness and it's a slam-dunk case. It's not necessarily slam-dunk because people's memory -- memories fail. They don't often remember exactly what happened, even when they were directly involved. I mean, that is an issue. It's -- it's -- people's memories are fallible.

ALEXANDER: Yes, and that's very true. And there is scientific research to support exactly what you're saying about eyewitness accounts because a variety of different people see things in a variety of different ways, particularly, if they are under stress.

But what you have here, in this type an investigation, if I say I observe something, Don and you say something else, we're looking for a consistency of what may be similar.

And in addition to that, we are able to utilize technology, now, in many ways, that kind of substantiates, supports our stories or negates our stories because that certainly can happen.

LEMON: OK. You stand by. Thank you, both, for helping me get through this. Stand by, we'll talk to you, both, as it warrants throughout this breaking news.

We are in the middle of breaking news, right here, on CNN. Investigators working to -- into the night, here, trying to figure out what happened in Boulder, Colorado, in that supermarket earlier today. That's where a mass shooting happened, killing 10 people, including a police officer.

That officer's name is Eric Talley, 51 years old, been with the department since 2010. The other victims have not, yet, been identified. Here's Boulder's police chief, tonight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF MARIS HEROLD, BOULDER POLICE DEPARTMENT: We know of 10 fatalities at the scene, including one of our Boulder PD officers by the name of Eric Talley, who's been on the Boulder Police Department since 2010.

He served in numerous roles, supporting the Boulder Police Department and the community of Boulder.

And I have to tell you, the heroic action of this officer, when he responded to this scene, at 14:30 hours, the Boulder Police Department began receiving phone calls of shots fired in the area and a phone call about a possible person, with a patrol rifle.

Officer Talley responded to the scene, was the first on the scene. And he was fatally shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: As I said earlier, you can just feel the weight of that police chief, how this is weighing on her.

And who wouldn't be affected by this?

But she did manage to hold it together, very stressful situation. A very sad situation. A suspect, who was injured, is, also, in custody, I need to tell you. There is no information, yet, on a possible motive. And we don't know, yet, whether the suspect had any connection to any of the victims.

[00:05:00]

LEMON: One witness, though, expressing disbelief at nearly losing his life.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RYAN BOROWSKI, EYEWITNESS: This feels like the safest spot in America. And I just nearly got killed for getting a -- a -- a -- a soda, you know?

And a bag of chips.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, that was Ryan Borowski on CNN immediately after he witnessed the Boulder shooting and he joins me now.

Ryan, thank you so much. Listen, I know this is a stressful time for you. I mean, it -- it's just unbelievable what you experienced and what you went through. How are you doing?

BOROWSKI: I keep telling people I've had better days. That I feel, just, a profound sense of luckiness. Sad that this happened in Boulder and sad that, you know, people died. And just, watching that report of the police officer who died. It's just heartbreaking. And I'm still processing.

LEMON: Listen. Everyone can relate to what you were doing. I mean, that -- listen. My thing is soda, chips and a candy bar. That's my comfort food, right?

And I don't -- and my trainer and my nutritionist would say I shouldn't eat it but I love to eat it and I'm going to do it and I go to the store and I buy it because I want it. But we are relieved that you are safe. But you went to the store and the reason I said it's relatable, because you went to get some soda and chips, right?

And then, you witnessed a shooting that shouldn't happen to anyone. Tell me when you -- when you first realized what was happening.

BOROWSKI: You said candy bar. Well, my addiction would be ice cream. So I was going to get a Ben and Jerry's. And that was on the side of the store and I walked in on the west side. And I changed my mind, decided not to, went down a different aisle and pretty much, the moment after I made that decision, I heard the first two shots.

And by the third shot, I was running with everybody else towards the back.

LEMON: Did you know where you were running?

Or you were just trying to get out of the way?

BOROWSKI: You know, I worked at a grocery store for many years. So it must've been a little bit of instinct. But after the first two shots, I saw somebody running towards me with a terrified look on their face. I turned and ran and made sure everybody else was running in the same direction with me, went through the back doors.

The employees who were working there didn't know what was going on, yet.

So we had to tell them, "Gun, gun, gun. Run, run, run."

And they made sure that we didn't go down any dead ends. And we all got out the back exit, together. And, yes. Absolutely insane.

LEMON: How many people?

BOROWSKI: With me?

I think there was, maybe, a dozen people. You know, we were all running, single file, finding our way through the maze at the back of the house there. And I had, you know, my hand on somebody else's back. And somebody had their hand on my back. So nobody was tripping or falling.

But everybody was moving as fast as we could. It was the fastest fire drill I have ever been in. And, yes, it was all a blur. I -- I -- I hit the -- the emergency button on my iPhone three times as soon as I got out into the parking lot and looked around.

And like I said, it might have been a dozen people. It might have been two dozen people who escaped with me.

LEMON: So you just ran out of the back door, out of the supermarket, right?

BOROWSKI: Yes. It was surreal, in the fact that I was a bit of on obstacle course. Literally, people were starting to go into, you know, a storage room. And employees, who we just told to run for their lives, were, you know, cognizant enough to tell us which way to run.

LEMON: So as you were running out -- hang on. Stand by.

So as you are running out, you are encountering store workers and other shoppers as you are running?

BOROWSKI: Yes. You know, I had a -- other customer, behind me. And we busted through the back doors to the employee area. The employees looked at us with shock. And we just told them to run.

A couple customers ran into what was probably, you know, dry storage. And the employees were like, no, this way, this way is the exit. And we dove out the -- the receiving door in the back and ducked underneath the truck trailer and up a little hill, just to get as far away as we could.

LEMON: So in the area, that looks like a loading dock. You ran. That's where you were running towards, right?

BOROWSKI: Exactly. We got out the loading dock. We had to go underneath a truck and then up a little hill. So...

[00:10:00]

LEMON: Indeed, an obstacle course for you.

So listen, did you ever -- did you ever encounter -- did you see the shooter?

BOROWSKI: No. I was, maybe five, 10 feet up an aisle. But I was, you know, as close to the registers, you know, as I could. But the only thing I saw was the look of a terrified woman running towards me.

And that's when I turned and ran. I knew I wasn't close enough to think about being a hero. I told my wife that later, that I only had the choice of running and, luckily, I knew I wasn't running into a corner.

LEMON: And you knew, from the look on her face, that you needed to get out of there?

BOROWSKI: Yes. Yes. Excuse me. The -- the first shot was confusing. Maybe, it was somebody dropped something. Second shot came. And then -- and then, after that, it was, bam, bam, bam. And I was running and I heard maybe eight shots. Somebody else said 13.

But who's really counting, at that point?

LEMON: Did you -- did you hear anything?

Did -- did you hear the gunman?

Or did you hear any -- were you -- I don't know if you would even know -- but did you hear any raised voices or anything, an argument?

BOROWSKI: It seemed like there was some confusion, you know, between just that small, you know, between the first and second shot, there seemed some confusion. But when I -- you know, I heard you talking to your last guest about the fallibility of a person's memory but I don't remember anybody screaming. I don't remember anybody hysterically yelling. It was just go, go, go.

Get out of here.

LEMON: Yes.

BOROWSKI: Yes.

LEMON: Did you ever -- have you ever thought about what to do in a situation like this?

Or -- because, you know, Colorado has had several mass shootings.

Have you ever thought about what you would do?

BOROWSKI: Yes. There's a little boy in me who wants to be a G.I. Joe and tackle a guy with a gun. But like I said, I wasn't anywhere near it.

The other thing I am is a runner. So you know, there's a lot of runners in Colorado. And just, I -- I knew I had to move. I knew there was no question of hiding.

And, you know, I've heard -- I was listening to a podcast with Sam Harris recently. And he was talking to some guy about just self- defense. And you know, if you got somebody telling you to, you know -- do what they say. And otherwise, they'll shoot you.

This self-defense guy said something along the lines of -- and I am sorry if I get it wrong -- but he said, don't. Run. You know?

Like they want you to comply. They want you to do what they say and they can, you know -- but if you run, you have a chance. And I ran. And I lived.

I know that you were on, earlier, with Erin Burnett. And, you know, this was right after.

Is there anything you remember that you think you neglected to say, between now and then?

Because sometimes, after you settle down, things start to trickle, things start to come back to you. Or, you know.

Is there anything you want to say?

BOROWSKI: You know, I'm -- I am not going to be able to identify the shooter. I am not going to be able to testify on, you know, in court against this guy.

But I -- I said it to somebody else who was talking to me about this. And I just think that we're so far from the government coming in and solving everything with a gun policy. But every single individual has a right to deal with -- and a responsibility to deal with their own mental state.

I don't own a gun because sometimes I'm too depressed to think about what it would be like to own a gun and be depressed. And I think that there needs to be just encouragement for people to self-reflect, to meditate, to do what it takes to deal with their demons.

And, you know, I'm not religious. I don't believe in demons. I think that people need to deal with their real human problems, in whatever human way they can. And, yes, because if they don't, then it just ends up in some sort of terrible act of violence, like I saw today.

LEMON: You sound like, to me, someone knowing what people should deal with, someone who is fairly mentally healthy.

[00:15:00]

LEMON: Because not all people believe in therapy and -- and the things that you're saying.

But will you get help after this?

BOROWSKI: You know, to be blunt, I'd kind of been going to see my therapist lately.

And --

(CROSSTALK)

BOROWSKI: And I called her.

LEMON: We've all been there. We've all been there.

(LAUGHTER)

BOROWSKI: I -- I -- I texted her, as soon as I got home.

And I said, you know, can I get a session?

Because, you know, I -- I -- I walked home from the scene of the crime, a 2.5-hour walk. I ran some. I screamed some. I just did silly things. But you know, it's going to take whatever it takes.

And other people going out there, through things, just, you know, I -- I've been through darker -- dark nights of the soul. So I know that there's, you know, another end to these things.

Not to make it too political, but there was an end to the Trump presidency, too, and that cheered me up a little bit. So there is hope out there and things change. And for the individual to work on his or her self, you know, so that they can see another day without self- destruction.

And that's why I meditate. That's why I do float therapy. That's why I do yoga. That's why I'm a body worker.

You know?

And -- and I appreciate you calling me -- I don't know -- you told me mentally balanced or something. But some days, I don't feel that way and some days I do. But we just all have to get -- we don't know why we are here. But we get through this world together. And shooting people is not the way to do it.

LEMON: Well, I said that -- I said mentally healthy and that means, you know, it doesn't mean that you feel perfect all the time. Your body doesn't feel -- you can be physically healthy and your body's still sore or tired or you need rest. And so -- but the fact that you do get therapy, "Dark Night of the Soul," It's a good book. I encourage anybody to read that, if they -- if they so desire. It'll probably help them.

And don't ghost your therapist. We have all done it but you know, I am happy you have that relationship with a therapist that you can ghost your therapists sometimes. Thank you so much, Ryan, and we're glad that you are OK. And -- and -- and really.

BOROWSKI: I -- may I say one more thing?

LEMON: Yes. Yes. Before you say that, what I want people -- everyone should get help. There is nothing wrong with having therapy or saying that you have an issue or being depressed. Get some help. It's no different than going to the doctor for some other physical ailment on your body.

Go on. Sorry, Ryan.

BOROWSKI: Yes. No. don't apologize. Yes.

Whatever you can do, if -- if you need to talk to somebody, talk to somebody. Start with a friend. Go to a therapist. Go to two therapists. Try three therapists. You know?

And -- and find out what works. And beyond that, meditation, the Calm app, Sam Harris's Waking Up app. I know I'm going to be doing a lot of meditating over the next few days just to deal with this.

LEMON: Ryan, thank you. We're glad that you're safe. We thank you for coming. I can hear your family in the background doing something. But thank you. We appreciate it. Be well.

BOROWSKI: Take care.

LEMON: So again, I -- I -- I really mean that. If you need to get help, if you are having an issue, a lot of people are having issues, especially during the COVID and quarantine. A lot of depression going on. Lot of people have issues they don't want to talk about, unemployment, all kinds of things.

Get some help. Get some help. Reach out to someone. There's a national suicide prevention line, as well, if you want to get some help. It's -- don't be embarrassed about it. Everybody's dealing with some things, even me. Everyone does. So there you go.

So I want to bring in Lucy Kafanov, who is at the scene in Boulder for us to tell us what's going on. Lucy, you have been there. You have been covering this. You know more

about this than any of us because you have been on the scene all day. And you have also been speaking to the people there, who are in charge of the investigation. Including the governor, who has now released a statement.

What is the governor saying tonight?

LUCY KAFANOV, CNN CORRESPONDENT: He has. Governor Jared Polis issued a statement lauding the officer who tragically lost his life in this shooting. 51-year-old Eric Talley.

He also said, and I am going to quote you some of the statement. He wrote -- said -- in tonight, "Families of these victims, our fellow Coloradans, my neighbors are hearing the devastating news their loved one who simply woke up and went to work this morning or who ran out to pick up eggs won't be coming home.

"Our community anxiously awaits more information on the victims, hoping it's not our friends, co-workers and neighbors but knowing, in our tight-knit community, it will be.

[00:20:00]

KAFANOV: "And even if we don't personally know them, we all mourn their senseless killing and our sense of safety in our local grocery store."

Just to recap what happened, I mean, we haven't had new information from authorities. But we know that this was a quiet Monday afternoon. There is a snowstorm coming.

People were out and about, shopping. You know, taking care of business. This supermarket is located in a -- in a rather large shopping area. So there is a lot of stores around.

At about 2:30 pm, local time, police reported getting those frantic 9- 1-1 calls. They -- they described being alerted to shots fired and someone with a patrol rifle walking around.

What we understand, from footage that we've seen of the aftermath of the incident, is that there were at least two bodies outside in the parking lot; one, immediately inside in that supermarket.

We know that officers responded to the scene. We know that Officer Eric Talley, 51 years old, he's been with the Boulder Police Department since 2010, he was one of the first ones on the scene. He was shot, tragically, lost his life, one of 10 victims, 10 people, who lost their lives today.

We know that the suspect is in custody. He was injured. They have not released any details about who he was but we did see footage of a white gentle -- a white man. He was wearing shorts, no shoes, no shirt. He seemed to be bleeding down his leg and he was handcuffed, walked, in handcuffs, put into a ambulance and that ambulance took him away -- Don. LEMON: Lucy, still don't know, specifically, if that's him but we have

seen that video. Thank you, Lucy, on the scene. We appreciate your reporting.

I want to bring in now, former Secret Service agent, Jonathan Wackrow and former Maryland state police officer, Neill Franklin.

Gentlemen, thank you so much. Appreciate you joining.

Neil, I'm going to start with you. Ten people are dead, including a police officer, suspect in custody. You heard Lucy talking about it, about the situation there, just moments ago.

What is the most pressing thing for investigators right now?

NEILL FRANKLIN, FORMER MARYLAND STATE POLICE OFFICER: I think, right now, is to -- to find out what his motive was, also, to see if anyone else may have been involved, in any way, whatsoever, where he got the firearms from, the ones that he used, if he has more.

They want to be doing search warrants for his residence, trying to do a history on him, looking back 24 hours, looking back 48 hours and, of course and beyond. But I think, one of the most important things right now is his motive. You know, if there's any way that he could have had anything else planned, any type of collaboration with anyone else.

Is this just a one-person event?

Could it be something else planned with someone else in the near future?

So the investigators are going to be, first of all, looking for things that may occur, which may not have occurred yet. But again, the motive is very important because we continue to have these types of shootings.

We know from looking at these shootings -- and unfortunately, like you've said before, we've had many -- mental health is, also, an issue. You know?

Mental health is something that we're going to have to deal with much better than we currently do in this country. But initially, that's what I see them looking at.

LEMON: Yes.

Jonathan, I want to bring you in. Similar question.

What will the suspect's questioning be like?

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, you know, what -- what they want to know is the -- I'm stating the obvious here -- but why?

What was the motivational factor here? And, you know, that may not be clear right away from investigators. What they're going to have to do is they are going to have to look at every aspect of this individual's life to really understand, you know.

Were they influenced by anything?

Was -- is there any other factor in their life that's contributing, you know, to this horrific act?

You know, when we look at targeted acts of violence, it's oftentimes in response to some type of grievance. And the Secret Service National Threat Assessment Center has done research on these mass shooting events.

And what they found is nearly, you know, half of the -- the suspects were motivated by a personal grievance, related to either a workplace violent -- or a workplace issue, a domestic issue or something else.

And all of them, every single case that they've researched, there has been this significant stressor in the individual's life, something, you know, whether it's a divorce or a romantic breakup, a personal issue, a physical illness. That's a key factor that they're going to key in on, what -- what were those issues that were present in this individual's life.

And really, was there a way to avoid this?

[00:25:00]

WACKROW: And one of the -- the -- the shocking statistics that the Secret Service has found over the years is that over three-quarters have made -- three-quarters of attackers have actually telegraphed their action.

They've -- they've -- they've made concerning communications to other people prior to carrying out their act.

So when we start looking at, you know, the things that, you know, preceded and actions that preceded the event today, we're going to look for the warning signs. We're going to look for what was potentially missed in the behavioral anomalies of this individual.

That's what investigators are going to key in on. And then, they're going to try to piece all of this together to really ascertain what the motive was.

LEMON: Thank you. Thank you so much. I appreciate it, Jonathan Wackrow, Neill Franklin, very, very good information. Thank you, gentlemen, appreciate it.

Joe Biden is briefed on the shooting tonight, the one that happened in Boulder, the second mass shooting in this country in a week.

What will this White House do about gun violence?

That's the question. (MUSIC PLAYING)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(MUSIC PLAYING)

LEMON: This is our breaking news tonight. Ten people, including a police officer, killed in a mass shooting at a supermarket in Boulder, Colorado, the second mass shooting in this country in a week.

[00:30:14]

Joining me now to discuss, CNN political analyst Ron Brownstein. Ron -- senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein.

Thank you for joining, Ron. We have so much to talk about.

You know, it's so sad that we -- we talk about these things after a shooting. People say we can't talk about guns now, because you know, we need to find out what happened with the shooting and the victims and what have you. OK, fine. Yes, we are sorry for the victims, but should -- you know, we should continue to say that we should also talk about what happens, how to fix these issues so that we don't have to continue to cover them.

Two shootings in less than a week, Ron. How much pressure does this put on the Biden administration to act on gun violence?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, you know, we have sadly been in this position before. Many times over the past 30 years. If you go back to Columbine, through Sandy Hook, through all of these events that once seemed incomprehensible, now have been almost metronomic, a background hum in American life, a level of mass violence unmatched in any country in the world.

And yet, we still can't get over the fundamental stalemate. The problem is, is that for much of the Republican electorate, gun control has become an issue of cultural values rather than practicalities of saving lives or reducing risk. And as long as that is the case, the only way to break through will be to end the filibuster. And we just don't know if Joe Biden is ready to go there yet.

LEMON: What do you think is going to happen? You just don't know. But I mean, if this is one thing. In order to save lives around, Ron -- let's just be honest. In order to save lives and probably multiple lives, if there's any reason to break the filibuster, wouldn't this be it?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, yes. There's a whole bunch of them, but among them --

LEMON: Voting rights. But yes. But go ahead.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes, but in this case, I mean, it's the intractability of the problem. I mean, you know, there's an overwhelming public support for universal background checks. The public opinion is more closely divided, but there is still a

majority on banning assault weapons. And by the way, Joe Biden not only ran on banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, he said for existing assault weapons, he would either buy them back or require you to register them under the National Firearms Act.

And while Democrats in the House were willing to vote again, with only one dissenting vote, for the universal background checks, it's not clear to me at all they would do any of those other things without a much better indication that they could get through the Senate.

You know, they talked about in the last hour, Don. You go back to 1994, I covered that crime bill. There were 38 House Republicans who voted to ban assault weapons; also, 77 Democrats who voted not to ban assault weapons. The parties were much more divided on these questions now [SIC].

And you know, now we're kind of in a situation where, as they say, Republicans are united by ideology against gun control, Democrats are somewhat divided by geography on whether to pursue gun control. So you need strong presidential leadership, and you would also need, I think, clearly, there's no -- there's no practical way to do this without curtailing or ending the filibuster.

LEMON: Listen, I've got to ask you, if I can nab just a second here. If you can answer it quickly for me, I appreciate it. There is a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing on gun violence tomorrow. What do you expect to hear?

BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, look, I think you're going to hear the -- the arguments we've been having, literally, since at least Columbine and arguably since the crime bill in 1994, where Democrats and -- and law enforcement, in many cases, will advocate this is a practical response to a particular and real, unique American problem.

And you will have the other side basically arguing, You don't respect my cultural values if you want to limit guns. And the NRA has always tried -- and their allies have always tried to make this more of an obstruction, more of a statement of, You don't respect me, as opposed to this is something that we can practically due to keep more Americans alive.

LEMON: Ron Brownstein, much appreciated, always. Thank you, sir.

BROWNSTEIN: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Make sure you stay with this. We're going to keep bringing you the very latest information as we get it on the Boulder shooting.

Plus, the prosecutor who was in charge of the Justice Department's investigation of the Capitol riots says that the former president could be culpable.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: A former prosecutor who, until recently, was leading the Capitol riot investigation, says the insurrectionists could face sedition charges.

Michael Sherwin, the former acting D.C. U.S. attorney, also says that the former president may be culpable for that insurrection.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL SHERWIN, FORMER ACTING D.C. U.S. ATTORNEY: We have soccer moms from Ohio that were arrested, saying, Well, I did this, because my president said I had to take back our House. That moves the needle towards that direction. Maybe the president is culpable for those actions.

But also, you see in the public record, too, militia members saying, You know what? We did this because Trump just talks a big game. He's just all talk. We did what he wouldn't do.

SCOTT PELLEY, "60 MINUTES": In short, you have investigators looking into the president's role?

SHERWIN: We have people looking at everything, correct.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: CNN Contributor, John Dean is here.

John, hello to you. A fascinating interview. Good to see you, by the way.

According to Sherwin, former President Trump may be culpable for that Capitol riot. How will prosecutors decide if he is? I mean, he said -- I mean, he put it very broadly, saying, We have people looking into everything, when the -- when the reporter asked him specifically, if they were looking at Donald Trump. But I mean, how do they decide if he's culpable? And what crime would they consider here?

JOHN DEAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, there are a number of possible ways that could happen. One is the evidence itself will lead them in that direction, as they progress up the ladder and get to some of these leaders of these hard-core right-wing groups. One or more of them might flip. They might say they had relationships with the White House. They might reveal that aides told him this or that about the president. This would narrow the focus.

So they're -- it's pretty early, Don, in this investigation. They are just starting to really herd them all in. They've got another hundred cases they think they may indict. They've got 300 already indicted. So it's a massive case. It will be a while before we know if they're targeting the president.

LEMON: Yes. So listen, CNN's Evan Perez is reporting that there is some fallout within the Biden DOJ over Sherwin's comments that he, you know, made there on "60 Minutes."

They don't want prosecutors out there talking about an ongoing investigation. So why is it that this -- that this case, though, how should -- how could Sherman's [SIC] comments impact the ability to charge these rioters?

DEAN: Well, actually, that was my first reaction to this interview. I was surprised he was out there. I watched it on "60 Minutes," and I looked on -- this morning I happened to check the DOJ website to see if this was authorized. I could find nothing. They would have obviously cited it if he had approval of the department. He clearly did not have approval of the department.

And what he could be doing is tainting the case by public statements. This is something prosecutors, as a rule, do not do. While he is the acting U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia, this is the sort of thing you clear with headquarters before you do it.

He's a guy on his way out, though. He may be looking for a job. He may have wanted to do this high-profile interview for that reason. He's got great credentials. He's been on -- kind of on both sides. He did some work for Eric Holder. He's done work for Barr. It's kind of a mixed record.

He prosecuted the woman who invaded Mar-a-Lago, the Chinese woman. He also was on the Flynn case, and getting Flynn a pass.

So I think he wanted to get some publicity and -- and get his record -- and he's got a good education and good skill. So that's what he was showing off for the broader audience tonight.

LEMON: I got you. Got you, got you, got you. Thank you, John. Appreciate it. Good to see you.

DEAN: Thank you.

LEMON: Thank you.

Almost 25 percent of Americans have been at least partially vaccinated, and we've got an update on another vaccine that could be up for approval soon.

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LEMON: So we have some good news in the fight against coronavirus. AstraZeneca says that Phase 3 clinical trials show their coronavirus vaccine is 79 percent effective against symptomatic cases and, more importantly, 100 percent effective against severe disease and hospitalization.

AstraZeneca says it is looking to file for emergency use authorization with the FDA in the first half of April. It wants to deliver 50 million doses within a month.

The U.S. is currently averaging about 2.5 million doses a day, and the CDC data shows that almost one in four Americans have received at least one dose of COVID-19 vaccine.

So let's discuss now. CNN medical analyst Dr. Anne Compton-Phillips is here.

Doctor, it's so good to see you.

DR. AMY COMPTON-PHILLIPS, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: It's great to be here.

LEMON: Amy. I called you Anne. Amy Compton-Phillips. You were one of the first doctors I actually spoke to you about this. Remember?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: I do remember it well.

LEMON: About coronavirus a year ago, and I was -- I think I was on the road at some political event. This was before quarantine and lockdown. You were the first people -- one of the first people I spoke to. So thank you. It's good to see you.

You know, we now have, potentially, four vaccines, right? But experts are now warning that they're not worried about the supply in vaccines, but people willing to take them. Do you share the same concern?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: I absolutely do share the same concern. Because we know that supply is improving, and so the hardship it is right now to get the vaccine is going to be going away over the next couple of months.

And then, it's going to be a matter of convincing people that, for the past several months, have been exposed to misinformation on the -- all sorts of places on the web and the news. So now we have to really build trust with individuals, that these vaccines, all four of them, really are safe, are effective, and are available for everyone, in every community to get.

LEMON: Doctor, we have been looking at these videos for the last two weeks or so of -- and this one is from this past week. Right? The spring break, this madness of all these spring breakers in Florida. These are the crowds in Miami, the most recent ones.

The TSA says that more than 1.5 million people flew on Sunday alone. That is a pandemic record. And today, the CDC, the director, Rochelle Walensky, is warning that a fourth surge could still be on the way. With states easing restrictions, people traveling, could we see our progress just, poof, disappear?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: We absolutely could. You know, the scary part is we are on mile 24 of a marathon. And we just have to get to the finish. We just have to stick with the really sensible precautions, of wearing masks and staying socially distanced, for a little bit longer. And we can't lose the race between vaccines and variants that we're in right now.

LEMON: Doctor, our time is short, but thank you so much. It is good to see you again. Be safe.

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Thank you.

LEMON: Thank you. She now says no reasonable person would think she was telling the truth. What a pro-Trump lawyer says about her election lies, now that she's facing a billion-dollar lawsuit. Next.

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LEMON: Pro-Trump attorney Sidney Powell, who spread her bogus claims of election fraud, is changing her tune about those lies -- or spread Trump's bogus claims. She says, quote, "No reasonable person would conclude that the statements were truly statements of fact."

That's in response to a $1.3 billion defamation lawsuit she is facing from Dominion Voting Systems.

She is now CNN legal -- joining us now, I should say -- excuse me -- CNN legal analyst Elie Honig, a former federal and state prosecutor.

Elie, it's a little late. So good -- it's good to see you, though.

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I'm with you, Don. Always with you.

LEMON: OK. So what is -- what has your reaction been, because she is now admitting what we all knew, that she never had any proof, and that she was never to be taken seriously. What is -- what do you think?

HONIG: Exactly, Don. Even Sidney Powell now admits and agrees that Sidney Powell is full of it. Even Sidney Powell now tells us that this whole election fraud thing is completely fabricated. And not just a little lie, but a lie that's so great that, as you said, she puts in her brief, no reasonable person would possibly believe this.

I don't know what she's doing. To be clear, this is not even a defense to what she's being sued for, for defamation. What you have to prove, if you're Dominion here, is that the statements were false and that she knew it. She admits that --

LEMON: Now she's admitting it, yes.

HONIG: -- in her brief. I don't understand what's going on.

LEMON: Yes. But isn't it a similar language to a lawsuit of -- that mentioned Tucker Carlson, that no reasonable person would -- something like that -- believe that whatever -- believe what he was saying was true?

HONIG: Yes. What they're trying to do is hide behind a protection that's available, essentially, to parody or to something like "Saturday Night Live." Right? If it's so obviously over the top, if you read it in "Mad Magazine," you would understand it's -- it's a -- you know, it's a fabrication.

The problem is, we're hearing this from an -- a, more or less, mainstream media source in FOX News, and from Sidney Powell, who stood behind a lectern and purported to represent the president of the United States, former federal prosecutor. It's very different than the parody or satire situation.

LEMON: But don't they have that little insurrection incident that is a problem for them? Because so many people believed what they were saying that they admit it, and they went to the Capitol to try and overturn a legitimate election?

Anyways. Given that she was out spreading these lies, as an attorney, and now she is saying that it is all made up, can she keep her law license?

HONIG: I don't see any way she can keep her law license. I know the authorities in Michigan are already trying to strip her license.

Look, lawyers get a lot of leeway in what they can say. You can push the boundaries. I've seen plenty of lawyers go into gray areas. What you cannot do is make a knowingly, intentionally false statement. Here, she's admitted that. I don't know how the bar committee sees this brief and lets her continue to practice.

LEMON: Elie Honig, always a pleasure. Thanks for staying up late. We appreciate it.

HONIG: See you, Don.

LEMON: Yes.

HONIG: Anytime.

LEMON: We're going to continue on with our breaking news. Ten people dead because of that shooting in Colorado, including one police officer.

Thanks for watching. Our live coverage continues, here on CNN.

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