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Don Lemon Tonight

President Biden, Georgia Law Jim Crow in the 21st Century; Don Interviews Sen. Cory Booker (D-NJ); Republicans Using Trump's Big Lie of Election Fraud; Trump Claims Capitol Rioters Posed Zero Threat; Dominion Sues Fox for $1.6 Billion Over Claims of Voting Fraud in 2020 Election: GOP Senator Cotton Introduces Bill to Ban Teaching of Critical Race Theory in the U.S. Military; Remembering the Boulder Shooting Victims; CNN Heroes: Peace Builder. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired March 26, 2021 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Tonight President Biden outraged at Georgia's sweeping new elections law which restricts access to voting calling it an atrocity and saying the Justice Department is reviewing it and calling out the racial motivation of the law, saying it is nothing less than Jim Crow in the 21st century. Its restrictions targeted specially to suppress black voters in Georgia.

Also, tonight, Dominion Voting Systems going after Fox big time, filing a $1.6 billion defamation lawsuit against the right-wing channel for pushing Trump's big lie about election fraud, accusing it of recklessly disregarding the truth.

So joining me now is Democratic Senator Cory Booker on New Jersey. Senator, I really appreciate you joining us this evening. You know, we are watching the big lie now turn into voter suppression before our very eyes. President Biden saying this about Georgia voting that law today, here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: -- atrocity. The idea, if you want any indication that it had nothing to do with fairness, nothing to do with decency. They passed a law saying you can't provide water. For people standing in a line while they're waiting to vote. You don't need anything else to know that this is nothing but punitive, designed to keep people from voting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Alright. So, listen. He's correct about that. He also in a written statement saying this. This is Jim Crow in the 21st century. It must end. So, then why is he waiting to do something about it?

SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): Well, let's hope he will. I mean, I think that this is a wake-up call to which side of America you stand on. Do you stand on the one that wants freedom, vibrant, multicultural conclusive democracy? Or do you want to join a lot of other nations around the world from Turkey to Hungary that alert you toward authoritarianism, where people who are in power are changing the rules to suppress democracy to ensure that they stay in power.

So yeah, this is a throwback to a disastrous time in American history where there was widespread over suppression of African-American voters but also in the larger global context right now is showing the contest on the planet earth between the principles that America heralds most and the despotism, demagoguery, the propaganda-ism, authoritarianism of those who seek to undermine democracy.

The Republican Party leadership in over 40 states is choosing authoritarianism. Policies that suppress votes. Because this is why what you said earlier about the big lie, the widespread rampant in- person voter fraud does not exist in America. There have only been 31 cases since the year 2000 amidst the over billion votes cast in America, only 31 cases of credible voter fraud.

[23:05:10]

And so this is not about secure voting. This is about suppressing the vote because we know, G-8 report, when you put a voter I.D. Law, and remember disproportionately more African-Americans, black voters lack I.D.s, especially the kind designed by places like Texas where you're concealed carry permit count as an I.D. but your student I.D. doesn't. African-Americans disproportionately do not have these I.D.'s compared to others. This is one element --

LEMON: Interesting.

BOOKER: Especially Georgia of laws that discriminate against black people as well as low income people.

LEMON: I don't think you can be clearer than that. But listen, nothing is going to be, I don't know, you're in the Senate. You know this. Something has to be done about the filibuster. Is President Biden's strategy to wait until it is clear to the American people that the GOP is obstructing before coming out strong against the filibuster?

BOOKER: You know, I talk to the White House regularly on everything from police reform to last night talking to the White House officials about making the child tax credit permanent. I do not know what their strategy is. I know, you hear the president talk about passionate. He is sincere, this -- I would say this anguish is his heart, because he believes in a vibrant democracy and let the elected leaders that could make the best-case win.

So I know that they're going to try to do whatever they can. I know, I have an ally, we have an ally in them. But this is going to have to be both a fight in the Senate where those of us who believe that this is really an inflection point, there is a line to the big lie in the insurrection against those who want to protect this lurching toward authoritarianism.

And this is why this is not a Republican-Democratic thing necessarily amongst the people of America. In Georgia, these laws, depending on which one you go, are wildly unpopular. 70 to 77 percent, depending on which law, 77 percent giving people water in line law all the way down to 70 percent, some of the provision ballot changes they made are unpopular.

So, I'm telling you, this has got to be an inflection point for all Americans. You can't just sit on the sideline and say this is wrong. All of us have to begin to demand change.

LEMON: And I think people need to know, we need more -- people need to be taught more about what all of these terms mean, provisional ballot, and what is counted and what is not. An application. I think there's -- you know, people think that all of it counts, right? But it doesn't count until it's checked. And all of that happened in the last election. You can see court case after court case, recount after recount. It all happened. I have got to ask you something though, because you said, you spoke to the -- did you say you spoke to the White House about last night?

BOOKER: No. I spoke to the White House last night about (inaudible) policy issues. Not about what happened in Georgia.

LEMON: Alright. Got you. So, I have got to ask you about -- get your reaction about the former president defending his supporters who violently stormed our Capitol, claiming that they posed, this is a quote here, zero threat. We've all seen the video of the rioters violently beating officers, but I mean, you were inside. You were there. Your life was at risk. What goes through your mind when you hear the former president claim that these insurrectionists loved our country?

BOOKER: It's not just him. This is beginning to take root around conspiracy theory websites and social media, and this is my place of work. And I talk to the people that do the hard jobs in the Senate. There are hundreds of Capitol police officers. If you have any doubt, talk to them about their colleagues, dozens and dozens of them that were seriously injured. From eyes gouged out to serious spinal and back problems or maybe you should call the family of Brian Sicknick who died in the Capitol assault.

LEMON: Right.

BOOKER: So, I have no patience for folks who don't recognize what this really was. And they were trying to downplay it, when there are still people recovering, physically from the harm that they endured with these folks, this violent mob chanting hangs our vice president. Carrying weapons and chemical sprays. This is shameful, what's going on. And we can't, we should not give it any harbor.

[23:10:16]

LEMON: It is so insulting to, as you mentioned the Capitol police officers and I think police officers all over the country who put their lives on the line to pretend that what they faced, those officers in that Capitol, that they faced was you know, love and hugs and you know, kisses. It's just really unbelievable. Thank you, Senator. I appreciate your time. Thank you so much. BOOKER: I appreciate you. I just want to make the appeal, please, you

know, this is a time that silence is complicity. If you don't agree with what's happening in Georgia and the over 40 other states are pushing laws like this, this has got to be a moment that honors those who died for voting rights. Honors John Lewis, Medgar Evers, honors (inaudible). Please, please do not sit back. This is a time for activism. If you love this democracy and our principles, please stand up and say so.

LEMON: Senator Booker, thanks.

Professor Cornel West is here now. Professor West, welcome to the program. Good evening to you, sir.

CORNEL WEST, PROFESSOR OF PUBLIC PHILOSOPHY HARVARD UNIVERISTY: How are you doing, my brother? Another sad day. Another sad day.

LEMON: Yes. Let's talk about it. Look, Black people in Georgia followed the rules. They cast their ballots. Democrats won. So now Republicans are changing the rules. Whenever people of color take a step forward, why is there always a back lash? Or a white lash?

WEST: That's a good question. I've got my precious son down in Georgia with his lovely family, man, and it's the hound of hell in the language of the great (inaudible) and the teacher, Martin Luther King Jr. One of those houses, their fear, their hatred, their hypocrisy, their greed. And when you unleash those hounds in such a way that you don't have counter veiling forces.

That's why Brother Cory Booker is absolutely right. Hits the nail on the head, he's telling the truth. You have to have countervailing forces and voices and movement. Where are the voices coming out of our churches, our mosques, our synagogues our core community, our trade unions? We've got to have some kind of wave of response against these hounds of hell. Because we keep talking about the big lie.

The big lie is the rigged election. We know it's a lie. But the monstrous lie behind the big lie is white supremacy that always reshapes and refashions itself, over and over and over again. Slavery, old Jim Crow, new Jim Crow, new, new, new Jim Crow. If we don't push it back, we lose our democracy. It's just that simple. And Brother Cory is absolutely right.

LEMON: that's all at the bottom. I hate to do this, but that's -- you know that's what I talk about in the book, right. At the bottom of all of this. And until we come to that realization, come to that consensus and decide to do something together, it is never, ever, ever going to change.

WEST: Frederick (inaudible) told us, (inaudible) told us, (inaudible), Ella Baker, Fannie Lou Hamer all the way up to Baldwin and a brother named Don, from Louisiana got his voice in the chorus, too. Absolutely, but it is not just the voices. You have to have people who are willing to fight.

LEMON: Right. WEST: You don't need a spectator.

LEMON: Right. You've got to do the work.

WEST: Right. You've got to do the work. If you're a poet, then write some poem. If you're a singer, write some songs. If you're an organizer, organize (inaudible) better. If you're a teacher, teach the truth. This is what is at stake. But this has always been what is at stake, but never forget this, Don, this is a crucial point, my brother. That any time any forces have come at black people, we are at our best, we are great people. We were not conquered by slavery. We were not conquered by Jim and Jane Crow. We were not conquered by the new Jim Crow.

We will not be conquered by this Jim Crow new style. This Jane Crow new school. And it is not just in the ballot box. They've got forms of this happening on Wall Street, Silicon Valley, across the board. Right here at Harvard. It's right across the border. Fighting it back, no matter what language they used, they can talk all they want about it. This is (inaudible) diversity. This is a front-end clue. This is for equity.

I want to know where is the deeds. I want to know where is the substance. I want to know where's the content. But keep it in mind, brother, it is the love supreme at the center. We love the truth, we've loving black people, we loving humanity, we love beauty, and we loving goodness. And of course as a Christian, I'm loving God but everybody ain't got to do that.

(LAUGHTER)

[23:15:08]

LEMON: Alright, so listen. That leads me two souls at the polls. What you just said, when you talked about black people, you know, you come from a long line -- you come from a sturdy peasant stock from a long line of poets. One of whom said, the very time I thought I was lost, my dungeon shook and my chains fell off.

WEST: That's right.

LEMON: The passion that many black people have around voting, right, is because of the challenges, and that's not a strong enough word. And the suppression that African Americans face in the past. I want you to check out these people in Georgia. They're waiting in this line for hours to cast their votes in 2020.

Now if someone wants to give one of those people a bottle of water, are they going to get arrested? Is this what Republicans want to see? Is that -- they want to stop old ladies from going to vote in their church hats on Sunday and old ladies from getting water for waiting in line for hours to cast their vote? Is that what they want to do?

WEST: Well, at one, you see how mean spirited and cold hearted it is. But keep in mind, brother Don, on the vanilla side of town with those same folks who voted, if their mamas and their fathers and their aunts and uncles are in line, if they had to wait for two hours, they would go bring them some water. So that's the hypocrisy of it all.

You see, you can't take the hypocrites seriously. This is geared for the chocolate side of town. This is not the golden rule. This is not for them. They're so entitled. They're so arrogant. They're so hearty. They know it doesn't apply to them. If it did happen, (inaudible). We know the history of Jim Crow.

The history of white supremacy. Suppress these folks. Control these folks. Disrespect these folks. Devalue these folks. Dismiss these folks. But it is not going to happen in my neighborhood. Oh, no, no, not at all. We are going to treat them with dignity. And all we say, we deserve the same dignity as anybody else.

LEMON: And in the teeth of the most terrifying odds. A monumental dignity, right?

WEST: That's exactly right my brother.

Listen to Aretha tonight and she'll give you a sense of what the dignity of a sound is all about. The dignity of movement.

LEMON: I love having you on. I mean, you just, thank you, you inspire me.

WEST: God bless you and your loved ones.

LEMON: Thank you, you be well. Have a great weekend. Be well. Thank you so much.

So, we just talked about the big lie. The big lie that the election was stolen isn't enough for the former president. Now he is pushing another big lie claiming that nothing much happened at the Capitol insurrection. Does he really expect us to ignore what we saw with our own eyes? I guess he does. Maybe try to change the narrative. You know, shapeshifting is on the reality. And now insulting, and how insulting is all of this to the officers who fought those rioters?

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[23:20:00]

LEMON: So the former president's big lie wreaking havoc on our democracy. He's bogus claims now prompting Georgia Republicans who spent months confirming the integrity of their elections to pass laws claiming to fix problems that never existed. Trump's own officials confirm 2020 was the most secure election in our country's history.

Let's discuss now the former FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe, now CNN contributor. He joins us now. Good evening sir. Good to see you. So, let's talk about this big lie. There were multiple crazy lawsuits. We saw a violent insurrection where five people died and now laws restricting the right to vote. The legacy of the big lie, still a lie. Do you think we're going to be dealing with the danger of this for years to come, Andrew?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN CONTRIBUTOR, FORMER ACTING FBI DIRECTOR: No question. No question, we are. I mean, look, these lies, this is a cancer in the body politic of this nation. This continued harping on this falsehood, on the lies around the result of the 2020 election is that is a core grievance that the former president and his followers and his acolytes on the Hill who continue to mouth and amplify his messages.

This is the thing that ignites the fire of the grievance of extremism and violence and continues to divide us. This is not going away any time soon. And certainly not as long as he's still out there pushing it.

LEMON: Let's talk about another big lie that he's pushing. Alright, that nothing happened on January 6th. Don't believe what you saw with your own eyes. This is what he said about officials charging the insurrectionists. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They go after people that, I guess you would call them, lean toward the right. And they wave American flags in many cases. They're waving the American flag and they love our country. It was zero threat right from the start. It was zero threat. Look. They went in. They shouldn't have done it. Some of them went in and they're hugging and kissing the police and the guards. You know? They had great relationships.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I mean, Andrew, its beyond, this video is horrifying. It tells the truth. How insulting are Trump's comments to the law enforcement officers still with us who were beaten, they were tased, they were almost killed trying to protect our Capitol.

MCCABE: The disgraceful disrespect, the abandonment of the men and women who put their lives on the line every day.

[23:25:00]

It is just outrageous. Three of them died in that attack. 138 were injured. I just, it compels me to say to my brothers and sisters in the law enforcement community, many, many of whom are conservative in their political beliefs and that's perfectly fine.

But this crowd and this man, this former president, they are not supporters of yours. They do not support you. I don't care how many thin blue line flags they hang on their cars. There is nothing to this. You see when it comes right down to it, he lies about what happened, which we've all seen a thousand times on video. He minimizes their sacrifice and he abandon them in their time of need when they should be being propped up and recognized for their heroism. He dusts it off in some sort of hugs and kisses and there was no threat. It is absolutely outrageous.

LEMON: Andrew McCabe, thank you sir. Have a good weekend. I appreciate you coming on the show. See you soon.

MCCABE: Thanks, Don I appreciate it.

LEMON: Fox News facing new legal trouble for pushing Trump's big lie to the tune $1.6 million. And Dominion Voting Systems is calling out specific Fox hosts.

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[23:30:00]

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DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Dominion Voting Systems filing a $1.6 billion lawsuit against Fox today. The voting technology company says the right-wing media outlet recklessly disregarded the truth while pushing the big lie that the election was stolen from Trump. The suit methodically lays out their claim. Some of Fox' most prominent hosts repeated misinformation and gave Trump's attorneys a platform to spread lies. That's what it says in the filing. Lies like these.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: The Dominion software system has been tagged as one allegedly capable of flipping votes.

LOU DOBBS, FOX BUSINESS NETWORK HOST: A broadly coordinated effort to -- to actually bring down this president by ending his second term before it could begin.

TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS HOST: Electronic voting is not as secure as traditional hand counting, period.

MARIA BARTIROMO, FOX BUSINESS NETWORK ANCHOR: They have businesses in Venezuela, Caracas, they have businesses in Cuba, and there are also links to China.

DOBBS: The servers are somewhere else and are considered proprietary and they won't touch them. They won't permit them to be touched.

BARTIROMO: One source says that the key point to understand is that the Smartmatic system has a backdoor that allows it to be --

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Yeah.

BARTIROMO: -- that allows the votes to be mirrored and monitored.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, a spokesperson for Fox tells CNN the network is proud of its election coverage and describes it as being in the highest tradition of American journalism. Okay.

So joining me now is CNN legal analyst Elie Honig, a former federal and state prosecutor. Oh, Elie. Hello. Good evening. So --

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: Listen. You're the legal mind here, but isn't the evidence right there playing out across the country's T.V. screens?

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yeah, Don, it's right in front of us. This lawsuit is a real threat to Fox News. This thing has real teeth. Look, there are two things, let's bring it down, that Dominion has to prove. One, the statements were false. We don't even need to waste any time on that. We all know the statements were false.

The second thing is that Fox News knew they were false or recklessly disregarded the falsity. I mean, look, take it from Sidney Powell. Sidney Powell herself, one of the main architects of this whole big lie, has said this was so ridiculous that no reasonable person would have believed it. Now, Fox News, what are they going to say? We were so dense. We were so dumb that we believed it? They're in a tough spot.

LEMON: Yeah. I just want to read from the suit, OK? And it says here, it says, Fox took a small flame and turned it into a forest fire. As the dominant media company among those viewers dissatisfied with the election results, Fox gave these fictions a prominence they otherwise would never have achieved.

This suit is a systematic takedown of Fox's role in spreading that big role, and Dominion is not expected to settle here. So, what if they take this all the way to court? What are we going to learn here?

HONIG: Boy. Well, first of all, Fox has to be a little worried about the discovery process here. That's the process where you get information from the other party. I mean, if they get to that point, if they don't settle this thing, that means Dominion is going to get to take depositions of Fox News anchors, producers, executives. That means they're going to see internal Fox memos, e-mails, that kind of thing. This could be really ugly for Fox.

The other is, Don, there will be accountability here. It is a Friday night, I'll bring some good news. The big lie is crumbling and it's crumbling from within. We're seeing the leading perpetrator, whether it's Sidney Powell, Fox News is even saying our own anchors aren't to be believed. So, they're turning on each other, the big lie is being exposed.

LEMON: Well, I mean, Dominion is specifically naming Maria Bartiromo in this lawsuit. Tucker Carlson, Lou Dobbs, Sean Hannity, Jeanine Pirro, some of Fox's most popular hosts. Dobbs' show was actually cancelled two days after another company sued Fox over the same lies. So how much risk, if any, are they personally facing?

HONIG: Yeah, look, there's real risk. You're responsible for what you say on air. And, you know, Fox has taken this interesting tack with respect to its anchors. When Tucker Carlson got sued in another case, Fox argued in court, successfully actually, at the trial court level, he is not to be believed. Who takes him seriously? He is essentially a carnival barker.

At a certain point, if you call enough of your anchors carnival barkers in circus acts, you become a circus. So, I don't know how long Fox can sustain that line of defense and remain a viable, credible media entity.

[23:35:03]

LEMON: That's the Sidney Powell defense, right? No reasonable person would --

HONIG: Yeah.

LEMON: -- think that she was telling the truth. We shall see. Elie, thank you.

HONIG: Yeah.

LEMON: I appreciate your time.

HONIG: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: The defense secretary, Lloyd Austin, is trying to change how the military addresses issues of race, but GOP Senator Tom Cotton putting forward legislation to ban the military from teaching how to understand racism in our institutions.

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LEMON: Republican Senator Tom Cotton of Arkansas wants to ban the military from teaching critical race theory, part of the concept holes that the U.S. is inherently a racist country.

[23:40:04]

LEMON: So, he's introducing legislation. Here's what he says.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TOM COTTON (R-AR): Our armed forces should not be endorsing or recommending or requiring for training any of this left-wing nonsense that suggests that any race is inherently inferior or racist or oppressive or that our country or our founding documents like the Constitution or the declaration are inherently racist or oppressive.

When young men and women raise their hand and take the oath to join our military, they should know that they are fighting for a great and noble nation. That's why I'm introducing this legislation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I want to bring in now to talk about this with General Dana Pittard, former army ground commander in Iraq. He is also the co- author of "Hunting the Caliphate."

General, thank you so much. You heard him. Senator Cotton is calling critical race theory left-wing nonsense. He doesn't want -- want it taught in the military. What do you say to that?

DANA PITTARD, FORMER ARMY GROUND COMMANDER IN IRAQ: First of all, good evening, Don. Actually, I think the legislation isn't necessary. I served with and I know many of the senior leadership in the U.S. Military. And I trust them. And we need to trust them. Trust them as far as their judgment. And their mission is to build cohesive teams that can fight and win America's wars.

And so they are using a portion of critical race theory, not all of it, because not all of it is appropriate, but they're using a portion of it to help troops to understand the complexity of race and help them to understand the legacy of systemic racism in our country. I mean, those are -- those are fact-based. So, we've got to trust our senior leadership.

LEMON: You know, his bill, it's not a new idea. Trump ended diversity training back in September, which Biden has since reversed. But back then, Trump called training, you know, on subjects like critical race theory and white privilege un-American propaganda. Why are they so afraid of this conversation?

PITTARD: I'm not sure. I mean, it's -- it's interesting that we would like to look at America through rose-colored glasses. But, you know, America has a racist past and we're still dealing today with some of the legacy of systemic racism. But that hasn't changed why people fight and defend this country.

I served 34 years in the military, multiple combat tours, and fought for our country. African-Americans have fought for our country for decades, centuries, even though they came home oftentimes to Jim Crow -- the Jim Crow south or even slavery. So, I'm not sure why we want to -- we want to whitewash that.

LEMON: Yeah. Listen, for the people at home, you're one of just a few African-Americans who have reached a level of a two-star general or higher. You've had a career spanning decades. Over that career, you've faced egregious forms of racism. What is your experience been like? Can you please tell our viewers?

PITTARD: Sure. Racism is -- is, you know, throughout the military, just like it is in the country. Military is merely, you know, an example of what goes on in our country. But what we can't do is allow racism to define us. One thing my parents raised me and my brother on was the sweetish revenge is achievement and success.

LEMON: Mm-hmm.

PITTARD: So you don't let racism define you. You continue on your mission.

LEMON: Very well said. Very well said. Listen. I learned so much from you. We would love to have you back and continue these conversations, and thank you for your service. The entire country is very proud of you. Thank you, sir. Appreciate you joining.

PITTARD: Thank you, Don.

LEMON: Thank you. Colorado mourning the 10 lives lost from the shooting in Boulder, including Suzanne Fountain. She was many things to many people: A mother, a daughter, an aunt, an actress. Her life partner joins me to share her stories next.

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[23:45:00]

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LEMON: So we are learning the gunman charged with killing 10 people at the Boulder supermarket purchased his gun legally after passing a background check.

Investigators still don't know the motive for the massacre, and as funerals for the victims begin next week, the country is so desensitized to gun violence that it seems we're turning our attention away. But the grieving process is only beginning for the loved ones of those who died.

I want to bring in Philippe Bernier. His life partner, Suzanne Fountain, is sadly one of the victims. Philippe, hello to you. I'm so sorry for what you're going through right now. How are you doing tonight?

PHILIPPE BERNIER, LOST LIFE PARTNER IN BOULDER SHOOTING: Well, I have a lot of support. I have a few friends that are going to be over. You know, there -- most people that I ask, I say, you know, fine.

[23:50:03]

BERNIER: That's really all I can say.

LEMON: I'm looking at pictures of you and her. What a smile she had. Just -- I mean it looks like it just lights up the room. It's her in the garden. Tell me about her because you have a very special love story. You met years ago and then reconnected at the same theater 25 years later? Talk to me about that.

BERNIER: Well, that's -- it's not all true. Yes, it was a different theater. So, the theater was the Victorian Theater and we did glass menagerie together when we were both right around 30 years old. And -- and we dated for a handful of months. And then, we went on our way and did our life.

And then 26 years later, I was doing the closing show of a theater called Germinal Stage and they had been open for 25 years. And she saw my name in the paper and decided to come to the show. And we've been together ever since.

LEMON: Oh.

BERNIER: Yes. We've been till now.

LEMON: How long ago was that? How long ago was that again?

BERNIER: Eight and a half years.

LEMON: That's -- that's really -- listen. You got back together and that's fabulous, right? That -- and it's -- it's still an amazing story, even though it wasn't the same theater. I think it's still just as -- as wonderful.

BERNIER: Thank you.

(LAUGHTER)

BERNIER: Thank you. I just had to correct that, just for the people that were actually there.

LEMON: Oh, that's OK. That's OK. Listen. You -- you raised a wonderful son. She was a talented actress. She is described by her friends as fearless, as funny, as warm and giving. Tell me what was she like for you?

BERNIER: Well, I will start with the stuff that sounds weird. She was a bit of a bulldog. So, she was beautiful at it, but she would ask, nicely. If she didn't get the answer she wanted or needed, she would ask for the supervisor. She would not let it go.

You know, most of us, we get a call. We call our bank and they say, can't do it today. And we go, OK, we hang up the phone. Well, she would have the president of the company there before too long. So, that's -- I say bulldog, with love in my heart.

(LAUGHTER)

BERNIER: She had a way of -- of loving that was just not like other people. I don't know. I don't know everybody. But when she loved you, it was deep. And if you needed anything at any time, she was there. She was there, no questions asked. And I don't know too many people like that. A lot of people talk that way. I don't know how many people actually are.

LEMON: Yeah. Yeah. Well, Philippe, you know, these mass --

BERNIER: What else? What else about her? Go ahead.

LEMON: Can I ask you -- so let's talk about these mass shootings. And I hate to -- to ask you about this, but answer as much as you want. These mass shootings happen so often in this country. The attention is intense at first. And then, as more time goes on, the stories, they fade from the headlines, fade from the news. But this is never going to go away for you, and quite frankly, for the Boulder community as well, will it?

BERNIER: No. No. I -- you know, I guess, it's a little bit of my politics but -- and I think Suzanne felt the same way. I don't really hate the man who shot her. I -- I don't like him much, but I sort of blame society. This has been going on for a long time.

How many times on TV does somebody get shot? Five hundred times a day, kids are watching somebody get shot, no consequences, no anything. What do you expect them to be when they grow up? So, I'm sorry if that was dark, but that's how I feel about it.

LEMON: No, it's not dark at all and that's what you said, you don't hate. Do you forgive? I know you can't forget, but do you forgive?

BERNIER: It might take a little while. It might take a little while.

LEMON: Yeah. Well, I can see and I feel your presence. You are a good man. And I just -- it's just so awful. I am so sorry. And -- and -- and I appreciate you so much for sharing your story and especially her story so that we can pay tribute to her and you can honor her here on -- on international television. Thank you so much. OK?

BERNIER: Yeah. And -- and I -- may I say that her son is almost just as beautiful a person. And she's -- she -- she loved me like nobody has ever loved me. And I think a lot of people feel the same way.

LEMON: Thanks, Philippe. Be well. We'll be right back.

BERNIER: Thank you.

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[23:55:00]

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LEMON: Over the past several months, hundreds of school children in Northern Nigeria have been kidnapped. Many remain captives, pawns of terrorists in a place where militants have killed tens of thousands and displaced millions more. Some young victims from both sides of the Boko Haram conflict have found hope for brighter futures. Thanks to this week's CNN hero.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ZANNAH MUSTAPHA, CNN HERO: These are children who do not even know what's their second name, what's their tribe, their religion. Children who are not even having this war. They are confused and in a helpless state. You need to give them courage. You have to give them hope.