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Don Lemon Tonight
NYT: Rep. Matt Gaetz Sought Preemptive Pardon In The Final Weeks Of Trump's Presidency; Interview With Sen. John Hickenlooper (D- CO); MLB Moves All-Star Game From Atlanta To Denver In Wake Of Georgian's New Restrictive Voting Laws; Joe Biden Focusing On Infrastructure Plan; The Derek Chauvin Trial For George Floyd's Death; Study Reveals Key New Details About Who January 6 Rioters Were And Where They Came From; Coronavirus Pandemic In The United States. Aired 11p-12a ET
Aired April 06, 2021 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[23:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DON LEMON, CNN HOST (on camera): There's new developments tonight on the embattled Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz, who is under investigation now by the Justice Department over allegations of sex trafficking and prostitution.
"The New York Times" reporting that Gaetz asked the Trump White House in its final days for a preemptive blanket pardon for himself and unidentified Congressional allies.
Also tonight Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell slamming American corporations for taking a public stand against Georgia's restrictive new voting law but saying it's fine for companies to still make political contributions. President Biden who has been highly critical of laws restricting ballot access applauding businesses for speaking out and taking action.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: It's reassuring to see that for-profit operations and businesses are speaking up about how these new Jim Crow laws are just antithetical to who we are. The best way to deal with this is for Georgia and other states to smarten up. Stop it. Stop it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): And at the murder trial of ex-police officer Derek Chauvin, a Minneapolis police training instructor testifying that Chauvin putting his knee on George Floyd's neck is not a restraining tactic taught by the department.
I want to turn now to the new reporting on Congressman Matt Gaetz. Joining me now CNN's senior political analyst Mr. John Avlon. John, good evening. Thank you so much for joining us. I appreciate it. Let's get into this. I want to get your reaction to this New York Times report that
Congressman Matt Gaetz asked the Trump White House for a blanket pardon for himself and Congressional allies for any crimes that may have committed. It's unclear if Gaetz knew he was under investigation at the time, but it's a new development in the story tonight.
JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (on camera): It sure is. I mean, again, part of the problems with the preemptive blanket pardon is that usually the person who asks for it is afraid they've done something wrong. Now, to their credit the Trump White House has that request, but let's not forget the crucial bit of evidence here or information that is completely destroys any claims of a political witch hunt.
The investigation that Gaetz is apparently wrapped up in began under the Trump DOJ. Don't forget that. It's basic. So this new bit of information at the Times is important. And (inaudible) perhaps something was on his mine, because people who ask for blanket preemptive pardons usually got something that's eating at them.
LEMON: Alright. Let's talk about these voting laws, OK. Because now, you know, this push to make voting harder. President Biden is telling states like Georgia to stop it. You heard him in a soundbite. Just stop it. GOP knows that these voter suppression laws, they know it's suppressing the vote here. Are they winning now? Is this fight only going to escalate?
AVLON: The fight is escalating. But I think Republicans are on the back foot. Look, these efforts are being pushed in states across the country by the GOP and let make no mistake, they are being pushed because and in reaction to Trump's big lie. And the basic standard should be it either makes it easier or harder to vote.
In America we should be making it easier to vote. And for all the specifics and folks can raise issues about what actually went down in the Georgia bill, by basically (inaudible) the ability for partisans to take control of the voting apparatus, that's in no way consistent with the American ideals here.
So corporations backing the Democrat's position, albeit belatedly, Democrats got some wind at their sails. But Republicans are going to still make this efforts in the states. This is not going away any time soon. This is one of the defining fights of our time.
LEMON (on camera): Yes. It certainly is. You're right about that. I want to bring in now contributing writer to the Atlantic, Jemele Hill, she's here with us now. Jemele, welcome. Let's talk about this more. Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell is slamming corporations for coming out against Georgia's new voting restrictions. This is what he said today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): My warning if you will, to Corporate America is to stay out of politics. It's not what you're designed for. Republicans buy stock, and fly on planes and drink Coca-Cola, too. So what I'm saying here is I think this is quite stupid to jump in the middle of a highly controversial issue.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): So Jemele, this is coming from a man who spent years raising massive amounts of money from corporations in the name of free speech. This is rich.
JEMELE HILL, STAFF WRITER, THE ATLANTIC (on camera): Yeah. It's rich. It's hypocritical, and he just basically gave them the corporate version of shut up and dribble. You're fine to contribute as much money as possible to their campaigns, but shut up and don't actually worry about where your money is going or for that matter, what it's being used for.
[23:05:04]
And we shouldn't really be surprised. I mean, Mitch McConnell has been somebody who has stood in the way of democracy for his entire political career. He's one of the worst politicians this country has ever seen. And so for him to after he said all that to say oh, but keep donating, though. It's like does -- like, make it make sense, Don. Make it make sense.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Well, it's not -- Jemele, it's not just McConnell. I mean, many Republicans are slamming MLB's decision to move the All-Star game from Georgia to Colorado. Do you think this is going to make other corporations think twice about taking a stand now?
HILL: No. Because they don't really have a leg to stand on. Because listen, the reality is, like, they need corporate contributions. And we saw many corporations after the insurrection decide to shut off that money supply to them. And they don't want to be the enemy of the corporate community because at the end of the day, they need the corporate community.
And so rather than being on the right side of history, the Republicans have just chosen to me a no-win situation, and something that's going to make their party extinct a lot faster. I said this repeatedly and it bears repeating every time I have a microphone and a platform. Rather than come up with a way to compete for votes, to create a new vision, the Republicans would rather restrict people from voting.
And to me that's never going to be a winning strategy. It's like if your ideas are so much better, prove it. Why is your entire strategy built on not just a lie but built on restriction? If you really think that you have the future of this country in mind, create a vision.
Actually compete for votes. Appeal to people. I know it's an outdated concept, but the reality is that conservatives have no platform. They have no position. All they have is outrage at things like the Little Nas ex-video and Dr. Seuss. That's all they got.
(LAUGHTER)
AVLON: Look, you're totally right about the cancel culture distraction move here, but I think the problem is McConnell --
LEMON: Hold on, John, before you get to that, I will let you finish, John. This is not cancel culture, because the Democrats didn't want the MLB to take this game away from Atlanta. Stacey Abrams and Senator Warnock both said don't do it. It was the corporations saying this is inconsistent with our beliefs.
It's the same thing with Dr. Seuss. It was the company and the family behind Dr. Seuss who removed the books. It wasn't Democrats or Joe Biden, even though Republicans are trying to make this a Joe Biden thing that he's the one cancelling or somehow Democrats are the ones cancelling MLB and Dr. Seuss. Go on, John. Sorry.
AVLON: That's an important point, right. A lot of this is just the outrage Olympics is a distraction play by Republicans to try to keep folks' eyes off the ball about underlying policy. And we could have great big debates. The reason that Republicans -- that the corporations are stepping up on an issue is that this isn't a question of policy anymore.
This is about do you believe in democracy and making it easier or harder to folks to vote? We could say that McConnell believed all these years' that corporations should play a greater role in politics. He put his name on an FEC complaint that went to the Supreme Court to get corporations to spend more money.
But the problem with this is where we are because of the big lie, this is not a basic debate about whether you think money is speech. This is about whether you believe democracy should be opened or closed and that transcends considerations in corporations, they're listening to their constituents, their employees, their customers and taking a stand, belatedly in some cases, but taking a stand, and that's why this is different than a political debates in the past.
LEMON: John, Jemele, we love having you. Thank you so much. Good to see you, next time.
AVLON: Alright.
HILL: Thanks, Don.
LEMON: I want to bring in now Democratic Senator John Hickenlooper of Colorado. Senator, good to see you as well. Thank you so much. So, let's talk about this.
SEN. JOHN HICKENLOOPER (D-CO) (on camera): Nice to see you.
LEMON: Yes. Absolutely. The minority leader Mitch McConnell calling corporations, stupid for getting involved in voting rights. Is he just upset that they aren't on board with the false voter fraud claims and voter suppression agenda of the GOP?
HICKENLOOPER: I don't think I can speak to Senator McConnell's motives, but I can tell you that this is not a partisan issue. As you guys were just saying, this is all about democracy. And whether you believe in democracy, and I think most of the businesses in America when given the opportunity will stand up and say that they are for more people voting.
You know, when we switch over to all mail ballots in 2013, that next year of 2014 we had the highest turnout ever. We had no incidents of fraudulent voting in any way. We had a statistically accurate assessment done, and at the same time, Cory Gardner, my predecessor got elected to the U.S. Senate.
This last election in the primary we had slightly larger percentage of Republicans voted in the primary than do Democrats. This isn't partisan. It's about trying to make it easier to vote and there by encouraging more people to pay attention, get involved in the issues, and vote.
[23:10:03]
LEMON: I'm glad you said that, because you knew Senator Tim Scott was comparing Colorado to Georgia. What did you think of that comparison?
HICKENLOOPER: Well, I didn't hear him, but I've seen it on paper. It doesn't hold up. I mean, the bottom line is we send everybody a paper ballot. Now we don't have as many days of early voting, because almost everybody over 95 percent of our voters vote by mail, because they've gotten into the rhythm of it, the pattern of it.
LEMON: Before COVID? This is before COVID.
HICKENLOOPER: This is before COVID. So -- and the fact when COVID came, we knew we already had a safe way to vote. The notion that somehow their system is comparable to what Colorado has. In Georgia they have one black box for every 100,000 voters. In Colorado I think it's every 6,000 or every 8,000 voters. So there are many more places where you can drop off your ballots and know that they're going to get counted. The systems are very, very different.
LEMON: Yeah. So, let's talk about what's happening now with the MLB. Republicans are slamming the MLB's decision claiming that your state's voting laws are more restrictive, again in Georgia on top of that. But this is what our fact-checker found out, to get more specific about what you said.
Daniel Dale said that it is highly dishonest and I wanted to know what your reaction is to the GOP pushing this misinformation. First, I would mention what Tim Scott said, but he's not the only one there making this claim.
HICKENLOOPER: Some of my friends, I was out at Easter brunch and friends were giving the same argument, but it is based on the wrong facts. The key is what we tried to do in Colorado is get more people to vote every election. What people forget is that Colorado's system was created by Republican and Democratic County clerks working together.
The majority were Republicans. And they had a shared vision that they wanted more people to vote. They wanted to someday get to 100 percent voting. That's the vision. Isn't that what this democracy should be based on? LEMON: There is -- listen, there is this massive voting rights issue
going on across this country. But now the president is focusing on infrastructure instead. Is that the right focus? Is that a mistake? Is he right?
HICKENLOOPER: Well, certainly right now people are going to be talking about voting for a while. But I think infrastructure is exactly the right next step. This is -- I mean, people have been talking about Franklin Roosevelt and the great depression.
It's really -- it's more similar to the years after World War II where this country invested in infrastructure at every level and made investments over the next 12 or 15 years that paid dividends for the citizens of this country for 50, 60, 70 years and we can do that again. And we have to do that again. The world is changing. We've got to reenergize our economy and our ability to compete on the world stage.
LEMON: Senator, thank you. I appreciate it. I'll see you soon. Be safe, all right?
HICKENLOOPER: Always a pleasure.
LEMON (on camera): Thank you very much.
America is watching the trial of the police officer -- ex-police officer charged with the murder of George Floyd for kneeling on his neck for 9.5 minutes, but there may be nobody watching more closely than the people in the neighborhood. We're going to hear from them coming up.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHILONISE FLOYD, GEORGE FLOYD'S BROTHER: After we get the verdict and we get this conviction, we'll be able to breathe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:15:00]
LEMON (on camera): Nearly a year after George Floyd's death, the pain and sorrow of what happened to him still raw in the Minneapolis community where he died. Residents closely watching Derek Chauvin's murder trial. Some saying it's painful to hear the testimony, but they have to be witness to the trial because George Floyd is now a part of their community forever.
Here's CNN's Sara Sidner.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Few are watching the trial more closely than the folks in the neighborhood where George Floyd took his last breaths. UNKNOWN: Everybody that comes in takes a look at the trial.
SIDNER: Inside Cup Foods the place where Floyd allegedly paid for cigarettes with a counterfeit $20 bill, every day the television is set to the trial of the former officer accused of killing him.
UNKNOWN: This is the training that you received?
UNKNOWN: This is the training --
UNKNOWN: It's sad. It's so sad. And it's really sad to watch it in the raw.
SIDNER: Minneapolis resident Tracie Cowers came in for her breakfast with her dog, Adore. Cowers reveals what everyone around here already knows. The strongest of emotions are just under the surface here. One scratch, this time in the form of a question and sorrow flows out.
How hard is it to watch this trial?
TRACIE COWERS, MINNEAPOLIS RESIDENT: Its mind boggling how somebody is here to serve and protect and they're the very ones who harm you. Not all, but some.
SIDNER: She says she can't look away even though it hurts to watch.
Why are you packing?
The store owners say they have received both love and hate. Especially after their former cashier testified he was the one who took the alleged fake bill from Floyd.
CHRISTOPHER MARTIN, FORMER STORE EMPLOYEE, PROSECUTION WITNESS: The policy was that if you took the counterfeit bill you had to pay for it out of your paycheck.
SIDNER: Christopher Martin, a teenager, tried rectifying it with Floyd. That didn't work and police were called. Martin now regrets that.
MARTIN: If I would have just not taken the bill, this could have been avoided.
SIDNER: The store owner, Mahmoud Abumayyaleh says the store has received dozens of fake bills over time.
MAHMOUD ABUMAYYALEH, OWNER, CUP FOODS: When employees do take counterfeit bills, part of our training is we tell them they are going to be responsible to pay for it just as a deterrent. We've never made an employee pay for a counterfeit bill.
[23:20:03]
SIDNER: The store has also receive threats. But most people are sending support via stacks of mail for Christopher Martin and phone calls from all over the country. UNKNOWN: I just thought I would make a call to you to see if there was
something we could do.
SIDNER: We happened to be there during one of those calls.
UNKNOWN: You've done a wonderful job in raising him. This is what we need to do in society.
SIDNER: Outside the Cup Foods store, there is not just a memorial to George Floyd anymore. It's more of a community center. There is community gatherings that happened at the former gas station and there's a community garden that all of the people help plant and take care of.
On any given day, Jay Webb, a former professional basketball player, is in the square planting hope and beauty.
UNKNOWN: We beautify the situation.
SIDNER: Feet away, Floyd took his last breath last year. Then in March of this year, another man's body lay dying outside the store. He was shot and killed by a resident. Neighbors, business owners and activists are battling back violence and arguing over the barriers that have closed off the streets to traffic to the square for nearly a year now. But there is still love and light being shared here.
JAY WEBB, THE GARDENER, OF GEORGE FLOYD SQUARE: This is our response. Do your worst and we'll do our best. This is his. This is his, every direction. Peace and love.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON (on camera): Well done, Sara. Well done. You really brought the community home here. You have been in Minneapolis since it started, throughout this trial. Has any particular testimony really resonated with the folks there?
SIDNER (on camera): Absolutely. In talking to folks about what they've been watching, and look, it's hard for anyone to watch that video over and over again, and not just the bystander video that we're all familiar with, but all of the body camera videos that were worn by each of the officers.
Some of that was new to the public. The thing that they remember, though, it's interesting. They remember Charles McMillen. I know you remember him as well. He was the guy that everybody knows in the neighborhood.
LEMON: Nosey.
SIDNER: Who stopped and had -- nosey guy. He said it himself. He joked about it. But he was remembered, because he is 61 years old. They know him in the neighborhood. And to see that man break down the way he did sobbing on the stand really resonated with people. They understood how he felt and what he went through, because they, too, are from the neighborhood, and they, too, felt like they themselves had been attacked.
And then Christopher Martin, the young man, the teenager who said he felt guilty. He felt guilty about doing his job. And he did what he was asked to do when he asked George Floyd about that attempt to hand over an alleged counterfeit bill and then going and talking to him and then trying to do his job and then being upset that eventually his -- he told his manager who eventually then got someone else to call police. He felt like it was his fault in some way.
And people felt really strongly about that. That he shouldn't feel that way and he shouldn't be left with that guilt. And interestingly, the last person that was mentioned a lot was Lieutenant Zimmerman, the most senior member of the Minneapolis Police Department who has been there 35 years and he was unequivocal about what he thought he saw that day in seeing that video of his colleague which you don't often here police officers criticizing their colleague.
But in seeing that video of Derek Chauvin and saying that's not how it's done. That's not the way we do this. That it was wrong what he did, that really struck people. I asked someone about what they thought about the police chief, you know, what they thought about Madera Arradondo, getting up the stand as the chief and saying that is not our policy. It is not our ethics.
And you know what they said? And this is what I found really interesting. The two of three people who responded to me when I asked them, they said it wasn't surprising to us, because we know that guy. We know that chief. He's our chief, as they put it. He is the community chief.
So to them, they sort of expected him to come forward and say what he thought and tell the truth from his perspective. But it was the other officers and some of the witnesses that they really had an impact on the people there. Don?
LEMON: Sara, thanks for bringing us to the neighborhood and helping us to understand the community.
SIDNER: Sure.
LEMON: We really appreciate it. Sara Sidner.
Day seven of testimony in the Chauvin trial there in Minneapolis and we have got the biggest moments for you, that's next.
Plus 95 percent white and 85 percent male. We're digging into who stormed the Capitol? That's ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:25:00]
LEMON (on camera): The prosecution in the Derek Chauvin trial building on their case that he violated policy and did not use an authorized neck restraint in the arrest of George Floyd. One expert also testifying the use of force was excessive and officers should have stopped applying force once Floyd stopped resisting. There was some inconsistencies in today's testimony with two witnesses appearing to contradict each other.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ERIC NELSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR DEREK CHAUVIN: Have you ever been trained or trained others to, say when a person can talk, they can breathe?
UNKNOWN: It's been said, yes.
[23:30:00]
STEVE SCHLEICHER, PROSECUTING ATTORNEY: You trained officers that if a person can talk, it means that they can breathe?
UNKNOWN: No, sir.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (on camera): So I want to bring in now CNN senior legal analyst Laura Coates. Laura, good evening to you.
We've heard from multiple police officials and trainers saying that Chauvin violated policy, that his use of force was not a trained restraint. But we also saw witnesses contradict each other. How does that resonate with the jury?
LAURA COATES, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it's, you know, you have to concede the fact that the defense is going to be able to land a couple punches, be able to score a couple points. But actually, landing punches in the ability to deal a real blow is what's at issue here, and they have not done the latter, because they still have not gone to the meat of the matter here.
Of course, no one is contesting, Don, that an officer is allowed to use a reasonable amount of force to subdue and control a suspect. But there is a moment in time the prosecution must prove and they've done a great job so far from when it goes to the reasonable use of force to excessive use of force to going over to criminal assault.
We're getting more and more there, the more witness testimony, the more law enforcement testimony that says this officer knew better and chose to do the opposite of training.
Even if he had some right to be able to impose his body weight the way he did, it does not actually answer the one question the prosecution, if you're the defense, needs to answer, which is why did he maintain that deadly force? Why did he sustain it over nine minutes when the person obviously was no longer breathing, was no longer talking, was not resisting arrest --
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
COATES: -- and did not have a pulse?
LEMON (on camera): Yeah. The defense in cross-examination is trying to bolster their argument that the crowd may have distracted Chauvin, that bystanders didn't understand what was going on. Listen to this, Laura.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ERIC NELSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Does it make it more difficult to assess a patient?
UNKNOWN: It does.
NELSON: Does it make it more likely that you may miss signs that a patient is experiencing something?
UNKNOWN: Yes.
NELSON: And so the distraction can actually harm the potential care of the patient?
UNKNOWN: Yes.
NELSON (voice-over): You would describe sometimes that the public doesn't understand that police actions can look really bad?
UNKNOWN: That's what I've said, yes.
NELSON (voice-over): And -- but they still may be lawful even if they look bad, right?
UNKNOWN: Yes, sir.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON (voice-over): So this is -- these are other examples of what you were saying about the defense will be able to land some punches, score some -- some points in these exchanges?
COATES: None of those were any of the punches that were landed here. And here is why. Because it wasn't as if Derek Chauvin and the other three officers were trying to perform a duty of care in the middle of the street at the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade.
They were off to the side and the -- quote, unquote -- "unruly crowd" that was so distracting was actually imploring them to render aid. They weren't distracting them from other things and weren't suggesting to Chauvin that he do cartwheels or anything else. They weren't suggesting that he act more aggressively. They were imploring him to render aid.
There's a big distinction from a distraction of people unable to perform because of the interference in a way that jeopardizes the performance of care. That wasn't this.
And we also can contrast this, Don, to what we saw from the paramedics who arrived on the scene, who also spoke about wanting to move George Floyd into the ambulance to be able to perform their duty of care as well. But guess what. They were nimble and flexible in the application of their duty of care. They did not just simply decide not to provide that care.
Again, an unanswered question here. Even if the crowd was distracting in a way that was telling them to do the opposite of what they should have done, which was provide care, they made no effort as far as we know from any testimony to provide any duty of care.
It goes back to the statement from the opening statement, from Mr. Blackwell. If they're in the custody of the police, they're owed a duty of care. And what bigger sign could there be to these officers than people shouting out, at the very least, take his pulse, he is not breathing, you're hurting him, and calling the police on the police?
LEMON: Laura Coates, we'll be watching tomorrow, Laura. Thank you so much. Appreciate you joining us this late, staying up late for us. We appreciate it.
COATES: Thank you.
LEMON (on camera): Which of these people stormed the Capitol? Well, my next guests, well, they've been digging through the data and they may have found a clue.
And ahead, President Biden says vaccine deliveries in overdrive now, but the fight against COVID is not over.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think if everyone continues down the road where I'm now, it will be behind us. But it's not over yet.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Well, three months after the Capitol insurrection, 140 national security leaders are calling on Congress to form a January 6th commission. The bipartisan group of former secretaries of defense, homeland security, and senior intelligence officials, they want a full investigation into the attack on the Capitol.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's plan to create a January 6th commission has been stalled. That as new research reveals a very different picture than you might think of who the rioters are and where they come from.
[23:39:58]
LEMON: Joining me now to discuss the man behind this is Robert Pape, a professor of political science at the University of Chicago and director of Chicago Project of Security Threats. Thank you, sir. Good to have you on.
ROBERT PAPE, POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF CHICAGO: Yep.
LEMON: I appreciate it. So --
PAPE: Thank you for having me on.
LEMON: So talk to me about your -- the study, analyzing 377 people who have been arrested for -- or charged in connection with the riot, where they come, why they may have decided to attack the Capitol. You say 95 percent are white, 85 percent are male. What else did you find out?
PAPE: Well, with the large research team at the University of Chicago Project on Security and Threats, we've done an exhaustive study looking at all of the demographics of the individuals, the 377 from court documents, and also the county characteristics of where they come from.
And we made striking discoveries. First, economic causes don't seem to play much of a role. Why? Forty-five percent of the 377 are either business owners, CEOs or other -- come from other white collar occupations, doctors, lawyers, accountants.
So this doesn't mean -- poverty doesn't look like a good explanation. We also looked at militant group membership. And yes, there are Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, Three Percenters, but they only make up a little over 12 percent. Eighty-seven percent are not affiliated with right- wing militant groups like the Proud Boys.
So we went through there and we started to look at the characteristics of the counties they came from. We discovered some very striking things about the counties. First of all, over half of the counties they came from are counties Biden won. And that's very striking because these are blue counties and not coming from the reddest parts.
And then we went further and we further analyzed the counties, and we discovered a very striking feature, which is the -- most of the insurrectionists are coming from the counties in America that have seen the largest decrease in non-Hispanic white population.
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
PAPE: This is an extremely striking finding. It holds when you control for population size, distance to Washington D.C., just about everything -- even percent Trump vote. That is the more rural the county, less likely to send in insurrectionists, the more Trump vote in the county, the less likely to send in insurrectionists.
These are all pro-Trump people to be sure. But it's the loss of white population, growing diversity, which is the main characteristic of their counties.
LEMON: I don't think that's surprising because that's a fear, right? That it's a fear that the demographics are changing where they're from. So I think that makes sense. And also, you said where white populations are growing the fastest. There's a fear there. That makes sense to me.
But you've also done -- and it's also not surprising, by the way, you said they come from counties that Biden won. They're probably upset that Biden won their county, right, instead of the president. So that -- the former president --
PAPE: Yeah. The big surprise --
LEMON: Go on, sorry.
PAPE: The big surprise, Don, is we have the hard evidence to back that up.
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
PAPE: You see, we now have the evidence that we can really show people systemically and help open their eyes.
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
PAPE: So today, when the studies come out, I've gotten lots of e-mails from people, some who say, oh, I'm not surprised, but others who say, wow, I just didn't know.
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
PAPE: And that's one of the things that social science really offers.
LEMON: Yeah. You also have done some digging into other forces driving some of this fear, some of this anger that's related to right-wing conspiracies.
PAPE: Yeah.
LEMON: It's known as the great replacement theory. Tell me about that.
PAPE: Yeah. So this is the idea that Hispanic people and Black people's rights are outpacing the rights of whites. And we found that this is a fear that's driving many Americans to this day to believe that the election was stolen and also to be willing to participate in a violent protest.
And how did we know that? We conducted a nationally representative sample with the National Opinion Research Council at the University of Chicago, one of the world's most prestigious polling agencies, and we did a detailed study of what Americans think.
And what we discovered is that four percent of all American adults, that's 10 million adults, believe both that the election was stolen and say they would participate in a violent protest. That's much larger than I thought going into this.
[23:45:02]
PAPE: Talking with people like former Secretary of DHS Don (ph) Johnson, much larger than he would have thought. And what we maybe thought before is, well, maybe it's one percent or less of Americans, but four percent? This is a serious and why the biggest risk factor was their fear of the great replacement.
This is something now we need to take very seriously as a country because it not only explains January 6th, it's not only true today, but it may lead to making volatile politics even more volatile in 2022. This needs to become now a national priority with much greater effort to vote and understand this phenomenon, and very important we start that now.
LEMON: We love having you on. We're going to have you back. Thank you for this incredible information. We learned so much. I appreciate it, Professor Pape.
PAPE: Thank you for having me.
LEMON: Thank you.
PAPE: Thank you very much.
LEMON: President Biden marking 150 million vaccines in arms. But with variants spreading, he is warning we are in a life and death race.
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[23:50:00]
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LEMON (on camera): President Biden reminding Americans today that the battle against COVID-19 is far from over, and announcing all American adults will be eligible for the vaccine within two weeks.
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BIDEN: By no later than April 19th, in every part of this country, every adult over the age of 18 or older will be eligible to be vaccinated. No more confusing rules. No more confusing restrictions.
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LEMON: Knock, knock. Let's let in the medical analyst, Dr. Jonathan Reiner, CNN medical analyst for our nightly house call. Thank you, sir. Good to see you.
So, during his visit to a vaccination site today, the president is announcing that he is moving up the date of eligibility for all adults to be vaccinated. How much is this going to help?
JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST, DIRECTOR OF CARDIAC CATHETERIZATION PROGRAM AT GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL: It's going help a lot. This is something that we've been talking about for the last few weeks. The variants are infecting young people.
You know, again, if you look at the data out of Massachusetts over the last two weeks, about half of the people who have been infected are under 30. And these are largely people who have not been vaccinated. And moving this up to just a couple weeks from now will help get shots in those arms and that's going to put this virus down. It's big news and it's coming not a minute too soon.
LEMON: Yeah. You know we're vaccinating people faster than ever with the seven-day average of three million doses, more than 40 percent of adults with at least one shot. But the U.K. variant is now in all 50 states now, doctor. What does that mean in terms of how long this drags out?
REINER: So the U.K. variant is more contagious. Think about this. The mutation is in the spike protein that the virus uses to attach to respiratory lining cells. So what it basically does is make the virus stickier.
LEMON: Mm-hmm.
REINER: So which means you can get infected with a smaller inoculum, smaller amount of virus, more casual contact, that's why this virus is infecting more people and that's why we need to vaccinate people.
The good news is that all three of the licensed vaccines in the United States are super effective against the U.K. variant. The best way to prevent getting it, wear a mask and get vaccinated.
LEMON: Yeah. There is a new study published in The Journal Lancet Psychiatry saying as many as one in three people infected with COVID- 19 have longer term mental health and neurological symptoms diagnosed within six months of their infection. Is that the next chapter of this pandemic, treating long haulers?
REINER: Yeah, what a fascinating disease. And maybe for the first time in human history, the world is learning about a disease in real time. Right, this study out of the U.K., over 230,000 people infected with COVID. And yeah, about 30 percent of the time out at six months, you can find evidence of either neurologic or psychiatric disease. And it's more frequent the sicker you are, particularly things like anxiety.
So, while it's true that the vast majority of folks will thankfully recover from COVID, it's not without its cost. And a lot of people, according to this study, suffer from either neurologic or psychiatric problems going forward. So, best not to get it.
LEMON: Today, Dr. Anthony Fauci saying the spread among children is largely happening during team sports where children are often unmasked. Not so much in the classroom. What are the reasons for that? And what should parents do? I guess it's just obvious, right? They're in contact with each other and all breathing on --
REINER: Without masks.
LEMON: Yeah.
REINER: Right. You know, if they're playing baseball or if they're playing lacrosse or basketball, they're probably doing without a mask. Masking in the classroom, spacing the kids out in the classroom have really helped to prevent spread between students.
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REINER: But that sort of falls apart when you get out on to the ball field or on to the basketball court. So it's a cautionary tale. And I think whenever possible, when it's realistic to wear a mask, kids should still wear a mask playing sports whenever it's possible because you can transmit the virus through close contact, particularly with the U.K. variant, which as I said is more sticky and more contagious.
LEMON: Yeah. Doctor, have a good night. Good to see you.
REINER: You too, Don. Thank you so much.
LEMON: Thank you. Thanks for watching, everyone. Our coverage continues.
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ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening. Ahead tonight, a rare revealing and sometimes surprising look at how the Derek Chauvin trial is being seen by people watching it.
