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Don Lemon Tonight

Trump Ally Says Giuliani Was A Show Of Force That Sent A Strong Message To A Lot Of People In Trump's World; Poll, Most Republicans Say Joe Biden Win Not Legitimate; Special Congressional Election In Texas; Man Dies In Police Custody After Being Restrained On His Stomach For Five Minutes; Families of Victims of Police Violence are Pushing for Passage of George Floyd Justice in Policing Ac; Fox Propaganda Becoming Policy; "Story of Late Night" Premieres Sunday on CNN. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired April 30, 2021 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: So, we have some breaking news tonight. The federal raid on Rudy Giuliani's home and office sending shock waves through the former president's inner circle. A Trump adviser telling CNN it's a show of force that sent a strong message. And now there are concerns more investigations could be coming. A defiant Rudy Giuliani condemning federal prosecutors, accusing them of being politically motivated and corrupt.

Also, tonight, a new poll shows a clear majority of Republicans do not believe Joe Biden's victory is legitimate. Joining me now, CNN White House correspondent John Harwood and Washington Post columnist Max Boot. Here we go, gentlemen. Post-truth society. Post-reality society. Good to see both of you. Thanks for joining.

John, you first. I've got to get your take on this new reporting that people in Trump world are worried about the FBI raid of Rudy Giuliani's office and apartment, that it sends a strong message that others could be next. You covered the Trump administration extensively, John. How bad could this get for Trump?

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Look, there's good reason for them to be concerned because the events that have gotten Rudy Giuliani in trouble are not just some random dealings by the former New York City mayor with a random country of Ukraine. This is all an extension of the interference in our elections by Russia that began in 2016 when Donald Trump hired a Putin-aligned campaign manager who had worked in Ukraine, for a Ukrainian leader.

He worked with a Russian intelligence agent. The Treasury Department told us that a couple of weeks ago, Konstantin Kilimnik. And Russia sided with Donald Trump in the election. Big investigation about that. Robert Mueller couldn't -- didn't find sufficient evidence of a conspiracy. He did find some evidence that Donald Trump tried to cover it up. You get to 2020, Russia is trying to interfere again. How? Well,

Russia was trying to shield itself from responsibility for having interfered the first time, spread the misinformation that Ukraine was involved. At the same time that Donald Trump was pressuring the Ukrainian government for dirt on Joe Biden to help him. That's what got him impeached. And Rudy Giuliani was working with a Russian-linked Ukrainian member of parliament also to get dirt on Joe Biden.

So, this is all part of the same thing. Now, is there any probability that there would be a demonstrable criminal conspiracy that you could prove in what Rudy Giuliani was doing? We don't know the answer to that. He hasn't been charged with anything.

But to the extent that that is a possibility, that that's the backdrop here, Rudy Giuliani, the deeper he gets in trouble, the more potential there is if he knows things that Donald Trump has done specifically that would get Donald Trump in hot water. He'd have every reason to tell prosecutors that.

LEMON: Yes. Max, I want to talk to you about this new poll, when I said this whole post-truth thing. A new CNN poll showing that 70 percent of Republicans believe Trump's big lie that President Biden's victory wasn't legitimate. 70 percent. How dangerous is it that the overwhelming majority of a major political party appears to be completely out of touch with reality?

MAX BOOT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: I think it's very dangerous, Don. I think it's a clear and present danger to our democracy. There really are not a lot of examples of a major political movement like the Republican Party becoming so completely untethered from reality.

And the examples that we know of in places like Hungary, and Poland and Turkey, they're very ominous because those parties have tended to go in a very authoritarian direction where they believe conspiracy theories and they glorify and deify their supreme leader and are completely out of touch with fact-based reality.

And that unfortunately describes my former Party, the Republican Party, as you just mentioned. New poll showing 70 percent of Republicans don't concede that Joe Biden won the election legitimately even though we know there is no fraud. There is no demonstrable fraud. Trump and the Republicans tried to find it. They couldn't find it. It didn't exist.

This is just complete nonsense, and yet this is very dangerous nonsense, which is believed by most Republicans just as also, you know, they also -- something like almost half of Republicans believe that Derek Chauvin, the Minneapolis police officer, was actually innocent.

[23:05:08]

And by contrast, only 11 percent, only 11 percent of Republicans think that global warming will present a danger to us in our lifetimes. So this is clearly a Party that has increasingly divorced from reality. And yet within a couple of years, they could once again be the majority Party in the House and the Senate. That's incredibly dangerous.

LEMON: Well, let me ask you, then. I mean the question is, with all of that, then why? Who are -- what does one have to be in order to be co- opted or exploited in that way? How does -- how does -- why? That's the question. Why.

HARWOOD: Terrified.

BOOT: Well, this is -- you know, I think this is really the litmus test of the Republican Party is now the willingness to engage in this big lie. It used to be abortion or gun rights or something else. Now it's having to get up there and to lie and to claim that Donald Trump actually won the election.

And the few Republicans who are not willing to say that people like Congresswoman Liz Cheney or Congressman Adam Kinzinger, they are pariahs. They are outcasts. They are being driven out of the Republican Party. In the mainstream, this has become what you have to say because this is what the base hears from Fox News, from Newsmax.

This is what they see on Facebook and YouTube and so forth. It's this self-reinforcing, hermetically sealed circle of nonsense, which is what the Republican Party believes now. It's, you know, very worrisome, very disquieting and very bad news for the future of our democracy.

LEMON: Terrifying, John? Why did you say that?

HARWOOD: Well, because you've got a segment -- the dominant segment of the Republican Party that is blue collar white voters, especially rural voters and white Evangelical Christians who see the United States and the world changing in ways that they think leaves them behind. They're less educated. They are less connected to the global economy in ways that people in large metropolitan areas are.

They see the demographic change in the United States, the cultural change in the United States. We're going to be a majority minority country by the middle of this century. And so that's the reality of how the world is changing and where the United States is going.

And they -- that feels to them like they're being shoved aside. And so they want to deny the reality. They want to pretend that it doesn't exist, that they still ought to have the controlling voice in American politics. And it's a large enough group -- it's a shrinking group.

It's not a majority of the country, of course, but it's a large enough group that when mobilized and given the distribution of electoral votes in states and the way House districts are drawn and the way the Senate is constructed to favor smaller rural states, they punch way beyond their weight in terms of political power.

And so Donald Trump inflamed, aroused, inspired those people. That's how he got elected even though he didn't get a majority of the popular vote in 2016. He came fairly close to winning an electoral majority this time. Narrow margins in the decisive states even though he lost the popular vote by more than he did in 2020. And so as long as you have this group feeling endangered that still

has a substantial amount of power, they have an interest in constructing and preserving their own reality as against the way the country is actually moving.

LEMON: Yes, and that's why you have all these voter suppression laws that are being enacted around the country, because as you said, they are a growing minority, still very vocal, right, and big enough. But they want to be able to hang on to that power. Thank you, gentlemen. I appreciate it. I've got to move on to the next guest.

So, I'm going to bring in now Nick Akerman, he is the former U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York. Nick, I'm so glad to have you on because I've been wanting to talk to you about this, get your perspective on this. Good evening to you.

So, you raise a really interesting point about this raid on Rudy Giuliani, that prosecutors would need information that is current to get a warrant, not six months old. So what does that tell you about this investigation?

NICK AKERMAN, MSNBC LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it tells me one of two things. I mean the press reports that we're hearing now is that this is all about Ukraine. But don't forget this particular search warrant, at least as it's reported, was brought before the Trump Justice Department six, nine months ago.

In order to get a judge to issue a search warrant, the prosecutors have to show probable cause. They have to show facts that are current, that are not stale, that the evidence of the crime was in Rudy Giuliani's apartment, it was in his office.

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And to just have the same warrant that was issued six, nine months ago wouldn't cut mustard here. You have to have new facts. And so from that, knowing that they have to have current information that the evidence is in the apartment and is in the office, that means either one of two things. Either there is a mole inside Rudy Giuliani's operation that has basically told the FBI that that evidence is still there or, two, it's a totally different crime that they're really looking at, and it's something more current.

For example -- and this, again, is speculation, but it's based on the speculation that to have a search warrant issued, particularly under these circumstances with a prominent individual, a former mayor of New York, a lawyer to the president of the United States, you absolutely would have to have current information as to where the evidence lies, that is, in the apartment or in the office.

So for example, we know that the FBI is out there arresting a lot of people out of the January 6 insurrection, and a lot of these people are being enticed to cooperate, are cooperating, and are telling things to the FBI. If, for example, Rudy Giuliani, who was on the ellipse with Donald Trump the day of the insurrection, inciting people, basically telling them it was trial by combat, that in a sense, what they could be doing is you could have people out there that have been turned and are saying they had conversations with Giuliani before this whole insurrection started.

And the one way to corroborate that would be to get his electronic information, his communications, and find out if these actual communications occurred. So, it's one of two things. We just don't know because in a search warrant, all of the evidence is in an affidavit that is presented by an FBI agent, and all of that is under seal.

LEMON: Wow.

AKERMAN: So we at this point do not know.

LEMON: Well, you've given us a lot there in one answer and all very succinctly. Thank you, Nick Akerman. I appreciate having you on. We'll have you back.

So, I want to turn now to this special Congressional election in Texas tomorrow that will test former President Trump's hold on the GOP. CNN correspondent Donie O'Sullivan has the story now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNKNOWN: President Trump is still the leader of the Republican Party. I don't think he's going to go anywhere ever.

UNKNOWN: The big lie that President Trump has said since Election Day and January 6th, they really shook me.

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER (voice-over): A battle for the soul of the Republican Party playing out in a special election in Texas.

You're concerned about the direction of the Party?

UNKNOWN: Yeah.

O'SULLIVAN: What do you mean?

UNKNOWN: I think it's time for us to move past Donald Trump.

O'SULLIVAN: That was going to be my question.

UNKNOWN: Oh, good.

O'SULLIVAN: Didn't like the man. Don't like the man.

UNKNOWN: Yes. I think a lot of people like us have been in a really hard position this past four years. I feel like I had to vote for him in November just because the Democrats have gotten so far to the left.

O'SULLIVAN: There are almost a dozen Republicans running here to fill a House seat left by Congressman Ron Wright, who died after contracting COVID-19 in February. But Michael Woods stands alone being the only Republican candidate to run with an explicitly anti-Trump message.

MICHAEL WOOD, CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE (R-TX): I felt like I had to stand up. Somebody needed to stand up and say this isn't what the Republican Party should be, and we've got to go in a different direction.

O'SULLIVAN: This is a district that has been largely Republican but in recent years shown signs of turning blue. There are 10 Democrats running in the race that's expected to go to a runoff with the top two finishers regardless of party.

You're talking to people, telling a lot of voters that the election wasn't stolen. Now these sort of conspiracy theories like QAnon are all B.S. What's the reaction been like on the ground when you're speaking to voters here?

WOOD: I've had people who were actually there on January 6th come up to me, you know, just shaking mad that I'm saying the sort of things that I'm saying about that day and also about President Trump. But I do think that there's about 30 percent to 35 percent of the Party that's open to this message that wants somebody to stand up and say this message.

O'SULLIVAN: So that's a small minority of the Republican Party. What is happening to your party?

WOOD: I don't know, and I'm really concerned about it.

UNKNOWN: The two dirtiest jobs in the world. Professional wrestling, politician, and bull riding.

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O'SULLIVAN: Other Republicans here are firmly on the Trump train, like Dan Rodimer, a former wrestler.

Michael Wood says, you know, what you're embracing here MAGA, what Trump is all about is bad for the Republican Party, bad for the country. What do you say to that?

DAN RODIMER, A FORMER WRESTLER: I disagree with him. I don't think he has any chance of winning unfortunately. He's a great guy, but he's a veteran, but I believe President Trump's agenda, America first agenda, was great with the route we were going.

O'SULLIVAN: Trump endorsed Congressman Ron Wright's widow, Susan Wright, who is running to fill her late husband's seat, giving a late boost to her candidacy in a crowded field. Yet Wright hasn't fully leaned into MAGA in her campaigning, instead focusing more on her husband's legacy.

UNKNOWN: His priorities were strong national defense, strong borders, life and individual liberty.

UNKNOWN: I voted for Susan Wright.

O'SULLIVAN: Michael Wood, he's a Republican and he's voting saying Republicans need to forget about Trump. What do you think about that?

UNKNOWN: Well, I don't think he's going to make a lot of headway. I just think too much of the Party is still very much ingrained with Donald Trump's values.

O'SULLIVAN: Michael Wood and Dan Rodimer represent two opposite poles of the Republican Party in a debate that will define the future of the GOP. Wood might have little hope of success here, but his campaign could help build a blueprint for anti-Trump Republicans in the 2022 midterms.

UNKNOWN: While I tend to vote Democrat, I thought, well, you know, because I'm not huge on a party. I'm huge on what they're standing for. So when you've got a Republican who is interested in changing the direction of the Republican Party is going in, I thought that was good.

O'SULLIVAN: There's a Trump 2024 flag right over there behind one of the candidates. What goes through your mind when you see that?

UNKNOWN: It almost feels like it's intentionally oppressive to somebody that looks like me.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'SULLIVAN: And Don, you know, it really says a lot about the state of the Republican Party when you have a candidate like that, Michael Wood, who is probably not going to win, but that it's controversial within the Republican Party that he is saying the election wasn't stolen. It wasn't actually Antifa that stormed the Capitol on January 6th. He's telling the truth, but that that is a controversial stance to take within the Republican Party. Don?

LEMON: So, Donie, I usually see you out in the field, not in a necktie and suit in front of a fancy background in a New York studio, and there's a reason for that, because this is your first report on the show as an official CNN correspondent, so congratulations to you. Very well deserved.

O'SULLIVAN: Thank you, Don.

LEMON: It looks good on you.

O'SULLIVAN: I don't know who let that happen here, but I'm sure they've been fired.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: Donie O'Sullivan, congratulations.

O'SULLIVAN: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Official, its official now. Great report by the way. Thank you so much.

Three police officers are on administrative leave in California after a 26-year-old man died after a struggle where he spent about five minutes restrained on his stomach, and it happened the day before a jury found Derek Chauvin guilty of murder in the death of George Floyd. I'm going to speak to the family's attorney.

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LEMON: An important story that I want you to pay attention to, OK? So the three officers on administrative leave in Alameda, California, after 26-year-old Mario Arenales Gonzalez died April 19 after a struggle where he spent about five minutes restrained on his stomach. Officers were responding to reports about a man who appeared to be under the influence in a residential area and another about a suspect and possible theft. They asked Arenales for his I.D. when they arrived. And we have parts of the police bodycam footage. And I warn you, it is disturbing.

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UNKNOWN: I got to identify you, so I know who I'm talking to, make sure you don't have any warrants or anything like that, OK? You come up with a plan, let me know that you're not going to be drinking in our parks over here. And then we can be on our way, OK?

UNKNOWN: Merry way?

UNKNOWN: Do you have any I.D. on you?

UNKNOWN: Merry go round?

UNKNOWN: Yes. Like that. Do you have any I.D. on you?

If you can't do that, then I'm going to have to take you, OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: The officer spoke to Arenales for about 10 minutes before moving to restrain him. And that's when footage shows a struggle began.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: Please put your hands behind your back. OK. Stop resisting us, OK? Don't fight us.

Stop, stop, stop.

Put your hands behind your back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So Arenales was pinned for about five minutes, for five minutes. It's unclear from video footage how much pressure officers applied.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: We have no weight on his chest.

UNKNOWN: No, no, no. No, wait. No, wait.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Moments later, one of the officers says Arenales is unresponsive, and they begin giving him CPR. He was brought to a hospital where he was pronounced dead. The cause of his death has not yet been determined.

So, joining me now the attorney representing the family, Julia Sherwin. Thank you, Attorney Sherwin. I appreciate you joining us. So let's get into this. Listen, I'm sorry for the family. Can you please convey that to me, my condolences? So this family has been through so much. This happened just before his mother's birthday. How are they doing?

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JULIA SHERWIN, GONZALEZ FAMILY ATTORNEY: Not well. Jerry was hoping -- Mario's brother, Jerry, was hoping to be with us tonight, and he just can't handle it right now. I mean this is an extremely close-knit family, and Jerry, Mario's younger brother, flew in from college in North Carolina so that Edith, their mother, would have all of her sons together for her birthday on the 20th. So, you know, in addition to being killed the day before the Derek Chauvin verdict, Mario was killed the day before his mother's birthday, and also a couple of days before his severely disabled younger brother Ephraim's (ph) birthday, which was on the 23rd.

LEMON: You know, what's interesting, because as I was reading this story and I read the initial police report. It made me think of the police report in the George Floyd. And you are -- the first police report for Mario's death, it reds this way, it says, officers attempted to detain the man and a physical altercation ensued. At that time the man had a medical emergency. Officers immediately began lifesaving measures and requested the Alameda fire department to the scene. The Alameda fire department transported the male to a local hospital, where he later died.

Now, I want you to compare that to the first release from the Minneapolis P.D. about George Floyd, and I quote here. He physically resisted officers. Officers were able to get the suspect into handcuffs and noticed that he appeared to be suffering medical distress. Officers called for an ambulance. He was transported to Hennepin County medical center by ambulance where he died a short time later.

You're pointing out the similarities. Again, we don't know -- the cause of death has not been determined here, but what do you make of that?

SHERWIN: Well, it's business as usual in policing unfortunately. I have the Minneapolis Police Department's press release from George Floyd's death taped to my wall in my office, because we see these so much, they could almost just cut and paste from the most recent restraint as fixial death. And none of these reports bear any resemblance to reality unfortunately.

LEMON: The interim police chief told CNN that he is troubled by what he saw on that video and that he has his own questions about the incident as the investigation plays out. Have you gotten any update at all from officials in the past few days?

SHERWIN: Oh, no, not at all. I mean they gave us a onetime run-through of the first responding officer's bodycam video the day before they released it to the public. So they showed it to my partner and I and our clients, but they have not provided any further information.

And, in fact, when they showed us the video, they asked us when they released the bodycam video to the public, would the family like them to black out Mario's face. And the family said no because the family's very dedicated to transparency, and they want accountability for Mario's death. And they don't want it being sugar coated, and the city still blacked it out, which makes it less easy to see Mario's humanity when he's -- you know, his face is a blur.

LEMON: Well, we're going to stay on top of this. And, again, if you will convey to the family our condolences, we'd love to have them on to speak with them as well. Thank you, Attorney Sherwin. I appreciate it.

SHERWIN: Thank you. Thank you.

LEMON: He's going from courtroom to Capitol Hill. Ben Crump takes the fight of policing reform. He's going to talk about that next. Plus, three in 10 Americans don't think Joe Biden really won the election. We're going to look at propaganda pouring out of pundits on the Fox propaganda network.

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LEMON: So some key moments this week for the families of victims of deadly police violence seeking to reform policing laws in this country. President Joe Biden in his joint address to Congress is calling on lawmakers to pass the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act by May 25th. That's the first anniversary of Floyd's murder. And yesterday, the families were meeting with officials at the White House and on Capitol Hill.

I want to discuss this now with Ben Crump, the attorney for the Floyd family who took part in the meetings. Ben, good to see you. Thanks for joining. You along with the families of George Floyd, Eric Garner, and others met with White House officials and lawmakers from both sides of the aisle over police reform legislation. You said these meetings got very emotional at times. What was it like? BEN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR GEORGE FLOYD FAMILY: Well, Don, the families

really told their truth about the loss of their loved ones and how this legislation that was being proposed has their blood on it, whether it's George Floyd, whether it's Eric Garner, whether it's Botham Jean or whether it's Terence Crutcher, which had family members in those meetings.

And in particular with Senator Scott and Senator Graham, they listened intently, and it really got emotional because the families said that, we can't go another 30 days because how many more hashtags will we see? And that was a deep question.

LEMON: So, as you mentioned, all these family members, they had someone who -- a loved one who was killed by police. You said there was a lot of listening, but do you think they feel that their voices were heard, Ben?

CRUMP: They do. And like President Biden and Vice President Harris, they are confident that we're going to get the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act done before the one-year anniversary of his tragedy.

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CRUMP: One of the things I think is profound to me, Don, is the fact that never have you had the Republicans say, it's going to be on Senator Scott, the only Black Republican, and what he feels is agreeable is what they're going to support. And Tim Scott told the families that he, too, as an African American has been, you know, profiled by police and he understands how that feels.

And so, I hope, I hope that they connect it emotionally because I know as a trial lawyer, when people are emotional, then they act. They do something.

LEMON: So, you mentioned Senator Tim Scott, the president. Now, you have someone who is the highest office in the land urging Congress to pass the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act, to pass these sweeping police reform by the anniversary, as you said. Listen, it's not very often that you get such meaningful bipartisan relationships and the possibility of passing a bipartisan bill on Capitol Hill, especially these days.

CRUMP: You're absolutely right, Don Lemon. And the fact that they all said it's going to be meaningful legislation because the family and Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer said that unless it was something that the family felt was representative of their blood that's on that legislation, he wouldn't bring it to the floor.

So everybody talked about meaningful legislation, not some watered- down legislation. Because at the end of the day, Don Lemon, what I am praying for is that this legislation will pass, and I will be able to close down my police brutality division of my law firm because I'm tired of Black people being killed by the police unjustly.

LEMON: Mm-hmm. Listen, you remember we were talking about this. This was before George Floyd. And I had the mother on last night. The Justice Department announced this week that three men were charged with federal hate crimes in the shooting death of Ahmaud Arbery, Ben. Ahmaud Arbery was chased down and shot while jogging in the street near Brunswick, Georgia. Do these charges signal that the Justice Department is making civil rights protections a priority as they have promised to do?

CRUMP: I believe so, Don, and I believe they're looking very hard at the officers who killed George Floyd as well. But I pray that they will look at not as popular cases like Breonna Taylor, like Tamir Rice, these cases that we all saw with our eyes that begged out for justice, but there was no justice.

So I'm hopeful that this Justice Department would do what other justice departments in the past have not done. And so Joe Biden will be delivering on his word to marginalized minority communities where he said, I'm going to have your back.

LEMON: Yeah. Hey, listen, I want to ask you really quickly and I was remiss because I should have asked you because it came right -- you came on right after the last segment with -- about Mario Arenales Gonzalez. His attorney was talking about the police report in that case, very similar to the police report in the George Floyd case. What do you think of that?

CRUMP: You know, Don Lemon, we've been doing this a long time, and so we know what the playbook is. They will try to technically justify whatever their actions are. And thank God for video because if you didn't have video, they will sweep it under the rug every time.

That's why we're fighting hard on Andrew Brown, too, to get the video out, because unless the public see it, unless the court of public opinion sees it, then it is swept under the rug, Don.

How many Black people have you and I talked about, and their death has been swept under the rug by this system that protects police officers from brutalizing us. And we're not against all police. We're against bad police. That's why we need transparency.

LEMON: Thank you, Ben Crump. I appreciate you joining us. We'll see you soon.

CRUMP: Yes, sir.

LEMON: So from the Fox propaganda network to legislation, we look at the lies being spewed and how they're becoming policy. That's next.

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[23:40:00]

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LEMON: Lying is the new normal in America. Trump's big lie about election fraud is now the basis for dozens of new state election laws restricting access to the ballot. Lies are being spoken by GOP lawmakers and then bouncing through the echo chamber of right-wing media. Lies are being turned into policy.

Here's CNN's chief media correspondent Brian Stelter.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is stunning. It's depressing.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is a simple question. A matter of fact, not opinion. Did Biden legitimately win enough votes for the presidency?

KING: Three in 10 Americans say no.

STELTER (voice-over): CNN's new polling by SSRS showing the blistering damage of the big lie.

[23:45:03]

STELTER (voice-over): Damage led by the former president.

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (voice- over): I ran two elections. I won them both.

STELTER (voice-over): These lies are now being turned into policy. With Republicans pushing bills in state legislatures, it would make it harder for some to vote. And with pro-Trump officials in Arizona holding a baffling recount.

KATIE HOBBS, ARIZONA SECRETARY OF STATE: This is just an exercise to perpetuate the big lie.

STELTER (voice-over): It is lying as the new normal, lying as the basis for political warfare. When you start to look around, you can see that lying is the scar tissue connecting almost every story in the news.

LAURA INGRAHAM, FOX NEWS HOST: The Virginia Department of Education is taking steps to abolish advanced degree for gifted students. Now, why? Because they're worried that students who excel aren't diverse enough.

STELTER (voice-over): No. The Washington Post said that's not true. Neither is this.

UNKNOWN: They're being given a book. Everyone is being given a copy apparently of Vice President Kamala Harris's book.

STELTER (voice-over): That nonsense about the V.P.'s books at migrant shelters started in The New York Post newspaper, and a reporter resigned over it. You can't help but notice how many of these non- stories start in right-wing media.

UNKNOWN: Say good-bye to your burgers if you want to sign up for the Biden climate agenda.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Cut our red meat. He wants to cut out 90 percent of the red meat.

UNKNOWN: No burgers on July 4th.

STELTER (voice-over): Cut it, cut it. It's all a lie. Yet even after it was debunked, the House GOP leader tried it again.

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): He wants control of your life. He's going to control how much meat you can eat. Can you imagine that?

STELTER (voice-over): Can you imagine lying with abandon? That is the big question all of this raises. When did this form of cheating, cheating the truth become so common? Did Donald Trump unlock something that's now everywhere? There's COVID misinformation, vaccine misinformation, and so much B.S. about Biden, it's hard to keep track.

LIN WOOD, ATTORNEY: The fake Biden speech.

STELTER (voice-over): Lin Wood, an attorney who fought for Trump in court, is now running for office in South Carolina, and he keeps implying that Trump is still the real president.

WOOD: Don't be fooled. Joe Biden never got more than two percent of the vote in his life.

STELTER (voice-over): Don't be fooled, he says, while trying to fool all of these people.

(On camera): It is distressing to see a video like that, to see hundreds of people being told these nonsensical lies in South Carolina. And sadly, this is all too common. Lying is in some ways the new normal. The incentive structures that normally discouraged politicians from straying too far from the truth have completely broken down. And there's not enough accountability, especially on the right, to stop shameless people from spinning tall tales and lying to big crowds.

Don, it's easy to look at this week and say, there is just something broken in American politics today.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

LEMON: Brian Stelter, thank you very much. We'll be right back.

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[23:50:00]

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LEMON: For the past six decades, late-night television has grown from a shot in the dark experiment to a thriving cultural phenomenon. Now, the new CNN Original Series' "Story of Late Night" examines how late- night T.V. not only keeps us laughing but shapes how we see the world.

CNN's Tom Foreman takes a look at what happens when late-night comedy and politics collide. (BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

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TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): For years, they have been on a collision course. Politics.

UNKNOWN: I don't know if he is ready for a second term, but he's definitely ready for the second grade.

(LAUGHTER)

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UNKNOWN: I am so proud of him.

FOREMAN (voice-over): Late night.

UNKNOWN: Apparently, the first rule is safety in numbers.

FOREMAN (voice-over): And comedy.

UNKNOWN: Scared Trump says it's bad. Sassy Trump says it's good. And nerdy Trump says bazinga (ph).

FOREMAN (voice-over): The notion is not really new. Steve Allen, Jack Paar, and Johnny Carson all took swipes.

UNKNOWN: Well, let's get right into the news. Nothing could be funnier than that.

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FOREMAN (voice-over): But in 1992, when then-governor Bill Clinton played saxophone on "The Arsenio Hall Show," the link between politics and late night grew tighter, and the comedy tougher.

GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You deserve better than tyranny and corruption and torture chambers.

UNKNOWN: Yes, you do. Yes, you do.

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FOREMAN (voice-over): No one ran harder with that idea than Jon Stewart, who starting in 1999, turned "The Daily Show" into a nightly skewering of political players.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Jon Stewart became the voice of sanity and the voice of reason. "The Daily Show" put him in the role of straight man.

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FOREMAN (voice-over): Similar shows soon appeared, some hosted by Stewart's former contributors.

UNKNOWN: I do not like that man, Ted Cruz.

(LAUGHTER)

UNKNOWN: I do not like his far-right views.

(LAUGHTER)

FOREMAN (voice-over): Now, late night in politics are so intertwined. When Jimmy Kimmel's newborn son arrived with a serious heart condition, the host went on air to plead for affordable, available health care for all, taking both parties to task.

JIMMY KIMMEL, TALK SHOW HOST: If your baby is going to die and it doesn't have to, it shouldn't matter how much money you make. I think that's something that, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat or something else, we all agree on that, right? I mean, we do.

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FOREMAN (voice-over): And he made it clear. Late night is not just playing for laughs anymore.

[23:55:00]

FOREMAN (voice-over): Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

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LEMON: Tom Foreman, thank you. And make sure you watch "The Story of Late Night." It premieres Sunday at 9:00 p.m. And right after that, make sure you join our friend, W. Kamau Bell, for a new season of his show, "United Shades of America," at 10:00 p.m.

Thanks for watching, everyone. Our coverage continues.

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