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Don Lemon Tonight

John Eastman Involved In A Plot; Russian Forces Took Kherson City; Mother And Child Jumping From One Place To Another; DOJ Going After Russian Oligarchs. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired March 02, 2022 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[22:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST (on camera): Stay with CNN for the latest from Ukraine. The news continues. I want to turn things over now to Don and DON LEMON TONIGHT. Ddon?

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Hey, Anderson. So, I've been asking people there when they come on to do an interview, what is the neighborhood like around you? You have been able to go out and talk to people. And I saw your story. You were interviewing these people in a bar. And instead of making, you know, cocktails they're making Molotov cocktails. Talk to me about what's going on. It's interesting to hear and to walk through those neighborhoods.

COOPER: Yes, you know, I've never been in a place at war in which the population, the civilian population is so united with determination to fight and fight back against an invading force. The last time I guess I saw this was probably Sarajevo in like 1993. You know, a long time ago.

It's extraordinary. Everybody you talk to here is just outraged by what has occurred and is just determined to do something about it in whatever way they can. I talked to a woman in Kyiv in a basement tonight, you know, who was saying that all 44 million people in this country are now part of the army.

That they all feel that sense of cohesion and that sense of togetherness in the face of a cataclysmic or an overwhelming foe. And you sense that walking around a neighborhood like this. You know, I -- there's -- there are still grocery stores that are open here. You can still get, you know -- I got some bananas and apples today. You can still get fresh fruit, which is, you know, a luxury compared to a lot of places in Ukraine right now.

But everybody has that sense of being part of something larger and they're trying to do whatever they can. A 14-year-old boy I talked to whose, you know, school is closed here, so he's volunteering and volunteering helps him make -- it makes him less scared because he feels like he is part of something. And he is part of something. And something that we're seeing, the effects of and the power of, over -- we've seen over the last several days. LEMON: And something definitely I don't think that the Russians -- I

don't think it was part of their calculation when they thought about invading Ukraine, the determination and the will of the people to fight back. Definitely on display there. Alive and well.

Anderson, thank you very much. Be safe. We'll see you again tomorrow.

This is DON LEMON TONIGHT.

And we have two -- we've got two significant breaking news stories tonight. Pay close attention, OK, because this is just now breaking. The House January 6th committee alleging in court documents that the former President of the United States and one of his lawyers, John Eastman, were part of a criminal conspiracy to overturn the 2020 election.

You heard me right. Part of a criminal conspiracy. We're going to have the full story just ahead.

In the meantime, our other big breaking news tonight, a raid. Air raid sirens late tonight all across Kyiv, Ukraine's capital, as large blasts lit up the sky. That happened just moments ago. It is up on your screen now.

And it now appears that Kherson is the first major city to fall into Russian hands. Putin's tanks and military vehicles rolling through the streets of Kherson, located in southern Ukraine. Heavily armed soldiers now patrolling the city of 300,000 people.

A CNN team in the region reporting that the Russians are instituting a form of martial law, telling residents to obey soldiers' orders. In hard-hit Kharkiv in northeast Ukraine Russian forces attacking a police department building, setting it on fire and killing at least four people. And blowing a giant hole in the wall of a school building which has been attacked repeatedly in the last few days.

Tonight, sources saying that the United States has delivered hundreds of Stinger anti-aircraft missiles to Ukraine's military. Ukraine's president has been pleading with western nations for more help.

And the Pentagon confirming the 40-mile-long Russian military convoy on the outskirts of Kyiv is indeed stalled. But saying the Russians are likely regrouping. U.S. and western officials also warning that Russia may be shifting to what they call a slow annihilation of the Ukrainian military.

Straight away to CNN's Matthew Chance in Ukraine's capital. Matthew, hello to you. Let's talk about those new explosions in Kyiv tonight. This comes as Kherson, the first major Ukrainian city, has fallen into Russian -- fall to Russian forces. What's the situation on the ground now?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Don, there's no real letup in the -- in the military pounding of Ukrainian towns and cities by Russian forces. You're right. We had that massive explosion in the Ukrainian capital on the outskirts of it earlier on this evening. We don't know what was hit. But the picture of that explosion makes it absolutely clear that this was a large device that detonated on the outskirts of the Ukrainian capital.

[22:05:07]

In other cities as well across the country, in Kharkiv in the northeast, in Mariupol in the south, in Kherson in the south of the country as well, more Russian attacks against -- against these cities as that Russian force, you know, continues its push to push back the Ukrainian military and other defenders, you know, from their various strongholds.

There is that convoy which is still poised towards the outskirts or outside of the Ukrainian capital as well. You mentioned U.S. intelligence indicates the convoy has stalled. But it may just be a matter of time before it starts up again. And that apparent Russian plan to surround the Ukrainian capital and potentially bombard it with an enormous barrage of artillery could get -- could get going once again.

There is a slight diplomatic hope, I suppose, if you can call it that, which is that it's been confirmed by both the Russians and the Ukrainians that there will be a second round of talks between the two sides. They're taking place in the neighboring country of Belarus tomorrow.

But, you know, I spoke about this to President Zelenskyy when I spoke to him in his bunker yesterday here in Kyiv. And he said look, you know, we might be wasting our time but we'll see whether the Russians are willing to talk about a ceasefire and to stop the fighting. Only then will we know if there's any real possibility of a diplomatic path out of this crisis, Don.

LEMON: Well, as you know, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, the president, has been talking as often as he can. He addressed the country from his bunker tonight, as a matter of fact. What is he saying, Matthew?

CHANCE: Yes, that's right. I mean, it's almost every night now that he dons his green fatigue, military fatigues and he puts out an address to the nation and posts it on his various social media channels. No difference today. He did that.

He said this. Look, we are a nation that broke the enemy's plans in a week. And he went on to congratulate the Ukrainian military for their sort of significant successes on the battlefield, some of which we've witnessed ourselves of course on the outskirts of the Ukrainian capital.

The sort of other civilian defenders who have taken up arms and have taken up defensive positions and have been battling any push into towns and cities by Russian forces as well. But he also praised the ordinary people of Ukraine who had stood up to the -- to Russian forces and sort of shouted abuse at them and sort of stood in the way of their armored vehicles and tanks and military vehicles to sort of show how angry and how defiant they are at this continued Russian action. And we've seen examples of that, you know, really across the country. It's been quite astonishing.

LEMON: Matthew, let's talk about this very dramatic confrontation between Russian forces and Ukrainian civilians in a small town in northeastern Ukraine with a Russian appearing to be holding grenades. What happened there?

CHANCE: Yes, I mean -- I mean, it's quite -- quite incredible, this video, because you can see a Russian soldier, an officer, with his arms up in the air. He's got two grenades in his hands, presumably with the pins out. Who knows? As he walks through this absolutely furious crowd. In this town. The town is called Konotop, I think it's pronounced in -- you're right in northeast Ukraine.

And he'd just come from the town hall where he delivered an ultimatum to the local officials saying, you will surrender or we will shell you with the artillery we've got pointed in your direction. And he had to walk back through that crowd to go back to the Russian lines.

The mayor of the town came out shortly afterwards and said look, to all that crowd, he said look, you know, if you -- they've told us if we don't surrender, if we resist, they will shell the town, but let's have a vote on it. If you vote to fight, we will fight. But we all have to agree, the mayor said, because they've got the artillery pointed right at us.

I don't know what happened next. I haven't heard about any shelling of that town. So, it's possible that a decision was taken by the townspeople, you know, not to --- not to confront Russian armor in that way. But it does -- it does show you that if there was any idea in the Kremlin that this invasion force was going to be welcomed with open arms, that was a -- that was a miscalculation, shall we say, a very big one.

LEMON: Matthew, you're doing a great job. It was a week ago that we came on the air and you were putting on a flak jacket and helmet and here we are a week later and you're on the ground, doing a terrific job. Thank you, Matthew. Be safe. We'll talk to you soon.

[22:10:05]

I want to bring in now CNN military analyst General Wesley Clark, the former NATO supreme allied commander. General, thank you so much.

Just first off, let me ask you. You've got this stalled convoy. Why not, why aren't they being hit? Why isn't anybody taking it out?

WESLEY CLARK, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: You know, that large convoy that's north of Kyiv is probably not the greatest threat. The real threat's coming from the south, Don. And the convoy in the north, a lot of those vehicles are out of fuel. A lot of them are disabled. And it's basically stranded. And this is causing a lot of frustration. It can't get off the road. They can't bypass the road. That's their problem.

But the Russians are making up for it by coming around from the south. And they are coming up from the south. They're reinforcing. So, we just heard that the city of Kherson has been hit. They're coming from the east. So, it's a matter of time before they work their way through this.

I'm sure Vladimir Putin is quite upset that they're not moving more quickly. So, he's using firepower. He's keeping the pressure on the Ukrainians. And the Ukrainians are taking out enemy vehicles. They're fighting brilliantly with what they have. But without air power. Without counter battery fires, without modern technology. They're in for a dark period here.

LEMON: What do you see also -- I want you to respond to what Matthew is reporting. The man with the grenade. He's not sure if the pins were out. Or just walking through. And also, that they have declared -- basically Russian soldiers saying martial law, saying obey us, do -- do what we say.

CLARK: Yes. There are of course -- the Russians want to lock it down. The thing is there are not enough Russian forces right now to keep it locked down. The best thing for Ukraine is keep as many force -- keep as many Russian forces in Kherson as you can. And so, when they start to move out of there and try to therein out their force, this should be the first test of what the Biden administration said could be the policy of feeding the Ukrainian insurrection.

So, will the folks in Kherson be able to then attack the remnants of the Russian force, draw that force back in and keep that battle going there? In the nearby city of Mariupol, I'm getting reports today that the Russians were actually pulling people out of apartment buildings, lining them up and shooting them.

So, there's no question that the Russians are capable of extraordinary brutality and crimes against humanity. And the Ukrainian people are going to have to reckon with this when they rebel against the Russian occupation.

LEMON: The Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin did an interview with NBC's Lester Holt tonight, and he was asked about Putin's nuclear weapons rhetoric and whether he's seen any actions to back up those words. Let's take a listen to some of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LLOYD AUSTIN, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: The rhetoric about the employment of nuclear weapons is dangerous. And I think we should -- we should avoid that if at all possible. I think it creates a climate or it creates the conditions for gross miscalculations. And we certainly don't want to see that happen. I am very comfortable with our posture, and I am confident that we can -- we can defend not only ourselves but our allies and our partners.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON (on camera): Creating the conditions for gross miscalculations. Isn't that the biggest fear right now, that something happens that pushes this out of control? CLARK: That's exactly the fear that we have. That somehow this would

escalate. That some action on the part of NATO would give Putin a rationale to say that's provocative and then use a nuclear weapon. But we don't know what Putin's red line really is. And there are some who think that Putin wants to use a nuclear weapon anyway.

In every exercise that they do, these big annual exercises, they practice the use of a nuclear weapon. They call it escalate to de- escalate. And the theory is that somehow, they'll find a way to use a nuclear weapon and NATO will jump back in fear and then the Russians take the field and they win.

In this case if we're not going to intervene in any significant way with our air power or ground forces and we're going to watch this grinding battle go on, maybe Putin won't see a need to use a nuclear weapon. But there's going to come a time when the slaughter is such in Kyiv, when their backs are against the wall or the big artillery's coming in, people are asking, they're already asking, how long is this going to go on? How long is the United States going aside -- stand aside and permit this?

So, I know inside the White House and the Pentagon people are really wrestling with these questions --

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: What do you think the answer is, General?

[22:15:00]

CLARK: I know what the answers are going to be, Don. They're aware of it.

LEMON: What do you think that answer is? How much longer?

CLARK: I don't know how much longer. And I couldn't speculate on it, Don, because these are the kinds of very private, very sensitive discussions that we expect our military and political leaders to have in private and to work out the conditions and what's going to happen.

Right now, the emphasis is on getting the resupplies in to Kyiv and those Ukrainian forces, keeping them in the fight, resisting the Russian forces, and maybe Putin will just get so frustrated with it he calls a halt. Is that going to happen? I don't know.

But right now, we're doing everything we can and I really believe that short of being provocative with our own major intervention to stop it we're doing everything we can to help the Ukrainians. And I include the sanctions in that.

I think the Biden administration has done a brilliant job with the sanctions policy and keeping our NATO allies together. It's just that many people see this ominous trend with the increasing use of heavy weapons with the fact that the Ukrainians don't have air power, with the fact that the Russians are closing in on Kyiv, a city of two million people, that's really the heart of Ukrainian culture. They see that happening and they're asking where is this going? And I

think that's a question that's going to have to be asked with increasing urgency in the days ahead.

LEMON: General Wesley Clark, thank you very much. I appreciate it.

CLARK: Thank you.

LEMON: One week ago, she had a home, she had a family, and a business. And now she is crossing Ukraine trying to get out with her 4-year-old daughter. A woman tells us how her harrowing story of trying to flee a war that she calls hell. That's next.

[22:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON (on camera): So this is the breaking news I was telling you about at the top of the show. The January 6th select committee says that they believe that the former President Donald Trump and a right- wing lawyer were part of a criminal conspiracy to overturn the 2020 presidential election.

I want to bring in now CNN's senior legal affairs correspondent Paula Reid, and our senior legal analyst Elie Honig, a former assistant U.S. attorney. Good evening to both of you in the middle of breaking news.

Paula, I'm going to start with you. This filing reveals the January 6th committee believes that Trump and others connected to his campaign broke the law. What do you know?

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Don. I've read through this 60-page filing tonight and here the committee revealing that it believes that former President Trump and one of his lawyers may have engaged in a criminal conspiracy. Specifically, the committee says that it believes that Trump and others may have engaged in criminal or fraudulent acts and they list a series of different crimes including obstruction of an official proceeding, conspiring to defraud the U.S., and common law fraud as part of their efforts to subvert the 2020 election.

Now, Don, all of this comes out of a filing in a case where the committee is trying to obtain e-mails from conservative lawyer John Eastman. But they allowed this filing to really be the most extensive summary we've seen so far of what it is they've learned in their investigation.

We know they've been gathering evidence for months. We know they've talked to hundreds of witnesses. But to what end? And here they've really given us a window, the most extensive so far, into exactly what they found, what their conclusions are.

Now, to be clear, no one has been charged with a crime here. Congress clearly cannot charge anyone. But they signal in this filing, Don, that they may be willing to make a criminal referral to the Justice Department against former President Trump and others depending on what they find in the rest of this investigation. It's one of the biggest headlines out of this committee so far.

LEMON: So, you heard what Paula had to say, Elie. The committee does say that they have evidence that Donald Trump committed a crime. I mean, this is a huge deal. What happens now? Because the former president isn't charged, as Paula pointed out, isn't charged here, right?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Don. So important to understand this is not an indictment. This is not a criminal charge. However, what it is, is a road map for DOJ if DOJ cares to take this up, which they ought to. There's really two things going on. In the narrow sense the committee, Congress, is saying we get to get these e- mails involving John Eastman because they're not privileged. Normally communications between an attorney and a client are privileged but not if they relate to a fraud.

So, the committee is saying these e-mails relate to a fraud, so we get those e-mails. But bigger picture, Don, this is a call to action by the committee to DOJ. This is the committee telling DOJ we think there's at least enough here that you DOJ need to be taking a very serious look and here's the case as we lay it out for potential criminal fraud and obstruction of Congress.

LEMON: Elie, the filing -- the filing includes an e-mail exchange between Vice President Pence's counsel, which is Greg Jacob and John Eastman. Jacob dismisses Eastman's argument to stop the certification of Biden's win saying, and I quote here, "and thanks to your B.S.," they write the word out, bullshit, "we are now under siege." Even the vice president's attorney is pointing the finger at Eastman.

HONIG: Yes. So, the theory here is Eastman's legal theory, let's put scare quotes around that, that the vice president had the unilateral authority to simply reject certain electoral votes, it's not just crazy or wrong legally but it actually crossed the line over into fraud.

And that e-mail, the committee is using that to show everybody knew that there was no basis on which Mike Pence could reject those votes. That it DOJ said Donald Trump had lost. Department of Homeland Security had said Donald Trump had lost. The FBI and even John Eastman himself acknowledged according to some of the testimony that Trump had lost and that Vice President Mike Pence had absolutely no basis to do this. That's what would make this a criminal fraud.

LEMON: But however, Elie, John Eastman is central to the effort to overturn the election. He's been trying to withhold e-mails under attorney-client privilege. The committee wants those e-mails.

[22:24:58]

More from the filing, it says evidence and information available to the committee establishes a good faith belief that Mr. Trump and others may have engaged in criminal and/or fraudulent acts and that plaintiff's legal assistance was used in furtherance of those activities. Do we have a convincing argument? HONIG: Well, they do in order to pierce the veil of attorney-client

privilege, Don. So ordinarily, when an attorney and a client, in this case John Eastman and Donald Trump, are engaged in communications, those communications ordinarily are privileged, meaning outsiders can't get those communications. They're secret. Unless those communications relate to a potential fraud. And that's the argument the committee is making sheer.

They're saying these communications between Trump and Eastman crossed the line. They had to do with the fraud of trying to steal this election of trying to obstruct Congress from counting the votes as required by the Constitution. So that's the narrow argument that the committee is making but I think the broader point here is to up the political pressure on DOJ to do something.

LEMON: Elie Honig, Paula Reid, thank you both. I appreciate it.

HONIG: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Up next, a woman who only one week ago she had a family, she had a home and a business. Now crossing Ukraine, fleeing to safety with her 4-year-old daughter. Her harrowing story is next.

[22:30:00]

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LEMON (on camera): So, imagine an invasion forcing you to flee your home with your young child. Imagine you make it on a plane, about to take off to safety when the pilot tells you no. They can't take off anymore. Then imagine fleeing to another city because the war and explosions found you again.

Well, my next guest has been living through what she calls a living hell in Ukraine as she and her family try to find safety. Kateryna Shapiro joins me now. Kateryna, thank you so much. I appreciate you joining us. How are you doing?

KATERYNA SHAPIRO, FLED KYIV: Yes, I'm here. Well, we're alive. But we're not doing well, honestly. It's a disaster. It's a hell. People are dying. I mean, really, really. It's horrible.

LEMON: You actually lost your friends today. I'm so sorry for that.

SHAPIRO: Yes.

LEMON: Can you talk to me about what happened? Are you able to talk about it?

SHAPIRO: Well, there was a huge, really huge explosion in my city that I used to live, Kharkiv, and there was an explosion in the center of the city. And I know for sure that some of them are not alive anymore, and I don't have a connection with some more of my friends now. But I really hope that it's a connection difficulty and they're still alive. LEMON: You know, it's difficult for most people to understand. I'm

sure before this happened it would be difficult for you to understand as well. You said to us that you had a normal happy life with a studio, a business, friends and family and then all of a sudden, within the blink of an eye nothing is normal. Your entire life has been uprooted.

You've been fleeing from city to city. You've gone from Kharkiv to Kyiv where you spent six days because you were afraid to go outside. You watched explosions from a friend's apartment. You ran again. And now you are near Odessa. What has this all been like?

SHAPIRO: Well, it's a nightmare because first of all because of our kids, because of my child. She's so scared. She's four years old. But she -- well, she doesn't understand but she feels it because she's really scared and she's really nervous now. She's crying all the time. If she hears any loud sounds, she's crying.

And I'll tell you, I'm safe now. I'm good. I worry about people that are still in hot spots, in Kharkiv, in Kyiv, in Sumy, in Kherson. The whole Ukraine is on fire.

LEMON: The whole Ukraine is on fire. What is it like as you are going? Tell me what it looks like from town to town as you are trying to get to safety?

SHAPIRO: When I was traveling from Kharkiv to Kyiv, it was still no war. So, it was just normal. When we traveled yesterday from Kyiv to Odessa, it was just like a checkpoint every 10 or 20 kilometers you're in the road. And Ukrainian military. They were really polite, just asking for the documents. And, well, that's it. It was like this.

LEMON: What do these places look like?

SHAPIRO: Well, just -- just military people.

LEMON: Are you -- have you had confrontations with Russian soldiers?

SHAPIRO: No. No.

LEMON: You were supposed to go to Egypt on vacation. So, then you went to the Kyiv airport and even got on the plane, as I was telling our viewers before we introduced you, with your 4-year-old daughter.

SHAPIRO: Yes.

LEMON: The plane never left. Tell us what happened.

SHAPIRO: Well, I was on a plane and -- because it was 3.55 in the morning. My kid was asleep already. She was without any clothes, like only t-shirt and jeans. So, when the captain said that we have to leave the plane and we just left it put -- I just -- I was holding my bag with the documents and that's what we have now at the moment. We have nothing. We have no clothes.

[22:35:05] But people are really helping. They gave us their own clothes so we can be warm and the child can be warm. But -- so we have to leave the airport. And as soon as we got outside of the airport they started to explode, there was so many explosions and like rockets or something. I don't know.

So, we started to run away from the airport. And my husband, he was running towards the explosions because there was a car in the parking zone, so he wanted to take the car because it was so cold outside and we were like almost naked. So, he took the car and he picked up us on the road while we were running away of the airport. So now, now we're here.

LEMON: What do you -- you said it's difficult, the difficult part is that you have a 4-year-old daughter. What do you tell your daughter about all of this? Does she know what is happening? And how is she holding up?

SHAPIRO: No, I'm not telling her what is happening. When we were in Kyiv and it was really loud, I was telling her that there's fireworks. So, well, probably when she will be grown up, I will tell her what was going on. But now I'm not sure that she's ready mentally to hear this. We're trying to do our best to make her feel like everything is going normal.

LEMON: Look, I think I know the answer to this question but I'm going to ask anyway. What are you going to do? Do you know what you're going to do? Do you know what your next step is?

SHAPIRO: Actually, we don't know yet. We're in a safe place -- well, safe. Safe for today. I'm not sure it's going to be safe tomorrow. We're in a safe place now. I don't know what we're going to do. Well, anyway, what we're going to do, we're going to pray. We're going to believe that it will end, this nightmare will be finished as soon as possible because we don't want to leave our country. We really love our country. So, we're going to stay here as much as possible. And then we'll see.

LEMON: Kateryna, thank you. Be safe.

SHAPIRO: Thank you so much.

LEMON: Thank you.

SHAPIRO: Thank you.

LEMON: Russian oligarchs scrambling to protect their assets, but the Justice Department's already working to target the wealth that they think is propping up Vladimir Putin. We'll talk about that next.

[22:40:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON (on camera): The Justice Department zeroing in on the lifestyles of the rich and Russian. Launching a unit to enforce sanctions against Russian officials and oligarchs. That includes targeting mega-yachts, private jets and sprawling penthouse apartments.

CNN's Jessica Schneider has the details on just how this task force will track down those assets.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Posh private yachts owned by Russian oligarchs are on the move according to several web sites tracking the richest Russians and their assets. Russian oligarchs scrambling their most pricey possessions including commercial-sized aircraft to safe havens they hope will be beyond the reach of U.S. and international law enforcement after a stark warning from President Biden during his State of the Union.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: We're joining with European allies to find and seize their yachts, their luxury apartments, their private jets.

(APPLAUSE)

BIDEN: We're coming for you, ill-begotten gains.

SCHNEIDER: Hours after the president's pledge the Justice Department unveiled a new task force titled KleptoCapture where prosecutors will team up with experts in sanctions, money laundering, and national security to target these ultra-rich oligarchs who the U.S. government believes are propping up Putin.

MERRICK GARLAND, UNITED STATES ATTORNEY GENERAL: We will leave no stone unturned in our efforts to investigate, arrest and prosecute those whose criminal acts enable the Russian government to continue this unjust war.

SCHNEIDER: So far, the U.S. government has sanctioned Putin himself, some of his closest advisers, and businessmen from his inner circle. But still unsanctioned by the U.S. are most of Russia's oligarchs, the wealthy business leaders who wield significant influence over the Russian government. The enormous scale of their global wealth has been on full display for decades. They've snatched up penthouses in London, Paris, New York, sent their kids to the poshest private schools in all parts of the world, and flooded cash into bank accounts across the globe.

Since Russia's invasion of Ukraine, the European Union has imposed sanctions on more than two dozen of Russia's most prominent people and oligarchs who are active in the oil, banking and finance sectors. And as a cascade of countries taking action intensifies, experts say Russian oligarchs are increasingly looking for ways to protect their wealth.

UNKNOWN: There was one of them with a 787 that flew to Dubai.

SCHNEIDER: Nineteen-year-old Jack Sweeney (Ph) has already amassed more than 300,000 followers on the new Twitter handles he's created to track the movements of the private jets tied to Russia's oligarchs and billionaires at Putin jets and at Ruoligarchjets.

MAX BERGMAN, SENIOR FELLOW, AMERICAN PROGRESS: We're seeing Russian oligarchs panic and quickly try to divest their assets.

SCHNEIDER: Max Bergman worked at the State Department during the Obama administration and says the new task force created by the Justice Department could not only freeze and seize significant assets from these oligarchs but it could discourage them from buying up land and property in major cities around the world.

BERGMAN: I think this is precedent-setting. I think there's been a recognition that the global economy has sort of become out of whack and global wealth and global elites have parked their money perhaps in illicit ways in the U.S. and in the west and there's a need to crack down.

[22:44:59]

SCHNEIDER: At least two Russian oligarchs have now publicly called for Putin to end the war including Oleg Deripaska, a billionaire who made his fortune in the aluminum business and has already been sanctioned by the U.S. back in 2018.

He wrote in a Sunday post on Telegram, peace is very important. Negotiations need to start as soon as possible.

EDWARD FISHMAN, FORMER U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT RUSSIA SANCTIONS LEAD: If all of the oligarchs were to come together and try to hatch a plot to change Putin's mind or, you know, potentially even change the regime in Russia, certainly that is something that is possible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHNEIDER (on camera): And our team has learned the White House and Treasury Department are preparing to impose sanctions on several of these oligarchs who keep close ties to Putin. It would be a major expansion in that effort to punish those closest to the Russian president. Don?

LEMON: Jessica Schneider, thank you very much. I appreciate that. I've got an expert on these oligarchs here with me. University of New Haven, professor Howard Stoffer is here. The question is, will all these efforts hurt Putin? We're going to talk about that right after this.

[22:50:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON (on camera): The pressure is growing on western governments including the United States to seize the wealth and assets of Russian oligarchs as Vladimir Putin's military brutally attacks Ukraine.

Let's bring in now Howard Stoffer. Howard is a professor of international affairs at the University of New Haven. He is a former foreign service officer, and we are so thankful, so grateful that you're here, sir. Thank you so much. Good evening. We just saw --

HOWARD STOFFER, PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAVEN: Thank you.

LEMON: -- Jessica Schneider's report about the push to seize assets from those oligarchs. What would -- what would that do to them?

STOFFER: Well, it's a very important first start. You have to realize that there are about 120 oligarchs and this is only a small number of them that the U.S. is going after. Other countries are going after all of them, especially in the E.U.

Collectively, these oligarchs control about 800 billion to almost a trillion dollars. And most of these yachts, planes, and pads, you know, these places where they live is hardly a real part of the assets that they have squirrelled away over the years. They've been waiting for this day for a long time.

LEMON: It's not -- so you don't think it's enough to make a difference? It's not enough to, you know, tick them off or to upset them or to force them to try to get Vladimir Putin to change course?

STOFFER: Yes, I think a number of them have spoken out and said they're against this war. They're probably afraid to say anything directly against Putin because they have a lot of the assets that Putin has distributed amongst them. Besides distributing it to his daughters and to his ex-wife and to his friends and relatives, he's given a lot of his assets, his almost 200 billion to the oligarchs to put away in places that can't be found. So, they're going to be very careful about what they do.

But it's a good start. It really shows as the people of Ukraine suffer from this criminal invasion, they themselves are criminals and are going to be hunted down.

LEMON: You call these oligarchs the glitterati of Russia. Explain the dynamic between strongman Putin and the oligarchs and how they support and enrich each other. You said he's given them a couple hundred billion dollars. But how do they -- what else do they do? What is their connection? What is their dynamic?

STOFFER: Well, it all started under Gorbachev, when Gorbachev basically brought in Perestroika and allowed some of the major industry owners to start getting bank loans to buy the industries they were managing. Then Yeltsin came in and allowed all this money to flow around so that people like Gordievsky and others could buy these industries and just enrich themselves.

They just bought it up, they had money from the government, and they've owned these industries for now, you know, 22 years or more. More than 30 years, actually. And so by taking these sanctions against oligarchs, by seizing their assets, it's ill-gained -- it's ill-gained wealth that they have acquired. And it's about time.

It's been a horrible scene to see that the people of Russia make about $11,000 a year on the average. And these oligarchs are living in incredible splendor. And that's why I use the word glitterati. Because they are the glitterati of the Russian federation. But they certainly do not represent the people of Russia.

LEMON: It sounds like, you know, the excesses of the '80s as you're going through talking about Mikhail Gorbachev and Boris Yeltsin, I feel like I'm back in the Reagan era in the 1980s, which is -- which is when this all started, correct?

STOFFER: Yes. It started when Gorbachev started giving the managers the chance to start owning some of the industries they managed. And then elites Yeltsin accelerated. And then when Putin came in in 1999 there were disputes among all of the oligarchs and he basically said to them, I am going to be the president and I will resolve your disputes and protect you but you've got to have my back or you'll pay.

And of course, Gordievsky was put in jail for 10 years because he went against Putin and finally fled to the U.K. once he got out. So, the oligarchs are afraid and they'd better be afraid now of the European Union, the United States, Japan, Korea, Australia, New Zealand, and other countries that are going after their assets. And trying to find out where they've put this money into all kinds of bank accounts, into all kinds of physical assets that will be hard to dig up. But this time it will be found.

LEMON: That was my next question, if you think it could be found. And you said it will. As we heard, there are already two oligarchs who are speaking out against Putin. You said that they have said, you know, they're against this war. There were some.

The Russian billionaire owner of the Chelsea football club in the U.K. now selling the team, although he hasn't yet been sanctioned by Britain. Do you think all this pressure, whether financial or public, do you think it is actually having an influence, Howard?

[22:55:00]

STOFFER: I think it has a psychological influence. For people to see that these oligarchs around the world, all being Russian owners of the property that belongs to the people of Russia. They see that they're scrambling. They see that they're sweating. They see that they're worried now that they're going to lose a lot of these assets. And I think that's an important psychological edge.

It won't have any impact, or very much impact on Putin. Putin has basically isolated himself. He only talks to Petrushev, the head of his national security council and Bornyakov, the head of the FSB, the Federal Security Bureau. But essentially once these oligarchs start hurting, he's going to get the word and he's going to understand that things are very different and it's not going to change until he gets out of Ukraine.

LEMON: Thank you very much. Howard Stoffer. I appreciate it.

STOFFER: Thank you, thanks so much.

LEMON: One of Ukraine's biggest cities appearing to fall to Russian forces today. Our correspondents are live on the ground in Ukraine and Russia right after this.

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