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British Troop Withdrawal From Iraq; Flypaper Theory for War in Iraq; Interview With Deejay Tom Joyner

Aired February 21, 2007 - 10:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning, everyone. You're with CNN. You're informed.
I'm Tony Harris.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Fredricka Whitfield, in for Heidi Collins.

HARRIS: Developments keep coming in to the NEWSROOM on this Wednesday, February 21st.

Here's what's on the rundown.

WHITFIELD: Hundreds of British troops coming home from war. Prime Minister Tony Blair announcing a partial drawdown in Iraq. The White House says it's a sign of success.

HARRIS: The Iraq war -- one study says it's creating a new generation of terrorists, adding up attacks since the invasion.

WHITFIELD: He's a popular radio host on a mission -- helping young African-Americans earn a college degree. Tom Joyner live this hour in the NEWSROOM.

HARRIS: And at the top this hour, big changes in Iraq. The U.S. sending in more troops, but Britain pulling them out of Iraq.

Prime Minister Tony Blair announcing this morning he'll start bringing his troops home.

CNN's Robin Oakley live in London right now.

Robin, is the prime minister's action likely to be seen as undermining President Bush?

ROBIN OAKLEY, CNN EUROPEAN POLITICAL EDITOR: Well, it could conceivably be seen in those terms, though he's at pains to point out that it's not really anything like that, Tony. First of all, he outlined to British lawmakers how the new numbers would stack up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TONY BLAIR, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: Already we have handed over prime responsibility for security to the Iraqi authorities in al- Matuna (ph) and Dykar (ph). Now in Basra, over the coming months, we will transfer more of the responsibility directly to Iraqis. I should say that none of this will mean a diminution in our combat capability. The actual reduction in forces will be from the present 7,100, itself down from over 9,000 two years ago and 40,000 at the time of the conflict, to roughly 5,500.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

OAKLEY: Then Mr. Blair explained how the actual role of British troops remaining in Basra would change.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLAIR: The British forces that remain in Iraq will have the following tasks: training and support to Iraqi forces, securing the Iraqi-Iran border, securing supply routes and, above all, the ability to conduct operations against extremist groups and be there in support of the Iraqi army when called upon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

OAKLEY: Mr. Blair was clearly aware how people would paint up the contrast between President George W. Bush putting in 21,000 new troops into Baghdad and him beginning to pull troops out of Basra. But he argued that Iraq was the cockpit of the worldwide fight against terrorism and that it was right to put troops into Baghdad where there were huge efforts to stoke up sectarian violence. But in Basra, where it was possible to start handing over to Iraqi authorities, it was important to show that the multilateral forces weren't going to outstay their welcome -- Tony.

HARRIS: Hey, Robin, how soon will the British troop drawdown -- how soon before it begins? And when will it likely to be completed?

OAKLEY: Well, it will probably begin in a matter of weeks, really. Some troops end their tour of duty in April. They could start being pulled back as early as May, though some will be kept in barracks and around Basra airport at first to see how things develop. But Tony Blair was hopeful that more troops could be out by the end of the year, reducing the British troop contingent to about 5,000. But he did indicate that British troops were going to go on, having a military presence in Iraq, so long as they were needed, certainly through into 2008.

No question of the whole lot of British troops coming out by the end of 2008, as some have suggested -- Tony.

HARRIS: CNN's Robin Oakley for us in London.

Robin, appreciate it. Thank you.

WHITFIELD: So, the U.S.' top coalition partner now changing things up a bit, and the White House is reacting with a positive tone, saying the coalition is still strong.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECRETARY OF STATE: The coalition remains intact, and in fact, the British still have thousands of soldiers deployed in Iraq, in the south. And any decisions that they make are going to be on the basis of conditions. But it is the plan that as it is possible to transfer responsibilities to the Iraqis, that there would be -- that coalition forces would no longer be needed in those circumstances.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Meanwhile, another coalition partner is making a move out of Iraq. Denmark says they'll pull their 460 soldiers out by August.

Once again, Iran thumbs its nose at the United Nations. Tehran ignoring a deadline to freeze its uranium enrichment program or face more sanctions. As today's deadline approached, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad vowed to press ahead with his country's nuclear plans, and he says Iran would not bow to western intimidation.

Those comments as the U.N.'s nuclear watchdog agency gets ready to report to the Security Council on Iran's nuclear program. That report expected a short time from now. It's expected to say Iran is pursuing uranium enrichment despite pressure to stop.

Iran says its program is strictly peaceful. The U.S. and its allies believe otherwise. They accuse Iran of trying to build nuclear weapons.

HARRIS: A new report raises questions about a Bush administration theory for fighting terrorists.

CNN's Tom Foreman has that story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): One argument for the war in Iraq has long been that it will make the world safer by denying terrorists a place in which to train and plan.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If we're not fighting and destroying this enemy in Iraq, they would not be idle. They would be plotting and killing Americans across the world and within our own borders.

FOREMAN (on camera): You could call it the flypaper theory. And, in theory, it works like this. Jihadist terrorists are drawn to Iraq by the hopes of striking at the American military and to stop the development of a democratic government there.

Once there, coalition forces engage these terrorists, killing and capturing many, and forcing others into hiding. All of this activity keeps terrorist groups from effectively focusing their efforts elsewhere.

(voice-over): Anywhere, that's the theory. And that's certainly what the administration would have us believe. But what if the war in Iraq were actually creating new terrorists and putting the world at greater risk?

A new study from New York University's Center on Law and Security suggests, that's exactly what is happening. Look what they found.

From the day after 9/11 to the day before the invasion of Iraq, there were fewer than 30 terror attacks a year worldwide. After the invasion, that jumped to 200, a sevenfold increase. Before the invasion, there were 501 terror-related deaths a year. Now there are nearly 1,700 annually.

The administration has argued previously that such numbers are climbing because coalition troops are engaging the enemy. But, even if you don't count the terror attacks in Iraq and Afghanistan, worldwide terrorism blamed on jihadists is still rising dramatically.

The study meshes with the government's own assessments. A national intelligence report last October found that Iraq is shaping a new generation of terrorist leaders and operatives, jihadists who are honing their skills by fighting in Iraq, but who will eventually go home to their own countries, yet more evidence that the flypaper may not be sticking.

Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: And right now we want to take you to the Pentagon, where a briefing is under way, the briefing we expected. And there's a live shot right now of that briefing, where we expect to learn more about the quote from yesterday, "the unacceptable conditions," at a building that is part of the Walter Reed Medical Center.

A number of Army officials speaking this morning. We expect to hear in just a short time from now from our Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre, who has had an opportunity to speak to the man who heads up Walter Reed Medical Center. We will bring you a bit of that interview, along with Jamie McIntyre, a little later this hour in the NEWSROOM.

WHITFIELD: Also in Washington, the fate of a former White House aide expected to go to the jury any time now. Jurors are scheduled to begin deliberations shortly in the trial of Lewis "Scooter" Libby.

Libby is charged with lying and obstructing the investigation into who leaked the identity of CIA officer Valerie Plame. Prosecutors contended that Libby disclosed Wilson's employment as part of an effort to discredit her husband, an administration critic. The defense countered that Libby was a scapegoat.

Let's check in again with Chad Myers.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HARRIS: You know, this guy can't believe he is alive. A Wisconsin police officer's dashboard camera shows what happened after a truck ruptured a gas main. The truck driver had run into a home utility room. The officer was able to get the homeowners out, but when he tried to rescue the truck driver from his vehicle, he felt the blast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OFC. BEN HENRICH, PRESCOTT, WISCONSIN POLICE: There probably isn't a reason I probably should not be dead right now. After seeing the force of the explosion, I guess I'm just beside myself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Man.

WHITFIELD: That was a close call.

HARRIS: How about that? The truck driver was killed in that explosion.

WHITFIELD: So what is ailing Walter Reed. The premier hospital for war wounded itself wounded by time and bureaucracy. We'll show you in the NEWSROOM.

HARRIS: Deval Patrick did it in Massachusetts. Can his friend reach his goal on a national level? Colorblind politics in the NEWSROOM.

WHITFIELD: And he's known as the hardest-working man in radio. Or let me start that again -- the hardest-working man in radio.

Did I do that right, Tom Joyner?

HARRIS: There you go. That was beautiful. That was beautiful.

WHITFIELD: He's right there, and he's going to be joining us live to talk about how he's also working hard for college students.

HARRIS: Beautiful.

WHITFIELD: The "Fly Jock" continues. And we're going to find out, does he still like to be called the "Fly Jock"?

HARRIS: Answers, questions, in the NEWSROOM.

WHITFIELD: In the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: He brings the noise every morning. But Tom Joyner's life is about much more than music.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS (voice over): This is how eight million people know Tom Joyner. They tune in to "The Tom Joyner Morning Show" for a mix of music, news, comment and comedy. The show is syndicated in 120 markets and has become a prominent place to reach out to African- American audiences.

Joyner's radio career was born in the civil rights era. He joined a demonstration in his home town of Tusked, Alabama, against a White-owned station that didn't play black music. When the station owner gave in to the protesters' demands, Joyner volunteered to be a deejay. After graduating from Tusked Institute, Joyner began a professional career that literally took off in the 1980s.

TOM JOYNER, DEEJAY: This is Tom Joyner and the morning team kicking it.

HARRIS: Joyner accepted two high-profile offers at the same time, a morning job at KKDA in Dallas, and an afternoon drive time gig at WGCI in Chicago. For eight years he commuted daily by plane between the two cities, taking on two nicknames.

JOYNER: This is the hardest working man in radio, the "Fly Jock".

HARRIS: Joyner's still working hard, and not just in radio. His Internet site, www.blackamericaweb.com, offers a wide-ranging menu of hard news, feature stories, and games. And Joyner has become a benefactor to financially struggling African-American college students. Since 1998, the Tom Joyner Foundation has given $55 million to historical black colleges and universities to help students complete their education.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: So, how fun is this? The "Fly Jock" himself, Tom Joyner, joins us from Dallas.

Hey, Tom, that was a pretty good lead-up piece, wasn't it?

JOYNER: Yes. And you all have been playing parts of it...

HARRIS: Yes.

JOYNER: ... all morning long with Soledad, and I've been getting calls from across the country saying, "What are you doing on CNN? I see you on CNN with hair."

HARRIS: That's CNN. That's what we do. We're going to show you more of those pictures in just a moment.

Great to talk to you, doctor.

Have to ask you, Tom, are you doing exactly at this moment what you want to be doing with your life, with your work? Is this exactly where you want to be? Are you doing exactly what you want to be doing right now?

JOYNER: This is not where I want to be. I want to go higher. That's one of the things that I picked up from growing up in a college -- HBCU college town like Tuskegee.

You see, in Tuskegee, you have the Tuskegee Airmen, you've got Tuskegee Institute, Booker T. Washington, George Washington Carver. You've got the Commodores.

You've got a lot of people that you don't even know anything about that were succeeding against the odds, that were -- you know, that were people around me that I grew up with.

HARRIS: Yes.

JOYNER: They were just overachievers.

HARRIS: But Tom, what does it mean? I mean, you've got the number one urban program in America right now. Hundreds of radio stations.

JOYNER: Yes.

HARRIS: A hundred and twenty...

JOYNER: And around the world.

HARRIS: And around the world.

JOYNER: Armed Forces Network and the Internet.

HARRIS: BlackAmericaWeb...

JOYNER: BlackAmericaWeb, yes

HARRIS: What does it mean for you to go higher? Where do you want to go?

JOYNER: The moon. The moon. Yes, the moon. I want to do a sky show from the moon with an old school funk band.

HARRIS: You know what, man...

JOYNER: Yes, that's it.

WHITFIELD: Shoot for the moon, you'll always be among the stars.

HARRIS: You know, Fred is -- Fred is with us. You showed Fred so much love in the break, Fred's got a couple questions for you as well. We're going to do this together, if you don't mind.

JOYNER: And she's an HBCU graduate.

WHITFIELD: I am. I'm a Howard U grad.

JOYNER: Yes.

WHITFIELD: So I understand what you mean, but, you know, how do you try to convey this to so many young people today who are really influenced by -- we're doing a segment on "PAULA ZAHN TONIGHT" -- influenced by music videos? You know, they're looking through the magazines, they're seeing the bling-bling, they're seeing the celebrities, so a lot of young people are saying, "That's what I want," but they're kind of skipping the part about trying to get a higher education, which is something that you are all about right now.

JOYNER: I think that's a small portion of the African-American population. If you look at the statistics, you will see that a lot of young African-Americans are trying to go to school to get a better status in life.

It's not always a four-year institution. It's sometimes a community college. Maybe it's an online university. It could be -- it could be a bible college, or a nail college or a massage school.

WHITFIELD: So what do you say to these...

JOYNER: Now, the fact is...

WHITFIELD: ... young people, though? What do you say to really reach them, to help them get it, understand the importance of getting an education?

JOYNER: I think that as they grow older -- see, I'm an optimist. I think that as they grow older and they become -- they become men and women, and they realize that they have to have a better status in life to take care of not only themselves but their families, that they realize that they need to go back to some kind of school.

Now, when it comes to our HBCUs, our beloved black colleges and universities, our colleges and universities have to make it so that they want to come to our black schools. Right now -- right now, you know, we find a lot of our young African-Americans going to the military.

HARRIS: Yes.

JOYNER: And why not HBCUs and why the military? Because the military is offering them something that our HBCUs are not, and that's what we have to focus on, is how to make our historically black colleges like your beloved Howard and my Tuskegee and all of the 100 and some odd -- 113 historically black colleges, we have to make our universities so attractive that they don't want to turn them down.

HARRIS: Hey, Tom, let's talk about some of those schools. Let's talk about your effort in New Orleans, Xavier, Southern University of New Orleans, and your every to raise money to help those schools get back on their feet again.

Have you just sort of come to the conclusion that we can no longer sort of depend on the federal government post-Katrina to do that kind of work? It has to be done ourselves?

JOYNER: Exactly. That's the attitude of most people in New Orleans, all the way from the mayor on down, that you have to do for yourself. So what we at the Tom Joyner Foundation -- the Tom Joyner Foundation is trying to rebuild New Orleans through education. That was our slogan during the month of January.

When we -- when we raised money -- and are still raising money, by the way -- for Xavier, Dillard and Southern of New Orleans, three black colleges in one town that was completely wiped out by Hurricane Katrina. So, what we did when the hurricane hit and these students were displaced and their campuses were just torn up, what we did was we provided thousand-dollar scholarships to whatever school they went to, be it another HBCU or an Ivy League school, it didn't matter, and we -- and we encouraged them to apply for this money.

HARRIS: Yes.

JOYNER: And we did like, I don't know, $2 million or $3 million.

HARRIS: Man.

JOYNER: Then, we -- then, during the month of January, we raised money on our own and through churches, black churches all across the country. Our goal was to raise a million dollars to help rebuild through education. Our money goes to students.

HARRIS: Yes.

JOYNER: Not to the schools. I heard you say that in the package.

HARRIS: OK.

JOYNER: Our money goes to students for continuing education at a black college.

HARRIS: That's right. Thanks for that correction.

JOYNER: And so, that $55 million that you said that I've donated to schools, every dime of that has gone in the pockets of students.

HARRIS: That's terrific.

Tom, back in the day, you know, when you were building this dream and considering what the next steps would be, and plotting your course to the moon, there are a couple questions that come to mind. Let's show the pictures, the pictures that you've already commented about that you're getting phone calls on, these pictures here, back in the day when the "Fly Jock" was doing his thing with a full head of hair.

The question of the morning, afro sheen or ultra sheen, was it the pick with the fist on the end, or was it the red, black and green pick that folded to protect the teeth? Did you use the silk scarf to get the line...

WHITFIELD: Oh, my gosh. We're really remembering, aren't we?

HARRIS: What was it, Tom? JOYNER: I want to see pictures of you, Tony.

(LAUGHTER)

JOYNER: I want to see pictures of you with your afro.

HARRIS: Because you know I had one back in the day.

WHITFIELD: Because there will be payback, right?

JOYNER: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Oh, yes.

HARRIS: Hey, Tom. It's great to see you. Congratulations on all your success. And anything we can do to help you get to the moon, let us know. Let us know, OK?

JOYNER: All right, Tony.

WHITFIELD: What an inspiration, because you're now, you know, getting all the wheels in motion for everyone to try to figure out, OK, well, what more can I do? And you've given us some great ideas.

HARRIS: Yes. That's terrific. Tom, great to see you.

WHITFIELD: Thanks so much.

JOYNER: Thanks a lot.

HARRIS: Thanks for your time.

WHITFIELD: And this just in out of the nation's capital. Now the jurors in the case of former White House aide Scooter Libby -- is now in the hands of the jury. They will now try to decide after hearing closing arguments yesterday whether, indeed, he lied and tried to obstruct the investigation into the identity of those who may have leaked the information about the CIA officer, Valerie Plame.

So, the jurors now have the case in their hands. They've gotten the instructions from the judge. And of course we're going to continue to follow this case to see just how quickly or perhaps how long it will take them before they reach a verdict.

HARRIS: And still to come this morning, British troop drawdown in southern Iraq. White House reaction, political implications, reality on the ground.

We are covering all the angles in the NEWSROOM.

WHITFIELD: And the smallest baby -- how precious -- beating the biggest job. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta looks at what little Amillia Taylor may face once she is home.

That's in the NEWSROOM.

HARRIS: Atlanta's Auburn Avenue, once considered black America's Wall Street until the boom went bust. What will it take to be Auburn sweet once again?

"Uncovering America" straight ahead in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: And welcome back, everyone. Good morning.

I'm Tony Harris.

WHITFIELD: And I'm Fredricka Whitfield, in for Heidi Collins.

HARRIS: And Fred, just moments ago we learned that the jury now has the case.

WHITFIELD: Right.

HARRIS: The perjury case against former White House aide Lewis "Scooter" Libby. As you know, Libby is accused of lying to investigators about his conversations with reporters regarding the outing of CIA officer Valerie Plame.

Once again, the jury now has the case. We will wait now for a jury verdict.

WHITFIELD: Meantime, a successful operation in southern Iraq. British Prime Minister Tony Blair touting his group's mission in Basra as an opportunity, an opportunity to pull some 1,600 British troops out of Iraq and to change the focus of those left in place.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLAIR: The next chapter in Basra's history will be written by the Iraqis. I've discussed this with Prime Minister Maliki, and our proposals have his full support and indeed represent his wishes.

Already we have handed over prime responsibility for security to the Iraqi authorities in al-Matuna (ph) and Dykar (ph). Now in Basra, over the coming months, we will transfer more of the responsibility directly to Iraqis.

I should say that none of this will mean a diminution in our combat capabilities. The actual reduction in forces will be down from the president 7,100, itself down from over 9,000 two years ago, and 40,000 at the time of the conflict, to roughly 5,500.

However weather the exception of forces which will remain at Basra Palace, the British forces will be located at Basra Airbase and be in a support role.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Blair's plan still leaves some 5,500 British troops in place, a fact not lost on U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECY. OF STATE: The coalition remain intact, and, in fact, the British still have thousands of soldiers deployed in Iraq, in the south, and any decisions that they make are going to be on the basis of conditions. But it is the plan that as it is possible to transfer responsibilities to the Iraqis that there would be -- that coalition forces would no longer be needed in those circumstances.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Here's a breakdown of the total commitments in Iraq. The U.S. has right around 141,000 troops in Iraq. As for coalition partners, Britain has 7,100 right now, but we know that number is going down. Other contributors include South Korea, with 2,300 troops, Poland with 900 and Australia with 850. That leaves about 3,000 troops from 16 other countries.

In the war zone, bombs today kill at least 15 more Iraqis. The bloodiest attack was in the holy city of Najaf. A suicide car bomber hit a police checkpoint killing at least eight people, including civilians.

Meanwhile, several attacks in Baghdad including mortar blasts, roadside bombs, and a car bomb laced with poisonous gas.

WHITFIELD:: In a country of red and blue politics, can voters think beyond black and white?

CNN's Mary Snow reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Can politics lead the way in erasing the racial divide in America? Some say yes.

DOUGLAS WILDER, (R) FORMER VIRGINIA GOVERNOR: This is the new level where the fight is to be fought for the advancement of mankind. And in this process, people of color can come to the front and be measured as any other Americans.

SNOW: Douglas Wilder became the nation's first elected black governor in 1989. It took almost two decades before a second black governor was elected in Massachusetts. Deval Patrick was sworn in this January.

GOVERNOR DEVAL PATRICK, (D) MASSACHUSETTS: I am descended from people once forbidden their most basic and fundamental freedoms, a people desperate for a reason to hope and willing to fight for it.

SNOW: Patrick won in a predominantly white state. His campaign style is compared to that of his friend, Democratic presidential hopeful Senator Barack Obama.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA, (D) ILLINOIS: We borrow ideas from each other. I think he's trying to do a similar thing in Massachusetts as I want to bring to the whole country.

SNOW: Can Obama win over America and its white voters the way Patrick did in Massachusetts?

RONALD WATERS, UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND: They're a post-civil rights generation was threatening. That civil rights generation was somewhat threatening to whites.

SNOW: Compare a Gallup poll in 1958, when 54 percent of people questioned said they would not vote for a black president, to this year, when just five percent hold that view.

Some political observers are skeptical of those polls and think the popularity of Obama and Patrick taps into something specific.

WILDER: I think it has to do more with the moment and the fact that they seem to have captured the spirit of the American people for change.

SNOW (on camera): When it comes to politics being colorblind, Douglas Wilder, the former Virginia governor, and now mayor of Richmond, says Americans should be blinded to color as a factor in voting, but to cherish their cultural identity.

Mary Snow, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD:: Atlanta's Auburn Avenue, once considered black America's Wall Street until the boom went bust. What will it take to make Auburn sweet once again? Uncovering America, straight ahead in the NEWSROOM.

HARRIS: What's ailing Walter Reed? The premier hospital for war wounded itself wounded by time and bureaucracy. We will show you in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Let's bring in Jeffrey Toobin to talk about the Libby case going to the jury now.

Jeffrey, great to talk to you.

Give us a sense of where we stand right now with this case, the charges. We will put up a full screen in just a moment, reminding folks of the charges that Lewis Scooter Libby is facing, and give us your overall view of where we are right now.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SR. LEGAL ANALYST: Well, this was -- the trial lasted about a month. Scooter Libby, Vice President Cheney's former chief of staff, certainly one of the most important people in the government, charged with perjury and obstruction of justice in connection with the outing of the wife of a critic of administration policy in the war in Iraq.

It was, I think, a somewhat more a simple trial than many people -- many of us thought was going to happen. Patrick Fitzgerald, the special prosecutor, tried a lean case. He basically said what prosecutors always like to say to jurors, which is, hey, this is really simple.

Yesterday -- and that's what he did in his summation. Yesterday in the defense case, Libby's lawyer, Ted Wells, also one of the best lawyers in the country, said, no, no, no, it's not simple; it's complicated. You've got a lot of different agendas here, you had a complicated factual situation, a lot of people talking about the same set of things, same set of facts at the same time, confusing stories, and, you know, that's where -- I think that's where we are. I expect that the jury deliberations will last at least until the end of this week. This is -- there's a lot for the jury to consider. They want to appear like they're taking the case seriously, so I would be very surprised if there was a verdict before Friday, but I've been surprised before.

HARRIS: We all have.

Hey, Jeffrey, as you look back over this case, and I'm not asking you how this will ultimately -- I'm not asking you for a prediction here, but which side, in your opinion, did the best job of making that simple case? We oftentimes talk about a clear, simple, narrative line through the presentation.

TOOBIN: The prosecution, tony. I thought they did a very effective job taking a somewhat murky set of facts and making it simple. The issue in the case is this -- Libby testified in the grand jury that he learned the identity of the wife of the CIA -- of the critic, Valerie Plame, learned her name from Tim Russert, the NBC News correspondent. That was his testimony in the grand jury, and that's what Fitzgerald said was false.

What Fitzgerald said was it's false in two ways. One is, look at this list of people, eight witnesses who is described talking with Libby about her identity. So saying that's really where he learned of it.

Then the other part of the case was Russert's testimony, saying I never discussed Valerie Plame Wilson's name or status with Libby in the phone call that we both agree that we had. That I think is a very straightforward case, and another big factor, I think, worth considering is the defense in this case is -- I don't -- I made a good-faith effort to answer these questions. If I mis-remembered, I apologize. If my memory was wrong, that's one thing.

HARRIS: Well, Jeffrey, there was also this idea that I was -- I've been made a scapegoat here in this process.

TOOBIN: Right.

HARRIS: Thrown under the bus.

TOOBIN: That was a little peculiar aspect of the defense, frankly, that I didn't understand very well, because that really didn't relate to the perjury. It related to sort of the overall political environment.

Basically, Ted Wells, Libby's lawyer, was saying, look, you know, the White House was panicked in reaction to the absence of weapons of mass destruction being found in Iraq. So they had to get out a story, had to respond to critics, and they were trying to protect Karl Rove but push Scooter Libby out there to respond in public. That may or may not be true. It doesn't really explain why he lied or didn't lie in the grand jury. That's why I didn't really find that part of the defense very effective or significant.

I think the real answer -- the real issue in the case is did he lie or did he make a good-faith mistake? Did he just simply remember conversations differently than other people did? And I think that's going to be -- that's a tough defense, especially when Libby himself did not take the witness stand to explain his memory problems.

HARRIS: His version of it. Yes, sure.

CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin for us.

Jeffrey, great to talk to you. Thanks.

HARRIS: See you, Tony.

WHITFIELD:: Well, perhaps you shop at one of the nation's major wholesale clubs. Well, you need to listen up. An E. coli scare connected to a popular food. Details straight ahead in the NEWSROOM.

T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: I'm T.J. Holmes, standing in front of the historic Ebenezer Baptist Church on Auburn Avenue in downtown Atlanta. A lot of people familiar with this end of Auburn Avenue, with the historic church, historic King site. But coming up, we're going to flip this camera around and show you an area called "Sweet Auburn," and why some say the "Sweet" hasn't been there in a long time.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: And very quickly, let's take you live now to Fort Lauderdale, Florida. We have a water rescue under way right now, as you can see, just to the left of your screen -- we lost the shot. There is a vehicle in the water there. This is described as a canal. Moments ago -- wow. Obviously, just moments ago -- you can still see some of the air bubbles from that vehicle underwater now in this canal. Just a short time ago, Fort Lauderdale, Florida, pictures provided now by our affiliate WFOR.

Once again, let's go back to the live pictures now if we could as we can see firefighters are on the scene trying to make this rescue, divers on hand as well, trying to get down to that vehicle. We have no idea at this point, Fred, how many passengers, certainly a driver, but also passengers, might be in that vehicle right now.

A better shot now of the vehicle that is submerged in what is described as a canal. Miami-Dade County, Florida, Fort Lauderdale is the city. A diver now being harnessed with that air tank right now to go down and try to make this rescue. This is a scene that is unfolding right now here on CNN. Maybe we can get another shot of that vehicle. If we could, let's go back to the tape from just a moment ago of the vehicle as it was clearly going underwater. We could clearly see some of those air bubbles from the vehicle inside there.

As you see, the firefighters on the scene right now. Pictures from just a few moments ago, and it looks like you can see the fins of a diver going down, trying to make that rescue, certainly to get an assessment of the situation. What the divers are dealing with right now, a driver, how many passengers, if there are other passengers in that vehicle right now. Can't tell at this point whether we're talk about a car, some kind of sports utility vehicle perhaps.

But this is the scene from just a short time ago. The live pictures now. Let's move back in -- the live pictures of the firefighters, the divers.

WHITFIELD: And we're talking about a jurisdiction that is incredibly proficient in this kind of rescue.

HARRIS: Absolutely.

WHITFIELD: Because unfortunately, this happens more often than you think in the South Florida area, with the number of the major roads and highways that are, you know, right up against canals just like this. And there you're seeing a picture, a broader picture there of how something like this could happen. But these rescue teams are A-1. They are the best at this.

HARRIS: Absolutely. Absolutely.

WHITFIELD: So, we're going to hope for the best.

HARRIS: And we'll keep an eye on this situation and hopefully have good news to report in moments for you here in the NEWSROOM.

WHITFIELD: Meantime, out of the nation's capital, a major embarrassment for the U.S. Army: problems uncovered at Walter Reed Army Medical Center, the main destination for troops wounded in Iraq -- mold, infestation, water damage, you name it. Now the Army is promising a quick fix.

Senior CNN Pentagon correspondent Jamie McIntyre joining me now , because you were able to hear from head of Walter Reed to talk directly to this issue of what's gone wrong, why is it like this?

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, the Army strategy on this is to admit their failure, as you say, promise a quick fix, and Army leadership is almost tripping over itself trying to assume responsibility for this.

But I sat down with the top commander at Walter Reed, and he says the buck stops with him.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MAJ. GEN. GEORGE WEIGHTMAN, U.S. ARMY: I think what's happened is it's an older building, and there's probably issues there that really we need to replace the whole HVAC system, because a lot of issues are related to antiquated plumbing, and also with moisture, which relate to the HVAC issues.

So I think he's absolutely right. I think we have to take down the building as far as the plumbing goes in order to solve that mold problem once and for all.

MCINTYRE: Now when did you take over as top commander here?

WEIGHTMAN: It was the end of August this last year.

MCINTYRE: And when did you become aware that there were these problems with substandard housing?

WEIGHTMAN: That was just only recently, Jamie, within the last month.

MCINTYRE: And when did corrective action begin?

WEIGHTMAN: Actually we began corrective action almost immediately upon hearing it, and really that's stepped up in the last two or three weeks.

MCINTYRE: General Cody, the Army secretary, Francis Harvey, said they didn't know about this. It's right outside the gate. How could that be?

WEIGHTMAN: They did not know about the building or the condition of the building?

MCINTYRE: They didn't know about the condition of the building.

And You live right across from that building.

WEIGHTMAN: Right.

MCINTYRE: And you were unaware of it?

WEIGHTMAN: Yes, I was unaware, because I did not -- I had not seen evidence of that through either surveys that we had made with the chain of command or talking with the soldiers that were there.

MCINTYRE: So if Francis Harvey says this is a leadership problem and you're the top commander here, how much of this responsibility falls on you?

WEIGHTMAN: Jamie, 100 percent of it falls on me. I'm responsible for everything that does happen or does not happen here at Walter Reed. And it was obviously a failure on my part to reach down and touch those soldiers and find out directly from them.

Quite frankly, though, talking with the soldiers that live in that building, many of them are pretty happy being there and they'll tell you, hey, I've lived a lot worse places than this. I think part of the problem, in addition to some of the rooms -- and we'll talk about that if you'd like the details on the rooms needing improvements -- is that most of the soldiers that have now lived in building 18, formerly lived in the Malone House, and there's a big difference in how the rooms are -- you know, the furnishings that they have there.

The ones in the Malone House -- so it would be a natural inclination to say I'm not getting the same level of care and compassion and building that I got before that.

MCINTYRE: Do you understand the outrage that people felt when they began to hear what was going on in some of these buildings?

WEIGHTMAN: Oh, I absolutely do. And I felt that same outrage because we take our care for wounded warriors very seriously here, and we have a reputation at Walter Reed for being a world-class medical center. And then these allegations that we were not taking care of that hurt us all as far as that reputation goes.

MCINTYRE: Is this a resource problem? Is it a bureaucracy problem? Is it simply that you're overwhelmed? What explains this?

WEIGHTMAN: Well, it's not a resource problem. I think now that we are aware of the problem, we had the resources both within Walter Reed made available to us from the Department of the Army to fix that. I think the issue is that we had to identify those problems earlier and we didn't.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MCINTYRE: Now the Pentagon says that they're going to look at facilities all across the board, but the main facilities are Walter Reed and the Bethesda Naval Hospital. That's going to be the focus of most of the review, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: Primary locations for the wounded. And so Jamie, you had a chance to see these conditions. We looked at the videotape. In Weightman's defense, however, even though maybe within the past month he was made aware of it after taking the job in August, certainly that kind of damage does not look like something that cropped up overnight. But it's been many, many months, maybe even years that it's been in condition like that?

MCINTYRE: Well, you know, they've renovated the building several times, but the army admits it wasn't done right. And yes, I looked at some of the rooms. They're not great rooms. They're like a low-rent hotel and U.S. service members obviously deserve better.

But they're not terrible, squalor conditions, they're just sub- standard. And the army, to its credit, is admitting that, they're not trying to make excuses. And they say the main thing is they're going to fix it and they also say they're getting all the money they need from Congress to do that.

WHITFIELD: I guess what incensed so many people is given what these men and women have gone through, certainly they deserve a whole lot more than that.

MCINTYRE: And the army gets that.

WHITFIELD: All right Jamie McIntyre, thanks so much.

HARRIS: The trial of former White House aide Lewis Scooter Libby went to the jury a short time ago. Brian Todd has been covering this case and he joins us from Washington. Brian, good to see you. The case is literally now in the hands of the jury.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It literally is. They just got the case, Tony. Eight women, four men, their first order of business, likely what they're doing right as we speak, is electing a foreperson. That was what the judge told them to do first when they went into the deliberation room.

He took about two hours to explain the instructions to them. They listened very intently to those as they have throughout the case. It's been a very, very attentive jury.

One key piece of instruction that had to do with an important component of this case, and that is Mr. Libby's decision not to testify in his own behalf.

The judge told them, quote, "Mr. Libby has decided not to testify. You must not hold this decision against him. You must not draw any inference of guilt from his decision not to testify."

He also spoke about questions of memory, which are very key in this case, but the deliberations are under way. Mr. Libby of course has a lot at stake here with these 12 people. He faces a maximum of 30 years in prison on these five counts: obstruction, perjury, and making false statements, Tony. So we should hear literally any time now.

HARRIS: OK, Brian Todd for us. Brian, appreciate it, thank you.

TODD: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: Beware of the mushrooms. A wholesale club recalling one brand. E. Coli concerns straight ahead in the NEWSROOM.

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WHITFIELD: They are a main stay in salads, soups and sauces. Today new concern about mushrooms. B.J.'s Wholesale Club recalling packages of fresh mushrooms. An inspection turned up the possible presence of the deadly e. Coli bacteria. The product, Wellsley Farms brand fresh mushrooms bought between February 11 and 19th. Officials with B.J.'s say they have not received any reports of illnesses and right now they're running tests on the mushrooms.

As a precaution, however, the company has pulled the product from its shelves. It's asking people who bought the mushrooms to return them for a refund. HARRIS: You are back in the NEWSROOM. Oh, oh, I'm sorry. It's if you want to get your daily dose of news online, log on to our Web site. I got you, I got you.

WHITFIELD: There's something in my throat -- hopefully not a mushroom.

HARRIS: Yes. Just to get the latest health news, just log on to our Web site. The address, CNN.com/health. And you are back in the NEWSROOM one hour from now, Don Lemon here now with a preview.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: What a busy day, a lot going on, so let's get right to it.

Let's get the partisan started, as they say. Britain says it will draw down its troop levels in Iraq and the story spurring plenty of spin on this side of the pond. Senator Ted Kennedy says it's stunning rejection of the president's Iraq policy. But the White House sees it as a signal of success. We're covering all the angles on that one.

Also, you can call this one the hullabaloo over hip hop. Paula Zahn -- you've been talking about it guys, you'll join us live for a preview. More on her prime time special on a solid music that provokes a strong reaction. Some people really, really love it. Others really, really hate it and claim it is ruining some kids lives. We'll have more on that controversy ahead in the NEWSROOM at 1:00 with another very hardworking woman in show business, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: I'll be with you.

HARRIS: Unbelievable, the shift you're working.

WHITFIELD: Oh quick, quick, quick, happy birthday to mom.

LEMON: Oh, happy birthday, mom.

WHITFIELD: All right, had to squeeze it in, special day.

HARRIS: OK, we've got time for one more quick story here. This is is a bit unusual, not the unusual kind of dashboard cam that we usually show you. But one thing it is a slow speed chase, very slow, when the perpetrator...

WHITFIELD: ... Taking the time to scratch.

HARRIS: Yes, is about a ton in size, highlander cow, eventually runs into the police cruiser here. Gets tired, had enough of this, and there you go. "YOUR WORLD TODAY" is next with news happening around the world and here at home. Have a great afternoon, everyone.

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